View Full Version : another question for experienced users

Chris Olsen
03 March 2002, 05:44 AM
hey people, I know these kind of newbie questions can be somewhat annoying, but please bare with me. With the latest drop in Lightwave prices my wallet is itchin', but because it it still going to be ~$2000 canadian dollars I want to make sure I make the right decision. With all the new features coming out in 7.3 it looks like it is really beginning to become a complete package!

Personally i love animating, but I don't see that many lightwave animations about (w/o the help of messiah), as well as few animation tutorials. I was hoping I cold get some links to character animations done purely in Lightwave.

Also, what exactly did Messiah do for Lightwave. Did it have it's own bone system, or did it just provide NLA to Lightwave to which was unavailable in Lightwave 6.x and earlier versions?

thanks for your help. Cheers :)

Mike RB
03 March 2002, 06:29 AM
Messiah has no NLA. Is is a plugin ment to give a robust character animation toolset to LW 5.6

LW 7.0b on the other hand is very good on its own. I have worked on 2 projects that used LW 6.5b and 7.0b with no additional animation plugins.
'somthing fishy'

'3d teaser'

There are many other animations done without messiah but I don't know the links to them all.

The only plugin that really helps a lot with LW 7.0b's toolset is Keytrak by Mark Brown. (Which still wasent used in either of those productions above)

its 99 bucks and is a total bargian.

Where in Canada are you?

Chris Olsen
03 March 2002, 07:23 AM
hey mike,
I liked your animations, pretty cool. As for me I am in Edmonton, Alberta, the land of no animators. I swear to god there is absolutely no companies here that work in the animation industry, they are all in Vancouver. I work in a totally different area, but it sure would be nice even to work for free just to get the foot in the door.

As for the plugin that you gave me the link for, I never really got the jist of what it does, maybe it was my lack of Lightwave experience or lack of sleep, but it never made a lot of sense.

Thanks Mike

Mike RB
03 March 2002, 08:48 AM
The graph editor is for tweaking animation curves. An animation curve holds information about both the value of a key and its place in time (thats what is 'graphed').

Keytrak is a mini dopesheet. Which only holds timing information. It lets you cut through the clutter of a graph when all you want to do is time your keys or poses. A lot of the time a graph editor is displaying way too much info and it slows down timing of animation. Keytrak makes timing things much much easier. It also has a lot of other nifty features but its main job is making timing easier.


03 March 2002, 09:53 AM
heyas mike,
i just saved your feet rig tutorial and ill study it later on
i am also studying DRM files for rigs using follower.
my main issue right now is:
how to keep those feet on ground while the rest of the legs are been ik used???
i also just read the "REF" making of and the guy used a lot of expressions for ik/fk blending.
is there a way to fake ik/fk without expressions?
i am trying ikblender plugin but im still getting the hang of it.
any help on this would be greatly apreciated.
also, take a look, if u have the time, in some of my animations at:
and tell me what you think:)

thanks a lot,

Mike RB
03 March 2002, 10:09 AM
Yah your having some foot trouble in those animations... and the timing is off. Otherwise your posing is pretty good.

My leg tut takes about 10-20mins to do. It gives you a rock solid foot that wont move at all when you move your character. It also dosent use any expressions or follower. Unfortunately IK blender currently dosent play well with match goal orientation so its not the best for feet. I found a way round that problem but its a little tedious. Most of the time you really dont need both IK legs and FK legs in the same shot. Having multiple rigs based on what the character has to do in the shot is standard. It's impossible to built a all purpose rig. And why would you want to? It would be a zillion controls that you wouldnt even need for a certain shot. You would spend more time in setup than actually animating...


03 March 2002, 02:01 PM
LW 7.0b may be good (animation wise) compared to what it was, but it is still nothing like P:M. P:M is still far better and easier to use. I'd go insane if I had to use LW on it's own for any type of character animation. :p

Mike RB
03 March 2002, 02:13 PM
funny, we get along totally fine at work with no P:M


Facial Deluxe
03 March 2002, 06:56 PM
Mike, the fish movie is excellent, it's LOL !

Facial Deluxe
03 March 2002, 08:22 PM
... And hateful Chris is Huge !!!!!!

Mike RB
03 March 2002, 10:03 PM
Hateful Chris has a bright future

03 March 2002, 10:21 PM
Great stuff Mike! Are you folks using Lightwave for most of the work?

Mike RB
03 March 2002, 10:47 PM
all of it.

04 April 2002, 11:22 PM
LW has a robust animation tool set. <No doubt. I USE BOTH all the time>. BUT and there is a "But". I would argue that after using P:Messiah, one would want to go back to using LW for character animation. You get hook on the speed and feedback. I mean animating to a wav file is 100% better as jerkiness and lag time. No need to make a preview to gauge your timing. Its really fast.

Messiah doesn't have a NLA yet but its motionclips is just as awesome in te years of its use.
Expression system is better.
Realtime softbodies.
Go here and see how people are finding ways to duplicate messiah features in LW.
- blue bones are stretching on the z axis.

I really like cloning and renaming objects in LW though, much better than messiah.

Mike RB
04 April 2002, 11:31 PM
whats with the weird scorpion tail neck structure in that avi?

04 April 2002, 08:59 AM
I like the scorpin-neck-thingy a bob.

actually I used a lot of Bones for the head because I have this big floppy ears I am using for the character and they branch off the back of the head. Course 'simple of expression' or Parent in Place takes care of that now.
Top image
my avatar

newer but Old too, haven't had time to touch this character.

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