View Full Version : The Beginning ... (a MUST READ for anyone interested in helping)

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01 January 2003, 09:16 PM
OK co-lab folks ... here's a start for my proposed short film project. If you missed the description of this short here it is.The story is sort of MIB'ish and revolves around 2 juvenile delinquent aliens and a border patrol agent (by border I mean "Earth"). The aliens cause a lot of havoc (i.e. cattle mutilation, crop circles, RV abduction, etc.) and the agent tries several times to arrest the hooligans.

There should be enough challenging things in the short for 3D guys (which is one of the reasons I haven't started on it yet). There's a runny nose scene, several effects shots with UFO lighting and rocket blasts, a liquid substance shot and it all takes place outdoors (trees, rocks, grass, etc. with wind dynamics).

I think it will run around 3-4 minutes. Depends on what I add/remove when I re-do the storyboards.I have Maya 3.0 and I know how to use it, but I'm not the most skilled at it. Consider me a newbie when it comes to 3D. Which means I'll need lots of help with modelling, texturing, rigging, animating and FX if this film will ever be made.

I'll be taking this slow because I do work full time and have a wife and 3 kids who need my attention occassionally. But, I'm going to be dedicated to this if there are some people who are interested in helping me out with it.

I'm currently re-working the character designs and storyboards and I'll post additional stuff as I complete it. But for now here is the first alien design (see below) if someone wants to start modelling and work on a few animation tests (character sheet coming next).

NOTE - this alien is approximately 3 feet tall or 1 meter (if I remember my metrics properly) and should be pretty flexible for the animation. Squash-n-stretching much like a Warner Bros animation.

I also have some wav files that might be good for lip sync tests. A friend of mine did some sample recordings a while ago. I'll post a link to the files when I get my ftp issues resolved.

This project is for fun, learning and sense of accomplishment. I hope a few of you can help. PM me full names for the credits if you do any work on it, and I'll keep a project log and try to keep everyone motivated.

That's all for now ...

01 January 2003, 10:32 PM
Hi Kirt, what can I do for you?...just ask, you can count on me! :)

01 January 2003, 02:53 AM
Hi Ila! Glad you can help. Right now, while everyone is waiting on me to complete the storyboards, I'd like to see this alien character modeled and put through a few tests just to see that he'll move properly. I'm not a great character modeller so I'm not sure if the design is something that will translate well to 3D.

I know that cloth can be a problem so his outfit is going to be a challenge (or maybe not ... that's why I want to see him moving). Also, once we get something started it might attract some others to the project.

Oh ... one shot in the film will call for him to have a cold and some really runny stuff dripping from his nose and mouth. This is probably going to be one of those tough shots to do. I envision really stringy strands of muchous to be streached and flung around by his hand movements. Would be funny if he could blow a snot bubble with his nose or mouth also. This is something we could test as well ... start thinking about solutions.

I have a couple sound clips that we can try lip synching with. They are a few of the emotions that he'll be put through during the story (laughing, giggling, sneezing, getting sick, confused, etc.) I'm trying to get the files uploaded to my webspace, but no luck so far. Send me a PM with your e-mail address if you'd like me to forward them to you that way.

Like I said ... there's no real rush on this project so we're going to take it slow and easy to make sure that the quality is there and consistant. This is my first film to direct, so be patient with me as I try to get things organized and everything rolling along.

Hopefully, within a year or so we'll have a finished short that we're all proud of. :D


01 January 2003, 03:07 AM
Calling for duty, sir!

Well, I'm pretty much a newb at 3d, but I can make a nice website for that project when it gets established enough....

Maybe some of you 2d guys could help with that mascot project around here somewhere....

Oh, if you need any mechanical stuff, that's what I'm trained for, so just holler...

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 05:56 AM
Count me in also... this sounds like alot of fun! Il give that alien a shot ;)

I also have a few ideas for space ships and guns.....

01 January 2003, 10:47 AM
I'll have some basics of the ship up soon. I have a general design, it just needs to be tweeked to perfection. Glad that we have a few people interested in this already. You are all going to keep me busy with your enthusiasm. Just try not to get ahead of me ok? heheheh :D

Take frequent breaks ... we're not on a schedule, yet. :beer:

01 January 2003, 07:26 PM
Just try not to get ahead of me ok?
Sorry Kirt, I can't promise that! ;)

01 January 2003, 07:33 PM
Also, the alien will have a partner in crime. I was thinking he'd be the same type, but different build and clothing so the two are distinquishable. But, if you want to try and make a different race of alien we could probably do that.
Only restrictions are that he has to be short (about 3 feet) to fit in the ship, He has to have arm/hand that are somewhat humanoid for wiping nose, high-five, pointing, and carrying objects, etc. And he must have enough features on his face to display a wide range of emotions (laughing, sneezing, suprised, etc.)

& I tried some quick sketches...but not all of them in crime! ... stupid, scientist, pirate, ...

01 (
02 (
03 (
04 (
05 (

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 07:53 PM
I like the 5th sketch alot :thumbsup:

Kirt that would be great if u could post up some of your ship sketches.... il see if i can't keep myself busy in modelling this alien. First attempt made him too weird and mean looking :shrug:

01 January 2003, 09:45 PM
Rice ManX you should be in hurry!

wire (
shade (

01 January 2003, 09:48 PM
Ila - I actually like the direction you're going with 1 and 2. 3 and 4 are too sinister. They have to be somewhat goofy and mischievious looking. Going for a simple design too so that the characters 'read' well while in action. Number 5 is an example of "too gadgety" for this short. Too much to distract the viewer.

Rice ManX - I knew you guys would get fidgety for the spaceship designs so I worked on them a bit this morning. I'm going to abuse the attachment option here until I can get my webspace fixed. Then I'll edit all posts to link to the images. :D

01 January 2003, 10:04 PM
hey, nice flying saucer, but don't you think it must be simplified like the characters? (as u said)
emmm, I had some spaceship sketch before, maybe they are usefull & can be changed to fit to your short. here they are:

01 (, 02 (, 03 (, 05 (, 06 (

01 January 2003, 10:24 PM

just making sure I subscribe to this thread, it sounds very interesting.

I'm not saying I'm in, but I'll keep an eye on this and I'll post some sketches in the next few days, just for fun... who knows.. maybe I'll join you later (if you admit me of course) :)


Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 10:24 PM
hmmm k then u want me to work on the space ship i can do that much better than humanoid figures... ??? i finished the head but it looks like crap i did it in less than an hour.... :shrug: so i think il start on the space ship... i like Kirts sketches. but u guys can guide me here. I won't be back at the computer for a few hours. Cya :)

01 January 2003, 10:35 PM

Are we just dropping the mascot?

01 January 2003, 10:58 PM
ila - You don't think that's a simple design? I thought it was pretty basic saucer type. One thing about the ship is that it is almost a character in the short (as much so as the aliens and our hero). So, it'll have to do specific things other than just fly around and be a transport for the aliens. I guess once I get the storyboards up that'll make more sense (or just read on ...).

Rice ManX - Go ahead and stick to the basic shape, but add/fix as you think is necessary. The hatches are pretty important to the design. One scene the hero will threaten the ship with his gun and the ship responds by opening hatches to reveal lots of big weapons (railgun lazers, missle launchers, the works). Another scene the aliens will grab the agent via mechanical hands that pop from the ship.

unLevel - :shrug: I was hoping you guys would get busy with that too so it gave me more time to work on sketches and storyboard. I still have to finish my challenges and you're all making me get stoked about this project. :D

Frinsklen - :wavey: The more the merrier - and sooner the project gets done, right?

Another concept sketch (old one). I'm not too sure about the glasses now because the eyes will be important to show emotion. And it'll also be nighttime through the whole film.

01 January 2003, 11:07 PM
Story, StoryBoard... :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
(hey kirt, there are details! ... I need clue)

01 January 2003, 11:17 PM
Hmmm ... let me see if I can describe the look and feel of this short.

1. Animation and timing like Warner Brothers classic animation (See Chuck Jones), but not as stylish in the look.

2. Simple construction of characters and props but with enough detail to make objects identifiable and believable. (Ice Age, Monsters Inc., Toy Story should be good reference material). I don't want to overwhelm the viewers with complex bump maps, textures, and accessories that aren't essential to the story (i.e. Final Fantasy movie).

Does that help?

01 January 2003, 11:27 PM
Yes, It does, my favorite style too
& now I need your crits & guide, see this:

alien-wire (, alien-shade (

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 12:28 AM
Ila: Here is my version of the head i did lastnight, but i forgot to save the most recent which had wrinkles and many updates to its shape so here is what i have if u want me to keep going with it (could be second alien?) but if u guys don't like its ok. THis is my first head mind u.....

And Kirt il have a version of the ship to show u tonight, so far its going well :)

01 January 2003, 04:21 AM
Rice ManX - too scary looking. This a CG cartoon (although I don't think we'll use cell shaders).

ilo - good base to start off with. Right now I think the area to work on is the head. You have a lightbulb shape from what I can see. It should actually be more heavy in the back. Eyes need to be bigger, neck more narrow, ears smaller in diameter at the ends and the mouth should be more "Veggie Tale"-ish. He doesn't really have lips, but they can look like lips as he forms words or gives and expression that calls for it.

Here's another quick sketch to show more character construction.

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 06:21 AM
Ya thats wut i figured :)

01 January 2003, 07:03 AM
That helps much, Thanx Kirt.

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 08:44 AM
Ok well i spent about 2 to 3 hours on this space ship. And i think its looking pretty good. it has alot of work to it tho but its getting there :) I still need to do the engine and bottom of the hull. But i have the cockpit all ready, headlights, and the weapons panel/bay (that took most of the time) So tell me what you think of it so far...:bounce:

01 January 2003, 11:32 AM
Hi Rice ManX, I think you should pay more attention to the cockpit, it's small now, must be bigger & more round shape. :)
(more spherical), keep working man... :) :thumbsup:

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 03:15 PM
thanx Ila. Uhhm how do you mean rounder? because i will be smothing this with smoothing groups. But i will try to make the cockpit bigger. :)
I can post more views of it if u like?

01 January 2003, 07:39 PM
I think what ila means is that proportionally you have too much ship and not enough cockpit. Take a look at the scale on the sketches I made. The diameter of the ship is maybe equivelent to 4 of the aliens standing shoulder to shoulder (maybe a little bit bigger). From the looks of the cockpit on your ship, the diameter looks to be about 8-9 aliens across.

It's too big. This in not a huge space cruiser. It's like the sports car model of spaceships and could probably park in any house garage (if it weren't for the high tail fin). If the aliens are 3 feet tall, the ship diameter should be about 7-8 feet.

Also, try to keep the saucer looking like a disc. This should be a retro looking design. There will be other design elements that reflect a 1950's feeling in this short (mobile homes for one example).

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 07:52 PM
Ya i know its supposed to look like a disk no worries there. Now i know the width on the ship seems a little big. Il show you an over head view. But functionally i think it needed to be bigger? because the gun bays.... il give u an overhead view of it so you can see the porportions more correctly. And if it still looks a little wide il change it. But i intentionally made it a little larger, but it shouldn't look too big? hmmm il post the pics.

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 08:03 PM
Ok here is the overhead. Uhhm i can slim up the sides a bit make the cockpit look bigger, but its kinda tuff at this stage to make size adjustments to the cockpit itself. But the sides can be slimmed up if u want me too.

01 January 2003, 11:23 PM
hmmm, little tweaks in head:

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 11:48 PM
Ila: thats pretty good looking. ahh the front of the face looks a little flat to me. I dunno if u meant it to be like that but just thought ide let u know. But very good start so far:thumbsup:

01 January 2003, 12:01 AM
Rice ManX - Functionally, it's going to operate like a toon. The hatches will be closed and then *bam!* they'll be open with guns, etc. aimed at the hero. I want to go with guns and weapons that will look oversized for the ship to emphasize the "oh crap" expression that we will cut to on our hero. Try not to think to logically about how the ship works. It's a cartoon vehicle and we'll probably squash and stretch it to emphasize the action.

We can get away with a lot in 3D because parts of the ship can scale rotate and overlap inside the hatches (as long as this isn't visible to the camera). Logically a rocket launcher wouldn't fit if there were already a railgun stored inside. But with 3D we can store objects so that they occupy the same space. Make sense?

In the end I think we'll probably need 4 versions of the ship. One for general flying around shots (the hatches can be unoperational. Another 2 for the gun and the mechanical hand scenes. And the last will have a detailed cockpit for the end when the aliens give up and exit the ship.

ila_solomon - The shape of the head is looking much better. I know it's still WIP, but I'll mention these things just so that you don't overlook them.

The eyes should have eyelids.
My sketches had 4 nostrils and they were lower.
I'm still not happy with the ears. Too symetrical and trumpet looking. Maybe more organic where they attach to the head. Those donut shapes on the skull should be skin rolls.
Neck thinner.

Here's a link to the audio files that I mentioned previously. [Right-click-save] ( files/
Voices are rough, but they'll do for animation tests.
Voice Credit = Dan Ross

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 03:47 AM
Allrite, here is an update. I slimmed up the sides considderably, and improved the overall shape considderably. if u want an overhead il give it to u. But rite now im dead tired so im gonna goto bed early. Cya guys :wavey:

01 January 2003, 07:32 PM
ill join gladly :) awesome concept too!

01 January 2003, 08:49 PM
Just wanted to let ya know that this project looks great so far. If there is anything I can do to lend a hand just let me know. I can do some light modeling and animation with Maya or XSI, also have Combustion, Illusion for FX or Compositing and Avid Xpress DV so I could do some editing as well. I have access to broadband so no prob getting the files. I could also help out with the web site as the web is what sent me down this strange and twisted path I am on these days. Please let me know.

01 January 2003, 09:09 PM
again, some additions + tweaks: (still wip u know)
Kirt, I keep 3 noseholes just because of 3 eyes & 3 fingers structure, if you don't mind.

01 January 2003, 11:38 PM
Hey, pwhitlock, I'm sort of "in charge" of the website, I wouldn't mind you working with me, though these guys may need you more for modeling and such...

Kirt, you've got volunteers, where are you?

*starts slapping Kirk's volunteers*

*kirt* "trent, what are you doing?"

*trent* "I was anticipating you will, sir."

*kirt* "go away, please"

*trent: *jumps off ship*

Hehe, just bored...

EDIt: Hey, Kirt, is it OK if I go ahead and make you a site? splash and all? It won't be anything fancy, and it'll be missing a lot of the stuff, but I think I can wing a decent site, do you mind if I got ahead and start?

01 January 2003, 12:12 AM
ila_solomon - Wow, that's starting to look really good! Excellent work. The 4 nostrils was done deliberately to break up the 3-n-3 pattern of his anatomy. I drew him originally with 3, but I liked 4 better. What does everyone else think? 3 or 4 nostrils?

Rice ManX - I still think the scale looks off. Bring the center height of the canopy up and round it off more. That should probably fix it.

CGFreak - I don't have anything specific at the moment, but if you'd like to design a few props that would get us moving on some more modelling. Need: hand gun for hero, teardrop shaped mobile home (2 wheeled with trailor hitch type), weapon designs for ship, mechanical hand designs for ship.

Wiz - What can you offer? Skills? Software? That might help me find a job for you to do on this project. Glad you can help, I just need to know what to assign to you.

pwhitlock - Your compositing help will be greatly appreciated. I didn't have time in school to mess with composite software, so that's one of my greatest weaknesses.

unLevel - Are we ready for a website already? Geez you guys are really pushing me on this ... keep it up! What can we set up on the site? We'll need a place to put files that everyone can share and hosting concept work would be nice (my webspace is going to eventually run out of room).

I imagine that we'll want to keep somethings to ourselves so that there are a few surprises to the public when the film is done. For example, if we post up the complete storyboard the jokes will be expected and not as funny. So, restricted access to some files would probably be a good thing.

That's all I have for now ... I've been sick the past couple of days. :hmm:

01 January 2003, 12:17 AM
No wait ... I do have this horrible title graphic that I was playing around with. It sucks, I know. But what can you expect when I'm coughing up my spleen? :D

01 January 2003, 12:26 AM
coughing up your spleen? Take two of these *hands "2" to Kirt* and call me in the morning...

Ok, hmm....I wish there was a good FREE webhost out there that I could host all of you guys, kinda like what I want to do with CoLabs (we'll be offering artists their own webspace one day hopefully)....

Oh, well, I'll get right to work on the site, and start hunting up webhosts...

01 January 2003, 01:39 AM
:bounce: Well let me know when you get to the point that I can be of assistance.

01 January 2003, 01:53 AM
hehe, playing around, splash concept....

EDIT: Just got a good idea for sometihng....disregard that splash....hehhe, this is going to be cool...hehe

01 January 2003, 06:38 AM
pwhitlock - can you do modelling also? Do you or anyone else have access to a recording studio or something suitable that we can record voices? Know anyone who is a voice talent who might be interested in helping with this no budget project?

unLevel - "Be afraid"? What are you trying to say? :D I'm waiting with nervous apprehension for your next submission.

01 January 2003, 10:18 AM
I can help in modeling!
i work with wings so i can pretty much improt it with out any problem to any Program!

01 January 2003, 12:12 PM
Kirt, I was JUST PLAYIN...

I, too, am waiting anxiously for my next submission...

01 January 2003, 09:41 PM
just shoes remain...crits on others.

01 January 2003, 09:43 PM
low-poly shaded view:

01 January 2003, 09:44 PM
no fingernails? :(

and ila behind neck u can get a way from that triangle
just delete the edge in middle :) awesome!

01 January 2003, 11:16 PM
hey, lilsolomon, I'd add a bit more 'legs' before you add shoes...

Just a thought, VERY nice model..

01 January 2003, 03:00 AM
Ok, ok, Kirt, since you're anxiously awaiting...

EDIT: man, it looks a lot rougher than I had originally thought...

So.....don't start complaining yet...

01 January 2003, 08:54 AM
but I think a simple web site with cartoonish touch & vivid colors, like warner bros & chuck jones style would be much better ;)
I suggest let Kirt designs primary look & basic style of everything, including the site :) what you think?

01 January 2003, 09:20 AM
unLevel - I agree with ila, the site should be playfull and colorful. The short is a comedy about mischevious hooligan aliens causing havoc around a trailor park. I think the website should reflect that bit of humor and juvenility, but without being amateurish.

It might be easier when I have some more artwork. Or if you have an idea I could create something specific for the site.

ila_solomon - I can't convince you to put the 4 nostrils on there, huh? :p I got a few more suggestions for you but I need to do another sketch of his backside to illustrate. I'm at work now, but I'll get back to you tomorrow on it.

Wiz - When you see something you want to do, jump on it before someone else does. :D Or better yet, let me know what you think you'd do well modelling and I'll try to get some concepts for you. Busy busy busy ... but I'll do my best to keep everyone working and happy.

01 January 2003, 01:29 PM
alright, alright....

Whatever you guys want to do with the site, it's fine with me...

I just want something to do to help out, since I'm learning modeling right now, I didn't think I could do that.....

If you guys want to do the site, that's fine.....

Sorry, maybe I should have warned you that I'm a newb to EVERYTHING....

If there's something else I can do, since I goofed the website, just tell me...

01 January 2003, 03:07 PM
ill be glad to model characters :)!

01 January 2003, 09:46 PM
I can't convince you to put the 4 nostrils on there, huh?
:D LOL! ok, I make them 4 just for your pleasure (but in final renders just before hard printing I make them 3 again!! ;) )
ok, now show me some 'Back Stage' Kirt. soon after I finish the entire polygon model I'll post you a Maya . obj version for your examination, then I practice with rigging & animation test.(anybody else here wanna animate? Andres ? where are you?...
After that I begin to model the 'Super Hero' (yes, all you hear that, the 'Super Hero' is mine! nobody touch him! emm..., I mean nobody create a single polygon of him!! :p :) :D but maybe I change my mind! LOL! ... -> J/K )


01 January 2003, 09:48 PM
hey, lilsolomon...

you using wings, right?

cause I just d/l it and I'm learning watch out...hehe...

Also, maybe I should have asked first...

WHAT DO YOU WANT ON THE WEBSITE? (color scheme/ general layout, do you even want me doing one?)

01 January 2003, 10:19 PM
I'm very interested in films in general, so I'd really like to help in any way. Unfortunately I'm not a 3D guy, so I might be out of the picture, but my offer stands. :)

01 January 2003, 10:21 PM
what kind of guy are you?


01 January 2003, 10:28 PM
Loooking forward to seeing your treatment, Kirt.
Ila's model is looking great! And those side-kick designs! :buttrock:

01 January 2003, 10:38 PM
:) well, I don't want anything yet!, I think it's soon having a dedicatd site for that, but ask Kirt if you insist. :) (& I'm not 'lil', I'm 'ila'! ... hehe)
Ila's model is looking great!
Thanx friend, & I wish you accept some job here :)

01 January 2003, 10:39 PM
my bad!!!!!!

I seem to have a lot of "my bads" lately...

01 January 2003, 11:39 PM
Thanx friend, & I wish you accept some job here :)

I have yet to complete a challenge :hmm:
Would rather not let anyone down.

When I have some time I am working on a short called "Father's Day". I really hope this forum produces a festival piece. I've seen lots of attempts peter out. I trust you guys to break through.

I'm 'pressing my thumbs for ya'!
(That's the funky German way of crossing yer fingers :scream:

01 January 2003, 12:32 AM
ila - Sorry, I got involved with my Robin Hood picture today (deadline is tomorrow). But here's what I had in mind. The straps that attach at his hips should continue all the way around the back like a belt and attach to the overalls in the back with two belt loops. Think you can do that without the illustration? Sorry, you got so far into the modelling and I didn't provide a back view. The belt will, I hope, help define where his waist is more from the back view.

Oh ... and I plan on doing some of the animation. That's about the only part of 3D that I can tolerate. Heheheh.

unLevel - Don't give up on the site yet. Keep trying and you'll hit on something spectacular. I don't have any ideas to help you with it right now, though. Once we get the model rigged we can get a few pose shots for you to use. I think putting a 2D image on the front page will be misleading since this is going to be a 3D short.

Wiz - I'll try and get a character sheet for you before the end of the weekend. We'll need cows, a cat, lady in curlers and her baby. Plus there is still the issue with the second alien. I'm thinking a different race of alien would be the way to go, rather than making a chubby clone of ila's model.

Culann - Set designs? Sound like fun to you? We'd love to have your help.

dobermunk - Thanks! I hope it's a festival piece too. Would be great to see everyone's hard work turn out to be something grand. Trying not to get my hopes up, but my wife says it's a funny story and I usually trust her judgement. :D

01 January 2003, 01:51 AM
Ok, ok...

here's a sample of a another design I"m working on simultaneously:

EDIT: I don't know why I'm showing you the other design, cause it has nothing to do with the project, just wanted you guys to look at it, maybe?

I just don't know what to do with this site....cartoony is sort out of my reach right now (I'm a newb....I think I may have mentioned it before...)

If there's any sites that you see and say "wow, that layout would really work for this project" PLEASE, PLEASE!!!!!!! TELL ME!!

01 January 2003, 02:41 AM
im here to help aswell, this looks like a promising short. I am able to do FX and im a 2d designer and a web designer aswell.

01 January 2003, 03:07 AM
let me get to it.
something i just coocked up.

hope this is teh kinda color scheme u looking for. Send me some more images to work with and i will be done with it in no time.

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 04:10 AM
Ok, here is an update, havn't had much time tho to play with it. I hope this is more acceptable for u Kirt? It looks more TOony to me so i hope it is! And i hope im not dragging this thing out too much? :curious:

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 05:13 AM
Ok well i just took alook at your sketches for the ship again Kirt, and for somereason i can't get down that streamlined shape youv got goin there. And like youv said before, the side of it are a lil too big. But im hopeing you like the one i have now?!? but if u really want that exact i could restart it. But ive just noticed the overwhelming dissimilarities the sketches and the model have :scream:

01 January 2003, 08:15 AM
Rice ManX - Hmmm ... yeah, it looks more like a hovercraft than a spaceship. Maybe the sketches are deceptive. The body of the ship is nothing more than a pancaked sphere. There are no bulges on the 'wings'. The cockpit can probably be formed from 1/4 of a sphere and the engines are just cylinders with cones inside. It's ok if you want to try again ... we're not in a hurry right? :D

Unlevel & illustrativ (welcome :wavey: ) - I think I have a solution to the website design problem. How's this sound? We use a rendered view of the inside of the ship and use it for the web interface. There is going to be a few monitors, gauges and a halo-projection device in the cockpit that we can use to display images, text or 3D rotations. Also several switches or buttons that will access these little eye-candy goodies. I was thinking we can have ...

... a captain's log (or ship's log if that's to presumptuous of me) for recording specific events or adding our bios/notes/pictures/whatever relevant or of interest regarding the project.

... a pre-flight checklist that would show our progress on our way to "Launch". Little red lights next to labels (i.e. concept, storyboard, audio, models, previsual, anim tests, render tests, first rough, LAUNCH!) would turn green as we updated or passed one of these milestones. These would also provide links to whatever eyecandy we have available.

... a systems display which would bring up a display of software, hardware used to make the film. Links to appropriate sites and of course one for CGTalk at the top!

... just about anything else we wanted in here. A single white sequined glove hanging over the rearview mirror might link to SETI, Rosewell homepage, Mary-Kate & Ashley or whatever else alien you can think of. Links to the artists homepages, favorite foods for munching during rendertimes (you know stuff like twinkies re-filled with peanut butter and cheeze or oreos with bacon).

Anyone know Flash? This would work best in Flash I think.

Anyway, I got a lot of drawing to do this weekend to catch up to you guys and make sure you all have something to work on. Can't do it in the morning because I have to finish my Robin Hood before the 2D Forum lynches me.

01 January 2003, 09:48 AM
Hey Kirt ,i woudl love to model a 3nd character :) sounds lots of fun! here is an example of my Work.. (My Wip atm)
(just so you can see my genral Skill)

01 January 2003, 10:58 AM
oh - ive been browsing these forums for about two months now and just yet discovered this board here ;)

This short your are attempting seems to be fun stuff to do and i would like to contribute (as little as i can do).

I am a beginner in modelling and texturing and wanted to try my skills at some spacecritters for your short if they are needed - is there a storyboard for the movie i can take a look at?
Or just give me an assignment if you have something in the back of your mind :)

anyways - i like the idea of doing a group project rather to see my meager attempts on my own :thumbsup:

01 January 2003, 02:53 PM
Hey just got my combustion 2.1 upgrade!:buttrock:
I am kind of busy with a project for work right now so I can't really devote alot of time to modelling and besides i'm not really good at that imo. I will be happy to help with animation, and still can help out with the web page. I don't want to take away from anyone elso though. As usual, let me know!

01 January 2003, 03:09 PM
Wow, Kirt, you've got what, 10-15 people all wanting work on your project....

How cool is that?

01 January 2003, 03:19 PM
Set Design sounds great! I just don't know if my skill level is high enough for that. As long as I don't have to do Star Wars-esque perspective line overkill sketches, I figure I'll be alright. :)
How advanced is the script, btw? One of my main strengths is writing, so maybe I could help in that department? Only if you want, of course, it's your story/script after all!

01 January 2003, 03:39 PM
well, I don't know flash personally, but my brother does, and so does the other members of CoLabs if you want their help.

Sounds good, Kirt....

Also, I might take up attempting modeling a few things, I'm just beginning, though, so you'll have to be patient...

Also, anyone have any ideas for a webhost...

hey, illustrativ, let's me and you chat or something sometime, so we can both work on the design, once we get a webhost, we can start swapping and modifing our designs until we're both satisfied or whatever....

Also, do you guys want a splash page?

If you do, we could do several and use coding (it can be done several ways in html) to randomly generate one out of several...

Just some thoughts...we need a webhost...

Rice ManX
01 January 2003, 03:43 PM
@Kirt. hmm yes the sketches were deceptive in that case. But thank you for clarifying. I think i will restart :shrug: Il see if i can come up with an update today. New computer comes in today also!!! allrite seeya guys around.

01 January 2003, 05:18 PM
Originally posted by unLevel
Wow, Kirt, you've got what, 10-15 people all wanting work on your project....

How cool is that? Way cool! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Like I said earlier (maybe in the other thread?), this short would not be possible if I were to do it all myself. I'm thrilled that so many talented artists have taken an interest in it. Expecially since you haven't even seen the storyboards yet (I'm working on them ... I'm working on them!). I expect that we'll all be very proud of this short when it's complete and at the very least we'll all have learned a thing or two about short film production.

OK ... just a few things this morning, then it's back to work:

Culann - The story is complete, I just have to translate it to storyboard. If you have any suggestions to improve it after seeing the storyboards, I'd be happy to hear them.

Don't worry about your skill level. I think we're all new to this in some way or another. This is my first short that I directed, so I imagine I'm doing dumb things already. We're all doing this to learn so, do what you can and we'll all help you get better. :thumbsup:

unLevel - I'm not a big fan of splash pages, but if there is a logical reason or necessity for it, then go ahead. I think I have an idea for the webhost, but we'll need to advance the project more so that they know we're serious. Work on the design parts and outline the content some more while you wait. Then we'll be ready to upload everything when we get the space.

Wiz - Better than I could do. :D (see modellers below).

mmh.Nemo - :wavey: Welcome! Storyboards are currently being re-developed for publish to the net. (see below)

modellers - You'll have to wait until this weekend before I have anymore concept stuff done. This project has been on scratch papers and bookmarked in the back of my head for awhile. I never thought it would gather so much enthusiasm so quickly. I'm trying to catch up to you guys now and make all my crib notes into something more presentable (or at least something you can work with). I'll sketch and draw as much as I can during the weekend so that you'll have something to work on during the next week. Sadly, I work late nights and long shifts Monday thru Friday.

everyone - I'd like to start a project log so that I can keep track of everything. If you do work on this project in anyway, shape or form ... please e-mail me your full name so that I can include you in the closing credits. Provide a discription of what you have done also so that I can match up your username here to your name/e-mail address. Thanks!

Also, if you have an idea for something you'd like to include on the website when it goes live, go ahead and write it up and send to me for proof reading/approval/whatever. I'll make sure that it gets to the right person when we're at that step. This project is as much yours as it is mine. I'd like to see that you get your bit of praise for the hard work you've done. Personal bios, links to homepages, personal notes to our viewers, photos/avatars or special notes of thanks to your wife/girlfriend/parents/whoever are the types of things I'd like to see included on the site.

Until I win the CA lottery (like that's going to happen :hmm: ) I can't pay you guys, but I'm going to make sure that I do what I can to make sure you all get plenty of credit and recognition for your work.

Thanks in advance for helping me make my film a reality. :applause:

My e-mail address =

01 January 2003, 06:34 PM
Alright, I'll wait for the storyboards to see if I can contribute anything productive. :)

01 January 2003, 07:06 PM
sounds cool..
as this a volutntree thing ,i think no one is expecting to get money out of this..just pure fun ,and some learning :)

sounds good to me!

02 February 2003, 01:45 AM
Ok, guys, I sort of found a site that might be cartoony and hi-tech at the same time...

Now, I know Kirt you said about a cockpit thing, which is fine with me, I just want you guys to look at this, please...

EDIT: I'm almost at 300 posts!!!!!!!

02 February 2003, 07:33 PM
Ok, Kirt, I think the model is almost finished, need your confirmation (I send you an .obj mesh) then I begin rigging & materials

02 February 2003, 07:39 PM
One small critique:

there's a large seam going down his middle, do you think you could flatten that out?

02 February 2003, 07:48 PM
there's a large seam going down his middle, do you think you could flatten that out?
:) that's because it's mirrored & I haven't welded it yet. no prob friend that will be ok

02 February 2003, 08:05 PM
Hey, friend (as you referred to me(

Do you use wings?

02 February 2003, 08:11 PM

Beautiful model, Ila.

only one thing before I forget... Those feet are too big. They might look cool right now, but remember that he has to walk. I can't picture him walking with those feet.


PS. I missed all the updates for some reason, I'm currently reading them all... this is just a quick reply to crit Ila's model only, I haven't forgotten about the other guys, I'll reply again later... :)

02 February 2003, 09:31 PM
The alien, now that it is 3D, reminds me of some characters from an old game by Adventure Soft, called 'The Feeble Files'. It was, like this project, a send-up of sci-fi conventions and the protagonist was an expert crop circle creator...or something like that. It's quite old, really...I would take a few screenshots, but it won't run on my new PC. I found this pic online, though:

02 February 2003, 09:59 PM

02 February 2003, 11:00 PM
Hey, friend (as you referred to me), Do you use wings?
:) Indeed Dear Friend.
I can't picture him walking with those feet.
You shouldn't picture those big feet, you must animate! prepare yourself!
The alien, now that it is 3D, reminds me of some characters from an old game by Adventure Soft, called 'The Feeble Files'
You know these kind of cartoonish aliens are not orignal anymore, just the proportions & details are different.

02 February 2003, 11:03 PM
Kirt, please provide me a 'Color Scheme, use this pic if you prefer: I need the original (diffuse) plain colors.

& now some rendered shot: (forget the colors & ..., still WIP)

02 February 2003, 12:12 AM
GRRRRRR ... darn dial-up crappy ISP! I can't upload anything right now. They always seem to do this to me on the weekend. :annoyed:

ila - the model looks great! The only thing that I would change is the position of the hips and length of the legs. I think he's lost his pudgy pear-shaped body that I had in the concept drawing. I did a paint over your image to illustrate this ... but I can't show it to you (see above).

The renders look great. Looks like a clay model actually. Which could be an interesting look for the film. Is that intentional?

I'm not sure what you need on the colors. What's wrong with the color choices I have in the concept drawing?

02 February 2003, 08:13 AM
I see it's a painted illustration & you lit it from the back & darkened the front, I can't guess the exact colors of the cloth, body & shirt. :)
but it's ok I try my taste, & I think the colors should be more saturated & in contrast...what do you think?
The clay idea is great, I like these style (saw my 'beast of burden' entry?)

02 February 2003, 11:05 AM
Kirt, check your mail box (yahoo)

then here is a quick color test, I also changed somethings to fit more into 3d (especialy for animation), I scaled the shoes a bit & delete the front belts on them (they were attracting eyes too much)...I will adjust the hip & legs scales later.

02 February 2003, 10:41 PM
I really like the claymation look, but I don't know if it's going to be a wise decision for this short. I haven't been drawing character sketches with the clay look in mind, so I'm curious to see how the hero, the spaceship and the other characters are going to translate to that style.

Anyway, here's a couple more character designs. The Mom & her baby, which will live in one of the mobile homes that the aliens try to steal using thier tractor beam. The baby only appears breifly in the film and Mom will be carrying him.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 01:13 AM
Hey Kirt, ide post an update, but unfortunately ive tried a few times to remake the model. BUT i can't seem to get the cockpit rite, the distortions of the perspective drawing make my model turn out weird. If by any chance you can post an over head view of the space ship, that would help alot!!! but il see what i can do in the mean time.

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 01:33 AM
WTF..Kirtydude...Nobody wasnīt telling me about this project. If ya need something,... count me in. I am also awaiting my Challengeprice soon.... This means I can do some basicmodelling stuff too.. or Texturework or whatever...but I prefer 2d action. Ya know:beer:

So, tell me what to do...

Cheerz Buddy

Tommy Lee

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:38 AM
Never mind that last post Kirt, i think i got it this time around. After i eat il and do a few lil tweaks il make sure to post a pic up. Now that i think about it, it really looks much better...... ok cya round!:D

02 February 2003, 01:24 PM
Kirt nice concepts! can i model anyone?

02 February 2003, 07:50 PM
Try, Uri :->

02 February 2003, 12:24 AM
If you need help putting the movie together, I'm skilled with Adobe Premiere. I own version 6.5. I loved the 6.0 demo so much that I maxed my credit card to get it. I should probably have waited until AFTER I paid the rent. I wish I could have afforded the complete DV Collection.

02 February 2003, 12:49 AM
Also, I think that the little purple(? I'm colorblind) alien thing should constantly twitch its ears backwards. Sort of like a nervous tick.

02 February 2003, 11:29 AM
Sorry, I haven't updated here ...

Tommy - You know you're more than welcome to help. I just don't know what I can have you do right now. We're still early in the stages on this one. I'll think about it ... or if you see something you think you can contribute to, jump in there.

Rice ManX - I'll see if I can't work out some more sketches for the ship. I appreciate that you keep trying at it though. :thumbsup:

Wiz - Yeah, we're going strictly volunteer here. If you think you'd like to model one, then go for it! Just let everyone know what you're doing so we don't have a bunch of people doing the same thing.

Grosserfrosch - Like I said earlier, we'll definately need someone who can edit this thing together and piece in the sounds. I have no experience with doing that stuff. However, I think we're quite a way from that step at the moment. Keep and eye on the thread and speak up when we start asking around for editors.

I think the ears should be rigged for movement also, but I don't know about a nervous tick. They're hooligan teens - not homicidal loonies. Thanks for the suggestion. We may use it in one scene.

ila - Re: your last e-mail. I think short legs can still be animated. He may not have a large stride and we'll have to move him with quick shuffle-like walk, which is close to how I imagined he'd walk (see Sid from "Ice Age"). There will be less bending in the toe area, so I think you can put that front buckle back on his shoes and we won't have any problems.

I know, it's a nit-picky detail ... but I liked the shoes better with both buckles.

02 February 2003, 12:47 PM
Oo'Kay...Okay! ( I see you can't take it easy! I let you try animate that buddy with short fat legs & big feet! ;) he will look like circus clown or charly chaplin :p )
anyway, did you check the refined .obj version yet?
cheers everybody

02 February 2003, 01:09 PM
I think a clownish circus seal waddle would fit the character great!
Who's riggin'?:p

02 February 2003, 02:08 PM
I don't think anyone has jumped in for rigging yet.
Grosserfrosch - welcome to the post production part of the team, I will be handling compositing and some editing with Avid, when the time comes we'll have to go over the storyboards and chat about how to put this whole thing together.
Things are looking great guys, keep it up.:applause:

02 February 2003, 02:18 PM
hey Kirt i need some images to start the website, so let me know when you have some renders for me to get something going. Dont worry i can use flash aswell, so a flash site is ok.

02 February 2003, 02:50 PM
Who's riggin'?

well, I do try, but I have to rig it in Maya, & I never did it before, so maybe it takes long for achieving the best setup :) could anybody help for rigging in Maya?


02 February 2003, 09:13 PM
I'm skilled with Adobe Premiere. I know some of the other video editing packages but I'm best with Premiere. Its also the only one that I own. Once this thing starts going, I'll PM you so we can set up a chat.

02 February 2003, 10:20 PM
WTF... :eek:

Just came to this thread... I should visit this forum more often.
This is exactly what it was started for.
Great work everyone :buttrock:
Cheers, Jeroentje
(hm.., would be cool to make a movieposter for this one... Time dammit. Why has a day just 24 hours...)

02 February 2003, 11:28 PM
:) HI jeroen, good to see you here
well, dudes this Maya killed me! finally I've got a rough render out of it with the model modified as Kirt mentioned. copy.jpg

02 February 2003, 12:10 AM

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 12:22 AM
whew, ok Kirt im hoping this is more of what you had in mind!?!?! ahhm, i was concentrating mainly on that cockpit and the ships saucer shape, which i think ive got down. The tail fin needs work but that itsn't a problem.:p This is a perspective if u want me to i can post side veiws and front views.

02 February 2003, 02:54 AM
ila - Circus clowns and Charlie Chaplain are both very funny, which is exactly what we want for the short. :D It's not as bad as it sounds though. Throughout most of the short the aliens will be inside the ship. One of them will have a short scene in which we'll see him walk, but we can always use the 2nd (yet undesigned) alien. At the end they will crawl, stumble out of the ship.

The design of this guy was to give the impression that he's a chubby lazy slob. Like he spends too much time sitting on the couch watching TV. So the bottom heavy look of his body was important to that look.

I'll look at the new Maya file tomorrow, I had one of my kids switching schools today. So, that's readjusted my free time schedule a bit.

I didn't have much luck with the last model I tried to rig, but I have done them before in Maya. I'll give it a shot and see what I come up with.

illustrativ - I'd start saving some of the images that you see here. We'll most probably want to show a few WIP images on the site as well as the concepts. As for renders for the actual interface of the site, you'll have to wait until we get the interior of the ship modelled. I've been working on concepts for that (a little bit), hopefully I'll have something solid soon.

pwhitlock & Grosserfrosch - I think you guys will have the longest wait times, at least until we have storyboards that we can work a previz reel from. (Forgive me, I don't remember if you said so) Do either one of you do modelling as well? There will be several props that will need to be done and some of them set up to be animated.

jeroentje - Hey! It's my partner in crime! :D Except for the short blurb that I put on my website, I haven't really been spreading the news that this is started. But, it doesn't seem to deter people from finding out about it. That's good I suppose, I just wish I had held off a bit before posting the starting thread. I had no idea there would be this many people interested immediately and now I'm trying to catch up on concept and story work.

I swear all of my clocks run at 4X normal speed. So I suppose in California we have 6 hour days (In other words, I know how you feel).

Rice ManX - Yeah! :thumbsup: Definately going in the right direction now. Can't wait to see more.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 04:16 AM
Yes Kirt that would be wonderfull if you could sketch the interior of the ship.... i still have a few things to do with the exterior (latches, engines, vents etc...) im also wondering i there is anyone else here who works in 3D Studio Max, because mixing animation files between two diff apps can be really frustrating. I myself am a 3d studio Max user.

02 February 2003, 04:16 AM
:rolleyes: I could probably help out with some props, just nothing organic. My modeling skills are at best pathetic. I think I remember you said something a while back about a trailer and handgun. Maybe I could give those a whirl. I take it you are going with Maya 4.5 for the project so I will work in that. I will post some rough ideas soon. Can't wait for th post work though!

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 08:04 AM
So I am in... Iīll see what I can do right now...hmmmmmmmmmmm. Well, Iīll think about something if ya send me a rough story or I wait for directions.

Cheerz buddy

Tommy Lee

02 February 2003, 10:16 AM
Originally posted by Kirt
jeroentje - Hey! It's my partner in crime! :D Except for the short blurb that I put on my website (...)[/B]
He, that is exactly where I found the link ;)

I swear all of my clocks run at 4X normal speed. So I suppose in California we have 6 hour days (In other words, I know how you feel).

Hm, funny, although we (unfortunately) live half a world apart from eachother we do live in the same twilight zone ;)

I definitely want to do a movieposter design (did I mention I do graphic design for a living aswell?). Anyway, maybe this weekend (choice: entering the LOTR challenge or doing the poster.......)

Cheers, Jeroen

02 February 2003, 10:35 AM
Do your LOTR entry first. We have plenty of time for movie posters. Besides, wouldn't it be easier if you had a better understanding of the content of the film?

Enough talk ... I'm back to work on the storyboards. I'm such a bottleneck. Heheheh :D

02 February 2003, 11:00 AM
LOL good points ;)

02 February 2003, 02:30 PM
ok Kirt i got all the wip's so far so im just waiting on the interior now. Since it wont be ready for now is there anything else i can do?

02 February 2003, 02:55 PM
Kirt, do you need me for anything? I don't know but I think illustrativ's got the website?

If you don't need me now, that's fine, I'll just go find some other project to destroy...ehehe..

02 February 2003, 03:32 PM
Hey, maybe I can do one of the other space ships, Kirt, tell me which one I need to do, though be warned, I'm not the best modeler in the world....

02 February 2003, 05:18 PM
unlevel - There is only one ship design. Er, actually there are more at the very end of the film. But, they will be shown from a distance converging onto the trailor park. If you want to model some minature scaled saucers that would be OK. They don't have to be the same as the primary ship, but I think they should be saucers and not something like an X-wing. These can be modelled, textured and set up for animation of any moving parts (i.e. if you want to make one a revolving disc). Also, for this shot, several different types of mobile homes will be needed. I'd like them to be true "mobile" homes, not the double-wide type that are parked and secured. In other words, they have to have wheels on them. :D I'd say no more than 10 mobile homes and saucers will be needed.

illustrativ - I can't think of anything at the moment. Everyone's waiting on me, I guess. I'm going as fast as I can. :D

Tommy Lee - Probably not what you want to work on right now, but I love your tattoo style and think you could probably come up with a kick ass looking title design. I want the title, Alienz, to look somewhat like a cross between grafitti and tattoo design. I think it will really set up the characters as being little hooligans. So, the title should look rebellious and alien (in origin), but easy to read for us humans. :D You think you could do that?

ila - I opened the latest Maya file and everything looks like it's there. However, everything got merged together into one object. So, if I select an eye all of the geometry gets selected. There is only one object in the hypergraph. :shrug:

02 February 2003, 06:17 PM
Saucer you say. here is a saucer i did awhile back, it has a nice texture on can have it if you want.

02 February 2003, 09:59 AM
Kirt, I am going to post you the new model with parts detached, & clown walk is good IMO too! :)

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 10:31 AM
Kirt... you are Steven Spielberg and I am the little So ya say and I do!!!!!:bowdown:

Sounds good and I like to do that for ya buddy. Iīll come up with first titlesketches this weekend.
And BTW..Great team so far....

Cheerz to all the Kirtyslaves..hehe and Kirt!!!!!!
:beer: :beer:

Tommy Lee

02 February 2003, 04:49 PM
Here is the gun sorry about the PLE. I only have maya at work. Kinda Marvin Martian'ish.

02 February 2003, 12:04 AM

02 February 2003, 12:36 AM
Hello :wavey:
Sorry, I've been doing storyboards and an occasional break to do some other things. The weekend is almost here ... expect some new stuff by Monday.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 06:35 AM
Ok well im posting just to let you all know, that i am making some good progress on the ship, the tail fin is done, the engines about 60% done, the overall mesh is about 70% done, i added a bunch of little details tonight, i don't think its worth posting tho. And im working on hatches for guns, THEN i will begin modelling interior of space ship!!!! (sketches for that would be wonder full Kirt, or would you rather me come up with a design!?!?!) Thats my update for now. I will also start on guns this weekend. Cya guys around!

02 February 2003, 11:22 AM
Just want to say: keep up the good work!!! Look sreally cool at the moment. I would love to help out, but I use XSI, and have very little to no knowledge of maya.

02 February 2003, 10:12 PM
OK, I've done a few different concepts of the interior of the ship and this is the one that I like the best so far. This is incomplete, the perspective is FUBAR and the angle makes it difficult for modellers ... but it's a start. :D

I'll work on it a bit more today and see if I can't clarify a few details for the modellers.

02 February 2003, 11:03 PM

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 11:10 PM
Cool, ahhm il begin modelling that into the ship soon as i get a chance, too. I have a good idea of spacing, but a drawing to show the porportions of everything (spacing, hight) would be helpful. Mean time il see if i can't show you my progress so far on the exterior of the ship.

02 February 2003, 01:02 AM
Kirt, what are the 2 large round ....mirrors? or is it kinda a semi-transparent objective thing, kinda like a mechwarrior thing showing fuel, speed, and whatnot?

I just wonder if it will obstruct their view? If it's a semi-transparent thing, I guess it won't obstruct their view, just wondering what it it....

02 February 2003, 03:12 AM
The two round objects in front of them are HUDs (Heads Up Displays). They will be clear or tinted glass and graphics (targetting cursors, ship stats, etc.) will be projected onto them.

The container behind his seat which holds a one eyed creature isn't really necessary for the film. I just put it there to show the space is used for storage. The box will be needed though. More on that later.

02 February 2003, 04:02 AM
:wavey: Just curious if anyone has looked at the gun. Is this useful or should I try again. Also what other types of props need to be modeled. I think we can just use some public domain props for most of the sets. Things like chairs, tables, etc. Let me know.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 04:28 AM
Yes Pwhitlock, i looked at it, it looks fine to me the main person to ask is Kirt... 1 q. How are you going to get that from the MayaPL to your licensed version!? i don't think they allow you to do exports. All of the other props sound like they are needed but again, Kirt is the dood here :)

02 February 2003, 04:30 AM
Yes, I saw the gun and it does look too Marvin the Martian-ish for this short. It would probably be fine if the aliens were packing heat, but the guns I want are for the agent. So, they should be Terran in design. Nothing too sci-fi either. Maybe just a slightly modified clip-type handgun (not a revolver).

I don't want to use public domain props because (1) those who know 3D will recognize them as public domain props, (2) I think it will be difficult to match the styles to this 'cartoon' short, and (3) the public domain props that I've seen ... uh ... well, they suck. I think we can do much better to create our own props. :D

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 05:51 AM
Here is a WIRE render. (thk god for the Edit button lol)

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 05:51 AM
Ok i have a few updates, im also going to post up a render i thought was pretty cool for Illustrative, its low res and small, ask for bigger 1 if u want it.(i think yer the one doing the webpage?) so far i think its coming along great!.


02 February 2003, 06:50 AM
Rice ManX - It's hard to tell from this angle, but it looks like the disc part needs to be thickened for the toon look. I like the way the cabin is shaping up. It's a definate improvement over the last one. The engines need to go though. They look really buggered up. Stick with a simple form like I had in the concepts. If you try to get to intricate with it, you'll loose the toon feeling.

Here are a couple more illustrations for you guys to work with. First one is the agent's gun. This is more along the lines of what I wanted. It doesn't have to be exactly like this, but close enough. The mini grenade launcher (at the bottom in this design) will be used in the short.

Secondly, is the design for the other alien. Look, his legs are designed for walking! Heheheh. I'd like to give him a few tattoos, but I'm lousy at designing these. I know Tommy is a tattoo artist and I sort of had him in mind when doing this guy. How about it Tommy? Can you give me an alien looking sleeve tattoo?? Maybe one for the center top of his head too?

I'll color the alien later. I'm still working out the details on the ship interior.

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 07:00 AM
No Prob dude. And for the titledesign...well I need some storyboard to throw out the best. The tattos are coming along quickly. And mybe I can do some tweakings on the second Alien?
So please send me the highrez-pic to my email please.

Laterz Kirtydude


02 February 2003, 08:51 AM
Does he not need the third eye Kirt?
& now who want to model this guy?...hurry up!

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 09:19 AM
Here is a first rough tattoo-design for the second dude... I also did some tweakings on the allover-design. May ya like it.

02 February 2003, 09:23 AM
Tommy - I like the changes you made to the clothing and boots. The face looks too old now ... I think the addition of forehead rinkles and bags under the eyes are too much for the character. The tattoos are definately what I had in mind, but maybe a little less. Go up his right arm but maybe just a flash on his left bicept. I also want to keep the tubes on his head wrinkle free. I think the shape of that will be repeated throughout the film (the other alien's head, the end of the gun, some shapes on the ship, and an intergalactic jellyfish - not yet seen) and it lends itself to the overall style. No offense, but your redesign makes them look like penises.

ila - No, the third eye isn't that important. I wanted to do this one different, like he's a different race of alien, but could come from the same planet (i.e. his hieght is similar so he fits in the ship). Thier orgins are the same but the class is different ... kind of like comparing a dog and a cat.

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 09:46 AM
LOL...ya right about the penises...hehe. is the redesign of the redesign with more tattoos.:beer:

And I think bout the tattoos: When its modeled i should get the colormap and add the tattoos by myself to get a realistic look of the tattoos.


Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 10:38 AM
Okay Kirt, ive made a new engine, and made a new Tail fin, but im too tired to post it tonight. Il post it tomarrow with some other screens so you can see the thickness fo the saucer (although i think its fine as it is). Night thnx for your Crits by the way! lol

02 February 2003, 01:59 PM
I bought the gun from full version at work into PLE at home to render and email. The original is at work just don't tell my boss:rolleyes: . I have some others that are more along the lines of what you had in the sketch, i will modify some of them and post them either today or tomorrow for your review. Thanks. Like I said, modelling is not my strong point, but I am trying. Also, I wasn't thinking of PD models for main props, but for things in the background. But I see your point.:)

02 February 2003, 12:56 AM
Hey guys,

I just noticed this thread and thought it looked like a cool project. I am just learning modeling and thought I'd give a handgun a whirl for 3eyez. It's somewhat based on kirts concept, but it's an early wip so let me know what you think and let me know if it will come in handy. If there are any other props that need to be modeled I'd be glad to give 'em a whirl.

Here's the gun wip...



02 February 2003, 02:29 AM
hey JD i think that gun is definately what kirk is looking for, i love it.its looking good, but wait on the boss to make his crits.

02 February 2003, 03:07 AM
:shrug: Great gun Jdex, well on to other things. No seriously that will be perfect I bet. That IS Kirts gun.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:09 AM
it looks awesome, round the top a bit though. (I know im abit of a hypocrit :rolleyes: )

02 February 2003, 03:13 AM
hey Rice ManX how is the ship coming along and do u have anything ready for me yet?

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:38 AM
Ok Kirt, i think the engine is pretty good looking now. ive got two views shaded and a Clay render so you can see it all. I dout im going to need to change the saucer shape. But if u want me too i will.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:42 AM
Here is a shaded view.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:55 AM
It would be awesome if you could start on Guns Illustrative (for the ship) if you want i can export the model of what i have so far so you can get the right dimensions of the Gun Bays? Or wait arn't you doing the webpage? i can't remember, if you need renders for webpage sure i can give u plenty. For some reason i thought you were Pwhitlock, but if u want to do its guns also thats fine!

02 February 2003, 04:00 AM
me not that good at modeling, me good at web designing.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 04:03 AM
Ya i just remember, lol srry. Ya i can render some stuff out for you. What u want? Wires...

02 February 2003, 04:05 AM
give me all you can, ill soon be off to bed.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 04:06 AM
Ok give me about 30 minutes il see what i can whip up for you.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 04:21 AM
Illustrative- Ok well nevermind that statement, cuz u hide your email. So what IS your email, then il shutup.

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 06:43 AM are some titledesigns I threw out. Check it out and tell me which one comes close to ya mind...

Cheerz buddy:beer:

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 07:15 AM
Tommy- I like the First Row far right, thats my fav. Awesome designs!

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 07:25 AM
Thx man:beer:

02 February 2003, 12:09 PM
Real quick because it's late ...

JDex - The gun is more of what I had in mind, good job :thumbsup: I'd like a few adjustments though (I like to keep everyone busy so they don't get ahead of me :D ). First of all, the bottom barrel should be small ... bullet size. The mini-grenade launcher on the gun will be used to shoot a small vial (sort of a chemical/biological weapon). And it would be good to keep it functional so that we can see our hero load it.

The upper barrel I want to be larger than normal. So that his weapon looks greater than a pea shooter. Its exaggerated so that he's not underpowered too much in comparison to the ship weapons (he will be, but I don't want it too extreme).

I would probably model the gun with barrels and then model the bulbous covers over the top. That way we can animate the top cover kick-back and the bottom one can open as shown in the concept. Does that make sense or would another drawing help?

Tommy Lee - Love the titles so far. Number 4 and 6 are my favorites, but I like the shape of "en" in 5 over 6. Try upper and lowercase like this: AlienZ

Rice ManX - Renders are kind of dark. Can you render them with ambient light or just default shaded view with wireframe on top would be good until we have a final design. From what I can see it looks like your on the right path now. The new engine looks much better and more along what I had originally concepted. A little adjustment to the tail fin and window below ...

02 February 2003, 03:40 PM
hey Rice ManX sorry i went to my bed last night, my email address is: and please no spammers.Not from u Rice ManX, im talking guests who visit the forum.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:40 PM
Ya sure i can just take a screen of the model in its veiw port. Il see what i can do with the Tail fin and the cockpit. Although the cockpit is pretty close to accurate (i have your concept in the background viewport now for referance) in my side viewport. But il see what i can do.:cool:

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 05:24 PM
Yessir!!!!:beer: Title coming up soon!

02 February 2003, 07:00 PM
Here's an update...

I separated the components and reworked the design (my modifications from the concept weren't cleaning up very well so I sort of started over). I still need to make the clip, trigger, shell ejector, and work on the inner workings of the mini-grenade launcher (kirt I could use a bit more reference on this as far as how you see it being assembled).

Thanks for the encouragement guys... I have been trying to model for a few months now and this is the first model that resembles the vision...

pwhitlock... didn't mean to steal your project, I honestly didn't think it would turn out very good... :)

Hope you guys like... :p

02 February 2003, 09:25 PM
No prob Jdex. I wasn't upset :rolleyes: ........
I think your gun looks great! I just am looking forward to seeing this thing start to come together.:buttrock:

02 February 2003, 09:29 PM
Hey i wanna model the 2nd Alien! :)

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 11:11 PM
Kirt- IS it allright if i could get your Email ? that way i can send u my higher rez pics quicker, i know others won't get to see it, but mainly YOU need to critique it.

02 February 2003, 11:57 PM
kirk's email is on page 6... not sure what his file-size limit might be though...

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:58 AM
Thnx JDex i guess i missed that page...

02 February 2003, 10:55 PM
Wiz - Go ahead and start modelling, and post some WIP!

JDex - Looking good ... I'm working on a new drawing for you. One thing to keep in mind though, this is a cartoon film. The gun looks like a Half-life or Counterstrike Mod object. Soften up the edges and puff up that barrel. :D

ila - I think this is what you were looking for earlier. These are some of the colors that I'm using on the storyboards. So, if the short has a color pallette, this would be it (so far).

02 February 2003, 11:34 PM
Yeah sure, thanx Kirt...
but now I have a bigger problem, I can't export my model to obj without losing the shaders, texture mapping & bone structure, so you can't use my setup for shaders & skeleton in your maya3. I have not maya 3 & you have not 4.5 ;)
anybody knows if maya 4.5 PLE import/export .mb files correctly & with full support, let us know, please...thanx a lot..or at least a convertor that can do such a task.

"I'm fighting with maya's renderer to get a good quality out of it! even MR doesn't satisfy me enough, yet"


02 February 2003, 02:10 PM
*looks around*

Looks like everything's going good here, Kirt, just holler if you need anything, since I haven't DONE anything for your project yet...

02 February 2003, 02:38 PM
I will leave an eye in this thread! ;) hi hi

02 February 2003, 03:14 PM
Do we have a sound designer? I can do a little but my portable DAT recorder is broken so I have no way to get new sounds.

02 February 2003, 05:04 PM
I have some sound gear and a bit of the knowledge to use it... I can do some voices as well... if there is any voice direction ready and some script I'll give them a test run to see if they sound alright... just let me know...

BTW the gun is going good... no visual update right now... I have restarted it to reduce poly's and get more of the "puffed up" look... anxiously awaiting the new sketches kirt...

02 February 2003, 07:20 PM
hey ila as far as I have seen the PLE fully supports the ma/mb correctly. Textures and shaders are fully compatible. Just that once they are in PLE you can't export back out except in PLE format. So as long as it is going in but not meant to come back out you should be fine doing it that way.

02 February 2003, 07:38 PM
i just began this guy..very basic stuff
anyways i try to follow the simple look ila began
so here it is..

still no eye lids..(i am gonna do the sphere ila style)
and no hair things or ears..
really just begining..

02 February 2003, 11:42 PM
Hello everybody,...
Dear pabbloz, would you leave a hand instead of an eye for this?!! I know you are not busy with Space Duck project anymore! ;)
Hey Uri, good start man, I think you are doing right
examin the wireframe so you can see how 'clean' & 'smooth' is my model, do always keep the model's polygons in minimum, avoid unnecessary polys, then you will have more control & smooth curves.
& now we need a texture guy (this is always hard to find!)...Kirt himself or Tommy, please?...this eye iris texture that i've made is temporary... copy.jpg

& What about 'Classic B&W B-movies Style' ?! ;) copy.jpg

I think kirt must get hands on a Maya PLE version. then we see how we can transfer the files correctly.

02 February 2003, 11:49 PM

That's looking great ila... I really love the colors...

The only crit I have is the buttons need button holes, pretty anal huh! lol

Can't wait to see this here gun in his hands...

02 February 2003, 12:01 AM
I've got an absolutely awful voice. My accent is rather screwed up, it jumps around alot. I'll do a voice if I need to, you'll just have to hear it. I'll see if I can find somewhere to upload an audio clip. My host is for images only.

02 February 2003, 01:26 AM
ila - You are the man! That looks fantastic! Love the look and colors on the first image. Button holes aren't needed and I'll get 4.5 PLE next week (I'm off from work on vacation and downloading it at home would take forever).

I'll tell you what I know about making textures for models ... use procedurals and flat shaders. Hehehehe. But, if you can unwrap it for me I'll be more than happy to give it a try. (I should read up on Leigh's texturing how-tos).

I should be getting more of the storyboards up this weekend. I have several penciled and I'm going back and forth to color some. Then, making webpages to display them ... ugh I wish I had done these earlier.

Here's what I have uploaded so far. ( It's only 4 panels of the intro sequence. I'm just putting the link here so you can keep checking on it later. I'll let you know again when I finish the whole thing.

And yes, I know these are very 'complete' for storyboards. I just wanted to provide more info than necessary since we're all working on this without meeting face to face. I imagine working over the internet will have it's challenges. We'll have to tackle those one by one as they present themselves.

:thumbsup: Keep up the good work!

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 05:21 AM
Kirt is there more than 1 engine on the ship? it looks like that on your story boards, and those drawings do help by the way :)

02 February 2003, 05:31 AM
Well, there are thruster engines located behind the cabin in that last panel of the storyboard. So, to answer your question ... yes, there is more than one engine, but I didn't plan that originally.

Whatever works best with the model. We don't have to make it exactly like my storyboards, because I'll most probably shortcut details here and there.

Sorry, if there are some inconsistencies ... I concentrate on the story and camera more than the details of the models. :shrug:

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 08:24 AM
Its all good i can add those if u want me too, i just didn't know what those panels were in your sketches, then i saw the storyboard with flames coming out of them.... By the way i recently just fixed the cockpit i noticed it was looking funny, and il add on the headlights if i have time tomarrow? Kirt did u get my last email by the way!? or were the files too big? my addy is: just incase its blocked or somtin... talk later.

02 February 2003, 09:06 AM

Yeah, I got the image and everything looks good so far (except for the tail fin - which I mentioned already). I don't really have anything else to critique on it at the moment. Keep working on it while I try and get some more illustrations done.

I know ... reversed order of business there, but what can I do? My wife says I can't quit my job and work on this full time. Something about bills to pay and food to eat. I'm not sure what she's talking about. :shrug:

02 February 2003, 09:12 AM
If you are using any type of Meshsmoothing(no idea what maya calls it) remove it from the modifier stack before you export. That should cut out a good bit of size. And it'll be just the same if its smoothed on someone else's copy of maya.

02 February 2003, 10:20 AM
Hey! ila solomon! Really thanks for the offer! This project is very cool! but I really will not able to spend time on this! In fact, I have very few time for 3D and soon I will try to do something simple for me! :)

But anyway! I will be here for comments and critics! but for the moment, the work you've showed it really rocks! :thumbsup:

02 February 2003, 10:52 AM
Wow, what an excellent project :thumbsup:

A little suggestion for the ship: when the alienz have 3 eyes, wouldn't it be more consequent to give the spaceship 3 engines? Like 1 extra on each side.
I think they'll fit more together that way. Just a thought.

Cheers, Jeroen

Tommy Lee
02 February 2003, 11:19 AM
Hey Kirt...Title is coming soon I promise. I had no time yet because I got my Cinema 4d R8 and worked out the new stuff in this version....also Iīve muuuuuuuuuuuch work in the Tattoostudio, what is good... because I bought me a Sony Trinitron TV with 29 INCH and a Wacom Graphire 2 board...WOOOOOOHOOOOOOOO!!!!!! That second Wacom is absolute perfect!!!!!!!

SOON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:beer: :beer: :beer:


02 February 2003, 02:30 PM
Yeah, Kirt, this project has really gotten off it's feet and running...

If there's anything you need me to do, just holler...

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:58 PM
Jeroentje- Ya there r 3 engines, and i just figured that out lastnight, although i havn't modelled them yet, Kirt in his concepts has them as flaps under the big engine in that back compartment.

02 February 2003, 10:38 PM
ok here is my progres.. again very slow :(

kirt is it ok so far?
i am not sure ,are they legs legs or are they wear?
i didnt really understand it from the refernce..

02 February 2003, 12:04 AM
Wiz - Definately put some pants on him. We don't want any aliens running around "open-air". I liked the one piece jumper design that Tommy Lee did (In this picture ( Those end in shorts with kneepads and high boots.

Also, take another look at the ears ... they're not tubes like the first alien. They should actually be like holes in the side of his head. I don't think we should define a neck on this guy either. Take his head down into his shirt and put that roll of fat at the back of his neck so that we know he has a neck ... it just doesn't show. Bigger eyes too. :D

02 February 2003, 12:37 AM
hey kirt,

I'm already doing too much 3d work as it is, but i recon you need a score for this animation? .. normally, i'm composing music for my band, but this would be a great learning exercise.
If you want, I can send you some of the things I made for my band (well, not really a band, actually it's me and a songwriter/singer ;)..

02 February 2003, 10:42 AM
allright just holes? that would be easy :)
hmm thanks ill fix everything else too!goodday

02 February 2003, 11:25 PM
Kirt, I'm happy you like it!...if you think some area need texture work then give me some then I unwarp them on object.
The rigging part is about to finish, I did some tests, not bad but still not final (needs more work to do) here is a sample test:
(ah! these maya's pivots & bones are killing me!) copy.jpg

The next step is making morph targets for facial animation.

I don't want to do animation test yet, I think it's soon for such a thing, we should finish all the characters first. (but maybe a little walkcycle test doesn't harm anybody!)
Kirt if you've got the PLE then may I send you this rigged body for examination?

btw, I'm going to start my Short soon (not "the old man & the fly" that I've started a while ago, a new one! so I'll be involved into 3 short projects in a same time! :p )

02 February 2003, 02:24 AM
hey ila_solomon this is looking cool, i like it, keep up the good work.

02 February 2003, 03:26 AM
Hey, that rigging looks very nice Ila. Great job everyone.

Sorry if I sound too picky, but I still think those feet are too big. Whoever is going to animate this, is going to have it rough... I would have also added a bit more detail to his fingers, just to make them easier to understand.

I like Jeroen's idea about the 3 eyes and 3 engines, it helps to create a more original environment too.


02 February 2003, 04:22 AM
Frinsklen - The feet would be a problem if he was going to be walking much in the film. But, I established earlier in the thread that this alien will stay seated in the ship through the film and will only have to crawl/fall out of the cockpit at the end. He'll do just fine for that, so the feet are good as is.

ila - I think the alien looks really great the way he is. I can't see much need for texture work on him unless we want to put a few stains on his clothes to further emphasize that he's a slob/slacker/holigan alien.

You can send me the model, but I won't get PLE until Tuesday when I go back to work and can use their T1 line for downloading. It would just take too long on my home dial-up connection.

magicm - I would like to hear some of you work, but sending it to my mailbox isn't a good idea. I only have 6M available and sound files usually take up a bit. If you have them on the web somewhere, send me a link here or PM so that I can dl them. We'll definately need some music. I have a few talented friends but recording equiptment would have to be rented and I'm don't even know if they would have time to help with a soundtrack.

pabbloz - Good to see you around here and it's understandable that you're busy. Your knowledge and critiques are more than welcome. I love what you're doing with Space Duck and it was one of the inspirations for me to get started on this short again.

02 February 2003, 11:46 PM
hey, what a silent crew!...everybody's out? ok, just for your considration!: copy.jpg

Rigging is almost finished (did I say it before?!) : copy.jpghttp:// copy.jpg

C'mon men, we have a lot of work to do, put your efforts. hurry up ... (seems even 2 years is not enough for making this short!)


02 February 2003, 11:50 PM
looking good ila, it looking good. Yeah i was wondering where has everyone gone. I am currently working on another project so i just look here to see if there is anything for me to do yet and check out whats new.

02 February 2003, 12:25 AM
ila... looks like a good rig... can't wait to see him do a jig.

the boards have been quieter in general today than normal, I personally have been shoveling white-death all day, I'd love to say it was other peoples driveways for moohlah, but it was just trying to keep up with the 16"+ in my driveway that we have gotten today.

I have been working on the ngons, poles and tris in the gun the last few days... the bulbous covers are a real biatch (for me at least. will hopefully post an update Wed.

02 February 2003, 12:40 AM
I haven't seen snow in over 10 years. It makes me sad, really. I love snow.

02 February 2003, 12:52 AM
& here is snowing...really heavy one! ;) I love it .

02 February 2003, 01:26 AM
snowing here too, though not enough to get me out of school...:shrug:

02 February 2003, 05:20 AM
Warm and sunny here in CA, but what is new? :shrug: I actually took some time to play with the kids and get some things done around the house this past weekend. BUT! I managed to sketch the mobile home this evening and I'm still working on storyboards. So ... I'm still here. Keep on it guys! :thumbsup:

Edit - Ugh ... looking at it here I noticed more FUBAR perspective! Anyhoo, you get the idea. It's a teardrop shaped mobile home just big enough for the Mom and her baby to live in. I'll have some interior sketches later.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 07:32 AM
Kirt- Now is the ship im modelling going to have a cockpit? if so i could use somemore sketches to get started on that, sorry for the slow updates recently but my job is really demanding, and track season has started so im a lil preoccupied. BUT no worries im still in :)

02 February 2003, 08:10 AM
We will need an interior for the ship. It can be modeled separate though and used as a set for the interior scenes. We'll also need a less detailed interior for when the ship opens and the aliens exit the ship. We can add that to your model later.

I know ... everyone is waiting on me for sketches. :argh:

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 08:28 AM
lol, its all good man, im also on a time crunch. But ive been doing small tweaks to the overall shape, soon i will post progress. But as usual anything will help, and more side views and top views with perspectives REALLY help. (Sides and Tops for viewport matching, and persp to check porportions), no pressure :) ttyl

02 February 2003, 09:54 PM
wow, this is really good. I like it.

02 February 2003, 11:43 PM
Do you think any shape is missing?

I don't know when I should leave this character & start another one! maybe after an animation test.
Kirt I think we (everybody) need a schedule for tasks!
even fun & spare-time projects need an agenda.

02 February 2003, 12:05 AM
Hi Kirt,

I would luv to help out in any way if you guys need it. I like to model characters and Im good at rigging/skinning and. But if there are no character assignments left, I wont mind doing some props. Just let me know, Ill have a lot of spare time for the next few months.


02 February 2003, 12:14 AM
Hi Steve, I think there are some characters left for you, the Hero, the Mother & her Baby.
you can model in any app you want, but rigging & shading should be done in Maya. (that's because Kirt has only Maya in hand)
feel free & join us :) :beer:

02 February 2003, 06:10 AM
Kirt, do you want me to start on that website?

I can try to work on it sometime this weekend, though I'm kinda a newb, and I don't know flash....

02 February 2003, 06:17 AM
I still think we're a bit early for a website. But if you want something to work on, go for it. The worst that's going to happen is that we'll get a better idea for the site later and you'll have to redesign. :D But who knows, you might also make some really neat things that we'll want to keep.

I take it you don't want to try modelling anything? No better way to learn than to give it a try. Make one of those small spaceships that I need for the end. Make an RV. Anything really ... we need more models.

:wip: :wip: :wip:

02 February 2003, 06:18 AM
more models...gotcha!!!

I just don't want to embarass myself any more than I have too..hehe...

02 February 2003, 06:34 AM
You haven't seen my models yet. :D

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 07:54 AM
Ok well i am waiting for my ISP to respond to the problems im having with my webspace, so youl have to hold till i get it to see any updates.

02 February 2003, 01:06 AM
quick question...

is this gun for our 3-eyed friend here or another character?

The reason I ask is how can a character with 2 fingers and a thumb hold a pistol... I guess it would be possible, but would look kinda funny.

Anyway I have had a hell of a time with these bulbous covers, I'll probably post an update tommorrow evening...

02 February 2003, 01:36 AM
The gun is for our human hero, the great defender of cattle and trailer parks. He has at least 4 fingers on each hand (haven't decided if I want to do Mickey hands or not).

The aliens will not have personal weapons. Only their ship will have weapons.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 05:23 AM
hey Jdex, if you use 3DSMax use FFD modifiers to make the round shape thats the easiest way i would think.

02 February 2003, 12:17 PM
Yeah I know, I miss those stack modifiers, but I only had the demo and that has long expired... wings user now... been hand merging stretched spheres with the cube modeled gun... I think I've got it now, but I think I've ended up with too many poly's again and that half-life mod look...

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 03:48 PM
O i see, ive never used Wings so i dunno what its like.

02 February 2003, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by ila_solomon
Do you think any shape is missing?
what about the smile? I think he needs two more shapes, one for the left side of his mouth and another one for the right side, (that's what I normally do, just to avoid symmetries).

02 February 2003, 11:55 PM
what about the smile? I think he needs two more shapes, one for the left side of his mouth and another one for the right side, (that's what I normally do, just to avoid symmetries).
:) u r rite! i wanted to do them too but i was lazy! I can do them by mixing a few shapes together.
I've added some more shapes like JAW DROP & WISTLE/KISS shapes, just in case! ;)

I think now morph targets work well: ready to animate! copy.jpg

02 February 2003, 01:20 AM
I think the one in the render should be just a little less wide. It doesn't look like an expression so much as somebody has his fingers hooked into the poor guys mouth and is pulling it wide open.

I'd get another opinion before you change it though. I just might be wrong. Its happened often enough.

02 February 2003, 02:25 AM
LOL - that's a pretty extreme render! I was looking at your mouth shapes trying to think if you missed anything. The only thing I've come up with so far are ...

A 'F' shape ... where he bites his lower lip.

Hard to tell on this since they're all front view but - do you have any shapes with the upper/lower lips in and out? Say we need to make him pout and push out the bottom lip or make a "duh" face where the upper lip is out and bottom lip is in.

Also, are you going to add his green toungue so we can animate that as well? I think a bone setup would work for most sound shapes and if we stuck his toungue out of his mouth.

Really good work ila! I'm very happy with how this one turned out. I gave you a plug on my website as well. :thumbsup:

02 February 2003, 11:10 PM
:) hi everybody
I'm glad you like it Kirt, the F shape is the upper-right corner....& the toungue will be there!
also there is a 'upper in/lower out lips' there, emmm, I think below the 'kiss' shape, I must check from side...
btw I'm going to post you the rigged-skinned mesh, you HAVE TO get PLE to check it out! ;-P
& thanks a lot for the link, the lucky one is Me! :beer: :thumbsup:

Grosserfrosch, don't worry about those kind of expressions! in moving they will be fine (& cartoonish), it supposed to be a TEX AVERY style, I think, I hope!.

02 February 2003, 02:46 AM
I really like follow this thread! Thanks for show the progress! :thumbsup:

Just... where is the green tongue? :D

I'm not sure If I already wrote it... but I love those feet! BRAVO! :applause:

[edit] Ouch! I've already read Kirt suggested a green tongue too! :D
Ok! I'm agree about rig it with bones! :thumbsup:

02 February 2003, 02:50 AM
btw... Kirt, great sketches! :)

02 February 2003, 05:08 AM
I'll be adding some color to this later, but this should give everyone a good idea of what I want done with the cockpit. I'll also mark up this image later for ideas I had for the web interface. But that's still a long way coming.

ila - Go ahead and send me the file. I have 4.5 PLE now, I just have to install it. I'm going to try and get the Complete version before the short is done. I might have a good start when taxes come back. :buttrock:

Once again ... that model just rocks! And you work pretty fast. Are you still interested in doing the hero? If so, I'll have to get to those sketches soon. It looks like you're near completion with this one.

pabbloz - Thank you! Thank you! (You're so nice I had to say it twice.) :D

JDex - I think the easiest way to model those covers would be to spline model it. Then convert it to polys. It would be easy to duplicate and scale a curve to get that shape. Let's see your progress.

MaDuece - Have you started on one of the characters yet? Let us know what you're doing so noone else starts on the same thing.

02 February 2003, 09:03 AM
yes I'm interested, but I'm waiting for the others to respond, someone wanted to model a characters here ... :)
& facial bone, of course it works good, but the setup & working with it is a little harder than morph shapes. let see what happens.
Thanx a lot pals.

02 February 2003, 11:36 AM
This thread is great! Love Kirtīs sketches and Ilaīs model! The animation will be gorgeous for sure!

Itīs very instructive to see how a short is done from the concepts to the final render. Keep it up! :thumbsup:

02 February 2003, 02:32 PM
Spline modeling would likely be best, but wings is just a poly-modeler for the poor, sob-sob... Here's that up date... haven't focused on the wee-lil parts (clip, trigger)...

Haven't found a way to cut the grooves in the sided of the bulbous covers that doesn't warp/distort the bulbous cover... still working on it.

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 08:24 PM
wow havn't been to the thread in a while email has been down :( but Ila your stuff looks awesome! and JDex thats an awesome job :thumbsup: im not sure how you would do the groove ither but you could extrude an edge inwards to see if that would work? Booleans are also another option but im not sure if wings has them....

Kirt, i can start working on the that cockpit if you want me too? i will also see to posting an update of the ship.

02 February 2003, 02:29 AM
Ok guy, sorry it took a while for me to get on board. Heres what i did today. A few basic shapes, in and of of themselves not complete. Ill probably do some more tonight, and post an update tonight or tommorrow.

Kirt- I cant say im quite used to modeling this sort of style, and im having difficulty visualizing this little guys head. I understand you are busy, but quick sketch of a profile of the head would help alot.

Great Job on tha alien guys

Rice ManX
02 February 2003, 04:12 AM
Hmm so far its ok diaper needs work. and its overall shape looks a little boxy too me.

02 February 2003, 06:42 AM

I think you have the torso part down pretty good. The arms and legs need to be more pudgy with less definition though. And the diaper isn't supporting enough "load". Nice start. Hope this side view helps.

02 February 2003, 12:18 PM
WOW this looks amazing!!!

I don't usually land in this forum but i'm glad i did today. The talent in here is just amazing.

I'm still learning but if there is anything i can do please gimmie a shout.

I currently do web pages and eLearning (obviously of little to no use) and i'm learning lightwave.

Damn i only wish i had some talent!!!! but if you need a plain old box with no twangles and weebergals i'm your man :) i also have some talent in silly words (see previous)

and again....just amazing work :drool: :drool:

02 February 2003, 10:51 PM
This thread rocks! come on guys! :thumbsup:

Lovely sketches, Kirt! really! :)

02 February 2003, 11:16 PM
Here's a couple more new images of our hero. These are really quick sketches. Let me know what needs to be defined more for modelling.

I decided the humans should have 5 fingers and our hero will not be wearing sunglasses as in the previous illustration (on the first page of this thread).

02 February 2003, 11:36 PM
WOW! :)

he doesn't wear glasses, what about the Mask? ... most of the superheros have one, ... but I think he doesn't need it too! :D
GR8 WRK Kirt

02 February 2003, 12:25 AM
Yeah, no mask for this guy. Although he's got the build and spandex like a superhero, he's really nothing more than a border patrol agent. I was thinking about changing his outfit to something more "border patrol" like, but I think this one works fine the way it is.

02 February 2003, 02:49 AM
Roger Wilco, Space Quest 5. Beefier, but similar looking.

02 February 2003, 03:11 AM
I failed to see any simularities ...

If there are, it's purely coiencidental (I had to look it up to see what you were talking about). :D