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11 November 2005, 04:44 PM
OK it has been a while but here goes (anyone else can correct me if i am wrong)

For the purposes of the story the scene takes place on a ledge with a cave inset into the mountain or cliff side.
My general impression is that it is day time. The cave man has just awoken but it is not dawn. probably just before mid day.
It is generall sunny and colourful in my eyes.

The original concept was to go for something Pixarish. I think we are still looking for something along those lines.

Pitty about the blur site, it is a great wee animation and very funny.

Try and different browser perhaps.

11 November 2005, 06:00 PM
Hmm. With IE the blur site works, now loading the trailer. :)

So were going the Pixarish way? With more cartoony way than realistic? I really need to know this before I start texturing.

11 November 2005, 06:20 PM
That Blur In The Rough was awesome!
Is that the style were after? The bit cartoonic but still realistic?

11 November 2005, 07:01 PM
I think that is a pretty good style, and one that will definitly work for this toon.

As i said in the last post I think it will be mainly daylight so it will look a little more colourful and bright. This will also add to the cartoony atmosphere


11 November 2005, 12:50 AM
OK Guys,

It's been a while since I have done any 3D stuff so I thought I would warm myself up again with a little critter. This is my effort for tonight...I am thinking he will be quite reptilian in texture but the feathers are there as a little link to evolution :P

No idea if he will make the grade or the story but you can tell me what you think anyway. I still have work to do on 'Stumpy' but I wanted to try something new first before tackling an old model :)

C&C welcome


11 November 2005, 11:14 AM
WOW Thanks guys, I will take your total silence as a sign of complete awe and admiration of my skills and utter greatness as a human being!

Only kidding... :D

I am sure you are all very busy folks and I am just posting to see what else is happening.

Erikoinen: Have you had a chance to start the environment? I might have a wee go at this myself, although considering I have not done this kind of thing before it will probably look like a lot of randomly placed polygons Sub-D'ed into a blob. If you have had a chance to get something started I would love to see it and see how you begin this kind of thing.

How are things going with the rigging of 'Stumpy'? I seen some great progress earlier on, really looking forward to seeing him posed or even animated :)

OK as scary as this seems we still really don't have a fully fledged story. We have a couple of story overviews but nothing concrete. Nor do we have a storyboard. I think if we have any budding writers or storyboard artists here who would like to get involved then now would be a great time to join.

As far as 3D modeling goes for this project all we need is:

Caveman (modeling 80% complete) (rigging started) (texturing is a faint dot on the horizon)
Critter (nothing really done yet, a quick concept model from me and a possible free model suggested by BOY1DA, if you have any ideas on this one feel free to jump in)
Environment (this could be a pretty big job as there will probably be quite a bit of flora and fauna in the scene, waiting for an update on this and I will also take a stab at it too.)

As you can see this project is a little bit scatty at the moment. But it really is a labor of love and I think we will get it done in the end. The original ideal was not to take it too seriously and so far we seem to be pretty relaxed on this project. If you do feel you would like to contribute then please jump in. In my order of preference we need the following:

Writer (to finalize the script and layout the story)
Storyboard Artists (to put the story in a beautiful picture format)
2D artists (help us with some more environment sketches and concepts for the critter)
Environment Modelers (We have one or two on board at the moment but feel free to jump in, I think a nice environment will help bring this toon together)
Texture Artists (Help make everything look purty)
Animators (Once the rigging is complete) (Animation will be completed in 3DS Max as far as I am aware so you will probably need to have access and knowledge of this app)
Musicians and FX (I don't think we will need any voice acting apart from the occasional grunt and roar so music and FX will play a major part in telling the story. The original inspiration for this was roadrunner inspired and the score on those cartoons was always fantastic so you guys will have your work cut out :))

OK I think that's me for the moment. Feel free to comment on any of the above nonsense and hopefully we will have something more to work with in the next few weeks.

I am going to give the website a go, I will host it on my web space in the mean time. It would be nice to have a little more content before it goes live.

On that note, can we suggest some titles for this short? would help with the website and this thread :)


11 November 2005, 12:25 PM
Yea, what TheFreak said..... just copy and paste it here :p

11 November 2005, 07:02 PM
Yes, I've started the environment. I actually made a concept of it which never was anything like the 3d-environment. :) The concept is on paper, and I don't have a scanner, so you can't see it, and the 3d-environment still needs some tweaking before I can show the first version of it for you. So, just hold, I'm doing it as I have spare time. :)

11 November 2005, 08:35 PM
Well, TheFreak, I've never done anything like this before either so my cave scenario is a randomly scattered polygon blob too. :)
But here we go, here's the first version:

Would need to add a lot of plants here and there to cover up every seams that are shown.
There's no bump map yet and of course the texture neither is final.
Rocks, a tree, background, etc. will be added.

Any comments and suggestions are welcome! :)


Honest opinion on this: Do you wish me to continue, or is it a piece of crap?

11 November 2005, 09:00 PM
It's a good start it's gives us something to work with.

I think the ground in front of the cave should be flatter.

and maybe the cave and the ground should be all rock no grass..

By the way what software do you use for your 3D

11 November 2005, 09:06 PM
I agree with BOY1DA on this, it is definitly a good start and the cave should be rocky as well.

I think if we build on this we will have our scene soon enough.

Keep updating and we'll see how it goes, it is all a good learning experience and I'm sure we will learn alot from it too :)

Thanks for the quick update too

11 November 2005, 12:30 PM
Rock it be then. What about the tree on the sketch BOYIDA made? Is there growing a tree on the rock then? :p So I'll cut the grass off and move it to the bottom of the scene, or delete everything on it. But on next time, beware for rockiness! :)

I use 3dsMax

11 November 2005, 01:47 PM
I am bracing myself for the 'rockiness' of your next post!!

I would still like to see some foliage on the ledge. I would also like to see some loose boulders and stuff. So I guess the plants that will be there will be pretty hardy and weather proof.

I am a little concerned about the over all size of the piece. I don't know as yet what the scale will be for the caveman against the cave but going by the grass on the scene it looks like it would be a pretty small ledge.

I think our lack of a story board and 100% complete story is showing here as we don't have any definitive guidelines for how much of the ledge will be used or how the scene needs to be used.

Keep up the good work anyway Erikoinen I am sure we can cope with any changes later if we need to.


11 November 2005, 08:20 PM
I'm going to work on the story some over the next week or so. I'll try to get it in script format and everything. . .

As the scriptwriter, I'll insert my two bits on the scene. We'll need a bit more space from the edge of the cliff to the cave opening, because the caveman charges the critter (he'll need a few strides, so say maybe fifteen to twenty feet? I'm not sure what the caveman's running stride is. . .).

11 November 2005, 12:06 AM
I would like to offer my services as a modeler on this project although I do know how to rig and animate as well. I do think you would benefit more from my modeling skills since that is my strength.
I can use either Maya or Max and I'm competent in photoshop as well as After Effects and Premiere. I'm aslo learning ZBrush and XSI at the moment. Time might be an issue for me since I have another project I'm working on but I would love to help in any way I can.

11 November 2005, 11:03 AM
Hey Guys,

dbates: That would be a great help to the over all project. It will be nice to get something finalised for the script.

karabo: Welcome to the team :) The modelling tasks we have at the moment are mainly for the scene and the critter. I threw something together the other day for the critter but it was just an idea. Feel free to have a go too :) We are going for a Pixar type look so nothing to defined I suppose. Or if you want, you could work along side Erikoinen on the scene. Looking forward to seeing what you produce.

I think we might also be in need of some props but we will wait for the final script before worrying too much about this.


11 November 2005, 02:44 PM
Well, we will definitely need the caveman's stick! I can't think of any other props just yet.


11 November 2005, 04:25 PM
I read that line quickly and then had to re read it again....for a brief moment I thought we might need to reinstate the stump from 'Stumpy' :P

I am seeing some impressive soft body dynamics going!! :D Poor guy!!

11 November 2005, 05:38 AM
I read that line quickly and then had to re read it again....for a brief moment I thought we might need to reinstate the stump from 'Stumpy' :P

I am seeing some impressive soft body dynamics going!! :D Poor guy!!


First of all thanks for looking after things while I have been ultra busy lately. Anyway I have got a site design ready. I paid a professional designer for this. It's for a group called 'binary games' which I started this year for these sorts of projects. (there are placeholder images and this layout is not fully coded yet)

@Erikoinen - Fantastic, thank you. Just in case you don't know, I'm Chris, the director (And composer). Of course I won't be coming in properly until the animation begins but welcome aboard and thank you for your work so far.

@karabo - It'd be great to have you modeling for us. Thank you for your interest (Nice portfolio by the way).

I will make a new update shortly. Lack of updates is due to exams, fortunately which are almost over.

Does anyone know anything about Chris?
I don't want to sound harsh, but without a director or any kind of organisation, continuing this project is totally useless.

Sorry for my lack of updates, it is totally my fault. Luckily TheFreak has stepped up and taken over while I've been (mega) busy. I'm almost 100% back though.

This is what we're looking to do from here:

-Continue modeling, rigging, etc. (Keep up the great work!)
-Finilshing off script, publishing.
-Finding a storyboard artist and going over shot/camera plans.
-putting up the website and getting some project interest.


11 November 2005, 05:04 PM
Erikoinen (member.php?u=34226) Nice job :)

11 November 2005, 10:40 PM
Welcome back Chris

Nice to know we have a site :) God knows how long it would have taken me to do it along with other work.

As for keeping this thing alive I really need to pass that to BOY1DA as well. He did most of the chatting while I was away too. I just wrote a big post last week to try and sum things up for folks :P

Nice to see you back, hopefully we will have more stuff coming in soon


11 November 2005, 12:47 AM
Oh my gosh.. I didn't receive one email from cgtalk saying this was replied to... I am so sorry.. lol. I am still working on the shoulder, but i havn't had any time lately, finals @ school :). I hate IB. Anyway. Here is a little movie (a 5 second animation - would animate it a whole lot better, but multitasking at the moment...) anyway. Let me know your thoughts I will render a wireframe too (w/ controls) and well... i think the bird will be much easier to rig. :) This shoulder thing is killing me.. it is actually just pissing me off.. I think i made it worse the otehr day :) but ya know the saying, things get worse before they get better.


edit: soryr, forgot the movie.

11 November 2005, 01:14 AM
I realized I have a lot of work to do with by doing these poses.. ugh... check it out.. (i just was fooling around, its has no relation to the story.)

edit: I did this in like, a minute, and uh.. i need to go back to grammar school ... lol.

11 November 2005, 10:53 AM
Hey omega, nice to see this guy moving about :)

Just looking at the animation and the poses and I know you are still working on the sholder area but I just wanted to let you know. If you find any problems with the Mesh please let me know. I am seeing some odd things in those pictures that look both like mesh issues and possible rig issues. So I will have another look at him tonight and see if I can tweak him a little more.

I have not done enough rigging to know what works and what doesn't work and in the end up if you are having problems with it then don't be afraid to say it's the mesh. I will try and fix it up where I can.

Also, an observation about 'Stumpy' that I never really though abotu until I seen your image. I see in one of them you have his head turned. Due to the nature of his head I don't know if this will work too well. I am kinda seeing stumpy as a bit of a hunch back and there for he would have very little head movement from left to right and any major movement would probably involve the whole body turning (kinda like me when I have a sore neck :P). Perhaps BOY1DA can comment on this one as he is 'Stumpy's creator :)
That might add to the humor in the story as well.

I still don't know if the bird is going to be used in the final animation, he was just an idea I had at the time. Nobody has actually made any comment on him as yet to say what they think :P


11 November 2005, 12:07 PM
I think stumpy looks great…
Yea, he is not perfect, but I’m just so happy to see him come alive.

I know most of the time I’m pretty critical about CG art.
But I’ve been so stressed out with my project, trying to get everything
so perfect to the point I really don’t care about perfect anymore.
I just want to have fun with it… if he looks a bit off I think that will make
It even more amusing .

About the neck thing, it works for me, I don’t mind how it looks at all.
I guess right now it just comes down to how far you guys want to push your work
as artists….

As for the critter, I think he looks great model wise.
I would of preferred a smaller critter like a newt (, salamander ( or gecko (
Something really tiny almost to the point you can’t really see it.
Because I keep thinking about the part where it crawls around under
Stumpy’s loin cloth… the back story, how Stumpy lost his “stump”:eek:

11 November 2005, 02:52 PM
… the back story, how Stumpy lost his “stump”:eek:

That sounds painful!

Well the bird was more of an exercise for me, so I will give a little guy a go

11 November 2005, 06:40 AM
That little fella shouldn't be too hard to rig at all... Not only will he be small, but he will have just a spine and legs.. lol. That would be a simple rig. Anyway.. This skinning will have at o wait a little I have about 20493.5 tests this week. Gotta study! I will work on him when I get bored/tired/sick of studying :). Thanks for the comments.. I do like the gecko idea, but the bird is good idea too.. I was wondering what our site's url was. (if we had one yet).

peacin out,

11 November 2005, 07:25 AM
I'm sorry I've delayed this project with having no updates in a while and still not having one. I've been busy doing other projects and stuff but I try doing an update this week!

11 November 2005, 07:07 PM
Haha, omega3d- that sucks, I know. I've got exams at the moment. :S Well at least they will be over soon.

@Erikoinen - that would be great.


11 November 2005, 10:46 PM
I created a really simple website for the project (just so we have something while the real site is in development). I'm no web designer, so it looks awful. . . Anyways. It has a picture of the scene design, a link to the Stumpy animation and a link to a (fairly old) Stumpy picture. As well as a page for the script, so people don't have to go back a half-dozen pages or so to get it.

(There's a small data transfer limit, so I may have to remove the picture. . . but it's free hosting, so I can't complain.)


11 November 2005, 11:21 PM
Sounds good. I have done some web development so I can see if I can come up with a flash presentation type stuff.. Well, g2g back to work. lol. ppjpo.

11 November 2005, 02:58 AM
@dbates - thanks for doing that :)

At the moment I am shot planning. If you are a storyboard artist and wanting to help out, please contact me. I am also going to get the website coded and up ASAP.



11 November 2005, 04:25 AM
OH! we already have a website. lol.. my bad.. well I came upw tih something anyway. lol.. let me know what the dealeo is.

11 November 2005, 09:11 AM
Argh, I don't think I can update on this week, guys. :/
Got to do a lot of work and the weekend is booked 'cause I have my welcome-to-my-new-home -parties (whatever they're called :)) and other stuff. I will update next week!

11 November 2005, 10:41 AM
Hey Guys,

Nice to see this thread pumping back into life again :)

Looking forward to seeing the website Chris, let me know if you need anything from me. I have been doing web design for a while now so I am sure I can help. I also do ASP and PHP if you need that kind of thing.

Erikoinen, no probs on the update man. Just enjoy yourself and take things as they come. Hope you have a nice house warming party. I expect my Invitation just got lost in the post or something :sad:

I will try and give the critter another go, found a nice way to make UV maps in LW so hopeully I will begin texturing some stuff soon as well.

Until then....

11 November 2005, 10:19 PM
TheFreak, oh you didn't get the invitation? Oh man, sorry. It's not yet late to come! :)

11 November 2005, 01:40 AM
I think the postal service lost mine too.. ugh. But I am comin anyway. :)

12 December 2005, 07:52 AM
Bumping this topic back to page one...

Anyone have any updates? busy times I know, so let me know when you get a free minute, anyone.



12 December 2005, 04:21 PM
Finals this week and next, so I'll have to postpone that script edit. . . but I'll get it done!

12 December 2005, 02:42 AM
I am still pluggin away at the shoulders but these next weeks are going to be crazy... 2 trips and finals. haha. boy, i don't know if it can get worse. haha anyway. I have made some progress, but it appears that i have placed the clavical in a semi-unfortuante area. :( I am going to try and fix that. :)

Do we have a set yet? Looking forward to animating.

12 December 2005, 06:28 AM
BUMP right back to the first page.

Okay. So is anyone still here? My internet was down for the past week (isp:() Anyway, I left from posting here for a little while because december can be a pretty busy time of the year for everyone. Anyway, who's still here? Any updates?



12 December 2005, 07:12 AM
I believe I worked on the shoulders a little while I was sleeping.. Because I can't remember doing it, but it looks a wee bit better. I was wondering if this project is halted... I havn't heard about anything and I am glad you posted.. Sorry about the delay, but it has been pretty hektic... Finals.. this week. fun.


How is everyone doing.. hope you had a great holiday, will talk to ya soon.


01 January 2006, 01:43 AM
Hey Guys,

Glad to see everyone is still alive and well, I have been busy with other things for the past while and have not done a lot of anything to be honest...but the break was nice.

Anyway I had another little go at the critter, came up with the basic idea last night and did this tonight. Need to do a good bit of work on the eyes, but I was having problems there and getting a little frustrated so I moved on before I gave up :)

Anyway this is it so far, C&C is welcome. If he is used he is used, if not, no biggie :)

01 January 2006, 03:39 AM
Cool critter Freak...I really like how you did the legs, feet and toenails! :thumbsup:

01 January 2006, 09:31 PM
lil update to the critter, altered a legs a little and fixed the head a lot :)

Also did a little morph test for the eyes and mouth

C&C Welcome as always


01 January 2006, 06:10 PM
I like that concept, TheFreak. Be sure to add many sharp teeth! ;)

BTW, I just watched Ice Age I (first time) last week; that's kind of the look I've been visualizing for the characters. Not hyper-realistic by any means, which is much easier on us all.

The script has no dialogue; do you guys want me to change anything with it? I posted the current version online at

Glad to see you guys back, Omega3d, TheFreak, ChrisBG.

01 January 2006, 08:03 PM
That is pretty awesom. I love the concept. Was that maya nurbs? anyway...

I am somewhat finished on the rig. I am just doing some final touches. I am looking forward to animating him. :)

Well, just thought I would give the 411.

Gotta go!

01 January 2006, 08:03 PM
By the way, I like the script, simple, short and sweet!

01 January 2006, 08:05 PM
Sorry, one last thing... I like dbates idea about big teeth, maybe not a lot, but like this:

01 January 2006, 03:39 AM
Hey Guys,

Thanks for the feedback, was beginning to think everyone had gone walkies :)

I like that concept, TheFreak. Be sure to add many sharp teeth!

The reason I had not added sharp teeth was due to the herbivore nature of the critter, although in reading the script I think I will need to change him as he will need a good set of teeth to gnaw through the club. Perhaps a little more beaver like would make sense.

The script has no dialogue; do you guys want me to change anything with it?

I like it, it has a few features of the one I did a LONG time ago but you have improved it a lot and made it a lot more viable for this sort. Good work on that :) As for the no speech I think that was agreed long ago, just a few grunts and stuff was all we wanted.

That is pretty awesom. I love the concept. Was that maya nurbs?

I am a Lightwave user so it was Sub Divided Polys, not sure how similar that is to Mayas NURBS but as long as it gets you the result you are looking then who cares eh! :)

I will probably need to rethink the wee guy again to work more with the script. I guess that why you should wait for these things before diving in, but I was bored and I might use him for something else :)

I will have another go and see what I come up with.

dbates or Chris: What sort of critter did you have in your head when writing the script, that would really help me create something. If you are thinking about how it moves and eating the club etc. This will give us a good idea. I would like to stick with a reptile of some sort as fur would be a nightmare to animate. Any ideas or comments would be great.

Glad we have a script, we should really update the first post or something.

I am also learning texturing at the moment, so far it's going grand so i will be able to give these guys a little more life when I am done.


01 January 2006, 06:57 AM
Could I possibly get the model in an obj or a dxf from lightwave? I wanna try texturing it in zbrush. I think that would look cool with a bump map. I am still figuring that out though :) It would be fun to play around with.

01 January 2006, 01:57 AM
Here's my vision for the critter. BTW, I do my concept work by googling for photos--my drawing is not good enough to express the ideas in my head. So. . . I'll provide several links of photos that I like.

Starting off: The body could resemble a gecko, for ease of rigging and rendering and all that. Sort of like -- the Geico mascot. The critter is a fast, agile creature with no defenses but speed. It is also quite impudent, as the script (hopefully) suggests. The mouth is its most prominent feature; it demolishes the caveman's hefty club in a few seconds. The teeth may look somewhat like this:

The head could resemble an ostrich's:

Basically, a gecko's body with an ostrich's head and a horse's teeth. No feathers or fur, of course. What do you guys think?

01 January 2006, 02:57 AM
TheFreak (http://member.php?u=8526) - That's awesome. You've captured the feel really well. Even if we don't use it for the critter, it can defenately be in the film somewhere- there will be a few background creatures etc. For the shots I have started planning, it would be nice to have a pterodactyl fly by etc. Once we've got the characters designed I will work more on the storyboard sketches, then hopefully we'll get a storyboard artist.

Tonight, I'll update the main page with the script, project information etc.

dbates (http://member.php?u=187477) - That's the sort of thing I was thinking about too, that's a great idea. The script is fine how it is. It instantly gives me ideas on the exact camera angles and shots I want to use - good stuff! :)

Good to see things are on the move, I'll post again once the topic is updated.

EDIT: edited main post. More to come soon. :)


01 January 2006, 11:52 AM
Cheers Chris, glad you like him :) I didn't know there would be other critters in the shots, if that is the case then he can be an extra :)

I like the idea dbates, I will put something down on paper and get started on it, I was thinking horse like teeth myself but the ostrich head is a nice touch.

I will keep you posted as always.

01 January 2006, 04:22 AM
hey dudes, this looks really interesting i am really looking forward to join, i have some experience at modeling at most, mostly scenes and objects

01 January 2006, 04:26 AM
Thanks for signing up Carlos. (This guy is good, we've worked on stuff before). Welcome aboard. We can get you working on something very soon, I'll discuss this with you.


01 January 2006, 06:13 AM
Hi Chris, I'm interested in doing team work like this, but many usually prefer people with experiences. I believe this should be good to gain experience and more exposure in 3D world.

I'm interested in joining your team if you accept a student who only has experience for 1 year in Maya. I also use Photoshop, Illustrator and After Effect as my supporting software.

If you want to look at my projects, you can see them here (

01 January 2006, 09:48 AM

Thanks for your interest in the project. Your work looks very nice, and I'm sure this would be a perfect oppertunity for you to gain experience. At the moment we are getting the two main characters modeled - the caveman, and the critter. I'll send a PM off to our first scene modeler and see where things are at. Very shortly, we'll have other things that can begin to modeled - for the environment, so keep checking the thread for further details.

Once again thanks, and lets make this a great animation. Welcome to the team! :)


01 January 2006, 04:47 AM
Some doodles I did while burning a dvd... based on the image links posted by "dbates ("

01 January 2006, 10:35 AM
Hey all. I dont want to burst anyones buble but blur stuido has an animation called "In the Rough" your storyline is akwarly similar to what you guys are trying to acomplish and even the cave looks like the one used in that animation any ways here's a link ( go to shorts and look for "in the rought"

01 January 2006, 05:29 PM
Hey all. I dont want to burst anyones buble but blur stuido has an animation called "In the Rough" your storyline is akwarly similar to what you guys are trying to acomplish and even the cave looks like the one used in that animation any ways here's a link ( go to shorts and look for "in the rought"

I went to atomfilms and played the short ( and I don't think we have anything to worry about. The only similarities between the blur studios short and our script were:

1. The cave. Our cave is fairly similar, but a cave is a cave, right?

2. The critter. Their critter was a mammal (if I remember correctly), and it never ate the caveman's weapon or tricked him into falling off the edge of the cliff. I think we're okay there too.

Their caveman didn't look much like ours. We have an entirely different plot. Our critters and our caves are alike only in function. . . we're okay.

Anyways, BOY1DA: I like the #2 head and the #4 body.


01 January 2006, 04:59 PM
dbates is right, we're fine. :) I agree also, head #2 and body #4. Good to see you guys back.


02 February 2006, 10:58 AM
Feb 1st -

Any updates anyone? I've been busy scoring short films but I have been checking up on the thread - nothing yet. Are you guys still around? Any more done on the critter, scene or anything?



02 February 2006, 01:10 PM
I'm still here! Wasn't the scene nearly done? We just need some background (sky dome, background forest, etc) which can nearly all be done as matte paintings I think.

02 February 2006, 06:48 AM
I did a little more on the rigging... looking for the animation... I will probably have to compromise the rig for the scene requirements. This is just a fact of life :)... I will animate him when ready! How is the scenery comin?

02 February 2006, 03:31 AM
Are we uh.. calling this proj off? Just askin.

02 February 2006, 10:57 AM
not that i am aware of!

it has gone a little quiet but it's not the first time and i doubt it will be the last :)

I am up to my eyes in work and I am trying to find a new job so I just don't have the same amount of time to dedicate to this at the moment. Once i get all this out of the way I will be back to hep out.


02 February 2006, 11:23 PM
Actually, we are still waiting to hear from everyone in involved. I'll give it a few days - please, if you are interested in working, list your name & skill here. We still haven't heard from everyone. Cheers. I'll be sending off the emails again tonight, no replies so far.

By the way, if anyone is interested in checking out some of the films I scored recently, go to (under "sci fest") and check it out. I scored three of the films: "CPU", "The Guassian Project" and "Mi, Robot". It's a competition currently in the viewing/voting stage.


02 February 2006, 06:30 AM
If we have the creature.. I will rig that puppy... I have the rig somewhat finished on the man. Just need to do some fun facial rigs. But if not, I would really like to do some animation.

02 February 2006, 07:40 AM
If the critter isnt modeled, i could probably give it a shot.

02 February 2006, 08:44 PM
Sounds good... If you don't wanna post in the thread with correspondence, then you can email me at jonathan @

That goes for anyone of course.


02 February 2006, 11:01 PM
The current critter design is at

02 February 2006, 12:07 AM

I'm looking to do some work in my off time.. I think I read you guys are using Maya. I'm a noob when it comes to Maya's animation, but ok at it. If you guys need any animators I'd be happy to help. Not sure how long or how much help I'll be but I can lend a hand...


02 February 2006, 11:16 PM
Here's what i put together so far.

I found some inspiraton on the web and it borrows some of BOY1DA's designs, will add big teeth and tongue too (but no need to use it, i just want him to have one ;) ).

I also have a rig question for omega: i modeled him in a "biped" pose but it might have been a bad choice? I can always change it later but let me know if its gonna be a problem. And the curly tail might be a hassle too...?

Feedback is welcome since i kind of went my own way and not everyone might like it.


02 February 2006, 01:16 AM
I like it... That should be really easy to rig... The joints won't require much skinning :). Hopefully they like the design. Could you send me that so that I can begin rigging?

-Russ=: Hey! Glad you came to join us. Our rigs, the ones I am doing anyway, are in max, and I am not sure if you ahve max or not... But we can get you a job I am sure. I believe you will have to ask dbates.

Right on! Peace out!

02 February 2006, 02:53 AM
I like it so far, the mesh looks real clean too.
I think the tail would look nice a bit skinner, but that's just a nip pic.

Looking forward to see the rest.

02 February 2006, 05:29 PM

THats awsome that you are using max. Max is my poison of choice. I'll pm dbates and see what he's got...

02 February 2006, 06:37 PM
-Russ=, We'd be glad to have you on board with us.

Psyk0 - that looks nifty! Keep heading in that direction, and keep us posted on how it goes. :) Great job.


02 February 2006, 09:11 PM
Hey thanks guys! :D, ive done a bit more work last night.

Scaled down the tail a bit, i'll make it even thinner and see how it looks. Comments, ideas?



02 February 2006, 01:42 PM
Psyk0: I like it! No crits yet.

I'm struggling through a few storyboards, but I can't sketch characters. I'll post the (four) that I've completed so far and see if anyone can take them from there. (I have to scan them in yet--they should be online by Wednesday morning at the latest.)


02 February 2006, 06:04 AM

Whats going on guys...I'm looking to get started, is there any anim work that needs to be done.

02 February 2006, 10:34 PM
And here's the promised storyboard (or part of it, anyway): (

Be advised, I'm no pencil-and-paper artist, and I suck at drawing characters. So hopefully we can get a "real" artist to finish these. . .


03 March 2006, 07:08 PM
Modeling near completion, here's what i've done this time:

-Finished head
-Built inside of the mouth
-Tweaked hands

To do list :wip:
-Horse teeth!? lol
-Tweak the tail

I'll probably UV map the little guy soon, might take a shot at texturing, i need practice :D.

I'd help with storyboarding, but my drawing skills arent that good. (

03 March 2006, 07:11 PM
Hey, that looks preety cool.. as a quick suggestion shouldn't you model the tongue straight and put that bend in it on the animation side of things? Same with the tail... for rigging it straight would be better.

03 March 2006, 09:16 PM
You're probably right, shouldnt be too hard to fix tho.

03 March 2006, 01:05 AM
Thats pretty neat. I look forward to rigging it. That should be much easier than stumpy due to the "smaller arm pits" lol. Do any of you know how to get a texture from ZBrush to max? I have been stumped. I have seen many methods, but none seem to work for me, or I am doing something slightly wrong. So if you have any links?


03 March 2006, 04:49 AM
Psyk0 - wow. That looks neat! Awesome job, I really look foward to seeing this progress.

@dbates -Thanks for having a stab at the storybords - though I will want to do the rough sketches then hand them to an artist, since I will be directing the short. I'll get started on them soon, I have the whole film visualized in my head now.

More importantly though, we are in desperate need of scene modelers. If you are one, please post here or send me an email at As for animation - not yet guys, but soon! Keep checking the post and giving feedback. Once our characters are all modeled up and rigged we can start doing some animation.

Keep up the great work, I'm going to send off a few PM's


03 March 2006, 06:13 AM
Thats pretty neat. I look forward to rigging it. That should be much easier than stumpy due to the "smaller arm pits" lol. Do any of you know how to get a texture from ZBrush to max? I have been stumped. I have seen many methods, but none seem to work for me, or I am doing something slightly wrong. So if you have any links?


Your texture should show up in the material slot and from there you export it to image format of your choice.

This thread might have the answer:

03 March 2006, 02:45 AM
i might be able to do some scene stuff. what all do you need?

03 March 2006, 02:11 PM
Here's what we have from Erikoinen (post #259):

BOY1DA and TheFreak decided to remove the grass from the cave and the ground, and substitute rocks.

I would still like to see some foliage on the ledge. I would also like to see some loose boulders and stuff. So I guess the plants that will be there will be pretty hardy and weather proof.

I am a little concerned about the over all size of the piece. I don't know as yet what the scale will be for the caveman against the cave but going by the grass on the scene it looks like it would be a pretty small ledge.

Erikoinen is using 3ds Max.

03 March 2006, 10:03 AM
Hey Guys,

Sorry for the lack of input in a while. I have been really busy in work and outside of it. I hope I will be freed up by mid to late April so I can help out again after that.

I am loving the critter. He is very cool. Nice to have you on board Psyk0 you definitly have some knarley skills :P

Anyway just thought I would pop in and say hello to you all again and I can't wait to get back into this and 3D in general when I get the time.

Hope you are all keeping well.


03 March 2006, 11:48 AM

i am an animator (3 years experience, Maya & XSI). I Read the script on the website - sounds like fun.

Would be nice to have a summary of facts so far (too lazy to read all posts), i see the set and characters are pretty much done by now. Appearently in max.

I figure it's likely that people use different software, but one could actually grab the model and do his own setup to use for one's shots i think. I would be willing to.

I only have about 3 weeks of spare time from now though. Was planning to do some personal animation exercises.

03 March 2006, 06:29 PM
Thanks TheFreak! :D, i think modeling is final, did a quick unwrap too. I'd like to hear suggestions for color schemes, style and resolution?...maybe someone more experienced should handle that part but eh it doesnt hurt to try.

Dunno if this will work, but copy paste in browser for a turn around:

If we need more stuff modeled just give me a shout i'll try to squeeze it into my schedule.

03 March 2006, 11:50 PM
Could I get the model of the critter? Take a gander @ riggin

03 March 2006, 06:41 AM
You have done an outstanding job Psyk0 !

Maybe you should try a quick paint over in photoshop , with a few colour setups you think would look good ? and post them to get some input .....

Well the only real things that can be modeled are trees and plants, and a rock or 2.

03 March 2006, 06:40 PM
Hey everybody, i sent an e-mail to omega so he could get started on the rig and started playing around with texture.

Here's my initial color choices for the body (

and some experiment to get a reptilian look for the skin (diffuse + bump) (

03 March 2006, 08:42 PM
Here's my input on the critter's color scheme:

The green and blue looks a bit too fluorescent (imo). Since the critter is a herbivore, and only has speed for its defense, it will probably be camoflagued. It lives in the woods, not in the water, so it will likely have earth tones mixed in with the green. Here are a couple of references to show what I'm talking about:,GreenLizard_0100.jpg (

The critter's skin should be rough and scaly--like what you're working on in your second image, Psyk0.

03 March 2006, 09:49 PM
Ahh i see, makes sense, i'll setup new colors and make proper scale pattern cuz well it was just an experiment :).

03 March 2006, 07:42 PM
hi,i amnew to this site,workin on my demoreel at the moment,on modelling actually,my skills are not the best at the moment but im getin there,i love to model characters n love to help with modelling:bounce: ,n i love to work

03 March 2006, 09:19 AM
Ahh i see, makes sense, i'll setup new colors and make proper scale pattern cuz well it was just an experiment :).

Looking foward to it. Looks nice so far!

karan_shetty - Thanks for stopping by, we'd be more than happy for you to do some work in our little team if you would like to.

Finally, my broadband is being upgraded here. Had a few problems lately and now they're finally upgrading it so it's 3x faster. New Zealand broadband really sucks.

I'll check in tomorrow.


03 March 2006, 07:44 PM
Sorry for being M.I.A, i've got another project that needed some attention, i'll try to put some work on the texture...also i'd like to know if omega had any updates on the rig?.

03 March 2006, 02:01 AM
Oh yeah i do.. lol... For some reason, I don't receive thread updates, still trying to subscribe, so email me if for some reason i go MIA. :) Here is a pic of my latest version.. which happens to be the first version. :)

03 March 2006, 02:49 AM
How does he work, do you have a video capture program ?

03 March 2006, 04:59 AM
I don't, but I will try and get one by the time I complete the rig. I just did a little more work on the foot rig, and it may need a little tweaking when we do the test animation, but other than that... The rig is coming together a lot quicker than stumpy... :)

I don't think I have done a critter like this before, it will be interesting on how the tail turns out.. First time doing a tail, so if you have any sugguestions... I currently have a spline IK for it.

03 March 2006, 06:09 AM
Hey that's cool! cant wait to see it move!.

03 March 2006, 07:02 AM
Alright... Here is a rough animation - and I mean rough - I just did it to see if the rig wouldn't explode on me :). Surprisingly, I have had no real trouble with this rig. HAHA. I never thought I would say that. Here is a little clip scrapping the surface on what the rig can do.. I didn't have time to compress it, so its 13M. I will have to remove it in a couple of days, so take it while you can.

See ya,

03 March 2006, 05:17 PM
You have been very busy lately with so many projects under your belt.
you're doing a great job with all these projects.

That is pretty impressive. This guy came to life real fast.
Will you use morph targets for the head or is it going to be a bone set up.

Just an idea for the tail maybe you can set it up sort of like a finger curl.
where if you rotate the base bone the rest of the tail will curl in the same
direction. unless it is set up like that and I didn't notice...

But hey I won't be animating , so maybe it is for the animators to say
what they need, And so far I think you are the only animator right now ?

03 March 2006, 06:48 PM
:thumbsup: Awesome! i was worried some areas would cause problems, i've rigged a few game models in the past and i know how frustrating it can be when things go wrong.

Big thanks for your help!

03 March 2006, 08:45 PM
Hey, thanks for the comments... CG is always fun.

I found this awesomly free (thats probably why i like it so much) screen capture off of sourceforge... Pretty nice. If any of you don't want to pay for one, this is the right one... I use it and crop/compress it with cleaner. Works and does just what I need.

Well, gotta finally do my procrastinated homework.



03 March 2006, 10:27 PM
Okay, I have an updated version I just uploaded today, I think the only changes I made was to the tail.. Took your advice boy1da. The rotation thing worked out nicely... When we are doing the animation, we may need to change some of the pivot points, but other than that, the tail should be fine. Check out the compressed screen capture (+- 2megs)

I deleted the other video.


03 March 2006, 10:50 PM
More, more! hehe, might want to brighten the background for next captures, we can still see what's going on tho.

04 April 2006, 05:14 AM
Alright, I lightened the bg just for you... Check out some animation poses... Animation files:


(Rough animations.. just to see if mesh liked me or not)

Edit: One more for your viewing pleasure.

Edit #2: I got carried away...

04 April 2006, 05:29 AM
Wow, that was fun. Well, the shoulders wern't animated, thats why there is that crunch... But that can be easily fixed, just lazy. There are also finger poses that crunch, but those are just carelessness. :) Its a fun rig to work with.. I will rig the tongue soon so that it is moveable!


04 April 2006, 11:47 AM
Hope we can get to see a textured and posed version soon.
With everything in place... Does the mesh you rigged have all the UV in place.
Maybe you can work with "Psyk0" and get the maps from him.
You should also credit him in your tests, for making the model.

OH SNAP! I just remembered that we didn't do a scale comparison
with "Stumpy" and "Gex" the critter. They are both rigged but the scale maybe off ?
I could be wrong , you might of had that in mind when you rigged them ???

Hope to see some environment modelers jump into this ?!?!!?

04 April 2006, 04:10 PM
I must say, he did do a great job with the mesh. It was very easy to rig.

04 April 2006, 04:20 PM
That walk cycle just made my day!

I really need to put more work on the texture and fix any UV issues. I usually map for games so i have no clue what kind of res we're going for (like twice the render size maybe?).

I'm more than happy to provide the model, but like BOY1DA mentioned, it'd be nice to be credited for the modeling :D.

Hopefully my next post will have something interesting to show.

04 April 2006, 10:30 PM
There ya go, sorry for not crediting you.. It was a really quick post, and pretty late. haha I might have been delerious.


04 April 2006, 05:33 AM
I made a sky for the enviroment....

I figure I will try to spark it off for the set modeling.
I don't know how much I will model as far as set goes but I will keep trying
to do small things... I want to make some volcanoes next.

then work my way to the foreground to the plants and stuff.

Here is a link to a divx of the sky. (

I made 2 domes , a big one with the far sky and a smaller one with
closer clouds that can be animated, to make it look like the clouds
are drifting......

Jon, can I see a scale comparison of the 2 character together.

We have to keep things in scale, because it is not a good idea to scale rigs.
We have to make sure everything is the right size, at least as far as characters go.

04 April 2006, 05:51 AM
Geez. That sucks. I did have that in mind when I was rigging it, and I even got out the tape measure (The built in one in max), but I must have used different units. lol. Well, I like the critter rig, so I am thinking about re-doing the stumpy.

04 April 2006, 06:17 AM
uuummm, maybe we can try to scale the whole rig , do you think it will mess up ?

If you have to re-rig stumpy, let me know...
Because I will have to give you the version I have, it has the proper UV on it.
The mesh you have has no UV. I did the UV unwrap a while beck. the same time you did the rig.

04 April 2006, 06:52 PM
I think the sky is perfect for the style. :D

I'm no expert on rigs, but i always thought it would be easy to re-scale on the fly...i did this a few times, i created a dummy "root" object on the floor and linked the bones hierarchy to it, so whenever i needed to move or rescale the whole rig, i'd only manipulate the root object. My rigs were never too complex tho.

04 April 2006, 06:24 PM
Textured the body...and gave him some cartoony eyes. (

04 April 2006, 02:29 AM
You have done a great job with the texture.

The color seems a bit too real, I would of preferred to see a more cartoon
style color like something silly , like purple skin wit blue dots and a pink belly..

Or something the looks like a poisonous frog color.

But the way you have it now will also work I guess.
Maybe it would look good if the belly is beige instead of white
with lines like a snake belly ?

The shader needs some work as far a specular gloss.
The texture looks flat shaded.

So what's next.

04 April 2006, 03:25 AM
Forgot to mention, the render is 100% illuminated.

I chose to follow dbates' advice, more earth tones rather than the fluorescent green and blue i had originally cooked up. Changing colors shouldnt be a problem.

Totally agree about the belly, i kind of left it blank, wasnt sure what kind of pattern to add. Also, it doesnt render too good because well, its too white!.

Indeed, the shader sucks, someone more experienced should handle that part. Arent shadows "miraculously" calculated at render time?

04 April 2006, 03:51 AM
Kool, well I was just thinking out loud.

I think your job is done as far as the critter is concerned.
All that stuff I said can be tweaked at render time so no big deal.

Is there anything else you would like to work on ?

04 April 2006, 03:26 PM
All of this is looking really good. I hope it all fits in with Stumpy. Sorry You had such a pain rigging him omega, my inexperience in this area probably shows in the mesh.

If you spot any major problems I will try and resolve them. But you might be quicker tweaking as you go along in Max at this point.

I am still out of action as far as fun things go, but I will try and get back on board soon. Everything is looking great though.

Great job on the critter Psyk0 he really is looking great.


04 April 2006, 05:20 PM
Go ahead and add the purple spots--we're going for a cartoony look, after all. ;) A strange mix of realism and imagination ought to add to the humor.

I can't see the sky dome. . . no DivX codec installed on these (school) machines. Any chance you could post a jpeg capture, BOY1DA?

04 April 2006, 06:26 PM
Kool, well I was just thinking out loud.

I think your job is done as far as the critter is concerned.
All that stuff I said can be tweaked at render time so no big deal.

Is there anything else you would like to work on ?

Yeah sure, i could make additional stuff, just give me a list and some pointers.

here's a preview for dbates, i guess im way too late ;): (

04 April 2006, 06:56 PM
Thanks for posting the image... I was too busy to do it.

I will try to draw some doodles to show what I have in mind, some real easy stuff.
some rocks leafs a lots of cloning. maybe even some 2D images on planes I will have to look
threw my clip art libraries for images of cartoon plants and stuff...

What program do you use to model ?

04 April 2006, 08:01 PM
I use 3d max 5.1 & just got max 8.

04 April 2006, 08:52 PM
I will try getting the rig done, sorry for the absense.. I have been/still am pretty busy with an animation... Needed to be out in a week, and ya know how that goes :)

Well.. Everything looks great.. I like the texture, and I think that if we throw that into like, gi or something, we should get killer results...

04 April 2006, 12:44 PM
Thanks Psyk0!

BOY1DA, I like that sky. Looking forward to an environment! Hey--maybe we could make use of the Matte Painting forum and see if we could get some help with a background plate.

04 April 2006, 08:07 AM
Thanks dbates, that's a good idea as well.

Psyk0 and anybody else.
Well here is some of my ideas as far as environment props go.
Maybe we can even make some bones of a dead animal to throw in.

I may be too busy to work on any of the props right now.
but if anybody wants to model any of the stuff below please do so.
Also if anybody knows how to do particles, we could make smoke coming out
of the volcano .....

04 April 2006, 09:03 AM
Looking good, I like the style of the props. I might play about with them in a couple of weeks when I am a little more free with my time.

I have had nothing but bad luck with my PCs at the moment. As you may remember I lost my HD a while back. So I got back up and running and bought myself an external drive for backing up.....which has now died as well...and while I was trying to troubleshoot it my PC died either mobo or CPU, trying to figure out which.

So PCs seem to hate me at the moment. I will sacrifice a goat or something to the god of PCs a I hope it pleases him enough to leave me alone.

This wee project seems to be moving along nicely though. Looking forward to seeing it evolve.

Until then....

04 April 2006, 11:36 PM
[me donates a goat]

I agree--nice props. (The only particles I know are in Maya, and I'm not even proficient with them yet. . . sorry. . .)

Random idea: should we put a half-finished tic-tac-toe grid in the [dirt] floor of the cave?

04 April 2006, 12:34 AM
Dont have i'll sacrifice a frozen chicken.

Here's a lathe (aka mushroom) and a vine "system" i came up with: ( (

04 April 2006, 10:02 PM
Well, I am going to have to re-rig stumpster.. If you wanna give me a model with the correct uv info that would be cool, save some time in the end.

04 April 2006, 10:04 PM
I like the idea of a tictac game goin on, maybe it can be a heiroglyphic tho.

04 April 2006, 02:18 AM
I'm looking at the file with the uv, and I didn't do such a great job, because
I was trying to learn how to use pelt mapping... but it is better then nothing at this point.

omega3d: I put the file I did on my server, so you can find it there with all the other stuff
you have done for my project.


04 April 2006, 11:16 AM
Hey Guys,

Well I have finally got some free time so hopefully I will be messing about back in here again. I have also got access to Max in my new workplace so I am going to try and use it for the mean time. Always nice to try something new.

I thought I would start off simple and make a couple of mushrooms for the scene. No idea if they will be used but it was a quick education in Max for me :)

Anyway here they are. I will try and churn out some more stuff over the next few days/weeks etc.

PS Sorry for the crap lighting, I never was much good at it and I don't have a clue about it in max :P

04 April 2006, 03:29 PM
Those mushrooms have a lot of character ....
Good to see you putting 3DS MAX to the test.

I think the director and story board artist should jump in right about now.

If we can get the very first shot decide on, we can all work to getting
that shot done as our first milestone, then we can move on to a second shot.
If we are able to complete the first, We will then have a better idea how to place
objects in the scene, we can use block objects as place holders and then
replace them one by one as the final models are textured and ready to be shot.

05 May 2006, 08:40 PM
I might be a little late but if you guys still need anything modeled i would be more than glad to lend a hand. i know some Maya...and a little max still have a little to learn about modeling but i should be able to handel a few things you send my way.
looking forward to it!

05 May 2006, 10:31 PM
Been a while, cool mushrooms TheFreak, they got more style than mine! :D.

Alive: feel free to model anything from BOY1dA's sketches:

05 May 2006, 05:47 PM
Hey guys :)

I would like to join in this project as modeling artist and animator.Wil someone please tell me who i should contact ?

Take care guys :)

05 May 2006, 03:40 AM
ChrisBG is the director. . . TheFreak helps out a lot too. I'm not sure where Chris is now (haven't heard from him in a while), but he'll be back soon, I'm sure. I pop in from time to time, though my work is mostly done (I'm the scriptwriter).

06 June 2006, 09:03 AM
Hi Stavrev-Maya thanks for the PM, i didn't even realise you had posted in here already. Anyway if you are still looking to help out then we are more than happy to have you.

The project goes along at it's own pace, its kinda driven by the people. So when everyone it in the mood it skips along nicely but then it usualy dies down again afterwards. But it's a WIP and it will get done eventually :)

What skills are you looking to use on this?

We really need some offical concept art for the scene and then the 3D modelling to flesh it out. If you have any 2D skills like that is would really help. BOY1DA (the TD) has done a lot to help us in this area at the moment but he is a busy man so any help is always welcome. We have also had a good outline for the scene in 3D (check the threads for updates) but we need something a little more concrete. To be honest I am reluctant to tell you to go and model without first having a decent ref to go on. That has probably been the downfall of this project thus far, everyone is working off a different style and imagination. We need a little consistancy.

So if you have 2D skills and want to make us an environment then that would be great. If you have any friends who have 2D skills and would like to help then that would also be great. I think we need to hold off on the 3D stuff for the moment until we have this down.

Read the script and look through the pictures on the thread to get an idea of where we are at the moment and then we can take it from there.

Thanks again for the interest
(and that also goes for any of you new people reading this. Feel free to jump in, the water is cold but you will soon get used to it)

06 June 2006, 01:57 PM
Hey guys.. Just for an update, I have been working on stumpy on and off... The rig should be a little better this time. The animal is fairely complete.. I think I want to re-skin it in Max8.. I like the envelopes better. I hope you guys have max 8... Anyway.

Hope all is well


06 June 2006, 05:10 PM
Hey Jon,

If you are having problems with stumpy and you think it's mesh related, let me know and I'll see if I can tweak him. I am probably a bit ignorant when it comes to that kind of thing so it will be a good learning curve if it is the mesh.

Let me know if you need any help.


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