View Full Version : Master and Servant 3D Entry: Berter Akyol

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03 March 2005, 09:38 PM
Berter Akyol has entered the Master and Servant 3D.

Challenge Page (

03 March 2005, 10:54 AM
I have had actually waited a dear while until a question would be answered in the FAQ forum before I begin my with my concpet. As time is sort of valueable to me. I really preffered not to waste it.

The idea actually coming from my wife would give me the reason to want to dedicate this entry to her part. Dracula being of her most favoured movie and actally character (Tells alot about why she chose to marry me) I think it would be a great dedication
Her words were simple.. About the manner Dracula as capable of controling the nocturnal beasts. How the living of the night were all servents to his command.

You can imagine where that short statement led me to...
But unfortunately I was not too sure of the acceptability of the vampires (Leave alone the Prince of Darkness... NOT the Ozborn one) would qualify as to be humans. So I had to ask it through.

None the less I think that if I happen to wait any longer I shall be starting too late.
I thought I would change my concept slightly to the general atmosphere painted with the dominence of the vampire and his tight-grasp to the control of night and all it inbeds. So in a manner be able to add in his human servents to ensure that a human is envolved...

This shall conclude the seas of those that he has victomised to servent him until their last drop of blood has served to fullfill his thurst; the waves of mist concieving mysteries to his demand; wolves howling to music his terror; the many eyes of the night spying all for his service.
So my upcoming scene is going to be a sort of full house with a variaty of characters all together:

"How the night is a Servent to this cursed Master!"

Well hey I had better get some sketches done... Hope I'll have some time soon.


03 March 2005, 01:56 PM
Sounds exciting! Loads of options as to how you might do it!:thumbsup:

But I imagine it would also be very difficult to get the idea across exactly!

Good luck with that!:wise:

03 March 2005, 02:18 PM
Thank you very much.. I hope I can manage to live up to halve of what you have pictured as you read through. It is going to be as demanding as everybody elses projects.

Well better get something uploaded soon! :bounce:

03 March 2005, 10:43 AM
COME OOONN BLACK; GET BUSSYYYY:scream: dont slack off and get to work:buttrock:

03 March 2005, 08:59 AM (

Oops.. Sorry Nebezial;
But other than being busy, I had a good excuse: Stupidly enough, I had uploaded my last 2D-ConceptSketch here. And didn\\\'t want to upload til things got cleared out.
Which was AGAIN my fault because Robertfixed the problem the minute he read the email early this morning.

So not having a decent excuse anymore; I had to sit and sketch what I had sort of visioned onto paper so I can keep you guys posted.

The general era I am going for is sort of like that of a musical.. full of colours and movement... the elements shall be various with a variaty of decoration through out. But I intend to shade all of it in the blue-tints of the night.
The location I preffered to is in the skirts of the country side. I was in doubt of placing him on a tower or something. But I thought the enveloping stone construction under an arc-bridge would give the same atomsphere, and allow me to add the variaty I am sort of going for.

The sketch was done in the VERY little time I had. So it is not really that discriptive, nor successful. I hope it can be enough to help you get some idea.

Any advices would be very helpful;
Thank you.

03 March 2005, 12:40 PM
BETTER! u r forgiven but dont let this happen again! your concept is awesome, it has that movielike thing going on. cant wait to see some modelling... weeelll... iiim waiiting:D

03 March 2005, 01:36 PM
Wow, I love the theme!!:twisted: ahaha
Great start Berter! Can´t wait to see the models!!
See you soon!:thumbsup:

03 March 2005, 01:42 PM
nice theme, nice sketch ... bring on the blood:thumbsup:

03 March 2005, 06:45 AM
wow.. thats relly something... i like vamires a lot... you have captured an relally good feeling in your drawing,, cant wait to see what happens when you turn this thing to 3d...
and yeah, blood more blood...

03 March 2005, 06:58 AM
Don't tempt me.. Or you will get a picture bled in crimson all through out! And dark only where the blood has clot into a crust of wasted nutrition! :twisted:


I got REALLY 'dull'ed-up up with 'all work and no play'...

And am going to try and spend the whole of today to do things for the two entries only! Lets see if I'll get stuff good enough to post

Thank you guys for your generous compliments.


04 April 2005, 12:15 PM
all work no play makes u sumthin sumthin:D that s the ticket no pain no gain... and pain is good for u YEAH BLACKIE; GO CRAZY:buttrock:

04 April 2005, 12:50 PM
Lol.. the quote sounds a lot better when it is written out of the hand of Jack Nicholson :)

I have started on the Vampire yesterday.. but I am redoing it today.. didn't exactly like how it went.

Oh BTW Nebezial; You can refer to me in many versions of Black, but 'Blackie' has another personal meaning to myself. And I would prefer you don't use it. I am overwhelmed with your friendliness to me, Please don’t feel as if you have offended me or anything. It is just a request.

04 April 2005, 01:11 PM
understood BLACKSTER:D

04 April 2005, 01:31 PM
Hey Black.

Your sketch is looking good, I can almost imagine the intense dar night setting allready. What do you plan to do with the empty space, a layer in compositing? I always have trouble getting good organic looks done.

C Ya

04 April 2005, 01:32 PM
nice sketch dude, great concept

04 April 2005, 02:39 PM
Thank you JMBoekestein,

I have been a little bit over-occupied by my other (2D) entry. Especially since I am obsessed with going extreme in detailing.

The sketch presented here is sort of embarrassing to my part... as it was done in a serious rush with little quality to my liking. But it was a general legend to how I plan on laying my stuff out.

I do not know which empty spaces exactly you are referring to;
The area right at his feet is going to be a crowd of people.. all motioning towards him. I can't give an exact number yet, but I presume something around 20 or 30.
The area to the left of the screen is going to be the bed of the canaal/river which the bridge is going over. There shall be pebbles and water plants where the land meets the water. And a variety of rats shall be populating it.
And the area on the right of the screen shall be shaded by his cape to allow a blend by cutting off from the background. The people motioning to him shall disappear under it. This and a heavy mist is meant to keep the foreground layout to be a bit more acceptable.

I have placed a variety of the elements elements I had a mind to add in. They shall all be having blood-red eyes; luminent to the shades of the dark. And have also a mind of making a vulture and a spider some where.. going to see how I am able to pull off the modelling on the draft stage of them. And then I shall be startiing off with really setting things into their final positions.

EddieEllis; The concept is not exactly a story I created from scratch as I would prefer. I am hoping to improve and personalise it as I go.

Thanks evreyone:)


04 April 2005, 05:58 PM
I really liked your 2d entry, so I had to check this one out. I like that you're making it look theatrical-- should bring it lots of attention. Don't know if this would help, but your concept reminded me of the Kinks' song "Sleepwalker". ( Not sure if you've ever heard it but I thought the lyrics might be good inspiration. Since your wife's a vampire fan, do you have any plans of making her the female lead? ;)

Again, good luck in the challenge!

04 April 2005, 08:58 AM
Interesting storyline/concept.......Like the sketch work too....Well done Black.....I'll be looking in to see how you of luck to you....:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 04:27 AM
Hey Black, where´s the ups my friend??? I´m anxious to see the models! haha
Good luck mate!

04 April 2005, 09:06 AM
Waiting for your progress...Good luck!!!

04 April 2005, 07:51 PM
ILikeSoup; Went through the lyrics.. :) So you shall be remembering me each time you hear it again?:bounce:
As for my wife.. well that you shall just have to see. Won't you now?

Viruoso; Always have anice thing to say don't you? :blush:
Thank you.. in the manner things are going: I shall truely be needing all the luck I can get.

Mecman; Working on it. I had done two head versions (The second being generated) of the main character and well didn't work out at all. So last night just around dusk I had my wife take a few pictures of me screeming/snarrling. Will be preparing some sketches taking that as a refference, and posting SOMETHING tomorrow or so.

J++Dragon; Ok, I'll try to hurry up!

Thank you all for still keeping track of my "One-Post" thread...
I'll especially get things in order so I have more time for the contest. It came up in a very bad timing. I am very dence here.

Thank you again;


04 April 2005, 07:56 PM
Sounds great!

you allready have an intricate iea of what to do! Especially like the idea of the people running into his coat. Reminds me of cloak and dagger.:)

04 April 2005, 08:09 PM
Very interesting and detailed concept. I hope to see models soon :arteest:

Good luck!

04 April 2005, 07:27 AM
Hi Black. Really looking forward to seeing your WIP for this concept. Good luck. :thumbsup: Claireabella

04 April 2005, 08:32 PM
damn Black. those horses... looks better than just good ...
i really wait to see that all in 3d.. and im really sure it is going to be something amazing "like allways" some wolfs maybe fits in the scene nicely?

04 April 2005, 08:50 PM
Thanks for your support everybody.. I have a variaty of my models planned out. And shall be posting some layouts of them as I get things together. The first to come shortly.

Juha; Well actually I had put wolves in it! :sad:
But they are so tiny in the sketch...
Take a look at the top right hand corner of the sketch... you'll see them howling on the tops.

04 April 2005, 08:51 PM
Hi BlackDidThis, nice to see some good old fashioned darkness in your work:thumbsup: Looking forward of course to it being good old fashioned 3d darkness tho...
Good luck mate

04 April 2005, 09:12 PM (

Well not really a fantastic post I know;
but I was too embarrassed to keep the thread as empty as it was.

What you see here was modelled by shifting verts and extruding. Occasionally I had to flip edges or split things differently for a more suiting topology.
I preferred to construct this guy symmetrical at this stage. I’m going to be having Six horses in total that I shall be detailing differently, but taking this as a base for all of them.

The workflow I have in mind is to rig this base, and then give it separate poses according to the sketch at the top and then to export each to Zbrush so I can start making them sort of unique. And much more detailed.

Though I have drawn horses many times. I have only modelled a horse once while trying to create a centaur. So I am sort of in doubts for the mane and the tail-hair. What would you guys advise? Should I try to go for dynamic hair or soft-bodies? Or should I go for overlaying trans-maps? Or should I just sculpt it all out? Since it IS going to be a still...

Hope you like it...


04 April 2005, 09:16 PM
Thanks DaddyMack; I'll try my best to keep it dark and wicked. (Though I am in doubt to make it sort of 'turn of the century' styled or not)

04 April 2005, 09:17 PM
Finally!! hahaha, great my friend! nice step by step!
Good luck! and keep the ups coming!!:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 09:21 PM
We have 3D launch.....I love saying that......looking to be off well too.....All from that little box.....almost like magic....;)

Keep it coming Black......I'll be watching,and wish you the best as you move forward....Nice start...:arteest:

04 April 2005, 09:46 PM
Thank you MecMan, Viruoso; Yeah finally I got around to post something. your patience shall hopefully pay off in the days to follow.

Tag Viruoso! ... your turn to post! :)

04 April 2005, 09:50 PM
damn sorry. i didnt see those beauties, only few lines but there they are... damn.. your skills are something really amazing....

04 April 2005, 02:39 AM
Wow great modeling, and on top of that a tutorial in one image. Great work:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 11:36 AM
Hey there BlackDidThis, mental modelling so far, very efficient workflow too:thumbsup:

His neck area may need some attention tho...It looks a bit thick (maybe it's the angle) and I'd say he would benefit from a slightly more pronounced chest, maybe that will come from tightening the neck.

Congrats for hitting the polys mate, keep it up

and thank you for your insights into my entry.

I'll be around to see where you go;)

04 April 2005, 11:58 AM
Thank you Juha, Artutik and DaddyMack; compliments ost apreciated.

DaddyMack; I see your point about the neck.. the camera angle also has a play in this.
It distorted too much to my liking at the result of it. But since it was just to show the model I hadn't payed as much attenion to it as I should (Forgetting that it has to be good enough for you guys to be able to point things out).
If you could take a look at my ref image, that is the (Almost) exact measures the model you saw has been modeled in. Would you still say that it is too thick, or am I fine?

There is alot of details I plan on adding once I create various poses for each horse. I will definately note your comments about the chest then if not already. (Now searching for refferences for the constraints)

Thanks again;


04 April 2005, 12:12 PM
Hey Black, my first impression, from the sketch as well, was of zebra like proportions but I do wear glasses, and I've been staring at this screen all day...

04 April 2005, 02:39 PM
Naa it's not really your glasses nor your 'staring'ness...

I guess I just added the mane to the neck or something. When I took another look You have a point. I tried to leave most to the Zbrushing. But this is a bit too obviouse.. instead of fixing it for every model, I had best fix the base! :)
Actually I would like to fix the eye aswel. I wanted it a bit big, but not THIS big;

Expect an update later in the evening


04 April 2005, 03:22 PM
Hi Black, finally, made it over here as well! Your horse looks very good, nice step by step, and your concept looks very promissing. I love the dandyvamp he is, also the time you chose has beautifull fashion features. looking forward to your progress here, no crist so far yet cuz what you done yet is methodoaclly clean and stylistic cool. keep it up mate!:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 09:27 PM
very neat work there Black. Allthough now the horse seems to have a rather thick neck it's obvious you know where you're going with this! Cool work!:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 09:37 PM
Nice horse. I like horses too.

(at cizmisin usta)

04 April 2005, 06:38 PM
Yes The1st_Angel;
Finally.. Sorry to keep you guys waiting. Thank you for always being around patiently.
I am not sure any more of the era.. but will be going for it in the end most probably. I am liking the sketches lay out more and more. I am happy you liked them. Thank you for the compliments.
I don't exactly have an intention of calling these tutorials or anything. But I think it a good method of presenting the work. Gives those that are curios on the methods a chance to take a look on the making. Unfortunately this was not of my best models as I intended on just creating a base mesh for now. I think it took aoround 2 or so hours to make.. and unforunately it shows :sad:

Thank you again for your confidence in me. Well I sort of have plans of my own. But I would like to hear any options shall you come up with any. Thank you again for the time and kind words.

I was just over at your thread. And I must accept that you have done a very impressive job on your horse there. I shall try and detail mine soon.

Yesterday my Father came on the thread and asked about the number of horses I was to use. Reminding me that the sketch had only 4. I think he had a pint. 6 may be JUST a bit too much for the whole crowd I have there. So I think I will get back to the original 4 horsed carriage.

I had actually hoped to be able to post an update this evening. But things went very hectic. I shall be leaving off with my wife on a holiday. There is a chance that I may get online for other matters. But if not I shall be back and running Wednesday on.

Thank you guys again, and til later!


04 April 2005, 10:09 PM
Black thanx for your tip on the specular pass for my puppets, I'll try it out.

04 April 2005, 02:39 AM
Hey Black,

I'm really liking the concept, and I'm preety sure you will have no problem makeing it your own. The sketches are great, and not to mention your modeling of the horse. The typology and edge flow is right on point. Black this is agreat start keep it up, and I wish you luck. :buttrock:

Master and Servent thread

04 April 2005, 10:09 AM
Hey Black,
Just stumbled across your horse modeling and checked out your concept sketch. Looking darn good. Very brave building a horse, real buggers to draw I can only imagine how tricky to make. Cheers sean :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 10:22 AM
Great Job Black. Good work. very clean. Keep it up :D :D

04 April 2005, 03:04 PM
Arlutik; You are most welcome. As some one with such an impressive thread as yours. It was only a matter of time before you would have figured it out yourself. I can provide a link to a simiallar effect I went for in one of my earlier models shall it serve use by your seeing what it may look like.

Sifer; Thank you for your kind words. I had modeled this horse under a great rush and great hurry (forgetting that it is not speed modeling this time :) ) As I was in a VERY dence schedual. But now that I got back I feel rude to have posted it in such a state. I shall work on her a bit more.

UK3D; I have to agree with you on the bit that they are adevil to do. I think this was the first time I had a real go at it. And I failed miserably. At least I am glad you liked my concept sketch :)

Agamemnwn; What a pleasent suprise!! :) So you too are here eh? So are you going to show off with an entry from yourself aswel? I would be looking forward to it if you could spare the time!

Thanks everyone for stopping by. It means alot as we all already know. On my trip back I had done a new sketch for thescene and I am not sure if I should go for it. I'll get to it after I am done with some other stuff I have in hand and post it to see what you would propose.

Expect an upload in a few minutes;


04 April 2005, 03:22 PM (

Ok here is another base character. Though I can hardly call this one a low-res.
The composition has not been finalised yet, and these guys just might be in the far back.
So until I decide on what to do with the pack. I guess this is the form you will be seeing the wolf-base (Like without more descriptive paw’s). Though you may get to see a variety of poses.

The model was realised by a technique I had discovered on Dave’s site (A.k.a. The Hobbit Guy). It is basically tracing out your image.. and then dividing it up into the rough topology you would want. After you pull all the vertices out, you simply start pushing them back into position. I left a gap for the ears and the legs to extrude them out from here later on.

Now the worst part about this model was that I had to REALLY struggle to get it to look the way it is. In fact it wasn't done in just one attempt. Each time the result looked more like a dog than a wolf.
Actually I am not completely satisfied with this one either. What do you think? Would you call this guy a wolf?


04 April 2005, 03:29 PM
Keep goin good luck

04 April 2005, 05:31 PM
Hey, nice idea and sketching. Like Dracula too.My M&S thread

04 April 2005, 07:14 PM
looks wolf to me.......really good one ... :bounce:

04 April 2005, 07:46 PM
Hey BlackDidThis, another fine base mesh man:thumbsup: He's looking way wolfy too, you might try scaling his height and length a lliile and he'd probably benefit from a slightly stronger bottom jaw...I dig the workflow shots man, I used a similar workflow for the first time with Flat Cat and I'll definitely go at it again...Keep fighting the good fight my friend;)

04 April 2005, 08:17 PM
Hi Black........Yes I would say he is a wolf for sure.......Perhaps to give him a final touch you can add some "girth" some "Beef" to the hind legs,and even a touch to the front ones.......also a touch more size and thickness to the body itself........the jaw can also get a touch more size in all directions..........actually it's real close,just some added overall "Beef" size,thickness.....real good job,and I think you got yourself a wolf for sure......keep this up,doing real nice....your one of the few 5D guys.....2D and 3D.....well done......:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 12:42 AM
Hey Black

Great looking dog, very nicely modeled.

and thanx for the one page tutorial, I love the way you set your modeling presentation.


04 April 2005, 01:14 AM
I loved your wolf,
i'm watching your topic..

04 April 2005, 06:50 AM
Suk-Grigorij; I guess then you would get along with my wife well. Or at least you would like me (I sort of look like him :) ) Thank you for dropping by.

Juha; I know your lovely Teea and yourselves are literally experts on dog's and K-9 races to compair to me. And it is only because of your support that I dared post this guy, though I am honestly not self convinced. Will see how much time I will have to be able to spare. Thank you both for sparing the time to look at my K-9.

DaddyMack; My 'always there' friend, thank you for again dropping by. Especially while modeing heads I do go for a technique such. It allwos some serious control over the details. But I think the wolf attempts were the first time I had used it for the whole bod. Simply because I didn't have a sketch prehand this time to refference from. I'll try to bulk her up a little... And I think I may try going for a more powerful jaw.. will see.
Thank you for your help

Virtuoso; Thank you, well it helps to read that she looks like a wolf. DaddyMack Had said about the same thing in a manner. I shall try adding some more 'bief' as you put it. I think it might add some more wildness. As for the jaw, I shall try to thicken it on the y axis a bit...
But you see when I had thickened it as it is, I lost the elegent snout thing that the ref photo's all had. Not to mention that when I narrowed it I had a fox! :(
I'll give your offers a go, and see she can turn out to bite some serious arse! :)
Thank you again for your support!

Arlutik; Nooooooo!!! :cry: Looks like a dog doesn't it?! :(
Thank you for your kind words and support. I'll try to make her look a bit more like a wolf.

Gui_Mends; Thank you for dropping by. I hope to not disapoint you in the process.

Thank you all for the support... I'll be updating some more later on today


04 April 2005, 10:35 AM
First thanks for such explainatory posts with pro-done models WIP!!!
About the wolf, well it is a little bit hard to say it is a wolf, man unless you called it so...Wolves are more athletic, I mean their chest is wider and stomach is thinner and large shoulders...And the most important parts are their ears and mane...Ears are sharp, pointing straight up to sky, the mane is around the neck and continues a bit through the ridge...It is not too much like a lion but enough to show them majestic!!!
And your wolf seems a bit shorter to me, try to lengthen its body and limbs...The tail and the mouth is just like you did...Texturing can change a lot of things, waiting for your textures...
KEep the good work goin' man!!!

04 April 2005, 04:52 PM
Hello J++Dragon;
Funny, I was JUST at your thread a while ago.
I must confess that to compair to your hard working and impressive thread, I am proceeding at turtle speed here!
Thank you for your generous compliment. I had put aside renders as I worked, but I figured it be a btter display shall I post them all together.
As for your pointers about the wolf; I have too always thought the ears more pointed out, and infact drawn them such, but aparently they were round and foldable. I might make them a bit less fleshy in the final. But it seems to fit a variaty of my ref photo's.
I have to agree about the magestic stance of the mane and the broadening of the neck. That part was sort of a dilemma all through-out my modeling her; since it was a combination of her thinner fur overlapping the thicker/shorter ones; wasn't sure if I should model it out, or fur it out.
In the final state, I sort of tried to leave that to the fur. I'll try your sudgestion and bulk that up a bit aswell as the rest of the body when I try the advices. But I think I might leave that to the fur in the result.
The hight.. yes I think you are very right on that! I shall try and get her higher than that. Now you said it, I notice that it's looking more like a Belgian Shpeherd. I will definately give that a go. Actually again the camera angle is doing it's thing... but the legs are shorter than they should be.
Thank you very much for pointing that out with all the other useful information you have given me.

I noticed my biggest mistake in the making of her while re-evaluating things:
I left the mouth open in order to have easier access to the inside of it... And that sort of made it difficult for me to calculate the exact structure of the jaw. I shall be modeling it's teeth and jaw soon.. hoping that it will help solve a few things.
I have taken notes of all that you guys have pointed out, and shall see how each works out.
This evening I have nothing in hand, and I really intend on doing some serious catching up. So expect a few updates tonight; if not tomorrow morning.

Thank you all once again;


04 April 2005, 05:06 PM
looks good - i like that technique - i find its a really fast way to get a model started on the right path. The only downside is that you start with this perfect profile and then if it doesn't look quite right in the perspective you can be at a loss as to why exactly. Your model might have a bit too much bulk, thickness, for a wolf, more like a german shepherd, whereas a wolf is characterized by a really long thin body and legs, also the snout looks a little wide. Looking a like a pretty good basis tho. Keep it up!

04 April 2005, 09:57 PM
Oh, you say you are slow but I think faster than me.
Wolf is good. In my opinion dont waste time with shaping it. It will become a good wolf as soon as you make it wear a good texture map. Later you may change some vertex coordinates as well.

(Kurt çizmişin hehe... güzel olmuş beğendim hakikaten.)

You were asking about the Turkish historic edged weaponry. Infact I have quite well knowledge about arms and armour of all ages (by a personal interest) and a wide variety of reference pictures etc. (several hundred mbytes of jpg.s bmp.s or scanned ones including my own drawings) Forget about the comic book "janissary". I only smile to that one. I may help you with the real knowledge and references.

Yeniçerinin nesini istersin? Zırh? Silah? Başlık? Tarihçe?

04 April 2005, 05:22 PM
Nice wolf Black!! The mesh is very clean indeed!!
I think Virtuoso made some great keep it up mate!! I´m following!!

04 April 2005, 07:10 PM (

This was a sketch I had started off in the hotel\'s lobby and went on with on our ride back.

The idea came with a conversation with my wife over the part about how he is able to make the fog behave in mysterious ways...

My first wish from the start was to have his head massive and dominating the canvas.. and the rest of the servants and landscape to fall within. But I changed that due to it being TOO post work dependent.
That’s what got me to sketch this guy here. To sort of have him command a scary stance to the mists as the bats blast a deafening shriek. Such as your eyes to play tricks on you.

Another thing I am possibly going to go for is again going to be through particle dynamics; to have him sort of disintegrate legs up.

Most of the rest is just about the same, other than them not being under a bridge, but on his terrace or something. I guess I will decide along the way.
I had LOVED the bridge idea and the lighting it would provide. But it really won\'t go here this time.

C&C welcome... Till later!


04 April 2005, 07:27 PM
Ereitz;Thank you for dropping by... Yes the technique does have it's down falls. Actually most techniques do. I do advise a few try outs before hand for those not too familiar. Then again, it is just about the same in most methods.
As for the wolf; boy am I left in the middle. You are literally stating the opposite of what everone else did. I think though, I found Kuzgunoglu's proposal the best, as to leave it for later and not waste more time. It IS going to be in the back.
I shall though make it's legs longer as J++Dragon has proposed. With that in mind, would you think the too bulkiness would be handled?

Kuzgunoglu;I am a fast modeler when it comes to sitting and modeling. But I can not really say I am contributing as much time as I would so want to for this.
As for the offers for the wolf.. I think you gave the best advice. I AM going to individualise each of them as I paint and sculpt them to a finer detail with ZBrush. So what can I say? Thank you for giving me the wake up call and wish me luck!
As for the Yeniçeri(Janisary) You are VERY kind thank you very much. I have already private messaged you on the matter. We'll talk things over.
Thank you again!

MecMan;There you go with a scary avatar again!!:eek:
I agree with most of Virtuoso's comments and WILL be applying them. But not any longer in this model. Since I shall be sculpting the individual wolves... I think I would be sort of loosing time on a character mounted on a cliff.
Your support and observations a very motivating reason to go on. Thank you!

The more I think of it.. the more this new composition is starting to sink in. I shall be bringing out more of these as I model along. Any comments and idea's are most welcome!


04 April 2005, 08:55 PM
This can be very interesting Black........"The watchful eye".....that looks over all...the master of all before it.......I think this can be real interesting and fun to see come about....Hope to see more soon......:arteest:

04 April 2005, 01:44 AM
Hello Virtuoso; And thank you again for your support.

Yes I had sort of hoped for a dominating watch over the whole scene since day one. And this last composition seems to have it a little bit stronger than most yet.
I shall really have to do a few tests first. Cause though I would like the randomness of the particle systems such as to ensure a natural look; I am also going to have to keep them well under control. Making sure they serve the master as he wishes them to.

Sort sure it will be intresting.. lets see if it will look good in the meantime.

Thank you again;


04 April 2005, 01:48 AM
Nice concept & drawing :thumbsup: Should be looking great in 3D. Looking forward to it :)

04 April 2005, 01:55 AM (

I tried to fix up the horse, keeping my notes from your critics in mind.
Hopefully it is more suitable, since I am going to leave the base like this so as to start generating horses from it.

First I fixed the shape of the head and neck, and added a broader chest in the meanwhile.
Then I went in and replaced the eye... modifying the socket and lids to fit around it.

Hope you like it!


04 April 2005, 07:19 AM
Nice work and once again even if it seems i repeat myself thanx for the great modeling tutorial

Great work man :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 02:46 PM
Hi there!
shame on me I haven´t written before...
I like a lot the sketch, fantastic and misterious... and the models are great! :thumbsup:
Are you going to put red ayes to master and servants???

I was about asking, the wolf and its modeling technique? is this technique fast compared to others? It seems to be interesting but really hard.

04 April 2005, 02:58 PM
Wow man!! I can´t wait to see this sketch turned on 3d!! Really nice idea Black! I love the eye and the atmosphere!!!

Here goes some scenes to inspire you! Hope you like!!
See you mate!

04 April 2005, 04:57 PM
You can repeat yourself all you want. I am very glad you spared the time to drop by and let me in on your thoughts.
Embarassingly, this is not exactly a good tutorial... though I am sure you are more than capable of following through even this!
Would you guys preffer or like it that I prepare it as a tutorial? Or the ones to follow? I just thought my posts so far were nothing really special.. and mostly things that most of the contestants are already well capable of.
Bealobo;(yeah; Shame on you :p )
No you shouldn't feel bad. I am enjoying your thraed, and your aprouch to my thoughts in it. Nothing done for you to feel bad of not coming and posting in mine :)
But thank you anyways for your kind compliments. And also for sparing the time.
Yes I am going to be adding a pair of red eyes to all his animal servents. And maybe his coachman. They are not exactly going to be bright red specular.. but they are going to have a sort of incandescence on them... I shall probably model one this evening and texture it in the following. You might have something to add on them when posted.
For the modeling technique of the wolf;
Hmm well the answer is "yes" and "no" actually. It really depends on your workflow.
When I had modeled the horse, I had a ref image prepared. When I box model.. I really preffer to have a ref image to gain speed. I earned a habbit of trying to start and finish my models fast, or else I work on them forever. So box modeling was fine.
As for the wolf I didn't.. so I just drew a cut profile of it first with the polygon tool, cut the legs and ears and went head on. Thus this saved me alot of time. But had downfalls in the result.
This is actually a technique that Dave Komorowski ( has developed for modeling heads. And ever since I have read it, 80 percent of my (espcially irregular) heads were all done by his technique. Chek out his tutorial in his home page for a better detailed explanation. The wolf was the first time I ever used it for a complete body. Though I would see it also veryuseful in modeling for anatomy charts of muscles and bones.
THE man! :) Thank you for your once again kind words. I hope it was as nice as you say, cause it is really building on me though I couldn't find a way to resolve the forground like the earlier version. I just might go for it.
Actually the more I think about the technicality it is going to cover, I am having more doubts. What I want is to have my 3D completely 3D.. and my 2D completely painted. so the fog is going to be again 3D and thats not as easy to do as it is by painting... Lets see how far I can take them.
Thank you VERY much for the links.. they are literlayy PERFECT! I definately will be making well use of them. Thank you!

Thank you ALL for dropping by and your kind words. I shall hopefully updating somewhat later this evening.
Til later;


04 April 2005, 09:46 PM
Hi Black,
More more...Waiting to see what you do next. There's some great modelling here can't wait to see it all come together. I'm following your development. good luck. :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 09:55 PM
Hi there again BlackDidThis, great fine tune on the horse base mesh man, I really like the new eyelids...Good luck with all the zbrushing, sounds like great fun...I'm into your last sketch too..gotta say it tho....clock's ticking...
Keep the quality coming mate:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 12:23 AM
ALOT more is going to come.. I am really working on it.
I would't personally call the modeling as great as you cared to compliment me for. But your encouragements are working dearly.
Thank you!
I just hope for the rest to be good enough to what you are expecting.

I'll be honest with you (Don't tell anybody else on the forum); I was nearly falling asleep on my keyboard when I had done the first model horse. As I stated before; I was very embarassed to have posted her such. I guess I was too ambitiou to post something.
None the less the eye lids suffered from that alot aswel. I am glad you like the new ones. Oh and what do you say about the neck this time? I had the llast shot with the exact same angle as the first posted series so you could better compair.

I KNOW the clock is ticking :sad:
I just HOPE I can make it.. and I have so MUCH to do! :cry:
(Keep reminding me though.. I think the stress would add to my pace :twisted: )

Posting a little something in a while;


04 April 2005, 12:31 AM (

I have a few things I am working on, but not really readied to be posted yet. You guys see a nice clean layout; but I sort of do some try outs with things before I decide on them.
So until I have the other stuff readied; here is a little something I did earlier today upon a reminder from Beatriz (Beolobo);
A VERY basic method such as to model out an eye. Some would prefer to model it out from sphere as it is. But I personally don’t like having to ad and remove isopams around when I could simply play with one curve and thus alter the whole shape.
Before I would also go through the trouble to have modelled out the anterior and the posterior chambers as well as the lens (To give a more realistic refraction). But in time I grew to understand it to be a serious waste of time and computer calculation... since a simple dark pocket pitted inside of the retina has proven efficient enough.

I simply started with a circle, rotated it, then set it’s sweep to 180 (Semi-circle).
Then I played around with it’s CV’s till I got a satisfactory shape. Then I added one more intersecting curve for the retina, and another for the ‘pocket’ mentioned earlier.
I cut and combined them together. Then revolved the result into a surface in the software’s default settings.
From the side view I drew a curve slightly larger than the first, with a bulge on the tip and rotated it to create the cornea.
(With the history still attached; now is a good time to do some last adjustments to the shape of the curve)

Going to be texturing it now.. I will most probably post it very soon.
Til later;


04 April 2005, 01:26 AM
Less time clicking here..more time clicking there me thinks mate...Alt-Tab out ...

The neck looks great, as does the rest of the horse, cool quick eye too:thumbsup:

Now go to your room;)

04 April 2005, 04:45 AM (

Still occupied, but I will be able to post some cool modelling stuff soon (I hope)

This is a short lay-out on how I got the textures on the eye correctly. Thought I can easily call it a custom made texture, I overlaid the veins for the eyes from a Deadeye-texture and the referenced the iris/pupil from a photo of my own eyes.
In order to know where to place what in the photo editor, I had to sort of integrate painting in a 3D package and painting in a 2D package interchangeably.

One more thing that was sort of important here was that I first flattened the pupil and the iris to make it easier to paint. Later I restored the file to before my flattening, and just applied the texture (One of the cool parts about NURBS, they have a consistency)

The bump, diffuse and specular were greyscale variations of the tex map. I additionally added a colour pass to the iris in the specular map, so as to have the glitter in the iris a bit more spooky.
Til later;


04 April 2005, 04:47 AM
great eye texture.. fantastic the way you showed a step by step way of texturing helps learners and newer cg'er's have an idea of how to get a good eye texture going... fantastic

04 April 2005, 05:00 AM
Less time clicking here..more time clicking there me thinks mate...Alt-Tab out ...
Now go to your room;)
:sad: yes daddy :sad:

You thinks right I would say.
But I sort of found a system: when ever I am waiting for a render or a save, or an open: I pay here a visit. Infact it happens that I even type in my updates to a word doc.. or completely prepare my updates, but post it 8 hours later in the next time I have to sit and wait.
As weird as it may sound. It sort of spices up the workflow.
Thank you again for your supportive compliments. I have a dear few updates coming in the next few days. I hope to be as free as I was last night.

Thank you for dropping by, I am very glad you liked the lay out...
Unfortunately they don't exactly carry a 'tutorial' quality in teaching. It is just a brief to fill you guys in in the steps I took.
Maybe it's because I so enjoy the struggle I give in the creation process of things, I really want to share it with you all :)

Til next time;


04 April 2005, 05:01 AM
Yeah Black...Nice tutorial..The incandescance is a cool touch, it changes the look all together, I saved it for reference:thumbsup:...I keep meeting all these mental, nocturnal people here...and they keep teaching me all this great stuff...Thanks mate, LYW!

Still wondering when you'll start to really hit us hard though, with some good 'old country' darkness...

04 April 2005, 04:29 PM
Ah YES, Black - you're horse is now looking so much better :) good job, man.
Looking forward to updates; cool concept you've got there too ;)

edit: If you've got a spare eyeball or two in 'ASCII' format, please don't hesitate to knock on my door sometime ;)


04 April 2005, 07:56 PM
very nice models. can you post smooth version?

04 April 2005, 10:18 PM
thanks for the tips, the eye is looking good (what about a little reflexion map?).

I think all this thing about red eyes for everyone is a good hit, a really cool thing that put together the characters and the relationship master/servants.

and thanks for the info about the link and so. :)

04 April 2005, 11:04 PM
:thumbsup: hey, nice looking eyes
thanks :bounce:

04 April 2005, 11:33 PM
Thank you... It is a sort of obligational in this case, since the raytrace shadosws will literally kill out the eyes in the night light settings I have in mind
About the hittin you guys hard bit; well yes it is true that I have been doing alot more modeling for this than what is posted. But not exactly a 'hit' quality stuff. Don't get a too big impression of me. I'm really no body special.
Note: I guess you hang out aroud areas for nocturnal individuals such as myself :twisted:

Chris, when did you ever ask me for something and I said no??!!!
I hope you meant MaYA ASCII files... but in any case I have them in a variaty of formats. Shall you apreciate, the file sizes were VERY small for the mesh's, but the textures were fairly high. I gained this stupid habbit of almost never creating a texture smaller than 1024 square. Shall you have need message me and I'll see what I can do ok? (
EyeBall.obj (
EyeBall.DXF (
I have left the history attached to the curves.. so you can modify the whole mesh freely through moving the curves around. It is ofcourse not so possible with the object/CAD files. (I have to note that the DXF teselation didn't really complimnet it all :sad: )

Actually this one is a VERY simple and 'just done' eye. it is going to be more the textures and rendering settings that would make it better. Just try it out then message me.
The eye I am going to make in the middle of the last composition (if I a go for it) is going to be the really SPECIAL eye. I think I shall be really getting into that ones anatomy.

Yes I can.. and I DEFINATELY shall. But in time.. I have other things in progress for now. You shall hopefully be seeing alot of stuff really soon.
Thank you for dropping by and your support.

Do you mean to set an env map or a reflectivity and reflected colour map?
Well for the env.. I usually go for image based lighing or try setting high dynamic range images of my own to compliment the settings. Infact I have one readied for this entry (Not one I myself made though :sad: ) and it was what I have used in the renderings.
For the reflected colour, I think I left it at the system defaults. As in I left it Black.
And for the reflectivity, I selected the pupil and the iris from the texture map and filled it with white after feathering it a bit. Inversed the selection and desaturated and lightened the selection. Then I inverted and darkened the result so as to have a bit of lightness on the veins, but almost completely black in the rest then applied this as it's reflectivity map.
My logic was simply in the means of a cat's eye. I wanted the light rays to be trapped in there for one more pass to enhance it's specular spectrum. The rest was darkened because I simply did not want the white of the eye to be reflective. The outer cornea layer was doing it much enough.

Mr Micro26;
My pleasure.. thank you for your kind words and for dropping by.

I had a diffrent scenario for tonight, but some bits were more complicated than I had thought. So insted I am going to upload another little something for now. Maybe later towards the morning I will have an update, but I doubt it.
See you in a while


04 April 2005, 11:50 PM (

Many things are going a bit ‘difficult on my stage. Especially inefficient data on a Desmodus Rotundus (Common Vampire Bat) for me to model from. I guess they are sort of like hamsters. You can never really photograph them laying still :sad: .
I have completed the wolf in order to get a few poses than sculpt things out. But that’s still a bit far from being ‘post able’ for now.

While completing the wolf. I had to finish off the limbs, giving the extra geometry the paws would be needing. And while doing so I recalled how much I hated doing parts such. And how difficult it actually could get.
So I just thought I would run through a quick modelling sample showing how I handled my pair.

These are of the front legs of the beast, left to be precise. It is all through extruding and splitting besides my collapsing edges at the begining somewhere.
I haven’t positioned the claws into this sample, but I presume that it is sort of straight forward from here on.

Hope you like it... Til next,


04 April 2005, 12:37 AM
Anothe fine workflow mate! and another very precise looking base:thumbsup:

Aww come on Black, we're all someone special...I just meant that I was wondering when you'd stop teasing us with these precision base meshes and start throwing some Zbent stuff our way...Definitely not a complaint.. I've saved most of the workflows you've posted...I'm just way curious to see what you are doing with the fine work you've posted so far...Dare I even say it...yep...curiosity killed my cat, I know...I said it and I'm sending me back to my room!

Keep it coming man

04 April 2005, 07:58 AM
l like the sketch much indeed and the work flow seems to be a kind of tutorial for newbies. l had an eye on your updates. keep goin buddy, good luck. bu arada 3 cizgiden yaptigin goze hasta oldum :)

04 April 2005, 12:25 PM
Hey sweet method for modeling a paw, great work, thanks for sharing! :applause:


04 April 2005, 12:41 PM
Thank you again for your support yet again.
Honestly last wight was intended to be a MUCH more diffrent update. But I'll just break it short: I didn't like it. So I went for updating with this.I am glad you like it.
And DaddyMack; it's not the first time I post also the modeling steps. But I have a habbit of posting an image to only one place. Never repeating. I could put together a collection of head, prop modeling giff's if you would please.

I am flattered to hear these from a modeler like yourself. I am sorry to not really make them eficient tutorials, but at least they give an idea of my methods.
As for the eye; on my post before I linked a few EyeBall formats for AtWooki. You can all feel free to download and take a look at them. They are not really fantastic though. You will need to sort of texture it specially.
One other option is to not combine the curves and revolve them individually after cutting. Then you could texture each of them seperately, thus allowing much more texture detail.
Thank you again for dropping by, you rock!

Thank you for dropping by to encourage me like this. IT is not exactly a tutorial, but well the steps taken. I would adise you to click on the images for my post so as to see the lines more clearly.

Thank you all for your support. Hopefully tonight I shall be working some bit more on my updates.


04 April 2005, 06:25 PM
Sorry from those that have downloaded the *.obj I have replaced it with a working version. It is yet still in a low/med res... so you can smooth it to your will.

til next;


04 April 2005, 08:45 PM
Hi Black

thanx for your comments on my thread they're always appreciated.

You're looking for bats reference, I might have one in a book I could scan for you I just need a way to send it to you.

04 April 2005, 01:54 AM
Thank you very much for your aditional efforts on getting them to me. I happened to have a few anatomical studies and so forth. But the problem is that not too many specimens were out there for this particular bat.

Your thread is one of the most enjoyable ones through out. Even the posts have a story of their own.
So on the contrary; thank YOU for sharing your works with the forum! :thumbsup:


04 April 2005, 08:32 PM
Black you're making me blush.

04 April 2005, 10:45 PM
Very good 'paw' modelling, in your earlier post, Black :thumbsup:

I was only kidding about the eyeballs, BTW (one of my many 'dryer-than-a-parched-desert' quips of dryer than dry humor) but nice to have a quick lookee at ;)

Definitely some very solid work being generated here :applause:

all the best


04 April 2005, 11:06 PM
Thank you again for your support yet again.
Honestly last wight was intended to be a MUCH more diffrent update. But I'll just break it short: I didn't like it. So I went for updating with this.I am glad you like it.
And DaddyMack; it's not the first time I post also the modeling steps. But I have a habbit of posting an image to only one place. Never repeating. I could put together a collection of head, prop modeling giff's if you would please.


Much appreciated, I'm a mad tutorial hoarder, and I haven't got any really tight modelling skills that would be a mad help...

I'll get my people to contact your people after the dust settles on this competition...

A humble :bowdown: to you good sir

And where's the Zzzzzs? tic toc...

04 April 2005, 02:26 AM
'Blush' intended .. lol

Hmm I do get this alot. I am too often critisized about taking everything literally. Guess it comes with not having a life :cry:

Once your people contact my peoples people, you'll probably get access to some serious modeling time laps's and tutorial for the models in the upcoming production.
But til then here are a few I had prepared for the DigitalBacklot:
Head_1a (
Head_1b (
Head_2a (
Head_2b (
Head_2c (
Head_2d (
Head_3 (
BodyArmour_a (
BodyArmour_b (
BodyArmour_c (
BodyArmour_d (
Sword (ç_TimeLaps.gif)
Knife (
Helmet (

Thank you all again for the support... til later;


04 April 2005, 07:32 AM

Umm... I think that's a concise summation of my feelings...

btw sword and helmet didn't give up the goods

I've never seen animated .gif's put to such good use before... Exceptionally inspiring...Plz don't ever get a life mate...

*digs elbow into your ribs once more* and says where's the Zs

Thanks muchly good sir, you've just handed this humble plebling some gold...

04 April 2005, 08:34 AM
your modeling is great. very clean and precise :thumbsup: i'll wait with patience to smooth version :)

04 April 2005, 10:52 AM
hey black
things are going well around here! but... we want more!!! update! update! LOL

about the reflexion of the cornea and so, I see you have everything under control, I was just talking about the cornea actually reflecting something like an environment or whatever (a map or other geometry).

OK! Keep it up!

04 April 2005, 01:18 PM
HI blackdidthis,Like the sketch mucho.I like the way you dive into your project so studiosly,,that's recomendable.And i guess only way to do quality work in the end...
Keep posting and You'l be watched,,I can guarantee on that.:)))

04 April 2005, 01:43 PM
Well woow what can I say? I am über Flattered!
So sorry about the sword and the helmet bit. I had a talk with them and they have decided to give in.
Infact to compensate.. I am even going to add in two MP44 *.giff's. There is a dear more stages of it I have readied out in order to make more *.giiff's. I'll send them also over to you shall have the chance to put them together.
Sword (
Helmet (
MP44_ (; MP44_ (
I am so sorry to keep you waiting. But my computer is still busy with some serious rendering tasks in hand. I have some things readied, but I would preffer to give you guys these animals first.
Oh I am so sorry dear beatriz; I hadn't really wanted to argue that I have it under control... I had really thought it was a question rather than a helpful advise. Thus I went through explaining... My wrong.
Yes you are so right, what is a reflection from a wet surface, it there is nothing there to reflect ;)
You are so kind and supportive to me. Thank you. I hope to be able to live up to it.
Thank you very much for dropping by. I think I AM going to go fro the last sketch. It seems fitting. Preparing a variaty og fields and curves now for the particle sprites to follow up onto. The fog is going to be the biggest attraction I had better not mess it up.
I don't know if I deserve such generouse compliments yet. I hope things will evolve to it.

Thank you for dropping by;


04 April 2005, 08:23 PM
Thanks again Black, It's always been kinda rare in my life for people to just throw kindness my way...much appreciated! both for your kindness and for your consistent humility:thumbsup::thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 08:58 PM
Hey,,there's no progress,,updatez updetaz,,cmon.
Wanna thank you for great crit.For the time being Im expiriencing you like
ROGER AND EBERT of cg(they are the known critics of hollywood movies and movies generally).If you say it's good,,than it really is. :) :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 10:16 PM
As usual things going good here. Paw is good. Inscriptive.

Hocam sen bi internet modelleme eğitim merkezi filan açsana. O ne tafsilatlı kurt bacağı modeli imalatı resmi öyle. Bak mesleği herkeşe öğretiyosun yarın öbür gün kediler kasap olur neme lazım.

04 April 2005, 10:38 PM
i think i'm gonna stay here waiting for your updates :) hope you soon can fully continue working.

have no words that can enough thank you for the great eye texture explanation. it will take me more than this challenge to figure it out ( am i a slow learner?..). thank you again and keep your great work here up :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 10:49 PM
Oh I am so sorry dear beatriz; I hadn't really wanted to argue that I have it under control...


Hey black, it´s me the one who's sorry because I didn´t want to argue or whatever, :) about the thing "under control" ... I meant that I saw you were thinking on what I was saying previously to my post, so my question was a bit out of place :) so sorry
I suppose "under control" has a different connotation in spanish hehe I was saying it in a possitive way :thumbsup:

so... keep it up and show us more! you´re doing great
and thank you so much for those gif tutorials

04 April 2005, 04:34 PM
Great work! And thanks a lot for the modeling gifs ... very inspiring. It looks so simple when you know what to do ... have to go practising.
good luck to you :thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 01:40 PM

My little imagination sees a man too busy beasting away to spend much time here...I like it!

:thumbsup: See you round Black...

04 April 2005, 06:25 AM
Oh BOY .. have I been rude in keeping you guys waiting!!!

My initial reaction would be to say: "then find a better environment" :) .. but yeah I understand what you mean.
Think of it this way; if you do kindness, you know that it is possible. Since you know that you were able to do it.. it sort of helps build up a good reason to have more faith in people. I think I am just a succer for lending a hand. I am very glad you found use for them. From now on I am going to do every post for this challange in stpes just so you can make use of them aswel.

I am very very very very very very (hope you got the picture) Sorry.. I know I have been lazy for here. But I was TOO busy elsewhere. And the free time I had was spent for another affair.
As much as I am OVER flattered by your generouse compliments to my taste.. I can't really credit myself that much.
I have to admit that you have a very impressive thread decorated with some wonderful works. I would be overjoyous shall you believe that I had some use to it!

Dostum, thanks again for the kind encouragements..
Yes I do have a plan for a varaity of classes to be found free on the net.. but too soon for them now. I have much more important matters to handle first.
As for your warning: I believe that if you know the rules of football you can only apreciate a game of 22 guys/girls chasing a ball...
So while teaching my methods, I don't really loose anything I believe, on the contrary I have more people living through my journey to better understand the work put in. :)

I am more than happy that you see them useful.. In depth I would have to type pages to give you the right grasp of it all, but I am already feeling bad for filling up your thread like that. If you would like to you can always contact me for details.

My kind Beatriz(Makes me wonder sometimes how you can omdel such horrible subjects).. thank you for trying to clear things up. No I doubt it has a diffrent meaning. I guess I was just trying to be too humble. I agree with you completely and thank you for your earlier concern.
I am so glad that you liked the gif's.. I'll try to send up some more of them soon.

Now that you say it.. yeah; you have a point. Even when I look at them they seem so simple, though I had to do run a variaty of tests before I was able to get them to this state!
Thank you so much for the compliments.

Yeap As you guessed DaddyMack.. I was TOO busy.
But I am not busy enough :) Going to update VERY soon.. infact I have already promised in my 2D thread that I would be posting 2 updates a day from now on :eek:
Wish me luck!


04 April 2005, 08:21 AM
lookin great man, i gave up on mine.. too much work on 2d and i really didnt expect that, good luck with the time!:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 02:22 PM
ooo my spidey sense is tingling...Is that a pending update I feel? Or am I just experiencing the kinda curiousity that killed the cat?

Hahah yep, new environment...I hears ya... I got a family as my priority 1 but I'm always seeking new stimulus... I just meant that I guess I'd become really accustomed to being the puveyor of said kindness than the receiver...Tis a most pleasant experience which I hope to indulge in more...Thanks again good sir:wise:

04 April 2005, 07:27 PM
Hey it has been a while!! I had thought you stopped on updating and were only spamming threads. I didn't get any updates in a week almost (possibly your girls didn't make it through my "internet-Nanny" filter :D ).
Good to know that it was just me without any notifications.
It is a tisk you won't be able to make the 3D til the dead line... I just hope you can finish it in your own pace later on... It would have been an intresting concept.

Lol.. What can I say.. travel the world.. see all, hear all.. but don't give up the only little thing that makes you special :)
No you are right.. a promise is a promise; there are updates coming.. and as stated before I am going to do my best to make them step by step for you to save out.

Til later;


04 April 2005, 07:52 PM (

And finally an update...
Consider this one and the one to follow only teasers as I actually intend on presenting my works on the stagecoach on the background. I had to go through a few difficulties in getting back to the models.. (firstly to try and remember what was what)

For this particular post I had not drawn but used an existing photograph of a wolf’s claw that you can find Here (

The modelling was VERY basic actually. I had it in step by step for other reasons.. and just decided to make a post out of it as well since I have not yet posted any textured or even smoothed model (Though the texture is only a projection and is to changge)
I know you want to be in on the rest of the models.. They shall be put up soon. It’s just too much work right now.

Til later;


04 April 2005, 07:54 PM (

Ok now this one was not as exactly as simple to resolve as it was to do the claw above...
I have to confess that I was very tempted to just leave it out as it is.

The model was again modelled by taking a few photo’s as reference. You can again access the photographs I have used in the process from HERE (

The teeth were all from cubes or modified duplicates of already existing teeth previously created. Actually the animal happens to have a much greater amount of back teeth, but I seriously doubt they would ever show in this project so I left to tackle that in another attempt.
Modelling was basic cube-modeling: where you just extrude and split to need then tweak the verts around.
Like always you can click on the image to see a little larger scale of the image.

Hope you like it... More to come soon;


04 April 2005, 09:07 PM
Doing a real nice job here in all aspects Black........Things look to be coming in both 2D and 3D....your one of the few doing 5D........:arteest:

.............Are you a dentist on the side when not doing art.....;)

keep it coming as you are.....very nice effort.....See you as you go on Black......:arteest:

04 April 2005, 11:54 PM
Buraya başka bişey yazmıyorum. Çok geç oldu. Yarın işe gideceğim, uyumam lazım.

04 April 2005, 02:22 AM
Hi Black, thanx for the tip for the candle now I'm gonna redesign my reflectors again. Now my turn, your teeth are great, it's the claw I have a problem with it's not pointy enough blast the weight on that vertex, the smaller the claw the nastier, don't forget bats need to be able to grapple pretty much anything so they can rest grab the neighboors cat or a squirrel that was minding his own business and look at their claws you'll see what I meen. Not bad was able to type four lines to say barely nothing, in other words just make it very pointy. :hmm:

Now to your 2d challenge, talk to you later and don't forget to close the blinds.

04 April 2005, 03:53 AM
• Hi Berter, I've seen your avatar a couple of times, now i find u here, well, good job so far!
Ok Black, keepDoingThis :scream: :beer:

04 April 2005, 08:50 AM
those mini tut are great it seems like it´s no effort! very clear and so.

04 April 2005, 08:58 AM
by your last update i see you brush well... both your teeth and with a 3d brush! great work man... teeth and claws look great.. i must say you are a very handy person to students.. the way you present your wips is fantastic.. helps alot of people and shows you are no selfish man.. so take your logo off that says "nobody special" and put "im bloody special alright" LoL... great work mate... lets see more! :beer:

04 April 2005, 02:47 PM
As I understand we are alike in the manner of not taking the copetition as a goal; but a tool to create. I just hope for you to be able to make the time for so many that are awating your works.
Lol, actually I am well involved with dental practice. IT all started off with making use of their unique carving toooools for my miniature sculptors.. but as you get into it.. you get into it. :D
You are always supporting me Micheal; thank you so much for your kind words.

I wish I didn't have to.. but the rules don't allow team works :P
Naa get what you mean.. but I am not doing anything others aren't.

I am glad to be of help, you really don't have to come here to thank me for it. I am already happy if it was of some use.
For the Claw:Thanks my dear friend.. it WAS a matter that I shall keep in my mind in the bat I am modeling now. I do have some dear refferences... but for the claws the squirrel IS a good catch :)
The claw you see was completely refferenced from an existing wolf's claw. You can see the link to it in the post I set shall you read it. And although it would save time greatly. I had little intention of using the same claw for all of the creatures... Come to think of it.. with slight modofications... why not? I'll try it out.

If it was in the 'wanted' lists.. that wasn't me :rolleyes:...
Thank you very much.. things in my life other than the competition are dearly slowing me down. But I shall work harder on it. :)
Thank you for dropping by.

I have to confess that the claw was less effort than the most. I am so glad you think so.
People as yourself make it so much easier to want to post something. Thank you.

Lol.. good catch.. I really hope them to be useful.
I learned so MUCH from the internet; and every step I take in paying things bak are only but small ones.
Actually it is also a good method to display the in-between wrok. And all of it's little details in the meanwhile. Some of us just tend to overlook the efforts one puts into the slightest of changes. I guess that would make me a little bit selfisher than you depicted :)
Thank you SO much for your kind words of encouragements:thumbsup:

Gotta get back to work. Will update this evening, thank you all!


04 April 2005, 05:30 AM (

This is actually a render that I should be burying into the depths of my hard drive for no one to see…
It is NOT something I have modelled!!

What happened is that while going through my vampire bat reference photo’s... I came to notice that the thing really looked like it had a head of a French Bulldog.
So the thought just grew on me and I wanted to experiment with it. I took the head of a dog and the body of a bat found in a library.
I just removed the body of the dog... decapitated the bat and enlarged the ears. :)
I DID do a few subtle tweaks... but nothing too special, mostly on the nose and all.

My point to post this was:
Modelling a bat .. especially a vampire bat. You might want to just get a readied one.
Unfortunately he anatomy charts for bats out there for free are usually from much larger bats since they happen to be easier to dissect. So most probably the models you shall find will be referenced from one of these specimens
Well this fast solution just MIGHT be a solution for you to play with. This took like 5 minutes of my time. Shall you spend a bit more time, I am sure you can get better results.

Hope this can be of some help;


04 April 2005, 05:51 AM (

It really took me a while to be able to get down to modelling this little guy...

I have to confess that it was not too easy a task to start on. But once you get the courage to sit and do it.; the result comes to you sooner or later.
Well so here you have it: the head study of the Desmodus Rotundus. Better known as the common vampire bat.

It was again modelled with Dave’s method which I have given a link to earlier in my thread. I again was too lazy to go around drawing a bat to model from. Instead I used two base photographs. My front view can be found here:
And my side view from here:

A small advice would be to NOT go ahead and model a bat only from the side and front images... the shape IS demanding, collect as many reference photo’s as you can get your hands on and try to really build up an idea of what the creature looks like.

I am going to leave a majority of parts without details when I really get into sculpting things out because it’s going to be covered all over with fur anyways. I am probably going to have three resolutions of the bat. And have the lower res ones be the ones at the way back.
Another thing I did was to really enlarge the Iris and Pupil to compare to that of the wolf’s version of the same eye. That is sort of an advantage to leave the curves history still attached. I shall be doing the same for the horse and the opposite for the rat.

Til next;


04 April 2005, 07:13 AM
what a great and clean theeth and bat head modeling :thumbsup: interesting way to model the head. i feel empathy to your difficulty starting the bat. it happened to me with every new task i didn't experience before. thank you for sharing, and thank you for the great tips, links and files. the dogbat test is sweet and funny. it looks natural :)

04 April 2005, 08:35 AM
The head is cool! Keep it up!

04 April 2005, 10:08 AM
That's a fab Desmodus Rotundus however you did it! :thumbsup: Claireabella

04 April 2005, 11:06 AM
Those models are cool,traditional style!:D
keep it up!:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 12:19 PM
People as yourself make it so much easier to want to post something. Thank you.

hi! thank you! but I think is more on the contrary, you´re participating a lot and honestly really helping everyone. so, it´s you who deserves the flattery. :thumbsup:

the dog-bat render is ... how to say... why does he has 4 ears? :) I´ll be posting one of my early ice tests for you to have a laugh.

I think this new bat is really amazing, I have seen many bats in my life and this is very accurate. Having references is so important, I´m lazy at collecting references, but ... it´s so important.
I´m still like this :eek: to see this modeling technique, it looks definately very hard to do (I haven´t tried yet).

Keep it up! this is looking so well, clear and organized!

04 April 2005, 12:47 PM
You are the taskmaster Black! The bat head is absolutely mental, this thread is really starting to remind me of some of the Ernst Haeckel 'plates' (images these days) I've collected... Your work shows a sincere appreciation for and understanding of each of your loyal subjects... Just keep on keeping on.. humble thanks good sir:thumbsup:

04 April 2005, 02:33 PM
looking great man! very cool character... great work as always black! :thumbsup: as always mate! :arteest

04 April 2005, 04:06 PM
Hey black, nice progress. Great model you have here.

Keep up good work.
See ya

04 April 2005, 10:31 PM
very cool characters. good luck to you!

05 May 2005, 12:19 AM
hi Berter!...firstly good work in progress!!!
your *The Bat's Head* wip is so cool...interesting and good modelling technic.i think very well bat's head .seems nice!:thumbsup:

your project is going nice*friend!
good luck!i'm looking forward to seeing your next update.

05 May 2005, 07:46 AM
Your posts are growing to be a great relieve, since unlike a mass, you do care to read things first :)
Thank you for your once again over generouse compliments.
The basis of the modeling ttechnique would be to arrang the base for the topology prehand and then to pull the verts our and to push them back in depending on where you want them to go.
Check the deeper explanation for the technique in the link provided. I hope it can aid you with your vrey impressive modeling.
I'll try; but I can't promise. :)
Oh the bottom one I modeled from scratch... the above had no use to me in it's process. But if you are reffering to the top one beinf fab... mmm taste differs!
Thanks for the support Claire!!:thumbsup:
Thank you for dropping by and caring to encourage me!
Lol it has two ears because I really did not want to spend any more time on it :rolleyes: Sorry
I am voerwhelmed by your compliments on my humble Bat.. I am hopping that sith texturing and preparing the right shader settings it will look a bit more accurate than this.
Funnny eh? this little creature is not even going to be seen in the total image fro it's size. I just wanted to put more work into him since he sort of represented the whole concept
Thank you again Beatriz
TaskMaster? lol.. if I do a hundred posts. are you going to come up with a hundred names? :p
Robert, doing something with such emmence care and observation then posting it is one thing... posting it for eyes that see and try to apreciate like you guys do is something else. I don't know what to say to your too generous comparison.
I just hope them to prove as much use as those plates have for so many generations.
Shall you want to have the higher resolutions of these WIP images just private message me.
Mmm not ALWAYS... but I am so glad that I am giving out such an impression to you. I haven't detailed any of my characters yet. I hope that will really bring things out.
thank you for the encouragement!
Thank you very much... There is so much work . I am sure I will be needing all the luck that I can get my hands onto! :thumbsup:
Woow thank you very much. Well the WIP is going very slow due to some serious amount of other works I have to do. But I am gaiing pace to catch up.
Thank you so much for supporting me through it! :)

Still alot more to come;


05 May 2005, 08:14 AM (

I took me a dear amount of browsing until I was able to decide on what kind of a carriage I was going to be going for.

After long thought (And great help from my Father and Brother who cared to help me find a dear lot of carriage samples) I have decided to go for a Landau couch.
I know it is going to be a challenge to make. But hell, what have I chosen to do since the beginning of this whole episode that is not really a challenge?
I just hope I do good enough.

Now this is of one of the first peaces of the carriage. The rear and front wheel. In order to give less load on the pull the rear wheel is kept as large as the carriages height can afford. And the front wheel is kept relatively smaller to ensure better steer.
There are a hundred ways maybe to model such a subject, the reason I chose the methods you see here is to be able to literally save time in UV mapping. And to sort of build the wheels as they would be built in the real world. It is always an advantage to try to take similar steps.

Well more to come!


05 May 2005, 08:24 AM (

Now I had told you earlier that I had done a few attempts to modelling the wolf;

This was one of those attempts. I sort of had a wrong start and any change I was doing was turning it into a fox or something else.
But still I did like it enough to not want to through away hoping that I would think of something I could do with it later on... This post is more to ask you guys your opinion. What would you say for it? Should I go through the extra effort and make an additional variety to the wolves? Or should I try and make it like a fox?
In real doubts here and I would appreciate it greatly if any creative idea crosses your minds.

Thank you in advance;


Heeeey! ... as I typed this post an idea just struck me! I could make a statue out of this for the terras or something! :)

05 May 2005, 08:30 AM
Hi're really putting up a real fine effort here.......Lots to follow,and the workflow looks to be right on target......You're putting up some fine examples here,and showcasing your progress and skills in a real nice way.......5D problem for you,your passing both areas with flying colors......A Landau couch will be real interesting to see come together,I wish you luck,and look forward to seeing this come together.......Sure it's a chalelnge.....but thats what this is right......?;)

......... Just keep on just as you are,you're doing a great job on all front's here.....I'll be watching,take care and work well.......:arteest: :beer:

05 May 2005, 08:36 AM
THX pal,,,
U plane to finish it till the end of challenge,,I started doubting my concept,,,finishing in time naturaly.
Your wolf is good,i dont have any pics arround me,,,But as I remember,,
wolf has slightly stronger eybrow area,,the forhead part that goes down to his eyes,,
maybe bit bigger cheaks,,I mean,the fur on the cheaks is bigger,,And the snout
little smaller,,im probabaly wrong,,But If this is finished model I could say more,since i dont know are you making fur with real fur or just simulating with volume mesh,,,
Im inpatience to see the finished composition actually..
And yeah,,you quited your 2D,I liked drunk guys,,made me laugh,your post in whome you say,,U worked few hours and got to cunclusion with the bottle and fingers,,,hahaha :)
Not funny,more frustrating ,,,seeya :) :) :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 09:16 AM
Thank you for dropping by! AndI have nothing I can say to all your encouragements!!! Thank you a lot :eek:
Oky okay... you have it tattoo'd into my head.. I accept .. 5D it is.
I hope that I can live up to the standard you guys have been presuming all the way long. Yes it is meant to be a challange and I agree that this is what makes it fun.
Nothing to say, I'll try and do my very best!! Thank you once more for your kind words:thumbsup:

A I R;
My good friend.. you have got it all wrong :)
Thank you for trying to help me on my wolf model. But I have already modeled and posted the wolf model I tend to be using. You guys see one model posted here with a nice clean result. Sometimes I get a result instantly.. soemtimes I have to try and retry.
Since in some incidents the base topology is wrong there are times I restart from scratch.
Now you see I had done the same for the wolf. This was one of the models that turned didn't work out. But I liked it and wanted to keep it.
I just wanted to make use of it but couldn't think of what to do with it. As I typed now I just though I might make it a dog statue in the terras or something. Will see. If you have an idea for it to fit into my concept I am all ears :)... oh wait.. I am four eyes :p

My 2D entry? Quiting?!! Oh no no.. I was demoralised but didn't stop on it. Infact I made a promise that I would do two uploads a day for the challanges.
The finger tips were shorter because of perspective. They are bent in from his strong grasping the bottle. No mmistake there... My mistake was the smaller bottle. I took the wrong contour as outer.
I started now on my bigger bottle.

Til next;


05 May 2005, 09:42 AM
Ni Berter nice start on the wolf, hopefully you'll have it done for tomorrow, cause I want to add it up to my "Black made this" collection. Great work so for when are we seeing texturing or more then modeling. I'm very curious on what you're preparing.

05 May 2005, 03:22 PM
"A I R;
My good friend.. you have got it all wrong"
That's because I have slow net connection,I can't afort to go trough all posts and
update my self on the situatution.
Next time before I try to trow advices and constructive comments related to improving the quality of the artwork I'l try to get the background image if possible. :) :)
Oh,,I like what yoi did with bat,,the one U played,,dogs head and bats body,,neat.

05 May 2005, 03:46 PM
Thank you for dropping by arain!
You should already have the wolf I am going to be using in your collection. I hope to get you this last one as a possible garen decoration or something. Though I haven't started on it literally; I have plans in mind for the env aswell.
I am a bit ore free today. I'll try to pose my wolf base and finish up onthe coach. (IF the darn 2D entry doesn't take the best of me :sad: )

A I R;
Oh I hope I didn't sound offensive. I know you well enough to doubt you had a bad intention. On the contrary thank you for the pointers. They are correct. Just that I was in doubt to use this one still as something aswel (In order to not have the work go to waist).

Such as to help you catch up; the concept is basically Bram Stoker's vision of vampires, and the manner the elements of the night are their servants; how the animals be come their eyes and ears; how he can demand them to his service and how they can make the fog act mysteriously...
So these are just a few of the many I have to model out. I am going to have a few wolves... so I just prepared a base model that I am going to be exporting in diffrent poses to Zbrush so as to sculpt them into unique models.
You can see my base wolf on post #99 ( I have modeled out the paws and teeth for it also.. but those you already saw.

Your imput on with idea's to any level would be of great use to me. So shall you have any questions on what I am doing please feel free to ask. It would be great fun to share it with you especially!

See you all later!


05 May 2005, 03:53 PM
Hi BlackDidThis - your modeling is great. love your way of thinking. you seems to be very organized. it's very important for good quality. i'v learnd in that project it is also importent to think of the uv while modeling ( but not always as i'll add later). saving a lot of time.

just looked back at your wolf model. it looks great. as all your models. very precise and with great clean topology. your current model looks like a dog but so are wolfs and fox, i think. sorry sorry for not having a constructive idea ( quite afraid of me been foolish again..). i'd like to tell you that in the place i'v workd we made wolfs ( ok, crtoon wolfs) from houman base mesh to keep uvs. but it took more time in the end. is that why you prefer not to correct the topology ? you are faster with building it correctly from the start? i think about your dog bat mixture, maby you can use it here (oops.. another bad idea?) i think there is much creativity freedom in your concept.

thank you again for your very kind words and all the great and important help :)

05 May 2005, 04:14 PM
There is no such thing as a bad idea if it is an effort to help..
I hope I am not giving a scarey impression. I really don't mean to. Please feel free to tell me what every you think regardless of making a mistake. Your posts ar not flakey nor empty; and are valued greatly.
Thank you for your kind words on my modeling and methods of working. I guess I just developed into how I am.. my modeling included.
And yes you hit it spot on. That is the exact reason of why I preffered to remodel them such.
I sort of believe a good planned topology can get you very far in a very short time. and try working such. For example the modeling of my wolf totaled about 2 hours with the tweeking included. Had the topology not been set correctly; it would be another two hours to model to pull it around into shape and the topology may not have accepted as much detail as correctly in the result of it. So to have things correctly while they are still simple is sort of a key.
The dog/bat was honestly an idea with hopes to have a ref model underneath to pull verts to (I some times place a sphere to help round the head for example). But that again was more trouble than it was worth. But I found it as to be a radical solution for those that may not have the time to model it out.

So in this case I have an 'unemployed' model base in hand ... the last post. And I am floating around ideas of what to do with it. Would you say adding a fox would be a good idea? I mean the base model DOES seem to propose a fox to come out of it more than anything.

Well gotto get back to work now!:wip:


05 May 2005, 05:02 PM
:) ok, i'll speak.the impression you give is a kind and clever person. not scary at all. it's me been careful.

you are very very very fast. amazing!! i should try that method. i'm working many many hours on modeling. wow!! 2 hours? with such a great results? :bounce:

nice idea to use ref shape( like a sphere, somthing i did also at work but forgot all about it). don't know why i enjoy pulling vertexes, shaping, reshaping and so on. i should be more efficient.
these are great methods. looking forward to see how you develop them into their final shape.

could swear i hear a fox howling but i won't. don't realy. what i feel is that there is realy a fox wanting to come out. that's what you see and want, isn't it? then listen to yourself. i'm a great believer in the creation process. maximum you won't use it now. i understand it's a matter of time but it seems to me it's a good idea. new thought came to me. do you realy need it? why? what are your plans for it? see? i'm not very decisive , sorry :sad:

happy work with what ever you choose :)

05 May 2005, 05:43 PM
Hey Black, thanks a lot for sharing the steps. I know I really enjoy looking at your work! :buttrock: You have an excellent mastery over the shape and form, can't wait for your next update!


05 May 2005, 07:09 PM
Brother do whatever you like. But in my opinion your old wolf was more wolfish.

Al sana bi kurt, atıl kurt. ... Atılmadı. :)

The main problem is what made you are projected to crits and all nonsense cacaphony is that all the complaints about the size, shape, proportions of a wolf and being just or not similar..!!! Oh, hard to believe... is there any wolf being the same on earth?

Of course not. They are like other furry animals have certain differences like fingerprints. Besides in different seasons they appear differently since they have a FUR to protect them from BUSHes, DIRT, INSECTS, FROST and other bad things. In winter furs grow up and appear nearly twice thicker. Now what can we insist on having narrow or thick neck? 35 centimeters? 45 centimeters? 16 inches?

Humans differ in faces and animals differ in size, color, stance etc. Do whatever you like, and as far as it does not look like a fox, it is not.

Abi şu kurt meselesini bırak artık bak onbeş gün kaldı. Eleştiri yapçaz diye çomaklamasınlar. Biri kıllı kurt görmüş, biri zayıf kurt görmüş, biri kamyon çarpmış kurt görmüş.... ötesi benzemedi, şurası olmadı, orası eyle olsun burası beyle olsun ha ha.. salla gitsin ya, yüz verme bunlara.

Şimdi kurdu bir de başka bir açıdan görelim.

05 May 2005, 08:14 PM
:shy; thank you.. I should have you visit more often shouldn't I now? :)
Lol not ALL of it.. but the first base model you saw there was such.. around 2 hours. It may have been faster had I spent some time prparing reffrence pictures. The Bat's head took about 4 or so hours.. not sure.. plus/minus halve an hour. You have to also keep in mind that it was not my first wolf I wnet to modeling.
For the fox; no I think you are right.. I think I should keep the intent to go for a fox with it. I'll see if a garden design or something like that is an option for it. Else I will use it later in my other projects.
About the pont of "DO I want to use it?" Well the point is that yes I am a faster modeler to compair to a few. But the amount of time I loose more is starting on a model. And this one is readied. Lets face it, size matters. So if there would be a use for it some where in the scene I would like to go for it. What is left for this model is so little to be done.

I am glad you like my methods. I actually still go through beginers tutorials as I have time to do so. They STILL teach me something. If nothing they can teach you how NOT to model :)

I hope to not disapoint you on the updates. I have increased the amount of updates I tend to provide per daily basis.
Thank you very much for the encouraging words... though "master" is a strong/difficult word to live up to.

My dear brother. Thank you SO much for trying to defend me.. but no my friend they are trying to help on what I have asked them to...
For the wolf I am going to be listening to one of the BEST crirt's given .. wich was from you! Yes the base was good enough.. all the rest was to come from the texturing and sculpting.
What this is is that I had this first attempt laying around. I wanted to ask if you guys could come up with anything to use it with since I already modeled it.
I have to strongly agree on everything you said about the spectrum of variaty in animals.. but as you now better understand that is not the case. And I am not delaying on asking about the wolf any more don't worry :)

Thanks again for running to my resque! :thumbsup:

Speak the wolf.. I have the wolf just about complete I shall be mooulding out 4 variant poses from it. Hopefully to be posted in a few hours. Now I have to eat (Hungry like a wolf! :p )


Ps; Oh for those of you that most possibly wouldn't get the joke; Kurt; meaning wolf also means worm :) .. Tell me that wasn't funny..

05 May 2005, 10:18 PM
Black good sir, this creature kinda reminds me of a Thylacine or tasmanian tiger...It's kind of reassuring to see that you, with your finely honed process still can 'stumble' a little, like us mere mortals along the way to your achievements... Almost Human of you (DaddyMack Quote #17) I guess you could probably quite easily tweek it into a fox... I think your current wolves don't need any distant cousins... Dunno tho mate... You're probably the most informed as to what your scene needs Black... Focus... Thanks for your consistent ways...

Oh and did I hear a clock ticking...

05 May 2005, 04:59 AM
Another nice thread to follow here... interesting... I'm waiting the continuation and best wishes mate... :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 06:42 AM

I JUST forced the program to shut down and didn't save!!
I had modeled a quicky for updating.. Will have to remodel it. Gosh does this really get annoying :sad:

Lol you are very right.. it DOES infact look alot like the Tasmanian Tiger.. And it WOULD take one from down under to notice that :thumbs up:
Though wait, thats not a K-9 now is it?!
The thing about the model is it being started off. I think I am going to go for a statue or something out of it. At least I won't have to worry as much for it's textures.

Gosh does it feel good to be human'ish :) I should try this more often!

Thank you so much for dropping by.
Well this is going intresting indeed but I can sure say that I am not able to spare as much time for it as I would wish to. Thank you for the support!


05 May 2005, 10:49 AM
Leeyyyyyyydieeessss annnnnddd Gennnnttleeeemmmmeennnn

l m happy to introduce you to Mr Tutorilal Man, in short cut, Mr. Tuto

l would like be a newbie to get this modellling tutos with poly that they are awesome:)

05 May 2005, 12:52 PM
dear BlackDidThis

i surely will visit here often. you deserve that very much. i'll try to model from pure topology after the challenge, see if it will make my modeling more efficient. it's amazing how fast you are.

i see you'r going for a statue? i find it sweet that you'r attached in some way to the mesh you'v created. like you must give him life.

looking for your next update dear man :)

05 May 2005, 03:02 PM
Hi BlackDidThis, it's really good to see your process in the modeling. You really spend the effort there to make things so clear for everyone :thumbsup: Not sure what software u used, but if it's 3dsmax, they've got this autoback feature to backup your files every 5 mins by default into a autoback folder, I believe other software should also have this feature.

Hope u'll get to finish this in time & good luck to you.

05 May 2005, 04:39 PM
I should find your thread much much earlier, amazing step-by-step wips :thumbsup: And great tutorials too, have to check them before I start my next head :) For the dog-wolf-fox-whatever, making a statue of it is a cool idea, maybe in a jumping pose or something... keep posting, good luck!

05 May 2005, 10:56 PM
Hi there, Black!

You're wolf's looking pretty fine so far, buddy :thumbsup: I'd watch the width of his upper forelegs though ....should perhaps be a little narrower, I think -
I feel somehow qualified in the wolverine department, having done a couple in the past :D (here's a link to the model

Go with it! I'm sure in your capable hands he'll work out just fine ;)


05 May 2005, 03:03 AM
Hey black just wanted to look at your 3d as well and see how you're getting along. your modelingskills are very high, your wf's look that clean and efficient, nothing to crit yet since i know what wip means and minor tweaks are made in a click. Like the wolfies a lot. am curious how they goin to look with the fur. keep on rocking mate, looking forward to see more soon :) cheers

05 May 2005, 08:24 PM
Can't really call them tutorials.. they are more just walk throughs to those that already have an idea and would like to find newer ways.
Thank you for dropping by to encourage me :)

It is going to be embarassing then for me to say that the toad I am about to post took me around 4 hours to make if not even more. I guess I am not as good with some models as I am with others.
And yes, I get attached to the things I create. I don't like selling any of my originals for the exact same reason. They are hard to let go of.
So you guessed right. I liked the model enough to not waste it. I DID find a radical idea of what to do with it though... Not going to bring it up since I am very fed up with everybody telling me on what to do for the wolf when my wolf is already finished.
Thank you for your support yet once again :)

I think I am showing great care to show off.. glad you son't see the selfish parts of it :twisted:.
He heh.. actually really.. what beter way to display your model? Takes a little more effort but thats it :)

I sort of grew to hate max, so I don't really like using it. Not to mention that what I have is dearly outdated.
Thye software I preffer to use has a feature called inscrimental saves.. but that requires that you go in and press save. I was very tired and I had something I had to do. so I just rushed through the model to finish up and post. So I just managed to loose the model. It's ok though I like my second toad alot more. And it has proven as I worked on it that I was far from being able to complete it anyway. A toad just seemed so much easier to model than it was for me.

Thank you for dropping by;
Heheh.. I am glad you liked it and I just hope they can help you live the making of it with me in the process.
In great houses dogs such as Danes used to be set on the doorways or entrances so as to tower a 'guarding' feel.. I may go for such a pose for a K-9 statue. But well I have what I want to do with it decided on. I hope you guys will like it.
There is a LOT of modeling going on in relation to this entry. But shall you understand, It is not easy to display them all So you may just see a more 'finished' verion of it.

Oh boy... I am really sorry I ever posted that...
My dear friend, thank you so much for the help. And the link (Which I have to add that your wolf is a very good one)...
But my wolf is completed.. UV'ed and soon to be sculpted in poses. I'll get that over by the week end to you guys.
My reason of posting was to ask if any of you would be able to come up with an idea to use an earlier 'failed attempt' wolf for something else. As I just told Smaddl above. I have found a use. Hopefully that shall come next week.

Sacha you too?
My dear friend. that wolf was from my first attempt to model the wolf I presented earlier. I failed because of a topology error from the begining, so I just redid it all with a better base.
I had asked if any of you would be able to have an idea of what to do with the first attempt.
Thank you for once again dropping by to boost my ego with compliments :thumbsup:
I just hope I can make it.

Thank you all for the support and creative idea's. I shall be a bit more busy now on so I can't be doing this every day.
I will go on, but a bit less capable to paritipate in the forums through the process :sad:

Update coming soon;


05 May 2005, 08:28 PM (

This is going to be the base for the toads...
I have slightly changed the background into a scene I had modelled in one of my first 3D models I had ever made and textured (Remodelling it of course)... I’ll be updating you on that with better details later.
So now the scene shall not be TOO close to a river bed as before.. But toads are always of use.. I can use them for the ornaments later if nothing! :)

I kept the base fairly simple. As regular procedure; a simple texture has been assigned but shall change radically depending on the shape the final toad shall look like.. since once again each is going to be fairly unique.
I have enlarged yet again the pupils and iris in order to have the eye more suiting to a toad.
Just like the wolf or the horse this is going to be only a base mesh to sculpt from. I think that after this the rats and humans are the only ones that are going to be using a common base mesh. The rest shall be individually modelled.
So far of all the models presented the bat is the only one that is not exactly a base mesh. Though I shall have a few changes and distortions that I shall randomise through a utility in MaYA called a ‘Switch’. I’ll try and detail you on that better later.
Well that’s about it for now.


Ps: Due to our dense schedule; I am not able to update as I would wish to. Work is being done. But updates shall be every next day from now on. I tend to spare one evening for 2D and the other for 3D... hope I’ll make it

05 May 2005, 10:59 PM
hahaha, exceptional sweet pet. very cool toaddee :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 06:21 AM
Berter, dear friend.

I wouldn't eat this frog the legs are to small.

05 May 2005, 01:31 PM
Another excellent job Black! :buttrock:It depends on what you are going for but it seems to me that the area around the eyes in the final mesh/render stick out a little too far. This is more what I mean:

Just my two cents, and as you said it is just a base mesh. Also always wonderful update, I can't wait to see all of your elements in place. :applause:


05 May 2005, 01:34 PM
great toad!! as all your models. you are very good and fast, please don't ask me how much time it took me to build a frog. i won't say.. more then embarassed..

glad you find what to do with the model. i think there is no more time for hesitation. go with what you have. it's great!! :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 04:31 PM
Hi Black!
you know, this toad looks so sweetie and adorable, but I know it is a dominated toad, it is just an instrument of some evil master... :twisted: hehhehe I like a lot the concept. Have you ever played Vampire: the eternal struggle? it has got some vampires who can control animals. I guess it´s not new like you said in the very beggining (Stoker and so...) but I like so much this concept! I love horror and vampire stories.

Well, all this bla bla talking is because I have nothing to crit, the modelling is so well made, it´s organized and all the things that I have told already.
Keep up the GOOD WORK!

05 May 2005, 07:12 AM
not able to call it sweet at the while.. your remark about it jumping on the bed and licking your face in the morning is still too vivid in my memories :sad:
Thanks Sacha!

Lol... thats why they eat frog legs and not toad legs I guess :)
Thanks again! :thumbsup:

Just your GOOD two cents :) Thank you.
Yes you are right. the eyes ARE a bit out to what they would be expected for the type of frog I would like to make.
It's just that it seemed easier to do it this way I guess. Since I really hadn't intended the eyes so out.
I shall flesh it around the eyes some dear bit more. I hope it will fit the discription better then ;)
Thank you for the pointer

Thank you again Smaddl... Well it's the same story you now: Us boys will always be boys, and we love trying to show off :sad:
Well what I am going to do is going to make it a set of sitting statues at some point.. but one with it's face turned to us and it's eyes opened revealing a pair of blood red eyes :)
I hope it all looks good together. I'll post the background (Nearly done) soon

Hello again! And thank you again for the encouragements!
I have ALOT of work more to do for this entry.. even though I have not really been able to post all of my progresses. I just hope I can get it all done in time. I am growing more and more to like my 2D entry, I may shift my greater intrest towards it if things get dence here again.
I am a perfect work-aholic and so rarely do I use the compter to play games. But what ou described sure sounds like what I am going for.
A simiallar situation has been covered in a variaty of versions.. but yes you aparently get the picture well.
It's always good to have someone into horror following up... gives a better edge :)

Thank you all again!


05 May 2005, 11:04 AM (

I have been busy with the modelling of the background settings for the scene.
At first I had done a search for possible Blueprints for a sort of great house with a court.
And I found a photograph from a castle that of which I had modelled one of my first 3D models out of years ago.
And I decided to use that for my scene.
I don’t know how acceptable this is going to be for the rules... I know pre-made models are not allowed period. So I am intending to completely remodel and definitely increase its detail (It was low poly intended and change things to my liking.
Just in case it is against the rules to reference from an earlier model no matter how much we change it I am providing this address where you can view it from:
ClickMe (

The preparation of the scene was fairly comprehensive and it shall not be easy to display the making as I had done earlier. Until I find a way to resolve that I am uploading this that I scanned today.
The whole thing is to ensure that I have realistic looking textures. Until now I have not used any ready set textures/props/images or etc... And I am planning on sticking to that. I would like to see up to how far I can push it.
So in order to gain time on the mall, instead of taking a picture of a wall, I made a miniature version of my own to my liking out of 50 percent grey Clay; and scanned it for later use.

Using a grey clay is a very fast and simple method to get a variety of complex textures.
I am sure you use something similar.. and if not, well here is an idea :)

Hope this helps;


05 May 2005, 01:03 PM
This clay thing is a really smart approach to spare time :thumbsup: And thanks again for the tutorials, I used'em to model my second head and it worked much much better :)

05 May 2005, 01:10 PM
Good old cutting mat!... I love the lateral approach Black!
What's next? shaving wolves:argh:?...

05 May 2005, 02:09 PM
love ya frog, and rest of ya zoo too... you got a good eye for animalanatomy. Really interesting thread, this one... ya good at pass on your knowlidge in a understandable way ... :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 05:26 PM
I am a perfect work-aholic and so rarely do I use the compter to play games.
it is a cards game, but really doesn´t mind.
the idea of modeling with clay is great to get textures.

05 May 2005, 10:04 PM
I am overwhelmed tohave been of some help.
I too used to model much diffrently before.. Usually with patching since I never got too good results with cube based modeling. And after going through Dave's tutorial I have to say that I have gained much greater control over the modeling. Some on the contrary have a harder time with such a technique. You just have to find your way I guess
Lol :blush: ... yes ... LINK (

Naaa.. I wouldn't be able to harm any animal. not even a cat.. Mmmm ok maybe your cat :rolleyes:
It was from a variaty of poto's I refferenced my wolfs textures from... I am going to mention of this more in detail when I post the textured animals. But shall you need refferences for anything such, here is the link: Refference's (
Lol yeah.. I hve sure put together a zoo collection havent I?
I guess I had better get some props out aswell. It is just that they are much easier to present out as individual peaces.
I'll try to get together a few prop posts aswell.
Oops.. now do I feel stupid :blush: ...
I used to love creating characters and running them to adventures. But it has been long a while since I got my hands on FRP's. And it seems that I don't really know about it enough doesn't it :)

It is a technique I developed more through generating a skin texture. I draw the edges on the face that would match up to the model and then just paint latex over the skin and then pealed and scaned the latex (The liquid latex would consume the drawn marks that would aid me greatly in UV maping it later on) :thumbsup:


05 May 2005, 06:25 AM
Clay wall is a great idea... I really want to se the result in your scene mate... more more more :scream:

05 May 2005, 07:46 AM
BlackDidThis,,Hi black.OK,,you are one commited son......of a gun.
Gee.I go trough your thread,Like,like I'm watching making of for some spec,effect movie.
Strong performance. :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 08:05 AM
dear black. clay is a great idea. i'm going to save all this great pages when it done. you didn't mean to be but you'r my great teacher. anxious to see it all together. happy texturing :)

05 May 2005, 09:22 AM
props? naaa i like all the animals *L* i love going to the zoo...:bounce: but i guess that ya props i just as good education as ya animal.. so go for it.. hit us with ya good stuff :applause:

05 May 2005, 10:15 AM
Great idea with the clay! This is such a good thread for inspiration, thanks :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 12:06 PM
Thanks.. it is a useful one. I can always send you what I make out of this one if you would like to update your textures :)

A I R;
Hahahaha.. yeah that would be great.
My wife and I are trying to finance a production for a movie of our own.. I HOPE it looks capable :)

Well I do believe that unintentionally we are all teachers to each other, It is just that some teachings are omre noticable.
I am so glad that you find mine such!

hehehe... just for you I am going to try and make an animal prop :p

Thank you for dropping by and I am glad you found it all inspirational.Hopefully ore shall be on it's way.

I have sort of prepared an update for you guys.. but I have things to attend to..if I can I'll update very shortly.. else a few hours later :sad:

05 May 2005, 02:06 PM
That's a great way of getting to do a quick wall texture. Nice work on the clay modeling :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 02:16 PM
Good old cutting mat!... I love the lateral approach Black!
What's next? shaving wolves:argh:?...

Hahaaaaahhh and I thought I was being witty... You slay me Black! Great refs!
Good luck mate!

05 May 2005, 05:24 PM
Hey there Black, wow, that is a very fascinating idea! :thumbsup: Looks like it is not only a fast method but an incredibly detailed one! Kudos for sharing the idea! I will be back around to check out more of your great updates.


05 May 2005, 06:39 PM
Honestly as flattered as I am with most of your apreciation of my CG works. Personally think that I paint and sculpt faster in the traditional mediums. And enjoy it a bit more aswell.
thank you...
... You slay me Black! ...Mmmm maybe later.. I don't need human reffrences at the moment. :)

Check my answer to Bealobo a bit above... that what I originally have the use of scanning from. It might help you aswel in refferencing skin textures.

Folks I am sorry for the delay nin the update.. but this creep is soetime obligated to rest and well one of those times cought up to me :(
Will be putting the pictures together now.. expect an update soon;


05 May 2005, 07:27 PM (

Ok .. this is the part of the courtyard that I have an intention of using the new textures on.

It is all ploy’s besides the revolved surfaces holding the rails.
Most of it went fairly fast actually.. The more complex to make parts have been examined separately. I’ll be posting them soon after this one

I have stated in the making of the brick texture as well. The model I am going for is a newer and more advanced version of an old “Low-Res” that I had done before. I am once again giving the link for clarity: OlderVersion ( In the final judging stage if this happens to disqualify me even though it was of no use to me other than a blue print to know where to put the elements.
I guess there is nothing to do about it. I prefer to honestly state everything I do instead.

I have left some bits of it a lot less worked on (Like the stairways to the upper platforms and the garden itself.), but that’s because I would prefer to work on them depending on the shot angle.
A fast trick I went for in the making of the curves for the stairs was to convert it to a SubDivision; crease some edges and then convert it back with a tessellation set to adaptive.

Hope you like it... the details about to come;


05 May 2005, 07:29 PM (

Well now this was a dear bit tricky. I have to sadly say that it took me a whole day to make.: even though it was all planned out, the work was too much and was definitely very demanding.

The face was patch modelling I started from around the eyes (I prefer to patch model feline creatures.. it is sort of easier to me such)
The body was done by contouring and then extracting. I didn’t go into that in detail since it has been covered one time too many.

The model was referenced from a book of ornaments and patterns loaded with illustrations. I specifically made use of the lion illustration 1 and 2 on plate 42 (Page 66) , Illustration 3 on plate 43 (Page 67), and the panther head illustrations 3 and 4 on plate 49 (Page 77)
As much as I would like to post the references I feel that they are copy written or something.

The harder looking parts (The mane and the tail tip were done in actually a simple method I prefer to go for while sculpting hair on statues.:

You first create a sphere or something with a high UV setting.. or a polygon with high vert counts. I prefer to use a NURBS sphere and then make it live (Snap able) or just convert it to a polygon.

Sculpt this sphere into the general shape you would like to have.. then flood smooth over it couple of times so you don’t have any peaks.. It would be a good practice have it as little bumpy as you may.

Then using it as canvas, start to draw your hair strands onto the surface by appending faces onto the polygon. A good idea would be to draw free hand and then to convert them into quads...

Last start selecting face sets of the strands and then extrude them to your liking.

The method can also involve connecting the already extruded peaces and then extruding again from there. I is a lot of work, but the results are VERY demanding. And I have to confess that I really had fun with mine.
Just to ref from.. my stats for my mane as it was posted here are as follows;

PolyAveragVertex'ed 484 times
PolyTweak'ed 254 times (those that were written into it's history only)
PoplyExtrudFace'ed 198 times
PolySplt'ed 245 times
DeleteCopmponent'ed 176 times
PolyCollapseEdge'ed 81 times
PolyAppedn'ed 529 times

I hope some of this can be of some use to you.


05 May 2005, 07:32 PM (

And the gate.. it only LOOKS difficult or cool.. but honestly it was as easy as anything! Took me about Ten to Fifteen minutes to model.. I had times in between to think of what to do.. but nothing was really rushed.

Instead of explaining it all, I tried to put together a presentation such that can give you a better idea on what I used where.
The only thing confusing may be the toros’s; The bottom ones are just cut in halve and stretched.. the second to top ones are just extruded from the top of it and then four faces from the upper and lower side of it’s bottom half were again extruded.

I hope this helps;


05 May 2005, 07:45 PM
Great updates Black . You really are becoming mr. tutorial man :D Every piece looks amazing in detail and the way you are working really shows how to do things for us not so used in modelling in polys. Thank you :thumbsup::D

05 May 2005, 07:51 PM
Lol; You are most welcome.. thank YOU for the encouragements...
I may cut down on tutorial type displays for a while though.. It does take some extra work.

It is much easier to model when you don't have the timer ticking down an hours count! :) But since the speed modeling I noticed that I am always keeping track of the time it takes to make things.. and usually I try to rush the best I can to fit under an hour :sad:

I hope all is well withyour side :)

(Note to those that don't follow... we know each other from a speed modeling contest from another forum)

05 May 2005, 09:10 PM
Mmmm maybe later.. I don't need human reffrences at the moment. :)


Re your latest models and tuts, love the history lesson on the lion and his mane is awesome, it lends a great deal of credibility to your loyal subject... The courtyard and gate are also fine examples of your workflow... The systematic fanatic is at it again, LYW!

05 May 2005, 09:11 PM
the lion is so great :applause: :applause:cause my english is quite bad and it takes me a lot of time to read i'll do this after i'll calm down. then i'll come back to learn how to make modeling more efficient . keep it up dear black. you and your work and are amazing!!!

05 May 2005, 09:47 PM
If it cuts valuable time from the challenge plz cut down on them by all means. I want to see you finish this project and i hope the best about it. keep up the good work my friend :D :D

P.S i too am starting to look att my watch all the time even if i dont modell for a challenge :D


05 May 2005, 09:56 PM
Hi Black.......I like you're progression......on all fronts.....the tile/stone idea is quite interesting.......The courtyard looks be something with lots of potential......The lion as well will really add alot to the scene,well done Black.....Nice to see this all come together,I see lots of potential.......and thus far you are reaching the potential you have shown up to this point.......Interesting work flow and the execution looks to be on a real nice road........Keep this coming,I'll be watching with interest.......:arteest:

05 May 2005, 06:50 AM
yeah.. :applause:more animal prop, thanks Black..
You and your thread really make me wanna learn this 3D magic. the right way, not just sit and push all the buttons. hmm wonder what happens when I push this one. or that one :eek: *L* Saving it all, and study it at at home.
Keep you image going :bounce: its really good stuff.

05 May 2005, 08:27 PM
dear black. just visiting your thread. hope everything is going well :)

05 May 2005, 08:55 PM
Thank you again.. you know you and your bossts are one of the mager reasons I am posting them such.
I would be so happy if they are proving to be as useful to others as you compliment them to be a potential of.

No your English is very fine.. I think I just wrote things a little bit on the complex side.. I am sorry :blush:
You can always message me for details shall you wish explanations of any kind.

Unfotunately moderating the other forum is taking 70 percent of my free time.. shall you agree, it is like a kindergarden there at some points.
I think the thing about speed modeling is that once it starts and you get to a level of control it REALLY gets under your skin.. like a fear of the bell or some thing :)

Always there and always polite and supportive :thumbsup: Thank you;
The court is much more detailed.. and the figures are to be set.. But I haveb't yet decided on the shot angle to go nuts with it all. Hope it makes it in time!

When was it ever that you wanted something and I said no? :)
Yeah one more.. I have also a rat on the way.. But I don't know if I can remodel it to have it tut like.. too much work in my hands now.

My dear Smaddl; yes everything is fine.. Thank you for the worries.. I have just been overflooded with work. Actually I have a Toad update waiting on my desk top.. I just couldn't get around to post it.. I will once things are clear.

Well guys.. another update coming.. with textures for a change.
I am slowly having the scene set, so I know alot better on were to put the details.
Hope you like them;


05 May 2005, 09:11 PM
ops! i didn´t mean it like that. at all. take you time to work on your image, don´t mind me, I have enough to study, with all the things you already done for us in you thread.... Thanx again :applause:

05 May 2005, 09:20 PM
Lol.. Dear Mona;
I know VERY well that you had best of intentions all the way.. I am sorry.:)

No what I meant is that I would like to bring them ALL out such.. I just wish I had the time in my hands to do so!
Oh by the way I just emptied out my mailbox.. So sorry for the situation.. Didn't notice I had so many mails :sad:

Thank you for always making any post I do worth the time :thumbsip:


05 May 2005, 12:50 AM (

I originally hadn’t planed on displaying any of the base meshes again.. but it seems I won’t be able to post every step as I am usually attempting to.. so it may be best that I just show you what the base mesh looks like with the base texture that is to be tweaked to the dials.

The mesh is the exact same mesh as presented earlier.. with just a difference of textures added and a smooth subdividing done all through out.
Behind the stage bits of this little toad that you guys don’t get to see is the posing of it and sculpting each pose individually. I may make a bigger group of them also. But I doubt I will worry about sculpting those guys. As they won’t be too visible.

I’ll be posting a few posed versions shortly... Hope you like it;


Ps; [I]The two textures you see are the bump and the colour maps. I tend to variant the bump for the secularity. But I doubt I’ll make them too glossy.. or glossy at all :)[I].

05 May 2005, 01:32 AM (

Alright; the first posed toad...
All textured and sculpted!.. I actually did a big mistake on this one... When working with MaYA I often apply things such as T connections together with quads.. and I had the same thing with this one. When it imported to Zbrush.. it just left a big hole in the foot. Not too big a loss since I can always put that to the back.. But I shall try to fill it up in MaYA later on.
You see I had noticed the mistake a little bit too late (AFTER I got to detailing the feet :sad: )

As for the pose.. like you can guess.. it’s on a rock.. resting it’s belly in the meanwhile :)

I have another pose sculpted out.. and shall be posting that one also for you once I have the texturing handled. (No missing faces this time :))

05 May 2005, 01:59 AM
thank you black for a good laughter :bounce: this toad is sweet and funny. great texturing :applause:

05 May 2005, 02:08 AM
Hehehehe.. actually when you come to think of it.. the texture DOES look like a run-over toad! :)

Heey that could be a good idea for texturing the next time :rolleyes:

Thank you again for the support Smaddl! It so helps boost me to do some more :thumbsup:

More to come in a while;


05 May 2005, 02:12 AM (

While texturing the second pose.. I thought I would display a clay render of the sculpted version as it is...

Like you can see.. not really fantastic sculpting to the software’s abilities.. but most of the high res is meant to be used as a bump map.

Hope you like it, more to come right away...
(Well sort of... working on it)


05 May 2005, 02:24 AM
i think the texture looks great!! i was laughing because the toad is so funny. i love animals and toads as well. and again, dear black your thread is priceless. thank you for sharing your steps.

05 May 2005, 02:31 AM
Hey I just noticed now!!! You took up my chance on the 200th post! :sad:

At least it went to some one I enjoy getting posts from :)
Well yeah.. they are funny creatures to my opinion also. I hope you find the textured version of the one I posted as funny.. It's just about done now.. preparing the layout now.
I didn't think bad of your laughing don't worry. But it just struck me on how I had done the UV lay out... like a flat toad!
Must have been hanging around Robert for too long :)

Til a little later


05 May 2005, 03:02 AM (

Here is the textured version of the second pose as promised...
I don’t think I will sculpt the other variations until I am sure of the settlement of the final shot angle.. So will be moving on to finalising the vampire and all the humans (Wouldn’t want to get disqualified from leaving out humans now would we? :) )

Modelling/Painting/Sculpting.. these are all processes of literally relearning nature... An endless source of things to observe... Like before modelling this toad.. I hadn’t known they had only four fingers in the hands :eek:
Soo... ; none the less I am more enjoying this than anything else :)
I just hope that it is as much fun for you as it is for me.

Til later;


05 May 2005, 06:08 AM
here I´m, rightclicking, save as, in to my PCs folder, Blacks Zoo... *LOL* Thanks... :bounce: "tiretrackfrog"... hehe, it´s nice to laff a bit, with the first cup of coffee in the morning... and sorry, but can´t help repeat my self here, great work..:bowdown:.. nothing else too say... :shrug: *L*

05 May 2005, 09:16 AM
And they say I am too serious!

Glad you liked it...
Things are getting together on this side.. but I really don't know how I am going to put them together and show them.
My only goal is to have a good result.. and in the process have a good WIP presentation. I guess they both don't really go together that easily :sad:

Thank you again for the encouragements!


05 May 2005, 09:36 AM
Speechless... Well except for that.. oops, and that.. Oh you know what I mean... Work like this makes me and Jeebus :cry:

Finer even than my kinda vivid imagination imagified it

Nice to see the absolutely mental L e e a p over into the land of Z

BTW, I consider my modelling skills to currently be umm.. Primitive at best, Your tuts have given me much insight and inspiration as I'm most certain they have to others as well, You're a gem Black;)...Thanks once more good sir:bowdown:

05 May 2005, 09:41 AM
Turned out nice Black.....I like the blend or slight color change from one color to the other...the transfer of one color to the next and that middle ground where they change.....Well done.....keep hammering away.....;) :wip:

05 May 2005, 12:00 PM
Hi there, it seems that you are very experienced in the animals. Frog is an enough example.
Thumbs up.

Kurbaa da geldi. Hadi bakalım. Öte yandan zaman da bitiye.. süre de doluye.. :P

05 May 2005, 02:00 PM

I haven´t been in the net for a days and now... I´m very happy to see this updates.
They are great! and I love the way you show your workflow, and you master the process (and the modeling, and the texturing, etc etc)

This is turning out GREAT!
I´m sorry I can only post compliments but really can´t critize anything.

05 May 2005, 02:15 PM
Hey there Black, wonderful updates! Great work on the frog he looks absolutely natural. Also I really like your work on the lion statue very much, great sculpting as usual. :beer:


05 May 2005, 02:43 PM
besides the nice models that clay wall idea is very cool! I finally found an excuse to pull out my clay blob out of the closet.:thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 05:42 PM
Great updates Black. keep up the good work :D :D :D

p.s as for the other forum , yes i believe sometimes it can be a cindergarden :o)

05 May 2005, 02:51 AM
One of the MOST annoying things happened a few hours ago...
I had this long and sincere rely to each of you and as I hit submit.. or preview.. not sure now...
It said that my session had expired! And I lost it all! :sad:
Wel that kapt me from getting back at it again for some time.

And when I a'read a posts like yours I go :blush::blush::blush:
And turn all read in :blush:
Gosh would I call that a boost?! You really so under the skin in servicing my ego don't you?

As flattered as I am, I doubt that I am at any level that would require you to put your skills or yourself down like that. And I doubt that I shall ever reach such a level.
I can not find words enough to explain how you have actually helped me in collected period that I had really needed to feel special.. Thank you. I HOPE to live up to your standards, how ever exagerated.. just to be able to sort of pay back.. may I make it to the deadline or not.

Michael, I am so glad you like it.
Originally I was going to prepare texture and displacemant maps that were set to a sort of sampler ramp to provide that I have a base mesh for it to follow up on to. But since I am not exactly going to animate these guys, I tunred from going through the trouble of sorting out crowd behavior scriptings.
I shall do so for the bats.. and posible for the rats. But for the most, I shall maybe give you guys a sample of what it could have been like and then I shall be sculpting them individually

Lol; yeah.. I am aoiding the complexer human model =D ... Not too easy to model those guys you know!.
Thank you for once again supporting and exagerating my talents.. I am only as good as so may here... One of them is you!
I have this tactique that I am going for.. making this a GOOD image and a GOOD WIP is literally my priority.
If I manage to live up to my own standards.. then I am a winner regardless to the result of the contest :thumbsup:

Lol thank you.. always there and always supportive. You and your support simiallar are some good reasons why it becomes so easy to want to share my metheods. I hope that they are as worth your time to go through them as you so often exagerate them to be...

Well onw that I have posted them.. I have to admit that I am not too happy with a various amount of sculpting blobs they have. But none the les I guess this is the part that I have to be more what profssional and learn to let it go since they are small little characters.
I am so glad you liked them all.

Yes it really is.. I often go for the option of scanning flat surfaces for base textures.
Actually I think I am just making it an excuse to be able to play with clay some more =D Since they are also possible to be done through my painting them individually.
Thank you for dropping by and your kind words!

Thanks for the support and for following up on me! I'll try to keep em up.. but no promises!

Yeah I have to admit that each often I do find good reasons to be so sorry that I accepted the postion. But well. I don't like to run from my responsabilities if I can avoid it. Gotta do what I gotto do!

Thank you ALL for your great BOOST.. I am free now and as late an hour as it is here.. I am going to start on trying to set out the human models to show you guys..
I doubt I shall stop until I have finished them... but don't really expect an update any time too soon.

Thank you again... til next time;


05 May 2005, 04:31 AM
Annoying...same thing happened to me a coupla days ago... made me a little hectic it did...
Thanks good sir, it's an absolute pleasure dealing with you here there and everywhere;)
I call em how I see em Black... I beleive that that is yet another thing we have in common

My perception of my modelling skillset is independant of any external influences... I just felt it apt to inform you of the insight you have given me into methodology...and the appreciation I have for said givingness... Here's a little reality for you... I discovered what an 'edgeloop' is about 3 months ago... lol:applause: sad yet true.. Modelling has always been a weaker aspect of my toolset...

My advice is to forget my standards, or anyone elses for that matter, just keep on living up to your own good sir.. 'Tis why we all come to watch..
Good luck with the next steps...
May the force be with you

05 May 2005, 05:30 AM
Berter, amazing job you did on that toads skin, it's really realistic.

05 May 2005, 05:46 AM
I'm certainly not a toad's specialist... but this one is perfect for me... but take care to don't lose time... only remain you 9 days to finish line... I want to see impatiently your final picture... bon courage gars :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 02:51 PM
Agree, wonderful toad! You continue to inspire with your work and generosity to share your tricks. Good luck in wrapping it up now, not much time left :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 05:51 PM
One of the MOST annoying things happened a few hours ago...
I had this long and sincere rely to each of you and as I hit submit.. or preview.. not sure now...
It said that my session had expired! And I lost it all! :sad:
Wel that kapt me from getting back at it again for some time.

I have a trick there, you now me and my rightclicking *L*... mark the text and copy before you try to send it, then if the things don´t work as you planed, just open again and paste... :) works like a charm...

05 May 2005, 10:08 AM
sweet sweet toad. it seems a bit sad . maby because it lost the volume in the throat.

i always copying my replys to empty mail message in case i'll lose it.

looking forward to seeing more :arteest:

05 May 2005, 07:40 PM
looking for updates dear black. hope you'r missing the forum cause you'r working very hard preparing your scene.

05 May 2005, 04:29 AM
nice detail for toad.:thumbsup:
look forward to final images.
hope u finish both2d and 3d in time.
take care.

05 May 2005, 07:59 AM
Hello Everybody!

I am VERY sorry for the amount of delay I have put in between for updating my stuff...

What happened was that we had apparently forgotten to pay this months bill for the connection thus they cut us out!
Though we paid the bill that afternoon.. I have VERY little reason to compliment the speed of the bureaucracy of this country. We JUST got it back!

But this did NOT mean that I stopped working on a few updates. In fact not having all the questions to answer or obligational chats with friends; I have gained great pace, so I just went a little bit more extra on the details both for the 2D and the 3D entries...
I hadn’t noticed how much of my time it actually demanded. (For those that are reading and fit in the category, don’t worry my priorities are always Family, friends then work)

Being cut off for so many days has gotten a load of work to gather on my case and I have to get to them right away!
So this is just a fast note to thank you all for still following up.. I shall post a variety of updates hopefully in the evening.

For all those that have private messaged me through different channels to ask questions: Thank you for trusting me with your problems... I am so sorry for keeping distant and hope you have resolved the situations in hand. I shall try to visit the threads aswell when I can...

BURRIED with gathered work!


05 May 2005, 08:11 AM
Lookin forward to it all Black in both 2d and 3D...all 5D......Welcome back......:arteest: :beer:

05 May 2005, 11:55 AM
HI BLACK.Great to see ya back black.
tension growing each minute.allmost u could cut it with knife.
We must finiiiish. :) :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 06:29 PM
Funny you shall say it such, just as you had about your renderings :)
But none the less you are proving to be able to model rather well.. enough to get some dear attraction and your renderings have been some impressive works!
I am so glad that you are able to think so highly of me or what I try to present... And well in thiy already have won. And with a good image to keep :)
Thank you for chekking up on me often and giving me such reasons to go on!

Thank you very much Gerard.. I think I have gone a bit overboard in the texturing unit.. You shall see what I mean as I start posting them.. Infact I am planning on even removing a few models I have made for this since they look very cartoonish to compair to the rest

Thank you for the friendly reminder.. Actually the 3D is much more done than what is presented here.. but shall you apreciate, it is not too easy to post updates in this manner.
I do TOO however have the fear that I won't make it in time. I just wish things will be a bit more easy on my 'other' life so I could work a bit more on the challenges.
Thank you so much for chekking up on me.

Well I can at least say that I entered a wonderful WIP :p
Thank you so much for your kind words.. but well none of them are really tricks.. they are things that a great percentage of this comunity is already aware of. I just thought it a bit more discriptive to present my work such. I am so glad you like it.

My dear Smadar... Yes now that you say it .. it does look a bit sad :(
But well I have always had a thing for sad little creatures .. I usually made mistakes such as pressing the back button or something and the page resfresshing to a blank.. this time I had things going fine but well I lost it again.. And damn is that annoying
As for the updates bit.. yes I do have a dear few prepared for you guys and shall be sharing them shortly with even more to come tomorrow.
Thank you for always being so kind and supportive to me.

What can I say? If someone as obsessed with details as you are can call the details 'nice' than I can be very proud of my work! :) Thank you
Yes well I hope so to. I know that I will finish them.. but never too sure about the 'In time' bit about it :(

How 'un-human' to not allow some one to access the internet right?! :p
Well I am just back here.. but none the less I was able to work in some details into my entries. I hope to be able to give in a good set of 2D and 3D images before the deadline.
Your support is helping it a lot.. thank you for always being there.

A I R;
Lol yeah.. you have a point there.
I think I like tension... it makes you feel your heart beats with all of your sences.. sort of like feeling alive :)
None the less I am not as stressed on this as I should be I guess. I have so many matters in hand that are upsetting that the competiton is a more 'running' from them for me.
I just hope I get an image to my standards readied in time. The contests results won't be AS binding for me then.

Thank you ALL for dropping by... I am very curious on how the entries are going/finishing-up for each and every one of you.. but it shall take me some time to be free enough to pay your threads a deserved visit.. bare with me please.

Thank you again.. updates coming shortly!


05 May 2005, 06:55 PM (

Well the moment you have all been waiting for :( Yet another naked woman model here in the CG Forum’s... HOW original eh?

Well I tried to make her a bit more ‘real’ with more daily postures and casual breasts. My logic was simply that there was no plastic surgery back in those day.. and a little bit of plump here and there was acceptably desired.
I used an optically scanned woman found free on the internet as reference for the breasts. I am not too sure of where at this point.. but I shall inform you guys shall I come across it again.
Enjoy her this naked best you can. Cause after I have textured her I shall make sure that the nipples are covered. (Personal ethics)

The model is again a base.. I have added a variety of extra edges on parts of her body to ensure that I can change her to different characters as I work on her.
Unfortunately I couldn’t go through the trouble of setting the breasts to be morph able, so all the figures shall most probably be having the same pair.

Oh and last of all.. the head is not there to stay.. it is only placed there to ensure a specific vert count on the neck and to have a place holder for the proportions. There is a good reason I go into modelling the whole and then the details: It ensures that I stay loyal to the known proportions .. or at least to what my eyes would like to see them as.

Hope you like it!


05 May 2005, 07:14 PM (

I especially kept the head separate as I had figured that the most of you would enjoy a sort of time laps on modelling the head.

I have to repeat again that I can not really credit this as a tutorial. It is only a display of a few of the steps I took in the making of the model.
My original idea was to have two base meshes for the heads.. one for the men ad another for the women...
But as I worked on morphing a draft model (A simple pair of heads I had laying around in my hard drive) I noticed that I started to get men that looked girlish.. and girls that looked.. well not too feminine :(

So I decided to go for just one model with a little bit extra care in the making.

The modelling was again done via the method I had introduced earlier... just that it is applied this time to a human head.
If you see a head modelled by my part.. it is most likely that the work flow was some what like this.

A last note is that I HATE doing ears.. maybe because I suck on them!.. I did ONE ear earlier and have no intention on remaking one. I have already used the same ear (by pointing the ears a bit) for the vampire.
The ear you see here was reused from my base head I had done for a guy... and shall not be making use of for this project. I’ll see if I later on have the time to show you guys a few steps on ear making... but I can’t give any real promises.

Hope you like it!


05 May 2005, 07:27 PM (

Now finally some stuff for the vampire! :)

I do not really intend on creating a naked base model to dress up on his part...
For ease in posing I might rig him a simple geometry underneath .. not sure yet.

Well if nothing it is definite that he is going to have at least one of his hands bare and the nails showing (His other hand is going to be gloved and holding the other pair)

The modelling was done in a GREAT rush.. and VERY unwillingly at first. But I sort of liked the manner that he awkward extrusions had given out a more odd looking set of fingers... So I just decided to go on with it.

Please do not take any notice of the smoothed version.. I know that it looks horrible and I assure you that it shall be presented MUCH better when sculpted and textured.. this was just a ‘hit on the button’ smoothing.

Well a lot more to come.. just have to sort things for you to be able to follow up onto.


05 May 2005, 07:30 PM (

Ironically... one of the FIRST characters/models I have worked on for this entry. But one of the last to be posted :)

There was a very specific pose that I wanted to mould this guy into. But since a realistic approach has been the standards to all the elements of the entry up until now, I was sort of obligated to take life references.

On the top corner you can notice my initial character sketch that I have actually stayed loyal to. But with an additional touch of ‘real life’ referencing.

Photographs taken were also intended to be used for texture referencing so the images were especially taken at dusk or so.
The little glowing bits are a sort of polymer clay named ‘Fimo’ that you can bake into a hard form. Most of you have probably heard of polymer clay in the form of ‘Sculpy’.. Well anyhows... this specific one I used was a ‘Glow-N-Dark’ variety of it.
They were placed on specific areas pointed and shall be referenced in the final morphing for the pose. The glow-n-Dark bit is to make sure they be vivid enough.
Well they worked well and helped out greatly.

The modelling was done a bit more radical this time since I had an exact idea on where to place the vertices.
It was a great mistake to work such as it took a great amount of my time to be able to fix up the resulting problems such a technique brought.
IT works.. But I would not advice it.

These are some in-between steps from the incremental saves... so not too descriptive. I just thought you might like it this way.
The ears are of the ‘reused’ ears I had mentioned earlier. You can notice the ear in it’s ‘stuck-on’ and it’s ‘made-pointed’ states.

Hope you like it!


05 May 2005, 07:43 PM (

I had at some time wanted to do a little bust of my father. To be used as a concave lamp (Long Story)
While working on it, I had this sort of doubt on whether having his eyes shut or open.. so like I do with everything... I just went on and tried both to see which one liked most.
I honestly couldn’t decide on it still and have that project set aside for some time...

But the resulting grotesque era it gave sort of influenced me for what I would like the coachman/driver to look like!!

Well I had no intention on rigging this guys head, and it would really not be too easy to morph the existing base head to such a figure. So this would work just perfectly!
I went on and did a few modifications.. added some more ‘skin’ and deformations.. and pronounced a sort of scar to his right side.
I have later on painted it in order to be photographed and be used as reference for both modelling and referencing.

Ideally I had an intention to work on him today, but I couldn’t.. so I guess I shall be getting to it later tonight. I hope to post it in the morning.. along with my first set of render :)

Well other matters are calling my attention now.. will be a few hours before I could get back to the competition... Thank you for dropping by


Ps: Please note that this servant has to be ESPECIALLY human.. so I can’t make him any more ‘weird’ than this.. Think of it this way:: he has to be able to drive the master around in daylight as he hides in the thick curtains :)

05 May 2005, 08:31 PM
great to see you back dear black :) great models and presentation as always. love the sculptor and the solution that comes from not been able to decide. would like very much to see all tose great models gathering to your scene. i'l be back tomorrow to see your updates. happy work :)

05 May 2005, 09:17 PM
OOoooooooHhhh How exciting!! I was thinking that you must be moving along since I didn't see any updates...Doesn't make sense I know but 'tis true... Great to see the standard your work hovers at applied to a human subject BlackGoodSir... All keepers...
Really appreciate the pics of you, always great to put a face to a mind...A dark one indeed! I work in fymo with my kids (that's my excuse)
The sunken cheeks and protruding top lip are very 'nosferatu', as is the angle of his ear...Well done!!

And of course, one more solid dose of proper respect from my side of this planet... You have inspired me to take up boxmodelling Black...I'll be implementing some mutations of your workflow in my next few projects...I really will try and get my head around the techniques you have displayed in this project and in your very kind extra .gifs... You've also inspired me to pass on more knowledge as I go as well... Humbly, I am in your debt my friend:wise:

My thoughts are with you with the looming crunch! Good luck!

05 May 2005, 09:19 PM
always a pleasure to see ya updates :) and nice to see a lady with a nomal figure...

05 May 2005, 04:32 AM
Lol yeah.. it was a good solution that also made me feel better about having such a horrible portray of my father.. Even if it was meant to be a base... Since you see, my father is actually an attractive guy, and definately proportional :)
I'll be posting the digitally modeled version of it as soon as I can.
Thank you again for paying me a visit and your generous compliments

I so wish that I would deserve to be able to say that I am moving along.. but things on the competitions side are going slower than planned.
And I am not going to juast paste them together to make an entry. I doubt it would be anything you guys would expect from me.
Hehehe.. yes that's me :) I had told you guys earlier that I literallylooked like Vampire myself! ... but yeah, now you have a face on the name.. not as Nerdy looking as one would expect eh? A creep none the less :blush:

And yes the lips were worked on with intentions such. I am so glad that at least you have noticed the asition to be able to conceal the over-grown K9 fangs...
The funny things is the amount of times I had to remodel him... I think this is the 3rd complete and textured version.

So whats normal :p
Well it's always nice to see a lady (DO note that I am a guy)... and always nice to see an update! So it was great to be able to do them both. Well naa.. I have to confess that I find the amazing poser woman posted in Renderosity and simiallar to be attractive and I can't say anything about it. But when it comes to creating my own, I just can't get around to modeling such! I have to have a realistic touch/feel to it.
Actually my wife is well fit in the supermodel standards.. But I doubt I would like to post naked models of her :EEK:

I have prepared so much to share with you guys.. I just don't have the time in hand enough to be able to post them all :(

My good friends.. Thank you for helping keeping my thread in the level it is.. your encouragements and kind words are held highly!
More updates to come!


05 May 2005, 07:00 AM
I so wish that I would deserve to be able to say that I am moving along.. but things on the competitions side are going slower than planned.
And I am not going to juast paste them together to make an entry. I doubt it would be anything you guys would expect from me.
Hehehe.. yes that's me :) I had told you guys earlier that I literallylooked like Vampire myself! ... but yeah, now you have a face on the name.. not as Nerdy looking as one would expect eh? A creep none the less :blush:

And yes the lips were worked on with intentions such. I am so glad that at least you have noticed the asition to be able to conceal the over-grown K9 fangs...
The funny things is the amount of times I had to remodel him... I think this is the 3rd complete and textured version.

Hello again Black, sad to hear that you may not make the crunch but in little doubt that you'll be able to escape producing great work from the characters you've given birth to here.. Your face has the strength and features of a great bloodline, and your hairline is wicked... I'd say you're not as creepy looking as I expected mate, your face would fit comfortably in many of of my circles of friends... I've always tended to gravitate to those who chose to appear as they wish... for themselves... Anyway my new friend, Keep up the BlackDidThis-ing as only you can, and many thanks:bowdown: for all you've already given...
More Power to the night rockers!

05 May 2005, 07:02 AM
hmmm whats normal? I´m normal and I´m a girl...:thumbsup: naaaa... not what I meant... It´s not anything or anyone that can be described as normal, really... but the girl ya made is nice, in that she is not made of silicon an have been under the knife. But I´m for sure can get why ya guys like those 3Dgirls... eyecandy as it is.. :) my only wish is... that it would be more of males that was shown in that way, perfect bodys and handsome faces... hehe...
anyway.. I hope ya work is coming along as ya deserve, just perfect! and I´m looking forward to the finalimage of yours... :bounce:

05 May 2005, 08:21 AM
Oh I shall try to make it to the crunch none the less... It is just that I have no will to put aside quality to be doing so.
And as you have stated.. I am putting a little bit of myself into what I am making.. giving birth to. You have to ensure you can nurse a child before you bring it to life don't you? :)
Well I am actually a decendant of an area of Romania that is known as the land of 'between the mountains'... so you never know... my bloodline may just as well be touching the Mr. Most famous Vampire :twisted:
Well lol; I am not realy a goth.. I just look how I do. Not trying anything especially. And hell does that say alot about your friend circles if I happen to be able to fit in :)

hehe.. naa I was just pulling your leg.. I know what you meant.
I agree with the eye candy bit and the unjust eye candy on male figures to compair.
But well at some point a great variaty of them seem a bit too superfacial and childishly fake to me. I felt a bit more as if I have achieved something when I modeled her such.
It was not too easy, then again which model is ever easy to do?

Thank you for your time spared. Going to have to get back to work now! :)


05 May 2005, 02:56 PM
I don’t know what I can tell you... thank you allot for sharing your work:bounce: ... sorry for my english :sad:

05 May 2005, 03:51 PM
WOW pal,This is super.U rock in real materials to,But than again,you have nothing to look in 3d software if you dont understand it in real world,wright.
But Im curious,in which stage are you at the time,havent read posts.
Hurry. :) :thumbsup:

05 May 2005, 08:16 PM
Berter, how many clones did you put on this one?

Dude love the way you modeled your head, you did a great job.

Hope your internet doesn't crash again cause took me an hour to read all your new post.

Good luck on finishing this, not much time left but if you don't sleep at all you should finish it ;)

05 May 2005, 08:17 PM
Hi Berter:thumbsup: Thanks to support my thread:thumbsup: ...sorry for the lateness and brevity of my post here, you know time is going faster by now...Your art knowledge are really very impressive...I hope I can visit this thread after the challenge, when the waters get calm....I can see you are in a running too so we better get back to work:wip: .

good luck to you too:thumbsup:

MyMasterAndServant (

05 May 2005, 09:16 PM
my bloodline may just as well be touching the Mr. Most famous Vampire :twisted:
Well lol; I am not realy a goth.. I just look how I do. Not trying anything especially. And hell does that say alot about your friend circles if I happen to be able to fit in :)

Clearly you're a being of heart, strength and passion... Darkness is somthing I've never really feared, it comes with a sense of honesty for me... Good luck with the crunchiness Black... Ummm.. We have a saying for those who work nights

... No rest for the wicked ...

05 May 2005, 11:43 PM
Here I am... with nothing to say except Woooow... my complete respect to U, your process is so artistic and technically awesome... Can't believe I didn't see this thread before... Amazing work, love the way you use the clay for 3D tests and textures... man, U rock! :buttrock:

And, thanks 4 visiting my thread, I'm so happy with the quality of artists that visit me! :D

05 May 2005, 05:47 AM
Firstly thank you all for coming by.. I am sorry for not updating again, but my health has dearly declined...
I have a dear set of stuff readied, but I have no idea on how I can prepare them for you to see the work in it's progress. I shall how ever do all I can to give it in in time with all it is so far.

Sukran for your kind complliments...
The sharing bit was a great pleasure one would wish I could give more, but it is not always possible.. and your English is just fine :thumbsup:

I am very sorry Gerard :sad: But well it might happen again.. wasn't able to update yesterday :p
I couldn't work yesterday actually.. that already lost me a day. I just prey that I will get some more strength to get things over with.

Lol.. now that was a SURE intresting boost.. an apreciated one none the less. I would be honoured for you to come and visit my humbnle thread later on. I would like any of what I presented to be of some use, if not a good read to all of you.
Thank you for dropping by and good luck with your stresing! :thumbsup:

Hahahaha.. You REALLY make my day.. I shall definately enjoy your friendship and am very greatful to having the privilage of your warmth.
I guess I can be called a little bit dark :rolleyes: ... I had a poem I had written when I was in the academy still.. about how we overlook the details lost in the contrasts of daylit terrians.. and how darkness would compliment everything evenly, and set you more beauties than you had earlier seen, if you can just adjust your eyes to it.
Sort of like dealing with things let down or left aside.. always have. And it got me to be the wicked you compliment I guess :twisted:
I shall give this in especially for you and your simiallar. I would hate to be a disapointment.

Well it's a pity then that I can't really declair myself an artist. But I must thank you for your generous compliments on my thread. I hope that the result will be as intresting.
The methods are used by many I am sure.. it is nothing too difficult to think of. I just enjoyed sharing my steps in the making.
Thank you again for dropping by!

Thank you all again.. I shall work on no end til I have something up tonight!


05 May 2005, 06:43 AM
dear black. just wanted to ask you to think about yourself now. hope you feel better . you are so great talented and giving person . would very much like to see you finishing on time.

05 May 2005, 07:47 AM
Oh boy do I feel so rude for missing out on you A I R...
I am so sorry.
I guess I had better really get back to bed! :sad:

I have to completely agree with you on this one.. if you have a control over the creation process in the real world, all the softwares and digital enhancments are simply another tool to fullfill your line of statement. To many who ask if they should start drawing classes before they start on 3D.. And I simply answer them that if they do 3D they can be a good modeler with hard work. If they learn to draw things first.. they can be a very good modeler if they work hard :)
As for where I am.. luckily in a better state than most of you fear.. But I won't be able to render things yet.. there are alot more to do.
I have lost some dear time trying to unify the elements and ended up modeling each of them seperately. I sometimes marvel at the amount of elements some are able to produce. I guess I just put too much detail :sad:

You are always too kind in wyas more than one.. Thank you, and I shall do as you say and take myself to a priority for some while.
I too would like to be able to present a finished image to especially friends I have achieved such as yourselves. You have all supported me so wonderfully... I feel bad to not feeling up to my full potential to work.
All is not lost.. I will just have a lower quality final render with some post work if all goes bad :rolleyes: I think... naa I can't do this to the models.. they deserve a good image.
Hope to be able to give them one!

I doubt you shall be hearing from me for the day...


05 May 2005, 01:04 PM
Really impressive way of handling the challenge here man..

I wandered throughout the many pages. I have gone and watched and inspected etc. amongst many, I daresay that yours are the most scientific ones.

You are giving an incredible attention to your work. Win a prize or not, but you have already won the respect of the many.

By the way :)) I think they will still call you as the "tutorial man" just because mine part tells only what to do whilst yours are telling how to do. I can't get this nick from you, sorry :).

05 May 2005, 01:18 PM
I feel I cannot help you in anyway, but I like to say that you´re doing a great job, using so many references, so many techniques... simply great! the results are great obviously with your mastering.
and the vampire is going to look scary in that expression! :scream:
Go, go go!