View Full Version : Magdalena (ut2004 Game Model), Skullbox (3D)

06 June 2004, 08:00 PM (


[url=] (

CrouchF: (

WalkF: (

It took a while longer to complete but it made it just in time for the Make Something Unreal phase 3 submissions. The image above links to the UT2004 model itself, the thumbnails below to samples of the animations (DivX). It was a lot harder to get the motion right at the required speed for this one due to the very constrainted setup she has with the pistons and short hind legs, but I'm very pleased with how she moves around in game.

This is a remake of the Quake3 character ( which was the first project Jason and I did. Since that was an extremely fun project to work on we both wanted to do a remake with our newly aquired skills and the abilities of the suberb Unreal Engine. She's built out of 3789 polygons, one 1024 texture, one 512 texture and 64 bones. It wasn't meant to be the model directly following Effigy - we wanted to do something else inbetween - but time kind of restricted me from from doing another project.

I hope you guys like what we've done to her, as always, let me know what you think! :)

Dark Horizon
06 June 2004, 08:01 PM
well it was fun to revist an old favorite of mine with bastiaan

anyways heres the flats

made in photoshop

06 June 2004, 08:28 PM
Holy sh*t. I have no words for this stunning work. Just great.

06 June 2004, 08:30 PM
WoW !! Really nice work :thumbsup:

Your model and your textures look damn good. And the animations look really smooth too :buttrock:

Seems like i have to install another playermodel ;)


06 June 2004, 08:48 PM
I think this is from the maker of effigy?

If you are, effigy is featured on the UT2004 special edition disk on the behind the scenes footage. He his shown briefly running around firing a rocket launcher. :)

Looks nice.

EDIT: Should read more carefully first... :rolleyes:

06 June 2004, 09:31 PM
aweesome texture

06 June 2004, 09:37 PM

06 June 2004, 09:46 PM
plugg it! :) Great work Jason and Bastiaan. The whiter tone eyes better then the red one too dh :)

06 June 2004, 09:56 PM
Simply amazing!
Can you please post a wireframe?

06 June 2004, 10:33 PM
Realy amazing work! I'd like to play with this one:drool:
your texture are wonderfull man:thumbsup:
can you post wire please?

06 June 2004, 11:27 PM
Originally posted by Virum
If you are, effigy is featured on the UT2004 special edition disk on the behind the scenes footage. He his shown briefly running around firing a rocket launcher. :)

Aaargh, that eddition wasn't available here. Is it related to the Make Something Unreal Contest winners of the first round by any chance?

06 June 2004, 11:42 PM
Great work boys!
Love your muscles jay!
Love the way you make jays muscles move, bastiaan!

06 June 2004, 11:47 PM
Beautiful. Only reason I wouldnt use it is because it would be outta place, and by outta place I mean better looking then all the original models.

06 June 2004, 12:05 AM
My god. Amazing. The concept is terrific man. The modeling and the texuring as well.:applause: :applause: :applause:

06 June 2004, 12:11 AM
I saw the animation too. You have done an excellent job man. You have to know this. I gave you 5 start. Do you know why. Because there is no 10.

06 June 2004, 12:30 AM
OMG. This is absolutely amazing.

06 June 2004, 01:24 AM
digging the model, design, textures, animation, everything.
excellent work:applause:

06 June 2004, 01:35 AM
wow! that texture job is top notch! excellent model also! have any wireframes?

06 June 2004, 01:58 AM
Originally posted by SkullboX
Aaargh, that eddition wasn't available here. Is it related to the Make Something Unreal Contest winners of the first round by any chance?

I'd host the section of the clip but my web host was an asshole recently and deleted my account. Still trying to get the DNS stuff so I can switch to a new host.

Nope. It was the behind the scenes making of. They were discussing how they shipped UnrealEd which allowed you to make mods and custom player models. While he's talking he shows your dude running around:
Clicky (

No, I'm not running a Mac. :rolleyes:

BTW, I'm playing Magdalena now. The only thing that could make it better would be some sick rag doll effects. :)

06 June 2004, 05:49 AM
:bowdown: :drool: :love: :bowdown: nothing more:)

06 June 2004, 05:53 AM
the models pretty cool. but those textures are were its at dude. Im very impressed and ive been doing this for quite some time.

06 June 2004, 06:21 AM

Thats some amazing texture work there!
Really solid, fleshy looking hands too.
Post it in the games forum for more appropriate feedback though...

06 June 2004, 06:37 AM
holy shit!!:applause:

06 June 2004, 06:52 AM
front page :bounce:
front page :bounce:
front page :bounce:
front page :bounce:
front page :bounce:

06 June 2004, 07:13 AM
brilliant work.

06 June 2004, 07:43 AM
simply sickly amazing

06 June 2004, 07:54 AM
great job!!

:applause: :applause: :applause:

06 June 2004, 08:16 AM
really impressive work !!!

your are a texturing KILLER !!!

your design and animation are great TOO !!!

FRONT PAGE !!!!:surprised :surprised

06 June 2004, 08:33 AM
very very nice work guys !

you havent thought of making a tutorial on the unwrapping of the character ? :D I always get problems with seams and stuff...

06 June 2004, 09:00 AM
:drool: it's all i can say

Kel Solaar
06 June 2004, 09:08 AM
Texturing is awesome and animation very smooth!

06 June 2004, 11:06 AM
Virum: Thanks. The model actually has a ragdoll though, so if you're not seeing it, you probably disabled dynamics in the game...

enzodiac: Jason Sallenbach (Dark Horizon) was the one who unwrapped (and textured) it. There are quite some game oriented unwrapping tutorials available on polycount, and some searching on google should bring out some good ones. Hyper (als oa member here) wrote some pretty good ones on it.

06 June 2004, 11:08 AM
The model looks terrific! and the textures are just awe-inspiring :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 11:11 AM
That texture is UNREAL!

were there any refrences, or was it all hand painted?

the detail is INSANE... :cry:

06 June 2004, 12:43 PM
Very nice incarnation, looking forward to it getting a plug on the front page too, excelent work from you both :)

Why havn't epic got round to making it easier for client side pluging models to work on non pure servers, it would be so much less trouble getting some good models n game, especially after the quality of the UT2k3 models in relation to the UT2k4....


06 June 2004, 02:46 PM
youhouuuuuu :bounce: :applause: :bounce:

06 June 2004, 03:14 PM
awsome model awsome texure awsome animations just one thing
how did you do the animation when hes driving cars and stuff i would think that it would be some clipping since hes pretty big and that he isent built like a human??

06 June 2004, 04:40 PM
:thumbsup: Fantastic:thumbsup: Wonderfull maps and fantastic modeling.

I don't know if someone had already ask you a wireframe ... :cool:

06 June 2004, 05:30 PM
Hey Bastiaan,

Nice model man! It's not up there with the last one you made, but it's still pretty damn slick. As said, awesome texture work! The animation is pretty slick too, but he just seems a bit to light and bouncy. Also, is she supposed to limp in the crouch animation?
Even though I'm not really into this sort of model, I can appreciate the quality of it, and the effort that's been put into it. Nice job!

Dave Black
06 June 2004, 06:18 PM

Amazing everything!

*PLUGGED* on the front page! Congrats!


06 June 2004, 06:22 PM
Awesomely textured!

06 June 2004, 06:23 PM
Deliciously twisted. I bow to your magnificence. :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 06:26 PM
very awsome model and textures

i would love to play this character in UT

06 June 2004, 06:35 PM
Extreme work !!

06 June 2004, 06:35 PM
great concept
cool model
awesome textures
good animation
perfect skinning...

i can't actually find any flaw...

that will make a tough entry in make something unreal!!!

i also made some models for ut2k3 (inspired to warhammer 40k)... and in the gameplay were ok... but yours...
absolutely rocks!


06 June 2004, 06:45 PM

wow! You guy's have SERIOUSLY raised the bar on... well... EVERTHING! Modeling, texturing, animation, and you even got it all in Unreal!
I believe that's game, set and match for you guys. ;)

my little ditty (

06 June 2004, 06:45 PM
Awesome work! :thumbsup: You guys make a great team! :buttrock:

06 June 2004, 06:53 PM
marvelous texture maps. I'd really love to see it with some cool animations. Good work!:wip:

06 June 2004, 06:56 PM
Originally posted by SkullboX
[b]Virum: Thanks. The model actually has a ragdoll though, so if you're not seeing it, you probably disabled dynamics in the game...

D'oh, I think it's teh slowdeath mutator. I'll check it later. :)

06 June 2004, 07:12 PM
I dont like to be a Wow guy but dude WoW! nice map/model :bowdown:

AIPh Pretzel
06 June 2004, 07:16 PM
I've used your Magdelana model for Q3A, and it was probably the greatest thing I've ever seen. Sometimes it even crashed my PC! :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 07:18 PM
horrible work :D

just kidding, dude that is amazing


ahhhhh i love it

John Keates
06 June 2004, 07:53 PM
That is an incredibly striking model. So nice to see so much creativity going on in it.

I have one crit though and that is that the specular on the arm is a litttle to perfect.

Amazing stuff though.

06 June 2004, 07:56 PM
model is amazing! animations are amazing! I even noticed the weight on the hands! Can't wait to try it at home.

what app did u use to animate it?

06 June 2004, 07:57 PM
Creepy!:drool: Where can I guet the model??? sorry for the question. I didn't read all the posts.

Keep surprizing us with such stuff. ;)

06 June 2004, 08:08 PM
great modeling and texturing. i love that dark piece of art! :bowdown:

i always can't understand how you can do such a great textures :rolleyes:

06 June 2004, 08:13 PM
Man that looks incredible! Great job on the modeling and texturing. No crits at all.

2 questions,

1) Can you please post a wireframe?

2) Is that poly count, quads or triangles?

06 June 2004, 08:19 PM
I use everyday this model in Q3 version!

:thumbsup: tnks

06 June 2004, 08:20 PM
:drool: AMAZING

Beautiful work! :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 08:27 PM
this is friggin amazing :surprised :surprised
marvellous job

06 June 2004, 08:58 PM
Great work! I love it!

06 June 2004, 09:00 PM
Jesus christ

And I thought MY current texture wip was good.. you just raised the bar about 5 notches bro. My hats off to you..

Thats the best texture painting I have ever seen. Beautiful variations and range in there... keep up the excellent work.

06 June 2004, 09:01 PM
what else could I say...

texturing is so nice !!
and anamation very smooth !!

I m just not a big fan of the quake 3 designs... but great job man !!

06 June 2004, 09:03 PM
DAMN this is a F....... good work. AMAZING :buttrock:

06 June 2004, 09:14 PM
Amazing textures, model, and animation! Congrats! :beer:

in your sofa
06 June 2004, 09:20 PM
crazy...just crazy

06 June 2004, 09:22 PM
I remember Effigy when you posted it on here all those months (a year?) ago. I was impressed then, and I'm impressed now.

Excellent job mates.

06 June 2004, 09:54 PM
sweet! absalutly sick textures! keep up the good work guys!

06 June 2004, 10:01 PM
Nice model :) way to go :)

Aniation Critts are:

Its very nice, but somehow I kinda feel like hes floating? like he has no weight to him on his figers when hes doing the sidesteps. thats all I can critt on :)

keep it going DUUUDE!

06 June 2004, 10:10 PM
Amazing model and animation...but i think I told you allready. That texture is just stunning...superb work guys :buttrock: ! !

Cheerio Koen

btw, Bastiaan are you still on the HKU? didn't see you around lately

06 June 2004, 10:15 PM
I´m not so into blody things
but this I just cant deny

great - allready loved you effigy model

06 June 2004, 10:19 PM
WoW, amazing work, and UT2k4 rules, can't wait till the new unreal 3.0 engine comes out, great work !

06 June 2004, 10:21 PM
Loved Effigy, love this.

Keep it up.

06 June 2004, 10:36 PM
the character is great
and the texturing rocks! :buttrock:
i wish to have this game and play with this character

06 June 2004, 10:59 PM
hi .. greeeaat job guys, U really rock on model and texture. The animation are great too .. i lije the weight effect U put on the gun and and the mouth .. could the character be a little bit heavier.. i think she's a bit too fluide... anyway , i'm a big fan of U're character.. but I got a problem , i want to see her live and fight as a great amazon in the arena.. but when i clic on the link on the first big image as U said it .. i download a file from fileplanet which is a corrupted .zip ...:cry: i've tried to find it somewhere else but could only rich the 2003 version... could U tell me if U have another like forwarding to the same file or could U post a direct link on this thread.... thX a lot if U could do it....

continu U're job , it's always a plaisure...

06 June 2004, 11:16 PM
Absolutely amazing! Makes me want to go and buy UT 2004! Good job and thanks for the inspiration! :)

06 June 2004, 11:18 PM

This is a great model.

The walk cycle I think would look more organic/live if you spaced out the hand contact so it did fall on the same frame as the foot contact. Make the hands come down 3-4 frames after the foot.

Right now his walk seems kind of "jolty" and un smooth.

Of course you may be going for that kind of feel.

anyway great work.

06 June 2004, 12:08 AM
Oh my! That's a lot of replies... anyhoo, just wanted to tell you that I have the QIII arena model and it is one of my favs. Obviously, this one is going in my models folder as well in UT2k4 :beer:

06 June 2004, 12:28 AM
impressive textures.

06 June 2004, 01:18 AM
Thanks a lot for the crits and comments!

voodoofactory: Ey Gatze, thanks for the comments. All animations, especially notable on the crouch have a tick in them due to the render/compression, they're smooth otherwise. The light and bouncy feel probably is because of the low framerate on these renders, In game they play back quite a bit faster, but I don't know how to easily change that when rendering.

Dave Black: Thanks man, awesome!

AgentX: I'll post the wireframes a bit later. The count is in triangles.

Cycone: Hey Koen! I quit attending the HKU due to several reasons, mainly the loss of interest in the program and iets educational system.

grafikmon: Thanks a lot for the suggestion. Somebody else also advised trying the same and it looked a lot better. The animation was, as one of the few (along wit hthe Run Back) kept close to the original animation set, most of the other movement cycles are totally unlike those. The altered Walk look a lot better though. :)

Thanks again, I'll post the wireframes later.

06 June 2004, 02:11 AM
ok... i just splooged in my pants...

crazy nice. the piece... {cocks eye brow and slowly brings pinky finger to the corner of mouth} unreal?

awsome texture, your ruined raw flesh and tarnished metals are in creadible... great detail

06 June 2004, 02:26 AM
ULTRA WORK! :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 02:35 AM
this is really and truly amazing. The texturing is incredible. You guys have some skill, and thats no lie. And the animation is great, love the suttle movements.

Really Great JOB :bowdown:


P.S. Seriously though, you guys deserved frontpage for this!!!

Moo 4.5
06 June 2004, 02:44 AM
*reads 6 pages of "you are god"*

*opens the door joins the ride.*

Brilliant work!

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

06 June 2004, 02:46 AM
Excelent work, and i mean it.

Congrats, ( this makes me feel guilty that i dont do Lowpoly )


06 June 2004, 03:07 AM
This is sweet.

I really like it... Great job.

06 June 2004, 03:18 AM awesome stuff :)

06 June 2004, 03:20 AM
as dark horizons roommate, i only have one thing to say.

:beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:

06 June 2004, 04:01 AM
WOW amazing .. but after 6 pages .. no one posts pics of in game play

Super nice work

3D-ima Green
06 June 2004, 04:03 AM
this totally :buttrock:

lovin it, great work!

06 June 2004, 04:07 AM
here's an in game shot

06 June 2004, 04:38 AM
Any chance of seeing a screenshot of how the skeleton looks? I'm curious as to where the 60+ bones go on this mesh as I'm heavilly into rigging right now.


06 June 2004, 04:54 AM
This is so beautfiul!! I still can;t believe it's a she. I really love how you did the skin, the colours and subtle hues really gave her that extra oomph! Where can we download her? She would so own the other characters in UT2k4. ahahaa.:beer:

Very inspirational.

06 June 2004, 04:54 AM
:buttrock: AMAZING....

This is really really good ! !
How long does it take to finish this stunning work?

so good~

06 June 2004, 05:06 AM
Amazing!!! :drool: :buttrock:

06 June 2004, 05:23 AM
really nice work ... anyway chance of seeing more ..

06 June 2004, 05:43 AM
Originally posted by the_podman
Any chance of seeing a screenshot of how the skeleton looks? I'm curious as to where the 60+ bones go on this mesh as I'm heavilly into rigging right now.


I bet a majority of the bones are in the hands/feet. Looks like he has alot of articulation in them and I can count at least 35 bones in them.

BTW, great work on the model and animations. Only thing I would change on the animations is to offset the feet and hands by a couple frames. They lift off the ground and touch the ground at the same time.

06 June 2004, 05:59 AM
Wow thats .... thats... thats. Cant find the right words.

06 June 2004, 06:16 AM
Depressing quality of a model you have there:eek: Nice Work

06 June 2004, 07:28 AM
That is an incredible model. I love the gun placement on the character's back.

06 June 2004, 07:51 AM
Excellent work.:buttrock:

06 June 2004, 07:52 AM
really really nice boys...

do some animation with that beast for us an post it...

06 June 2004, 08:30 AM
Great stuff. Really solid effort all round and a well deserved front page.

Well done.


06 June 2004, 09:26 AM
I like this model more than any Epic Model in the game... awesome work!

06 June 2004, 11:05 AM
awsome model!! :thumbsup:
i just played the character but the skin texture looks kinda too bright in the game. it's not as fleshy as in your screenshots, or the one r0ssr0ss posted. anyone know why this could be? tips and help would be much apreciated. anyway - the model is just "beautiful".

daniel | schyzomaniac

06 June 2004, 11:09 AM
wow, that looks amazing, the map is top-notch!
how many hours did you put in to making that?-model and map

06 June 2004, 11:16 AM
I like this very much, nice detail on the character and its overall impact is quite gruesome! other words, very well done! keep up the great work!:thumbsup:

p.s - wud love to play the character when i upgrade my system in a month or two!...yay!

06 June 2004, 12:31 PM
I think I dated her............

Great model!

06 June 2004, 02:39 PM
Very nice!!!:thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 04:51 PM
truly stunning... whatever he's going up against doesn't stand a chance :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 04:56 PM
That looks really great, thanks for sharing!

06 June 2004, 05:47 PM
I'm using it right now!:applause:

06 June 2004, 06:18 PM
daaarn thats nice... wow

06 June 2004, 06:19 PM
Wow ! great work , Very good muscles deformation.... cool and excelent texture painting.:beer:

06 June 2004, 06:44 PM
That's terrific. I really like the texturing.

06 June 2004, 07:17 PM
love the textures, how long did u spend doing the fleshy texture sheet. was it all done from scratch?? what tips do u have for doing textures like that??? any links or advice would be great!!!

06 June 2004, 07:30 PM
Well I'm sure you've heard it plenty of times but the texturing is just awesome.

This looks great!

06 June 2004, 07:58 PM
Amazing texturing!
Amazing model!

just amazing :thumbsup:

Dark Horizon
06 June 2004, 08:34 PM
thanks for the compliments on the texturing everyone

i'll try to answer the questions im seeing...

enzodiac : i've done 1 recent tutorial on texture painting, which can be found on my website, but here is the link

bobydazzlaa : if i had to guess i'd say i probably spent about 2 solid weeks of working on the textures for a few hours each night after work. it was all from scratch. i'd recommend the link to my tutorial if your interested in how i work.

3DKnight : the textures are all handpainted, i did not use any reference for this even though i should get more into that habbit. i use texture overlays to help acheive some of the subtle things that make a texture a bit more realistic, i usually ahve them on a layer and set to softlight blend mode at a low opacity, so you get just the hint of it.

thanks again guys :beer:

06 June 2004, 09:08 PM
awsome job :) :applause:

06 June 2004, 09:22 PM

this makes me want to buy ut 2004, to bad it wont fit on my computer hahaha (only 3 gigs left of 20 wooohooooo)

06 June 2004, 12:16 AM
i used this kind lady in Q3 a lot in the day. it's a joy to see her renewed so greatly :beer: seriously gonna buy that game.

plus i think it's great that game characters are posting work here. mod forums would be more suited, yes but isolated to a given game. a Farcry gamer like me would never of seen it

06 June 2004, 12:36 AM
superb modeling & texturing!! wow... totally awesome... its like I can feel the blood and flesh itself.... great work! :buttrock:

06 June 2004, 02:32 AM
excellent! really detailed stuff!

06 June 2004, 05:28 AM
As with all EXCELENT models i have to pick nits until I find SOMETHING... this one was a hard one but i found it.

In the crouch walk forward the leg polygons fold in on themselves

I had to search for it but i found the error in this model (there is always one)

The only other functional error i could find is the "jaw" cylinder where the rod goes into the body of the cylinder, should be a linear sliding motion only with the body moving to accommodate any realignment (head movement), but the joint where the rod goes in "bends". a cylinder couldn't work that way IRL.

So there’re my 2 nits for the night... love it make another.

06 June 2004, 05:57 AM
absolutely stunning work.. I love the model, but the texturing inspires me... :bowdown: i aspire to be that good one day...

06 June 2004, 09:41 AM
Thanks everybody!

gilley: That suggestion was also made before by two other people, it indeed looks a lot better, so thanks for the crits! You were also pretty much right about the bone count, it's debatable whether or not it actually benefits form that amount of bones in a fast paced real time games, but there is no notable performance drop nor do I really care about people not being able to run it anyway, as I'm just doing this for fun. :)

Ebola: yeah, that's a bit of a shame, but game deformation is a little more limited than high poly stuff, so anything too far from the normal range of motion distorts a bit. So it was either exaggerating the arched back like that and pretend the deformation issue didn't occur, or make the animation less interesting. There are more animation that have quirks like this, the wrists twist around their axis in one of the gesture animations because it was badly rigged, but in the end I felt it helped the model more than restricting the animations. :)

Here are the wires and a shot of the skeleton as requested, for the one who asked it was all done in Max 5. Thanks again! :)

06 June 2004, 11:51 AM
Hey dude,pretty wicked.:buttrock:

06 June 2004, 12:26 PM
Hi SkullboX
i've just downloaded your hellboy tutorial but I can't get it to play!
what codec did you encode it with?

06 June 2004, 10:47 PM
Originally posted by funkyrayuk
Hi SkullboX
i've just downloaded your hellboy tutorial but I can't get it to play!
what codec did you encode it with?

The texture tutorials as well as the texture for this model were done by Jason Sallenbach aka Dark Horizon, he's the one who posted the flats. Not much people read this it seems, but the credit for both laying out the mesh as well as the amazing texture go entirely to him. It was the techsmith codec, though :)

06 June 2004, 11:03 PM
Thats an unbelievable texture...!!!!

5stars looks this to me... :)


06 June 2004, 08:31 AM
It's sooo damn awesome and i like the way you rigged the arms a lot (palms, fingers) - overall superb job.

Keep up the super duper work :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 09:51 AM
Wow, I really like it :buttrock:

06 June 2004, 11:30 AM
texturingskills!! thats all i got to say! :applause:

06 June 2004, 07:16 PM
fabulous work. a specular map in realtime would really make the skin look more wet , especially at the places with flesh showing through. I really love the fingers and nails as well as the size and form of the hands.

06 June 2004, 09:55 AM
Killer man, thats awesome:beer: :buttrock: :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 04:02 AM
I - M - P - R - E - S - S - I - V - E

06 June 2004, 04:56 AM
i am replying to this post second time man its tooo nice image... really impressive ........


06 June 2004, 11:29 PM
Excellent modelling, texturing and movements

The character is really great... magnificent idea

Congrats on your accomplishment , would love to control it in realtime :thumbsup:

06 June 2004, 05:12 AM
wow your texturing is great. I'm speachless on the rendered character. IT'S just wow!

06 June 2004, 08:35 AM
What cam i say more about's awesome.

06 June 2004, 03:58 AM
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: nothing to say~
just great !!!!!

06 June 2004, 07:55 PM
very well done the detail in the skin is amazing. WOW

06 June 2004, 03:31 AM
Great work boys!
Love your muscles jay!

09 September 2004, 05:15 PM
great work man, your texturing work is awesome.:eek:
is all the textures are hand painted or use some references

sorry for my bad english

Dark Horizon
09 September 2004, 06:11 PM
i hand painted the textures in photoshop

09 September 2004, 05:24 AM
I love Quake III Arena! Quake III Arena is not only one game, it is a religion! ;)
Congratulations for excelent work!
I hug ;)

12 December 2004, 11:35 PM
verry good model and texture. animation have some small bugs in plygons to the arm, but is impressive.

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