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View Full Version : Messiah 4 vs Motionbuilder 5


cornel H.
10-13-2003, 10:08 AM
After getting into Motionbuilder for a few months, my enthusiasm is wearing off a bit. I love the realtime stuff, but now after looking at the messiah 4 demo, I'm getting a little envious (this also looks pretty much realtime). The walk designer looks good, dam this is what I need. Dynamics, softbodies - nice. Motionbuiler is second to none regarding the proccessing of mocap data, but for keyframe animation I'm not so sure anymore, if this is the top choice.

My questions:
- Does Messiah have an easy to use speech designer ? What is the workflow to create dialogs ?
- Does Messiah support Lightwaves Endomorphs for facial expressions, or do have to use bones for this?
- Where can I find a full detailed feature list?
- How do you export animations back to lightwave ? Can you plot to skeleton as FK as in Motionbuilder ?

Thanks for your input.

Gene Williams
10-13-2003, 05:10 PM
I have used Messiah for a while now and have used MotionBuilder.
Have to say IMO that Messiah is the champ.
1) New autorig...allows setup of character in just a few
minutes...really.
2) Bring endomorphs right into Messiah using Super Blender...automatically sets up sliders and the audio scrubbing puts MB to shame.
3) Customize your rig to your hearts desire...expression system is awesome.
4) Try animating more that one character in MB...what a nightmare. Messiah is great, no problem at all.

So much more to address that makes Messiah a truly wonderful and fun program to use...try out the demo and see for yourself..you won't be disappointed.

tOd
10-13-2003, 05:32 PM
Originally posted by cornel H.
After getting into Motionbuilder for a few months, my enthusiasm is wearing off a bit. I love the realtime stuff, but now after looking at the messiah 4 demo, I'm getting a little envious (this also looks pretty much realtime). The walk designer looks good, dam this is what I need. Dynamics, softbodies - nice. Motionbuiler is second to none regarding the proccessing of mocap data, but for keyframe animation I'm not so sure anymore, if this is the top choice.

My questions:
- Does Messiah have an easy to use speech designer ? What is the workflow to create dialogs ?
- Does Messiah support Lightwaves Endomorphs for facial expressions, or do have to use bones for this?
- Where can I find a full detailed feature list?
- How do you export animations back to lightwave ? Can you plot to skeleton as FK as in Motionbuilder ?

Thanks for your input.


-There isnt a speech recognition function like in MB. Ive never done lip synch in Messiah directly but Im sure the work flow is alot like other apps in that you scrub and set key frames but with Messiahs keying, dopesheet. and graph editor it would be easier I think than most. It does also support Magpie files.:thumbsup:

-It supports endomorphs and you can use bones with morphs or just morphs or just bones. Really cool to have options

-I think thier website has alot of detail about both products

-You export animation back to lightwave real easily. The connections are pretty good right now. You have messiah connected to LW via the plugin. Load your objects into messiah and set up and animate away. When your ready to send it LW hit F12 and they are there with the animation on the object. It is just point data though and there is no bones transfered back to LW.

hope that helps

3DDave
10-13-2003, 10:40 PM
Messiah deforms the models mesh and outputs that back to the host applicaation. No bones from Messiah, all adjustments to deformations must be done in Messiah.

MB does the opposite, it uses bones from the host application for it's characterization and then exports (from ploting) bone rotations and translations to the host application. This pipeline allows you to work with your applications bones to tweak deformations.

Both systems have their pros and cons, it depends on what your goals are. As far as "Real Time", MB uses a Real Time engine that makes the animation really fast. Messiah is just plain old poly's so your graphics card does all the work. The IK/FK is fast, but don't expect anything like MB with a skin around the skeleton.

MB4 and MB5
Messiah Advance .7, .8, .9, 1.5
Lightwave 7.5

Panikos
10-14-2003, 04:01 AM
Messiah is great, in all aspects, and will grow more.
Its so open that never felt any restriction.

LW 5.0 ... LW7.5
Messiah Plugin ... Messiah Studio

:thumbsup:

Julez4001
10-14-2003, 05:40 AM
2 ways - 1st get endoexport or endosplit

It'sll spit all endomorphs into separate objects

1. Traditional way -- load audio
Use morphs via morph blender or bones for facial animation and dope it all using the graph editor

2. Magpie
(a) Use the gizmo loader to load the giz file that would be generated using Magpie Pro ( I 've done this on 7 characters in a production)

(b) SuperBlender will (or have by now) load data **same as Morphmixer in Lightwave ** to load data file that magie Pro can generate using endomorphs.

lmilton
10-14-2003, 09:37 PM
Originally posted by 3DDave
Messiah deforms the models mesh and outputs that back to the host applicaation. No bones from Messiah, all adjustments to deformations must be done in Messiah.


To clarify this, you're not limited to mesh modification in the host (LW, Maya, etc.). You can also modify motion. This means that it's possible to control the bones in the host. It takes a little more work to set up, but it *is* possible.

Keep in mind that this option isn't mutually exclusive. You can have messiah displace some objects and transform others, all at the same time. It's your call.

-lyle

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