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View Full Version : FXWars! FLAMETHROWER : Klemen Lozar, Freeform Entry


Klemen
07-05-2010, 08:51 PM
I'm joining the challenge. First I'm going to focus on simulating accurate flamethrower behaviour. I will post stuff as soon as I get started.

Klemen
07-06-2010, 09:17 PM
This is my first simulation test. I'm using fumefx with a particle source. I'm not very happy with it at the moment, needs to be more violent and there's to much smoke for my taste.

Here's the simulation:
- Flamethrower test 1 (http://www.klemenlozar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/flamethrower_Lg_Prog.mov)

joshfilms
07-06-2010, 09:42 PM
Good start but I agree with your critique.

-Josh

tool2heal
07-07-2010, 03:03 PM
It actually doesn't look that bad man. I would say to try and keep the particles more clumped together.
as with fumefx when they start getting further apart from each other you start to notice they are individual sources. Also about the smoke, I actually think you have a good amount of smoke, but may you take my suggestion of either birthing smoke only when the fire burns off. (fuel creates smoke) or an even better way to do this, and the way I have been trying. is to use two different events.fire particles that through an age test spawn more particles (smoke) and then just using an afterburn op to tell fumefx that A particles are fire (and possible a little smoke,) and B particles are all smoke.
This way you can also have 2 different radius's. I have come to figure out this right now is the best way to simulate the rapid expansion of a flamethrower in fumefx.

I'm just still trying to figure out if i want to take the time to enter this one.
it's tough competing with all you pro's.

Klemen
07-07-2010, 04:26 PM
Thanks for your comment Josh!

Wow thanks for that suggestion Jason, now that I think about it it makes a lot of sense. I too have noticed that flamethrowers work that way in terms of producing smoke. Only when the fire burns out it creates a lot of smoke. I will try you technique asap!

Thanks again, and be sure to check back here to see whether I'm making any progress or not :)

Oh and I encourage you to enter Jason, you know...It's not the final result that's important, it's the whole path that will take you there. At least that's how I feel.

Carl25
07-07-2010, 07:45 PM
what program did you use for that

Klemen
07-07-2010, 09:01 PM
Here's my second test. Well, It's more like sixth or seventh but it's the second that i'm posting :) I'm still not quite happy with it, I want it too look more violent and threatening. I have no idea where to go with the scene yet either...

- [/url][url="http://www.klemenlozar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/flamethrower_2_Lg_Prog.mov"]Flamethrower test 2 (http://www.klemenlozar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/flamethrower_Lg_Prog.mov)

I'm using 3ds max, Fumefx and After Effects for compositing.

TheGrak
07-07-2010, 09:30 PM
I'm still not quite happy with it, I want it too look more violent and threatening.

Try increasing the initial velocity of the emitted particles to a really high value, then when the particle's age exceeds a second or two, send the particles onto another event where alot of drag and turbulence affect them.

This should allow you to get the violent discharge of liquid while still retaining the character of the flame. If you don't slow down the particles as they get further from the emitter then it feels like there's no friction. Friction is important! :)

*edit - Friction = Air Resistance

tool2heal
07-07-2010, 09:39 PM
It's looking much better with the new smoke, I say increase the smoke amount a little more maybe.
and make it darker cause if you look at footage of flamethrowers you notice that the smoke it creates is basically black. It's best to run the simulation on a gray environment to see better detail.

also, notice that you can see the individual particles at the end? I would suggest either increasing the particle count or maybe the radius slightly just enough to cover that up.

One thing though you need to make sure is that FumeFx will only sim the particles that are actually visible to it. so if you have your particle source set to only display 50% of the particles in the viewport, then FumeFx is only going to sim those 50%
so say im birthing 8000 particles, but I have the source set to display 50% then FumeFx will only run the sim using 4000 particles.

Other then that, I would say maybe increase the opacity of the fire and decrease the color slightly?
cause right now at the start you can see through your flame, and i don't think you should be able to.

And as stated in the previous post. The further away the flame gets the more it expands, which means the more its going to encounter drag, so yes there should be some form of drag. I'm going about this in a slightly different manner which is increasing the size of the flow as it gets further away, but still the same concept.

Good luck.

Klemen
07-07-2010, 10:02 PM
You guys are so helpful, I really appreciate it! You both have very valid points, I guess it's time for more testing :)

Klemen
07-08-2010, 08:23 AM
I put all your suggestions into consideration and I think it's looking much better now. A lot of room for improvement still though. Next I think i'm going to scale up the whole effect a bit. Make it shoot farther away, make it look bigger...

- Flamethrower test 3 (http://www.klemenlozar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/flamethrower_3_Lg_Prog.mov)

Klemen
07-09-2010, 08:17 PM
Here's more progress. At this point I'm just playing with the settings, experimenting with different looks.

- Flamethrower test 4 (http://www.klemenlozar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/flamethrower_4_Lg_Prog.mov)
- Flamethrower test 5 (http://www.klemenlozar.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/flamethrower_5_Lg_Prog.mov)

I can't seem to get rif of those individual particles at the bottom. I'm not that worried about that though, i think it looks sort of cool, kind of reminds me of unburned fuel dripping off. What do you guys think?

tool2heal
07-09-2010, 11:26 PM
I like the way it's looking but I would like to see the remaining area that's being cut off in your video (the smoke rising and dissipation.) Cause that and the interaction of the smoke inside the fire are pretty much the most important parts.

That's what I'm trying to get looking good right now is the way that there's mass amounts of smoke twirling inside along with the fire, and it dissipates quickly until you actually stop the fire. which then just sorta converts to smoke and floats away.
I'm trying to do this by having two systems right now. one smoke and fire, and one just smoke.
Cause i notice to often that with FumeFx you can't get correct interaction between swirling fire and smoke.
But if you fake it by using one fire source and then just pumping it full of smoke with another source it actually works pretty well.

Good work man, your progressing nicely.
I'm still just running sim's and changing settings repeat..repeat.. lol.

good luck man.

Klemen
07-10-2010, 09:04 AM
Post an update dude, I'm currious to see how that system of yours looks :)

I won't be posting anything new for about 10 days...going on vacation. I hope i'll be able to catch up with you guys once i get back, if i don't get discouraged by all your progress :)

Good luck everybody!

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