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bigquix
06-24-2010, 08:29 AM
Hi friends

I've been trying to find a way to use hair on a particle system in max (like the method used in XSI for this add : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H22QvGq5m7s )
but after investigating a lot I found that apparently there is no way to do it with the native tools in max; the reason being "hair & fur" is a world space modifier and it could not be applied to instanced geometries used as the particle system.
I tried to use "mesher" compound objects and assign the hair & fur modifier to it, but it doesn't give a convincing result; specially when the particles are being created. (the hair keeps changing until the last particle is being created)

It would be a great help if you share your suggestions and solutions
thanks

hotknife
06-24-2010, 09:18 AM
Can you not model a single Feather and use that for the particle system ? You can have the feathers spawn and stick to a surface - or have them fly away from the surface. Not sure why you are trying to use hair for this?

Nickolay411
06-24-2010, 02:44 PM
Hey!

You can actually put instance geometry into the Hair NODE! :) MAXhelp for that. But the thing is the hair still has to be stuck to some sort of geometry. :) Maybe inPFLOW create shapes where the feathers would be. Bake those shapes out. (pflow baker script or mesher compound) Then put a max hair and fur on those shapes. So wherever the shapes fly the hair/fur feathers follow. SIM those for dynamics in hair properties and your done. :)

Also check this out.

http://orbaz.com/documentation/particleflowtools/box2/tutorials/TutorialAdv2.html

The box 2 solution gives you full control as to where the particles could go and how they would fly and giving you dynamic bending feathers. :) But this one costs money!

-N

Nickolay411
06-24-2010, 04:22 PM
just re read your post!

If you are having trouble wiht new particles. Use the Bake Script and Hair and Fur each one fo the objects seperately. You will need to know some scripting to get past some of the redundency of simulating each one seperatley when it comes time to sim the hair.

or use animated visibility...

Nickolay411
06-24-2010, 04:31 PM
sorry i keep responding. this has got me interested.

Birthing all your particles at once will solve your issue with mesher compound. But if you need feathers to be birthed at different periods in time well, box 2 lol...


all out of ideas :)

bigquix
06-25-2010, 04:20 AM
Can you not model a single Feather and use that for the particle system ? You can have the feathers spawn and stick to a surface - or have them fly away from the surface. Not sure why you are trying to use hair for this?

that was what I have actually done. I need the hair for close ups; where the details of those fluffy feathers are seen.

bigquix
06-25-2010, 04:36 AM
thanks lostdragoon! you ideas are great!

I came up with almost solution:
I create all of the feather instances at once and put them very far away. I create my particle system and with a script operator, I place each feather onto a particle by geting the transform matrix of each particle and keyframe my objects based on that.
I got the idea from this tutorial from Bobo:

http://www.scriptspot.com/bobo/mxs5/pflow/pflow__MovingObjects.htm

there are a few problems with this method though:
first of all its not very procedural, as the hair modifier is not generated as an instanced modifier.
also it might be very heavy while rendering.
the other problem is image motion blur (I guess); when the objects are moved from a very far distance, they create a very undesirable long motion blur.

I would love to see more creative ideas!

Nickolay411
06-25-2010, 03:17 PM
Ooh! nice dood. I got an idea so your motion blur isnt so long when your birth your particles.

what if on frame zero you birth them really far away like you already did.

then on frame one send out to another event with a new closer position object?

That should give them zero blur since they are changing positions and not moving across the space.

-N

Nickolay411
06-25-2010, 03:17 PM
or you can try animate the motion blur settings! :)

bigquix
06-28-2010, 08:13 AM
Ooh! nice dood. I got an idea so your motion blur isnt so long when your birth your particles. what if on frame zero you birth them really far away like you already did. then on frame one send out to another event with a new closer position object? That should give them zero blur since they are changing positions and not moving across the space

still the objects should be out of the frame, and when bringing them into the frame, the artifact is created

or you can try animate the motion blur settings!

the problem with this method is that particles are not created at one time and their animation will overlap. therefore this method is not useful also ;)

but thank you for posting replies dude!

PsychoSilence
07-01-2010, 03:04 AM
http://www.orbaz.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8033&sid=12afecf8dd349517595f05ddf08066c9

or

http://www.augustolombardi.it/TUTfeathersENG.html

check this out, maybe its what you are looking for :)

kind regards,
Anselm

bigquix
07-02-2010, 07:06 AM
Thanks Anselm

actually I was thinking the other way round: I didn't want to cover objects by particles, I needed to have fur on my particles. As mentioned on the post above yours, I almost find a way. It's slow but it somehow does what I want, but with some difficulties.

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