Any i7 price drop soon?

[sentry66]

i7 930 overclocked to 4.2 ghz or 980 overclocked to 3.9-4.1ghz are the best deals in town right now. There's no point in getting a 950, 965, or 975.

It'll probably be 3-4 months before intel releases 4 core 32nm chips. Prices won't really drop. Instead, old models will be discontinued such as the 920, 965, and 975 as newer models replace them

[earwax69]

mmm... im not sure I will overclock. Maybe a little bit on the stock fan, like 3.2ghz... just for say I push it a little bit but I dont wanna risk anything. I will do lots of long renders on that machine and I dont want the cpu dying on me in 2 years. even if its not anymore my main computer at that moment.

Cant find the 980, its only the 980x I see at 1099$!!

What exactly is the difference between the 930 and the 860? different socket?

[sentry66]

yeah the 980x is what I meant. Yeah it's pricey, but it's scheduled to be the fastest chip intel sells for the next full year.

I didn't see that your budget is less than $1000 for the full system. Are you building this machine or ordering it from somewhere? You probably should stick with socket 1156 or go with AMD

The i7 860 is the 1156 socket which is different from the i7's 1366 socket. The 930 i7 will be faster than the 860 because of the more advanced platform. The 1366 socket supports i9's which are the gulftown 32nm chips (980x is one) and will be coming out throughout the next year or two so you'll have a possible upgrade path. The 1156 is pretty much dead in the water at this point. There's only 1 last chip scheduled - the 880 in a few months and that's it for the platform. It's dead.

....Bear in mind that early next year intel is going to likely announce a new socket for their "sandy bridge" chips. So far they appear to basically be a gulftown chip but with a new vector instruction set (that'll probably take awhile for software to make use of) and is more power efficient. IMO it's not nearly as exciting as the 1366 architecture was when it was first announced. It'll eventually have 8-core chips 3rd quarter 2011

[earwax69]

Thanks!! Is 3 channels DDR3 will make a difference for RAM oriented software like After Effects?

Here what I got from a sept 2009 post:

`
The memory bandwidth isn't that difference between 3 channels of DDR3-1066 on the 920 and 2 channels of DDR3-1333 on the 860/870.

The 860/870 Turbo Boost to much higher frequencies, so they are actually *faster* than the 920 in a lot of workloads.

Also the 860/870 use less power.

About the only disadvantage is that you won't be able to upgrade an LGA1156 system to the 6-core CPUs that are coming out next year...

[earwax69]

Ok, if I go with a i7 860, any recommendations for a good cheap motherboard and parts?

I will not use SLI or plug tons of hdd, this will be a normal workstation and I dont plan to update it at all.

I dont have access to newegg because im in Japan but I'll probably be able to find all pieces on amazon.jp.

The more I look at it, the more the 860 seem like a good deal. I really like the 3.4ghz single core turbo mode... it will speed After Effects cs4 a lot!

[goldilocks20]

I would strongly suggest you go for a 930 instead of a 860.

If you're currently in Tokyo, you might want to drop by Akihabara to source for good deals.:)

[sentry66]

it's going to be tough to get an i7 setup under $1000. I'm really not sure how much would be saved with the 1156 platform though - is the memory dramatically cheaper? the cpu is only $10 less than the 930 **edit** oh wow, the 1156 motherboards are cheap as hell - $80-140 easy

i7 930 with stock intel heatsink $290
motherboard $160-200
antec sonata III case (comes with a 500 watt power supply and is a decent case) $120
geforce GTS 250 $115
hard drive $70-100 (though there's some really good 250 gig drives out there for $45)
DVD drive $25
6 gigs memory $150
Windows ?? - $100-150? maybe you already have a copy that you'll transfer?
--------------------------------
= $900-1150 or so


even still, the 860 and 930 are extremely close in speed overall when you compare the benchmarks

[gawl126]

The i7 920 and 930 are pretty cheap at Microcenter. If you have one near you, then great.

i7 920 - $169.99
http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0302727

i7 930 - $199.99
http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0331303

[sentry66]

holy cow that's a great price on the 930, but too bad it's for local pickup only

I just bought mine 2 weeks ago and already installed it, otherwise I would have gotten it from them for sure and saved $95...if there was one even in my state

That's not going to help him though if he's in japan right now

[imashination]

Thanks!! Is 3 channels DDR3 will make a difference for RAM oriented software like After Effects?

Basically, no.

[gawl126]

holy cow that's a great price on the 930, but too bad it's for local pickup only

I just bought mine 2 weeks ago and already installed it, otherwise I would have gotten it from them for sure and saved $95...if there was one even in my state

That's not going to help him though if he's in japan right now

Wow, I didn't know he was in Japan. I just read the topic and his first post and put in my response. I will need to pay more attention next time.

[earwax69]

Thanks for all the replies!!

Well...

i7 860 - 2.8ghz - 3.4ghz in turbo mode, 95w, 261$

i7 930 - 2.8ghz - 3.06ghz in turbo mode, 130w, 281$

Then, the 860 is clearly winner for the turbo mode only. There still a lot of single threaded processes in the softwares I use.

Still I will not be able to update later for a 1366 socket cpu. I dont think 6 cores cpu will be cheap until end 2012 though. And are we sure the good deals will be on 1366 at that moment?

Now i wanna compare the price of RAM...

Look like 2gb of ddr2-667 is 27$ here and 2gb of ddr3-1333 is 53$. Cheap Buffalo brand. (weird, ddr2-800 is very expensive here..!)

Then 12gb ddr2-667 for 161$ or 6gb of ddr3-1333 for 159$!!

[earwax69]

My mistake, I was confuse... 1157 is not supporting ddr2 memory at all. My bad.

Then its ddr3 all the way, damn... ddr2 was way more cheap.

ddr3 memory here is like 53$ for 2gb. look like I'll be stock with 6gb.

[imashination]

Then, the 860 is clearly winner for the turbo mode only. There still a lot of single threaded processes in the softwares I use.

Hmm, but do consider you can spend 60 seconds overclocking the 930 up to 4ghz with all 4 cores active at the same time.

[earwax69]

Hehehe, on stock fan? Also I've read somewhere that the 930 is not the best overclocker... but yes, I could easily push it to 3.4ghz without any stability issues.

LGA1366 specs:

Asus P6T - 195$
i7 930 - 281$
case: SCY-T33_BK: 38$
6gb (3x2gb) Buffalo ddr3-1333 - 162$
HEC psu - WIN+ 550W HEC-550TE-2WX - 59$
HGST (hitachi) 500gb SATA300 7200 - 42$
GPU: GTS250 512mb - 107$

Price: 884$

LGA1156 specs:

Asus P7H55-M PRO - 98$
i7 860 - 261$
case: SCY-T33_BK: 38$
6gb (3x2gb) Buffalo ddr3-1333 - 162$
HEC psu - WIN+ 550W HEC-550TE-2WX - 59$
HGST (hitachi) 500gb SATA300 7200 - 42$
GPU: GTS250 512mb - 107$

Price: 767$

[sentry66]

...well I'm running my 930 rock solid at 4.2 ghz at 1.35 vcore with hyperthreading on hovering around mid to high 70 degrees C when batch rendering and it wasn't hard to do at all.

I can run 4.4-4.45ghz as long as hyperthreading is turned off or I don't use all 8 threads.

I'm sure there's been better chips for overclocking over the years, but the 930 and all i7's IMO don't seem lazy about overclocking. Seems to be equal to the 860 at least. IMO the motherboard, ram, and heatsink will determine how easy either chip is to overclock.

[goldilocks20]

Agreed with the HT turned off or don't use all 8 threads part.

Anyway I always try to keep my CPU running below 50 degree celsius to keep it working smoothly and in a way to prolong its lifespan.

[sentry66]

yeah, under 50c is ideal, but so far people have been running high overclocked i7's for almost a year and a half now so they seem to be up to the task of handling the hot temps.

I figure if the chip died, it'd probably be about time to upgrade anyway to an i9 or sandy bridge - if they're 1366 compatible.

My overclocked systems in the past always outlasted their usefulness and were ran hard

[earwax69]

Hey Imashination, this is the monster you got on your motherboard?

http://kakaku.com/search_results/?c=&query=TTC-NK85TZ&category=&minPrice=&maxPrice=&sort=popular&rgb=&shop=&act=Input&l=l

[CKPinson]

The absolute highest you're going to get the 920 on stock heatsink and fan is 3.0 ghz and even then it runs hot under full load and ppl have said that Prime 95 puts more stress on the CPU under full load then rendering but I found that to be false. When I rendered Real Temp shows 100% CPU usage and temps reach 60 O/c to 2.8... close to 2.9 so I imagine 3.0 would be the safest bet. 4.0 would push your temps well over 70 if not 80 which will shorten the life of your chip!

[earwax69]

Then, what you propose for get an healthy 3.4ghz? just change the heatsink?

If I go the overclocking way, I'll get the Antec 900 case + Titan fenrir, it should help a bit!

I just wonder if a 600mhz boost is really worth 150$ more.

[earwax69]

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2010/04/12/new-socket-to-replace-lga1366-due-in-2011/1

Well, that reduce the future of a lga1366 board quite a bit. The next generation of intel chips will not be compatible with either the 1156 and 1366 and I dont think I will jump in the 6-cores i7 wagon anyway.

I'll get the 860, save 150$ on the board, spend it on more ram and be done with it.

Thanks for all your advices!

[sentry66]

right, it's been rumored for a very long time now that intel is likely going to switch sockets with the next breed of chips, but that doesn't mean they won't offer a 1366 compatible version, just like how you can get i7's for the 1156 platform even though they were introduced for the 1366. They've said they're sticking with their "tick-tock" strategy which sounds like they're going to do exactly that.

[earwax69]

Thanks Sentry66, yeah it would be wiser to go 1366 but I dont plan to upgrade it at all. When the time to get a new comp come, I'll just keep that one for renders.

One last question; are you guys disabling the page file??

[sentry66]

no. I wouldn't disable the pagefile unless I was running at least 24 gigs of memory. Whatever amount of physical memory you're comfortable running, you'll need at least twice as much ram to comfortably turn off virtual memory.

I always try to disable the pagefile on the C drive and make a big one on another drive.

To see how much virtual memory you're currently using, launch the task manager, go to the processes tab, then in the view menu select "select columns" and check Virtual Memory size and you'll see that for roughly every meg of physical memory being used, almost the same amount is used up as a page file.

[earwax69]

There is no "Virtual Memory size" in my columns... im under vista 32 right now, hopefully for not long.

maybe memory paged pool? or Virtualization?

Anyway I'll follow your advice and leave it or optimize it. I was also wondering if placing my OS on a 32gb ssd disk would help while working... I dont care booting time but I really want to suppress any waiting time on this machine. After Effects often hang for a while, cleaning up its memory, and its really driving me mad. Of course with 8gb of ram and a 64bit system, it will be better. Still I want to optimize to more I can. That Buffalo 32gb is 80$, quite cheap. Do you think it will speed up my work?

[sentry66]

Oh weird, I would think the Virtual Memory Size was in vista's task manager after you select the check box which is usually 2nd from the top on the right side after selecting "select columns"

For sure manually set the lower and max limit to be the same so the OS doesn't fragment your VM. If you end up needing more virtual memory than what you selected, the OS will still expand it. There's probably no specific rule, but I usually set it to be higher than my physical memory and round up to the nearest doubled digit (4096, 8192, 16384, etc)


SSD's are so nice and you no longer defrag the drive, but at the same time I can't say it's really the massive change everyone says it is. I mean, sure the machine boots like 10 seconds faster and launches apps 1-3 seconds faster...but so? I have a 80 gig intel X-25m and have run intel's SSD optimizer software

When I take a 300 mb maya file and put it on my SSD drive, it takes 15 seconds to load. When I put it on my 2 year old 7200 rpm drive, it still takes 15 seconds to load...I'm not really seeing the massive speed benefit in terms of working with 3D files.

I ended up putting my page file on a traditional drive instead of my SSD because of the concern for wearing out sectors with the constant access and overwriting issues SSD's have that normal drives don't. I did compare it to having the page file on the SSD and I didn't notice any performance difference.

[earwax69]

Ok, question:

http://translate.google.ca/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.scythe.co.jp%2Fcase%2Fscy-t33.html&sl=ja&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8

Here is the case I will get, pretty good I feel for the 38$ price. I wanna add 1 more fan, should I put a 14cm fan on the top, blowing out, or a 12cm fan on the side, blowing in?

[sentry66]

I'd absolutely do the fan on top blowing up. The exhaust fans will naturally pull air in from the side and front.

If you're going to use the stock intel cooler, that'll also pull air in from the side vents

IMO putting the side fans on is a little more controversial. They'll force more outside air in, but at the expense of turbulence - which you'll already have from the stock intel fan anyway.

Overall the side fans will help, but you won't get as much benefit from them as the exhaust fans.

[imashination]

If youre only going to buy one. fit the large top mounted exhaust fan blowing out and reposition the included fan as an intake at the bottom front.

[earwax69]

Hey thanks again Sentry66 for the fast answer!!

ha damn, I was watching those ssd comparisons on youtube and the seeing photoshop boot in 6sec was quite impressive. Bah... maybe it was already cached.

Ok, I'll skip the ssd for now, if its not making me work faster, I dont really care the faster boot time. Its good to get a real life feedback!

I will get a 140mm top fan. It's exactly what i was thinking... better blowing out the rising heat!
I hope a 900rpm fan will be enough. The one I want is a bit expensive (16$) but very silent.

[sentry66]

hey no problem :)

[earwax69]

Imashination - Its true, it doesnt make sens to have the intake just under the exhaust. At the front bottom it will also cool the drive (only one im afraid).

Cant wait to get all the parts at start building it, its like playing lego again!!

[earwax69]

Sorry, me again!!

I was planning to get a 550w PSU for my comp but I wonder if its not gonna be a bit tight for overclocking. I could get a 700w PSU for 10$ more. I only got a 8600gt.

I am also gonna get a Kabuto SCKBT-1000 cooler for the cpu. just 27$ here in japan. (its 42 on newegg!) It have nice reviews and its silent.

Is the thermal paste is usually shipped with the cooler?

[imashination]

For the sake of a cheeseburger and fries, get the 700w. Heatsink/fan kits almost always come with the gunk, but i'd ask.

[sentry66]

yeah usually heatsink coolers come with thermal paste, but you might want to double check anyway. You'll be glad you got it. $27 for a reliable 30-40% speed increase is a no-brainer IMO

A 550 watt power supply is perfectly fine if you're not running one of the power hungry graphics cards. Even overclocked, you'll probably only run about 450 watts at peak with the 8600 card. $10 is so little though for giving you the capability of running a modern card. If it were me I'd do it.

[earwax69]

10$, thats a big cheeseburger!! ;P Maybe a windows 7 whopper?

Ok 700w it will be.

Here are the updated spec:

Intel i7 860.............................................................261$
Cpu cooler: Scythe Kabuto SCKBT-1000...............27$
MSI p55m-gd45.....................................................84$
Case Scythe SCY-T33-BK.....................................38$
Umax Cetus ddr3 4gb............................................105$
HEC psu - WIN+ 700W HEC-700TE-2WX..........70$
HDS721010CLA332 1tb SATA300 7200..............65$
140mm fan - Scythe SM1425SL12L.......................14$


Total........................................................................664$


Yep, the thermal compound is include in a little bag.

[sentry66]

yeah, that should be a nice system.

Actually if I were buying renderfarm computers right now, that's a really nice template for a low cost yet fast machine. The only thing I'd change in the case of a purely rendering machine would be to up the ram and bump down the hard drive and video card.

[earwax69]

I know the RAM is low right now but I will buy another 4gb soon enough. How fast will depend on how After Effects react to the 64bit system. I got few HD projects coming this summer anyway... I'll probably get it then.

I would like the i7 system to work with ddr2 Ram though for a render machine...that would reduce the price by half. Still its amazing that you can get such a machine for 600$! All the computers I bough were over 899$ in the past. (mostly Dell crap)

[sentry66]

Yeah, don't forget the price of the OS unless you have that taken care of already.

[earwax69]

It is, I got a free upgrade to win7 home premium. I hope it'll be enough for my needs.

Thinking changing the Kabuto cooler for a Mugen 2.

Here the Kabuto with it top fan:
http://www.modreactor.com/images/stories/reviews/cebit_2009/day_3/scythe/12.jpg



And here the tower Mugen 2 with a side fan, which you can put on any sides you want:
http://www.overclock.net/attachments/air-cooling/113214d1245730790-scythe-mugen-2-information-center-club-img_0847.jpg



Here my case:
http://blog-pcparts.coneco.net/image/coneco46343/4b82711196a20o0400040010424832568.jpghttp://img16.shop-pro.jp/PA01092/237/product/17901609.jpg


The best thing for air flow I think would be to put the mugen 2 fan at the bottom, blowing from down to up, pushing the hot air into the top fan of the case. But I might be wrong.

The kabuto on the other hand, would take air from the side trap and blow it on the cpu and the surrounding mainboard.

then 3 options;

- Mugen blowing from bottom in the top fan,
- Mugen blowing from front in the rear fan (would probably have a better alignement)
- Kabuto blowing on the cpu and board.


Here the board:
http://i.neoseeker.com/p/Hardware/Motherboards/Socket_1156/msi_p55m_gd45_profilelarge.jpg



There is 2 pci-e, (16x-4x), I wonder if I can put the graphic card on the bottom pci-e and still get 16x or if they are locked, up 16x, bottom 4x...

[gawl126]

Check out this air cooling guide for more info on different heat sinks and fans.

http://www.overclock.net/air-cooling/565007-guide-air-cooling-questions-answered-here.html#post7040970

My set up is a Megahalem + 2 S-Flex F fans. And for whatever heat sink you get. I'd put it in a push-pull configuration sending hot air out the back.

EDIT: More heatsink reviews http://www.frostytech.com/top5heatsinks.cfm

[sentry66]

I just put a mugen heatsink on a computer at work. Nice heatsink and works really well, but tricky to install. The instruction steps kinda suck. I found having the motherboard overhang over the table so I could get a screwdriver behind the motherboard while holding the heatsink worked best.

Anyway, any of those setups will work well. Figuring out which heatsink or config is nitpicking over 1-3 degrees C. I'd probably aim the heatsink at whatever exhaust fan is actually moving more air.

IMO the mugen will be better

[earwax69]

Cool! Mugen 2 then. Sold!

Hey nice read Gawl, that made me notice that the airflow will be negative in my case if I put that big 140mm top exhaust fan.

[sentry66]

yeah, IMO negative pressure is way better than positive pressure

[earwax69]

Yeah? point is I was worry about the dust... Its very dusty here.

Here the choices I've got:

Exhaust : 1 rear 120mm (38cfm) + PSU fan
Intake : 1 front 120mm (40cfm)

or

Exhaust : 1 rear 120mm (38cfm) + 1 top 140mm (60cfm) + PSU fan
Intake : 1 front 120mm (40cfm)


First choice is quite balanced, second is more powerfull but less balanced.
I dont know how much the PSU can push air, I didnt find any specs.

The front fan is really clutered, there is a plastic enclosure just in front. Look very bad for a nice draft.


http://www.scythe.co.jp/images/scy/scy-t33/scy-t33-300na2.jpghttp://www.scythe.co.jp/images/scy/scy-t33/scy-t33-300bay.jpghttp://www.scythe.co.jp/images/scy/scy-t33/scy-t33-300fr-fan.jpg



EDIT: "Its very dusty here" I should add that we are very careful with the cleaning but its just that the air in this city (Osaka) carry a lot more stuff than the air in Canada. We get all the sand from China's deserts, blowing over the Sea of Japan. Both my daughter and me started having asthma since we are here. Its not very good for computer either, I got to airspray every 2 months.

[sentry66]

with negative pressure, you can always take off some of the 5.25 bay covers or get some vented ones and air will come in through there too at the top of the case

or if you have room, you can mount a fan on the inside with some zip or twisty-ties to suck air in from the top.


it's weird, I've found cases seem to get more dust with positive pressure setups than with negative pressure. Then again, I never use dust filters and use a bottle of canned air every few months or so.


Probably off subject, lately I've gotten into the habbit of mounting a 80mm fan on the outside of the power supply to help suck hot air out. I just fasten them on with a long screw or twisty-tie. I figure as many power supplies that I've seen go bad over the years, half went bad because their internal fan stopped. I just like having another layer of redundancy cooling, especially with the high watt ones used these days.

[earwax69]

Hey not a bad idea to put a fan at he place of few useless 5.25 bays.

Here the scythe version of this concept. http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/acc/073/scbk2000_detail.html

I cant find it in store though... not big deal. It should be easy to make a homemade version if I need something like this!

Its really cool to make a case strategy!

As for adding a fan to the PSU, im not there yet really... the PSU I want have good reviews anyway, I'll cross my fingers!

Im still curious if you would put 2 or 3 fans... 1 intake/1 exhaust or 1 intake/2 exhausts. ??

[imashination]

If its any help, this is what i put together last week. All fans set to low except the cpu, gfx and psu fans which are automatic.

http://www.3dfluff.com/files/mashi7air.jpg

[earwax69]

Yeah it help, thanks. I recognize the 900. I notice that you put the cooler fan on the top as exhaust. That would make the heat directly dissipate in the top fan. Good idea.

I just got 1 fan enclosure at the front, and its obstructed quite a lot. Would you recommand me to put another fan in the 5.25 bay area with a slight mod? Or just use one of the 2 fan holes on the side of the case. I think adding side fans might disturb the airflow but probably help anyway, especially with your top cooler exhaust idea.

Do you use filters in your new comp?

[earwax69]

Just found that I could get the Antec 200 for the same price as the SCY-T33-BK/140mm fan.

Then Antec got already 2 fan, louder but with 2 speed. Its ugly but the front vent is better.

The SCY-T33-BK hd enclosure look better though.

I notice that the Scythe one will put the psu fan down, the Antec up. :curious:

SCY-T33-BK
http://blog-pcparts.coneco.net/image/coneco46343/4b82711196a20o0400040010424832568.jpg

Antec 200
http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad302/superinggo1234/200_O.jpg

[earwax69]

Is it possible to control the fan speed via software? regulating the electric current via the motherboard...

[sentry66]

yeah, there's software that you can set up to kick the fans in higher when the temps get hotter. Speedfan is one program.

I usually just leave the fans at 100% myself though

[earwax69]

But you need special fan no? not normal fans...

[imashination]

If theyre simple molex connectors then no, you set them manually.

Also small error on my diagram, the cpu fan is at the bottom pushing air through the heatsink, but still in the same direction, this is a very important detail.

[earwax69]

Yes but at the bottom it will push hot air from the card no? at the top, like your drawing, it would suck the the air with a wider range, getting some from left to right too. I dont know really... it make sens in my head!

Ive just configured an i5 render node for only 370$! great stuff really.

[imashination]

Yes but at the bottom it will push hot air from the card no? at the top, like your drawing, it would suck the the air with a wider range, getting some from left to right too. I dont know really... it make sens in my head!

Ive just configured an i5 render node for only 370$! great stuff really.

The gfx card has little impact on any heat reaching the cpu. Its *always* much better to blow air through something than suck it out the back, this makes a massive difference.

Hold your hand out in front of you and blow gently, you can feel it right? Now suck as hard as you can. You wont feel a thing. Sucking pulls in air from the side which for cooling is very very bad.

[earwax69]

Quite convincing I admit. I'll do the same if you permit.

Im going to order all the parts tonight :buttrock:

[evanfotis]

If its any help, this is what i put together last week. All fans set to low except the cpu, gfx and psu fans which are automatic.



this diagram is quite interesting.
would you mind sharing the specs of this rig, as I'm in the process of building a new win7 machine?

[imashination]

All yours, its hardly top secret ;-) Still going 100% rock solid right now. The only thing I will say is that this motherboard doesnt seem to like sleep mode, so youll either have to shut it down or hiibernate.

ps. ive updated the airflow diagram so its more accurate, dont want anyone sticking the fan on the wrong side.

[evanfotis]

All yours, its hardly top secret ;-) Still going 100% rock solid right now. .
..OK.. have u posted the specs somewhere which I've missed?
I mean what goes in the rig, which mobo, cpu, gfx, ram, hdd etc?

[imashination]

My recent build,

New parts:
Gigabyte x58a UD3R motherboard
i7 930 cpu
12 gigs (6x2) Corsair XMS3 PC3-12800C9
Titan Fenrir V2 cooler
Radeon 5870 (Sapphire vapor X)
128 gig Corsair c300 SSD

Old parts
Seasonic 600watt psu
Antec 900 case
2x pioneer dvdr
4x 1tb drives
win 7 64bit
Apple 30"
Dell 24"

[evanfotis]

thanx,
do u still find 12gigs the sweet spot price/performance?
Is there any chance ram prices will drop shortly to meet last years levels, so a 6 slot mobo could fill up with 24gbs?

[imashination]

I think 12g is the nice spot at the moment. 6 gig would actually do most people perfectly fine, but thats the level where you could run out if you had a lot of apps open. stick 12 gigs in and youve got a very nice machine. 24 gigs would need 4 gig chips, which would be highly unlikely to let you overclock to 4ghz

[earwax69]

Another question: Do you absolutly need good RAM for overclocking the cpu? Is it matter if I got cheap ram? Most brand here are hardly known (buffalo, CFD elixir, Umax Cetus...) and the Corsair is 30$ more. PC3-12800, PC3-10600...

[sentry66]

it's not absolutely needed, but it gives you more options.

For instance my work machine uses crucial 1333mhz ram, but because of where the overclocking is sitting with the BLCK, I'm only able to get 1038mhz out of the memory because the next bump up in memory speed brings it up to over 1400mhz which is higher than the memory is rated.

On my home system I use nicer corsair dominator 1600mhz memory and so I get more access to high memory speeds and could handle the 1400mhz just fine. Actually it somewhat depends on the memory and motherboard anyway because every clock setting I do with my home machine I seem to get 1600mhz or just under it.

having memory go from 1038mhz to 1600mhz makes about a 3-5% overall performance difference, but you quickly run into diminishing returns with the higher speed memory - not to mention it getting stupid expensive. The CAS rating makes a slight difference as well. The lower, the better

[earwax69]

Im lost... sorry. The only reason you overclock the ram is to get a little speed boost out of the ram? or is it a prerequisite for overclock the cpu?

Can I overclock my cpu whil leaving the ram well alone? In this case cheap or good memory will have absolutly no influence on my cpu overclock.

[evanfotis]

I think 12g is the nice spot at the moment. 6 gig would actually do most people perfectly fine, but thats the level where you could run out if you had a lot of apps open. stick 12 gigs in and you've got a very nice machine. 24 gigs would need 4 gig chips, which would be highly unlikely to let you overclock to 4ghz
I see..
Does it not seem silly somehow that 2day a 12gb kit -the one you mentioned above- can be obtained with almost double the price of a 12gb kit I got last year?..(not the same of course)

Since the tech guys at the shop, do not endorse Over-clocking and will not O/C any cpu over 12% of its original speed (up to 3.1Ghz in this case)
is there any elaborate hands-on guide for newbies for OverClocking the 930 to 4Ghz? (including cooling, ram etc tweeks)

[redpandafire]

Intel Xeon X3440. ;)

Sorry, I didnt read all 5 pages. If you've already bought your i7 860 then its cool. But you seemed to be the kind to need a price squeeze and the Xeon X3440 is basically an i7 860S. Save $40 from the 860 and get the same chip with a few Mhz less, but nothing an OC tweak can't fix.

Its currently my price/performance sweet spot for anybody looking for 1156 and hyperthreading.

Also, bleh to the 1366 vs 1156 debate. A CG artist does use Tri-SLi and triple channel isn't even supported properly. Who really cares whats futureproof when in the future you KNOW your going to buy a new computer anyways.

Buy for the present. Save some cash now. Use it and then upgrade when the need arises again.

[sentry66]

Im lost... sorry. The only reason you overclock the ram is to get a little speed boost out of the ram? or is it a prerequisite for overclock the cpu?

Can I overclock my cpu whil leaving the ram well alone? In this case cheap or good memory will have absolutly no influence on my cpu overclock.


No you don't need to overclock the ram. You want to run the memory at the speed it's rated at. However, as you overclock the BLCK, that essentially overclocks the whole system, including the ram. So the ram's speed has to be bumped back down to stay at it's rated speed.

It bumps the ram down based on a increment numbers and there's only so many numbers and each one is a huge jump. If you use 1333 ram, you might sometimes get stuck having to use a really low ram speed because the next higher ram speed is too high for the memory. If you have faster memory that can do say 1600mhz, then you have more speeds to choose from to keep the ram speed as high as possible without being stuck at the slowest memory speed possible.

And the memory speed does have a slight impact on your overall speed


The only type of cpu overclocking that has zero impact on the speed of anything else is increasing the multiplier, but usually that ability is locked by intel except on their extreme edition processors. Turbo mode bumps the multiplier up 2 notches as long as possible to increase the clock speed. On some motherboards, you can use those 2 higher multipliers permanently, while on others you can't and are stuck with the max multiplier intel locked the cpu to.

BLCK x multiplier = ghz
The default BLCK is 133
Usually people take the BLCK up anywhere from the stock 133 up to a max usually around 211

[sentry66]

is there any elaborate hands-on guide for newbies for OverClocking the 930 to 4Ghz? (including cooling, ram etc tweeks)

There's a bunch of guides if you search google.
Every motherboard is different though and everyone has their own approach.

I tend to move more aggressively than some people with overclocking. IMO all i7's can sustain 3.6ghz with a reasonable aftermarket heatsink, so I tend to jump right into a speed around there first and get a feel for the temperatures using Speedfan or RealTemp while running either prime95 or the Intel burn test to load the cpu. The intel burn test is brutal in maximum mode and will load the cpu and ram harder than anything you can possibly do. I sometimes run prime95 on top of it just to ensure the cpu is constantly floored between burn sessions

Once I get a feel where things are at, I'll make some adjustments and probably try bumping things up to 3.7 or 3.8 ghz. If your computer freezes when running prime95 or the intel burn test, chances are your vcore isn't high enough to sustain that clock speed. As long as you have some headroom with your temps (say high 70's - mid 80's C at most), then it's ok to add more voltage. If temps are already on the high side and you're locking up, then you need to either get better cooling and/or lower the vcore.

You'll eventually zero in on a stable clockspeed with reasonable temps. At this point I'll load up a heavy poly model in maya and have it spin a few million polygons around on top of prime95 or intel burn test and let the machine do that for a couple hours or so, just to verify the machine will handle everything I can throw at it.

What's going to matter is if your motherboard's auto vcore settings edge on the low side or high side and offset the auto values accordingly.

90% of everything is adjusting the BLCK and vcore settings. A couple of the other voltage settings you might bump up a notch or two when you start getting into the high 3ghz's. You always need to double check that your memory is running at a speed that's within what it's capable of since the auto memory speed setting doesn't always work on some motherboards

[earwax69]

Alea Jacta Est, The die is cast. Thanks RedPanda, I've got the 860 here with me. Didn't know about the Xeon at all but here the price is 260, exactly like the 860. All is well.

Hey Sentry66, thanks, its a lot more clear now. Here what I ordered yesterday night;

CFG w3u1600hq-2g (DDR3 PC3-12800 2gbx2) (ddr3-1600)
The timing is 9-9-9-24 I think... pretty standard.

The comments were ok for that ram, I just hope it will fit well with my MSI board.

I plan to use the MSI OC GENIE feature to do my overclock automatcally. I hope it will achieve acceptable results. If I cant get enough mhz, I will dig a bit deeper and learn my way to overclock it the old school way!

Anyway, thanks for your support! very appreciated.

[earwax69]

Soooo frustrating!! Ive got all the parts for my built except the case and I just received a email saying they are out of stock.

If I get the Antec 300 at the place, it already have a 140mm fan. I will be stuck with 2 140mm fans. No way I could fit that second 140mm fan in the front?? I guess it's tight fit for a 120.

[sentry66]

yeah, I know what you mean. I had the same thing happen to me with the case I wanted being out of stock and not getting one for a few days after I already had everything. I wanted to get started, so I put everything together and installed windows with the motherboard just sitting on the anti-static sheet with the heatsink etc on with one of the fans just blowing air over the whole thing.

[earwax69]

hehehe I guess its understandable if you have to wait 2-3 weeks... Im ok for wait a bit as I started my project on my old comp. Like I said before, if you got a good screen, a good chair and a wacom, it make working on a slow computer a lot more bearable.

[redpandafire]

If I get the Antec 300 at the place, it already have a 140mm fan. I will be stuck with 2 140mm fans. No way I could fit that second 140mm fan in the front?? I guess it's tight fit for a 120.

The Antec 300 is an excellent case. I've been using it for two years now and each time I have to do maitenance, upgrade, or clean the fans, I always wonder how on Earth I lived without it. The way things are placed, the thought behind how they compartmentalize the hardware, and the beautiful look is just perfect for me! If you have a spare 140mm fan, then have it as stock if/when your current fan begins to wheeze and make noises (mine never has *crosses fingers*)

About OC. For my Xeon that is basically the same core you have, all I did was increase Core Frequency (your mobo might call it BCLK or base frequency, whatever) and left everything else automatic. So now its at a modest 3.3Ghz at stock voltages without any frustrations and runs absolutely solid (Linx 30 passes, Prime95 10 hours). The Nehalem architecture is quite frightening.

You may be required to disable these three features: Intel Speedstep, Intel Turbo, C1E support, and Intel C-STATES.

Make sure to get a good 120mm fan cooler if your overclocking. Don't be a dummy like me and throw away $30 on a 92mm fan that pushes less than half the air a larger fan would. Its currently the only thing limiting me. :( Worst part about it? The 120mm fan + cpu heatsinks are $5 more. -.- FAIL

[earwax69]

thanks for the advices Redpanda...

There is already a 120mm fan on the Mugen 2 cooler, it cold achieve better scores with a second fan though, in a push-pull situation. I am not sure that Im gonna push the cpu too far though because it is my workstation for the next year and reliability is a priority. I dont want my cpu or mobo dying on me in the middle of a contract.

Intel Turbo... you mean the turboboost mode?? I was hoping to keep that one...

[redpandafire]

thanks for the advices Redpanda...

There is already a 120mm fan on the Mugen 2 cooler, it cold achieve better scores with a second fan though, in a push-pull situation. I am not sure that Im gonna push the cpu too far though because it is my workstation for the next year and reliability is a priority. I dont want my cpu or mobo dying on me in the middle of a contract.

Intel Turbo... you mean the turboboost mode?? I was hoping to keep that one...

Nice! The Mugen 2 is a great cooler. Its a shame you won't OC that lovely i7 860, because it could really do some magical things with a higher clock!

I just realized this, but we almost live in the same city. :surprised

[sentry66]

Yeah you really shouldn't have a problem setting it at 3.5-3.7ghz permanently, but I can understand if you don't have any sort of spare computer. Just keep the max temps under 80c and you'll be fine.

[earwax69]

Ho, I totally plan to overclock it, it's for that I got the Mugen 2. But probably not until 3.8 thats all.

I just realized this, but we almost live in the same city. :surprised

Hu? Im in Osaka now... Japan. I've quit montreal 3 years ago.

[earwax69]

Ok, it's up and running. I did make a mistake while installing the heatsink (instructions are terrible) and it's a bit shaky, not enough pression. It was quite a nightmare to install really. All hail push pins!

Now I just installed Core Temp and RealTemp and my Idle temp is around 42.

I did not install the front fan yet.

EDIT: shit, yeah its all wrong. Run Prima95 and it immediately went over 95... I shuted down. I will put it out, clean the cpu and put it on again.


http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/8320/img1821gg.jpg

[sentry66]

so it hit 95 without a fan? For sure get the fan on there since that's what's going to blow the heat of the heatsink.

yeah, the instructions were horrible

[earwax69]

No no the fan was on the heatsink. The case front fan was not installed.

But its my fault, I installed some bolts upside down and I could not screw the heatsink at full pression. I just finish reinstalling everything, with a bit better cable management, and I will test the temp in few minutes.

pffffff its a lot of job.

Now it look like this.
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/8379/img1832a.jpg

[earwax69]

Haaaa thats better, between 27 and 31 at idle.

between 68 and 71 at full load with prima95.

Is it ok??

This is at stock speed, case open, with top and rear fans at low. No front fan.

[earwax69]

I use Core temp, with a Tj of 99.

Somewhat I am not impress by 70C on load... it's like the stock cooler.

[sentry66]

you can try loading up speedfan. I use both that and real-temp. Speedfan is great because it shows a lot of data and can graph it in realtime. Real-temp is nice because it'll let you know what the min and max temps are. I haven't used core-temp though.

I'm curious what your chipset temps are. If your chipset temps are high and you can find a way to get a fan to cool it off, I've found doing that actually will improve cpu temps by up to 12 degrees C.


70c at load with stock clock is high for that cooler. The temps will get better as the thermal paste sets, but only a couple or so degrees after a few days.

I'm not familiar with that motherboard, but you might be able to reduce the vcore voltage, but it'll depend on where it's at right now. I'd think you'd be able to run a vcore around 1.2 volts at the stock speed. Speedfan will tell you what the vcore is at you're at when you run prime95. The board might be setting the vcore too high at the default clock.


Something to consider experimenting with if possible is flipping your power supply over so the intake fan sucks in air from the bottom case opening - I think it has one right? It's only because you have that fan pulling air in the opposite direction from the other fans.

[earwax69]

Realtemp is around 28-32

Here is a grab of Speedfan:

http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/6512/img1833y.jpg

No, the case have no holes on the bottom for inverse the psu, a shame really. I dont have tools to make it so.

Ok, I'll admit something. I did not clean and reapply the thermal paste, when I separated the heatsink and the cpu, there was too much thermal paste. I putted out the excedent and applied the rest uniformly on the cpu and heatsink with the finger in a plastic bag. Reason is I dont have rubbing alcohol here. Japaneses use something else to disinfect injuries and its not pure alcohol at all. I made sure that only a very thin layer was left on the cpu before adjusting the heatsink.

Maybe its that the problem, I should have reapplied new thermal paste and not use the residue from my last instalation.

Anyway, I'll try some render with lightwave now for fun sake!

[imashination]

Theres nothing wrong with the psu at all, no case has a hole in the bottom, it would be terrible for sucking up all the dust off your floor.

Ok first on the thermal paste. Clean off as much as you can. When you apply it make a simple X cross in the centre, with each leg of the cross 1cm long. Put the heatsink straight down flat onto this, dont pre spread it with your finger or anything else, the goo will spread out all by itself. Go watch this to easy your worries about what happens underneath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyXLu1Ms-q4

When you fit the metal heat sink, it should be absolutely rock hard solidly stable. there wont be any movement in it at all, if there is, its not on right. It should go on so tightly that youre afraid of breaking the motherboard.

How hot the cpu gets under load is largely down to what the motherboard and bios is set to. It will be set to spin the fan up to keep it within a certain temp range. So long as its under 80 at full load its ok.

[earwax69]

Imash, yeah, I will find some cleaning solution (acetone, alcohol, whatever) and start again from scratch because I am not satisfied with the temp I get. Its not bad, 64-68 while rendering, but its not what I expected from this heatsink.

What bother me is that the Mugen is really hard to install neatly. You have put the motherboard upside down, over the heatsink. Its hard to give a balanced pressure.

Look here how the cpu looked when I put out the heatsink... this was with a pea size amount of compound. The stuff I got from Scythe is really liquid...

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/2829/img1830b.jpg
and the heatsink
http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/7527/img1831t.jpg



I will get the some Artic Silver 5, I found it on some online japanese site.

[imashination]

Dont worry about the paste, use whatever you have, the difference in temps between different thermal compounds is negligible. The websites claim up to 5 degrees difference, but thats being generous and is also when comparing to those white fluffy pads.

[earwax69]

Ho ok, I dont think I have a lot left though... I'll check tomorow.

I've read that a lot of people have problem to seat the Mugen 2 rev B perfectly on the cpu... There is no way to know if it's really straight.

[sentry66]

the temps on speedfan all look good, so nothing stands out there.

yeah I didn't think the power supply thing would make a huge deal difference, but only worth experimenting with if it had holes on the bottom like I've seen a lot of cases do.

When I installed my mugen heatsink, I didn't do it upside down like you did. I did it right side up, then slid the whole board over the table just enough to expose one or two of the screw holes, then put the screws in from the bottom. It was a little tricky to put pressure on the screw receiver on the top, but it seemed to work ok. I would get one screw in and tighten it just a little, then do the others. When all 4 were in, I'd tighten them all up bit by bit until they were about as tight as I could comfortably tighten them without stripping the screws.

your thermal paste spread looks fine. It doesn't appear that you used too much, but maybe that can vary from paste to paste. I used OZC freeze paste, which was really stiff and needed to be smeared on with some light pressure and is difficult to spread perfectly even because of how "chunky" it moves. I agree that the paste only makes a couple degrees difference though anyway.

[earwax69]

your thermal paste spread looks fine

Ha yes? damn, I've put out 3/4 of it before reinstalled it. Only left a 0.25mm layer on the cpu. Maybe there is not enough now. Anyway, I'll do the X method next, I'm bound to get enough this time.

Also I noticed strange turbulences between the cheap graphic card and the cpu fan. Where the fan is not cover by the card, air enter straight in it but just below, where the card is, a lot of air is pushed out of the fan. Just like if the fan was in the wrong direction. The problem will become even more obvious when I will instal my bigger graphic card. I think the micro ATX board is just too small to use a bottom to top cpu airflow. Also now the heatsink pipes goes vertically, which is a mistake as the gravity will slow down the pipes internal process.

I will now try a configuration like this guy here;
http://i524.photobucket.com/albums/cc322/silverwolf0/IMG_1795.jpg


Another question: I have only 1 cpufan connector on my motherboard. Is it normal?? It mean that if I add another fan on my heatsink, they will not be synchonize at all. I have a spare 140mm 62cfm fan and was planning to put it on the Mugen with some rubber bands. It will obviously take power from the PSU and not be regulated by the mainboard.

[earwax69]

Just disassembled the heatsink... This was clearly not enough thermal paste.

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/7477/img1835c.jpg
http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/8048/img1836is.jpg

[earwax69]

Nice and easy did the trick!

http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/7660/img1838.jpg

25-28 C on Idle, 48-50 on load.

However I notice that in Real Temp, the cores 1 and 3 are quite hotter than the 2 and 4. 4 degrees more at idle.

Idle : 28 - 25 - 28 - 25

On load its more balanced but still core 1 and 3 are a bit more hot, 1-2 degrees more.

Maybe the paste did not spread evenly on the cpu.

[sentry66]

Nice and easy did the trick!

http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/7660/img1838.jpg

25-28 C on Idle, 48-50 on load.

However I notice that in Real Temp, the cores 1 and 3 are quite hotter than the 2 and 4. 4 degrees more at idle.

Idle : 28 - 25 - 28 - 25

On load its more balanced but still core 1 and 3 are a bit more hot, 1-2 degrees more.

Maybe the paste did not spread evenly on the cpu.

glad to hear it worked out

the temp differences are normal. The cpu isn't perfectly flat and neither is the heatsink. If you lapped the cpu and heatsink, the temps would even out some between the cores.

[nogojoe]

Nice and easy did the trick!

http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/7660/img1838.jpg

25-28 C on Idle, 48-50 on load.

However I notice that in Real Temp, the cores 1 and 3 are quite hotter than the 2 and 4. 4 degrees more at idle.

Idle : 28 - 25 - 28 - 25

On load its more balanced but still core 1 and 3 are a bit more hot, 1-2 degrees more.

Maybe the paste did not spread evenly on the cpu.

That's really too much paste. Paste only exists to fill in what are essentially very small flaws in the heatsink/ihs. The rule of thumb is to use a grain of rice sized paste, and spread it thin with a razor blade.

[earwax69]

Hey Sentry, yeah im very please! I learned a lot in the process too. The Mugen 2 is not an easy beast. I know japaneses enginners can find a better installation system.

Nogojoe, well, as you can see up this page, the grain of rice sized dot spreaded all over the cpu didnt work well for me. My temp were 20C higher. Now this is more likev 3 rice grains and the temp are down. I guess the paste excedent went on the sides of the cpu. It is actually less than what is recommanded in the Mugen 2 manual.


Aaaaanyway, now I got some room to try overclocking. I wonder what I can get with a 20 degrees margin. I'll try later when I get my ssd.

Ho, just a side note... I tried to mimic a push pull configuration by placing a second fan on the heatsink, hold by hand, while running prima95. No difference whatsoever. A push-push side and bottom configuration didnt make any difference too. Strange because people say the Mugen 2 is best used in a push pull manner.

[earwax69]

Ok, I've enabled the OC Genie of my MSI board. Its an automatic overclock. It booted the computer at a whooping 3.7ghz but prime95 did a fatal error and Lightwave render crashed. pffffff what a crap.

Any suggestion? I'll go google on my side.

[imashination]

The amount youve used in your cross image is perfect. Sorry Joe, but youre way off the mark. The old "A grain of rice" amount is a throwback to the old Athlon days where the cpu core die was directly exposed. The area in contact with the heatsink was the size of your small fingernail. These days cpus are packaged up with surface areas 10x larger in contact with the heatsink.

Dont pre-spread it, just draw the cross, smack the heatsink straight down on top and tighten it up. Everything else will take care of itself.

The orientation of pipes in the heatsink makes no difference

There will be turbulence around the fan intake, thats normal, so long as its blowing upwards

The amount of paste in your 'removed' image isnt terrible, but youre right, it could have done with a bit more.

[earwax69]

wouahahahahaha! cant stop laughing like mad!!

Base frequency is 160
ratio 21, I cant change this one, I dont know why.
Memory ratio 5 - 1600mhz
QPI 16 - 5120mhz

and all the rest on auto.
turbo boost ON
C1E and EIST enabled.

its working wonderfully. Now I just wanna know if I should touch the voltage before going to 3.8ghz

This is under full load with prime95.

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/6638/capturejo.jpg

[imashination]

You increase the voltage to gain more stability, at the expense of creating extra heat. Only turn it up if it crashes.

[earwax69]

Haaaa... good to know.

Yeah, at 3.8ghz, prime95 crash after a while and the voltage is already at 1.3xx. Temp still good though just around 68.

I've put down everything back at 3.4ghz, with all Intel features enabled.

At Idle the multiplier is at 9, at load it goes until 22.
1.445ghz to 3.533ghz.

Temp at 58-59 under load. I'll keep it there for now.

Thanks for the support, I've learned quite a lot in the last few days. Now its time to do some wicked 3d projects and give all this a raison d'être!

[sentry66]

most people have had to bump their pll up a point or two and their northbridge voltage up a point to get stability past 3.7 ghz.

Each board and cpu is different though. My work computer at 3.9ghz is solid at 1.24vcore (keeping the speed low for several reasons, even though I'm sure I can hit 4+ghz) while my home machine at 4.2ghz runs 1.35 vcore. That's a huge jump in vcore for that extra 300mhz.

[earwax69]

I just tried a stable 3.8ghz by disabling hyper-threading. But render time become slower than 3.5ghz with HT enabled. Im back at 3.5ghz with HT and TurboBoost.

I guess higher clock speed is cool for gamers but for my CG work, Hyper-Threading give me a clear 15% boost.

[sentry66]

at 3.8 ghz, you were disabling turbo boost right? having it enabled when overclocking that high is a guaranteed crash

[earwax69]

At my first try, no, and it crashed. After disabling all Intel features, it was stable. My problem with the MSI board is that I cannot control the voltage... I can only decide to add some more volt in small increment. The board pump the voltage automatically to fit with the frequency/ratio.

[sentry66]

IMO you wouldn't want an absolute constant voltage anyway. Offsetting the vcore with the +/- keys is the way to go. When the computer is idle, the vcore can drop down and help lower temps than if it was constant and create more of a heatsoak.

Turbo should always be disabled when pushing the system hard. Hyperthreading is optional and will increase temps 5-10 degrees C, but I've been able to run it just fine on the systems I've overclocked so far.

[imashination]

Ive got turbo boost on, ht on, default voltages and all ram slots packed out, I think its far more down to the motherboard youve picked than anything else.

[sentry66]

yeah, I guess I do have turbo on with my 3.9ghz work machine.

My 4.2 ghz home machine I have it off though

[earwax69]

Turbo mode is on here too. 3.6ghz default, and I can see the Turbo boost monitor going to 3.8ghz when using after effects.

Did you guys have Intel C-state enabled? I got all intel features on except that one.

[sentry66]

IMO C-state especially should be left off. It allows Windows to restart your computer if Windows for power conservation if it doesn't like your vcore setting, even if it's completely fine and needed for stability.

It's more of a laptop feature than a desktop thing anyway

[earwax69]

Ho, good then, I'll let it off for sure. I really like the others Intel power saving functions. I cant believe some people are disabling them.

[sentry66]

yeah I keep C1E and speedstep on. Seems to help with temps too with preventing unnecessary heat

[earwax69]

Exactly. And the changes in stepping are marvelously real-time. Just try modeling while checking your temp and frequecy in Real Temp, its impressive. Each time I release the mouse, it go back to 1.5ghz, each time I click and hold, rotating my model, it jump to 3.8ghz.

[earwax69]

Hey, I notice that my cooler fan is always at maximum and its quite noisy, even at idle. I've reduced to 50% with speedfan and its way better but that would not be good under load. Is it not suppose to be automatic? Did the overclock messed up my fan behavior?

How can I adjust my fan speed threshold?

[redpandafire]

Wow, I just bought my computer at the same time as you and we've mirrored each other's steps and questions almost word for word! :argh: (Except at a different message board)

Anyhow, about your fan, I'm told the motherboard controls its speed but you must have a 4-pin connector not the standard 3-pin one. To see, u would have to disconnect the fan attached to your heatsink and check if there are 4 or 3 pins at the connector.

If there are 4, you should be able to go to your BIOS and adjust settings to suite your needs.

Good luck!

[redpandafire]

Also about temps. I was told to test "real" max temps, run Prim95 and select Small FFT's. Let it soak for about 7-9 minutes (enough time to make and enjoy some tea) and then check your temperature with RealTemp.

I have a 3.5Ghz overclock + HT + Turbo on my Xeon which maxes at 75C. I feel its kind of high for a modest overclock, but then again my board is an EVGA P55 Micro with SLi. Not meant for high-end OC.

Good luck.

[sentry66]

yeah the xeon boards look like they have absolutely terrible heatsinks for their chipsets. Just small little shallow heatsinks because they often place them under your graphics card to make room for extra ram or cpu sockets

They're probably fine for stock speeds, but if the chipset heats up, I've noticed the cpu temps seem to inherit that heat somehow.


and yeah, for sure need fans with 4 wires that connect to 4 pin connectors on the motherboard to control fan speed. Otherwise they're only going to work at full speed. The 3 standard wires are power, ground, and rpm feedback. The 4th gives actual fan speed control

[earwax69]

Hey thanks Redpanda, I've fixed my fan problem yesterday. The Bios fan setup was actually workingbut with a slight delay. When my cpu reach 60, it take at least 20sec before the fans kick in. I was thinking it was not working at first.

Sentry, you think the Xeon stock heatsink is not good? 75C for a 3.5ghz+HT+turbo, on a stock cooler, I think its excellent. Even hard to believe. I get 70C at 3.6ghz with my Mugen 2.

Now I am stuggling with SSD optimisation... it's a bit of a mess right now. Its fast yes but I cant install the Intel Matrix Controllers. pffffffff...

[imashination]

You shouldnt need a 4 pin fan to control the fan speed, you only need the fourth pin in order for the fan to report back its current rpm. I would be very surprised if the motherboard couldnt adjust the fan voltage irrespective of knowing its current speed.

[sentry66]

Sentry, you think the Xeon stock heatsink is not good? 75C for a 3.5ghz+HT+turbo, on a stock cooler, I think its excellent. Even hard to believe. I get 70C at 3.6ghz with my Mugen 2.

Well it's the chipset heatsink I'm not really impressed with on the xeon boards. His cpu temp is fine for the stock cooler and 3.5ghz is very conservative, but the xeon platform isn't exactly ideal anyway for overclocking when you factor in the chipset heatsinks, ECC memory, all the extra ram slots, and possibly dual proessors etc

The xeon boards stock chipset heatsinks don't typically lend themselves to overclocking very far. Most xeons run at stock clock and so board manufacturers don't go overboard with those heatsinks. Even if you get a really nice cpu cooler, you can't do much about the xeon chipset heatsinks other than try to wedge a fan in there or replace them altogether. If the chipset overheats, that's just as bad as the cpu overheating, and you'll run into problems above say 4ghz

The hardcore i7 motherboards that are really meant for overclocking have gigantic chipset heatsinks and heatpipes going all over the place connecting all the different chipsets together to vent off heat. You'd be able to overclock those boards in a more extreme way.

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