PDA

View Full Version : Custom UT3 Character with Muscle System Simulation


barnesy
02-28-2010, 12:49 PM
Hey guys this is another project I'm working on at the moment. Im looking into how musle systems are used in next gen games for my FYP. Basically I want to try and simulate muscle deformation by any means nescessary in UT3. If anyone has tried this before can you let me know how it went please? There seems to be little infomation about it on the net.
Heres the concepts so you can get an idea of the style im going for.

Original Concept
http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/head2.jpg

Front Blueprint
http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/front.jpg

Side Blueprint
http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/side-1.jpg

barnesy
02-28-2010, 01:02 PM
Heres the Zbrush sculpt. at sub div3 and at the current sub div is how I would like the muscles to look at the end but smoother. When get higher res models though, they just look like plastic men.

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/subdiv3.jpg

I decided to make the traps smaller, might change them back. I also longer boots to give the character better proportions. The skeleton beneath the mesh is Epics Male skeleton for reference.

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/new.jpg

Currently I am re difining the muscles and ading detail to the boots. Ill post another update when I have more done :|
Cheers

Bouke285
03-01-2010, 10:04 PM
As far as I know the only way to simulate muscles is with morph targets in the animation. You model different positions of the muscles and set them to a slider, and then link the slider with bone movements somehow.

PermaGrin
03-02-2010, 08:09 PM
Just an idea, I have never done it nor have I seen it done anywhere specifically for muscles, animated normal maps or switching/blending between normal maps?

i.e.
one normal map has muscles in one state, relaxed
another in a flexed state

I think Batman's cape from AA used some form of this.

PredatorGSR
03-03-2010, 07:59 AM
When I worked on a film project, we used that method of blending bump maps for subtle facial expressions, along with blend shapes for bigger stuff. You could definitely get good results using those methods, I don't know how well they apply to games though.

barnesy
03-03-2010, 11:05 AM
Just an idea, I have never done it nor have I seen it done anywhere specifically for muscles, animated normal maps or switching/blending between normal maps?

i.e.
one normal map has muscles in one state, relaxed
another in a flexed state

I think Batman's cape from AA used some form of this.

Thanks for the feedback guys!

Animating nonrmal maps sounds really tricky. Ill deffinatly take that techniue into account. Im guessing that the majority of this is done in Unreals animation tree?

-update-

Heres some more progress. Ive been really ficusing on getting the anatomy correct. I really strugglled on getting the back looking real rather than one big but crack...literally..it went in way too much haha.
I should hopefully have the anatomy finished today so that I can start the fine detailing like the skin surface and the tears in the serratus and external obliques muscles aswell.

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/progress-1.jpg

If anything doest look, feel free to oint it out and ill try mending it

DoctorMonkeyFist
03-04-2010, 12:17 AM
You should make the forearms longer. You should try to solve the overall anatomy and shape before adding smaller details. You should not worry about animating the normal maps. Hope that helps. Good luck!

barnesy
03-06-2010, 01:46 AM
You should make the forearms longer. You should try to solve the overall anatomy and shape before adding smaller details. You should not worry about animating the normal maps. Hope that helps. Good luck!

Thanks monkey :)



After comparing him to the super average guy I noticed that his chest is too low , back is too wide , ribcage is too small and the neck is too thick.

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/test-1.jpg

Ohhh also in the picture I have created some armour for the waste as the action man genetalia wasnt really a good look for him haha

I have to be consious of the scale in realation to the Unreal skelton as it might cause rigging problems :\

Testure
03-06-2010, 07:27 AM
uhh.. no offense, but did this really need TWO threads?

barnesy
03-06-2010, 10:36 AM
uhh.. no offense, but did this really need TWO threads?

Well one thread was based on the problem itself regarding muscle system export and this thread is based on the actual modelling of the character itself.

Due to the time constraint of this project I couldnt afford to wait until I had modelled the character to then find that it isnt possible.

ramer
03-06-2010, 02:49 PM
After comparing him to the super average guy I noticed that his chest is too low , back is too wide , ribcage is too small and the neck is too thick. :\

barnsey you're doing good work here, great stuff from the reference drawings.

im also a musician/composer and ive learned that if you listen to everybodys advice and start pulling apart your projects piece by piece you lose what was good about it in the 1st place, but you'l only notice that when its too late.
yes the forearms could be a little longer but comparing your mighty looking warrior to Clark Kent, don't bother cos you'll end up changing it too much mate.

all the best

barnesy
03-07-2010, 02:05 AM
barnsey you're doing good work here, great stuff from the reference drawings.

im also a musician/composer and ive learned that if you listen to everybodys advice and start pulling apart your projects piece by piece you lose what was good about it in the 1st place, but you'l only notice that when its too late.
yes the forearms could be a little longer but comparing your mighty looking warrior to Clark Kent, don't bother cos you'll end up changing it too much mate.

all the best

Thanks for the advice ramer. I think thats a good approach to take to avoid generic lifeless models.

Ive had a play around with him today and noticed that he didnt have any bones in his arm and and began payng attention to the head. Hes no Clark Kent but hes getting there :)

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/monterside.jpg

Heres another picture showing the direction I am going with regards to styising the character. As you can tell hes very much a warrior. I think that aztec like armour along with the strange head growth will really bring the character together.

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/front-1.jpg


Heres a close up to show whats going on with the head
http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/head-3.jpg

barnesy
03-09-2010, 02:26 AM
http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/forum.jpg

Heres an update of the sculpting progress. The overall anatomy of the character is far more convincing now. Tommorow I am going to add some detail to the boots and necklace. Im liking the simplicity of the armour around the waist. I think if i take off those sharp edges itll lose its whole aesthetic :\

ramer
03-09-2010, 06:51 PM
looking good Barnsey, keep it up mate its starting to look sweet:applause:

barnesy
03-10-2010, 11:01 PM
Thanks ramer :)
Heres a quick update with the sculpted boots

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/boots.jpg

barnesy
03-19-2010, 05:33 PM
Heres a quick update to show how the retopologizing the sculpt. Im really trying to model the edgeflow around the major forms. You may wounder why the body has the same amount , if, not more polys? Its because I want as many edge loops on the body for the muscle deformation.

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/retop.jpg

Theres a large amount of pinching beneath the arms and where the horns join on to the head. I dont know if any of you guys have had this before? I think that itll be a case of smoothing it out with the smooth brush when it is finished.

As for the muscle simulation itself I am going to create tweo sculpts. One Flexed and one relaxed. Im going to play around with skin fx to see how i can get muscles to deform beneath the skin and create a clean simulation of muscle deformation.

Im open to any crits and suggestions if you may have any \o/

ramer
03-19-2010, 07:04 PM
hi barnsey

well i can't give any specific help, 'cos i'm not familiar with ZBrush, although since seeing your work i went and checked it out and it's certainly an incredibly powerfull looking tool, no doubt. I use Max for most of my modelling work, although tackling such a detailed model as yours in Max would be a daunting prospect for sure mate.
keep up the good work:cool:

barnesy
03-19-2010, 07:36 PM
hi barnsey

well i can't give any specific help, 'cos i'm not familiar with ZBrush, although since seeing your work i went and checked it out and it's certainly an incredibly powerfull looking tool, no doubt. I use Max for most of my modelling work, although tackling such a detailed model as yours in Max would be a daunting prospect for sure mate.
keep up the good work:cool:

Cheers mate,

Basically zbrush is a program where you can sculpt with millions of polys at a time. Its usually used for the creation of normal maps (projects the look of high detail onto low detail meshs)

You should get your hands dirty in it and play around with sculpting a sphere etc, its really fun :)
Theres also Autodesks Mudbox which is the alternative to ZBrush and is also a sculpting program, although I havent really had a chance to play around with it yet.

If you read through this snall tutorial it should help you understand the modelling pipeline alot better

http://www.marcusdublin.com/ParagalisTutorialPage1.html

Hope this helps

ramer
03-19-2010, 08:16 PM
If you read through this snall tutorial it should help you understand the modelling pipeline alot better
yeah mudbox looks similar.
cheers barnsey, unfortunately at the moment i'm still using 3dsMax7, but will soon be upgrading to 2010, so that tut will defo come in handy mate. ta';)

barnesy
04-18-2010, 12:37 PM
http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/anatomy.jpg

I have finished the other modules that I had to do alongside this one. I recieved alot of criticism for the overall anatomy of the character.
Here is an update of my efforts to fix this problem. I also have to re address the amount of armour that is distributed throughout the character as it seems unbalanced at the moment with the large boots and waist peace on just skin.
Let me know what you guys think :)
Thanks

barnesy
04-20-2010, 02:38 PM
Hey guys, does anyone know where I could find a pre made skeleton like the one below (Marcus) For Unreal?

http://i676.photobucket.com/albums/vv125/barnesy35/marcusbones.jpg

I need a IK skeleton for my project so that i can rig my character to it and experiment with morph targets
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks

barnesy
04-23-2010, 02:03 AM
I have found out that i dont actually need to create such a complex bone system and that a simple character studio bipd will be fine.
I have been battling GoMax all day as it seems to scale my model up all the time . The next issue i face is finding out how to bake the diffuse texture from the high polly onto the low poly if thats even possible

CGTalk Moderation
04-23-2010, 02:03 AM
This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.