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View Full Version : FXWars! NUKE!: Samir Kharchi, Freeform


Katachi
02-10-2010, 12:47 PM
Hi,

ok, I definetly join this challenge and will of course use my own plugin software for the nuke simulation. Wish everyone a fun time and good luck. :thumbsup:

Current state:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWZG7Iop8oA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpHVPggRO4M

Katachi
02-11-2010, 01:44 PM
Alright, I decided to make a classical mushroom explosion with lots of billowing features as seen on large scale nukes. Then also visualise the shockwave with particles and the formation of smoke due to it. Some stuff and debris flying around would also be nice, though I am not sure I find the time for this.

Am just about to make the low resolution simulation now.

VTeixeira
02-11-2010, 04:17 PM
Great, can't wait to see that plugin working.
Good luck

Katachi
02-11-2010, 05:06 PM
Here is the first progress of the low res simulation. Pretty unspectacular but a good groundtruth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Hx8mXWAptw

Itīs a little fast but the high res simulation will be slower due to the subgrid turbulences. I now make some high res tests.

Katachi
02-11-2010, 05:45 PM
Added one subgrid layer (doubles the resolution).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qsfYheSjyk

VTeixeira
02-11-2010, 06:04 PM
EFFEX plugin right?

Katachi
02-11-2010, 06:06 PM
yep it is.

Katachi
02-11-2010, 08:45 PM
here we go with another resolution layer. Now we are at 200x235x200. Still no turbulences added to the resolution layers. Maybe I tweak a more mushroomy shape out of this and use a higher simulation space and probably a bigger scale.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en1TnNsP1Ls

Next one will be 400x470x400. This should give the required resolution for a full HD shot and for generating big enough billowing features with subgrid turbulences.

mustan9
02-11-2010, 08:53 PM
That's looking very good. What software did you use?

Katachi
02-11-2010, 09:06 PM
I used DPIT Effex within Cinema 4D.

Katachi
02-12-2010, 01:31 PM
Ok, with some more tweaking I think Iīm now getting near the mushroom look I imagine. I may change the motion to shape an even more mushroom top but the billowing Iīm already quite satisfied with. More brocolli details would be good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpWFHy3gcr0

Katachi
02-12-2010, 06:32 PM
ok, now I got a result that I like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GyuolOETUg

Katachi
02-12-2010, 07:16 PM
I rerendered the cached simulation with a more soily color and used a bit different turbulence distribution for that one and added rendernoise to give it some more small but subtle details. Then composited them together in AE. I am quite satisfied with this. And I must get back to work for some days now so I stay with this one for now. Iīll probably render a longer simulation of this at the end of the project.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3Cfrto3N04

Next thing will be adding the shockwave and the smoke coming from this. Maybe also model some simple buildings and trees for blast reactions.

ragupasta
02-12-2010, 07:26 PM
Thats a really nice looking fluid sim. :)

Katachi
02-13-2010, 12:49 PM
Thanks :) Itīs quite hard I must admit to make larger scale nukes in comparison to smaller or midscale explosions but Iīm getting there. I have another longer render of this animation now in the pipeline though I think I first need to get some more RAM for it (my 10GB are hit with more simulation cells soon).

JohnPGiancarlo
02-13-2010, 03:34 PM
This is lookingh very good. :)

mustan9
02-13-2010, 05:55 PM
Looking very good. Nice progression in the development of your nuke.

Aikiman
02-15-2010, 07:01 PM
Interesting, cant wait to see some final renders.

Katachi
02-16-2010, 12:08 PM
thanks guys. Although I am very satisfied with the explosion so far (the detail is just what I wanted), I am playing around with fuel driven explosions at the moment. Maybe I make a compilation of several explosions...I have in mind sth like a documentary about explosions. Darn, if time wasnīt an issue... :D

Katachi
02-16-2010, 12:39 PM
ok, here is the latest state. I made some minor tweaks, a little more turbulence particles and made the simulation a bit longer. I like the top in the end, it builds out nice overall details.

Resolution is 400x600x400 and simulated within 20 hours (simulation itself took less than writing the compressed cache files, which were 1.5 GB in the end...what the..). Rendering took another 5 hours using the caches. But this really hits my RAM limit. I couldnīt render another single more cell..hehe :D (thereīs some flickering visible...was a render bug..fixed it right afterward)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWZG7Iop8oA

Anyway, I keep on doing some fuel driven tests, maybe I can combine them (though the motion will probably be different) or mix the simulations.

mustan9
02-16-2010, 02:42 PM
20 hours!

That's the problem with these fluid sims they're just to slow. You got my vote for effort :)

Katachi
02-16-2010, 02:47 PM
20 hours!

That's the problem with these fluid sims they're just to slow. You got my vote for effort :)

:D yeah, sims can take quite some time. Though it would have taken approximately 10 hours without precaching! So thatīs fine. Is there an effort price? :beer:

Katachi
02-16-2010, 03:02 PM
Here we go with another try, this time with some longer burning phase.

This time with less turbulence particles but a bit stronger strength. 400x576x400 (92 mill cells). Rendertime was 5 hours (no caches written) but itīs only 210 frames. I do a longer simulation (400 frames is the goal) overnight. This time without caches. Letīs see how much quicker this gets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpHVPggRO4M

Aikiman
02-16-2010, 06:42 PM
I think its looking really good man, just one thing, it has a really fluid feel to it as if you've poured ink into a jar of water. Perhaps its unavoidable with the method you are using, but if its something you can iron out, this effect will look awesome.

Katachi
02-16-2010, 06:51 PM
Hmm, I am not sure I understand what you mean by "fluid feel". Could you elaborate on this?

You do know that an explosion actually does obey the fluid laws? The combustion and the generated products are all either fluid phases or in the global air phase, so being fluid is what it should be.

Edit: The method is that of incompressible fluids without viscosity simulation.

But let me know what you mean. thx!

Katachi
02-16-2010, 07:11 PM
btw. Aikiman, everytime I look at your avatar, I feel kind of observed... :curious::D

mustan9
02-16-2010, 07:16 PM
yea, it does have a fluid feel to the motion. More like a vapor cloud.

Aikiman
02-16-2010, 07:20 PM
Hmm, I am not sure I understand what you mean by "fluid feel". Could you elaborate on this?

You do know that an explosion actually does obey the fluid laws? The combustion and the generated products are all either fluid phases or in the global air phase, so being fluid is what it should be.

Edit: The method is that of incompressible fluids without viscosity simulation.

But let me know what you mean. thx!

Yeah I understand that, Ive read up on Navier-Stokes method a long time ago, at least thats what Maya uses. I guess what Im trying to get at is that your explosion has a sense of weightlessness to it rather than feel like there are millions of tons of debris been lifted by heat, kinda like its all gas and no earth. In Maya I would probably increase my density emission and maybe play around with bouyency, making the temperature lighter than density.

Anyway just something I noticed thats all.

Katachi
02-16-2010, 07:28 PM
Mustan9: So you mean it feels not "heavy" enough? Maybe itīs cause the perspective does not give the large scale feeling and the motion therefore seems to be too light? I will try a different perspective, maybe that helps. Or maybe itīs the turbulences motion?

Aikiman
02-16-2010, 07:29 PM
btw. Aikiman, everytime I look at your avatar, I feel kind of observed... :curious::D

Trust me im just keeping an eye out for you ;) BTW when I look at your avatar it feels painful :)

Aikiman
02-16-2010, 07:33 PM
So you mean it feels not "heavy" enough? Maybe itīs cause the perspective does not give the large scale feeling and the motion therefore seems to be too light? I will try a different perspective, maybe that helps. Or maybe itīs the turbulences motion?

No, the immensity of the explosion is great and nothing to do with camera angle. Damn if you were using Maya I could help you more. What types of attributes are you emitting?

Katachi
02-16-2010, 07:40 PM
Yeah I understand that, Ive read up on Navier-Stokes method a long time ago, at least thats what Maya uses. I guess what Im trying to get at is that your explosion has a sense of weightlessness to it rather than feel like there are millions of tons of debris been lifted by heat, kinda like its all gas and no earth. In Maya I would probably increase my density emission and maybe play around with bouyency, making the temperature lighter than density.

Ah I see. Well, it is mostly gas and not earth. Density is already quite high, I think itīs more the optical properties that give the light appearance. I will try to crank up these values to give it a more solidified look (as in earth debris are not participating media, comparable to this try: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3Cfrto3N04 where you get kind of a mix of gaseous media and more solid stuff). But I would like to avoid a fully solid appearance because most of the material in such a large scale explosion is burn products which are simply densely packed participating smoke particles and not earth material but I see the point in including the earth material fact to give more weight.

Edit: does anybody have a link maybe to a page that shows a ratio of soot/smoke and solid material that is in such an explosion? I think that would be great to know!

I work on that. Thanks!

Anyway just something I noticed thats all.

Sure, otherwise I would imagine you are reading minds. ;)

Katachi
02-16-2010, 07:43 PM
No, the immensity of the explosion is great and nothing to do with camera angle. Damn if you were using Maya I could help you more. What types of attributes are you emitting?

Sorry, that answer was meant for mustan9.

Anyway, emission is done by the fire simulation, it emits of course heat (fluid is accordingly affected by the buoyancy force) and smoke/soot density as combustion product.

Aikiman
02-16-2010, 07:49 PM
Perhaps all it needs is some ground effects to "ground" the explosion, I hope I didnt comment prematurely. I like it though.

Katachi
02-16-2010, 07:59 PM
Perhaps all it needs is some ground effects to "ground" the explosion, I hope I didnt comment prematurely. I like it so though.

I add ground explosion with one of the next simulation. Maybe it indeed helps but I think the earth debris point is a good fact to include in any case. And nope, definetly not commented prematurely! I am open for crits at any time. I just seem to be so involved in the programming that I sometimes forget the artistic POV. So sometimes I may well be too critical as my brain says "hmm, the physics seem ok to me, code is fine, energy distribution fits the scale..." :D

So nope, keep it coming whenever thereīs something you feel seems strange or may even be visually improved (in the end this is a freeform entry and I also want to make it look "cool" and not physically super accurate). Any comment makes me think and itīs good that way and may lead me to new ideas or way to improve the simulation. whether this is artistically or physically. Most of the time an optimal balance of both hits the spot. :)

Aikiman
02-16-2010, 08:07 PM
Look forward to it.

Katachi
03-11-2010, 01:04 PM
argh, 4 days till dateline and I still have so much to do. Maybe I find some time this weekend to get into it again and finalize at least an entry. In the meantime I at least made some research and found that most nuclear explosions are not ground or subground explosions as in my setup but are air bursts. Well, I take this approach then maybe it results in more interesting explosion behaviors. :)

Destructor007
03-11-2010, 01:56 PM
http://forums.cgsociety.org/images/icons/icon13.gifawesome work samir keep it up!!

Katachi
03-22-2010, 11:55 AM
thx for the heads up! Today is dateline and I will now try to bring up at least something. The other final entries all look great btw.! :thumbsup:

Katachi
03-22-2010, 02:38 PM
Here is my scene for the explosion.

http://www.dpit2.de/temp/fxwars/fxwarsscene_low.jpg

Katachi
03-22-2010, 08:22 PM
here is a row of images of the explosion so far. Added ground dust and some debris dust. Will add shockwave effect, explosion glare, some more debris and maybe change a bit here and there like atmospherics in post. Not much time left so cannot do more here but it seems to work out nicely.

So maybe 3-4 more hours till Iīm ready. Maybe earlier letīs see how fast the renderings finish.

http://www.dpit2.de/temp/fxwars/fxwars_scene_wip01.jpg

mustan9
03-22-2010, 08:57 PM
that looks awesome. I really like the quality of the rendering and the lighting setup.

JohnnyRandom
03-22-2010, 09:19 PM
Sweet looking good, down to the wire :D

Katachi
03-23-2010, 12:12 AM
Thanks guys. Iīm finished. Phew, glad I still made it. Really had stuff to do until yesterday. Well, it worked out today (though I am not sure if it was a good idea to add the lighting from the blast. It takes away the nice starting part). :)

Aikiman
03-23-2010, 01:15 AM
good going!

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