Enchanted Forest - enviroment - ZrO-1

[FortUno]

That sounds really cool. Is it going to be dark and gloomy, or enchanted and magical since the magic has returned?

[ZrO-1]

It will be a bright image...pro'lly mid-day type of lighting. I don't want it to be post-apocaliptic rather more like so much time has past that it's just become overgrown with nature. Getting some reference stuff together as I write this, also I have the sketch about half done...updates soon.

[ZrO-1]

Alright, I have the initial sketch finished. Keep in mind it's really rough, and more for referance for me.

[ZrO-1]

And here it is again with some quick color

[ZrO-1]

OK, I've got a screen-cap and a test render. How about giving me some C&C people c'mon! I know there are a lot of new threads to read but just a word or two of what you think isn't asking so much :p

[ZrO-1]

And here's the render the lighting is SUPER temp.

[Koma]

i love the idea ,good start:thumbsup:

[Gilgamesh]

Yeah, the idea sounds good, and it seems like you have a pretty solid composition and a good start. On you first post you said that the magic has returned to the land. How are you going to make this apparent in your concept? I would like to get a sense of why this forest is enchanted, rather than just an overgrown city. Nice work so far.

[ZrO-1]

Thanks Gabe :beer:

Gilga: Well one idea I had for adding that magical feel would be to have the city re-inhabitated by magical creatures. Orcs and Ogres would live in the lower overgrown areas, Elves would live in the sections where the vegitation hasn't reached yet, dwarves, hobbits, and the few humans that are left would live along the water in Venice Itally style, and Dragons would nest on the rooftops of the tallest towers.

I just want to nail down the city (which functions like the natural rocky/mountianous landscape would) and the forest that grows in/on it before I start adding the magical element to it.

Imagine a feel to the enviroment like a cross between "Planet of the Apes", "AI - artificial intelegence", and "The Lord of the Rings".

[leigh]

Very cool idea, and looking great so far too :)
Are you actually going to model all the elves, ogres, humans and dragons??? :surprised

[Faeroon]

GREAT IDEA!!! :thumbsup:
Your sketches are great - they manage to catch the feeling
of wilderness...

Wish you good luck with this and keep us updated!!! :buttrock: :buttrock:

[ZrO-1]

RE Leigh:
I might put together a dragon and put it on top of the chrysler biulding a la King Kong...but for the rest I'll pro'lly try and just put the suggestion of the other creatures. The camera is too far away at this angle to see all the characters if they were in. But you will see evidence that they are/were there.

[ZrO-1]

Alrighty! I found some awesome photo references from the 1930's for the Chrysler Tower...sooooo...I re-made the tower, it's more accurate to the real thing now. Let me know what you think.

Here's the screen cap, below is the no light render.

[ZrO-1]

OK and here's the render...I didn't put any lights in this time. Anyone have a link to that GI plugin or script for Maya 4???

[chi]

GI_Joe is a GI Plugin for Maya. You can download it at highend3d.com.

from one of the other threads :)

looking cool cept it looks sheared towards the bottom, or is that just the camera angle?

love the concept drawing

[ZrO-1]

Just the camera angle :insane:

[rolhionjs]

Very nice sketch and model !!! the idea is really awesome !! I hope to see soon the following images ! :)

[ZrO-1]

OK, the basic city model has been constructed...again here's the screen cap followed by the render. Oh and I dropped in a couple of lights (directional & ambient) to help show the definition.

[ZrO-1]

And here is the render. Crits about composition would be best...keep in mind I'll be detailing the buildings with textures since all of them can be done with cube proj. maps. :D

[Adam]

Looks good so far. I love the idea. I think the placment of the camera is perfect as long as the light source is placed opposite of the chysler building to balance the image. It looks like that is what you are planning anyway. It should be very stable and strong like that Great work. That is going to be a lot of texturing but it will definetely be worth it in the end.
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :wavey: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[ZrO-1]

Some more updates....I think I should set up my file server...

[ZrO-1]

close up of damage

[ZrO-1]

Temp water added in

[Howard Day]

This is going to be an interesting one. If you can pull it off convincingly you've got a sure-fire winner on your hands. The only thing is that the right have of the image seems empty. I'd put something in that, maybe a big tree with something sitting in it, I don't know. It needs fillings, though.

Keep it up!!

[ZrO-1]

Thanks Howard, I apreciate it :D

Yeah about that right hand side...not to worry I have some ideas for it that will put some weight back on that side. ;) hehehe

[urgaffel]

Your idea rocks. I will watch this thread with great interest :)

Even if you don't manage to finish for the challenge, you got to finish it! It would be a crime to leave it half-done...

Ganbatte!



:thumbsup:

[vancorso]

Umh, it's a good idea. It remind me a little bit to "12 monkeys", the Bruce willis' movie, in the post apocaliptic escenes.

The composition it's looking good. Keep it on! :thumbsup:

[ZrO-1]

Oh yeah, I forgot about 12 monkeys...I'll have to watch it and see what was done there.

Here's one more render...Added in ground on both sides to anchor it all.

[ZrO-1]

I forgot the pic...That's what happens when you stay up and work till the wee hours of the morning.

[MikaelPersson]

If you are going along the 12 monkeys, add a bridge with giraffs running over it.

But seriously a bridge might add some to the composition, make it go from the city out on the right.

[ZrO-1]

LOL you read my mind. I already started on a bridge, but it's going to have to wait till tomorrow 'cause I need some sleep.

[hypercube]

Just catch up here..wow! Killer concept..looking good so far! :applause:

From the beginning description though kind of pictured a more street level shot..but you're adding stuff to fill in that empty space now, so composition shouldn't be a problem..was thinking maybe you could have trees thrusting straight up out of the ocean too? maybe punched through some places in the city itself? Like chrysler-building-sized in their own right. Maybe they grew up relatively fast, but still more of a gradual intrusion.

Anyway, I should either get to sleep or get back to mine, though it's purely academic at this point :)

Can't wait to see how this develops..

[ZrO-1]

It's supposed to be a rooftop/treetop vantage point. If it doesn't work please let me know people.

[Slot]

Pretty impressive.

I'm not sure of what will look like when finished, but I'm sure that it will be great.:applause:

Keep showing your advances.:bounce:

[ZrO-1]

OK...I added in the brooklyn bridge over the river. I also tweaked the scale of the docks on the waterfront. I added in the background hills. And finally, I added the rooftop where the "viewer" would be positioned rather than floating in the air.

C&C encouraged...I'd like comments on the modeling before I start on the textures and plants. Just keep in mind that most of the buildings will function the way rocky mountians would in a natural landscape, with the exception of the Chrysler Building, which will be jutting out of the forrest. Refer to my color sketch if you're unsure. Thanks! :D

[Danmoreno]

Hey Man, great conecpt! I guess its one of the most originals here...well. thats really cool, cant wait to see it finished

[ZrO-1]

OK, bit of an update. I layed down the ground texture on the hills, and dropped in a sky. Let me know what you think.

[marcom]

great idea, i really like this concept and your work so far.
however i think the river should be wider.

marcom

[ZrO-1]

Allrighty, I've painted in an idea I had for where to put the two main trees in my piece. These two trees will be modeled. The rest of the plants will be custom 3D brushes. Let me know if you think these 2 trees will work.

[hypercube]

Ah, now yer talkin'..that should be really cool.

Only thing that seems troubling about it, is if the tree grew out that big, and that's huyuge, where did it start? might be good to have more of the side smashed out with clinging roots showing, or if it's the upper branch of an even bigger tree that's torn up through the inside, have another branch or so busting out a few additional holes. Anyway, if you were planning that and just didn't want to sketch it, nevermind :D

Either way, should be great..the near tree balances out, etc. keep em coming.

[ZrO-1]

The tree is rooted into the top of the biulding (where the camera is). It is pretty close to camera which is why it is so big in frame. If you look at the drawing you can see an impression of the roots going into the roof. So i guess what I'm trying to say is that the tree and camera are on the same plane in space and are close together. I hope it will be more obvious once I start on it in 3D.

[hypercube]

Oops, sorry, I meant the one growing out of the chrysler building. Foreground tree is totally understood. I'll just go be quiet here a bit and leave ya to it :D

[ZrO-1]

ohhhh OK, now I get ya. Yeah I think I'm going to have to work a LOT on the Chrysler Building since it's sort of the focus of my composition.

[dmcgrath]

Nice Job Z, your modeling is plenty fine at this stage. Just overgrow everything with the trees and grasses. If you are going to have buildings with trees growing off them, the place really has had to have gone to hell. hehe...
BTW it would be really cool to have another fantasy element in there to add to the effect. Like you said maybe a dragon on top of the Chrysler Bldg. Or a goblin, with his back to us, sitting with his legs dangling off the bldg edge.

[ed_gross]

It seems that you are spending a lot of time modeling stuff that has been modelled a billion times. I will let you "borrow" the original Brooklyn bridge model and Chrysler building / Empire State building model from a show we deed two years back if you think that would help. We also have all of manhatten and the manhatten bridge as well. Just let me know what format you need and assure me you won't use it for commerical purposes.

[ZrO-1]

Thanks Ed, but I'm doing this on my own. I'm kinda new to Maya and I need to learn through trial and error. Using someone else's work won't help me out any in the long run. Besides I've only been at it (this project) for 5 days since the sketch was finnished.
As far as the project itself goes I'm not trying to reproduce an exact duplicate of Manhattan or the buildings in it. Rather I just want the suggestion of it. The scene I'm creating is totally fictional and I don't think it needs exact models. I'm not concerned with how many times Manhattan has been modeled before. I don't think it has ever been done like I'm trying to do it this time so my work should still be unique.
I appreciate your offer very much, but I'd rather fail on my own than get praises for someone else's hard work.

[ed_gross]

That's cool. I totally understand your desire to learn from practice. I guess my only point was that your time might be better well spent concentrating on lighting and composition as opposed to modelling. Either way, I am sure you will have a lot of fun and learn a whole bunch... Good luck..

[GrAnt]

I absolutely love your idea and the way that this entry is heading!!! keep it going man!!!!!

[ZrO-1]

:annoyed: Ed man, why don't you just come out and say that my stuff sucks. :annoyed: First you offer me models and basically tell me that I'm waisting my time on the models. Then after I try to reply to you politely even after feeling insulted, you come right back and tell me in a patronizing way that my time would be better spent on comp & lighting. If you don't like my stuff then say so. I know it's not great but if you want to be helpful then provide constructive criticisim not charity.:mad:

[ed_gross]

Wow, I aplogize if that's the way you took my post. I actually like your idea and composition very much. I regret if it was interpreted in a negative way, that was not it's intent. I will work on my wording.

[ZrO-1]

OK, no problems, no worries Ed. :D I pro'lly just took it the wrong way. Water under the bridge ;) (bad pun).

Anyhoo, I've done some work on the stone texture. Let me know what you think. Oh yeah, it most likely will be about half this scale in the composition.

[ZrO-1]

Here's a little more. I've put in the first background trees. Now I'm really feeling the lack of power the GeForce 3 has for pro 3D work. :cry:

[ZrO-1]

I thought you guys might enjoy a good laugh. Here are the results of my first ever UV texture map. The image is really temp, just to see if I could do it right. :p

[ZrO-1]

Oh yeah, some other updates: I trashed most of the textures and am starting them over. I killed the trees and am starting them over as well. I tweaked some of the background land mass, refined the water, got rid of the camera image plane with the sky on it, uuummmm....Oh yeah I trashed the secondary buildings which I had done as one poly and am rebuilding them as individual polys. I'm going to spend one more week at most on the modeling. Then the next 2 weeks on textures and the last week on lighting.

man, I'm loosing stars like a B-movie actor

[dmcgrath]

Hey Zro,

did you give any thought to adding something else into the foreground? Your UV mapping is sweet for what you need it for. Remember, since it is a still shot, you can tweak it with P-shop instead of using MAYA. Unless you want to put a camera in there and fly it around a little. That might be cool.
:bounce:

[ZrO-1]

Yeah I do have some stuff for the foreground. If you look at one of my earlier images you'll see that I had one pic where I had painted in two large trees. One was sprouting out of the damage section of the Chrysler Building, the other was coming off the corner of the roof where the camera is set on. Also I beleive I will have 2 dragons in my scene, one will be perched on the top of one of the taller towers (maybe Chrys. Build.), and the second would be in that big void in the sky flying towards the first dragon...kind of like a nesting pair.

[Teyon]

You've destroyed my beautiful city!! Ugh!! :) Well, at least you did it with style.

I like the concept and you are following it through very well. Hehe, I'm just picturing Central Park gone haywire and the zoo animals running around the city all Jumanji like. This is a really cool concept, ZrO-1. Good work.

*looks at the devastation and sighs*...And I just got a new apartment. :cry:

[ZrO-1]

Don't worry the city will be back soon. Right now I'm concentrating on texturing the Chrys Build. I'm getting all the UV's set up and have started on some higher quality textures in PS. I'm going to make the Chrys Build solid then drop back in the secondary and terciary buildings. After that it's time to make like Johnny Appleseed and get some trees into the mix :D I'll have some updates on the texturing tomorrow.

[ZrO-1]

Whoo Hoo!!!
Well I think I have the base textures set up for the top of the Chrysler Building. It's all UV mapped and seems to be working pretty well. PLEASE let me know what you think. C&C encouraged.

[Faeroon]

Wow!
It's looking awesome!!:buttrock:
Keep us updated Zr0!!:airguitar

PS: Thx for the fur tip at Leigh's thread... gonna test
this, hope this works.

[MBUUN]

Yes, this is a very cool looking scene so far. Obviously a lot of work and thought put into it. I like it.

[ZrO-1]

OK guys, I've got the next "layer" of the tower textured. I also adjusted the reflectivity (I called it specularity in the last post :hmm: ) texture map to better show the shinyness of the glass and chrome on the building. I think it helps separate the glass/metal from the stone a bit better. Anyhoo, let me know what you think. Thx :D

[Adam]

I suppose you know this but could you make the water bumps a lot smaller and put a second and possible third map smaller to create mini waves within the large waves. It would make it alot easier to get the idea of the actual size of the structures.

Looks great so far!!!

:wavey: :wavey: :airguitar :wavey: :wavey:

[ZrO-1]

Yeah I agree about the water. I'll make sure I tweak it before my next post. Thx!

[leigh]

Hey ZrO-1 :)
Ummm... those textures don't look too great to me, but I think that's due to the jpg compression. :surprised
Won't you do us a favour a post a couple of cool extreme close up!! renders, so we can see what's going on in your textures? :bounce:

[Howard Day]

I'm with Leigh. The contrast between perfect looking textures and old and dilapedated ones is waaay too sharp. I'm sure you've got some fix in mind for this, but I though I'd point it out anyway...

[hypercube]

Cool map! I know it's 'only the top' mapped right now, so ignoring the bottom, but the main thing I can think of right now is that it doesn't look old..hell I'm not even sure the chrysler building looks that clean NOW :D Need to really ravage that metal and bust out the glass and all that. I know you've got the mojo to do it though, so roll on..

[ZrO-1]

Well I managed to crash my PC today and just got it back up (1:50am) I didn't have my tex-mapped version of the city backed up so it's gone. I'm not to sad about it though since my maps ****ed major hairy ballsack. Anyway I thought I'd post a photo of the REAL tower as it is now and am hoping that you guys could give me some suggestions as to the best way to make it look old. As far as what it's made out of: Top arched section is stainless steel and stone is african marble facade. Any tips would be MAJORLY appreciated.

[sean_G]

yeah gotta go with howard on the "way too sharp tip". as far as the actual chrystler building tex. on the top i might suggest a grunge-map ala pixar. essentially this is a layered shader, or mix-node in XSI.

I might accomplish this by painting a seperate texture for the grime and dinge: this would include-1. a Diffuse and Bump map for the marble, consisting of drippy rain stain deposits,and stress fracture cracks (maybe from the overwhelming wieght of its new inhabitant, the dragon.)
2. a reflection and transperancy map for the glass altering the oh-so freshly washed look and giving it some stress fractures as well.

[Twisted-Imperial]

Lookin pretty good 0-1 ! looking forward to the final entry
keep up the good work!

-PEACE

[ZrO-1]

THX for the tips on the tex-maps you guys. I do have annother question as far as the work-flow on the textures. Do you think it would look better if I made it look as it does in the photogragh first and then age it, or start right away with an aged look?

[Twisted-Imperial]

I think it all boils down to how much of the aging ur gonna model, because if theres alot of modeled ageing id dive right in, but on a texture stand point i think its ezier to have a nice new fresh looking building and ripping the hell out of it :)

[ZrO-1]

OK! thx twisted.

I think I'm going to try doing a high-poly model of the tower and see what I can do with that. Then what I'll do is post a side-by-side of the lowpoly w/textures and the highpoly and you guys can vote :)

[MikaelPersson]

Why are you going for polygons? I do think you would be best of using NURBS. For the buildings atleast. Then you wouldn´t have the problem of UV mapping the stuff.

[ZrO-1]

@Mikael: Doh, I guess I said that wrong. What I meant was like a high level of modeled detail. In other words modeling the details instead of relying on textures. That's what I meant by high-poly...:p

[MikaelPersson]

Haha. ok. Yes it usually turns out quite nice when you do the modelling instead of texturing.

[ZrO-1]

OK, well we're right back where we all started here :)
Here is a screen-cap followed by a render of the new tower. This time around I'm using a photo as a tracing image so I get the proportions correct. Note the higher level of detail I'm putting into the model this time around.

[ZrO-1]

And here's the rendered version. Oh yeah no lights yet.

[ZrO-1]

'nother lil update. Think I'm going to take a break from these darn arches and work on the eagle gargoyle pieces.

[ZrO-1]

BTW here's a closeup of what the eagles look like for real.

[chadlychoo]

Lovin the concept Zr0! The new tower is turning out better. In this one try to model some the windows instead of using maps. It will raise the poly count a lot but the finished product will feel a lot more real. Also mess with the geometry a bit more. Put some holes and deep cracks in it so it looks more aged and decayed. Good work man! :applause:

[ZrO-1]

THX chad :)
I'll pro'lly do the windows and deep cracks with a displacement map. The big holes I'm going to model like I did in the 1st version. I've been doing some work on the eagle. I actually had the darn thing 90% done when a thunder storm knocked out my power here for about 15 mins. So I had to RE-do the eagle. :annoyed: hehehe Anyway, I think it's coming out better the second time around. Here's where I'm at so far:

[chadlychoo]

Sounds good. Man you have horrible luck with losing work! If I were you I'd save every 5 minutes. :wip: Anyways, the eagle is coming along nicely. Try making the top and bottem a bit more flat. Are you using other references when modeling them or just those pictures you posted?

[ZrO-1]

Actually I found a third really nice pic between the time I lost power and I started over. I have been using that as the tracing image. Yeah as far as my luck I'm hoping that was the end of my bad streak. But just to be on the safe side I've been saving every time I get it to a point I like. Here's the pic I'm using:

[ZrO-1]

Here's a little update. The chrome texture is just a temp.

[hypercube]

Coming along nicely..the building as well, should be cool to have all the detail there 'for reals'.

Not that it'll matter from the distance, but the eye on the eagle seems too far forward, or the nose/eye area relations a little off. Ah, actually I think it may be that the whole head is too long?


Heh, so many movies and shows have people standing on this thing I think it's a stock rentable prop now :)

[OZ]

WOW!......u great!WOW and another time WOW!!............lord of robots......u just rox.

[Mr. Nice Guy]

Great job your are doing. I really like the idea.

One comments I have is for the texturing. Make it more dirty. It was very clean now.

Keep on going.

[ZrO-1]

OK, the eagle is done. I fixed the geometry a bit. I also tweaked the temp texture a little more "just because" :) I know it's not an exact replica but it will be so small in the scene it pro'lly won't even matter. But hey, it looks cool I think. :D

[ZrO-1]

I attached the eagles to the building. Man they are tiny in the pic now. I might have to do an animated camera "fly-through" when I'm done just to show them off. :p Here's the pic.

[ZrO-1]

Yes! I've got the primary modeling finnished on the Chrysler Building. All the major stuff is done...now I'm going to spend a little time on some of the details. And then it's done baby! :D

I'm really happy with the results of the final model. Please let me know what you think. :)

[Adam Klein]

it's a great model, the surfaces you have for it are nice too I'd like to see with the surfaces again with the new stuff.

keep it up ZrO

[ZrO-1]

@ hypercube: you were right about the head being too long I had accidentally stretched the image when I brought it into maya. Anyway I think in the second pic you can see that I shortened it a bit.

I think the reason why the eagles are used in so many movies is because they are so beutiful. I personally think that the chrysler building is the best looking of all the skyscrapers in Manhattan. It was built in 1930 and in all that time only 17 buildings have been built taller (15 now :mad: terrorist motherFruckers). It is mostly art deco (my fav) in style but it also has elements of gothic arcetecture as well. Not to mention the strong tie-in with automotive design (the only mechanical design that people call sexy). So anyway now that I've gone on gushing about the design of the chrysler building :love: I guess I'll really have to work hard on doing it justice.

Oh yeah...before I forget I think I've figured out a way to get the stainless steel plating on the arches and stuff tied into the rest of the old, overgrown theme. Since the tower rises above the treeline in my picture what I think I will do is keep most of the steel slightly shiny. It could serve like a shining beacon in the middle of the forest. Let me know what you guys think of that idea. THX!

[ZrO-1]

Blah blah blah...here's the city :D

[Tellerve]

ZrO-1, it still would be 17 my friend, *damn terrorist motherfrickers* because you said, "have been built". Those people can never take away what WAS. They may destroy it but I'll always remember them and my times there. Take that ya B@4t@rds!

Tellerve

[ZrO-1]

One more update. I recycled some of the landscape from my last scene. And I know the color of the water is off...I'll fix it once I get a sky in.

[ZrO-1]

Yeah yeah yeah :D here's annother one. I started on the two main trees. Boy...looking back I've been pretty busy today :p

[Tellerve]

Hmm, well you've already mentioned the water as being something needed some work but I think the ground does. I'm not sure if you've ever been to NYC but the ground is no where near that hilly. Granted this is a "fantastical forest" so big loping hills like that might be in order but figured I'd say something :shrug:

Tellerve

[Jac]

I like how this is coming along.... it definately gives that "nature overgrown" look/feel. The only thing though, the tree coming out of the chrysler building would have to be HUGE..... Just a thought.

[ZrO-1]

@ Tellevre: I live 10 mins east of NYC on long island. So yeah I know it's not that hilly. :p I made the land like that for two reasons. 1) It's way in the future so the land has changed. 2) I made the land like that so that when I add in the trees with the PaintFX brush I can get more range in the top levels of the forrest canopy. :D

@ Jac: The tree that is coming out of the tower is rooted in the hole not in the ground. And it's a full-sized rain forest type tree, so it'll be big. I still have work to do on both trees so hopefully when I'm done it'll show that they are growing directly out of the buildings.

Sorry guys, I guess I should have explained that stuff before.:hmm:

[Jac]

Sorry man, my bad. :surprised It just looked way to dis-proportional. I really look forward to seeing this progress and watching it pull together.

[high]

Hey Zer0-1, the trees are very nice, i'm wondering if you have some tips for trees modeling, yours seems very nice.

:bounce: Nice work man.

[ZrO-1]

LOL thanks high, but when you hear how easy they are to make you'll probably not think they're so great. :D

Anyway, all you do is make a CV curve in the path and direction you want your branch to grow in. Then you can either use a NURBS circle or draw annother CV curve in a circular shape and close the ends. This second circle shape becomes the profile of your branch. Then, all you do is extrude the circle along the path you made with scaleing included (I put .01 scale on mine). That will give you one branch. You just repeat that for each of your branches untill you have a tree.

A couple of extra things that can be done to the branches when they are done is to intersect each of the branches and trim the overlap at the bases. Then you could add in a bit of a fillet to give it a nice transition from branch to branch.

I'd say the hardest thing about this is drawing the CV curve for the path. You have to be careful to make a branch and not an Octopus tenticle.

[ZrO-1]

OK I'm attaching a copy of that last pic here to show you guys my thought process behind my piece here. What I have done is first I drew in a light blue path wich shows the path the viewer's eyes should take as they look at my pic. The top of the tower I think will be the attention grabber because once everything's textured it will most likely be the brightest part.

I also figured many of you were like "OK, so where the heck's the enchantment in this piece" :D So I drew in the magical creatures I imagine in this piece and that I breifly mentioned back on page one of this thread.

[Sangotten]

Hey looking very interesting...!!!

I think the idea is really original! the water is looking kinda rough, a bit to rough actually! I'm looking forward to see those creature being placed in the enviorment!

keep it coming!

[Joebount]

uh, a bit overloaded no ? We should se more the forest : when I look at your concept, the first thing I see is a big city that has been devastated, not a forest.

Nevertheless, the concept is interresting

[Adam Klein]

lookin good: thumbsup:

I think you have some great elements here and a good concept, but you should try pushing the camera around to see if you can snag maybe a more effective shot, especially so that more raw forest can be seen around your overgrown city somehow, imo

Also with the sketch you posted, whick looks likes you have some good stuff coming, it seemse mixed up with the scale... The dragons and Giant seems to scale but the elf throws it off.
:shrug:
after writing this I have come up with a little idea, why not have building as a foreground set, heavily overgrown, with your elf and that lil' setting, and have it overlook the rest of the city?
it your piece though, just a thought:deal:

[hypercube]

Cool, really coming along..

I agree the elf in the FG would be HUGE if that's correct..the top of the building you have in there now looks like a large office building top, I could fathom a gigantic tree coming out of the roof, but if a guy is that big, that's not right..might be cooler to have a little campsite or settlement if it's to that scale, or like adam said be much closer in on a rooftop ledge or crumbled out building side looking onto the larger scene.

Anyway, just little things to be sorted out, keep rolling :)


P.S. I agree the chrysler building is a work of art, I'm a big fan of deco when it's done in a cool way like that, and it stands the test of time. I think it's that sensibility that made coruscant so kickass.

[ZrO-1]

Thanks you guys. I appreciate the words of encouragement...About the elf: yeah I was half asleep when I drew that stuff in and I forgot about the scale there. The elf is WAY off. Just pretend you can't see it. As far as the forrest: don't worry I've got it under control...I'm saving it as a suprise :)

Anyway, I spent most of today working on textures for my tree and ground. Just keep in mind with the ground that I textured it to be the forrest floor, which in my mind doesn't have any grass. Sooooo here ya go!

Here's a link to higher res version (1024x768):
http://www.mjg1.net/City4.jpg

[ZrO-1]

I got a little more done with the textures.

Again, here's the link to the full res version:
http://www.mjg1.net/City5.jpg

[ZrO-1]

Well, I got a bit more done. I've started adding in some roots on the tree which comes out of the chrysler building. I also tried to make an aged stainless steel proc texture...which looks like cr@p, but I figured I'd show you anyway. :shrug: I ended up using photos for the bark texture and I like the way they came out. I think I'm going to have to try and take some good metal pictures and try them out.

[hypercube]

Looking good..roots are on a good tack..once you get more and detail out the wreck it should be cool. I don't think the eagles are a problem from 'back here' but then it depends on how big the final image is going to be. One thing surfacewise that could be a problem is that the two trees right now are feeling about the same size..so that messes with your head figuring out the one up here vs. the one seemingly far away and bigger..that kind of thing. The foreground roof isn't quite at a solidly defined scale yet either, but further things should help define that, and all of it, of course.

but then it's kinda late, could just be me :)

keep on..

[Joebount]

just one littl' comment : buldings aren't made of bricks :)

[Scott Harris]

cool concept...keep going. also...It never helps to have solid black in the background why not throw a paliminary sky in there, it will help our eyes fill in the blanks.
DAMN, that is one big mother #%@%#ing tree :eek:

[ZrO-1]

I'll see what I can do about your guys comments. I appreciate them all. You guys are right about some of the scaleing and perspective. If anything kills my piece I think it will be that. I'll work on it right away and see what I can do to fix it. THX!

[ZrO-1]

here's annother one. I scaled back the tree on the chrysler building. I made a second version of the steel texture. I started blocking out basic colors for some of the buildings. I made the background enviroment blue to better suggest a sky. And I began adding in the trees in the background.

Here's the link to the high-res version, you knda need it to make out all the tree details:
http://www.mjg1.net/forrest1.jpg

[ZrO-1]

Also, here's a closeup of the new steel texture on the eagles:

[OZ]

just this.....:thumbsup:

[Faeroon]

:applause: :applause:
Beautifull ZrO!!!
Poor Chrysler - but the steel texture looks great!
Is this done with some kind of reflection map?
(Sorry for the dumb newb questions, but I try to learn here *G*)

The whole scenery reminds me of something...
hm....*murmurs something*DAMN DIRTY APES, DAMN YOU
STRAIGHT TO HELL......... :surprised ;)

[ZrO-1]

@ Faeroon: I made the steel like this:
1) I got a decient photo of some metal with scratches/corrosion/rust. Then I doctored it up so that it would be tileable. That was for the color.
2) I then made greyscale versions of it with adjustments to the brightness/contrast. I made one low contrast, almost all middle-grey for the bump. I also made a high contrast one almost black and white for the specularity and the reflectivity.
3) I then mapped each one to their respective nodes on a PhongE material.
4) I did a test render and then tweaked the basic settings to refine the steel a bit.

[eirenicon]

Just want to say that I love this concept, and that I'll crit more when I can think of something good to say :beer:

[Faeroon]

Hehe - thx ZrO
Gonna test that myself at times :)

It definitely looks like REAL steel to me!
Cool work :applause:

[ZrO-1]

@ timD: does that mean that you don't see anything you like? (hehehe just kidding)

@ Faeroon: wow, thanks bro you just made my night! :bounce: :xtreme:

[eirenicon]

No, I meant that I didn't have anything to say that could improve the most excellent splendour of your image :p

[ZrO-1]

Now that I've had some time away from the picture, and came back to it, it looks to me like I lost some of the perspective depth with the way I placed and sized the trees. After I get some sleep I'll rework the trees in the city to try and bring back some of that depth.

[ZrO-1]

OK you guys, I still have a LOT of tweaking left to do on the trees, but I'm getting a little closer. Oh and the two big trees will also have leaves on them...I'm just holding off a bit 'till I get some other things done first.

Here's the high-res version:
http://www.mjg1.net/forrest2.jpg

C&C wanted.

[hypercube]

Hrmm..digging the tree textures, and good to see some green going in, but (yes, but)..

Scale problems abound..from what I can tell some of those leaves would be like, 10-15 feet across. And the ones across the river shouldn't even be visible..sort of making it feel like a miniature city instead of giant plants.

Also are you smoothing over the top of the chrysler building? Something funky is going on up there but not sure what.

Anyway, you're on the track, keep rollin'..

[ZrO-1]

@ 'cube: yeah I know the scale is TOTALLY off on all of the trees. I was really just trying to get an idea of where the green needed to be in this stage. That's why the trees look all ****ed up with the scale.

As far as the top of the tower, it's a combination of the lighting and the texture. I'm going to try rendering out a version with GI. Right now the scene only has one directional and one ambient for lighting.

[Iguiniz.X.]

This may be my first post on your threath but I'm already enjoying it since the beginning.:cool:
Your challenge is a hell of a job and you just keep us updated!
It looks excelent with the Crysler building ( Atr deco, right?)
I like the detail of the stones on the roof in the front. and with the plants covering it.:applause:
I just can say keep this up and I think you'll come a long way.
meanwhile I'll keep en joying:beer:
:thumbsup:
:wavey:

[Adam Klein]

A lot of great stuff, you've addded. One thing I notice is at the horizen, where the buildings are smallest, well across the water, the trees look taller than these buildings, it seems to throw off scale a bit.

keep it uuuup
:thumbsup:

[OZ]

Great idea!May u add a little blu haze?It could give more deepness at the image.seeya:wavey:

[dmcgrath]

Hey Zro,
Are those all paint efx trees in the background? If they are you could just render them seperately and paste them onto some simple geometry. Then, scale/ rotate/ etc however you want. It could save you some time on rendering. You really have your work cut out for you. It's looking better and better though.:airguitar

[ZrO-1]

@ OZ: I'll be putting in a teeny bit of haze at the end when everything else is perfect :p

@ dmcgrath: Rendering time isn't a problem here. :D

Alrighty, now that I've basically got an idea about where I want the green stuff I've deleted all the temp trees. I will be putting them back in brush stroke by brush stroke so that each one is perfect. I did a test render using GI_Joe (best plug-in ever). This is my very first time using GI_Joe so it's still kind rough and I haven't quite figured it all out yet.

So for new stuff in this pic we have GI_Joe, new ferns/grasses on the close roof, tweaked shaders all around, and ray-tracing turned off. Let me know what you think.

[Scott Harris]

ahh...there is G.I.joe...

[ZrO-1]

Yeah there it is. I love the softness it gave to the scene, but I'm not crazy about the tint it has cast over everything. I need to work on that. I'll pro'lly spend most of tomorrow trying everything in GI_Joe and seeing what it does. Really I think I just want to get that colored cast to the image out of there, while keeping some of the softness.

[Scott Harris]

yeah i know what your refuring to...i'ts right here...

select ONE of the lights on the top of the sky dome and then go to the attributes editor...(Ctrl A) just in case...you know...

[levin]

the concept is a winner, need i say more?
the textures are beginning to look good,

the only thing that bothers me is the camera angle.
the camera is facing the buildings flat.
maybe a more dynamic angle could improve the image.

[GrAnt]

Lookin good man!!!! You are managing to convey your original idea really well! keep it up and i cant wait to see it finished :)

[dmcgrath]

Hey Zr0

Where did you get the Gi JOe plugin? Is it costly? As for the rendering, it is very nice looking so far, you are pushing it into the aqua green color which will look cool, especially after you do all the other trees.

[Scott Harris]

hey man any updates today? I'm curious...did my advice help you at all with that tint?

[ZrO-1]

Sorry gang, I've been away from the PC for most of this weekend. I was getting burnt and needed some R&R. Anyway I have a small update for you. Basically what it is is I added in a sky. I changed the steel texture on the chrysler building (yes, again ;) ) and I put a temporary texture on the small background buildings to try and get a feel for how I might texture them. C & C away :D
I got the GI_Joe plugin from www.3dluvr.com/pixho/ and it's free

[hypercube]

Ah yeah, I know what you mean..it's kind of stupid when you get a break from doing CG and then relax by doing more CG. Or get away from the radiation of the monitor and carpal tunnel inducing mouse, to the radiation of the TV and carpal tunnel inducing gamepad. Sometimes you just have to get the **** out of dodge. :D

Anyway, looking cool..sky helps..much more subtlety on the chrysler building..trees are looking good, though the foreground one is seeming sort of metallic? Temp surface on the buildings kind of confuses things a bit when looking across the scene, but it'll all come out in the wash.

One aside though..lose the PURPLE. :argh: Insanely distracting. Rooftops are usually incredibly bland, I'd make whatever goes on it the interesting bit and let it blend away..right now it pulls your eye toward it so hard it almost comes out of the socket.

Anyway, sorry, didn't mean to get off on a rant..coming along great and look forward to more, more, more :D

[Scott Harris]

hey did you planer project that texture on those buildings? there is streching on the top and sides...tri-planer projection will work better in that case...
anyway...just trying to help. Keep it up man looking forward to updates:beer:

[ZrO-1]

Yeah I was aware of the stretching (you were right it was planar mapped).
Anyway, I have a new update. I tweaked the textures and the lighting. The textures that are on the buildings now will be the final textures and I'll focus on tweaking them. Of course I still need to do the textures (displacement maps and color) for the windows and details of the buildings. I won't leave that out, but as far as the basic texture and shade of the buildings what you see is what you get...unless someone can convince me that they are absolutley terrible and need to be re-done. :p

Oh, and here is the link to the high-res version:
www.mjg1.net/City8.jpg

Obviously I still need to get the trees back into the scene and put leaves on my two main trees. Hopefully I'll have more of that in the next update.

[ZrO-1]

Here's annother one....are they that bad? Nobody wants to tell me they suck? C'mon! tell me how bad my stuff sucks...

[Pixarman]

I think it's looking pretty good.

I have a question though, the reflection of the foreground tree in that center building, I think its too big. It makes the scale of the scene look very small.

I would like to see some treetops maybe at the lower points of the city, like in the middle area a bit...or some cool vines and vegatation wrapped around the smaller buildings....

I really like this concept and it has been something like I've been wanting to do myself for a long time...I think you've inspired me to go ahead and just do it. :thumbsup:

I can't wait to see the final image.

Pixarman

[ZrO-1]

Thx pixarman. The reflection was actually a mistake at first but I kind of liked it. It got sort of large looking when I tried to soften it and make it look more blurry and broken up. I'll work some more on it. I will have trees all throughout the city. They just really slow my system down once I get all of them in there so I'm waiting untill I have most of the other stuff finnished.

[ZrO-1]

OK, I've got an update for you guys (and gals). I got some folliage onto the two main trees. Basically it's a customized paintFX brush. I still need to do some tweaks to it but overall I'm really happy with how it turned out.

Here's a link to the high-res pic:
www.mjg1.net/City10.jpg

[Howard Day]

Nice. Two things: The far tree's leaves appear to be completely out of scale...and the water needs majoro work. It looks like you too a picture in your bathtub right now... Heh. Other than that, I' impressed with how this is going.

Keep it up...

[alaklij]

Hello Zr0-1,
I would like to comment on your composition. I have a hard time explaining anything briefly, but I'm going to try.

I believe your compsition would be stronger if you pulled the camera away from the buildings further, to exaggerate and allow the viewer to establish the the grandiose size of the trees.

OR, you can focus more closely on the main building (Empire State Building) off to the left or right while allowng the rest of the image to expand into the horizon.

I make these these comments because I looks like you want to focus on one section, yet feel you should create the scene.

I guess you could approach this as a cropped image and never view the other sides, or you invest much time building the scene in order the hae a camera fly through.

I say all of this not only because I'm a critical guy, but because I criticize things I like. :) :beer:

Cheers, and good luck.or

[ZrO-1]

Thanks for the comments guys. I've made some changes as suggested. Unfortunetly the camera angle has to say where it is because I've moddeled the whole set based on this camera position and any change would ruin the illusion. Anyway, here's a little update. Let me know what you think of this one:

Here's the high-res version:
www.mjg1.net/City11.jpg

[Clanger]

This is starting to look really good your making great progress.
The sea colour's a little odd though, maybe less cyan.

[ZrO-1]

Yeah...I still need to work on that water. What do you guys think: darker water, or lighter water?

[Bezerker75]

Hey man looking great!!
I would love to see it with a sunset, to bring more reds,pinks and oranges in with the blues and greens...or maybe have the sun just over the back ridge of the buildings with some rays of light shinning through them. :thumbsup:

[hypercube]

Hey, looking great..the foreground tree is ruling. :thumbsup:

Definitely darker water..the ocean and harbors are very dark. Deeper blue green, and tight speculars, maybe kill the waves a bit, unless you're going to have breakers coming around the bridge..but really since that's not the focus of the scene I'd make it subdued and natrual, let it sink into the atmosphere in the back.

Main other things I'd say right now is the new trees should be the same green-ness as the others, and more dense kind of makes them seem smaller/younger. I'd cheat it and vary their height more so that none are growing in front of the chrysler building tree/damage, gotta show that off and get the eye there.

And lighting wise you've lost the sun..feels very overcast..a strong direction with bright highlights coming off the chrysler building and etc. would really make it pop. Sunset is a good idea, too, gotta love the magic hour lighting.

Keep on keepin' on..

[derwolpertinger]

good work man!!:thumbsup:
i like the trees most-they're really great. i wish i could make a tree with leaves-but that's kinda heavy without maya and pfx ;(
however you gotta have to make some colour adjustments. especially the plants coming up behind the building in the foreground are way too much saturated. and in the top of the front tree i can see some stretches of the texture. there you gotta edit the uv a bit.
so go on- wanna see some updates!! :bounce: :bounce:

[ZrO-1]

OK you guys here's a sunset style version. I left the actual sun out for now...but maybe I'll try a version with the sun visable next. I still am working on the green of the trees that rise between the foreground tower roof and the chrysler building. And I'm still working on the water as well. Let me know how its coming. I left the high-res version out since the details are the same as the last pic except for the lighting.

[Sangotten]

HEy that going great!!!

I think the textures are looking much better now and the tree is looking stunning!!! I think there are some minor things that need a bit of attention, first the water is to rough, smooth it down, because now it looks like it is storming or that scale is way off! second the textures on the top of the empire state building looks better but the texture of the lower part looks really out of place... maybe look for some refference...
That was it, goodluck...

You're going great!!!:thumbsup:

[Wancieho]

Hey man, I just saw this challenge topic for the first time today so i'm gonna try enter myself(not much time left:))

Okay as far as your image: The latest image is starting to look much better but I feel you really need to add more detail to your textures. Your "general" texture bump doesn't look quiet right. Try using a mix bump map, this helps for close ups. The geometry of your buildings needs to be less sharp aswell.

The top of the roof at the bottom of the image looks to smooth. From your first post it seems you have learnt quiet a bit but you need to concentrate more on the texturing.

It's a bit tough to see now but do u still have that shiny texture on the eagle? I really don't see the eagle being shiny as if a city is this run down, who's gonna be keeping it clean?:) (no offense) It's very doubtful anything will be shiny, I think you really need to dirty things up(one of your buildings is very shiny aswell).

Another hint would be to go down more to ground level for a more "forest" kind of feel as the view of your image at the moment is straying a little off topic. I know this wasn't your original intention. Otherwise create more trees, shrubs etc...... in the main view.

I really don't mean to offend I just feel nobody is really telling you where and how to fix things. If nobody does you can't improve:) I know u got ticked a little at Dave so I hope I don't land up on that receiving end:)

[ZrO-1]

Thanks. I have to say I kind of impressed myself when I saw the results of my last render. I'm really happy with the scene with the sunrise/sunset lighting as it is now. I like the low sun angle and orangy-yellow light with out it being obviously a redish sunset or purpleish sunrise. So I'm calling the lighting finnished. I don't think I could do better than that if I tried for the rest of the challenge. Now I'm just going to focus on the textures and the trees.

In the next update I'll fix the water and get the rest of the trees into the scene. If both of those work I'll do the windows and refine the textures on the buildings.

Then If I have any time left after those things I need to add in a magical creature or two. I'd pro'lly just use simpified, suggestive models that are small and in the distance since the focus of my piece is the enviroment.


**************
738 posts since April. Leigh better watch out, I'm catching up to her record. :p :D

[dobermunk]

I really like what this has turned into - though I think the buildings need more crud, so to speak. They seem too intact.

I like the illustrative feel you've gotten.

[Bezerker75]

I really like what you did with the sunrise/sunset...I think it helps bring in the warm colors that it needed....coming right along!!! I know you are working on textures, and you are probably doing this already, but I would love to see some more elements from your original sketch. For instance, it would be great to have cracks in the buildings, and maybe some vines and moss...and maybe busted out windows....etc...keep it going it's looking excellent!!

[ZrO-1]

Expect a pretty big update from me tomorrow (or I should say later today since its 2:30am here). I think I've nailed the trees that make the forrest part of the scene. I'm doing a test render while I sleep and I'll post it as soon as I get back to the PC. Assuming I like the results and I don't get any crits about the foliage then the next step will be adding things to the buildings like the windows, cracks, vines(on the chrysler building), etc.

Well, stay tuned, this next one should be interesting :cool:

[ZrO-1]

OK guys, here's the latest. I re-mapped the sky's colors to the water's reflection. I re-tweaked all the trees also. I think it looks better like this. Let me know what you think.

Oh, and the high-res is definetly needed now. Here's the link:
www.mjg1.net/ForrestCity.jpg

[Faeroon]

Loooooooooooking goooood!!! :thumbsup:
- especially the foilage is awesome:drool: (Zr0 - I sent you a PM
yesterday, regarding the making of the foilage - did you get it?)

The only thing that needs to be finished seems to be the
waterplane - it ends to suddenly and leaves us with the skyshader.
Maybe some fog?
But hey - I think you've allready seen/fixed it ;) *g*

[ZrO-1]

Thx Faeroon I'm glad you like it. I'll try extending the water back a bit further and see how that helps blend the horizon a bit more. I never think to check my PM I'll do it now. :)

[Iguiniz.X.]

:applause: What a great tree you got there man.
Jus abslolutly awsome.:thumbsup:
As I always ask at the people who got awsome tree's.
HOW YOU MADE IT. ANd espaecialy the leaves.
One by One?
I don't have much to critisize but that it is really to bas you ai't using the windows like the crysler building noramlly has. In reall live I mean.
I think you know what I mean that's why I didn't post a pic.
:wavey: bye bye :wavey:

[ZrO-1]

Hehehe hey Iguiniz.X, how's this one? LOL I was working on putting the windows in when you posted that one. :D
As far as the tree goes, all the twigs and leaves are made with Maya's 3Dpaint FX brush tool (with a lot of customizing by me). It works by brushing a control curve onto a NURBS surface and having tubes come off of the curve that control the tree attributes.

OK guys in this picture I extended the water back further into the horizon. Also, I tweaked the texture on the less important towers to get rid of some texture wraping that was going on (you could see it as a lime-green top on a tower behind the chrysler tower). And pro'lly the most obvious change is that I added in the windows on the arches of the chrysler tower's top.

Here's the link to the high-res version:
www.mjg1.net/ForrestCity2.jpg

[ZrO-1]

I refined the textures on the chrysler building. I've got some closeups as well as a new master shot. Let me know what you think C&C please.

Here's the master shot:
and here's the link to the high-res: www.mjg1.net/ForrestCity3.jpg

[ZrO-1]

Here's a closeup of the arches:

[ZrO-1]

And lastly here's a closeup of the eagles. I know about the stretching, but it doesn't show up in the master so I'm pro'lly going to ignore it.

[Adam]

Hey that is looking great. The arch texturing looks great. Maybe dingy up the metal atena point thingy on top of the chrysler a little (scratches or just some dirt and dust build up. Your scene is really coming together. the sky looks good and the water finally fits really well

oh maybe add a radial or linear grdient opacity on the edge of the water so it fades into the sky a little better.

[ZrO-1]

Thx for the C&C adam. I'll see what I can do about softening the edge of the water.

Anyone else here have any C&C??? :hmm:

[alaklij]

Lovely.

[AuK59]

lovely, but you might wanna tone down the reflection on the top of the tower. Great work man.

[ZrO-1]

Here's the latest version:

pic deleted

I'm getting tired of looking at this thing. I think I'm going to take a couple of days off of working on this. That way I can come back to it fresh. Any C&C would be helpfull, I'm too close to it now to tell what needs to be done.

[ZrO-1]

One last picture for a little while. This is a close-up of the damage area of the chrysler building. As you can see here (and in the master shot above) I added back in the steel beams protruding out of the walls and around the tree.

[AroundTheFur]

I like it, but the only thing that really bothers me is the sharpness of the buildings. I havent read all the posts in this thread so i hope im not repeating anything, but I would say if you could slightly round off the edges and add some wear to them, it would make the scene a lot more believable. :buttrock:

[MikaelPersson]

The only thing that really bothers me is the bricks on the chrysler building.
This far away they just looks like a random pattern. To uniform. I know those kinds of textures are hard to do. But I would add a larger fractal or colour ramp/something to break up the uniformity.

But I know exactly what you mean by getting of and aquiring perspective. In a few days you will have fresh eyes again and change exactly the things needed to.

[Mr. Nice Guy]

It looks very good. The only thing is the Chrysler building map. In the total shot you cant see that it is brick. Maybe you can give it more the color, then using a brick map.

And aren't there any windows in the Chrysler building. It is now a very big brick building.

I really like the tree in the front. Nice texture and good looking leaves. How have you done that

Keep on going

[ZrO-1]

@MikaelP: I agree about the bricks in the distance. I'll see what I can do about them. I'm glad you like the rest of the pic so far.

@Mr. Nice Guy: Hopefully when I make the changes to the bricks to make them look less like noise I can also make the grid of the pattern stand out more. The Chrysler Building will have windows. It's the next thing I'm working on. As far as the tree: I modeled the main trunk and limbs. I then modified a 3D PaintFX brush to make the smaller limbs, twigs, and leaves. Glad you like it THX.

Here's a new update (so much for taking a break) :p
I "dirtied-up" the textures on most of the buildings. And I added preliminary windows to the little buildings. Let me know if it's better or worse. :thumbsup: :thumbsdow

[MikaelPersson]

wow, I like your windows. They add a lot. If there were some like them visibly broken in the chrysler building you would have a real nice house.

[Faeroon]

Yep I agree with Mika - the windows add a great part of
realism - more of them plz :thumbsup:

PS: Uuuuuuh the foliage , the fooooiiilage... so nice....
I'm going to add lot of this in my pic too :airguitar

[AroundTheFur]

I just had a quick thought, just something to throw out there. Aside from the tree coming out of the chrystler building, it doesnt look much like the forest has 'taken over' it kinda just looks as though its there. I was thinkin maybe add some vines to other buildings and stuff like that. just a thought...rock on:buttrock:

[Scott Harris]

hey! looking better every time you update...:thumbsup:

[Pancreas]

Nice idea! Nature will revenge... he he.
Maybe a few birds (no pigeons) flying and nesting on the buildings would reinforce the idea of nature invading the city.
The tree of the right side is superb, nice leaves! :thumbsup:

[ZrO-1]

Here's a new one. I think I'm about ready to call all of the secondary buildings finnished. All I really need to do now is finnish the Chrysler Building and get some enchanted things in there. Here's the full resolution image:

Picture deleted

[Bezerker75]

nice update!! I just had a thought...maybe you could have more of the buildings showing there steel framework and less intact brick and glass...I really like the look of the tree growing out of the building, and I think more of that sort of thing will help to give the sense that these buildings have been deteriorating for years and the trees and vines have just taken over....deffinately getting there though!:cool:

[leigh]

Hey Zr0-1, nice update! :thumbsup: Just a few general comments though -

- Everything needs to look older. If the city is so overgrown, it would stand to reason that no-one is cleaning those buildings everyday. Cover them in bird poop! And rain streaks! And grime and dirt!

- Also, try making the green of the leaves ever so slightly duller - they are a bit too bright :surprised

- Something you might want to consider is blurring your horizon line. At the moment it looks strange the way your scene just kinda ends suddenly.

- Let's have some more smashed glass!!

- that mottled brownish texture on the Chrysler building - what is that? It doesn't look quite right :surprised

By the way, that tree is the foreground looks really really cool :applause:

[ZrO-1]

The tree coming out of the Chrysler Building will be the only one like that.
I want to have that be the only one to help keep that tower unique compared to the rest of the buildings.

One thing I am playing around with is adding Elf-made castle type structures that are built on the outside faces of a couple of buildings. They would come off the building face in the same way the tree comes off the Chrysler building, but be more like the Elf city from LOTR movie in style.

So with the elf castles, the giant in the background, and a couple dragons on the tower tops, I think the piece should have a nice magical feeling to it.

[ZrO-1]

Hey Leigh! Nice to see you here in my little neck of the woods :D

I'll see what I can do about the dirt and grime as well as the leaves.
I'm trying out a couple of things to soften the horizon...just haven't found one that works all that great.

I'll get my baseballs and bat out and start smashing some windows up :twisted:

The mottled, brown texture on the Chrysler building is a brick texture. You can see the brick in the close-up shots earlier in this thread. I think that the camera is pulled too far back for the "grid" part of the bricks to show up in the render so it ends up looking like noise.

I'll try fixing the little things now...and then I'll work on the Chrysler building.

Thanks for the C&C!

[3DZukini]

Hey Zro, looking good so far...maybe some sort of linear fog would help fade off that horizon line. The trees and foliage look great!:thumbsup:

[ZrO-1]

I fixed the horizon. Maybe a tiny touch more tweaking but it's mostly there now.

[Traiven3d]

Wow, really lovin that tree...

The only thing I could suggest is maybe adding some vines growing up the sides of some of the background buildings to help tie your whole image together.

Also I find the grey building to the right of the Chrysler, near the center of the image, very distracting... its seems to keep pulling my eye away from the Chrysler building... which I think is more of a focal point...

Just my 2 cents... eager to see this image finished...

[ZrO-1]

OK guys, Here's a small update:
I further refined the sky horizon color and the water horizon color. I tweaked the brick texture on the Chrysler building to try and make it look less noisy. I also messed around with the settings on the glass in the windows and dulled down some of the trees in the background. I'm not sure if I like the new window glass. Let me know what you think overall, but especially the glass. THX.

picture deleted

[ZrO-1]

C'mon guys...what only 5 people can make C&C in this forum? :p I'm seeing the views, now lets get some comments going on. I need input

[mikey11]

I like the advancement of this image...but I got a couple of points that caught my eye:

1. the perspective of your sky image, both geometric and atmospheric, is off. Clouds shoud seem to go towars a vanishing point, also, they should be so close together at farthest point that they are simply a wash of pale color. They also need a little more depth in the texture, to show volume, and shouldn't be so sharp.

2. Reflections in the windows to work on; way too strong for the distance they are from camera...unless you are going for that super-sun type window reflection, therefore there would be a flare up.

3. The texture of the roof in the foreground needs a little bit of work I think...

Now I got some questions for you!:-)

1. How did you do the tree and leaves? very nice...
2. How did you post such a large image with amazing quality on this forum?? I thought they had to be under 55 k....all my post images look like crap!:-))

Thanks and keep up the good stuff!

Mike

[Scott Harris]

hey major improvment...the lighting has improved too have you been playing around with G.I.joe much?

but you want c&c so...
the chrystler building has a procedrial texture on it and if you can tell that by looking its a bad thing...If I were you i'd still play around with it. There is also streching on the side of that building to the right of it. The black and white building with the slanted top is my favorite...the grunge works well on that one, I would like to see you try something like that on the chrystler...have you thought about adding a little green or brown to the metal for a hint of rust or decay?

I have seen major improvmets on this thread man, nice job...we were talking about compositing ideas befor...if you render the trees in a seperate layer and take them into photoshop you can overlay them with a grunge map, just slightly...then they will fit in really nice. and also so you can blur the ones in the distance...they are too sharp for how far away they are.
:cool:

[ZrO-1]

Thanks guys. I'll work on tweaking the roof texture, sky textures, and grunge on the buildings as well as fixing that spec/reflec on the window glass.

@ Mikey11: I make the trunk and main limbs of the 2 primary trees with a simple extrude. All the twigs and leaves are majorly tweaked PaintFX brushes.

@ Scott H.: Yeah I'm loving GI_Joe it's fantastic. What I ended up doing was getting the average lighting set in GI then I added an extra independant directional for the sunset light.

I am able to post such a large and high-quality pic because I have my own website with 20MB filespace :p

[derwolpertinger]

wow you changed a lot! lookin' really cool though.:buttrock: :buttrock:
the only crit would be that the green of the leaves is much too saturated.

[ZrO-1]

Well, I've modified the brick and steel textures on the Chrysler building to make it look older and more 'grungy'. I also reduced the spec on the building windows. What else...I tweaked the clouds...tweaked the close roof texture.

I think the only glaring thing is that I need to soften the green on the foliage on some stuff. Please let me know what you think. THX.

Picture Deleted

[ZrO-1]

One thing that I'm really happy about with this last version is that in my eye at least the textures don't feel 3D CG anymore. To me they almost have gotten a photoshop 2D feel to them. The only things that i'm not too crazy about right now are a few of the trees seem too sharp still and the green moss on the Chrysler building looks a bit over saturated. Other than that I'm really happy with how this has turned out. Plus the only non-procedural texture I have used in this entire scene is the tree bark on the foreground tree trunk. I'll tweak the trees and moss color tomorrow plus add the windows to the chrysler building, and that'll give me 9 days to add in the "fairy tale" elements.

If you think I'm off about the textures or anything please let me know.

[Kaos]

looking forward to the fairie tale elements.....

has great potential, just doesn't cut it at the moment... your sky is really bad......

I like the tree in the foreground.. looks cool........

[leigh]

Hmmmm there is something overall that isn't looking quite right in your scene...
I think it may be the lighting - it looks like you have global ambient lighting on. SWITCH IT OFF!!!! It's making things look flat.

And yeah, that sky looks bad - it's too flat as well....ummm I'm not really sure how you can fix that though, without going and getting a new sky image :shrug:

There also seems to be a greenish, luminous colour on the Chrysler building... :surprised

That building with the pointy top doesn't look right either - you shouldn't have the windows going all the way to the edge like that :)

Also, fix that brick texture in the foreground - it looks fine on the sides, but not on the top.

Your scene does have a good, solid base, it's a few tweaks here and there that need to be done :thumbsup:

[ZrO-1]

Thanks for the C&C guys. I'll work on adjusting some of the stuff you have mentioned. As far as the building with the angled top. That is the Citicorp building and it has bands of glass and steel that wrap all the way around the tower...hence the banding. The sky is just an enviroment sky texture on an image plane for the camera, so it's easy to change (getting it to look good is annother story ;) ).

As far as the lighting, I have been using GI_Joe to simulate global illumination. I guess I'll try a version without it and just a bunch of directionals and see how it looks.

Thanks again. Oh...and here is a slightly changed version of the above picture.

[rolhionjs]

wow ! your foreground tree looks really awesome ! Very detailed !
I like your composition alot ! To join the other comments, maybe just the sky is weird, and some texture too but the main image is good for my eyes :)

[JacobB]

wow this one sure has come along, great work, did you think of adding a little haze or fog to cover up the buildings in the background a little bit???

[ZrO-1]

@ JacobB: I might add in a little fog in the end, just to see if it helps anything.

OK guys, here's an update. I tweaked the sky to get rid of the harh edges the clouds had. I majorly modified the steel texture on the top of the Chrysler building. And I softened the trees in the background. It's kinda hard to see everything in the lower res version here, but I want to get some more things done before I post the big version.

[ajitmenon]

This is my first WIP challenge, but I didn't want to use the concept of the forest too literally. More than that, I wanted to create a sort of space that echoes the magical nature of the challenge : a 'forest' of rock and mystic space : and intersperse it with a mysterious silhouette.
Spatially, I believe this image is simple yet interesting. Anyway, it's one of the first things I have done using Maya.
Let me know what you all think of it.

the final image is located at :
http://www.theriverbanks.com/image.jpg

[ZrO-1]

:curious: Ummm...Wrong thread?? I think you posted in the wrong section. :p

[ZrO-1]

OK, this is off topic, but a few people have been asking me how I did my foliage and what are PaintFX/how do they work. So I found this HUGE, detailed, and very complete FAQ tutorial on Maya's PaintFX tool set over on Highend3D. Here is the link (http://www.highend3d.com/maya/tutorials/paintfxqa/index.3d) to the article.

[digital_rhino]

I didnt read all 15 pages of posts, so i dont know if anyone addressed this already but...It seems to me that the water level around the city is awfully high to not be protruding into the city itself. It just seems like there should be water showing in the center of the scene somewhere. Other than that its coming along real nice. Cant wait to see some creatures.

[Risibility]

spare us the brick texture on the chrysler building, its hurting my eyes. fix water.

good good

[A MacVey]

on the chrysler building I would make the bricks a tad bit bigger and add some grime or dirt, to break up the brick texture a bit. Also it should show some ware since I dont think they would wash it...and the bricks right in front of you need some grime. Where that bridge enters the water, I would make the water slightly transparent so you can see the bridge under water and maybe even add some sand...I also think the scene would look MUCH better as a night scene, or a rain storm

[ZrO-1]

New update:
Things I tweaked: the brick...reflections all around...sky(again)...

Let me know if the changes are headed in the right direction.
P.S. Part of the reason the brick still looks rough is because of the high JPEG compression. Once I make a few more adjustments I'll post a full res version.

[Carl]

Yeah, I think the jpeg compression is really hurting the image. Have you tried photoshop's 'save for web' feature? I've gotten some nice results with it.

[ZrO-1]

Here's the latest full-res version.
pic deleted
Let me know if the brick is better now.

[hypercube]

Cool, it's starting to come together..exorcising the clouds helped free it up, and the more trees you get in the better..liking how the broken area on the chrysler building works.

But, (yes, that but), still problems..

Sky-wise and lighting-wise it feels more like the sun just went down, and it's not sunset..if that's what you're going for, that's cool, if not, need to golden it up and make the sun much brighter, plus make the orange-to-blue fade from the sun direction instead of universally toward the horizon. On the horizon, it seems way close still, like it's a large dropoff and waterfall in the back. Have to find a way to haze that out or extend the ocean way farther. Also would help I think if the clouds just faded into the sky color rather than black, may not cause you to look there or divide it so sharply.

Surfacing wise, I think it's starting to work, but a lot of the noise still feels like noise (maybe I've just seen too much of it over time and am sensitive to it). One major thing is that the reflective materials (glass, steel, maybe even the water) seem to be reflecting something amazingly bright that's not in the scene..when the sky gets dark, they should get dark, and everything reflected get dark. Right now it's making them glow unnaturally. The windows on the dark red building are more like all the others should be.

The chrysler is getting to be effective, and while I really like the moss/vines creeping up it, it kind of confuses the eye, it could either be huge or the size of a freeway underpass. That brings me to the big one - Scale. I think that's the thing hurting most right now, is that none of the scales match. The buildings near the citibank building seem to have windows and floors that are way larger than it, and on some of the other buildings it seems to be visually the same size yet physically much farther away in the scene, or vice versa, and it all becomes very confusing. On the windows riff also, need to get some on the remaining buildings as well, especially the chrysler, since no matter how old it is, they'd still be there..even a map would be fine from this distance. Some detail on the A/C or generator or rooftop-gizmo in the foreground left would help a lot too.

Anyway, didn't mean to write so much, and trying not to come across as harsh, it's just a really great image and would like to see you go the whole nine yards with it. Amazing how much text it takes to say things that would be a conversation of a few minutes in realtime. It's really great especially considering it's your second texturing venture! Gaining by leaps and bounds for sure.

So hopefully some of that made sense and look forward to seeing how it turns out at the finish line. :)

[ZrO-1]

good stuff 'cube! :) They are all good points. I'll see what I can do to address them.

[ZrO-1]

Alright guys, made some big changes. I modified some of the modeling in the middle-ground city. I also majorly tweaked the textures in that section. I also adjusted some more of the trees in the background, tweaked the water at the horizon, and added a few more bits of land back by the horizon. The last thing I did (and the most obvious) is that I added environment fog. Right now I have it at half-height...but I'm having trouble getting it to fade nicely into the non-fog above. If anyone here knows how to get the fog fading nicely I'd appreciate it if you could give me a pointer with that.

Anyway, here's the pic:
picture deleted
Let me know if you think the fog should carry all the way vertically in the scene. I think I would rather have it fade as it goes up, but if I can't get it to fade out nicely I would like to know if that band where the fog ends is not a good thing. Thanks.

[MikaelPersson]

Your new fog really helps the image. How about adding another one for depth?
How would your scene look with one more defined shadow? I like the overal look of the light. But a thought, how would it look if your front tree would cast a shadow over the roof. I think it could be real nice if you had a shadow from the tree going to the left.

How about a tad more contrast? I would appriciate some areas in almost complete shadow.

[ZrO-1]

Here's the version with the fog fully filling the image.

@ Mikael P: I'll see what I can do about increasing the contrast.

[ZrO-1]

OK I have some major changes with the lighting and shadows. I really love this render. Let me know what you think. C&C appreciated. Thanks!
Picture Deleted

[alaklij]

Wow! Much better! Darker foreground, lighter background... very nice, working well.

[Faeroon]

Alaklij took the words outta my mouth.
It really looks a LOT better now!
Keep on the good work!! (and so will I *posts an update*)

[MikaelPersson]

Now we´re talking. I think You´ve got the light right this time. The light looks really good. It actually looks like a sunset ;).
Now there is only one thing left. Sharper more defined shadows. Such low a sun usually do cast sharp shadows.
Good Work!

[ZrO-1]

@ Mikael P: I'm glad you like the lighting. I'm really happy with it too. :) As far as the shadows, I think I'm going to leave them as they are. That's for a couple reasons; 1, I think with it being such a hazy/foggy day in the pic there wouldn't be real hard shadows do to all the light scattering. And 2, I think hard shadows are always showing up in 3D CG and I can't stand that. So I think they'll stay soft.

OK on annother note....I got the windows mapped onto the bricks for the Chrysler tower. Once I get the color/spec/reflec worked out for them I'll post it as a full res version. Please let me know how you guys think the windows are.

[ZrO-1]

One thing I forgot to add. I'm having a bit of trouble getting all the paintFX stuff to cast nice shadows. Any other Maya users out there know the best way to get the paintFX stuff to cast decient shadows? Mine keep coming out solid black and I can't figure out how to soften/lighten them. :annoyed:

[OZ]

:thumbsup: WOW!!!and again WOW! U image is fantaztik! The colors are very good.............the tree looks icredible!Great work! u are a big surprise!:surprised ! WWRRRROK!

[MikaelPersson]

:) You are correct about CG and hard shadows. I was almost forgetting myself.
I am sorry I cant help you with the Pfx shadows. It´s so seldom I get to use it. I take care of the problem when it appears, then I forget it.
But I could try to look into it. I just have to remember.

It looks absolutley great. Now we´ll have to take the critique to a whole new level.
One thing I thought of now when I looked harder at it. It would be nice to get the sense of great height. Just after the end of the roof. Maybe move the camera a bit upwards (I know that that suggestion is evil :twisted: ). I dont have any other idea at the moment. But you did get what I meant?

[ZrO-1]

Well boys and girls, stick a fork in this one.
I'm really happy with this last version. And I think I'm calling this one complete. I know I had said that I was going to add in more magical things, but this is an 'enchanted' forrest not a 'magical' forrest. Plus I think this holds truer to the original sketch.

So...without further ado, here's the final image :)
Pic Deleted...for final image go to last page

Please let me know what you think.

[Faeroon]

Gratulations Zr0!! :beer:
Finally you've reached the end - it looks really good
and again I wish you good luck with the contest :)

It's great that your picture looks remarkable like your
sketch - look at my pic - my initial sketched was totally different :rolleyes:

Cheers :wip:

[Mr. Nice Guy]

I really like the end result. It is good to see that the Chrysler building has windows now.
I also like the feeling of a morning (evening) sun, but maybe you can make the shadows a bit darker, so that it give a more dramatic effect.

And I still love your tree with the leaves.

Good work

[ZrO-1]

Thanks for the kind words guys :love: . @ Mr. Nice Guy: actually the shadows are kind of strong already but the fog softens them up a lot. If you look just at the Chrysler building and the foreground roof top you'll see that the contrast is actually really strong. As far as making it stronger to compensate for the fog, I'm not going to. I really really like the softness the scene has to it now and I think stronger shadows would wreck that. Also, the primary light is coming from behind and to the right of the buildings so the strongest shadows would be coming at the camera, putting the scene into sihloette.

Basically, the lighting will stay as it is. It's the best lighting I have ever done and trying to tweak it will just make it worse (IMO). I'll still do tweaks with the textures and foliage if people see that anything needs adjusting there, but thats pro'lly all. :D
:beer:

[Carl]

Man, that was quite an ambitious concept and you pulled it off. Awesome! :thumbsup: You might want to try making the lit side of the Chrysler building even 'hotter': http://www.lordoftherings.net/media/desktops/tt_dsktp_800.jpg

[ZrO-1]

I thought you guys might like a closer shot of the Chrysler building. This shows a slightly different angle on some of the more interesting bits. Just keep in mind the rest of the stuff was set up to look good from the primary camera angle not this one. :D

[samartin]

That is some awesome work u have done there... but...

1 thing that looks wrong 2 me is the FG brick work it looks like u applied the brick texture only 2 the X axis ??? but apart from that faultless... :applause: :applause:

[ZrO-1]

@ samartin: I'm sorry, but I don't understand what you mean. Are you talking about the red brick tower with the tree coming out of the roof in the primary shot foreground? The red brick is a tri-planar projection and it's applied to the whole building. So I really don't understand what you mean....sorry:shrug:

[samartin]

just got home so I could upload the piccie...

sorry I didn't make things 2 clear 4 ya... I think it's just the tops of u're bricks, they just look as they are laid the wrong way ???

Hope this image helps u c wot I am talking about...

http://www.samartin.co.uk/jpg's/brick.jpg

[ZrO-1]

Oh... I see what you're talking about now. The bricks there do stagger, but the angle is low and what it is doing is there is a row with two bricks across then a row with one brick across. The low angle makes it difficult to see the single brick rows...but they do stagger. ;)

I'll see what I can do about tweaking that top bit of the bricks.

[ZrO-1]

@ Mikael P: I must have missed your last post after OZ's. Sorry 'bout that. I think I have a few ideas about the shadows for the PaintFX. I'll see if maybe a slightly different camera angle helps anything. Thanks

[ZrO-1]

I have some more close-up renders for you guys. Here's a series of different shots (these are just to show some of the various details):

[ZrO-1]

Here's the eagles. You'll notice that this close to the building the image for my texture becomes pixelated, but from the main shot that's not a problem.

[ZrO-1]

this is the roof top where the primary camera is set up, but the angle is from the tree top.

[ZrO-1]

Alright you guys. I got the paintFX casting nice shadows onto the foreground roof. So I'm calling this one complete. Please feel free to say what you want about the piece. C&C away.

Here it is:
Picture Deleted

[MikaelPersson]

I like it. The behind the scenes renders were especially nice. The best one was the view from the tree.

I think your scene would benefit from a slight camera angle shift. I have an idea for it:
pull back most, raise it slightly and narrow the view angle somewhat.

I think your foreground tree would benefit from being a bit darker. Do it in post. No re-lighting. Only the trunk though.

[derwolpertinger]

well-what can i say...nice work man!!!!:thumbsup: it was really great to see the process of your work and what you came up with again and again.:applause: :applause: i'm lookin' forward to see your work in the next challenge.

but there must be one crit at all:p :i think that the texture of the roff in the foreground is kind of a bit to low res. that's all! :)

[ZrO-1]

Thanks for the complements guys. I really appreciate all the tips and constructive crits I have gotten from everyone for this piece.

You know, I was just looking at the WIP thumbnail entry page, and all I can say is that I am SO glad I don't have to judge this month's challenge. There are so many great pieces and they are all good in different ways. I think this one is going to be a really hard one.

Anyway, thanks so much for all the support. Your guys help helped me make the best 3D image I have ever done so far. Thanks.

P.S. 919 posts in 3 months....think I spend too much time here? ;)

[ZrO-1]

Hey guys, anyone know where the results of the challenge are going to be put up?