11 seconds january competition

[citizenvin]

good one.. were you got these rigged characters.. can you share this..

[cani]

Cool keep working on that!
Characters are funny!

[zacleck]

All right, I really need some finalizing critiques. I've looked at this thing so many times I can't tell if something looks off or not.

http://vimeo.com/9033261

[Paul B]

I love the characters and setting but found it kind of "floaty". It might be better if the characters held a stronger poses for their dialogue. I felt I was never quite sure where to look because the character who wasn't talking was often moving around just as much as the one who was.

[zacleck]

can you be more specific please? I understand what you're saying but can you recommend specific areas to tighten up? Would you expect the character not talking to simply be sitting still? I haven't done a lot of character acting so any advice you could give me would be greatly appreciated.

-zac

[Paul B]

...I think it's mostly the tall, skinny guy. He should just sit still and quiet before leaning a bit forward for his line (lose the "no" head shake) then, when he drinks he should just quickly assume and hold the drinking pose while the other guy is talking. I think that would give you some contrast between the characters, the tall guy being more contained and reserved than the chubby one.

[Paul B]

This is what I think I'd do.

Lose Skinny's first pose and keep him in the upright pose he's at for "kin" but with his head towards camera. Have Chubby hold the fingerpoint pose (it's nice and strong) for the silent beat. Then Skinny just looks at him (hold) then leans forward and holds as he delivers his line (without leaning back at "betray us") then holds his glass up to drink and holds that until he leans forward again, similar to but even further towards Chubby than his first line. I thought whacking the glass down is good but pounding the table with his fist is essentially a repeat and doesn't add anything. Chubby's wiggling fingers while Skinny says his 2nd line was destracting. Just a clenched fist would tell the story.

These are just ideas, I don't mean to derail your project but I just thought it would look better with less extraneous action. Hold the strong silhouette poses that tell the story.

[zacleck]

I appreciate your critique. I've developed a nasty habit of setting too many keys from the get go and still haven't mastered the concept of a holding a pose. I still have a few days to put into this so I should be able to turn it around and experiment with some of these ideas.

thanks again

[zacleck]

http://vimeo.com/9038456

[Jeremydjutras]

Hi Zac,
Chubby guy: there should be more rotation in his back as he throws the chair down, do this yourself, you'll feel the motion in the shoulder and how your back compensated the force. The point @ "kin" should be faster but also ease in a bit to the hold, you mentioned having difficulties with the holds, I see your problem. You are freezing the character. After you hit the pose, you should have another pose keyed 5 or so frames (depends on the speed, the faster the motion, the more frames usually needed to cushion) from it that is pushed slightly more, easing into this new key.

Skinny fella': is mouth shape and movement after he takes the shot seems awkward, I think his mouth should remain shut after he drinks until ready to speak again

After the chubby says "kin" and points at him there is a long pause before the skinny guy speaks. You should really use this moment!! The audience will no doubt be looking for a response and definitely be focused on the skinny guy @ this moment. You should do more then just blink. Maybe he leans in to tell the chubby guy the line or looks up to the sky annoyed as if he has been already trying to prove his point. Maybe you can think of something better but I think this moment is not being used to its full potential.
Good luck in this months comp!

[Paul B]

Yeah! That opening part is looking better to me. A thing I wanted to say is that Chubby is all about movement and Skinny is all about stillness. He's giving short rebuffing answers to counter Chubby's outrage. When Jeremy says to really use the beat after "kin" It can be something subtle like he describes but the point is to keep him still enough that a subtle bit of action will read. If he's always moving, then nothing really reads. I think Skinny should have his glass up for "betray" and then quickly put it to his lips with his head back, drinking. Then hold that pose (he's a bit of a dandy) trying to ignore Chubby but then whack the glass down bark at him (like you have done). All this is just getting at the idea of contrast. If he's going to whack the glass down, it has more impact if he holds a still, refined or reserved pose for a while before he loses his cool. Also, when Chubby's gesture is horizontal and directed, Skinny's can contrast him by being vertical and contained. As the conforntation builds, it might be nice if they lean closer for each line as the argument builds.

While I'm at it, I may as well say that I think Skinny is too close to the edge of frame at the outset of the scene.

[zacleck]

lovin this forum. thanks everyone

http://vimeo.com/9050304

[dbalmert]

Real quick thoughts:

There's competing movement (visually) when the thin guy takes a swig. Typically, you wouldn't animate wide actions on a non speaking character.

Chubby rotates away from the frame too many times (acting choices). He gestures with his shoulders/head too much. Make some interesting hand gestures/arcs to give me something to watch if he's going to whip his head around.

His head movement is really linear. Make it more circular and it will be easier to follow. Yes, he's rotating his head, but his head still moves linearly on screen.

Also, there's still a few frames of freezed movement on the hand when he points. Give it a little more movement, but keep it smoothed. People can't keep their hands that steady on a good day, let alone an angry one.

The thin guy slapping his knee before "Who was fixin to betray us" is a little distracting. He just picks his hand up and puts it back. He needs more flow/follow through. Also, I'd recommend having it change positions - by that I mean, take it from his hip to his thigh, or knee to thigh. Don't pick it up and put it back. It makes the action unnecessary.

[zacleck]

I just looked at that last responce so none of it is in here as of yet, but I'll look into that stuff before I submit it. the hand slap at the end was just a quick idea I threw into there to see how it felt, I was sort of indifferent to it so nothing else was put into it, I guess I'll take another look at that. I liked the crit of the head moving liner too so I'll look into that as well. either way, here's where it's at right now with just over two days left til the deadline.

http://vimeo.com/9078494

thanks to everyone who's looked at it thus far.

[dbalmert]

Just so we're clear, this is what I'm talking about for arcs:

http://www.keithlango.com/tutorials/old/arcs/arcs.htm

[Paul B]

I like this a lot better than the first pass you posted. If you have time, the one thing I'd love to see is a version where Chubby gets WAY closer with the point. I think it would really be great to fill up that yawning space between them. I know it's hard to retroactively change this stuff but if you could cheat it by even sliding his root controller over for that bit, I think it would be funny and build the moment a bit more.

[zacleck]

the only problem with pushing him in closer is that table. That was why I tried that camera push in thing a while back, to try and make them feel closer by the end. this whole clip would have benefited with some planning on my part, but, oh well. lesson learned

[zacleck]

Here it is, my final entry. It's unfortunate that I couldn't light and render this properly but I was animating up until the end, so, it is what it is. Thanks to everyone who commented, it's been fun.

Feel free to critique it still, though, as I'm sure to do another pass and get it rendered good and proper.

-zac.


http://vimeo.com/9117755 (http://vimeo.com/9117755)

[CGOutcast]

your poses and animation is great, i just would recommend more snapping into the poses. Feels a lil too smooth. Oh and I was workin on this wav for 11 seconds to lol I like yours, you should rate mine when i post. Keep it up.

[chrisanimator]

Hi Zacleck,
nice work,

but I think you should improve the poses. Try to push it a little more, and give it more Appeal. The video-references are very usefull, you should try to record yourself with a videocamera. You will find a lot of important information.

regards
Christian.

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