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T0BER
08-21-2003, 05:55 PM
Hello,

I have been working on this character for a while now and would like to get some feedback.

Specifically I would like to receive critiques relating to how to improve the overall feel of the character in terms of aesthetics and proportions, i.e. how to make her look prettier and more attractive.

I intend to animate her so any comments about the topology are also welcome.

I also want to get as close to a realistic render as possible so any help there would also be greatly appreciated.


3D Software: Maya 5.0 - Subdivision Surfaces, NURBS surfaces, Paint FX
2D Software: Photoshop 7.0
Renderer: Maya raytrace


Thankyou. :)


http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemShadePrev.jpg

Link to full resolution of render (http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemShadeFull.jpg)



http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemWirePrev.jpg

Link to full resolution of shade (http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemWireFull.jpg)

SDIT
08-21-2003, 06:25 PM
good start. Your edgeloops need work or you will have problems with deformations. There's no continuity in some areas. Specially right inbetweeb the cheek and the mouth and also around the eyes.
your ear is a little too far back and it looks very flat from the front view. make it more concave and reduce the size a little. The other thing is check the proportions of the skull.
I do like the hair. maybe a bit too shiny, but i like it. And one more thing, there's something weird going on in the front part of the neck. I can't see it very well since the image is small, but check that out too.
good luck!
:thumbsup:

dmcgrath
08-21-2003, 08:10 PM
SDIT- I think what you are seeing on the neck was done on purpose. I believe that those are suppposed to be the sterno-mastoid muscles.

T0BER- My biggest crit is the width of the neck is almost the same as the head, from the front. It looks strange to me. It looks okay on the 3/4 view, but the wires are distracting me.
On your next full render could you make some bounce light up under the chin and into the hair? You are making basically a black shadowform and a black background. Don't forget that the shadow's color should be the opposite of the light color. It looks like you are using a colored light, but a black shadow.

cybernaut
08-21-2003, 08:12 PM
Excellent work!!! :applause:

You've really got a good handle on creating the hardest type of head, that being a beautiful young girl. So often heads end up looking older than you want or sometimes even masculine!. But I must say, she is definitely starting to look quite "pretty". I can see couple of things you could do too improve her appearence. From the front she looks fine except for having a neck that is too thick...football player-ish. The profile of the neck is a more accurate width so use that as a guide. I noticed a few things off proportional in her profile, but as apposed to going into great detail as to what they are, I am going to simply post your image next to one with some quick changes that I had done to show a comparison. I hope it helps!!

http://www.cgtalk.com/images/cgtalk/prop.jpg

SDIT
08-21-2003, 08:42 PM
dmcgrath: yeah u r right. those are the sternocleidomastoideus muscles, what i meant was they don't look exactly the way they should. Sorry i wasn't clear ;)
Cheers

mFlux
08-22-2003, 11:35 AM
I'm not sure if this was intended. Did you already deform the head/rig it so that she's looking down? It looks as if you modeled it from a photograph that's rotated a bit.. and the details are all aligned with each other on the front of the face, while the rest of the skull is still back in where you started at a different orientation. Lemme illustrate what I mean:

http://www.design.ucla.edu/~mflux/FemWirePrev.jpg

I rotated the head to the proper orientation (line straight down from eye to cheek, forehead to chin), and found that the ears are slightly out of place, and the back of the skull's proportions are a bit messed. Check that up and see what you think.

T0BER
08-22-2003, 06:33 PM
Thanks for the replies, :)

I have made the following changes:

moved chin and mouth forward
nose moved up
eye area moved back
reduced top and back of head
ear reduced and widened
light added beneath chin
neck width reduced

http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemRenderPrev.jpg

Link to full resolution of render (http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemRenderFull.jpg)



http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemShadePrev2.jpg

Link to full resolution of shade (http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemShadeFull2.jpg)



SDIT: Thanks. Maya's subdivision surfaces allow for detail to be added in at various levels which allows for smooth deformations if details are added at a higher level. This is a picture of the level 0 cage:

http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemCagePrev.jpg

Link to full resolution of cage (http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemCageFull.jpg)

There was also some pinching at the front of the neck where the seam is - it has been straightened out now.


dmcgrath: Thanks, the neck width has been reduced and a light added. I'm not sure what you mean from your comment "Don't forget that the shadow's color should be the opposite of the light color". There are no colored lights but there is a slight orange to blue translucency effect added to the skin tone if that is what you are referring to.


cybernaut: Thanks, she is a bit more masculine and maybe older looking than what I had in mind originally, but I think she looks better now thanks to your guide - much appreciated.


mFlux: Thanks, there is no rigging yet but your guide is very similar to cybernaught's and I have made the adjustments you've shown. I will rotate the head to your position when I come to do the rigging. Thanks allot.

dmcgrath
08-22-2003, 06:48 PM
It looks worlds better. You are really getting what you want out of this model it looks like.:thumbsup:


What I menat by the colored light idea is that all light should have a little bit of color in the renders. You are probably using a pure white light, I feel you should use a warmer color. Think sunset color, but not so extreme, just maybe a pale yellow. But then move the slider for the shadow color into a purple, but just a tiny bit. I mean opposite on the color spectrum.
Check out
http://home.att.net/~rocq/SIHwheel.html


Btw, isn't the extra light you added under the chin area just what you needed?

T0BER
08-23-2003, 03:39 AM
That's an interesting lighting technique, thanks, I'll put ti to use.

Yep, that lower light really helped, thanks again. :)

digitalDreamer
08-23-2003, 05:53 PM
That's looking really niffty!

The main thing that really jumped out at me is the way her ear lobes connect to her head. They join is just a little too sharply defined at the moment. Smooth that detail out just a fraction and everything will be looking great.

As for making her more attractive, well that's a bit tricky. A lot will depend on how well you bring her to life with your animation. One thing you might try is adjusting the eye shader a little. At the moment the highlights are a tiny bit too big and intense. Also, if you brighten up the colour of the iris and make the whites a little "whiter" it will make her eyes appear more "alive". Perhaps add a bit more bumps to the lips as well.

These are all just minor tweaks.

Well done - can't wait to see the rest of her :)

mora
08-24-2003, 07:54 PM
many things need fixing,some have been fixed,heres one more stuff to fix.the render look good though.very cute cgrrl

T0BER
08-25-2003, 10:08 PM
Thanks for the replies, :)

I have made the following changes:

brightened the eyes
resized the ear lobe
edited the bump map lips
edited the hair

http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemRenderPrev3.jpg

Link to full resolution of render (http://www.users.bigpond.com/regan_curtis/FemRenderFull3.jpg)


digitalDreamer: Thanks for your reply, I will edit the eyes further soon. The rest of her is on the way.


mora: Thanks for the picture, most helpfull. "Many things need fixing" you say - c'mon indulge me. :)

cybernaut
08-26-2003, 03:40 PM
Looking much better!!

I noticed from the angle shot that her brow tends to be a little overly pronounced still, perhaps pulling that in a bit could improve things. Also, she doesn't seem to have much in the way of eyelids, top or bottom, maybe have them showing a little more could enhance her realism. All other geometry looks more or less fine.

Keep up the great work :)

jab
08-27-2003, 10:47 PM
looks very nice, especially the face. for me though in the front view the top of the head looks a little flat. I would round it out a little more. Also I would pull out the back of the skull a little bit as to be able to see it from the front view. In reality the back of the skull is a little wider than the front, due to having to store all that brain.

nice job though, I wouldnt mind comming home to her at night

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