Lessons Learned

[bobtronic]

Hi Adam,

Thanks for the tips.

Another obvious thing but source of frustation
of many newbies. Finish your modeling before
texturing !!!

Bob

[flyingP]

Modeling:
Good my lesson is a bit here and is a bit hard to explain, I was in the process of doing the usual (yes I'm sorry) naked female figure simply because it is so damn hard and I wanted to see if I could do it.... I couldn't, at least not to the level I wanted (she doesn't look bad just deforms wrong in places) so I started something new, I bulit a new figure(don't know if anyone remebers my alien thing from a while back do a search if your interested, hope it is still there) but concentrating on the the way the 'polygons flow' around it. I started from one point if I remember correctly the knee and worked out from there just extending the polys concentrating on how the polys flowed from one area of detail into the next.
Anyway in the end I only need 2 triangles (really small and nowhere obvious) the rest were qauds. The mesh deformed in ways which blew my mind, and was reasonable easy to rig (even without use of Claude Bonet or vertex maps), except for the bloody face which I am still working on.
Started work on the female figure again yesterday by the way and hope to be able to post a WIP in the next week or so, but I am 'sort of' on holiday so it could be a bit longer.

[AdamT]

Ah, that's another lesson I've failed to learn. I often start doodling something (in 3D) and keep adding to it and adding to it until it turns into something I'd really like to develop. But because it was started in a haphazard way it's really hard or impossible to take it further. Lesson being--pay attention to mesh structure even if you're just playing around.

[bobzilla]

Well, I'm sure some of you remember my dinosaur. I've been working on it since, well...let's just say I worked from a life study!!

I had decided not to start anything else until I modeled, textured, lit, animated, etc. that one.

Lessons learned:
As you model, save selection sets. You'll need them later for UV maps and in some cases there are sections on the model that are almost imposible to get to later on. (Try ClaudeBoneting a crotch!! Hiding sections doesn't seem to prevent them from being painted!!)

Be happy, and move on! I must have went back over and redid the head 3 times. I've redone the textures several times and changed the UVs a few times.

Check deformations before rigging. I wasn't quite sure how to do this (still not), so I was checking, rigging and moving polys around at the same time. Not advisable!

Don't work in a vacuum! If you get stuck, get help. I couldn't have done any of this without this and other forums. (Once again, thanks to Wes Ware for getting me started on a leg rig that actually worked...and NAAM's expression!)

That's it for now...I'm sure there's a million other things. If I think of more I'll post them

[Shademaster]

Best lesson I learned is try to keep it simple for as long as possible, I know it's fun to go to the detailing of your mesh/lighting/everything at once but that will get you in a lot of trouble. I know these are just n00b tips but I think they apply on almost everything you do in 3d. Keep it simple as long as possible, THEN start adding detail.

My 2 cents....

:)

[anobrin]

If you do alot of animation
and if are rendering several small takes
to be later edited together in a NLE,
avoid the temptation of getting caught up in full
post-production of each scene that comes out of the render stack
it only will distract you from finishing the set ups for other scenes
to be rendered

If you are re-using a scene file in an animation project
(the properly lit/textured office you modeled)
for rendering different characters
Please remember to rename the scene file for each
new "actor" or save the movie to a different file name.

Yes it sounds like a "no brainer" but I was working on the scene from
"bladerunner"where the Old captain explains to harrison ford( deckhard) the events surrounding
the recent hijacking and murder by outlaw replicants.

after a long render with lipsych and all, i switched to the deckhard camera
to render his one word reply of : "embarrasing"
I hit the render button and went for a swim
to later find out that I just saved the short 3 second deckhard clip
over the 10 second more complex "captain bryant movie clip of the same name. :blush:

but the story has a happy ending :applause:

I was doing some harddrive cleanup yesterday
and noticed some rather large files in the Apple final cut Pro
"untitled project" cache

and yes!! there was my 10 second complicated "Captain bryant Lip synch sequence that was auto saved as a Final Cut Pro File
because i had violated my first rule about premature post production
on the bryant clip before moving on to the next render.

so this discovery may yet rescue this "blade runner" scene from my
ever growing land fill of abandoned projects.


:D

[LucentDreams]

Uhm remember to look away form the monitor and blink once in a while.

Don't get sarcastic with directors when they ask for text on a poster to be bigger by making it rediculously large, thye may just like it (right chi, remember my music weaving poster)

Never let pay be part of a verbal contract!!!

keep sharp objects a cetain radius away form your desktop workspace so if you do work to late and passout, you don't find something sticking out of your head in the morning.


THis ones off topic a bit but still important, don't piss in the wind and check the Wind chill factor before writing your name in the snow, windchill can cause frostbit in mere seconds.

[Shademaster]

THis ones off topic a bit but still important, don't piss in the wind and check the Wind chill factor before writing your name in the snow, windchill can cause frostbit in mere seconds

Are you speaking out of any personal experience(s)?

:p

[LucentDreams]

Originally posted by Shademaster
Are you speaking out of any personal experience(s)?

:p

no never got frostbite, but my wiriting wasn't very good either and have always known not to pissin the wind learned that before I mcould make the mistake. If you want a related one from experience, then how about check for bees when using an outhouse :)

[kiwi]

When you finish modelling or during also think of how your ridges and grooves,rounded edges etc are going to look under specular,keep the same in mind when working on your polys it will make painting so much easier{clean mesh}.When you finish modelling a leg or a hand etc save a tag for it then,other wise when you connect your sym object you have double of everything to make a tag for,plus other pieces of mesh may now need to be hidden to get to the area you want.Last but least make a point tag for your middle row of points and update it as you whack or make new polys,otherwise you might join your sym object after chucking the connected pieces only to have to clean all the point back onto 0 on the X axis because you forgot about it.



Oh ya make a backup camera of your editor camera in case your ed gets all screwed up when modelling,then just copy 2 camera coords back to your ed camera.



Again basic kind of stuff,but if you get excited or move a bit quick somewhere you can have a nightmare before you realize it.


Stu.

[flyingP]

Originally posted by Kaiskai
no never got frostbite, but my wiriting wasn't very good either and have always known not to pissin the wind learned that before I mcould make the mistake. If you want a related one from experience, then how about check for bees when using an outhouse :)

Oooouuuchhh!!!!

[VestanPance]

Lesson learned: Don't be afraid to start over.

You have just spent the last 3 days pushing and pulling, extruding, bridging, cursing, sweating and losing friends over your new "My first 3d head" project only to be left with a mesh that looks more like broken safety-glass then a human. "But", you think to yourself "I have spent so long on this...I will just GET it to work". Guess what, sometimes you can actually save a whole lot of time by starting all over. What!? Yep. You will probably spend 3 more days getting it to "work right". And guess what else, because of all the experience you just gained, you will probably be able to do it in 2 days...not 3.

So sometimes it's better to just scrap the whole thing and start over. I learned this on a huge Director project that was way out of control. So it can be applied to many creative ventures, not just 3d.

Edit: I know this is a much broader lesson but I thought it would apply any how.

[LucentDreams]

I think you hit one on the button their, and it does totally relate to any creative field, in theatre whe blocking for a scene is having serious issues and you can't seem tog et it to work, sometimes taking the whole scene on a different approach will bring something better along, or at the very least bring a new light to the original.

Heres another one, there is no better reference then yourself, need ot model a hand, you've got a hand right there to refer to, need a facial expression, thats what mirrors are for, need to know the timing for a character swinging a bat, grab a bat and start swinging. Reminds me of one of my classical animation classmates, being someone who studied a lot of tacting in highschool I was always up and about acting out my scenes and such, and he started coming over and asking me his characters walk would work and such, and then try to explain to me how I should act it out for him, he'd keep trying to explain and started showing me how, and then I pointed out, why do I need to act it out, your doing it yourself right now. any animation involving impaling or severing of limbs might better off be treated as an exeption to this.

[JamesMK]

This is good stuff!

I'll add some more:

* Do a lot of sketching. It's fast, and you can easily notice upcoming problems way before you end up in the middle of them.

* Assign materials to your objects and set selections as you model. They don't have to look anything like the final mat, just a basic color is fine, but nevertheless it will make your life easier as the scene progresses. And don't forget to NAME those materals.

* If you are doing something that's supposed to be slightly deformed (by magnet tweaking or similar), assign some UV's to it BEFORE whacking those verts - it will make that unwrap look just right.

* Get references for EVERYTHING, not only humans and critters, but even for the most simple objects. The human mind is a weird thing - the images stored in your head are rarely very accurate, so you will need to look at the real thing (or photo) before modeling anything detailed.

* Make sure that your textures are scaled correctly. I don't mean stretching and so on, but that the details in the texture, having a certain real-world size matches the intended size of the details of the model on which it is supposed to be applied. Uh... :surprised Hope you understand what I mean.

[flingster]

1) this thread makes interesting reading.

2) there is always more than one way of skinning a cat!

3) patience...

4) know you software toolset....learn your craft....don't be afraid of what people think...be afraid of not taking good advice...but always remember its your art.



:p

[JoelOtron]

(1). RTFM!!!!!

Forget about handbooks and such. Theres a vast storehouse of knowledge in the Maxon manuals and tutorial books. Too often I just experiment with tools and techniques because I'm too impatient to sit down with the books. I just learned a simple feature today that I should have known for a couple of years now, and would have known had I read that part of the manual.

(2). Plan ahead and follow through.

Resist the temptation to texture your model and build your environment or rig and animate you model before it is complete. Patience is a virtue---one that I surely don't have!

[sanfranguy]

Good thread.

Some things I have learned over the last few months.

1.) Don't forget to turn of Specularity on the GI renders.

2.) Caustics render faster if you use a non-diffusing materials.

3.) When Extruding with intent to Split, cut the new object and back-step to a stage before you made any alterations.

4.) Don't use too many shadows casting lights.

5.) Keep you Min-Res and Accuracy low for very speedy Radiosity tests.

6.) Don't forget to generate more caustics in the MAT editor, when creating HDR scenes.

That's me.

[VestanPance]

Originally posted by sanfranguy
...3.) When Extruding with intent to Split, cut the new object and back-step to a stage before you made any alterations....

All excelent stuff, but this one I can't quite figure out.

[knight42]

Great thread, very useful. My contribution:

- Don't drop a portable hard disk containing the most up to date copy of your project.

J

[JoelOtron]

Originally posted by knight42
Great thread, very useful. My contribution:

- Don't drop a portable hard disk containing the most up to date copy of your project.

J


Correction.
Drop your hard drive on the floor with confidence and a smile-as you have your work safely backed up on 2 other drives :p

[flyingP]

move one point in a mesh, hah!, get prepared to move more.

life is not fair:

[JIII]

learn all the new tools in your soft ware and learn them fast. I ignored edge tools and making cars and the like was hell. With edge tools cars and other once hard things became not that hard at all.


learn the new tools with each update they are their to make your life easy not harder.

[JoelOtron]

Originally posted by JIII
With edge tools cars and other once hard things became not that hard at all.


Could you cite an example?

I just stared playing with the edge loop/ring functions. No more "click, click, click, click, click....

Edge extrude is cool, though it doesnt always work. I alternate between good old "D" and Arndts edge extrude plugin.

[grstovell]

here's mine: get a tough skin, and a sensitive head.

1- if someone says, "boy, that's an incredible model!", take it with a grain of salt.
2- if someone says, "that model stinks! Why don't you just sell that computer?", take that one with a grain of salt too.

1- if you think you are getting better... pop in that Episode II DVD once more.
2- if you think you are getting nowhere... check out those models you made 3 years ago.

... and overall... always go back and animate a bouncing ball. It'll keep you humble and sharp.

-g

[sanfranguy]

If you want you illuminant mats to stay relatively dull, but would like to generate more light. Use the Generate GI in the "illumination" section of the Mat Editor.

It makes for very cool effects.

[thorn3d]

Don't model things that will not be seen by the camera (or a reflection). Seems obvious, but you'd be suprised how often people do something like model a gas pedal when only the car exterior will be seen, or spend a lot of time getting the perfect bevel on the BOTTOM on a coffee mug.

thorn

[AdamT]

Originally posted by neverwake
Don't model things that will not be seen by the camera (or a reflection). Seems obvious, but you'd be suprised how often people do something like model a gas pedal when only the car exterior will be seen, or spend a lot of time getting the perfect bevel on the BOTTOM on a coffee mug.

thorn
Oh no, I wouldn't be surprised at all. :)

[LucentDreams]

Originally posted by neverwake
Don't model things that will not be seen by the camera (or a reflection). Seems obvious, but you'd be suprised how often people do something like model a gas pedal when only the car exterior will be seen, or spend a lot of time getting the perfect bevel on the BOTTOM on a coffee mug.

thorn

guilty as charged on more then one occasion, its one of those things I know well now, but still find myself doing once in a while.

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