HMC #22: Classic Self Portrait: Scott Broad

[grantmoore3d]

At first glance, I thought that guy was rocking out on a electric guitar. :P

[scottimation]

hah! That'd be a funny take on it :buttrock:

[WyattHarris]

Lol, that would be a great interpretation.

I figured there couldn't be that many Roman sculpture about a guy stringing a bow but I underestimated how popular Cupid and Diana were. No luck here finding it.

Edit: And then I use the Atlas search and once again find it in 1 try.

Jacques BOUSSEAU
Chavagnes-en-Paillers, Vendée, 1681 – Valsain, 1740
'Soldier bending his bow' (http://cartelen.louvre.fr/cartelen/visite?srv=car_not_frame&idNotice=4292)

So not Roman, French.

[scottimation]

Awesome! Thanks Wyatt! I'll look more into this one :thumbsup:

[scottimation]

Ok, so I have decided on a sculpture, different from above due to lack of reference photos.


From wikipedia:

The Fontana del Nettuno ("Fountain of Neptune") is a fountain in Rome, Italy, located in the Piazza Navona.[1] Its basin is designed by Giacomo della Porta in 1574. The fountain is completed in 1878 by Antonio Della Bitta, who placed the sculpture of Neptune and Gregorio Zappalà, who created the other sculptures.

I plan on sculpting Neptune fighting the octopus with me in place of Neptune. May end up covering the junk though.:blush:


http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=146839&stc=1

[RexDiem]

I like the movement of the sculpture you picked and the Octopus thing. It will be great to have a strong facial expression in this.

[scottimation]

Got some modeling underway. Went with maya for the base mesh. Just noticed the nostrils are a bit off... Gotta say it's kind of weird modeling myself... :curious:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=146879&stc=1

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=146880&stc=1

[polymaster]

pretty close modeling ! good going with modeling! can u show some wires!

and i like ur choice of sculptures. it would turn great!

[scottimation]

Thanks, and yeah I'll get some wires put up soon. Got some work done on the head and body this weekend, getting pretty close with the face I think. Crits/comments on where to improve on the likeness? Thanks in advance :D

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=146998&stc=1

[Salvation]

Sweet man, coming along very nice! just crits from what i saw, your lips feel very flat and thin,they should be more fuller and rounded, and the bridge of your nose feel thin. But it's looking good, looking forward seeing more updates:thumbsup:

[scottimation]

Salvation - Thanks for the observations, I see what you mean. I moved onto the body for now to take a break from staring at my own face.

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=147069&stc=1

[TiMrozek]

Your ears look a little bit small too. Anyway, body looks great. So are you, much like myself, not using your own torso for reference? I know mine is boring, no wrinkles or muscles to sculpt makes for a boring torso. Just curious. Very nice work so far, Can't wait to start seeing some of the epic posing. I love the sculpture you chose in the end. There is actually a really great sculpture of Poseidon right out front of the Library of Congress that I had previously not been aware of. I'll try to take a picture and post it next time I walk by it.

[CraftMaster]

The face looks good. It has a close likeness. The body looks good too. Man, you are ripped.

[RexDiem]

Your face looks slightly scared right now. Are you going change the expression after you have everything the way you like it, is that why you made the mouth open? The body is looking sweet, them some diesel thighs.

[scottimation]

Thanks ppl. Haven't done much since last posting, hopefully this week will allow for more time on this.

TiMrozek - good call on the ears, I will address that. I am using my own body for reference, the proportions and silhouette are all me. I have chiseled the midsection of the model a bit more so than my own, taking the opportunity to use this as a muscle study as well. I may bring it back to reality once posed, we'll see.

Arisan - thanks

RexDiem - the face right now was modelled to a very neutral expression from a different photo. I left the mouth open to be able to see and model the lips. The reference sculpture has the mouth open, but I may push the expression even more.


I am trying to get the arms and hands fleshed out right now. Hope to post later tomorrow.

[Nothingness]

I'm not sure what your take is on the body right now - cause you want to bring it more to reality after posed - but i find it overal too much in the style of a comic super-hero. And this also refers to the proportions that should rather be addressed before the posing.

Then i think the muscles of the upper leg, the 4-pack :twisted: are seriously off on accuracy (besides it's cartoony character).

[scottimation]

Nothingness - what exactly do you mean by "too much in the style of a comic super-hero" and "seriously off on accuracy"? I have plenty of reference over here, but perhaps you could help me to understand better?

[Nothingness]

Ok, now this type is not something you can make science off. I mean, there are so many different bodies and body-shapes. I am working a lot on the body of my sculpture (don't mind the one you can see on my thread) to get it in a state i'm happy with.

Basically i just try to do a mix of whatever i see in my reference and what the muscle structure should be like.
There are a few bodytypes you can classify - like the classical body, the bodybuilder, the athletic body, the normal body , and so on.
Each one has it's characteristics. The classical - like the old statues from michelangelo and others - are based on reality but transformed into more of a symbolic body then the body of a strong human.

In my eyes, i see the body you sculpted as a cartoonish heroic super-hero because it shares a lot of it's characteristics. It's mostly based on a combination between an athletic body and a bodybuilder but with more esthetic proportions than the real human body.

(do note that this is just the way i see it)

So the thing that makes your body look like this, is the proportions that are not really convincing realistic. This is a hard thing to explain, but for example the lower leg seems too long. The human eye is rather sensitive to subtile proportions. Also the proportions and the shape of the lower stomach is very unbelievable.

Then the pecks are bizar. don't know what reference you use, and there are a lot of different shapes and sizes, but your model has a 4-pack instead of a 6-pack (since this one has practically no fat).
The muscles of the upper legs seem odd because the muscle that goes from the knee - the inside - to the hip doesn't seem to be in the right place and makes the shape of the other muscles in that region different from what they need to be.
Then i find the chest muscles a little odd too. For one thing, in my opinion they are a bit too high for such a muscular body. They also seem to be rather flat (which is not always a bad thing) bug since they ly ontop of bended rib-cage they're not always that flat.

Other things that make it look a bit comic-style, is that the muscles are rather too sharp lined, and that you have a lot of expressiveness in your details (like the knees of details in the foot).

But again, this is my take on it, and i think as a certain style it looks really great (besides some issues like the 4-pack) and would be just perfect for super-hero's.
While i'm working on the body of my character, i learn things too and discover that it's not always as easy as it all looks. And for example if you check out reference of a 6-pack, you notice that it's hard to find a few people with the same muscular layout.


If it's still confusing, i can understand it. It's starting to get confusing for me too. But deep understanding of the differences of body types and styles, and a good observation if the key to get what you want.
And please interpret this post as merely a good starting point for discussion :beer:

[scottimation]

You are right that there are many body types out there, and most people vary slightly in all areas.

Being a gym rat I can assure you that the body proportions (muscle size, placement, and joint length) are very accurate in regards to mine, closer to the athletic/bodybuilding proportions. I will refrain from posting my self photo reference, but I do appreciate the "heroic super-hero" observation :D

The 4 vs 6 pack varies GREATLY from person to person, not only in the number, but layout as well, and is highly dependent on genetics and body fat percentages. There is a lot of reference out there on that subject, especially in the bodybuilding/fitness realm.

I sort of agree/disagree about your statement regarding the major leg muscles(quadriceps)

"The muscles of the upper legs seem odd because the muscle that goes from the knee - the inside - to the hip doesn't seem to be in the right place and makes the shape of the other muscles in that region different from what they need to be."

The muscle "from the knee - the inside - to the hip", Sartorius, is not as dominant in this model as the others, but the general shape of the rest, Vastus medialis, Rectus femoris, and Vastus lateralis are pretty darn close to being in the right place and shape, perhaps a slight bit exaggerated at this moment.

The chest muscles are the correct height and possibly a tad flat, however, in that pose with arms raised the Pectoralis do tend to flatten out since they are at rest.

As far as the sharpness goes I partially agree. The major muscles definition is sharp, for now, as I stated I will be bringing things back to reality in terms of skin/fat layers. I am going to bring those details in after posing because they will be greatly influenced by posed limbs, twisting, flexed muscle and whatnot. Those areas will be very asymmetrical once posed. The feet and knees however will stay close to being that sharp, as mine are in life, not much meat on those parts.

All in all reference is key, and gives a good foundation and understanding over how muscles,tendons, and bone interact. However it cannot be relied upon fully for proportion. There is no "should be like" when referencing life. It is what it is. Muscles do have definitive origin and insertion points, specific functions, and general shapes, but proportional volume is subject dependent. What you see as far as proportion, size, and silhouette in my model, so far, are very close the my photo reference of myself.

I do appreciate your views on the matter since it gives me extra incentive to step back and analyze my model, and learn along the way. Kind of the point of these challenges I would say. :thumbsup:

[scottimation]

I took the model into maya and rigged it up fairly simply to pose it, obviously not the fingers yet. Time for some asymmetrical sculpting now... then the base.


http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=147312&stc=1

[zszs]

:surprised great work!

[scottimation]

zszs - Thanks :)

Small update today. Started refining the upper body and laying out the octopus with zspheres.

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=147367&stc=1

[WyattHarris]

Whoa, that is freaky looking and really awesome use of ZSpheres.

[Revalis]

:eek: You has an octopus on you! Get it!

[RubberEggs]

I personally think the pidgins pose more of a threat than the octopus hehe out numbered 3 to 1.. altho one of them seems to be focused on the cherub.. great model , can't wait to see the octopus.

[TiMrozek]

Pose looks awesome. From here the feet look quite nice as well. I'll just say it, I feel like the butt needs just a bit more crack. Still, the pose is wonderful and dramatic. I'm looking forward to seeing the octopus.

[scottimation]

Thanks all. Yeah the zspheres are perfect for this sort of thing, looking forward to sculpting the octopus as well.

TiMrozek : yeah the butt needs more crack :cool: I haven't touched the model much lately, but am planning on getting a bunch done this week, kind of need to.

I have adjusted the pose slightly by pushing the upper body twist more toward the original sculpture. Gives more power to the pose and makes it so he's looking towards the octopus, whereas he is looking off to the side at the moment. Also have the spear in there and reduced the size of the hands about 10%. I'll post another pic when I have made more progress.

[scottimation]

Small update. Altered pose, some muscle refinement, added spear, started the octopus, have yet to start the facial expression.



http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=147508&stc=1

[Intervain]

nice progress - so how about that maine of hair? - I think it's actually my fav part of the original sculpture, with all the movement in it... keep going

[scottimation]

Well I haven't started the hair yet because I haven't decided on whether or not I want it there. If I can get some good hours in this week on this, then maybe I'll go for it. Either way here's an update. Closed the fists, continued with the octopus, and got to work on the base. Rocks are fun :D


http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/body_026_web.jpg

[PKT]

Very nice sculpting going on here man. Nice work on the muscles, especially his right shoulder imo.

[scottimation]

Thanks dude. More updates, went to work on the face, covered the junk with a leaf... Almost time to wrap things up.

http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/haed_030.jpg

http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/body_030_web.jpg

[RubberEggs]

Very nice, love the octopus.

[TiMrozek]

Awesome progress. There is really a great sense of tension with the pose. You have captured the energy of the pose quite well.

[Paul4wood]

Amazing progress!
The maple leaf makes it look like a comment on Canada and the G8. :scream:

[scottimation]

d'oh... thought adding the maple leaf would show some national pride, perhaps not... fig leaf coming up :shrug:

[Paul4wood]

Sorry. Don't take my comment about the maple leaf too seriously. It is not really an obvious connection. Great work though!:)

[Intervain]

sweet - and LOL at the leaf hehe such modesty ;)

[Nothingness]

great progress,

but you might need a bigger leaf :argh:

[scottimation]

hah, well the leaf stayed as is, size doesn't matter :D ANYWAY, all finished, ended up sculpting the hair and beard, both were interesting to do. Had a lot of fun with this challenge, looks like everyone else did too. Here are my final images.


Click for high rez version (http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/SB_neptune_beauty_001_web.jpg)
http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/SB_neptune_beauty_001_websm.jpg (http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/SB_neptune_beauty_001_web.jpg)


http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/SB_neptune_ortho_001.jpg


http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/SB_neptune_ortho_002.jpg


http://www.scottimation.com/images/neptune/SB_neptune_wires.jpg

[TiMrozek]

Very nicely done. Awhile ago I promised to go take some pictures of the Poseidon sculpture outside the Library of Congress in DC but I kept forgetting to bring my camera everytime I walked by it so here are some pictures I found around the interwebs. It's a really cool sculpture. I think it's the only time I've ever seen Merhorses and Mermen with double fish tails (one per leg). Wish I could find better pictures of those aspects. Anyway, here they are, and great work too:

http://www.scientificpsychic.com/alpha/travel/loc/congress-library03.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1131/1289958685_2ceb73fb8f_b.jpg

http://american-architecture.info/USA/USA-Washington/009-library_exterior_fountain_big.jpg

[scottimation]

That's a great and very detailed sculpt, I remember coming across images of it when looking for reference. Awesome for reference, thanks for the pics.

On another note, I have been having issues with my images loading sometimes on these threads and am pretty sure it is my hosting server. Particularly when using my wife's macbook my site/images will either not load or take many refreshes to finally show... may be time to find a new web host...

[Intervain]

wow that's awesome sculptures

[TiMrozek]

I get to walk by it every week :). However, they've been doing work on it so they've been covered in plastic and surrounded by scaffolding for about a month. DC really has some cool architecture and art. Trying to just spend more time walking around.

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