HMC #22: Classic Self Portrait: Tim Mrozek

[TiMrozek]

Cool, just found this image too, another interpretation by another artist nearly 100 years later. Never knew this existed. Artist was Paul-Jacques-Aime Baudry

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ce/Charlotte_Corday.jpg/445px-Charlotte_Corday.jpg

Ok, time to get crackin on a self portrait of myself as a murder victim. The history of this painting is pretty interesting so if anyone is interested check it out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_of_Marat

[mecos]

i love that painting. i don't think you should change yourself for the challenge, unless you really want to. i've come to think of you as your avatar :P

[TiMrozek]

Well, my hair has gotten significantly longer since, however, I've not been without beard for years now so that has to stay.

[Intervain]

wow the second representation's marvelous :) [yes I love those stripy dresses]... David's painting is a true classic and would definitely be very challenging. I'm also a real fan of David - especially his painting of the Lavoisiers [the detail there always blows me away]. Best of luck with Marat!

[TiMrozek]

Ha, well, if I have time perhaps I'll add the murderer in her striped dress. That's the best thing about 3D, the limitless amounts of points of view. I plan to try to make this viewable from all angles. I see a lot of 2D paintings represented in 3D that can only be viewed from one angle. And yes, I've been a huge fan of the immense attention to detail by David ever since my wonderful history of 18th century French art class a few years back. It ended up being half a history of David class.

On another note, decided to post my current progress, just setting up the scene to try to get a feel for exactly how this 2D image translates to 3D. NOt much done yet but, eh, whatever, here it is. Wanted to do more but had to watch Top Chef.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Hardcore%20Modeling%20Challenge%2022/SettingWIP01.png?t=1253762827

[TiMrozek]

Well, a little bit of progress. Been a busy weekend. Should be able to put in some serious effort tomorrow but for now, to keep me going and to update, here is my mug! and an early wire of my basemesh for my face (still very WIP)

http://img2.imageshack.us/img2/4535/photoswire01.png
http://web11.twitpic.com/img/32456180-8287d95ec61bc8a8ba752775613ebc57.4abef32a-full.png

[TiMrozek]

I have basically finished my base mesh for my face. My ears will be covered by cloth most likely (unless I change the image a bit) but I had to torture myself and make ears again. I'm pretty happy with them, they're simple but they are clean and all quads. Also tweaked a good bit. I know it's hard to tell from the last update to this one because I took a sneaky shot of my last wireframe, where it was harder to tell that the cheeks were too deflated and the the lips were all off. Anyway, it's not perfect but I'll use zbrush for that. Onto the body.

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/1508/facewires01.png
http://web2.twitpic.com/img/32847505-3c7119273d3da577ffd4e22db155167f.4ac1636a-full.png

[TiMrozek]

Apparently twitpic isn't good for hosting images. They all seem to disappear from my thread 2 minutes after I post.

[RexDiem]

Good start, I was going to comment about the mouth being off, but then I realized that you are bringing it into zbrush! duh. The shape of the tub is great. Are you going to add claw feet to the tub? I don't know if that was the time period, but they are fun.

[RageOfAges]

may I recommend photobucket?
It allows you to create multiple albums, so you could create an album for every challenge u enter :)

http://www.photobucket.com

-Rage

[Intervain]

good progress Tim :) photobucket doesn't allow any nudity though - so a hint for future projects, they do take down 3d nudes too

[robo3687]

i find www.imageshack.us to be the best for me for image hosting, i've used it for years

[TiMrozek]

Thanks for the tips guys. I'm actually already using photobucket for another project I've got going on. Forgot about it's gallery's so I might switch over to that. Also, I had an old imageshack account so if photobucket considers a nude male upper torso to be offensive I have that as a back-up.

[RexDiem]

My personal favorite is Flickr.com, you can create sets and collections and directly connect to the farm files too.

[TiMrozek]

Well, the week has turned out to be a great deal more busy than I would have hoped and I haven't gotten as much done as I had hoped. But I guess that's probably the story with everyone. Well, anyway, I've roughed in the body and have started to sculpt in zbrush. Currently I'm just starting to add a bit of detail to the face. Can't really tell if it looks like me. I'm so used to seeing the beard and hair. Oh well, it's shaping up in one way or another. Please Crit away. I think i've been looking at it, and pictures of my face too long to tell.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Hardcore%20Modeling%20Challenge%2022/Self_Face01.jpg?t=1254521569

[TiMrozek]

Hi all, not a ton of progress, but the lips were really bugging me on that last post so I had to save myself by posting an update. Still having issues with the lips. Just hard to see my jaw and lips with this beard but I bought a tiny mirror that is helping. Anyway, here is where I currently am. I also think I got the general shape of the face and underlying bones much closer to my real face. Moving on to blocking in the body/muscles (already have a base built)

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Hardcore%20Modeling%20Challenge%2022/Self_Face03-1.jpg?t=1254598866

[TiMrozek]

Ok, I promise, last update of the face for a long time. I just still had issues with what I posted. I guess I always will because no one ever feels their work is finished, but I'm moving onto the scene next. Roughed in a body too but it's got some issues with proportion so I'll post that later.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Self_Face05.jpg?t=1254633328

[TiMrozek]

Starting to block in my composition in Z-Brush. I am pretty new to Z-brush and right now I'm finding all of their transpose/translation,scale,rotate controls to be awkward and difficult for precision but hopefully I'll get it down. So far the hardest has just been trying to start posing my character/myself since I built the body in a pretty standard T-pose that required a lot of altering to get him into the tub. Anyway, I think it's pretty obvious that I haven't quite gotten the character in there all the way yet, but I just wanted to post a WIP anyway since I started to build up the cloth and stuff in the scene.

Any comments, crit or suggestions are always welcome.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Hardcore%20Modeling%20Challenge%2022/FullScene_WIP01.png?t=1254800042

[WyattHarris]

Any time you transpose in ZBrush it creates an area around the spot you moved that looks like artifacts or antialiasing, best way I can describe it. From there you smooth out the results but to make it easier on yourself decide on the pose early and transpose at low low rez. This way you can have the shape in place before you start sculpting.

Tip if you don't already know it. Create your mask and then click once on the mask to smooth it. Makes the transitions much uh... smoother. :D

The pieces are coming together nicely, keep it up.

[TiMrozek]

Cool, thanks for the tips Wyatt. Yeah, I'm getting more and more used to it, I think I just miss not having a box where i can type in the exact amount I want something to rotate or translate.

Anyway, tonights post is a little different. I've made a bit of progress on the cloth and the pose but a friend from college decided to go ahead and make all of my posts way better and take them in a direction that had not occurred to me. Thought everyone might get a kick out of these. I can only hope he continues to add his touch to the rest of my updates:

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/34211002.jpg?t=1254885768
http://web12.twitpic.com/img/34530740-a511e333c34b5646407d802f746f24c9.4acc0552-scaled.jpg
http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/34500643.jpg?t=1254885220

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/34526870.jpg?t=1254885814

The master behind all of these is Shane Lynch i.e. iequalshane .

[RageOfAges]

Lol the bicycle is the best. How random is that?

-Rage

[TiMrozek]

Hi Rage, yeah, we had recently had a discussion about how the cyclists in our area drive us insane because they refuse to ride anywhere but the middle of the road, don't obey signs, are all around obnoxious, etc.

So I guess death by angry cyclist is how he sees me leaving this world.

So hope you can get back into a challenge soon. Been busy?

[Intervain]

nice - the cloth's starting to look really good - I think bringing it down 1 or 2 levels and smoothing everything over with a delicate smooth brush would get rid of the lumpy feeling you get in some places and make it smoother... keep it coming

[robo3687]

its certainly getting there, keep it up

[TiMrozek]

Intervain: Thanks for the tip. Yeah, I'm starting to feel a little better about doing cloth.

Robo: Thanks!

Ok, so it's been a busy week but I got a little done tonight. Posed hands, slightly tweaked the bathtub cloth and added my head wrap/turbin thingy. As usual, didn't get nearly as much as I had hoped done today. But still, I think it's coming together. I'm happy with where I am so far but as always, if you have any crits, please don't hold back. I know the body still needs work.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/FullScene_WIP04.png?t=1255232208

[YoongKunKim]

wow, looks good ~

I just started face , I dont know I can catch your progress or not :p

good job ~ keep it up !

[scottimation]

nice progress, I like the pose, he definitely feels dead. One crit so far is that his left hand index finger is too noodle-like.

[Nothingness]

Really curious to see where this is going.

[TiMrozek]

YoongKunKim: Thanks, I tried to pay a lot of attention to the face. Lookin forward to your progress as well.

Scottimation: Agreed, I tried to address that, when I was transposing to pose the body I think I left my masking selection too soft which sort of just curved everything. As long as he feels dead though, then I am happy.

Nothingness: Yeah, me too. Hopefully somewhere good.

Ok, I'm starting to get happier with how this is going. I've toned all of the muscles a bit, started to block in a beard, added feathers and the ink pot as well as the main piece of paper. Slow and steady here.

So here goes:

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/FullScene_WIP06.png?t=1255401292

And in keeping with the mood of this thread and my WIPs, Shane has created another wonderful interpretation.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/thuglife.jpg?t=1255401291

[Intervain]

wow the latest update's really impressive :) - this is really getting nice. I like the face in particular and the turban... what especially needs some revisiting are the forearms IMO - the one away from the camera looks rather flat from our point of view.. Keep it going :applause:

[TiMrozek]

Intervain: Thanks so much for the kind words :buttrock: I've really been spending lots of time in zbrush so it helps to hear that you think it's paying off. As for the fore-arms I know what you mean about the back arm. I started trying to imitate the painting then it seemed weird so I tried just doing what I thought an arm should look like and now I think it's sort of in limbo. Anyway, I'll certainly give them more attention. Do you feel the same about the forearm in the front? Well, I'll do a little touch-up on both. I think it's neat doing a painting because i'm starting to find that some of his seemingly perfect proportions seem to be slightly off and I've had to change things a tad to make them closer resemble the painting. Either that or I don't know what I'm doing ;) which is entirely possible.

Anyway, I uploaded a WIP turntable in case anyone is interested.

http://vimeo.com/7037390

[TiMrozek]

I have been playing with some different matcaps and really like the effect that this one is giving. I've more or less finished all the major components of my set up and I'm just down to adding detail now. I've detailed a bit more since my last update. Well, as usual please feel to critique anything or offer up any suggestions. I'm pretty much down to details and trying to decide if I'll actually paint textures or just leave it as models. Any thoughts are welcome. Thanks all.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Skin02.png?t=1255737093

[TiMrozek]

And here's a closeup just for fun cause I put a lot of work in on that turbin.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Skin03.png?t=1255737971

The Matcap is Ossuary by the way.

[RubberEggs]

Beautiful work. I think it would be interesting to see it textured, but the piece has a great mood as is. I really like the lighting, it's really soft but it's not blurry (especially the cloth behind the right arm, it looks sweet ) . The subtle wood grain :thumbsup: less is more.

[Paul4wood]

Wow! You are doing an amazing job!

Not wishing to take anything away from your great work but one thing that looks a little wrong at this stage is the right arm and hand. It appears to have too much life in it. This guy is meant to be dead isn't he? In David's painting you will notice that Marat's right hand reaches the floor and it is this compression of the fingers that helps to keep the quill in his hand, in my opinion. As you currently have it, in your sculpt, I believe the quill would fall to the floor. Perhaps you could raise the floor or straighten his forearm a little?

Keep up the excellent work. :)

[PKT]

Looking better and better

[TiMrozek]

RubberEggs: Thanks, I'm glad you noticed the wood, it almost doesn't even show up with some of hte shaders but there is really almost no noticeable woodgrain in the painting so I didn't want to overdo it. I mostly added it because I'm not sure if I'll get a chance to texture it but wanted it to be obvious that it's wood

Paul4wood: Thanks a lot and no problem, this stage is all about critiquing so I appreciate it. I see what you mean and I've been thinking that too. I know it extends out a touch too far and isn't parallel with the ground right now. I planned to finish putting in all elements and detail then do the final pose. Also, I just haven't put the ground in yet. Still working a few things out. Thanks for picking that up though. Yeah, he wouldn't be able to hold the quill if it weren't for the ground, very true.

PKT: Much appreciated :D

[zszs]

very nice progress.http://forums.cgsociety.org/images/icons/icon13.gif

[TiMrozek]

Just a couple of details. I added tassels, a knife and water (which you basically can't see) and I've adjusted the pose a bit to address the floating hand issue. Oh, and added a floor as well. I think I have one more piece of paper to add and that'll be it for getting all my models into the scene, then I guess just some refining and maybe painting if I have the time. Well, nothing hugely different from last post but here it is.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/FullScene_WIP11.png?t=1256006030

[Intervain]

hehe I was expecting more of those tassels ;) ... it's really looking nice - perhaps breaking up the parallel lines indicating the bones on this hand would add more... make one of them stick out less or sth... now they look just like 3 lines at equal intervals... very delibarate :)

[TiMrozek]

Oh no, the painting only has tassels on the green blanket. They aren't goin all the way around! I don't want to throw my computer out the window ;). Thanks for the thoughts on the hand. You are absolutely right, those bones/tendons kind of all come to a point at the wrist. They need some alteration.

[TiMrozek]

I think I have completed all modeling. Seems to good to be true. I keep looking at the scene feeling like I should build more but I think about there. Here are 2 shots, please feel free to make any recommendations on what to fix, add, remove, etc.

I know not much has changed since my last update.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/CloseUp_WIP02.png?t=1256338127

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/FullScene_WIP13.png?t=1256338154

[Intervain]

it's a job very well done :thumbsup:

[gottery]

i thought it was painting.:bowdown:well done.

[Paul4wood]

Yeah! Stunning job.

[TiMrozek]

Intervain: Why thank you. Just hope I can keep it up through texturing (which I have decided to go for).

Gottery: Wow, thank you! Although I probably owe some of that to the matcap which isn't mind. It's ossuary and can be found on pixologics site.

Paul4Wood: You are too kind :beer:

Well, I stepped away from the model for a few days. Came back yesterday and got a start on painting it. I know this challenge is all about modeling and the threads will surely be filled sometime again in the next few weeks with a debate over whether people should be allowed to texture or not, but I am texturing anyway. I figure, I want to texture it eventually and it's better to do it now before I lose my steam. I am still considering just submitting a standard shot with just a matcap for my final beauty render entry. Not sure yet.

For now, here is my progress on painting. All a little flat right now, just blocking in the bases first then I'll work up in detail. This is really my first time polypainting a full scene like this in zbrush so bear with me.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/MaratPaintedWIP05.png?t=1256763257

[RubberEggs]

Great Progress :thumbsup:

[TiMrozek]

Thanks RubberEggs.

Alright, using a different matcap as a base (back to ossuary) and have painted significantly more. I guess I will just submit a textured version for my final but I will include a standard, just shaded version too since I know about 3 days after the voting a thread will pop up about whether we should be allowed to texture or not.

Anyway, I put more detail into the face so I included a closeup of that as well as the full composition. Just the feathers, floor and back wall to go now.

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/MaratPaintedWIP07.png?t=1257019549

and

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/MaratPainted_CloseupWIP01.png?t=1257019548

[TiMrozek]

And a quick note/word of advice. Don't buy Little Big Planet 3 days before a challenge or a project ends. It will either waste your time or it will torture you while you are being good and not playing it all day.

[Intervain]

great result - the letters are a nice touch

[TiMrozek]

Great challenge everyone. I know this one really pushed me farther than I have been pushed for a little while (partially because I made sure to push myself). I really enjoyed getting to really use a lot of Zbrush. Sculpting is great fun and I look forward to making more and more art with it.

Anyway, just wanted to post my final on here too to wrap up the challenge. I now will be playing video games for the next 48 hours! Good luck all other participants. Hope everyone gets to finish by tomorrow night!

Artist Name: Tim Mrozek

Original Concept: The Death of Marat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_of_Marat) - Jacque-Louis David

Beauty Render:

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Beauty01.png

Orthographic Views:

Front
http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Front.png

Side


http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Side.png

Top

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Top.png

Wires:

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Wire01.png
http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Wire02.png

[scottimation]

Great job on the finish :thumbsup: The painterly textures are a nice touch.

[RageOfAges]

Congrats on the finish, Tim. Looks great. I actually prefer the untextured version from the previous page (http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv346/TiMrozek/Skin02.png?t=1255737093) better. Looks good with textures, but it loses the "painting" look a little. Have you thought of doing a paint over in photoshop (or whatever app you use), rather than textures? You could get really interesting results. Regardless your sculpt is great. I find your underlying geometry to be really efficient, with all your polys being more or less uniform.

-Cheers, and keep up the good work. This one was a big improvement on your previous challenges, so I can see that HMC is paying off for you.

-rage

[Intervain]

sweet finish Tim - I just hate that pink matcap ;) not that it's relevant heheh :scream:

[PeterR]

Nice model and finish ! grats :)

[TiMrozek]

Scottimation: Thank you, I was considering doing more post for the beauty render to give it more of a canvas feel too but I decided to leave that for another time

Rage: Mucho Gracias, yeah, I preferred that matcap to the one I used but I felt like it had some noise and stuff that took away from just the model so I went with a more basic one for my orthos. If you mean you prefer it to the fully textured then, i might agree ;). It is a cool look but I wanted to make it more mine. As for doing a paintover in PS, that's a pretty cool idea that hadn't really occurred to me. Might be the next step now, thanks for the idea. Also, glad you see improvement. I feel this challenge has helped me a great deal.

Intervain: Danke, Ha, well, I won't argue with you for that pink matcap. My only defense was that I went through a bunch and I liked the contrast that it gives to a model. I feel like it shows off the modeling without distracting from too much. A lot of the grays sort of hide detail, and while the basic red shows a lot, sometimes it shows too much that isn't really there (with it's weird white-ish color it throws into all dents and negative cavities). I considered customizing it a bit but, eh, I wasn't going for beauty there, just trying to show the model, so eh, that's all I've got ;).

PeterR: Why thank you.

[Nothingness]

Really great finished piece!

Would love to see it rendered in a real renderer with some serious dramatic lighting and shadowing. You think this is comming ? :beer:

[TiMrozek]

Absolutely yes it is coming. Might not be right away though, I have a few other things I wanted to get started on first. I'm happy with this result as a zbrush screen cap but definitely not happy yet as a finished piece. Well, not unhappy, but I just want to take it farther. Glad you like it though!

[JM-art]

Hi Tim... and excelent job! this one is my favourite so far, very expresive. It seems to me that you improved a lot your modeling skills.

Congratulations:buttrock: .

[RubberEggs]

Congratulations , this is one of the nicest entries in my opinion,I was on the fence about the textured version at first,but you really nailed it.

[TiMrozek]

Jmart: Thank you, yeah, I put a lot of time into this. I feel that I learned a great deal with this model too.

RubberEggs: I really appreciate it. Yeah, I know my early textured shots were pretty flat so I had to really work on changing that. I'm pretty happy with how it came out. Had issues with zbrush lighting though but I guess it's not really known for mindblowing lighting. I gotta get this thing into maya soon to do a proper mental ray render.

[Intervain]

congrats :) you did learn a lot from your previous comps, totally shows the dedication! Keep it coming :D till the next challenge then ;)

[TiMrozek]

Thanks a lot Maggie. Glad that my hard work is paying off ;). Hope i can do the next competition. I'm working on a few characters for a side project short film right now and might not have the time. Plus just workin on the reel and all. I love these competitions though, good way to really force yourself to create a finished product (or mostly finished). Regardless I'll be on the forums whether I'm competing in the next one or not. I definitely want to get involved in the Rockwell one.

[CGTalk Moderation]

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.