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View Full Version : DeGamma 0.30 Now Available


Per-Anders
09-02-2009, 06:17 AM
Just a note to let those of you that don't always frequent the third party forums that DeGamma 0.30 is now available for both C4D R11 and C4D R11.5.

This new version adds 5 fun new post effects for effects from Bloom/Gloom, advanced ToneMapping with automatic Dodge/Burning (based on but improved and massively augmented from the basic Reinhard Tonemapping algorithm), Bleach Bypass, Chroma-Blurring and render Distortion for that dreamy psychadelic feel.

Manuals for the new effects will be made available over the coming weeks.

brasco
09-02-2009, 07:08 AM
great service Per :thumbsup:

brasc

ThirdEye
09-02-2009, 08:18 AM
Great one Per!

vertigoz
09-02-2009, 08:56 AM
Thanx! :thumbsup:

tylerdurden369
09-02-2009, 10:02 AM
Sounds great!
…but I can't find the download link…
?

vertigoz
09-02-2009, 10:15 AM
Sounds great!
…but I can't find the download link…
?

It's on the mail you receive after you purchase it ;)

tylerdurden369
09-02-2009, 10:32 AM
Ok, I just downloaded it,
I thought there was a link for the update only…

Rich-Art
09-02-2009, 03:09 PM
Wow sounds cool Per. Thanks.....................

I've announced it on our site as well.


Peace,
Rich_Art. :thumbsup:

PhoenixCG
09-02-2009, 03:42 PM
is there a demo i can DL somewhere, i've heard DeGamma mentioned but i don't really know anything about it.

Rich-Art
09-02-2009, 05:12 PM
Just read the manual and you know everything you need.

Peace,
Rich_Art. :thumbsup:

ChrisCousins
09-02-2009, 05:36 PM
Just a note to let those of you that don't always frequent the third party forums that DeGamma 0.30 is now available for both C4D R11 and C4D R11.5.

This new version adds 5 fun new post effects for effects from Bloom/Gloom, advanced ToneMapping with automatic Dodge/Burning (based on but improved and massively augmented from the basic Reinhard Tonemapping algorithm), Bleach Bypass, Chroma-Blurring and render Distortion for that dreamy psychadelic feel.

Manuals for the new effects will be made available over the coming weeks.

Really interesting update thanks Per, the new post-effects are really interesting too, nice to have options inside of C4D.

But it seems to be new with v0.3 that it's enabled in every scene now by default, is that right? I'm often transferring files to other users and I don't want them to have a missing plug-in message when the open my scenes, or getting different render results - so I'd rather have this off if possible?

Thanks for the update! Chris

Per-Anders
09-02-2009, 06:16 PM
Really interesting update thanks Per, the new post-effects are really interesting too, nice to have options inside of C4D.

But it seems to be new with v0.3 that it's enabled in every scene now by default, is that right? I'm often transferring files to other users and I don't want them to have a missing plug-in message when the open my scenes, or getting different render results - so I'd rather have this off if possible?

Thanks for the update! Chris

The manual covers this. DeGamma is always enabled by default in new scenes unless you have a new/default.c4d file in your user settings directory that has DeGamma removed so that Cinema will always use that instead.

sjcrompo
09-02-2009, 06:49 PM
Thanks Per.

Steve

Continuumx
09-02-2009, 07:19 PM
Thanks Per, this was one of the features I was missing with Degamma, the tone mapping, and additional filters will make this plugin a great asset for animations!

flingster
09-02-2009, 08:20 PM
What does it do in simple terms and any chance you could post and example image from those new features?

Ryonosuke11
09-03-2009, 01:38 AM
Thanks for the update!

And Xtra special thanks for adding in the Fishy Distortion post effect! Now my fisheye lenses in C4d look curved and fishy as they should ^ ^

LemonNado
09-03-2009, 02:12 AM
What does it do in simple terms and any chance you could post and example image from those new features?

Check out this thread Flingster

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=47&t=791837&highlight=degamma

Rainer

Continuumx
09-03-2009, 04:06 AM
Hello Flingster,

To put it simply, Degamma great improves rendering intent in your work!

No Degamma:
http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/6874/normalidu.jpg

Degamma:
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/1754/degamma.jpg

This is with the older version of the plug-in. I cannot wait to test the new features to regain some of the definition.

flingster
09-03-2009, 11:52 AM
ok thanks guys..i like the end result i've seen so far, not entirely sure i understand it in the short time i've had a look through the manual..but its good to see a really good manual with it per so kudos on that. :thumbsup:

Cometsoft
09-03-2009, 01:53 PM
I don't seem to have the option to add DeGamma as a Post Effect It's available in the general render options, but not as a post effect from the popup list. I assume that's where these effects reside.

Wonder if I screwed up my installation? Copied .30 plugin over the old one. Noticed afterward you're supposed to delete the old one first plus user preferences (didn't see any of those to delete).

Am on OS X.

Resolved. Found out the download was linked to an old file. New one is there now.

AdamT
09-03-2009, 01:58 PM
Don't feel too bad, I can't even get the download link to work -- or Per to respond to my e-mails. :curious:

jonahtobias
09-03-2009, 03:03 PM
Hello Flingster,

To put it simply, Degamma great improves rendering intent in your work!

No Degamma:
http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/6874/normalidu.jpg

Degamma:
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/1754/degamma.jpg

This is with the older version of the plug-in. I cannot wait to test the new features to regain some of the definition.

I'll probably get slammed for this (and deservedly so!) but in 1 minute with photoshop curves I was getting essentially the same result as this plugin gives. Continuum, I took your non-degamma's image above and ran it through photoshop curves.
http://1q.com/images/uploads/normalidu6.jpg
Here's my settings--
http://1q.com/images/uploads/gamma_curve.png

Mine is brighter here, but not inside photoshop.

I'm not trolling... I'm curious. Does the gamma curve change for different images? or does this plugin essentially apply a standard gamma correction to the renders, albeit cloaked in lots of lingo and terminology? :curious: :curious:

AdamT
09-03-2009, 03:09 PM
I think you would see the difference with a more challenging render where you would get more clipping from traditional image manipulation.

MikeS369
09-03-2009, 03:51 PM
Are we supposed to get an email with the update link?

MikeS369
09-03-2009, 03:53 PM
Forget it. I figured it out.

shoqman
09-03-2009, 04:14 PM
The download link I have in the email leads only to 0.29. Is there a way to get the new version?

Ryonosuke11
09-03-2009, 05:47 PM
I'm not trolling... I'm curious. Does the gamma curve change for different images? or does this plugin essentially apply a standard gamma correction to the renders, albeit cloaked in lots of lingo and terminology? :curious: :curious:

I had my doubts about the plugin as well before I did some tests with it... as it did seem like only a gamma correction... now that I've used it for a few weeks I can't live without it! The changes it makes are very subtle... if you dont care about these subtleties than I guess the plugin is not that appealing but I can see some subtle differences in the image you applied curves too besides the brightness... the shadows are darker for instance...

Coming from a filmmaking perspective for me its like shooting on miniDV vs film... without degamma its easy to blow scenes out with hotspots from lights and their falloff is very sharp...to compensate you have to decrease the intensity which limits the area it can illuminate.....

With degamma its like lighting for film.. there are softer curves on everything and lights falloff like they do in real life..its more forgiving... no hotspots... nice soft falloff... So again the differences are very subtle but I've been able to attain a realism in lighting with degamma that I had never before achieved... its especially apparent when working with visible and volumetric lights.

Its like it gives your images more dynamic range to work with.

jonahtobias
09-04-2009, 07:35 PM
Thanks m dot for the reply. After reading the degamma manual a second time I think I understand it better.

The way i understand it now, my example with the photoshop curve wouldn't work so well if the objects had texture maps, particularly image maps because my photoshop curve would change those colors too. Images would get blown out and the color saturation would be screwed up. Degamma knows to leave that stuff alone, and only changes the overall lighting gamma.

Could one of you who have degamma post a render with texture maps and GI, and also put the c4d file that created it online? I think I know how the same color transformation could be done inside c4d w/o Degamma. Maybe its impossible, I'd like to try though, but I can't attempt it w/o the help of someone who has the plugin.

Per-Anders
09-04-2009, 07:51 PM
Heh, I can understand the confusion there, yes on a white scene with white lights you will match it with a curve (though why use a curve? the gamma control will do it far more precisely). But I think you misunderstand what Linear Color Workflow is from that example.

DeGamma does apply a gamma correction at the end (if wanted), but it's about Linear Color Workflow and physically accurate rendering rather than simply brightening up images. It allows you to target sRGB, standard Gamma, Linear or a totally custom COFFEE written colorspace if you wish. I suggest you check the old threads about DeGamma here (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=47&t=791837) and here (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=47&t=786713) and also download the manual from http://www.thirdpartyplugins.com/degamma/ as it contains a number of examples, and trust me you will not be able to match them by simply applying a curve in Photoshop.

The main thing to understand is that DeGamma applies the color correction curve but retains your correct original color that you picked while doing so, while applying a curve on it's own will not do so, you will wash out your colors. DeGamma doesn't do this through post effect trickery, the whole pipeline through the render engine is linear, which means the render engine can work in it's native linear color space (the only space where the light transport is approaching physically accurate), the result is an image that has perceptually accurate lighting combined with perceptually accurate color.

Here's a basic example that shows this in practice. Our old friend the cornell box.

http://www.per-anders.net/general/cornel_non_linear.jpg

Now here it is with DeGamma applied, notice the change in light distribution, highlights and the linearity of the gradient (no halo strong green, just a linear blend between the two colors).

http://www.per-anders.net/general/cornel_linear.jpg

And finally here's a quick preview for Flingster of a couple of the new post effects, the Fishy Distorter, Chroma Blur and Gloominance.

http://www.per-anders.net/general/cornel_fishy_gloominance.jpg

The strongest of the three bleach-bypass variants (designed to emulate the effect at the start of the process), the other two are Sharp and Soft modes, emulating what happens if you apply the effect later on in the process.

http://www.per-anders.net/general/cornel_bleach_bypass.jpg

Rich-Art
09-04-2009, 08:35 PM
Good explanation thanks.

Peace,
Rich_Art. :thumbsup:

jonahtobias
09-04-2009, 09:11 PM
Heh, I can understand the confusion there, yes on a white scene with white lights you will match it with a curve (though why use a curve? the gamma control will do it far more precisely). But I think you misunderstand what Linear Color Workflow is from that example.

DeGamma does apply a gamma correction at the end (if wanted), but it's about Linear Color Workflow and physically accurate rendering rather than simply brightening up images. It allows you to target sRGB, standard Gamma, Linear or a totally custom COFFEE written colorspace if you wish. I suggest you check the old threads about DeGamma here (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=47&t=791837) and here (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=47&t=786713) and also download the manual from http://www.thirdpartyplugins.com/degamma/ as it contains a number of examples, and trust me you will not be able to match them by simply applying a curve in Photoshop.

The main thing to understand is that DeGamma applies the color correction curve but retains your correct original color that you picked while doing so, while applying a curve on it's own will not do so, you will wash out your colors. DeGamma doesn't do this through post effect trickery, the whole pipeline through the render engine is linear, which means the render engine can work in it's native linear color space (the only space where the light transport is approaching physically accurate), the result is an image that has perceptually accurate lighting combined with perceptually accurate color.


Thanks for the informative post, Per. And I'm glad you didn't act defensively to my challenge.

I absolutely don't understand how Linear Color Workflow works, this despite having read your manual. Years ago i read dozens of articles about it when doing post on a movie shot on 35mm and delivered as cineon files. The primary reason I can't understand is because my brain is the size of a pea.

That said, suppose I applied a 2.2 gamma correction to just the illumination channel of a multipass render, would that result differ from degamma (I can't test this unless someone gives me a setup to compare against a degamma render)?

Per, I'm not trying to drive you into abject poverty by taking away the need to buy your plugin, although that would be an awesome side benefit! I am just trying to understand what degamma brings to the table.

Per-Anders
09-04-2009, 09:44 PM
Thanks for the informative post, Per. And I'm glad you didn't act defensively to my challenge.

I absolutely don't understand how Linear Color Workflow works, this despite having read your manual. Years ago i read dozens of articles about it when doing post on a movie shot on 35mm and delivered as cineon files. The primary reason I can't understand is because my brain is the size of a pea.

That said, suppose I applied a 2.2 gamma correction to just the illumination channel of a multipass render, would that result differ from degamma (I can't test this unless someone gives me a setup to compare against a degamma render)?

Per, I'm not trying to drive you into abject poverty by taking away the need to buy your plugin, although that would be an awesome side benefit! I am just trying to understand what degamma brings to the table.

Don't worry you're no iconoclast, I've had this conversation with many people and it's fine Linear Color workflow isn't something that is the easiest to understand till you use it properly and most reference on the web is completely inaccurate on the subject matter. Unfortunately no just applying gamma to the illumination channel will not produce the same effect at all. You've not considered several things, but most obviously that most lights are not white and that the illumination channel only concerns itself with the lights themselves, you would have to manipulate many channels in ways that aren't easily possible to do.

Correct light transport is much more than this, it's how the surfaces react to the light, how light is bounced around, reflected, refracted, diffused, and that's handled in the render engine in linear color space itself, not in your screen space, that's why when you render as per normal your results are just plain wrong. Trust me you cannot recreate linear color workflow in post because the actual information in the render itself will be different/not there, you can by dint of a hell of a lot of effort and work get close ot it, but why bother? You can quite easily do what DeGamma does without a plugin, however it's a very long and laborious process, you must set up each color multiplied to the power of the destination gamma, apply gamma to each bitmap (but not to the root shader in a channel unless you want incorrect blending) and so on for all objects in your scene and then apply gamma correction as a post effect to the end result. DeGamma offers more advanced color spaces than merely straight gamma but a gamma of 2.2 is close enough for most peoples needs.

I will say however that most images I see that claim to have linear color workflow and that have had it applied by hand clearly show innacuracies and are often very far from linear color workflow because most people do not understand what LCW is. This is where automating the process makes a big difference, it simply reduces the human factor in what is a long hard slow and boring slog. DeGamma merely automates the process and offers some fancy features not possible at all in the standard toolset, that's what all plugins do.

flingster
09-04-2009, 11:41 PM
so for some noob type questions..so bare with me.
is this purely post effect...or are you taking the initial linear render information and using that in combination with the render and a post effect?
would it theoretically be possible to come up with an effect rather like the color part of final cut studio that would allow a particular film style?
why the hell isn't this just available native in c4d since the result you posted speaks for itself?
all interesting stuff i'm liking the potential and some of the comparision renders i've seen for realism and thanks for posting those new filter images btw.

Per-Anders
09-04-2009, 11:54 PM
so for some noob type questions..so bare with me.
is this purely post effect...or are you taking the initial linear render information and using that in combination with the render and a post effect?

No, it automates the process of converting all colors and values into linear color space before rendering, and then after rendering it applies color correction to them. The manual covers exactly what it does and where.

would it theoretically be possible to come up with an effect rather like the color part of final cut studio that would allow a particular film style?

You've always been able to do that, LCW just allows you to make adjustments in the computers own colorspace before it's converted into the the more perceptually based sRGB (or an other colorspace). I'm not quite sure I follow you here though, you can tweak the curves and balance however you want and there is an example in my forum showing a COFFEE setup that allows separate RGB gamma curves with LCW if you want to do that. Color Grading and LCW are two distinct and separate things though color grading itself is done best on the linear image of course (as is the whole post processing pipeline), but in general should be one of the last steps after all other post processing has been done as it's very much a part of how the final image itself will look.

why the hell isn't this just available native in c4d since the result you posted speaks for itself?
Because it's a relatively new concern in 3D CG really only making it's way in in the past three or so years and the vast majority of people still don't understand it or it's benefits yet, that's very slowly changing. It's not a new concept to the worlds of print and compositing, just to 3D.

ChrisCousins
09-05-2009, 12:09 AM
The fun thing about this plug is that you don't necessarily need to understand the full workings behind it, it's made in such a way as to give you decent results by default and full control for when you find you need it. The long and short of it is that with renders with Degamma = bright and peppy, without = dull and muddy. And it's dirt cheap. What's not to like?

flingster
09-05-2009, 03:57 PM
yeah i'm liking it just trying to get my head around it really.
so is it possible to make render...adjust and output...take original render again and adjust in different manner..or is the output final render+linear processing via plugin and therefore in order to re-tweak you'd re-render?

robotbob
09-05-2009, 05:37 PM
hey flingster

straight away degamma has improved everything i do with it.

now understanding how it works is anouther thing altogether. i have tried to set up a linear workflow thru to after effects without success but this is because i do not quite get it yet. By this i mean using after effects colour management to follow a linear colour workflow with my linear renders while composting and grading then ( as far as i understand it ) you execute a gamma correction for the target on finaling. ie tv, HD TV, pal / ntsc or film and so on.

the reason why it dont have it yet is that when i set a linear workspace in after effects the results look different than the render before i do anything to it.

this is not a fault of de-gamma but my own. i am looking forward to sharing my settings here when i get it sorted

pete

rsquires
09-11-2009, 05:19 AM
Seems that DeGamma doesn't play nicely with IRR. IRR wasn't working so I took all my plugins out of the folder and then reintroduced them one at a time. DeGamma was the culprit. Can anyone else confirm this or am I just screwy.

all the best

Richard

ThePriest
09-11-2009, 06:23 AM
The fun thing about this plug is that you don't necessarily need to understand the full workings behind it, it's made in such a way as to give you decent results by default and full control for when you find you need it. The long and short of it is that with renders with Degamma = bright and peppy, without = dull and muddy. And it's dirt cheap. What's not to like?

Good point. I don't need to know the inner workings of a GI algorithm to fully appreciate the affect it will have on my scene. The same can be certainly said for the LWF, although in this case - a little understanding goes along way.

rocarpen
09-11-2009, 08:15 AM
Hi Pers, by way of suggestion: I spent several minutes searching for the DeGamma product page on your site(s). Finally had to Google it to get the url (http://www.thirdpartyplugins.com/degamma/). I'd suggest making links to the page on the Third Party site, and maybe a direct one in your sig. No good having interested potential customers have to hunt for the site.

Apologies if I've overlooked something brutally obvious! Great looking plug; I look forward to buying and using it!

dann_stubbs
09-11-2009, 11:59 AM
Just a note to let those of you that don't always frequent the third party forums that DeGamma 0.30 is now available for both C4D R11 and C4D R11.5.

This new version adds 5 fun new post effects for effects from Bloom/Gloom, advanced ToneMapping with automatic Dodge/Burning (based on but improved and massively augmented from the basic Reinhard Tonemapping algorithm), Bleach Bypass, Chroma-Blurring and render Distortion for that dreamy psychadelic feel.

Manuals for the new effects will be made available over the coming weeks.


hi per,

just had a request to purchase this plugin for the farm - does it work fine with NET?

also my workstation is based on OSX - but farm is PC - so when ordering can i set it for OSX? (i.e. does NET work without serialization?)

thanks in advance,

dann

ooo
09-11-2009, 12:13 PM
Seems that DeGamma doesn't play nicely with IRR. IRR wasn't working so I took all my plugins out of the folder and then reintroduced them one at a time. DeGamma was the culprit. Can anyone else confirm this or am I just screwy.

all the best

Richard

I also discovered (thanks to KvB) that Some functions in SurfaceSpread crash Cinema if DeGamma is enabled. I haven't checked IRR though...

odo

mogh
09-11-2009, 02:22 PM
hi folks

i own degamma and came across
some limitations i think ... it wont work nicely with depth of field in my case ... i get strange blurry glowing edeges ...


regards mogh

brasco
09-11-2009, 02:38 PM
Set the degamma to "After Render" seemed to work with depth better.


brasc

JDP
09-11-2009, 03:02 PM
Seems that DeGamma doesn't play nicely with IRR. IRR wasn't working so I took all my plugins out of the folder and then reintroduced them one at a time. DeGamma was the culprit. Can anyone else confirm this or am I just screwy.

all the best

Richard

Same for me, C4D R11.5, Win XP. Fiddling with Degamma with IRR activated also hangs C4D.

Per-Anders
09-11-2009, 03:20 PM
Seems that DeGamma doesn't play nicely with IRR. IRR wasn't working so I took all my plugins out of the folder and then reintroduced them one at a time. DeGamma was the culprit. Can anyone else confirm this or am I just screwy.

all the best

Richard
This is a known bug and is fixed in the next update coming this weekend.

Per-Anders
09-11-2009, 03:21 PM
Hi Pers, by way of suggestion: I spent several minutes searching for the DeGamma product page on your site(s). Finally had to Google it to get the url (http://www.thirdpartyplugins.com/degamma/). I'd suggest making links to the page on the Third Party site, and maybe a direct one in your sig. No good having interested potential customers have to hunt for the site.

Apologies if I've overlooked something brutally obvious! Great looking plug; I look forward to buying and using it!
Hi, yes you're quite right, I just haven't had the time yet to add it to the database.

Per-Anders
09-11-2009, 03:23 PM
hi per,

just had a request to purchase this plugin for the farm - does it work fine with NET?

also my workstation is based on OSX - but farm is PC - so when ordering can i set it for OSX? (i.e. does NET work without serialization?)

thanks in advance,

dann
Hi Dann,

Yes it's meant to be Net compatible, but I have had a bug report of it not working with Net for one customer so it's one of the things I'll be looking into this weekend.

Per-Anders
09-11-2009, 03:24 PM
I also discovered (thanks to KvB) that Some functions in SurfaceSpread crash Cinema if DeGamma is enabled. I haven't checked IRR though...

odo
Unfortunately I don't have Surface Spread to check this, however you should be able to exclude the Surface Spread object (and anything it's using to control it's spread) from DeGamma itself via the Restrictions tab.

Per-Anders
09-11-2009, 03:26 PM
hi folks

i own degamma and came across
some limitations i think ... it wont work nicely with depth of field in my case ... i get strange blurry glowing edeges ...


regards mogh
Hi, please check the manual as it covers this. The issue is simply that DOF doesn't play nicely with most other post effects, especially not color correction ones, you will need to set the application to After render as another poster already noted, this way it wont attempt to modify the sub-pixel fragments (which is what causes the haloing effect thanks to how the DOF effect works) and you will get a full LCW as all other post effects will be able to work in linear color space too.

tonfarben
09-13-2009, 03:53 PM
I rendered the whole last weekend lots of shots (approx 20000frames) with DeGamma on our inhouse Renderfarm with Netrender (unlimited) C4D R11 and it worked like a charm!
Thanks for the update Per, especially the distortion filter looks nice.

Ryonosuke11
09-13-2009, 09:46 PM
I just finished rendering a couple thousand frames on my little render farm with NET... All the scenes were using R11, Degamma, SurfaceSpread and SplineSpread together and there weren't any problems.

Per-Anders
09-15-2009, 02:23 AM
Just a notification for DeGamma users that this thread should keep you up to date with the next update :

http://www.thirdpartyplugins.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=64

Per-Anders
09-15-2009, 05:11 AM
(Locked as this is now out of date, newer thread further up.)