PDA

View Full Version : Modeling cave walls, tips?


Strandli
07-27-2009, 12:26 AM
Hi! Not a frequent user on this forum, so I'm sorry if this thread is in the wrong section!

I am currently planing a scene which takes place from inside a cave, and naturally this includes some rough stone surfaced walls and ceiling. And what I am asking about is tips on how to approach this task at the "best way"/most efficient and so on.

I'll have to make a lot of this, for both narrow tunnels and big rooms, and the camera will be close up to some of these walls, so I will need a high quality result (although that is not just about the technique).

The way I am considering at the moment is to first make a couple of planes, and with basic low poly modeling block out the shape I want of the cave. Subdivide, and export to Mudbox to add big cracks and texture, and just use the normal maps in Max.

I think this would be the easiest way, but the think I am most unsure about is the sculpting in Mudbox, as it would be kinda time-consuming to sculpt everything by hand with knife/sculpt or one of those tools. So what is the best way? Stencils with high contrast images of cracks and such?

I tried to be as specific as I could, and I think I have a basic understanding, but before I start the process I want to check if anyone had anything to say, tips and so on.
I am using 3DS Max and Mudbox, I am grateful for any help, I know many of you have some great wisdom to share!

Thanks!

SanguineJackal
07-27-2009, 12:41 AM
I am also very new at this, so please forgive me if my post is practically useless (especially as I work with Maya, not 3DSMax). Perhaps do a low-poly model of the caves and tunnels, and apply a high-quality texture of rocks, then use bump mapping?

eldee
07-27-2009, 01:01 AM
the easiest and oldest method for creating the interior of a cave is to do it procedurally. Just create some complex looking procedural noise and displace it, and add another layer for smaller bumps and cracks, etc. You can even texture it procedurally.

It all depends on whether or not you have something specific in mind. If you're working from a very specific concept, it might be difficult to do it procedurally, but otherwise I see no need to overcomplicate it.

Strandli
07-27-2009, 01:32 AM
Yeah, I have definitively considered the use of procedural displacement maps and textures, and I will try to use it for either base texture, or just for the walls far away from the camera.
I actually read some threads on this forum about procedural textures yesterday, and I am very interested in learning about that too.

But for those walls close to camera, I would enjoy a bit more detail and solid cracks and bumps, not just for the sake of detail, but I would very much like to learn a technique behind making rocks and cave walls.

Some of the reference images I've watched at:
Img 1 (http://www.digitaltutors.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3373&d=1238491647) | Img 2 (http://www.imageafter.com/dbase/images/industry/b20industry022.jpg)

This would probably be possible with procedurals, simple texturing and noise modifiers, but as I said, I want to try this with Mudbox too, so I get the practice. But if no-one supports that idea, I will of course reconsider. (I must also add that I have very little experience with procedurals, which is one reason for me to not use that for the close-to-camera shots)
But thanks for the response! I will definitly look into it!

far
07-27-2009, 03:10 AM
here is a reference article, you may find it useful :cool:

http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=69232&page=9&pp=15

The best way would sure be using zbrush or mudbox. Good luck :)

Strandli
07-27-2009, 03:13 PM
Ah, yes thank you!
Very good references and a good read!

I will probably try to make some low-res "lego blocks", and bring those into Mudbox, add details, and piece them back together in Max.

Anyone have any good textures/stencils and other resources which would be good to use for this kind of work? Big cracks, rocky noise and such.

Thank you all!

SanguineJackal
07-27-2009, 05:54 PM
Eep, I didn't realize my post had posted at the top.

Reepoman
07-27-2009, 06:16 PM
Hi! Not a frequent user on this forum, so I'm sorry if this thread is in the wrong section!

I am currently planing a scene which takes place from inside a cave, and naturally this includes some rough stone surfaced walls and ceiling. And what I am asking about is tips on how to approach this task at the "best way"/most efficient and so on.

I'll have to make a lot of this, for both narrow tunnels and big rooms, and the camera will be close up to some of these walls, so I will need a high quality result (although that is not just about the technique).

The way I am considering at the moment is to first make a couple of planes, and with basic low poly modeling block out the shape I want of the cave. Subdivide, and export to Mudbox to add big cracks and texture, and just use the normal maps in Max.

I think this would be the easiest way, but the think I am most unsure about is the sculpting in Mudbox, as it would be kinda time-consuming to sculpt everything by hand with knife/sculpt or one of those tools. So what is the best way? Stencils with high contrast images of cracks and such?

I tried to be as specific as I could, and I think I have a basic understanding, but before I start the process I want to check if anyone had anything to say, tips and so on.
I am using 3DS Max and Mudbox, I am grateful for any help, I know many of you have some great wisdom to share!

Thanks!

I have just made a cave interior for an animation but I can't show it because of NDA, however it was more of a constructed room in a cave so some big stone work rather then rock surface.

However check out some great stone rock textures here at

cgtextures (http://www.cgtextures.com/) :thumbsup:

Strandli
09-16-2009, 09:24 PM
Ok, I know this thread is a little old, but figured I could just revive it since it's about the same topic.

So, I have the same goal as mentioned in first post, only I have tested a couple of things since last time. The short version of the first post is: I want to make big cave-walls.
And I'm using 3DS Max 2010 with Mental Ray.

I did as eldee mentioned above, tried procedurals. And I must say, wow, I am impressed with the amount of details which can be achieved with just a few procedurals.

This is where I'm at:
http://bildr.no/thumb/489359.jpeg (http://bildr.no/view/489359)
(click to enlarge)

This is my first serious try with procedurals, so I've probably broken a few rules.
The way I made this wall is to use a plane with many segments, and apply a noise modifier to it, to get the basic shape of the wall. And for the displacement map I used a Cellular Map (chips, with fractals) and stretched it in it's height. Simple Smoke Map as bump.

And that's the result. I think the result is great, since it was a very simple and time efficient way to make a highly detailed wall. The only problem with this is the fact that is relies to heavily on the displacement map, and that is a resource hog.

And does anyone know some tricks to make the displacement more memory friendly? Since this is my first try with procedurals (and displacement) and a result of trial and error, I must have missed on a few important bullet points on how to make a good looking displacement map, as memory and render friendly possible. Because this is just too much, since I will need much larger walls anyway.

So.. any suggestions? I've punched in some random numbers in the "displacement" section in the Mental Ray Render Setup, but not knowing much about these values, I just used what "looked the best". So.. Any help out there?

Thank you.

far
09-16-2009, 11:55 PM
nice result, looks pretty detailed :)

For the displacement you now need to generate a high resolution normal map. The uv map for the low base won't be difficult as the geometry is going to be planer surface. That is the best way to go for in my view.

Good luck.

Doner
09-23-2009, 01:19 AM
On the zbrush website there is a video tutorial of how to add surface noise. Extremely fast, extremely cool. You would then apply it and bake out a displacement map.

http://www.pixologic.com/zclassroom/homeroom/

check out surface noise.

Reed5point0
10-07-2009, 04:53 PM
Here is another amazing study by Vibol Moeung at WETA I believe.

http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=059678

He also has a 17 min Gnomonology Tutorial on how he did this using Zbrush.

CGTalk Moderation
10-07-2009, 04:53 PM
This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.