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View Full Version : Layout Has 40 Undos....


Joviex
07-30-2003, 12:06 AM
Better, yes, but still pondering why they are sticking to an ATOM system for undos, instead of a true history.


All in all, all the character tools and dynamics, and my favorite, timeline/keyframe editing is much improved.

-mindcache-
07-30-2003, 12:15 AM
Yeah, having a true history and window to manipulate/click through(would be nice to go back and save out early step or segments if you forgot). However I don't think there is going to be many people out there using more than 40 undos :surprised which a scary thought.

Limbus
07-30-2003, 12:37 AM
The undos are only for move, rotate and scale!! No Undo in suface editor etc...

Florian

Mattoo
07-30-2003, 12:37 AM
Personally I get nothing but grief with the history features in other apps. I'd happily leave it turned off in Maya if it didn't rely on it so much.
I'd much prefer the simplicity of simple undos.

-mindcache-
07-30-2003, 12:40 AM
ONLY for move rotate and scale? No undo available in anything else in Layout in 8? I'm afraid sound that sounds seriously sad if that is the case.:cry:

Shade01
07-30-2003, 12:43 AM
Yeah, it's limited, but it's in there. For as long as we've gone without any sort of undo I'm not complaining.

3DDave
07-30-2003, 01:59 AM
Does that include working from the graph editor? Like adding a key, moving a key and then undo, undo to get back?

Shade01
07-30-2003, 02:01 AM
I dont think so.

DaveW
07-30-2003, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by 3DDave
Does that include working from the graph editor? Like adding a key, moving a key and then undo, undo to get back?

Probably not, but that's what footprints are for.

NanoGator
07-30-2003, 02:48 AM
Originally posted by swank
ONLY for move rotate and scale? No undo available in anything else in Layout in 8? I'm afraid sound that sounds seriously sad if that is the case.:cry:

On the flip side, it does train you to really plan your stuff out before ya do it.

tmcbroome
07-30-2003, 02:53 AM
If your not going to impliment a feature correctly (Multi Undo) then do not do it at all....

Only for transform function??!!! What a hack.

tmcbroome
07-30-2003, 02:53 AM
If your not going to impliment a feature correctly (Multi Undo) then do not do it at all....

Only for transform function??!!! What a hack.

Joril
07-30-2003, 02:58 AM
Well, I don't mind it that much, there are other ways of undoing.
I don't mind making a few keyframes for backup somewhere at a < 0 key.
I don't mind saving a few backup shaders. I don't mind using footprints (although the track editor is the place where you wish you you had multiple undos most)
I my eyes, making backups is alot more secure than relying on undos and redos.

I wonder if newtek would have included the multiple undos if it weren't for so much people whining about it and making it such a big deal....

It's not like modeller has only one undo....

geoff3dnz
07-30-2003, 03:15 AM
Damn. Surface Editor needs multiple undos.

Finkster
07-30-2003, 07:08 AM
I want 41 undos!!!!:annoyed:

rock
07-30-2003, 09:28 AM
If the undo is only for move, scale and rotate and not for Surface Editor and the rest of your edits, Newtek might as well undo what they had undone. Then redo it.

grafikdon
07-30-2003, 09:53 AM
Undo redo undone udid...what the heck, that is not a big deal anymore since I am used to the almost 'no undo' in layout. As long as you turn off auto keyframe you can always hit F9, abort the render and the scene will revert to the last keyframe. I wonder what what took NT centuries to add such a simple feature to LW. More like making a 'Chaka the Zulu' trilogy with Chaka fighting with bare hands only to be armed with his short spear at the last installment. Sounds pathetic to me.
I'd rather have real time preview, real time soft/hard body dynamics, cell shader that reacts to light and receives shadows than 500 undos.

Krix
07-30-2003, 10:51 AM
Hi guys,

I don't like to say that, but I simply get used to the life without undo. Undo makes your work more comfie, but it is not something what you cannot live without it. Since I accepted there is no undo in Layout...I just didn't want to use it. There is no really action what u cannot correct, or undone.

Unfortunatelly, it seems that there is a hard limitation in the code. Just remember that multiple undo didn't came in when they released the LW6 and said than rewrote the whole application.
Obviously they didn't rewrite the whole...so history, and real undo won't come untill they really rewrite the source code of the Layout. And who knows when it is going to happen...

The new bone stuff, and that it reacts to dynamics, turned me on much more. Point level animation is cool too, and hopefully works well in real production environment as the all other new features.
I didn't expect a miracle, like an architecture change...so I should say if the new tools working fine...it is good, and I'm satisfied.

I hope, they can hire some cool render engineer, and other stuff, and will make changes, and implement new features in that part of the program too in the future.

cheers,

Krix

geoff3dnz
07-30-2003, 10:56 PM
Originally posted by grafikdon
Undo redo undone udid...what the heck, that is not a big deal anymore since I am used to the almost 'no undo' in layout. As long as you turn off auto keyframe you can always hit F9, abort the render and the scene will revert to the last keyframe. :) You don't actually have to hit F9 and then abort, just jiggle the slider, or hit the left and right arrow keys, but whatever works... I feel that having undos for translate, rotate etc is'nt really that useful, simply because it's easy enough to revert back to an earlier position, but say for instance you had lots of layers in a surface channel, then you click the 'remove texture' button, instead of the 'accept texture' button. ALL that work is gone. Unless you had saved the surface earlier, or used the preset shelf, redoing that entire texture again could be potentially kinda painful.

cg_matt
07-31-2003, 02:57 AM
totally agree with you there Geoff.

garethjax
07-31-2003, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by geoff3dnz
...but say for instance you had lots of layers in a surface channel, then you click the 'remove texture' button, instead of the 'accept texture' button. ALL that work is gone. Unless you had saved the surface earlier, or used the preset shelf, redoing that entire texture again could be potentially kinda painful.

Hello, this is my very first post on the forums, but i've been lurking around for some time. :)

I second you on this trouble. I've also suggested on the newsgroup (comp.graphics.apps.lightwave) the introduction of a new preset regarding gradients.

Losing surface "Properties" would not be so bad, if the presets were a bit "smarter".
For example, adding a contextual menu over a surface with some options like:
- save surface to presets
- save new surface version to presets (eg: iron.1, iron.2,iron.3).
- save all the surfaces in a new library

I think that Newtek need an "interface" counselor instead of new programmers.
:wise:

colkai
07-31-2003, 01:26 PM
One reply I've heard is to create a preset.

Though for me that seems a bit of a pain. Then you have to keep tidying up your presets.
What I'd like to see is an added facility as the old versions had.
Say, set a parameter to determine how many surface sets to keep, then every time you tweaked a surface, or hit a function-key (not necessarily a render), it slapped a 'last surface' box up - like the old 5.6 / 4.0 way of doing it. Sort of a 'in progress' presets area which was automatically created but could be cleared out quickly.

Dunno if I'm making this clear or not! ;)

erikals
08-14-2003, 11:14 AM
:wise: The Graph Editor should have multiple undos.

(can it be that hard?)

E_Moelzer
08-14-2003, 11:27 AM
I remember a time when LW5.6 had four or five smaple- windows in surface- editor. Every time you made a change the lowest one was updated and all the others moved up (or was it the uppoermost and all moved down? ahh so many years). This was like having four undos in Surface- editor. I would really love to have that one back.
CU
Elmar

Mattoo
08-14-2003, 11:32 AM
That was brill, I'd forgotten about the updating balls until Proton mentioned it in a post a while back. I'm hoping it's gonna make a triumphant return for version 8.

tpe
08-14-2003, 11:40 AM
That is seriously depressing, and more or less inexcuseable IMO. I hope it is just a roumor. So what happens if you hit r instead of y, back to the old workarounds. If not a history undoo should be for everything, every key stroke every selection every action you make, otherwise it is at best confusing and worst useless or posativly bad.

what is wrong with a normal every day undoo.

oh well back to one of those other programs that have real undoos.

tpe

Facial Deluxe
08-14-2003, 03:10 PM
Well for unlimited undos, take snapshot of your screen :D

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