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View Full Version : Release: wom_archlight 1.0 - physically accurate light shader


wombat778
06-28-2009, 04:56 AM
Maya users,

I have today released the 1.0 version of my light shader that I have been working on for some time, and that has been tested by many of the fine people on this forum. In case you missed the original thread, here is a quick list of the main features:

Support for IES light profiles with real light profile intensities, and ability to scale profile intensity using real world units
Support for photometric (candela, lumen, lux) or radiometric (watt, watt/s, watt/m2) real world-units
A photon emitter that supports light profiles, area lights, and is linked to direct light intensity
Ability to use area lights with soft shadows while retaining IES profile sharpness/definition
Support for color temperatures
Light profile rotation
A shader to create object/geometry lights
A separate simple texture shader to add light profile support to other nodes
Works with both Maya and Softimage on Windows 64-bit and 32-bit, Linux 64-bit, and MacOSX (Maya only).
Completely free and fully open source (BSD license) with minimal restrictions, so you can compile for other platforms, incorporate the code into other free or commercial projects and redistribute.
Comprehensive manual
The goal of the shader is really to be the only light shader for mental ray you will ever need to use. Please post if you run into any trouble or bugs. Any comments, feedback or nice renders are always appreciated. Enjoy!

Updated to version 1.23

Here are the links to the latest version (version 1.23): http://www.creativecrash.com/maya/downloads/shaders/c/wom-archlight?search=wom_archlight

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=QHSHM9O4

Note that version 1.23 has no improvements from the 1.22 test DLLs that were floating around previously. The only purpose of 1.23 is to provide an updated full package that provides support for Maya/Softimage 2010 on all platforms.

wizlon
06-28-2009, 09:12 AM
That's fantastic.

Thanks you for all your hard work.

leif3d
06-28-2009, 07:35 PM
Dude, this is awesome.
Thanks so much for all your hard work.:applause:

I'm going to post this in Pixar forums to see if someone can compile this for RMS!

slipknot66
06-28-2009, 10:54 PM
Thank You Very Much wombat:bowdown::thumbsup:

djx
06-29-2009, 12:20 AM
The goal of the shader is really to be the only light shader for mental ray you will ever need to use.

I'd say you're well on the way to achieving that goal. I dont know anything about IES but I'm getting great results so far, and the object light is really nice. Thanks wombat :applause:

-- David

Wolfganng
06-29-2009, 03:04 AM
photon emission through the light profile...just because of that im like a kid on christmas day right now, not to mention the rest of those awesome features
Thank YoU!!!

Hamburger
06-29-2009, 03:52 AM
the wonderful day of an easy and practical photometric lighting workflow in Maya is finally here, thank you wombat.

this will help all mayan arch viz users like me a huge amount.

Jozvex
06-29-2009, 04:41 AM
Can't wait to start using this! You're a star!

:thumbsup:

igi
06-29-2009, 10:03 AM
Thank You so much Wombat :thumbsup: Awsome features

Giap
06-29-2009, 02:52 PM
I wonder if anyone here has used LightGirl 1.0?

http://www.lightgirl.net/about.php

cgbeige
06-29-2009, 03:05 PM
thanks again.

Gandalf3d
06-29-2009, 03:52 PM
Hi, I can't download it megaupload. Please re upload rapidshare. Thanks.

wombat778
06-29-2009, 05:02 PM
Hi, I can't download it megaupload. Please re upload rapidshare. Thanks.


Hi Gandalf3d,

It is also uploaded at si-community.com (it is the exact same version). Here is the link: http://www.si-community.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=114

Hopefully that should be easier for you to access. Let me know.

dagon1978
06-29-2009, 06:05 PM
wombat, thanx again for all you efforts :D

this is my "little" wish for v2.0, importance sampling ;) eheh i know it's a little bit complicated, but... it's a wish...

davegreenwood
06-29-2009, 06:25 PM
Hi Wombat, I'd just like to add my thanks too for this great shader. Also there's the documentation and last but not least the source code. I find it a great education to go through peoples source codes, and I really appreciate you releasing it.
Many thanks
Dave.

Gandalf3d
06-29-2009, 06:46 PM
Thank you wombat. I download it :)

ytsejam1976
06-29-2009, 07:09 PM
wombat, thanx again for all you efforts :D

this is my "little" wish for v2.0, importance sampling ;) eheh i know it's a little bit complicated, but... it's a wish...

oh yeah, little wish? :applause:
ciao

ytsejam1976
06-30-2009, 01:42 PM
I don't know if is possible, but i have a wish. On the final gather computing, the shadow rays is more more and more. This problems is the same of the mib_light_photometric.
Is possible to do any satisfaction reduce shadow rays on your shader?

Thank you very much.

Dario

wombat778
06-30-2009, 04:08 PM
@dagon: Hehe, importance sampling sounds complicated but I will see what I can do.

@ysejam: I will take a look into the shadow ray issue. I assume you mean that shadows get very slow when using FG. Are there any mental ray shaders that do not have this problem? I know that physical_light has a threshold mechanism that maybe I could use (if it would solve the problem). Thanks.

dagon1978
06-30-2009, 04:48 PM
@dagon: Hehe, importance sampling sounds complicated but I will see what I can do.

@ysejam: I will take a look into the shadow ray issue. I assume you mean that shadows get very slow when using FG. Are there any mental ray shaders that do not have this problem? I know that physical_light has a threshold mechanism that maybe I could use (if it would solve the problem). Thanks.
i dont know if your shader already use it, but there is a mechanism to reduce shadow samples for secondary rays in the area lights
3ds max use the default setup, 1 sample(very bed IHMO), so, for secondary rays you get a noise look
maya instead let you control this mechanism, there is a "low samples" and an "high sample limit", the number of "low samples" it's used for secondary raytracing and also for the FG


I don't know if is possible, but i have a wish. On the final gather computing, the shadow rays is more more and more. This problems is the same of the mib_light_photometric.
Is possible to do any satisfaction reduce shadow rays on your shader?

Thank you very much.

Dario
dario, when you need to use many lights, try to reduce the falloff, this reduce the "phisical correctness" of the lighting, but it help a lot to reduce rendertimes

wombat778
06-30-2009, 05:13 PM
i dont know if your shader already use it, but there is a mechanism to reduce shadow samples for secondary rays in the area lights

I think that mechanism should work fine with my shader. As far as I know, the high/low samples is controlled by Maya/mental ray automatically. The setting then affects how many times the light shader gets called. My shader just casts one shadow ray each time it is called for direct light to check that the given point is not blocked by an occluding object. This is the same way that all the mental images shaders work as far as I know.

I do know that physical_light has a "threshold" parameter that does not bother to do the shadow ray check if the point is already very dark. It is possible that this could improve performance and may solve the problem.

Puppet|
06-30-2009, 07:20 PM
I suppose 'threshold' parameter will be very helpfull.

ytsejam1976
06-30-2009, 11:45 PM
dario, when you need to use many lights, try to reduce the falloff, this reduce the "phisical correctness" of the lighting, but it help a lot to reduce rendertimes


Yes Matteo, i know that, but if is possible, why not? :)
In this case, i've been many tests with wom_archlight and no more more more, shadow rays on FG computing, but only 1 more. :) :scream:

Ciao

anevsky
07-01-2009, 07:12 AM
Just from preliminary testing wom_archlight seems to work great. Thanks Wombat - looks very very useful.

tuuhia
07-01-2009, 07:43 AM
thank you wombat :buttrock:

Hamburger
07-01-2009, 11:19 AM
dario, when you need to use many lights, try to reduce the falloff, this reduce the "phisical correctness" of the lighting, but it help a lot to reduce rendertimes

I'm not sure what you mean dagon.

Personally, I've noticed when using this shader with a few lights, my scene's rendertime practically doubles per frame. This happens even when the lights are not in camera's view and am rendering an entirely different part of the scene. however I hide the layer and rendertimes dramatically drop down again.

Is this what you mean by reducing the falloff in this situation?

wombat778
07-01-2009, 12:54 PM
Personally, I've noticed when using this shader with a few lights, my scene's rendertime practically doubles per frame. This happens even when the lights are not in camera's view and am rendering an entirely different part of the scene. however I hide the layer and rendertimes dramatically drop down again.

I spent some time last night optimizing, and I think I found what could be causing the behavior you describe. I will try to post a new version in the next day or so that hopefully should have much better performance with no quality loss.

cheebamonkey
07-02-2009, 02:33 AM
I heart your shader!

wombat778
07-03-2009, 03:46 AM
Folks,

I have updated wom_archlight to version 1.1. I edited the link on the first post (I will always keep the first post current with the latest version).

The main focus of this version is performance improvements. You should see a substantial improvement in performance with no loss of image quality (e.g., they were pure code optimizations). I also have added several additional methods of tweaking performance including a Shadow Threshold setting and the ability to limit emission from light profiles using spotlight cones. There should also be a MUCH greater improvement now using the falloff settings.

As always, please let me know if you have any questions or comments. Thanks!

Hamburger
07-03-2009, 03:49 AM
Very nice thank you once again Wombat.

Have you looked at a site for hosting your shader? Highend3D.com might be useful:
http://www.highend3d.com/maya/downloads/
Links won't expire like they do on Megaupload and there will be a wider audience because many Maya users visit there.

Cheers.

wombat778
07-03-2009, 04:04 AM
Have you looked at a site for hosting your shader? Highend3D.com might be useful:

Good idea...I just submitted it there. It is moderated, so it may take a while to show up. Thanks!

Hamburger
07-03-2009, 05:38 AM
No worries.

Just to let you know, this latest update has fixed the slow rendertimes I was seeing before.

Leaving the lights on or hiding them makes only a very slight difference to rendertime compared to before when it was almost doubling the rendertime. Thanks.

ytsejam1976
07-03-2009, 09:11 AM
Great wombat.

If you agree, i'm post a little test scene for test and after i'm set all light, i'm post the Bar scene for all users.


P.S. wombat, but you know that you are, for all we users, an angel benefactor? :buttrock:

Thank always

lazzhar
07-03-2009, 10:46 AM
Great wombat.

If you agree, i'm post a little test scene for test and after i'm set all light, i'm post the Bar scene for all users.


Please do, I'm one of people that got lost and ashamed to say it here http://forums.cgsociety.org/images/icons/icon10.gif

Thanks for the shader btw.

dagon1978
07-03-2009, 11:25 AM
Folks,

I have updated wom_archlight to version 1.1. I edited the link on the first post (I will always keep the first post current with the latest version).

The main focus of this version is performance improvements. You should see a substantial improvement in performance with no loss of image quality (e.g., they were pure code optimizations). I also have added several additional methods of tweaking performance including a Shadow Threshold setting and the ability to limit emission from light profiles using spotlight cones. There should also be a MUCH greater improvement now using the falloff settings.

As always, please let me know if you have any questions or comments. Thanks!

great improvements! :)
now Autodesk need to take a look at your shader and GIVE US an integrated photometric system
maybe they can just buy it, isn't what they do all the time?

wizlon
07-03-2009, 11:55 AM
I'm not using any light profile and I'm having a few problems with area lights in Maya. If I use spotlight arealight with cone set to 180 degrees I get very different results (much brighter) than if I use standard arealight. All wom light shader settings are the same.
Should we be using standard Maya arealight and not 'old school' spot area lights?.

Also setting area light to visible, I get no visible area light or reflections of arealight on objects. Setting area light to not visible, I get visible area light in reflections but not still visible to camera.

Thanks.

wombat778
07-03-2009, 12:25 PM
I'm not using any light profile and I'm having a few problems with area lights in Maya. If I use spotlight arealight with cone set to 180 degrees I get very different results (much brighter) than if I use standard arealight. All wom light shader settings are the same.
Should we be using standard Maya arealight and not 'old school' spot area lights?.

Also setting area light to visible, I get no visible area light or reflections of arealight on objects. Setting area light to not visible, I get visible area light in reflections but not still visible to camera.

Thanks.

Hi Wizlon,

On the second part, you are certainly right. There is something messed up when using visible area lights and spotlights, and I will try to pin it down asap.

On the first part (intensity), what units of intensity are you using? If you are using either lumen or watts, bear in mind that those units define the total output of the light. If you use a 180 degree cone spotlight, the light is emitting in only one hemisphere whereas a non-spotlight will emit in a sphere. Thus, to get the same wattage/lumen, the intensity within the spotlight cone will much higher. Similarly, the smaller the cone angle, the brighter the light will become, given the same watts/lumen. If you are using any of the other units, however, the intensity should stay the same between spotlights and non-spotlights.

Also, I forgot to mention that this build takes into account the inner cone angle for purposes of calculating the lumen/watts. Basically, when the inner cone angle is set smaller than the outer cone angle, a certain amount of light energy is lost because of the dropoff towards the edges of the spotlight. Wom_archlight now calculates this dropoff and boosts the intensity of the light to compensate, so that the total watt/lumen output remains the same regardless of the inner cone angle setting. This means that a spotlight with an inner cone angle of 0 will be much brighter in the center of the beam than a spotlight with an inner cone angle that matches the outer cone angle. All of this ONLY applies, however, when using watts or lumens.

wombat778
07-03-2009, 12:58 PM
On the second part, you are certainly right. There is something messed up when using visible area lights and spotlights, and I will try to pin it down asap.

Actually, after looking at it more closely, it seems that spotlights + visible area lights are working ok on my end. Is it possible that the visible intensity needs to be boosted to see it properly? If you are still having problems, any chance you could send me a scene to diagnose? Thanks!

EDIT: Ok, so I am probably coming across as flighty.:wip: I think I may have found a problem with visible area lights and reflections. Please let me know which version you use, and I will send you a test .dll that should solve the issue. Thanks, and my apologies.

ytsejam1976
07-03-2009, 01:05 PM
All this tests are on amd single dualcore

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/8083/withoutthreshold.jpg (http://img35.imageshack.us/i/withoutthreshold.jpg/)


http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/7243/thresholdonly.jpg (http://img33.imageshack.us/i/thresholdonly.jpg/)

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/9750/ststpthresholds.jpg (http://img88.imageshack.us/i/ststpthresholds.jpg/)

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/2433/onlyfg.jpg (http://img139.imageshack.us/i/onlyfg.jpg/)


On the latest image, you notice the artifacts of fg, but seriously, i don't wont optimize this for fg only, now i'm free.......................

wombat778
07-03-2009, 01:25 PM
Thanks for the test ytsejam! Another one you might want to try. Try setting both the threshold and falloff to off. Then make all the ies lights into spotlights and turn on Use Cone Angles with Light Profiles. Looking at the lights, try setting both the inner and outer cone angles to 100. That would be a less "biased" approach, and might give you close to the same performance. Just an idea!

ytsejam1976
07-03-2009, 01:34 PM
Yes, wombat. Now i'm go to work, but when i'm a free time i'm test with your specific notes.

this is the scene for all.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=8GGCBBJU My scene setting is in centimeters
I'm post the bar scene, on other time. Good tests :buttrock:

P.S. for dagon, you notice the lamp with hole? you note some likeness? You know that you are my master.

Ciao ;)

wizlon
07-03-2009, 02:26 PM
Actually, after looking at it more closely, it seems that spotlights + visible area lights are working ok on my end. Is it possible that the visible intensity needs to be boosted to see it properly? If you are still having problems, any chance you could send me a scene to diagnose? Thanks!

EDIT: Ok, so I am probably coming across as flighty.:wip: I think I may have found a problem with visible area lights and reflections. Please let me know which version you use, and I will send you a test .dll that should solve the issue. Thanks, and my apologies.

Certainly no need to apologize. Thanks for all your great work.

I'm using Maya 2008 Extension 2 patch 1. (osx)

Light is in Watts.

I didn't realize when using wom_archlight light from an area light would emit in a sphere . With MentalRay physical light, light emits in a hemisphere. (because of cosine distribution I guess)

I think the issue is with Cosine Distribution. When off light emits in sphere, when on light emits in hemisphere but light energy does not get redirected to hemisphere just clipped by Cosine Exponent. This works fine with spot lights and cone angle as you described. Is this achievable with area light and cosine exponent so that when cosine distribution is enabled and exponent value changes light energy increases to compensate? The total watt/lumen output then remains the same regardless of the cosine exponent.

wombat778
07-03-2009, 03:15 PM
I think the issue is with Cosine Distribution. When off light emits in sphere, when on light emits in hemisphere but light energy does not get redirected to hemisphere just clipped by Cosine Exponent. This works fine with spot lights and cone angle as you described. Is this achievable with area light and cosine exponent so that when cosine distribution is enabled and exponent value changes light energy increases to compensate? The total watt/lumen output then remains the same regardless of the cosine exponent.

Yep, you are correct. Cosine distribution is not currently compensated for when using lumens/watts. I think it should be possible to fix, though I will need to work out the math to make it work (I don't expect it to be much different than the math for the inner cone angle compensation). I will try to get that into 1.2. In the meantime I would treat cosine distribution as a non-physically correct setting.

Also, PM sent on the area light reflection issue. Thanks!

iduna79
07-03-2009, 03:36 PM
Seems to be a great plug-in. Downloaded and installed it. Will try it out soon

anevsky
07-04-2009, 05:41 AM
On the latest image, you notice the artifacts of fg, but seriously, i don't wont optimize this for fg only, now i'm free.......................

What do you mean and what are you showing with the last image?

Sorry for the slowness if it's obvious:D

ytsejam1976
07-04-2009, 09:00 AM
What do you mean and what are you showing with the last image?

Sorry for the slowness if it's obvious:D


in red area, but other fg artifacts on my image


http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/3535/onlyfg2.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/i/onlyfg2.jpg/)

slipknot66
07-04-2009, 11:13 AM
To get rid of those FG problems, try to use FG filter 2 or 3.

ytsejam1976
07-04-2009, 11:46 AM
thanks slipknot66. But i 'm usualy render without filter, and i'm optimized very well. Thank anyway, but i know how resolve this problem. :)

In this image i don't want resolve this problem, because i have the GI finally and the problem don't get with gI+FG, as you see on my first images.
Thanks
Dario

anevsky
07-05-2009, 08:04 AM
In this image i don't want resolve this problem, because i have the GI finally and the problem don't get with gI+FG, as you see on my first images.
Thanks
Dario

Aha. That is the answer to my question from before.

ytsejam1976
07-05-2009, 11:01 AM
Aha. That is the answer to my question from before.

eheh....... repetita iuvant :shrug:

orre
07-05-2009, 01:58 PM
Does this shader work with importons?

wombat778
07-09-2009, 02:45 PM
Does this shader work with importons?

Hi orre, sorry I missed this. I do not know off the top of my head whether it will work with importons, though I think it should work ok. I will try tonight. My understanding from the mental ray docs is that importons use regular photon shaders, so I would think it would work ok with the photon shader in wom_archlight.

wombat778
07-09-2009, 02:47 PM
All,

I wanted to check in and see how people are getting on with the last version. I am likely to put out another version this weekend. The changes are minor and mostly related to bugfixes to the visible area lights and cosine distribution. Are there any other issues that people are running into that I should check out? Thanks!

ytsejam1976
07-09-2009, 03:24 PM
Hi wombat and thank you.
I have a little question for all and not only for you that are great. I don't remember how i set a light shader in one touch in all light selected. I testing your shader with 200 light on scene and more that 100 are the same light intensity but set a womlight in all 200 light one4one is more hard. I know that a script mel help me, but i don't know the procedure and my knowledge no good for all MEL. Thank you in advance.
Ciao

I know that before i duplicate with connection my light, but in this situation is not good.

Libor
07-13-2009, 12:47 PM
Great work wombat!! I have tried it and it works nicely, so many thanks!


Just one question for everyone interested in this problematics...


Is there any database on the net for IES profiles?! I ve just got one from here some time ago but I m desperately looking for more of them.


Any ideas?


Thanks.

ytsejam1976
07-13-2009, 12:54 PM
some IES light profile database, for lluminare specific.

http://www.lumina.it/php/pages/wrapper.php?table_id=t_catalogo&lang=eng

http://www.simes.it/ita/download/index.html

http://www.lithonia.com/Photometrics.aspx

SimFox
07-16-2009, 10:08 PM
Sorry, if this is a totally dumb question, but would it be possible to use this shader with Max?

djx
07-17-2009, 04:17 AM
..how i set a light shader in one touch in all light selected.

I'm not sure if this is what you meant, but the following code will hook up a single light shader to multiple lights. You could make it into a shelf button or something.

{
// select all the lightShapes in the hypershade, then select the wom_archlight, then run this...
string $sel[] = `ls -sl`;

for($n=0; $n<size($sel)-1; $n++) {
connectAttr -f ($sel[size($sel)] + ".message") ($sel[$n] + ".miLightShader");
}
}

-- David

wombat778
07-17-2009, 04:25 AM
Sorry, if this is a totally dumb question, but would it be possible to use this shader with Max?

Hi SimFox,

It is a pure mental ray shader, so it should certainly be possible to make it work in Max. The only reason I have not done so is that I was under the impression that Max's built-in photometric light already does most of what wom_archlight can do, so I figured there would be little demand.

If there is demand for it, I am happy to port to Max though.

ytsejam1976
07-17-2009, 11:45 AM
I'm not sure if this is what you meant, but the following code will hook up a single light shader to multiple lights. You could make it into a shelf button or something.

{
// select all the lightShapes in the hypershade, then select the wom_archlight, then run this...
string $sel[] = `ls -sl`;

for($n=0; $n<size($sel)-1; $n++) {
connectAttr -f ($sel[size($sel)] + ".message") ($sel[$n] + ".miLightShader");
}
}

-- David

Yes is this. Thank you very much. I save this as shelf button, 1 for .miLighShader and 1 for .miPhotonEmitter.
And works fine
Thanks
Dario

SimFox
07-17-2009, 03:21 PM
Hi SimFox,

It is a pure mental ray shader, so it should certainly be possible to make it work in Max. The only reason I have not done so is that I was under the impression that Max's built-in photometric light already does most of what wom_archlight can do, so I figured there would be little demand.

If there is demand for it, I am happy to port to Max though.

Well, in some part yes but it is this line in the description that got me salavating:

A shader to create object/geometry lights

I assume it isn't simple FG/self-illumination setup is it?

It would be really great if you could port it to 64bit Max. Would it be version dependent? I mean the version of MR is different in every max...

wombat778
07-17-2009, 03:36 PM
Well, in some part yes but it is this line in the description that got me salavating:

A shader to create object/geometry lights

I assume it isn't simple FG/self-illumination setup is it?

It would be really great if you could port it to 64bit Max. Would it be version dependent? I mean the version of MR is different in every max...

Ahh, I see. No, it is a proper object/geometry light, not a simple self-illumination.

I don't see any reason why I could not port the light object shader to Max quite easily. I will see what I can do.

In terms of versions, I don't think it would make much difference what MR version you use. Mental ray started supporting object lights in version 3.1, and I think that ever since Max started using MR it has used more recent versions than that.

fabergambis
07-19-2009, 02:49 PM
I'm not sure if this is what you meant, but the following code will hook up a single light shader to multiple lights. You could make it into a shelf button or something.

{
// select all the lightShapes in the hypershade, then select the wom_archlight, then run this...
string $sel[] = `ls -sl`;

for($n=0; $n<size($sel)-1; $n++) {
connectAttr -f ($sel[size($sel)] + ".message") ($sel[$n] + ".miLightShader");
}
}

-- David

David, I want simply to tell you THAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANKSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!
You're GREAT! :bowdown:
You can't imagine how long I need a script like this.

JayHoo
07-20-2009, 01:26 PM
Could it be that the "scene unit size" does not really work in the wom_archlight?

I create a scene with a simple plane and a sphere. Mia_material_x with no reflection (similar to lambert). One area light over the scene with the wom_archlight.

The sphere is 7cm high and the area light is 30cm over the ground plane.

I used the photographic lens shader. "Physically correct" is activated in wom_light.

Inside the wom_archlight I set intensity to 58 (stands for a 60W light bulb), unit of intesity is Candela.

Scens Unit Size is both set to "centimeter".

Now when I render the rendering is black. When I set the unit size to "milimeter" the rendering looks ok. When I change the unit size in the maya settings, nothing happens.

The problem is that now I couldnot set up a scene where I get an illumination which is similar to an light bulb .

ytsejam1976
07-20-2009, 01:37 PM
It's strange, JayHoo. I don't have never problem to set in millimeter or centimenters or meters.
Can you post the scene?

JayHoo
07-20-2009, 02:22 PM
Ok, I got what I want. In the photographic lens shader I had to use the "arbitrary mode" (Film Iso = 0).

Sorry to blaming this great shader. :sad:

Now i can put an area light 2 meters over my plane and had a reasonable lighting.

I looked up the values for a 100W bulb and compared it with Candela and Watt settings for them. And it is 99.9% the same. Really great. :wip:

wombat778
07-20-2009, 02:54 PM
Ok, I got what I want. In the photographic lens shader I had to use the "arbitrary mode" (Film Iso = 0).

Sorry to blaming this great shader. :sad:

Now i can put an area light 2 meters over my plane and had a reasonable lighting.

I looked up the values for a 100W bulb and compared it with Candela and Watt settings for them. And it is 99.9% the same. Really great. :wip:

Hi Jayhoo,

Actually, I think you should stick with the non-arbitrary mode if possible (e.g, set the film ISO to something like 100) and the cm2 factor set to 1.

When you were having the problem, what did you have the camera settings set at? I know that Maya by default will set the ISO to 100, shutter to 1/100 and f-stop at 16. Those are WAY too high for an indoor photograph, and would result in a black image with a real camera. My camera exposure meter is telling me that without a flash for an indoor night shot to use ISO = 100, shutter = 1/5, and f-stop of 2.8. That is in a room lit by 3 75-watt bulbs, so the image will probably still be too dark for a single 60-watt bulb. Anyhow, try those settings and see if you get something closer to correct.

JayHoo
07-20-2009, 04:57 PM
thanks for your quick reply Wombat.

The advantage of the arbitrary mode towards the photographic mode (how the non-arbitrary is called) is that i only need to set ISO = 0. In the other mode I had to use the three values and I am not used to that photographic stuff.

The result with the arbitrary mode looks quit convincing. To get the same in photo mode I set ISO to 90 and shutter, f-stop to 1.

Scene Setting: plane, sphere and an area light 2,5 meter above.

Intensity = 58 Candela (this is like a 60W bulb)

wombat778
07-20-2009, 05:09 PM
thanks for your quick reply Wombat.

The advantage of the arbitrary mode towards the photographic mode (how the non-arbitrary is called) is that i only need to set ISO = 0. In the other mode I had to use the three values and I am not used to that photographic stuff.

Fair enough, if you aren't used to camera settings then arbitrary mode may be fine. The advantage of using the photographic mode is that even if you do not know the settings, you can get a real life camera to do the work for you by just taking a picture in a room with approximately the same light level, then inputting the settings the camera chooses directly into mia_exposure_photographic.

Anyhow, it does not surprise me that you had to use ISO 90, shutter 1 and fstop 1 to get a decent image. In real life, ISO 90 film is quite slow and would generally be used for outdoor shots (ISO 400 is probably more realistic). Also a single 60 watt bulb in a room is not very bright, especially if you are only relying on direct light (e.g., not using FG/GI).

JayHoo
07-20-2009, 05:19 PM
When I use ISO 400, shutter 1 and f-stop 2.8 then it looks good too.

If I knew the cam settings from the setting that would be nice too. But without the arbitray mode is easier to set up.

marlaS
07-20-2009, 05:52 PM
Hi wombat,
thank you very much, your shader is very very very good! :applause:

I read about soft shadow and point light, you say it isn't possible...
...so I tried... and tried... and I remember my test (made with my friends ystejam and fabergambis a century ago.. :wip: hhe) with the mib.photometric and I found a solution!:

connect your wonderful shader to the slot color of the point light (yes the pointlightshape1)

... and it works! Now you can set up the light radius, soft rays in the maya pointlightshape node but remember to raise the ray.depht.limit in order to get the same result of your traditional workflow.
I know this method need testing, but for now it work very well

Thank you again!

ytsejam1976
07-20-2009, 06:14 PM
Ehy alessandro. I want to see your fansworth House with womArchLight.

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/7503/giardinocopy.jpg (http://img216.imageshack.us/i/giardinocopy.jpg/)


:buttrock:

SimFox
07-21-2009, 11:53 AM
Ahh, I see. No, it is a proper object/geometry light, not a simple self-illumination.

I don't see any reason why I could not port the light object shader to Max quite easily. I will see what I can do.

In terms of versions, I don't think it would make much difference what MR version you use. Mental ray started supporting object lights in version 3.1, and I think that ever since Max started using MR it has used more recent versions than that.

:bowdown:

please, please, please!

everyone using max would be soooo grateful for this miracle!

ytsejam1976
07-21-2009, 12:57 PM
I'm search to use this on max and :
API 0.0 error 301181: .\shaders_standard\include/wom_archlight.mi, line 6: bad default value type integer, parameter "colormode" expected boolean
API 0.0 error 301181: .\shaders_standard\include/wom_archlight.mi, line 11: bad default value type integer, parameter "intensitymode" expected boolean

I 'think taht a GUI or other. And i attached on light on 3dsmax, but some strange, no great control for mow and the light profile not appear, or the wom light profile on 3dsmax not work. But i think that wombat resolve all.

tuuhia
07-21-2009, 06:04 PM
Hi wombat,
thank you very much, your shader is very very very good! :applause:

I read about soft shadow and point light, you say it isn't possible...
...so I tried... and tried... and I remember my test (made with my friends ystejam and fabergambis a century ago.. :wip: hhe) with the mib.photometric and I found a solution!:

connect your wonderful shader to the slot color of the point light (yes the pointlightshape1)

... and it works! Now you can set up the light radius, soft rays in the maya pointlightshape node but remember to raise the ray.depht.limit in order to get the same result of your traditional workflow.
I know this method need testing, but for now it work very well

Thank you again!

interesting solution...thank you for the info :)

wizlon
07-22-2009, 09:39 AM
Hi wombat,
thank you very much, your shader is very very very good! :applause:

I read about soft shadow and point light, you say it isn't possible...
...so I tried... and tried... and I remember my test (made with my friends ystejam and fabergambis a century ago.. :wip: hhe) with the mib.photometric and I found a solution!:

connect your wonderful shader to the slot color of the point light (yes the pointlightshape1)

... and it works! Now you can set up the light radius, soft rays in the maya pointlightshape node but remember to raise the ray.depht.limit in order to get the same result of your traditional workflow.
I know this method need testing, but for now it work very well

Thank you again!

From my tests using this technique, you also have to set Shadow Factor to 1.000 under wom_archlight Advanced Tab.

marlaS
07-22-2009, 04:44 PM
From my tests using this technique, you also have to set Shadow Factor to 1.000 under wom_archlight Advanced Tab.

Thank you for the tip, I will test it!:beer:

wombat778
07-23-2009, 04:46 AM
All,

I have updated wom_archlight to version 1.2. Here is the changelog:

Version 1.2 New Features/Changes

Added visible area light falloff options
Default visible area light intensity now is related to light output
Added ability to use spotlight manipulator in softimage
Added a Relative Inner Cone Angle mode that operates similarly to the Spread parameter of Softimage's soft_light
Cosine distribution is now physically correct when using lumens/watts in most cases
The default distribution mode is now Reference Light mode
Added an Enable Attenuation checkbox to enable attenuation
A few minor performance enhancements
Internal code reorganization and cleanup. Now only one function handles all unit conversions
Version 1.2 Bug Fixes

Fixed bug where visible area intensity would not affect reflections
Fixed bug where dark light colors could make intensity inaccurate
Fixed bug causing artifacts when using lux/watts/m2 at spotlight focus
Fixed some AETemplate logic bugs for Maya version
Fixed bug that could cause white dots under certain circumstances
Other minor bug fixes
Since some people had trouble with the megaupload link, I am sticking to highend3d this time. Here is the link: http://www.highend3d.com/maya/downloads/shaders/wom-archlight-5849.html

As always, please let me know if you run into trouble!

fabergambis
07-23-2009, 01:20 PM
Wombat, I have no words to say to thank you for your effort on sharing and developing this unbelievable light shader. Really thank you.
SInce you released the first beta, I'm using this shader for testing and refining old projects with artificial lights: that's what I was waiting for...

ytsejam1976
07-23-2009, 01:22 PM
Wombat, I have no words to say to thank you for your effort on sharing and developing this unbelievable light shader. Really thank you.


quote all


:buttrock:

wombat778
07-23-2009, 04:27 PM
Thanks guys, I am glad you like it!

On an unrelated note, I don't suppose anyone has any nice screenshots that illustrate the shader they would be willing to let me use for the highend3d entry? Right now the highend3d entry just has a generic icon. I am much more of a programmer than an artist (all the test scenes I have made are very simple and boring), and I am thinking that one of you guys will be able to put together something much more impressive...

wombat778
07-27-2009, 03:57 AM
On an unrelated note, I don't suppose anyone has any nice screenshots that illustrate the shader they would be willing to let me use for the highend3d entry?

Ytsejam sorted me out with a very nice image. Thanks!:beer:

orre
08-11-2009, 09:39 AM
Thank you Wombat for your efforts!

I am currently experimenting with your shader and I try to figure out which method will give the most accurate results. I have read your manual, it helps alot but doesn't really answer my question.

I'm trying to set up a light with a IES-profile from a spotlight. When I use this profile with an maya area light or a maya spotlight I get very different light intensities. The profile together with the maya spotlight seems to yield the most accurate results. Which is logic I think. However I don't want to guess about this matters and I would really appreciate to know which setup gives accurate results for a spotlight IES profile?

By the way if anyone is looking for IES-profiles then GE Lightning has plenty of them.

wombat778
08-11-2009, 12:09 PM
However I don't want to guess about this matters and I would really appreciate to know which setup gives accurate results for a spotlight IES profile?

Hi orre,

That is VERY strange. When using IES profiles in absolute mode, there should be NO difference in intensity when using spotlights or area lights. I just tested on my machine, and I get identical intensity with both area lights and spotlights.

The only thing I can think of is that you might have the "Use Cone Angles with Light Profiles" setting enabled. That setting is not a "physically correct" setting, as it will reduce the intensity of light profiles when using spotlights.

If that is not the problem, could you send me a copy of your scene or a detailed description of how the scene and shader is set up?

orre
08-11-2009, 02:14 PM
Thanks for the quick reply!

And your certain answer helped alot! Its good to know that your results are VERY strange :banghead: :)

It might be me who misunderstood the profile rotations. When I used a maya spotlight I chose downlight to spotlight and when I used maya area light i chose downlight to arealight. This way i get very different results, but if I use downlight to spotlight with both they render the same.

If I use uplight to area light I get expected results. Is there any special thought behind the different uplight/downlight rotations?

Anyway my problems are solved! Thank you very much!

By the way, did you come to any conclusion on using archlight with protons?

wombat778
08-11-2009, 05:28 PM
It might be me who misunderstood the profile rotations. When I used a maya spotlight I chose downlight to spotlight and when I used maya area light i chose downlight to arealight. This way i get very different results, but if I use downlight to spotlight with both they render the same.

Glad its working! Regarding the profile rotations, its a little complicated. The short answer is that mental ray area lights (disc and rectangle) and mental ray spotlights generally face opposite directions. In other words, if you create a standard rectangular area light with default transforms, and a regular spotlight with default transforms, the "front" of the area light will be pointing exactly backwards from the direction of the spotlight cone. The profile rotation presets were designed to allow you to rotate the profile so that it would line up with the direction of the area light or spotlight.

Now, the weird part comes in when using area spotlights. These basically create a "backwards" area light that faces the same direction as the spotlight. Thus, when using area spotlights, you should choose the Downlight/Uplight to Spotlight options to get the correct profile rotation. I should probably rename the preset to make clear that it applies both to spotlights and area spotlights. Apologies for the confusion.

Regarding importons, unfortunately I have not had much of a chance to get into it as I have been quite busy at work recently. I will try to take a look in the coming days/weeks though!

fabergambis
08-11-2009, 11:32 PM
I'm testing wom_archlight with FG+Gi+Importons and it seems everything works fine.
The fact is that I'm not sure about importons usage, so I'm testing so much just to understand how importons work but from my visual results, and comparing the results I get in the output window everything seems correct.
I'm quite satisfied of the effects I get with archlights+importons, much better than with simple photons.
Just to let you know :)

orre
08-15-2009, 06:39 PM
Wombat: Thanks for the explanation!

Fabergambis: It's good to know that I'm not the only one who thinks it works ok. :applause:

sisco78
08-21-2009, 02:38 PM
Hello everybody.
I'm trying to use this great shader, but I'm not able tu use wom_light_object in Maya 2009/32 on Windows XP.

I followed instructions (actually, I think so):

- created object "pTorus1"
- enabled geometry shader and assigned "wom_light_object1"
- assigned "pTorus1" as source
- assigned "areaLightShape1" as light shader and photon emitter

And in the render everything is black.
With default light enabled I can see background, but the object I'd like to use as light is invisible.
I verified and changed scale, without success.
FG or GI on/off don't change the result.
Later I'll test the scene on another system (Maya 2009/64 on Windows7RC)

May someone help me?
Thank you

Francesco

ytsejam1976
08-21-2009, 06:27 PM
the correct way is: create a poly dummies like you want. Enables geometry shader and connect womobject light. Create your tourus or anywant object and assign this as source. After this creat a womarchLight and assign it as Light and emitterphoton shaders. On the end, the dummys like a cube, take the tourus transform in render, you understand?

wombat778
08-21-2009, 08:38 PM
I followed instructions (actually, I think so):

- created object "pTorus1"
- enabled geometry shader and assigned "wom_light_object1"
- assigned "pTorus1" as source
- assigned "areaLightShape1" as light shader and photon emitter


Yep, ytsejam is right. The sequence you should use is:

1) create an object "pTorus1"

2) Create another dummy object (e.g., a sphere, cube - it does not matter as it will NOT be rendered). Lets just say you create a cube.

3) Enable the geometry shader on the dummy cube object, and assign "wom_light_object1"

4) Assign "pTorus1" as the source

5) assign a shader such as wom_archlight as the light shader and photon shader (NOT "areaLightShape1", as you appear to have done). You can also use any other light shader such as mib_light_point or physical_light.

It should then render fine. What should happen is that the there will be a light at the location of the dummy object in the shape of pTorus1. To move the light around, just move the dummy object. Let me know if it gives you trouble. Alternatively, I am happy to send you a basic scene with it set up properly.

sisco78
08-21-2009, 10:04 PM
Thank you very much ytsejam1976 and wombat778 for your quick reply!
Now everything is clear for me, and it works perfectly!

:bowdown:

ytsejam1976
08-21-2009, 11:55 PM
Hi wombat. Hi all
As you see, i'm all in test with your light. I'm intersting results with a spotlight and cone angle in wombat, in a luminaire on the ground. Some opinion much appreciate from all.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/7683/nightdef1womarchlightco.th.jpg (http://img291.imageshack.us/i/nightdef1womarchlightco.jpg/)

Ciao

wombat778
08-22-2009, 12:47 PM
Looks very nice ytsejam!

Also, have you, or anyone else using wom_archlight, run into any bugs in 1.2? I know there is a minor bug regarding the intensity of visible area light shapes, but I have not heard any other bug reports. Unless I get more reports, I will probably release a version 1.2.1 that just fixes the one bug. But if anyone else is has found any bugs or has other suggestions I am happy to include it.

Thanks!

ytsejam1976
08-22-2009, 01:04 PM
Hi wombat and thank you. In my tests i'm not results bugs. But some times, i not good work with one light shader connected on multipled light, i don't know if this is a limitation knowed on WomarchLight, in any case is not a very problem. But one request for other release, i don't know if this is possible: a fake falloff. ok we have a start and stop, but how control the falloff on wombat. I know that with area light inverse square i m work well, i think then your shader move in this way. But if i want some effects the control is hard. In ground lamp, i set two spot light, one up and one down direction. I don't use one only light, then is more simple to setting, ok not a big problem, but if is possible to semplificate the workflow, i much appreciate this.

Anyway, your shader are great and.......................... importance sampling when............? :)

Ciao and thank you

conio
08-25-2009, 02:12 PM
It is a pure mental ray shader, so it should certainly be possible to make it work in Max. The only reason I have not done so is that I was under the impression that Max's built-in photometric light already does most of what wom_archlight can do, so I figured there would be little demand.

If there is demand for it, I am happy to port to Max though.



Are there any news on a possible MAX-Release for this shader?

As it is a mental ray shader it should work in MAX right away (did not test it though). But some info on how to set up the scene in MAX (especially for objectlight) and maybe a modified mi-File would be totally cool :)

Can't wait to see it in MAX.
By the way, this shader is definitely useful in MAX as the photometric lighting in MAX sucks IMO (for example the show lightshape option is just a big BUG!).

Also there is no objectlight available (which is what the whole mental ray community is waiting for since years [and is what mental images + Autodesk don't seem to be able to build in... SAD enough!:D]).

wombat778
08-25-2009, 05:37 PM
Conio,

Unfortunately I do not have a whole lot of news to report. Work has been very busy recently, so I have not had much of a chance to port it over to Max. The main problem is that I really don't know anything about how Max's shader UI logic works, so I need some time to get up to speed before I do the port. Unfortunately, that time has been hard to come by recently:( Of course, if there is someone out there who already knows how to make nice shader UIs in Max and is willing to help, it might speed up the process a lot.

Anyhow, I certainly do plan on doing the port over the next few weeks. Sorry for the delay...

sherridge101
08-28-2009, 01:55 PM
Hi wombat,

Does your plug-in work in maya2010 for mac?

Cheers,

Steve

wombat778
08-28-2009, 02:51 PM
Does your plug-in work in maya2010 for mac?

I think it should, since it works fine on Maya 2009 for Mac. However, I have not tested on Maya 2010 so I cannot be 100% sure. I would go ahead and try, and report back how it works!

sherridge101
08-28-2009, 04:29 PM
All seems to work fine, cheers.

The issues I had was taking carpaint shaders plugged in to mia from maya 2008 to 2010.

Creating a new mia fixed one problem and changing flake scale to anything other than 0 fixed the other.

Cheers,

Steve

KIDI
08-31-2009, 08:51 AM
Great post, nice renders ytsejam1976 ;)

conio
08-31-2009, 09:21 PM
Did anyone get the objectlight shader to work in MAX maybe? The lightshader works perfectly but the objectlight shader does not work as it should. Though I think this because of the mrGeoShader-Plugin... since MAX doesn't support mental ray geometry shaders out of the box. Did anyone try it?

I tested around and actually the shader WORKS... meaning mental ray renders without warnings or errors. Just the connection to the object which should emit the light doesn't seem to work. Though I got some "visual response" when switching the visible state for the light on. But It looks like the background gets lit (at least a fraction of it) instead of the geometry???

I also tested it in Maya, where it works just perfectly, but noticed that the intensity of the shape when using visible light shape doesn't fit to the lights intensity. As I looked into the source code I noticed that there isn't a case for calculating the shape intensity when custom objects are used... just the normal (taken from physical light shader) rectangle, circle, sphere, etc. cases.

Is an implementation of such a feature planned? Therefore the surface area of the light-shape (geometry) has to be calculated first, right? Would be nice to know if this is possible and could be accomplished in the next updates???

Greetz Ben

fabergambis
09-01-2009, 11:17 AM
Is there someone who got wom_archlight working on maya 2010?
Since I check on the use light profile option, start render and after few seconds I get this:
DB 0.4 fatal 041052: accessing unknown tag 0x28.
Very very sad:cry:
Please wombat...do something! I cannot live without your shader:lightbulb

wombat778
09-01-2009, 07:01 PM
@fabergambis. That is very strange. I wonder if Maya 2010 somehow changed the way light profiles are used. Does it work ok when using reference light? Can you test to see if mib_light_photometric works ok? I will see if I can try it out on a copy of Maya 2010 and try to nail down the problem.

@conio: regarding the shape intensity, there is actually already code in there in wom_visible_area. The lines are:

case miLIGHT_OBJECT:
mi_query(miQ_INST_AREA, state, state->light_instance, &area);
break;

Were you looking at a different section of the code? Anyhow, I think it should work ok, though it is off by 3.14 due to a bug. Try setting the visible area light intensity to 3.14 and see if it fixes your problem.

fabergambis
09-01-2009, 09:08 PM
@fabergambis. That is very strange. I wonder if Maya 2010 somehow changed the way light profiles are used. Does it work ok when using reference light? Can you test to see if mib_light_photometric works ok? I will see if I can try it out on a copy of Maya 2010 and try to nail down the problem.

....



I can only say for sure that wom_archlight works without light profiles; recently I opened a scene with wom_archlight v1 and you probably know that when you have installed the v1.2 and open a scene with an older version, don't know why but the use light profile oprion is switched off.
So I rendered that scene and worked ok but I noticed a different lighting, I checked for wom shaders and I realized that light profiles were switched off. Once I turned on light profiles the render aborted with that error message.
That happened many times with two different scenes.
Don't know what changed in new mr 3.7.5 but that's it.
I just tested mib_photometric and works well, then I put wom_archlight on the same area light with the same light profile and had the same problem.
This time a little bit different error code:
DB 0.4 fatal 041052: accessing unknown tag 0x11
Hope it helps to solve the problem, otherwise maya 2010 will be quite useless.
PLEEEEAAAAAASEEEEEE!!!

wombat778
09-01-2009, 09:32 PM
Hope it helps to solve the problem, otherwise maya 2010 will be quite useless. PLEEEEAAAAAASEEEEEE!!!

Dont worry, I will figure it out. I am sure it is something really simple that 2010 does differently. I will try to fix it in the next few days.

wombat778
09-06-2009, 02:27 AM
Fabergambis,

Well, I finally got a bit of time to try to figure out your Maya 2010 issue. The strange thing is that I just tested it here, and it seemed to work just fine (both with light profiles and with reference lights). I just created a clean scene in Maya 2010, added a point light, added wom_achlight, added a light profile, and it rendered fine.

I am wondering if there might not be some problem with your scene. Can you try to do a very quick clean scene to see if that is maybe the problem. If not, can you give me detailed specs on your machine (just to make sure that it is not a problem specific to the version you are using).

Tobbe
09-08-2009, 02:56 PM
Hi wombat778,

It seems there is no way to turn off "emit specular"... if it's physical correctness we are after, first thing would be to turn off all "fake" specular highlights. I can of course turn this off in the mia-materials but there should definitely be an option for this in the light. Or am I missing something obvious?


Tobbe

wombat778
09-09-2009, 02:06 AM
Hi wombat778,

It seems there is no way to turn off "emit specular"... if it's physical correctness we are after, first thing would be to turn off all "fake" specular highlights. I can of course turn this off in the mia-materials but there should definitely be an option for this in the light. Or am I missing something obvious?

Thanks for the suggestion Tobbe. The issue is actually a bit complicated. In traditional pure mental ray, a light shader has absolutely no concept of "specular" or "diffuse". The job of a light shader is to do one thing and one thing only - calculate the amount of light arriving at a given point from a given light source. It is up to the material shader to then figure out how to represent that light on the screen (e.g., dividing it into diffuse and specular, modifying it by the illuminated point's normal etc.). The light shader itself does none of that. This is the way that wom_archlight works, as do all the other mental ray built-in shaders.

HOWEVER, Maya has added certain custom mental ray properties to allow light shaders in Maya to handle the "Emit Diffuse" and "Emit Specular" checkboxes on lights. In truth, the light shader itself does not really do anything at all with those settings...the only thing it does it take the checkbox value from the light and then pass them onto the material shader. As usual it is the material shader that does the work. More recently mental ray itself has added support for an API for mia_material that allows a light shader to set the diffuse and specular contribution. From what I can tell this operates similarly to the Maya custom extension, though it presumably only works for mia_material.

With that explanation out the way, hopefully you see the complication. There seems to be no easy, platform neutral way to do this. I would prefer avoiding the Maya custom extension, as it would result in wom_archlight needing a separate DLL for each different app. The mental ray mia approach seems pretty limited, however. In any case, I will see what I can do (though it may take a while). In the meantime, I would stick with disabling specular contribution in the material (where it should be, IMHO!).

fabergambis
09-09-2009, 11:59 AM
Fabergambis,

Well, I finally got a bit of time to try to figure out your Maya 2010 issue. The strange thing is that I just tested it here, and it seemed to work just fine (both with light profiles and with reference lights). I just created a clean scene in Maya 2010, added a point light, added wom_achlight, added a light profile, and it rendered fine.

I am wondering if there might not be some problem with your scene. Can you try to do a very quick clean scene to see if that is maybe the problem. If not, can you give me detailed specs on your machine (just to make sure that it is not a problem specific to the version you are using).

Did you try with area lights? I never use point lights :)
I tried with area lights in three different scenes, one very simple with a big cube as room and a new area light with wom_Archlight, and had the same problem as the other complex scene. Didn't try in a completely new scene and unfortunately I can't do it by now because my PC is actually broken: belive me or not, but a cat decided to piss on it!

Tobbe
09-09-2009, 02:14 PM
Hi wombat778,

Your explanation makes total sense! No wonder Adesk had problem making those checkboxes work.

Tobbe

perfectG
09-11-2009, 12:00 PM
Sorry for interrupting guys, i have used womlight in my car studio scene, it's only wip at the moment, i have a question: is there a way to reduce such a white blink to a normal blink? I have used 3 spot lights-area lights-visible, with womlight. this is the link: http://www.imagebam.com/image/fc466b48496520

Theodocious
09-16-2009, 05:17 AM
Did anyone get the objectlight shader to work in MAX maybe? The lightshader works perfectly but the objectlight shader does not work as it should. Though I think this because of the mrGeoShader-Plugin... since MAX doesn't support mental ray geometry shaders out of the box. Did anyone try it?

I tested around and actually the shader WORKS... meaning mental ray renders without warnings or errors. Just the connection to the object which should emit the light doesn't seem to work. Though I got some "visual response" when switching the visible state for the light on. But It looks like the background gets lit (at least a fraction of it) instead of the geometry???

I also tested it in Maya, where it works just perfectly, but noticed that the intensity of the shape when using visible light shape doesn't fit to the lights intensity. As I looked into the source code I noticed that there isn't a case for calculating the shape intensity when custom objects are used... just the normal (taken from physical light shader) rectangle, circle, sphere, etc. cases.

Is an implementation of such a feature planned? Therefore the surface area of the light-shape (geometry) has to be calculated first, right? Would be nice to know if this is possible and could be accomplished in the next updates???

Greetz Ben

Why would you want this shader for Max when you can render with IES in Vray? In my experience Vray handles IES lights extremely well

Hamburger
09-16-2009, 09:21 AM
(unfortunately) only mental ray comes bundled with Max and Maya. Vray just a 3rd party renderer, so noone gets it by default.

wombat778
10-03-2009, 12:49 AM
Did you try with area lights? I never use point lights :)
I tried with area lights in three different scenes, one very simple with a big cube as room and a new area light with wom_Archlight, and had the same problem as the other complex scene. Didn't try in a completely new scene and unfortunately I can't do it by now because my PC is actually broken: belive me or not, but a cat decided to piss on it!

Hi Fabergambis and anyone else getting the problem in Maya 2010, any chance you could try this dll: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O9T62P74 (currently only 64-bit windows)?

In short, the Softimage 2010 version was getting the same error that I was able to reproduce. I was able to fix it by recompiling wom_archlight using the Softimage 2010 mental ray sdk. I am thinking that this may also solve the Maya 2010 problem. Unfortunately I have no time to test at all, since my wife just had a baby and I have my hands pretty full at the moment. If this does solve the issue, I will recompile for 32-bit, Mac and Linux and then build a new proper release. Feedback is very much appreciated. Thanks!

djx
10-03-2009, 02:44 PM
wombat, congrats on the baby :applause:

...but you did ask for feedback

With 2010 I get the same errors as fabergambis if I turn on profile. (Renders fine with no profile)

I downloaded your 1.21Test. It appears to load ok.

// parsing U:/david/maya/mentalray-x64/include/wom_archlight.mi
// loading U:/david/maya/mentalray-x64/lib/wom_archlight.dll

Testing an existing scene I get

// Warning: (Mayatomr.Custom) : U:/david/maya/mentalray-x64/include/wom_archlight.mi: couldn't find shader library //

and in the output window

API 0.0 error 301031: call to undeclared function "wom_archlight"
API 0.0 error 301032: while defining light "areaLightShape1": undefined shader "wom_archlight1"
API 0.0 warn 302029: while defining light "areaLightShape1": light has no light shader

and nothing renders.

If I create a new scene and render I get no warning message, but the same in the output window, and nothing renders.

(Oh... I'm managing just fine with 2009, and wom_archlight has been lighting my latest project, so BIG thankyou)

-- David

wombat778
10-04-2009, 04:18 PM
Thanks DJX. Looks like I will probably need to spend more time on this issue. I promise I will get it working, but it may take a while. Sorry:(

ytsejam1976
10-04-2009, 05:34 PM
Thank you wombat. Fabergambis is out of order with your pc for the time and i think that he appreciate your work. Thank you

razfaz
10-06-2009, 11:54 AM
Great work wombat!! I have tried it and it works nicely, so many thanks!


Just one question for everyone interested in this problematics...


Is there any database on the net for IES profiles?! I ve just got one from here some time ago but I m desperately looking for more of them.


Any ideas?


Thanks.

hi Libor and all others intersted in.

you can find a huge of ies database + dxf download for 3d model of lamps at

http://www.erco.com

a big thanks for your very good job @ wombat! thank you very much for this.

greetz razfaz

wombat778
10-19-2009, 05:11 PM
If I create a new scene and render I get no warning message, but the same in the output window, and nothing renders.

Hi David,

Is there any chance you could try your test in 2010 again using the following dll: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O826IYYB (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O826IYYB) (the package includes both 32 bit and 64 bit). The first one I gave you had some problems related to VC2005 redistributables which could have been causing the errors you got. This version had been reported to work with Softimage 2010, so it very may well work with Maya 2010 as well.

Also, if anyone else is able to use these successfully in Maya 2010 with light profiles, please let me know.

Thanks!

djx
10-20-2009, 01:24 AM
I've only had time to do a quick test with the 64bit one. I think it's fixed.:thumbsup:
I'll test more fully (including 32 bit) and let you know sometime soon.

Thankyou. I really appreciate your hard work wombat. Your shader has made lighting so much easier and more fun.

UPDATE: 32bit works too. So to be clear, I've tested the wom_archlight 1.22 test dlls using maya 2010 (32 bit) on win xp and 2010-x64 on win 7 and both worked as expected.

-- David

ytsejam1976
10-25-2009, 09:16 PM
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/9343/autumn1night.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/i/autumn1night.jpg/)

Use womArchLight for picnic in to the forest. :)
Ok, i so jokerman. :)

khiro
10-28-2009, 11:52 AM
Hi Fabergambis and anyone else getting the problem in Maya 2010, any chance you could try this dll: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O9T62P74 (currently only 64-bit windows)?

In short, the Softimage 2010 version was getting the same error that I was able to reproduce. I was able to fix it by recompiling wom_archlight using the Softimage 2010 mental ray sdk. I am thinking that this may also solve the Maya 2010 problem. Unfortunately I have no time to test at all, since my wife just had a baby and I have my hands pretty full at the moment. If this does solve the issue, I will recompile for 32-bit, Mac and Linux and then build a new proper release. Feedback is very much appreciated. Thanks!

Hi, I had the same problem as Fabergambis, when I use an IES profile mental ray crashes. I try to download the new dll and replace and when render mantal ray says in the script editor:
"// Warning: (Mayatomr.Custom) : E:/Program Files/Autodesk/Maya2010/mentalray/include/wom_archlight.mi: couldn't find shader library // "

and in the output window:

"API 0.0 error 301031: call to undeclared function "wom_archlight"
API 0.0 error 301032: while defining light "pointLightShape1": undefined shader "wom_archlight1"
API 0.0 warn 302029: while defining light "pointLightShape1": light has no light shader"

I'm using Maya 2010 in Windows XP64.

All the shader works perfectly excetp IES and I'm very grateful about the shader, so please, if I can help you in some way to try to solve these problem count on me.

wombat778
10-28-2009, 02:43 PM
All the shader works perfectly excetp IES and I'm very grateful about the shader, so please, if I can help you in some way to try to solve these problem count on me.

Hi Khiro,

Did you you try the later DLLs I posted? They are here: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O826IYYB (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O826IYYB)

Those worked for others, so hopefully they should solve your problem. Let me know.

coccosoids
10-28-2009, 10:56 PM
Is there a os x version of wom_archlight?

wombat778
10-29-2009, 03:03 AM
Is there a os x version of wom_archlight?

Yes, its included in the package.

coccosoids
10-29-2009, 08:05 AM
Yes, its included in the package.


Works with both Maya and Softimage on Windows 64-bit and 32-bit, Linux 64-bit, and MacOSX (Maya only).
[*

Yes, this is what happens when browse forums at 2AM in the morning... whoop-dee-doo. :blush:

coccosoids
10-29-2009, 11:00 AM
I think there's a bug - at least in os X...

If I plug wom_archlight into two area lights and tweak the Visible Area Falloff parameter of the shader one of the lights will get VERY blurry - in reflections at least, while the other will maintain a relative sharp sillhouette - but at close inspection, will reveal some minor aliasing softening effect. Is this a known bug/limitation - or am I using in an improper manner the shader?

PS: If I connect different shader instances to the lights, both light bodies will maintain their relative sharpness in reflection (with a soft but discernable aliasing blur) at even high values like .98. If I go past 1 noticeable artifacts become apparent.

wombat778
10-29-2009, 12:16 PM
Is this a known bug/limitation - or am I using in an improper manner the shader?

Thanks for the report. As far as I know you are the first person using the visible area falloff settings (they were added as a bit of an experiment in the last version), so it does not really surprise me that there could be issues.

I will take a look and will try to replicate the problem. Unfortunately it may take me a bit of time to get to it, as I have my hands full at the moment with a new baby. It would probably be helpful if you could PM me a copy of the scene that is giving you trouble, or at least a few screenshots of the issue.

Thanks again!

coccosoids
10-29-2009, 02:05 PM
... as I have my hands full at the moment with a new baby.
Thanks again!

Haha, that's lovely. :)

I'm preparing the scene right now, therefore in a little while I shall PM it, although now you make me feel a little guilty - interposing work between you and 'baby'.

Thanks,

coccosoids
10-31-2009, 01:18 AM
I've sent you a link to a simplified scene...
If you render it 'as is' no reflection is visible for the left hand area light... but if one was to lower the Visible Area Falloff coefficient the reflection wondrously appears.
Sorry it took so long.

ytsejam1976
10-31-2009, 01:46 PM
Hello wombat.
I'm update you with some results.

Thank you

[img=http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/1598/old3copy.jpg] (http://img413.imageshack.us/i/old3copy.jpg/)

coccosoids
10-31-2009, 03:20 PM
Hello wombat.
I'm update you with some results.

Thank you

[img=http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/1598/old3copy.jpg] (http://img413.imageshack.us/i/old3copy.jpg/)



One aspect of your image that I find inconsistent with the overall illumination of the scene is the hot spots left by the lightsources on the walls. They seem a little burnt out, and to me this fuels the perception of cg rather than real life photography.

ytsejam1976
10-31-2009, 04:40 PM
@q_vazk
Thanks for the comment.

The burn is over? Ok

Ciao

khiro
11-04-2009, 09:38 AM
Hi Khiro,

Did you you try the later DLLs I posted? They are here: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O826IYYB (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O826IYYB)

Those worked for others, so hopefully they should solve your problem. Let me know.


Seems that works perfect with that dll. Thank you very much

orre
11-18-2009, 04:36 PM
Hi!

I have a problem with the visibility option. When I turn on visible to get nice reflections and highlights from my lights I start to get really bad artifacts in my reflections. And the shading looks much more flat. I have to set my AA to at least 1 3 to get acceptable results. Is this a bug or am I doing something wrong?

wombat778
11-18-2009, 04:40 PM
Hi!

I have a problem with the visibility option. When I turn on visible to get nice reflections and highlights from my lights I start to get really bad artifacts in my reflections. And the shading looks much more flat. I have to set my AA to at least 1 3 to get acceptable results. Is this a bug or am I doing something wrong?

Orre,

Can you post or PM me an image of the artifacts you are getting? This is not a problem I have seen or heard of before. Thanks.

VanDerGoes
11-18-2009, 05:10 PM
Hi!

I have a problem with the visibility option. When I turn on visible to get nice reflections and highlights from my lights I start to get really bad artifacts in my reflections. And the shading looks much more flat. I have to set my AA to at least 1 3 to get acceptable results. Is this a bug or am I doing something wrong?

I had this problem too but I don't think it's related to this shader. It is more probably a mental ray problem because it also happens in 3dsmax, typically when you have some visible light or geometry with very strong intensity, much much brighter than the rest of the environment. My workaround is to use a stand in geometry instead of turning on the light's visibility and attaching to it (well, to its material) a mia_light_surface with refl_contrib and fg_contrib tuned down in order to control its intensity in the reflections and final gather.
If anyone has a better solution please share.
Hope that helps.

orre
11-18-2009, 06:53 PM
You might be right, VanDerGoes. And thank you for sharing your solution! I tried to use subtitute geometry and a super white surface shader. But this made the whole image brighter. Using th mia_light_surface is much better.

ytsejam1976
11-20-2009, 12:02 PM
ArchLight&Magic :)

My principal is happy.
Unfortunately i'm not autorized to post the entire project, but some tile of final image. 130 light on night

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/7084/marenight.th.jpg (http://img149.imageshack.us/i/marenight.jpg/)

ytsejam1976
12-03-2009, 02:24 PM
i'm ever on tests;
Maya and 3dsMax, same intensity, but strange gamma on wood. I' don't know.

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/8738/2nightdefcopy.jpg

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/6238/kitchen1maxcopy.jpg

coccosoids
12-03-2009, 02:35 PM
I see alot of discrepancies between the two - are you sure you used the same maps and IES profiles, assuming you've used IES profiles at all.

For example the shadows in maya (left leg of the table, cabinet on the ceiling), the reflections on the wood in Max, the crinkled light on the cupboard in Max etc...

ytsejam1976
12-03-2009, 02:44 PM
yes. I know the discrepancies between the two. Some materials not shure equal, but the wood is the same. Obviously the results is not the same result on the two. In maya, the photons intensity is quadratic, in max, the intensity is the same in all direction or somthing like this(zap correct me if i'm not good). This is notice question i have made to wombat and this answer me some post later. The primary problem is the quality result the is a problem of the OEM integration in max and maya. The light max have importance sampling, in maya not.

ytsejam1976
01-02-2010, 12:06 PM
Hi wombat and happy new year.
I have a little wish.
In max the light have a shadow falloff control. This shadow falloff it's not like the start and stop because the effects is as shadow attenuation soft. This give me not Physical Look, but nice effects like soft.
it's possible to implement it on your womArchLight?

Thank you and ciao

SreckoM
01-10-2010, 12:31 AM
Thank you for this wombat, really gr8 work you did!

SreckoM
01-11-2010, 01:35 AM
Can someone provide some tips for speeding up render? I am experiencing some slowdowns using those lights.
I do not 100% understand fallof and shadow threshold, what values are good for optimizing render?

Tnx.

JayHoo
01-26-2010, 08:46 AM
Hi,

i have a problem to setup wombat archlight and physical sky together.

My setup without physical sky:

a bedroom scene, an area light 250 cm above the room. 65 candela. Scene unit is cm. Physical correct RGB uni conversion. Photographic exposure set to 1.

These settings works well for me. But as soon as I usue the Physical sky it does not work. I had to lower the RGB unit conversion in the sky settings back to .0001 to get a similar lighting. Really strange.

ytsejam1976
01-26-2010, 08:59 AM
Your light have a IES profile? If yes is semi normal. This is because the ies profile create a concentrated brightness in a specifical area. With the same candela but with another profile like a tipical spot light, in some case, you see much the light. 60 candela are low value for a light. try to use watts. i think you see the light. Anyway, the exposure value for interior scene setting is much important, the burn highlight is important to use.
Hope help you.

P.S. don't worry to set up your multiplier of womLight over the 1, this is used in max mental ray user, vray and much other engines.

JayHoo
01-26-2010, 09:42 AM
I am not using an ies profile. Just the standard settings. Only put 65 candela as intensity.

I used 60 Watts with 14.5 % lm/2. Got these values from wikipedia.

ytsejam1976
01-26-2010, 09:51 AM
possible to see an image for comparison. For to see the effects you have?

JayHoo
01-26-2010, 10:24 AM
Maybe I can upload one later. With a screen of the settings.

pupazzooo
01-29-2010, 01:10 AM
Hi, I'm a new member and i want use wom_archlight in maya 2010 on my mac but the light profile don't work. I find in this post the new dll for windows but not for mac... Is possible to download it ? Thanks for reply and sorry for my english. I'm an italian boy :D

mckenns
01-30-2010, 04:23 AM
Hi, I'm a new member and i want use wom_archlight in maya 2010 on my mac but the light profile don't work. I find in this post the new dll for windows but not for mac... Is possible to download it ? Thanks for reply and sorry for my english. I'm an italian boy :D

having same problem too, no wom_archlight.so (osx) on 1.22 package..
random crash with or without light profile.. :cry:
osx 10.6.2 maya 2010

wombat778
01-31-2010, 04:58 AM
Sorry guys, I haven't yet built a version of the 1.22 Dlls for MacOS yet. I will try to over the next few days and post it here.

Rafel
02-07-2010, 08:27 PM
Hello wombat778 (http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=199156) thanks a lot for this great shader!

i just started testing the shader everything was working fine till i checked final gather on, i got very poor FG result even with high FG values, images below:

is this known problem in the shader or i did something wrong?

http://www.rafel-akushali.com/wom_archlight_1.2_Test/noFG.jpg

http://www.rafel-akushali.com/wom_archlight_1.2_Test/FG100.jpg

http://www.rafel-akushali.com/wom_archlight_1.2_Test/FG1000.jpg

wombat778
02-09-2010, 06:14 PM
Hello wombat778 (http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=199156) thanks a lot for this great shader!

i just started testing the shader everything was working fine till i checked final gather on, i got very poor FG result even with high FG values, images below:

is this known problem in the shader or i did something wrong?


There is no known problem per se, though sometimes my shader will require higher settings than other shaders (because my shader actually respects the light intensity produced by the ies profile). That said, that is usually only an issue with photon generation, which requires many more photons than normal, rather than FG. Could you try just changing the light to a regular maya photometric light and rerendering with all other settings being the same? That should help narrow down whether it is a shader issue or a problem with other settings.

Thanks.

Rafel
02-10-2010, 03:46 AM
Could you try just changing the light to a regular maya photometric light and rerendering with all other settings being the same? That should help narrow down whether it is a shader issue or a problem with other settings.

Thanks.

Thanks for your reply wombat, that happened first when i tried the shader, later i start testing with Maya's mib_light_photometric and it was working okay with FG and GI

today i tried again with wom_archlight_1.2 and everything was running fine wih FG, I'm not sure why that happened at the first place! now I'm using the shader for a while and its working great!

Thanks a lot

wombat778
02-13-2010, 02:12 AM
Folks,

I have finally managed to build a new complete package of wom_archlight which is compatible with Softimage/Maya 2010. The links to the new version (1.23) are in the first post. Please note that there are no changes at all from version 1.22. The only purpose of 1.23 is to repackage those dlls into a full package and to add SI/Maya 2010 support for the Linux/Mac versions.

As always, please let me know if you run into any trouble.

Jozvex
03-01-2010, 05:40 AM
Hey there Wombat,

I'm using a whole lot of area lights with the latest Wom shader, along with an IES profile and I seem to have found an oddity. :)

The area lights are the actual Maya 'area light', but with the mental ray light shape also turned on for the other controls. The issue seems to be that if I use the same Wom shader across all the lights, the light profile seems to average out across the whole lot of them? But if I apply a separate Wom shader to each light I get the correct result. A bit like you get one giant light profile shape instead of individual ones.

I've attached an image though it's not terribly clear what's happening. My scene at work shows it much more obviously.

valler
03-01-2010, 02:34 PM
I ran into the same issue some time ago. I needed a separate archlight for each arealight in the scene in order to get correct results.

best regards, valler

wombat778
03-01-2010, 07:24 PM
Interesting find guys. I admit I did not do much testing with using the same light shader on multiple objects, as I did most development/testing on SI (where this issue is unlikely to come up).

Anyhow, I am not at a PC where I can test, so I am hoping you can quickly try something to help track this down:

1) Can you try turning off "Preserve Profile Shape with Area Lights" on the Advanced tab? It will make the light profiles fuzzy, but I am curious whether it otherwise solves your problem. If it does, I have a pretty good idea what I need to change to make a proper solution.

2) If that does not work, can you try testing with the MI photometric shader to see if it has the same problem?

Thanks.

Jozvex
03-01-2010, 11:51 PM
Hi!

So I did your first test and it does seem to fix the problem, in fact even better than using multiple wom shaders, it removed a dark spot from the light profiles. I assume what I'm getting is the right result now!

wombat778
03-02-2010, 12:28 AM
Hi!

So I did your first test and it does seem to fix the problem, in fact even better than using multiple wom shaders, it removed a dark spot from the light profiles. I assume what I'm getting is the right result now!

Thanks. With your tests I know exactly what is going on now. The missing dark spot is probably caused by the "fuzziness" of the light profile that I described. Basically, instead of a nice sharp light profile, the profile is being somewhat smeared across the area light. Anyhow, I will put a fix into the next version that should take care of the problem.

Jozvex
03-06-2010, 08:21 AM
Watch out I'm back for more! :wavey:

I'm using this shader a lot now so I'm mostly up to speed with it... but I have a couple of questions!

Is there a way to create a planar area light that only emits light out of one side? By default it seems to come from both sides which isn't always easy to deal with. I think one way would be to create a custom IES profile, but I just thought I'd see what other people are doing.

Next question is, how does the photon intensity relate to the direct illumination intensity? I've created a test scene where I set up the same scenario in both Maya and Maxwell to see how the light levels compared (because I felt like the Wom intensity was really dark, but no, it's fine). The direct illumination matched Maxwell but I had to crank the photon intensity on the Maya lightShape up to 50 million (leaving the Wom multiplier on 1) to get similar levels of bounce light. I can imagine with there being so many options on the shader it might be impossible to get the photon intensity to always match up, but if it turned out 50 million was a magic number I'd be very happy. ;)

http://www.jozvex.com/images/womTestSceneCompare.jpg

Wom shader on the left, Maxwell on the right. They both have a light set to 100 watts and an efficacy of 70. Same camera settings etc but yeah, had to set photon intensity to 50 million.

Last question comes directly from that image, the reflections are a little strange! The light doesn't appear in the reflections despite being visible and there's like a spotlight cone reflected in the chrome sphere?

I swear I'm not complaining I just want to be the Ultimate Wom Master!

Redsand1080
03-06-2010, 05:58 PM
Hmmm...I thought the womArchLight was supposed to handle photon emission as well. Meaning if you plugged in an IES profile the profile would calculate the correct photon emissions based on the measurements from the real world light. But I guess in your test you did not plug in an IES profile...you were just using it like a regular maya light?

Or am I just totally off in left field here? :)

wombat778
03-07-2010, 04:48 AM
Jozvex: Did you connect wom_archlight as the photon shader as well as the light shader? When connected as the photon shader, the relationship between direct and indirect light should be automatically taken care of (ie, it should be correct when both the intensity multiplier and photon multiplier are 1). The photon intensity in Maya should actually get ignored.

Let me know if that solves the problem!

Also, to get the light to come out of only one side, there are actually two different approaches that can work. The easiest is to try turning on Cosine Distribution on the Advanced Tab. Note that using this has a few caveats: 1) obviously it will only work with plane or disc area lights, and 2) The total amount of light emitted from an IES profile won't be fully correct anymore, as it will fade out at the sides.

Another potential idea is to try setting up an area spotlight, then set a 180 degree outer cone angle.

Jozvex
03-07-2010, 05:30 AM
Oh my goodness... you're a wombat and I'm a dingbat!

I completely forgot about lights having that photon shader slot!! Thanks!

:blush:

rasamaya
03-24-2010, 11:09 AM
I love you wombat778. Thank you so much.

rasamaya
03-25-2010, 01:11 PM
Would anyone have any suggestions for creating a vehicles headlight. I cannot seem to find any ies files out there for cars either. any help would be cool.
A wom preset collection of assorted light types would be cool too... maybe an ies preview window. That would be awesome too. Not complaining. So happy we have this. Made me want a light meter in Maya.

ytsejam1976
03-31-2010, 11:33 AM
I've notice that on the mia_photometricLight in mentalray 3.8 release, the workflow is the same of your light, wombat. Great stuff.
Anyway, much control settings in your light :)

slipknot66
04-13-2010, 05:51 PM
It would be nice to have this shader compiled for Maya 2011.
I think this shader works better than the native Maya 2011 one.
Also, with the wombat shader, you have the ability to emmit lights from objects, something that is still not present in mental ray for maya integration.

ytsejam1976
04-13-2010, 07:53 PM
Shadow threshold is the big one i'm use womlight. On mia_photometric is withou it and not productive.

Wombat we are in your hands

CrjRomano
04-14-2010, 03:33 PM
Downloaded :D
Thenk you so much vombat. :bowdown:
in one of these days I will do some tests.

wombat778
04-21-2010, 10:35 AM
Thanks guys. I do plan to update it for Maya 2011 (and SI 2011), hopefully in the next few weeks.

mckenns
04-21-2010, 10:38 AM
Thanks guys. I do plan to update it for Maya 2011 (and SI 2011), hopefully in the next few weeks.

Cant wait! :bowdown:

coccosoids
04-26-2010, 01:01 PM
Hey there wombat,

I just fired up a quick render in maya 2011 with the latest shaders. I venture a guess you haven't compiled them for 2011, but they kinda worked. Should I expect the same physical behavior as if the shader would have been compiled exclusively for 2011, x64?

Miko3D
05-07-2010, 01:10 PM
Hey Guys


Had a quick play with the new mia_photometric light shader in 2011 and im a bit puzzled...

with an IES profile and wom light shader,light seems to behave correct,so if i convert that light to an area light the global intensity of it doesnt change,it only really affects the quality of shadows , but the scene keeps pretty much the same amount of lighting even if i go a bit crazy with the area size scale.So because the IES profile drives the distribution and intensity this behaveour is to be expected .

But its not the same case with the mia_photometric,its actually very sensitive to light scale (note that im talking about light transform node scale no scene scale)to the point it acts as a intensity multiplier... so as an example if i set up my light as a spot, connect the mia_shader, add the profile and set it so it drives the distribution and intesity (mode 2 for both) also I set the units to meter to 100 (im working in cm)if the light scale is 1 for all axis I got the same light as if i was using a wom archlight with the same IES profile,great!,

but from the moment I change the scale of the spot light it affectsdramatically the whole intensity of the light, and this is unfortunate if you want to use it as an area light...

wombat778
05-07-2010, 05:19 PM
Hi Miko,

That does not surprise me. When I was developing wom_archlight, I spent a lot of time trying to make it work so that changing from a point light to an area light would yield physically correct intensity (depending on the units selected). I have not tried mia_photometric, but it sounds to me like they didn't make the same effort...

Miko3D
05-11-2010, 08:50 PM
Hey Wombat,

it would be great if you could add a cm2 value slot inside the RGB Unit Conversion so we can link it to the exposure photograpic shader like with the mia_photometric in 2011.

it will add a lot flexibility while working with plates and self illuminated shaders.

just my 2 cents.

craig12345
05-17-2010, 01:23 PM
Hi Wombat.

Gotto say thanks first of all. I have installed on maya 2010 and it works wonderfully.

I then installed it on maya 2011. So it actually does work it seems even without a conversion from your side, but i get block artifacts (black block as if it didnt finish the render. those blocks are random every time.

Can you think of what will resolve it, or is it just the conversion to 2011 that will resolve it.

Again, you have created quite a stir amoung people like me. THANKS

Kind regards
Craig

wombat778
05-18-2010, 02:35 PM
Guys, my apologies for the delay in getting this updated to Maya 2011 (Craig, I think/hope that the conversion will fix your problem). Unfortunately I had a hard drive crash and have been rebuilding my system, which is why it is taking so long. Hopefully I will be back up and running in the next few days or a week and will be able to get wom_archlight updated shortly thereafter.

Wolfganng
05-18-2010, 03:53 PM
Guys, my apologies for the delay in getting this updated to Maya 2011 (Craig, I think/hope that the conversion will fix your problem). Unfortunately I had a hard drive crash and have been rebuilding my system, which is why it is taking so long. Hopefully I will be back up and running in the next few days or a week and will be able to get wom_archlight updated shortly thereafter.


ahhhh bummer on the drive crash! Anxiously awaiting the maya 2011 version, and thanks a lot for your efforts!

craig12345
05-19-2010, 08:52 AM
Hey Wombat. No stress on this side. get yourself sorted before worrying about the update. Definately excited though. haha. Thanks again.

Jozvex
06-18-2010, 03:08 AM
Hello hello!

Any chance of being able to map textures to the geometry lights? I tried sticking a ramp or file texture into the Color slot of the Wom light, or onto the geometry but no luck. I assume the functionality isn't there.... yet? :drool:

simha.sai
06-20-2010, 11:53 PM
maya 2011 update pls

ytsejam1976
06-21-2010, 07:56 AM
I'm use the shader on maya 2011 and it work well, no crash no problems on my scene. What the problem on maya 2011 with womArchLight?

Wombat, for other release, is possible a falloff like 3dsmax? Not start and stop simple, but falloff. You know?

Thanks

simha.sai
06-21-2010, 10:41 AM
I'm use the shader on maya 2011 and it work well, no crash no problems on my scene. What the problem on maya 2011 with womArchLight?

Wombat, for other release, is possible a falloff like 3dsmax? Not start and stop simple, but falloff. You know?

Thanks

hmm.. i do not know it works with 2011 also :) let me try it..
Thank your very much for the info
ytsejam1976 Pls make a turorial on using wormarchlight shaders..
Iam follower of your blog ;) it would be nice if the tutorials have some sound (not songs) may be explaining the back what u r doing.. I tried to make what u did with mr sun and sky ( clouds) but failed) :)

craig12345
06-21-2010, 02:10 PM
Hey ytsejam1976,

"I have installed on maya 2010 and it works wonderfully.

I then installed it on maya 2011. So it actually does work it seems even without a conversion from your side, but i get block artifacts (black block as if it didnt finish the render. those blocks are random every time."

It gives artifacts when i render . i am using a dual quad Xeon on windows 7 . 64 bit with 32 gigs mem, and Gtx 260.

Any ideas why it would work n yours and not mine?
Thanks

arjunokecil
06-23-2010, 09:30 AM
Hi wombat,

First of all I must say I've been waiting so long for a cheometrylightshader. Finally it's here! Thank you so much. You must been working long and hard on this package. Hopefully autodesk will intergrate it in there next release, so you get some benefits from your hard work.

I tried to install them on maya 2011 without luck. It will be great if this package can be compiled for 2011 because of all the benefit's maya 2011 has. For example: colormanagement and the nice layout

JurriŽn

fdull
08-26-2010, 12:05 PM
Hello Wombat,

Any chance on an update of your shaders for Maya2011? That would be nice for the reasons JurriŽn stated.

Thanks a lot,

Filip

jasonhuang1115
09-14-2010, 06:51 AM
Hi, wombat,

Is this shader still being developed actively? I really hope we have an object light shader that can let us plug a HDR texture to make the geometric plane as an area light.

cheers,
Jason

ytsejam1976
09-30-2010, 09:28 AM
Hi wombat.
More time yes?
I have a necessity. A distance fallof for the womarchlight. It's important really important for work, for controll some intensity over, on some IES files, and offcourse for the unnecessary rays calculation.
Not good the start and stop, i wish a falloff. It's only a "wish" but really important. I continue to use your light shader for more controll, not use mia_photometric light.

Thanks in advance for your work.


Dario

chuckie7413
11-12-2010, 06:27 PM
Hi,

I am experimenting with the wom object light shader for a project. I need to be able to use it interactively with IPR but it seems to just render black. When I try a normal render everything works fine, it is just when I press IPR.

Is this a limitation with the shader or am I missing something?

Is anyone able to use the object light shader in IPR?

I am using latest wombat shader on maya 2009sp1a - mental ray 3.7.21

Many thanks,

Rich

LeeGriggs
02-26-2011, 04:41 PM
Hello, I tried Wom_light_object and cant seem to get it to work.

I dont know if it is something I am doing wrong or whether it just isn't working in 2011.

http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/8282/womlight.jpg

Can I ask what the difference is between this shader and incandescence with final gather?
I know it uses photon's but am curious if anyone has any comparison images that show its benefits?

Cheers,
Lee

m0z
02-27-2011, 09:39 PM
it doesn't work in 2011 for me also. an update would be MUCH appreciated.
maya just crashes at rendering, if the shader is used as light AND photon shader.

djx
02-27-2011, 11:00 PM
Can I ask what the difference is between this shader and incandescence with final gather?One is direct lighting with control over sampling and the ability to use light and photon shaders, the other is basic indirect light.

David

SuperHero
03-11-2011, 07:27 AM
I hope it gets updated soon!

ytsejam1976
03-11-2011, 08:53 AM
Hi wom. Some upgrade news?
Take a look at this. I reproduce a render of this
http://www.treddi.com/forum/topic/79986-nero-amore/

with your womlight

It the only way to try to render good result. Threshold help a lot.

(http://img571.imageshack.us/i/80881414.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

RagingBull
04-11-2011, 08:04 PM
Whilst we are hoping for a 2011/2012 release of this shader, will the mia_photometric_light do in the meantime ?

LinchpinZA
04-11-2011, 08:30 PM
Wow those are some amazing renders ytsejam1976. Excellent job, I love the leather shader aswell as the texture detail on the leather.

ytsejam1976
04-16-2011, 10:53 AM
@LinchpinZA
Thanks you. A couple of mixing node procedural. :)

The real help in this scene is womarchlight and start and stop, that block shadow rays. Shadow rays in Mia_photometric or any other light are something like infinite. Long render time, but with womArchiLight, it's fast.

ytsejam1976
04-21-2011, 11:34 AM
Hello. Let me explain whats happen.
If i have more light, i have good effects, but if i have one or two light, in verbosity, i see something like, no more rays then before set up accuracy get out from womlight. Something similar someone? If i get up accuracy from fg setting, no change on my scene. It's a bug?


@wombat778
Maybe you are Busy, but really, your shader is important. And if it's a bug, is important to fix it.



Dario

zartan
09-14-2011, 08:39 PM
Hi all ! follow link Wom_Archlight for OSX. Thx to my friend work JOE.

Link:
www.img.tv/Diego/Wom_Archlight_OSX.zip (http://www.img.tv/Diego/Wom_Archlight_OSX.zip)

Carabine
12-07-2011, 02:50 PM
Hi Wom,
First i need to thank you for this Supershader i use it every day. Right now i started to light scenes with light object connected to plane instead of using normal maya arealights because i need to map intensity of visibility of reflected light to get nice reflections like HdrStudios softboxes makes. Everything looks nice but maybe not realistic, but i dont care, if is it nice then its ok. Only what i dont now is how to let light come only from one side of plane, like when you check cosine distribution whit normal area lights.
Thanks
Carabine

Carabine
12-07-2011, 02:53 PM
Hi Wom,
First i need to thank you for this Supershader i use it every day. Right now i started to light scenes with light object connected to plane instead of using normal maya arealights because i need to map intensity of visibility of reflected light to get nice reflections like HdrStudios softboxes makes. Everything looks nice but maybe not realistic, but i dont care, if is it nice then its ok. Only what i dont now is how to let light come only from one side of plane, like when you check cosine distribution whit normal area lights.
Thanks
Carabine

mercuito
12-09-2011, 09:53 PM
Is the arch light something you guys would like to see included in mentalcore? Then I can guarantee support for all versions of Maya that MentalCore supports and will support as well as all platforms. MentalCore already has the ability to make geometry lights, but is the arch light shader specifically something that would be worthwhile supporting?

ytsejam1976
12-10-2011, 05:47 AM
Yes Corey.
On womArchLight important are cosine distribution, emission as watt candela and others, and would be great if we have a falloff distance, not as typical mental ray light with start and stop, but a falloff a la 3dsmax, you know what i mean?
Another one on womarchlight is "same intensity of photometric profile" if the area light change the scale size.

thanks, Dario.

SuperHero
12-10-2011, 06:17 PM
It would be great to have all that in one place.
geo lights in mental core already do a great job but they have two weak points imo. one is they take a lot of time to render and the other one is lack of ability to assign an alpha texture to control their intensity such as simulating a softbox light. other than that they are great from the the renders i got from them.

fdull
01-04-2012, 10:16 PM
I'd love to see womlights in mental-core.:thumbsup:

chuckie7413
01-06-2012, 11:58 PM
I would very much like to see womlight inside of mental core.

We use the womlight in all our shots.

Many thanks,

Richard

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