Autodesk Flare

[cresshead]

i wonder how much it is?
...more than combustion or toxic i'd guess.

[andjar]

i wonder how much it is?

"Under 40.000$!" according to this interview :
http://media.fxguide.com/fxguidetv/fxguidetv-ep054.m4v

[Stimpy]

i wonder how much it is?

owners of a flame or inferno are probably beyond such petty questions.

[StefanA]

You can only buy flare if you have a active flame license (under subscription). Flint, Smoke, Fire doesn't qualify.

[boomji]

owners of a flame or inferno are probably beyond such petty questions.


err...nope.
Not in the current economic climate.
Hosing themselves...again :surprised


b

[Stimpy]

err...nope.
Not in the current economic climate.
Hosing themselves...again :surprised


b

yeah i wasnt being sarcastic.

[andjar]

I think this "Flame/Inferno license exclusivity "is just a first step towards a hardware independent and reasonablly priced Flame...wich sooner or later had to come.It's obvious why Autodesk just can't screw their FFI customers so soon by selling an under 40K Flame software to anybody right now.
They finally realised that times have changed...hardware has dramatically evolved and the desktop compositors also.Nuke 6 and Fusion 6 are going to be killer realises.

[Imhotep397]

I don't know...ever since Shake was released and even before then I felt like the whole FFI thing was a little bit of a scam...because the were all essentially the same software running on different hardware configurations. I used to buy into the whole rationale of the pricing being set so high to keep the broadcast prices for services at a certain level, but anymore I'm a total believer that person driving the software and the company consistently hiring people with a high level experience/creativity/problem solving skills is what should demand the higher prices and not the software/hardware.

This kind of stuff from AutoDesk...releasing a "New" product that looks like flint or effect just for the sake of grabbing some headlines makes the company look like they're peddling stuff and trying to get something over on somebody. Wouldn't have made more sense to just release the next version as flint instead of changing the name, but using the same product? It just seems a little too much like dishonest to me.

[TAVO]

Keep in mind that FFI systems are 2k realtime interaction, don´t know if any other app can do it too. The thing is that with these systems you can work in real time with your client right next to you, which IMO can´t be so confortable but some people really enjoy doing it that way. The prices are way to high, but that´s because Autodesk sells the Hardware too, with their own kernel or a modify one, not sure wich one; so they can charge whatever they want, but yes those systems are way way expensive. Not sure if this Flare thing is that useful.

[dmeyer]

I thought this was what Combustion was supposed to be, the FFI supplement. :shrug:

[thatoneguy]

For roto. But then a bug broke the exchange format from what I hear like 4 years ago and never got fixed.

[Imhotep397]

Keep in mind that FFI systems are 2k realtime interaction...

I'm pretty sure with sufficient memory and fast drive arrays most high end compositors (Shake, Nuke, Fusion) can deal with 2K and even 4k sequences in realtime or near realtime, that's not including any additional hardware acceleration and it's been like that for a couple of years at this point. That's why FFI has been losing customers left and right. Even for some effects if you have to render for the highest quality the preview in these new compositing apps is no longer like the old school low res proxy stuff...it's pretty crisp, even blown up.

The thing that always seemed odd to me is that people have brought that client realtime review thing up, but most times a client is not going to sit there while you set up a four "Corner Pin" track since it's dull as dishwater to watch. Usually it seems like review and approve is more about color grading/timing of the speed of title generating/ 2D particles/ screen painting stuff...all areas where FFI is pretty weak in generating materials to begin with so you would be on different systems a lot of times to show those.

[Stimpy]

for a long time (still?) FFI were merely a status symbol, something people from an ad agency would recognize (oooh they got an inferno) and thus put more trust into your production.

friend of mine worked at an agency once, where basically her only job as an inferno operator was to show the client the finished stuff on the huge machine, while in the back room some interns with after effects were doing the actual effects.

[Als]

This seems like sort of an answer to MISTIKA, which kicks shi... out of flame... in terms of performance and what can do with RED.

http://www.mistika.tv/


Als

[SYmek]

Keep in mind that FFI systems are 2k realtime interaction, don´t know if any other app can do it too. The thing is that with these systems you can work in real time with your client right next to you, which IMO can´t be so comfortable but some people really enjoy doing it that way. The prices are way to high, but that´s because Autodesk sells the Hardware too, with their own kernel or a modify one, not sure wich one; so they can charge whatever they want, but yes those systems are way way expensive. Not sure if this Flare thing is that useful.

I don't think FFI systems work in realtime in 2K (maybe some of a features recently). They cache batches into disk to play them back. Secret is a fast storage not a software itself which is fine piece of tool but pretty comparable with other products.

Scratch for example works in realtime on 2K footage, on two streems if your hard disks allow it. The whole application takes ~3MB on disk and doesn't need anything else beyond standard graphic workstation (sic!). Surly toolset is limited (compared to flame), it's a grading system, but it shows the truth about architecture excpectations for such systems.

I think solid realtime 2K/4K support today belongs to Quantel only - which is hardware accelereted - afaik. Flame is a software piece of software for a long time now and I'm pretty sure it would work on any pc with fibrechannel disks just like that once AD wants it.

[Als]

Solid real time 2K and 4K belongs only to Mistika.

True native RED R3D real time workflow no import/export, instantly conform any standard EDL directly with RED or DPX footage. Real time 4K playback with Colour grading, primaries, vectors etc. without any intermediate rendering.

Sorry, but had to react to the above claim.





Als

[ggg]

Solid real time 2K and 4K belongs only to Mistika.

Als

2 x 4K S3D is possible, afaik, only on a quantel.

[Als]

Mistika can play and colour grade a single 4k stream or 2 x 2k stream without rendering.
I don't think anything else can play and grade without rendering.
Note that RED 4k and standard post production 4k are different.
Mistika's claims about 4k playback relate to uncompressed dpx files.
It cannot translate red 4k to proper 4k and play in real time. Nothing can.
Nor should they ever, since red has an effective resolution closer to 2k in normal terms so that's sufficient.
Mistika can play directly and grade RED files for output up to 2k without any import or rendering. Quantel nor autodesk can do that.
Afaik


Als

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