Adobe takes a stance against piracy

[erilaz]

Ick... MORE time wasting bollocks. Does it really matter how much protection something is given via internet activation, encryption donglisation, passwording and serial codes?

If people want to hack it they can. More to the point, they probably have already.

If people just bought stuff the way they were supposed to in the first place this wouldn't be a problem. Then again, if companies didn't have such high prices...

The arguement could go on forever.:shrug:

[Goon]

Considering how widely pirated their products are, especially photoshop, they have to make an effort. Even if they do not succeed, if they give up it would be even more harmfull than it already is (not in terms of success, but rather the message they would be sending).

[gruvsyco]

It seems that most of these schemes the software companies come up with just become more and more troublesome fro the legit users. The hackers/crackers/warezers ALWAYS find ways around it. Meanwhile, as someone who has legal licenses/copies of all their software, I feel like I'm the one being punished in the end.

[halo]

it will be cracked and distributed before it even hits the shelf, probably by using the enterpise edition

so what happens if you dont have web access??

[Hookflash]

I HATE online activation systems with a firy passion:mad:! I bought WinXP Pro with my new system and my mobo died (no fault of XP, of coarse). After I got the system repaired, XP started whining about my license not being valid. I wasn't even able to reinstall it with the activation code that came with my OEM package. I ended up having to phone MS support (with the usual ridiculous waiting, long explanations, etc.) to get a new code. It was a hassle, period.

[moovieboy]

Hmmm... Sigh... Double sigh...

All I wanna know is, will this force folks to have to purchase two copies if they want to have Photoshop on their main workstation and on their laptop?

I'm sure that's already technically "out of bounds," but I wish companies would be a little more flexible in that regard. For many, it's one "fluid" workstation even though the software sits on two machines.

Maybe if they could keep people from running the same license on two machines at once, but allowed it to switch between computers? I dunno :shrug:

-Tom

[erilaz]

Originally posted by moovieboy
Hmmm... Sigh... Double sigh...

All I wanna know is, will this force folks to have to purchase two copies if they want to have Photoshop on their main workstation and on their laptop?

I'm sure that's already technically "out of bounds,"
...*SNIP*
-Tom

According to the current Photoshop license (does anyone read that small print?), having a second copy on another machine is legit, you just can't use them both at the same time, ie. One at work and one at home or on a laptop. Whether or not this new activation method will hinder that....:shrug:

[moovieboy]

Well, fingers crossed it remains that way...:hmm:

Thanks for the info, erilaz!

-Tom

[Verlon]

Online activation is so annoying. Its really bad when you have to reinstall at night or on a holiday or some other time when support is not answering the phone.

Sheesh.

And it won't even slow down the hackers. They are quite clever, and even groups like Microsoft, Discreet, and IBM have been unable to stop them.

I agree that it feels more like the legit users are being punished than the hackers.

I own 2 legit copies of WinXP, and still prefer a hack so I don't have to reactivatie it every couple of hardware upgrades...

[klingspor]

:rolleyes:

All that this is gonna do is perhaps stop the casual "pirate" who gets Photoshop from Kazaa to fix up the digital photos from his last picnic - people that wouldn't even think of buying a software like this in the first place. They probably don't even mean any harm, it's just that they only know of Photoshop and haven't heared of competing products. Hey, I know my way around, and even I could only name 1 or 2 if requested to do so...

Still, anyone else will be able to get the cracked version faster than they could buy it legally.

Looks like Adobe has their priorities seriously messed up... how about some useful new features for a change? And I'm not talking about a liquify-tool here...
It almost seems to me that these anti-piracy features are added when a software has reached it's prime, when there's little left to improve or innovate. Likewise, Windows 2000 is widely regarded as the best version of Windows to date - so to XP they add anti-piracy features above anything really useful. I hope this isn't the path that Adobe is going with Photoshop...

[Gentle Fury]

Larger businesses that sign enterprise contracts won't have to deal with the new process. That's because online activation can be an added burden in already complex IT environments, and because most companies don't intentionally misappropriate software anyway, says McManus. "Those companies want to be legal, but sometimes they've lost control of the situation or it's too hard to manage," he says.

HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wow......ummm, as to my experience the "larger companys" are the BIGGEST culprits of piracy!!!!

Ever been to a news station with 300 workstations in it.....you really think they paid for EVERY license in the house?? sorry.

Most studios i know from the inside do not pay for ALL of their software.......just the stuff that matters, and could really kick them in the ass.

You think a smaller company with 5-12 people in it are gonna pay for 5-12 copys of premiere when there would only be one person using it at a time?????

The only people i think that are buying all legit software are the freelancers who are most at risk of getting in deep trouble for not playing by the rules.........so, once again the little guy pays for the stupidity of others.

I'm sorry though, online registration and remote monitoring is a violation of civil rights anyway. This is not a case of a dongle like most high end software (which i think is also a big pain in the ass) it is a matter of you going out and spending thousands of dollars on software and THEN having to go an ask permission from the makers to USE IT!!!! So, that means all you paid for was a pretty box and a shiny new cd of useless data. If your system crashes........or you have 2 comps......or you regularly clean out windows (i wipe the system every 4 months) you are going to have to ask someones permission to reinstall the software YOU PAID FOR!!!!!! And if they decide that you are lieing, and you didnt pay for it............they can deny you the ability to install it until you can prove your validity!! (this is how M$ works.....not sure how adobe will handle it.....but AW is very cool about it and easy going, you just fax in a form and your good to go)

Once again, as others have said, this only punishes people that werent gonna steal it in the first place!

A friend of mine would always say:

"Locks only keep honest people out."

btw, i would love to know the names of all these oh so honest and non-pirating big companys that just wanna be legit ;)

[tasty cloud]

I don't know about this... but I think 99% of those who has a pirated copy of photoshop would never consider buying it. So I wonder how much money Adobe actually looses.

If photoshop was made uncrackable, but lets say painter wasn't, every non pro would start using painter. It's not all that easy to say which company would earn more in the end.

PR can stand for piracy in some cases.

[yog]

I'm a ligit user of Photoshop, I'm probably one of the very few people who has even registered it with Adobe, but if they switch to remote activation of software, then I'm taking a serious look at the competition. :thumbsdow
Ship it with a dongle by all means, but don't go the remote activation route :annoyed:

This is the reason I run Win2k, partly because I didn't see anything startlingly new in XP, but also because I hate the idea of remote activation :annoyed:

[Gentle Fury]

Originally posted by yog
I'm a ligit user of Photoshop, I'm probably one of the very few people who has even registered it with Adobe, but if they switch to remote activation of software, then I'm taking a serious look at the competition. :thumbsdow
Ship it with a dongle by all means, but don't go the remote activation route :annoyed:

This is the reason I run Win2k, partly because I didn't see anything startlingly new in XP, but also because I hate the idea of remote activation :annoyed:

i'm def with you on that!

[NanoGator]

Originally posted by Goon
Considering how widely pirated their products are, especially photoshop, they have to make an effort. Even if they do not succeed, if they give up it would be even more harmfull than it already is (not in terms of success, but rather the message they would be sending).


To be fair, people can make a living with knowledge of apps like Photoshop. Even a pirate has a strong potential to be a long-term customer. It's not like a game where you play for a while and then you put it away.

[mind]

Why not just ship the thing with a dongle and end of story.

Do they really think they are going to stop crackers...cuz if they really think so this is my opinion: ha ha! The guys are damned clever and anything Adobe (and anyone) can do they can do it too...twice. These people take this kind of thing as a challenge and so they solve it with passion. Adobe does this with desperation...nah nah, it´s not gonna work.

Good luck Adobe but honestly, a very good waste of time and money and resources and all.

[NanoGator]

They're better off not increasing demand for the Gimp.

[Pent]

photoshop 6 is fine, silly adobe

[NanoGator]

7 kicks 6's butt! :arteest:

[MaHen]

I don't think this anti-piracy plan is aimed at the casual user or the "1337 \/\/4R3Z" guys... I think Adobe (and most software companies) are smart enough to realize that the hackers can get around ANY protection ("If Man can make it, Man can break it") and that the kid who downloaded his copy from Kazaa would have paid for his copy if his allowance was a few hundred dollars more per month.

The manditory registration stops the REAL pirates - the "businesses" in China and Indonesia who mass-produce thousands of copies of Adobe Photoshop - complete with Boxes, cases, and serial numbers, and then sell them to software stores who, knowing they aren't legit*, put them on the store shelves and sell them to customers. It really does happen, and it costs Adobe millions of dollars a year.

Adobe knows that "you and I" would buy photoshop if we could afford it... they understand that. What they are upset about is when you and I >>DO<< save up the $1K to buy a copy of Photoshop and the copy we buy from the store isn't legit.

The other form of piracy they are out to stop is the one Gentle Fury mentioned - where a business with 300 workstations buys one copy and installs it on every machine. The companies that do this usually aren't "1337" enough to get a "cracked" version - they prefer just to buy one and copy it. This will stop them as well.

It won't effect me (I tend to buy my Adobe products from Adobe online, so I know they're legit), but I see both sides. I HATE registration and am very supportive of the "try-before-you-buy"-minded software crackers (give every "Kazaa-kiddy" a cracked copy of photoshop 7, and when they grow up, they'll all buy photoshop 12 - you can't get better marketing than that) , but I can see why Adobe would invest in something like this.

(* Most store owners who do this will claim they didn't know the version wasn't legit, but when someone who doesn't work for Adobe offers to sell you Adobe software for less than half the price you get it from Adobe, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize they're probably pirated.)

[PhilOsirus]

The asian market is rampant with piracy at all levels, especially corporate. It is much more rare on such a scale here or in Europe.

[moovieboy]

I wonder if any bean counters over at Adobe can accurately predict the number of users that will simply halt with their current version of Photoshop (cracked or legit) simply because of the online registration.

Quark Xpress suffers from this, not because of dopey registration schemes, but by getting too comfortable and not offering anything new for Lord knows how long. A majority of companies have no intention of going from Xpress 4 to 5, and only OSX would make folks transition to Xpress 6...

My reason for mentioning Quark is because Adobe's InDesign is slowly picking away at Quark's bloated behind... Adobe should take note of their own strategies with Quark or Photoshop could be in danger of a similar fate...

-Tom

[mind]

Originally posted by MaHen
I don't think this anti-piracy plan is aimed at the casual user or the "1337 \/\/4R3Z" guys... I think Adobe (and most software companies) are smart enough to realize that the hackers can get around ANY protection ("If Man can make it, Man can break it") and that the kid who downloaded his copy from Kazaa would have paid for his copy if his allowance was a few hundred dollars more per month.

The manditory registration stops the REAL pirates - the "businesses" in China and Indonesia who mass-produce thousands of copies of Adobe Photoshop - complete with Boxes, cases, and serial numbers, and then sell them to software stores who, knowing they aren't legit*, put them on the store shelves and sell them to customers. It really does happen, and it costs Adobe millions of dollars a year.

Adobe knows that "you and I" would buy photoshop if we could afford it... they understand that. What they are upset about is when you and I >>DO<< save up the $1K to buy a copy of Photoshop and the copy we buy from the store isn't legit.

The other form of piracy they are out to stop is the one Gentle Fury mentioned - where a business with 300 workstations buys one copy and installs it on every machine. The companies that do this usually aren't "1337" enough to get a "cracked" version - they prefer just to buy one and copy it. This will stop them as well.

It won't effect me (I tend to buy my Adobe products from Adobe online, so I know they're legit), but I see both sides. I HATE registration and am very supportive of the "try-before-you-buy"-minded software crackers (give every "Kazaa-kiddy" a cracked copy of photoshop 7, and when they grow up, they'll all buy photoshop 12 - you can't get better marketing than that) , but I can see why Adobe would invest in something like this.

(* Most store owners who do this will claim they didn't know the version wasn't legit, but when someone who doesn't work for Adobe offers to sell you Adobe software for less than half the price you get it from Adobe, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize they're probably pirated.)



MaHen, I totally agree with you and I would add a lot more to it. Of course they have to stop piracy...still it won't work.
And they know it if they (Adobe) are clever enouth to think that 'if man can make, man can break it'.

Adobe should invest of course in antipiracy strategies but they should focus their investment in making the software better. Because those "kazaa-kiddies" out there would be expecting a lot more than what they offer today.

Shouldn't the one of "The best companies to work for" invest and focus on the development and future of itself by satisfying the already grouwn-ups and the future "past-kazaa-kiddies" aka costumers. And please...don't tell me this anty-piracy policy will solve that Asia issue. It will prove useless and that money could go for the people wanting to go work for one "The best companies to work for" and deliver outstanding products for their legit costumers.

If this package is so desired, why not simply add a super duper dongle to it. It will be cracked anyways but won't be so expensive to do...maybe it would make things a bit harder for crackers, who knows.

Of course all this is a personal opinion.

[moovieboy]

Personally, I hope the dongle thing isn't even a consideration. I am so freaked about damaging/losing/misplacing my Lightwave and/or Combustion dongles while on a tight deadline... It's also one of the most ridiculous things to deal with on a laptop. One slip up and you're instantly screwed.

I hate the idea that someday, a hardware problem could actually prevent me from using perfectly working, pefectly legit software for as long as it takes tech support to get me a new one... and I have no idea how long that usually takes... anyone?

And last, I've got enough things demanding USB ports...

-Tom

Sidenote: Since both C* and LW have both dropped so much in price and so much other stuff in that range has no dongle... think they'd ever give in and switch???

[NanoGator]

I wouldn't mind a wireless dongle of some sort. My Honda talks to my key via radio somehow and figures out that it is the right key. If I could set a bunch of dongles in a tray or something and have the PC recognize them, that'd be useful. 'Connecting' them is a scary process.

[klingspor]

Even with a dongle, the simple fact remains that it will be cracked before the software has been released - what, you think Combustion or Lightwave isn't available in Kazaa? Think again... I know people that own a legal version of the software you mentioned and still got a crack, simply because the dongles are so inconvenient!

And it won't solve the issue in Asia either: There, selling illegal software is a business - and a big one I might add. I've been there and seen it... it's huge.
These aren't script kiddies Adobe is dealing with here: The guys feed their (many) children by selling things like Photoshop, and it's even tolerated by the governments for the most part. It's their job, so to say, to crack the software. You think they won't find a workaround to a silly dongle? One in software that directly disables any anti-piracy measures Adobe could come up with so they'd still sell the CD to shops and businesses just like they're used to...

A dongle is just as silly a non-solution to piracy as online activation has proved to be. There really isn't anything Adobe (or anyone else) can do at the moment but improve their software and at least keep the legal customers paying and happy. And if you look at the cash those companies have earned in the last few years, that seems to work quite well anyway...

[yog]

If it was just a matter of simple online registration in order to get a second serial number I wouldn't mind a bit, some of my existing software does this.
But what I really object to is tying my Photoshop licence to a piece of my hardware (MB), or existing serial number from a different piece of software (OS), then making me jump through repeated hoops whenever I decide to change either. Basically treating me like a criminal until proven otherwise, or rubbing my nose in the fact that I should be greatful that they are allowing me to borrow their software (read the small print, we don't buy software, we buy the option to have borrow it). And as far as having remote activation rights to my computer, then they can get stuffed.

The reason I suggested a dongle is, despite the fact that it will be cracked as fast as any other security meathod (including remote activation), it would be no further anoyance for us legit users (been using dongles for 10+ years and never had one fail, unlike software locks), yet would allow Adobe to feel good that they are doing something against piracy, and would definately be cutting down on the casual copier.

But I don't see that happening, because it is cheeper in the long run for Adobe to anoy us users remotely than it is to invest in thousands of dongles.

[Gentle Fury]

Originally posted by stefanminning
Even with a dongle, the simple fact remains that it will be cracked before the software has been released - what, you think Combustion or Lightwave isn't available in Kazaa? Think again... I know people that own a legal version of the software you mentioned and still got a crack, simply because the dongles are so inconvenient!

And it won't solve the issue in Asia either: There, selling illegal software is a business - and a big one I might add. I've been there and seen it... it's huge.
These aren't script kiddies Adobe is dealing with here: The guys feed their (many) children by selling things like Photoshop, and it's even tolerated by the governments for the most part. It's their job, so to say, to crack the software. You think they won't find a workaround to a silly dongle? One in software that directly disables any anti-piracy measures Adobe could come up with so they'd still sell the CD to shops and businesses just like they're used to...

A dongle is just as silly a non-solution to piracy as online activation has proved to be. There really isn't anything Adobe (or anyone else) can do at the moment but improve their software and at least keep the legal customers paying and happy. And if you look at the cash those companies have earned in the last few years, that seems to work quite well anyway...

funny you mention that............we own Maya and we were using a crack version for a couple months after buying it, only because it was a pain in the ass to set up.......rather just have the software there and ready to use! Hell we paid $7000 for the damn thing, we just wanted to get started and not deal with all that crap till later.

We did eventually do it the legit way (maybe a month or two later)........but then maya 5 came out...........so, use a cracked copy till the legit one came in the mail. Its so silly all of it.........with broadband the companys selling the software should allow you to dl it off their site pre-registered (as you can set up secure dl's) then send you the software in the mail in case you have to reinstall!

Sorry, i hate having to wait!

And yes i also agree with your last statement......it's not like the companys are suffering.....they are multi-billion dollar conglomerates! And that isnt because the started shipping free pairs of Nike Air Jordans with every copy of Premiere.....it is because for every 1 pirate there are about 3 legit users......so as long as the good outweigh the bad they need to just realize the only way to win is not to punish the legit users (because that is ALL piracy protection does), but add new features we would like to have!

It reminds me of when Final Fantasy 8 came out for the PSX........Square claimed it had a rock solid anti-copy method on there......it would be impossible to pirate. Well, not only was there lil code cracked, but it was available world wide on burned cd's 2 days before it came out legitimatly!!!!!

It just goes to show, the more you try and protect your software, the more of a game it is to crack for these people!

[mind]

True.

Oh well:rolleyes: what to do with those CD burners.

Will the same happen with music, will they add dongles when you buy a CD?

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