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jeremybirn
11-02-2008, 01:37 AM
This is an old challenge now, this thread is archived. If you scroll down to the Challenge #17 section of the downloads page, you'll see that the models can still be downloaded for your tests, and also that a gallery has been made of top entries. Feel free to browse this thread to see what others have posted, even though you can no longer post here.

Challenge #17 Deadline: Monday, January 5, 2009. This will be the final deadline for your work to appear in the gallery. Start early, this is a big scene! The sooner you post a work in progress, the sooner you can get feedback and improve your work.

The goal here is to bring this scene to life, adding convincing lighting and depth to the space. You can use whatever software or techniques you want to create an original, well-lit 3D rendering of this scene. You may add or subtract or change the models, create textures, arrange the shot as you please, or do whatever else you want to realize your vision of the scene.

PLEASE: When you post an image, also post what software you are using, your render times, and any special settings or techniques you are using. For example, if you rendered the scene in different layers and composited, if you used occlusion or raytracing or global illumination, settings like this are interesting to other people doing the challenge!

This scene was modeled by Alvaro Luna Bautista (who did all the architecture and displays and everything except the dinosaurs), and Joel Andersdon (who made the dinosaur skeletons.) Please credit Alvaro Luna Bautista and Joel Andersdon for their modeling work if you use images of this scene on the web or in your portfolio or showreel.

Here is the link to download the files, and a few images of this huge, complex scene we have to work with!

Download Link: http://www.3drender.com/challenges/

http://www.3drender.com/challenges/Natural_History/Natural_History.jpg

punytjoshi
11-02-2008, 03:06 AM
Thats Nice ,

Will start working on it ASAP.

Leotril
11-02-2008, 05:40 AM
Hello all.. this look like another fun challenge .. heres my start on it :) default shader only lighting for the moment (need to check normals and add some texturing for sure .. ) but is a start .. hope u like it :hmm:

http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/AEcomp1-1a.jpg
1k render (http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/AEcomp1-1.jpg)

a desaturated version
http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/AEcomp1-2a.jpg
1k render (http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/AEcomp1-2.jpg)

visua
11-02-2008, 10:57 AM
A very nice challenge indeed, but my computer takes longer calculating all
the empty uv's than actual rendering... ;)

raylistic
11-02-2008, 12:26 PM
wow, big scene. This might take some time for me to plan! Nonetheless, look forward to great renders from you guys! I have never did interior lighting before so this might be first real go!

BlenderFan
11-02-2008, 01:58 PM
I don't know if anyone has already looked, but I searched "natural history museum" on pbase.com and found some great interior shots at different times of day. Could be good for lighting and texture reference.

dpendzich
11-02-2008, 04:23 PM
Hey everyone! I came across this photograph while searching the internet for some reference images and guess what? It appears to be the same museum that our 3d model has been based on. Check it out:

http://www.sigevo.org/gecco-2007/images/internal/nh-museum-interior.jpg

http://www.sigevo.org/gecco-2007/images/internal/nh-museum.jpg

BlenderFan
11-02-2008, 05:30 PM
Here is my first go. I am focusing just on the lighting at this point; texures and materials will come later. Tell me what you think.

jeremybirn
11-02-2008, 09:24 PM
Hey everyone! I came across this photograph while searching the internet for some reference images and guess what? It appears to be the same museum that our 3d model has been based on.

Quite right. This challenge idea started with when Joel Anderson (Joel3D) created the Dinosaur models. (I got the spelling Andersdon from his cgtalk profile and posts. His website joel3d.com uses the spelling Anderson, so I think that's probably correct.) When he first posted the skeletons last year, I asked him if we could use them in a lighting challenge, and he said yes. If you check his website, he has them textured and rigged by now, too, but back when we talked he only had skeletons, so we needed a complete environment to create a challenge scene out of the dinosaur skeletons.

Alvaro Luna Bautista (Samo), who also modeled the Local Train challenge, put about 40-50 hours of work into building a model of the Natural History Museum in London, using Blender. You can look through and find more pictures of the real thing at these addresses:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_History_Museum
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=Natural+History+London
http://www.nhm.ac.uk/visit-us/history-architecture/index.html
By coincidence, this lighting challenge is based in the same famous hall that was also used on cgtalk for a matte painting challenge, you can see here:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=196&t=501754

-jeremy

scorpion66
11-02-2008, 10:34 PM
hi guys iam with you{first time} :cool:

Fex
11-02-2008, 10:37 PM
hi all,
this is my first try usin Houdinis PBR renderengine... need correct decays
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t271/fexa/n_hist_01_.jpg

Voigg
11-03-2008, 05:22 AM
He's my first lighting render.

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r250/Voigg/HM.jpg

MistaFraggadeliX
11-03-2008, 07:31 AM
I see that in the downloads-section of this challenge Jeremy listed all the former publishers of the different 3d programs which have now all been assimilated by the Autodesk juggernaut.

This 'll be my first lightning challenge. Pretty ambitious one to start with, I know ;) I started on the lighthouse 2 weeks ago but the deadline was just too tight for me to make it.

HOOJK
11-03-2008, 10:09 AM
Hi I'm starting to love those challanges...
This is with C4D+VRay sun and some photoshop action:rolleyes:
:curious: why there's no C4D file format this time...???
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/2504/2copymu0.th.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=2copymu0.jpg)http://img411.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/3682/1copymb3.th.jpg (http://img46.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1copymb3.jpg)http://img46.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

kunwarnikhil
11-03-2008, 11:20 AM
hi guys
downloaded the model this is going to be a fun challenge looking forward to see all the posts and brilliant work that people come up with

ACamacho
11-03-2008, 02:12 PM
The scene is huge and my computer at home isn't handling it very well. But after some cleaning up, should be ok. Looks like it could be the most fun challenge so far.

spurcell
11-03-2008, 04:57 PM
wow this should be a great challenge. been looking forward to one, but have been so busy. Will try and make time. Here's a quick test, after cleaning up max file, and testing out some sun positions. Quick adjustments in photoshop.


http://i373.photobucket.com/albums/oo176/percydaman/natural_history_01.jpg
http://img201.imageshack.us/my.php?image=naturalhistory01fz6.jpg

tassel
11-03-2008, 05:18 PM
This scene is just amazing, big thanks to Alvaro Luna Bautista and Joel Andersdon.

I have also started cleaning up normals etc. so you guys can count on me in this challenge too :D

The pre-renders so far is looking good :)

visua
11-03-2008, 10:06 PM
Draft one, maya/mental ray:

http://www.nicz.net/Natural_History02.jpg

raylistic
11-03-2008, 10:59 PM
Look great peeps. So after the lighting draft, the next step is to add textures and shaders?

herbertagudera
11-03-2008, 11:56 PM
okay this is my first go at it.. and surely wont be the last.. specially because i have the same composition as fuhshizzle. hehe.. anyway.. time to go back and think of other angle but first..

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3250/3001307436_6ffb332130_o.jpg

kanooshka
11-04-2008, 12:36 AM
Spectacular! Thanks for the contribution Alvaro Luna Bautista and Joel Anderson!

BinaryRay
11-04-2008, 07:42 AM
Hey everyone! I came across this photograph while searching the internet for some reference images and guess what? It appears to be the same museum that our 3d model has been based on. Check it out:


For a moment i thought those was your first renders and got really scared!!

We can use any software we like but with the rate that autodesk is buying everyone we will all use their software in the end...

tassel
11-04-2008, 09:46 AM
For a moment i thought those was your first renders and got really scared!!

We can use any software we like but with the rate that autodesk is buying everyone we will all use their software in the end...

Yea! This fantastic new software called "3dsMaya XSI" ;)

zenerry
11-04-2008, 10:21 AM
Hi all,
I can't unrar the autodesk file. I'd like to participate in this challenge.
Can anybody help me?

HOOJK
11-04-2008, 12:21 PM
Hi... I've put some textures... but still a long work to do:rolleyes:


http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/6241/3copyfx2.th.jpg (http://img513.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3copyfx2.jpg)http://img513.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

mmoses00
11-04-2008, 03:13 PM
Some very cool renders so far....


Jeremy,

Can we ask that submissions include some stats: what renderer, render times, 3d package used, and basic machine specs? I am very interested in what's going on behind these cool renders.

THX!

Matt

jojo1975
11-04-2008, 07:04 PM
Wow I have to give this a try !

visua
11-04-2008, 07:16 PM
Sitting here reversing normals for the last hour or so, what else to do on tuesday
night... ;)

Voigg
11-04-2008, 08:54 PM
mmoses00- Mine is using Maya as the software, mental ray as render, and right now its a 6:34 render time i will post the new render soon as I can.

metal0130
11-04-2008, 11:38 PM
Sorry for the noobish question... In maya, none of my texture maps are displaying correctly on the objects. I apply a texture to the floor and in the perspective window (after pressing 6 for hardware texing) the shade will change but the texture still will not appear, nor will it in the render. If I apply a UV projection of any sort, then the texture will show.

I just started using maya 2009 this morning if there is something new that I am overlooking.

Is there something on the model that needs to be changed for textures to work right?

scorpion66
11-05-2008, 02:14 AM
first try to me without texture

http://maxforums.net/uploaded/54083/1225867333.jpg

ingramworks
11-05-2008, 04:14 AM
Hey all, love this model, a great challenge. Here's my start, no textures yet and still a work in progress.

http://www.xlfilms.tv/test_01.jpg

tuffmutt1
11-05-2008, 06:53 AM
wow neat challenge. hope i can get in on this this time.been backbrakingly busy past 2 months.

ngramworks: very nice approach to the lighting. i love it...keep going. what are you using to render it with?

MrHoo
11-05-2008, 07:23 AM
Sorry for the noobish question... In maya, none of my texture maps are displaying correctly on the objects. I apply a texture to the floor and in the perspective window (after pressing 6 for hardware texing) the shade will change but the texture still will not appear, nor will it in the render. If I apply a UV projection of any sort, then the texture will show.

I just started using maya 2009 this morning if there is something new that I am overlooking.

Is there something on the model that needs to be changed for textures to work right?

Yeah, you have to work on texture projections and texturing by your own, the scene is not prepared with uv layouts.

Great challenge by the way, will step in by time!!

raylistic
11-05-2008, 10:20 AM
ingramworks: very nice! Could you share how you lit them? any FG or GI used? Any compositing?

zenerry
11-05-2008, 10:34 AM
hi everybody,

I can't open the Max scene. I says there's a problem with that file.

Anybody is working with that file? can anybody share it to me?

I'd like trying to work on it.

Thanks!

jasvant
11-05-2008, 11:28 AM
hello jeremy sir,here is my entry.i used maya,mental ray(gi,fg).i used 800000 photons in global illumnation and rendertime is 10 minutes.for dinosaur texture i used layer shaders and procedural maps.post production done with photoshop.hope you will like it.:hmm:

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii257/jassi782477/bewareofdinofinallights.jpg

BinaryRay
11-05-2008, 01:14 PM
Well Rexxy, do you still insist that south is the right way?


http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/771/dinosfw0.jpg


The scene was too big for my machine to render so i tried something else...:D
I am using 3ds max 2009 with mental ray, in a 1gb ram single pentium processor desktop.

jeremybirn
11-05-2008, 01:46 PM
PakosM - Good job! Maybe if you split the scene into more layers you could render more?

jasvant - That's great! I think the dino texture is nice, but a little rough, maybe just softening it and wearing it down a little would help. The light from the window looks nice. I'd like to see the view through the window blown-out to pure white, with a little glow around it, to fit with the exposure level inside. In the sunbeam, the dino head has some strange angular shadows on it, and could use more bounce light permeating the inside of the skull.

zenerry - Did you un-archive the .rar file yet? What version of Max are you using? (Max can import other file formats like .fbx, .obj, etc. if you need it to.)

ingramworks - Great! Nice to see you start out with good basic color choices. That dino could get some more light on him, at least on the front part.

scorpion66 - Good start. I hope everyone starts posting info about software used, render times, and techniques.

metal0130 - Assign UVs, at least select objects and choose "Automatic Mapping." For software rendering, any projection or 3D procedural would look just the same without UVs, but you need UVs assigned to preview textures in hardware like that.

Can we ask that submissions include some stats: what renderer, render times, 3d package used, and basic machine specs? I am very interested in what's going on behind these cool renders.Good idea, Matt! I hope everyone posts render times, software used, etc.

HOOJK - Good start. It's looking nice and solid.

herbertagudera - Good start. I agree other compositions could work, the symmetrical one with the pink bar in the center isn't as dramatic as it could be.

Look great peeps. So after the lighting draft, the next step is to add textures and shaders?Shaders are a very good idea. Get the basic over-all colors, set whether the glass and floor are reflective, those things really help set the scene. If you see a background through the doors/windows, try to get that the way you like early, too.

visua - Good start! I hope everyone starts posting info about software used, render times, and techniques. If you were using Maya then clicking Automatic mapping or something to assign UVs could be a good idea.

fuhshizzle - That's great! Even with a symmetrical composition, moving the light to one side makes a big difference. With the lit dino facing away from us, maybe something should be done to the other dino to get a sense of reaction in him, or some other center of attention could be where the lit dino is looking? If you want, you're allowed to move the dinos around, too.

Voigg - Good start.

Fex - Thanks for providing the Houdini version of the scene we have for download. Good start on your first post, too.

BlenderFan - Good start! You should start with shaders/materials early on, if the floor is going to be reflective you'll want to see it in lighting tests.

Leotril - Good start with your first post. I hope everyone starts posting info about software used, render times, and techniques.

-jeremy

jeremybirn
11-05-2008, 01:51 PM
I already posted a bunch of links about the building, but here's a music video with scenes shot there:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRUsdQ-rNVk
The section in London Natural History Museum starts at 0:53.

-jeremy

Cabbage82
11-05-2008, 01:57 PM
Heres my entry... still work in progress. I just thought I'd post it and hopefuly get some crits :)

ingramworks
11-05-2008, 02:29 PM
ngramworks: very nice approach to the lighting. i love it...keep going. what are you using to render it with?
ingramworks: very nice! Could you share how you lit them? any FG or GI used? Any compositing?
Thanks :) I'm using Cinema4D's built-in render engine with GI. Trying to approach the scene as I've seen DP's on pratical sets do, so it's a great challenge.

ingramworks - Great! Nice to see you start out with good basic color choices. That dino could get some more light on him, at least on the front part.
Totally agree, was the last bit I was working on before turning my attentiion to the events of last night, but I'm still not happy with his light source. I also plan to introduce some more pratical sources around the set as well as improve the dynamics of that fill light off on the right. Lighting large spaces pratically is very tough and equally as tough in a virtual space as well, so thanks for provided this model, it's a fun challenge :)

swihartc
11-05-2008, 02:39 PM
Hey all, see some good stuff on here. I got the model last night and started cleaning and moving things around. There are so many good combinations of camera angle and lighting moods that could work for this. I will spend another day or so playing with lights and camera to get a good mood feel before steaming ahead. So far though, here are some screenshots of possible moods. I used max9, vray for GI. Very very low settings for light samples to get as many render tests out as possible :). Vray dirt override material.

CS
http://www.3dpragmatik.net/art/filmstrip.jpg

Shordy
11-05-2008, 03:55 PM
nice renders @all

here is my beginning... i think the floor is too dark i will search vor some gray marble...

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v1.jpg

Samo
11-05-2008, 05:24 PM
hi guys

I would like to share some information with you that can be helpful to lit this scene.

Originally lamps were used to lit this famous central hall, they can be barelly seen in this old photo (notice the volumetric effect BTW):
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/8659/ssimage6211qh3.th.jpg (http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ssimage6211qh3.jpg)http://img440.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
http://img440.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

Nowadays natural skylight and spot lights are used. The spotlights main task is lighting the painted ceilings. Example:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lnp1/2947024055/

There are dozens of images about this hall in Flickr. Input "london natural history museum" in the search tool. They can be helpful to get 'a second opinion' about a particular look. BTW some of those frontal images were really helpful to model this work.

There are two lamps types in the 3D scene, located at both ends.
http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/7594/lampspq7.th.jpg (http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lampspq7.jpg)http://img359.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

RealReality
11-05-2008, 05:41 PM
I've got a question regarding this challenge and the previous one (lighthouse),
the scenes are only available as polymodelled objects, no NURBS models.

It's the first time I render larger scenes like these...

My issue: rendering time in Rhino 4 + VRay
it takes about 10-20 minutes for a "quick" test render, without any materials set up,
is it because of the polycount, or because of incompatibility with the nurbs modeler rhino ?
(I know rhino converts a nurbs object to a polygon mesh before rendering, but I want to be sure it doesn't make a difference before I go on trying to make my renders faster)

Hardware: Q6600 2.4ghz, 4gb ram

Render settings for the test render were:
reso: 320x240
GI on => primary IR (multiplier 1) => secondary QMC (multiplier 0.8)
IR map settings: -5,-3 + standard values

Any help or advise would be appreciated :)

coolayan
11-05-2008, 06:25 PM
heres mine,
a draft texture and draft lightning.
im starting to enjoy this challenge, coz this is my first time to render and texture a very huge interior scene..
so guys help me out specially in texturing...i think texturing will be the most hardest part..
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n436/barorot101/draft.jpg
max09, vraysp2, cs3..
render time i think 5mins @ 1.6k resolution. GI low settings
mac pro 8core xeon processor, 4gb ram, XP 64Bit

zenerry
11-05-2008, 07:39 PM
Hi jeremy, I still have problems with max file. I'm using Max 9. I already know that I can import obj. dxf. ... ... but where can I find them?

thanks for your info.

I'm looking forward to take the file, to work on it.!!!

mmoses00
11-05-2008, 07:49 PM
Yes.. the max file posted is a Max 2009 file.... some normals are flipped.. but I have posted a max 9 version.. all you have to do is flip all textures to 2-sided... and they'll render ok.... just viewport will have the flip issues.


Here:
http://www.vfxproduction.tv/BIRN/NatHist/Natural_History_3dmax_9.zip (http://www.vfxproduction.tv/BIRN/NatHist/Natural_History_3dmax_9.zip)

(http://www.vfxproduction.tv/BIRN/NatHist/Natural_History_3dmax_9.max)


:)

metal0130
11-05-2008, 09:49 PM
Yeah, you have to work on texture projections and texturing by your own, the scene is not prepared with uv layouts.

thanks for the heads up MrHoo and jeremyBirn, I didn't know objects couldn't contain ANY UVs. I thought maya created UVs at each vertice at the time of vetice creation (or somthing along those lines). I know maya doesn't nicely lay them out for you :) but I thought they at least existed. I was thrown for a loop there.

Now that that's solved, on to those darn stairs... those are going to be fun.

zenerry
11-05-2008, 11:20 PM
thanks mmoses00 (http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=37503) !!!

At last! I've got the scene, I'll begin working on it!!

ingramworks
11-06-2008, 01:48 AM
Some more work on the light setups. Also added a little level correction and grain in photoshop to get a sense of what I may do once I get the layers into a compositor.

Pretty happy, though I'll probably tweak as I add some objects and texture, which I can hopefully start soon.

http://www.xlfilms.tv/test_02.jpg

herbertagudera
11-06-2008, 06:28 AM
okay heres an update.. just added a few lights.. and tried a different angle..

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3054/3007636322_c3b6bf812c.jpg (http://bighugelabs.com/flickr/onblack.php?id=3007636322&size=large)

swihartc
11-06-2008, 06:51 AM
Ok, I think I'm happy with this mood and camera/light angle, I'll tweak it a lot in post though I'm sure :/. T-rex took a visit to zbrush and got transposed into more of an attack position. Cranked up the GI settings for this render. Vray dirt override material. Some post work was done to this to see what kind of look im going for. Time to start on all the other good stuff.
Much more needs tweaked.

Curtis

http://www.3dpragmatik.net/art/challenge3.jpg

Cabbage82
11-06-2008, 09:57 AM
Tweaked my image a bit. My basic light setup is a combination of spotlights, GI and HDRI with Caustics also turned on.

JBrant
11-06-2008, 01:04 PM
Hey, All.
Here's my first stab at this scene. It's little more than a sketch at this point. I'm hoping to create a feeling of menace in this scene, maybe adding some school children to the left side of the staircase. I may try a few more cameras, but I do like the one point perspective on the grand stair. I'm using 3DS Max with Vray for GI and photoshop for post.

Thanks to Alvaro Luna Bautista and Joel Andersdon these models are AWESOME!







http://img50.imageshack.us/my.php?image=progress01qp8.jpg

davidsharp
11-06-2008, 02:18 PM
Count me in!

timmatron
11-06-2008, 02:35 PM
Hey Jeremy & Curtis! Very nice from both of you...

...and Shane! I didn't recognize the screen name. ;-)

GordonTarpley
11-06-2008, 03:30 PM
A few first drafts. i JUST got the file setup this morning, No real materials yet. LONG way to go! Still playing with cameras and light angles. I've got a few more angles but apparently there's a 3 file max... I'll have some more updates soon. Maybe a night shot. I'll figure that out once I decide on a camera...

Pedro3D
11-06-2008, 05:17 PM
Anyone using Maya Improtons and Irradiance Particles ? I would love to see some IP- Rays Emitted ETC ETC... settings that work, I'm having a extremely hard time making them work with this scene....



Because sharing is caring those who are interested in Maya IP and Importons here is a great article...

http://forum.lamrug.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1608&p=7124

visua
11-06-2008, 07:19 PM
Trying out different approaches to lighting. Maya/mental ray, rendertime 3-8 minutes (1024x768).

http://www.nicz.net/Natural_History05.jpg

http://www.nicz.net/Natural_History04.jpg

http://www.nicz.net/Natural_History03.jpg

Phil-roberts
11-06-2008, 10:12 PM
Hi guys, here is my view on it, my first challenge and enjoying it!
may try some volumetric through the skylights but dont want to brighten it up too much what do you think?

Gear is Dual Quad Xeons - 8GB Ram - Rendered straight from Max9 in V-ray no post at the moment.

Cheers
Phil

http://www.pr-creative.com/cg-society/museum7.jpg

mmoses00
11-06-2008, 11:09 PM
Some good looking starts posted already - I wanted to get in the queue.
So here is a no textures piece done in 3dsmax. No tex on buildings , I mean. The TREX has a simple texture.
Light is one directional area light outside, and one attenuated Omni that casts only on TREX bones... to give it shape, spec hits, and body. The rest of illumination is from global illumination in FinalRender... settings are turned up for secondary bounce multiplier.

FinalRender is still the fastest off the shelf renderer out there for speed/quality... with possible exception of Renderman (which is way too expensive for one man) .. I have a vfx workstation (Dual Quadcore BOXX with Quadro fx 4600 - 4GB RAM) and am able to get this in 2 min, 49 sec.

But, in production, I would camera map the walls...once I had my lighting... and get it back to 20 seconds per frame or less for the room.

http://www.vfxlighter.org/BIRN/NatHist/NatHist_NoTextures_001.jpg

Sealaender
11-07-2008, 12:41 AM
I use Maxon Andvanced Render 3.
Rendertime 120 min.
6 Renderclients (6x AMD Phenom 9550, 4GB RAM, Vista 64bit).
Including regulars Net render boo-boos (wrong settings.....my fault).
I think, the Ambient occlusion is too strong...?!
Yes, the perspective distortion :-/ ...i will amend this

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/5162/museeum1kj8.jpg

HOOJK
11-07-2008, 06:33 AM
Hey!
Strugling with the textures...

http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/5307/4copycopywz3.th.jpg (http://img384.imageshack.us/my.php?image=4copycopywz3.jpg)http://img384.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

scorpion66
11-07-2008, 01:28 PM
last update :)

http://www.up7s.com/uploads/images/up7s-4f4f89630a.jpg (http://www.up7s.com/)

i am still working on it :applause:


3dmax2008_vray_photoshopcs2

manki
11-07-2008, 03:46 PM
great - guys!

@moses: cool stuff! only the glass cage is a little bit disturbing.

@gordon: i like the middle composition (focus point directly on t-rex...). do you really think square aspect ratio is the best for this? nice contrast and appealing mood! can you explain - how did you achieve it?

that came out from my perspective tests....

http://www.mantidman.com/forums/natural_history/nh_test01.jpg

http://mantidman.com/forums/natural_history/nh_test02.jpg

http://mantidman.com/forums/natural_history/nh_test03.jpg

first real rendertest done in Maya2008, physical sun&sky (enabled sec. bounces) + ambientocclusion texture - but this looks awful yet ...
http://mantidman.com/forums/natural_history/nh_test04.jpg

davidsharp
11-07-2008, 08:02 PM
I'm going to give this a try too. Rendering in Max9 + Vray w/GI. No textures yet just trying to get happy with the light sources first...
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h184/cirruse30/lighting_comp/camera04_test03_720.jpg

Victor-Larsson
11-07-2008, 08:36 PM
Very nice scene but what happend to all normals?, half of all objects is normal incorrect :/.

gregsandor
11-08-2008, 06:09 AM
Has anyone made a split version of the .obj file yet? I gave it another shot but until I add ram I'm dead in the water.

To all who have posted images so far, they look great, part of the reason I'm inspired to start this challenge.

Samo
11-08-2008, 08:45 AM
I recommend using the Blender version in Jeremy's page to get an alternative export method that suits better your resources and needs (in stages, enabling/disabling options, etc). Blender has got many exporting options with several parameters for each of them.

spurcell
11-08-2008, 01:00 PM
Here's an update. Im going to be doing multiple 'versions' since we appear to have plenty of time. Along with a day, I'm starting a night version. Some initial lighting/textures. Have a long ways to go yet.

http://i373.photobucket.com/albums/oo176/percydaman/natural_history_night02small.jpg



And a link to a larger version:

LINK (http://i373.photobucket.com/albums/oo176/percydaman/natural_history_night02.jpg)

BTW, everyone's stuff is looking great so far! Looking forward to seeing more.
http://s373.photobucket.com/albums/oo176/percydaman/?action=view&current=natural_history_night02small.jpg

jeremybirn
11-08-2008, 04:32 PM
Has anyone made a split version of the .obj file yet? I gave it another shot but until I add ram I'm dead in the water.

To all who have posted images so far, they look great, part of the reason I'm inspired to start this challenge.
Sure thing, Greg! Now there are 2 different OBJ files on the download page (http://www.3drender.com/challenges/index.htm):



Natural_History_OBJ.rar (http://www.3drender.com/challenges/Natural_History/Natural_History_OBJ.rar) - This is the original OBJ file that Samo exported from Blender after he built the scene. Apart from the Blender version itself, all the other file formats have been derived from this one.
Natural_History_MultiPart_OBJ.rar (http://www.3drender.com/challenges/Natural_History/Natural_History_MultiPart_OBJ.rar) - This has the scene split into 10 OBJ and MTL files, which I exported from Maya after splitting the scene into 10 different groups.
I'm glad to see that most people are having good luck with getting such a large, complex scene working on their systems. This is not a trivial proposition.

-jeremy

gregsandor
11-08-2008, 04:55 PM
Thanks Jeremy. I'll dl it now.

fushizzle that looks cool.

JoyVoltenburg
11-08-2008, 05:08 PM
Here's my version - worked on it yesterday. Render took quite a bit of itme - in 3ds Max 2009, dual 2.3 Ghz, 3MGB ram, 512 video card. Had to enable force 2-sided in rendering which added to render times. (tried flipping normals, but quickly gave up when that got to be too tedious ). Rendered 800x600 - high image precision and high final gather to try to smooth out some shadow artifacts. The final gather map took well over an hour to generate and the final render took about 30 minutes. Still working on some materials.

Cool scene to play with!

http://www.hagerman.com/images/temp/museum%20nat%20histoy1.jpg

suedix
11-08-2008, 08:24 PM
First pic - My preliminary render after working on scene setup/cleanup (still have a little ways to go on both). Cinema 4d r11 Ar3 with GI and AO. 13.39 min to render.

Added my likely POV in second pic - I want to create a sense of menace from the tyrannosaurus in my final scene

visua
11-08-2008, 09:27 PM
Pretty happy with how the lighting is coming along, soon time
to start with materials. Maya/mental ray, rendertime about 8 minutes on
a mac pro quad xeon.

http://www.nicz.net/Natural_History06.jpg

Sealaender
11-08-2008, 09:59 PM
Hello mmoses,

your cam-position is spectacular! Do you risk deep blur?

Here my next attempt:
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/7991/mus2wu5.jpg

swag
11-08-2008, 11:57 PM
no dinos shot :)
http://www.swag3d.com/cgtalk/natural_history01.jpg

lazzhar
11-09-2008, 04:31 AM
My take:
http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9038/museum3ym0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/museum3ym0.jpg/1/w800.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img232/museum3ym0.jpg/1/)

jeremybirn
11-09-2008, 11:25 AM
This is going great! I'm really happy with all these images, and glad to see that this huge scene isn't too great a challenge for a lot of people to dive into. Here's some feedback on the more recent posts:

lazzhar - That's great! The composition is really dynamic. I think you could move the light you have on the columns on the right side of the frame over onto the dino and give him a little more contrast. The glass base is like an escher drawing that's hard to figure out. On the right, the glass wall appears to be dark and I can see the top and bottom of the glass wall, and its reflection below it. On the left side of the glass, there appears to be a top, a bottom, then a brighter part of the floor, then a dark edge, then the reflection?

swag - Nice angle! It could use a center of attention somewhere and some more texture and reflections. The upper left hallway needs lighting work: parts of it near the sunbeam need some fill or bounce light, and so does the ceiling of the part in the far left. For this big a space, some kind of haze or depth fading to reduce the contrast a bit in the distance would be nice.

Sealaender - Good start! I think you need more contrast or light on the dinos to draw attention to them within such a wide shot. The overall fill light looks very uniform, as if the same amount of light comes from the right and the left.

visua - Great! That's looking nice and solid. The two doors don't look very believable to me, maybe you expect to see some ground outside the building? Adding those smaller lights around the architecture is a good idea, but you'll need to put some geometry there so people can see the lights themselves.

suedix - Good starts! Both camera positions are good, in the 2nd one I think the framing should be fixed so you don't have half of that dino cut-off on the left edge. The floor reflections look nice, but I'm not sure that you have shadows visible in reflections. The reflections of the dark side alcoves look much too bright, especially in the 2nd one, as if the world getting reflected didn't have shadows there. The glass material looks good on the top of the one display case, but needs some work on the glass around the dinos.

JoyVoltenburg - Welcome! That's looking good! The two lamps in the back don't look lit-up, except for the light behind them. Maybe the glass in the front could be brighter, and then you wouldn't need as much light behind the lamps? The t-rex could use a little bit of kick or rim lighting, especially with all the light behind his head and to his upper left. Maybe a little reflectivity in his material or some specular highlights in places would bring the surface to life more? You might move the sign that lines-up with his foot.

fuhshizzle - Nice start on the night scene! Placing small sources around the scene give it a nice night feeling and a good sense of scale. You'll probably need to add some geometry (a model of the lamp itself) to motivate most of those spots of light. I don't know what's going on in the foreground with the three cubes, I guess that's just a test of some kind? I think you could do more with reflections and highlights on the floor and walls. Nice texture on the floor, too!

Victor-Larsson - On the version I brought into Maya, a lot of the surface normals appeared to be flipped, but that didn't seem to be a problem in rendering in MR. When coryc was making the Lightwave version he said he had to flip tons of normals. I don't know if anyone has a better version for your software?

davidsharp - Welcome! That's a very strong start, nice composition, good basic blocking on your key light. I'm looking forwards to seeing more.

manki - Good starts! I like the 3rd one down the best.

scorpion66 - Good start! Keep going!

HOOJK - Great! You have a solid scene, good basic lighting. I think it could use a little more of a center of attention, maybe light the left dino so we see more contrast in his face, or swing the camera to see more of the right dino? Your textures are off to a good start, too.

mmoses00 - That's great! I think the dino head looks a little dark and contrasty. When you his something like that with a bright light, I expect the whole thing to light up a bit because of all the white surfaces inter-reflecting, or because the material is thin, translucent and porous. Maybe a kick of light from that window below his teeth would help, and some light to fill in the area around his eye so the eye itself stands out?

Phil-roberts - Wow! You've just joined, you make one of the the first posts, and it's terrific! Welcome to the challenge. Your shading on the dino really makes him pop. I love the small highlight/reflection detail in the surface. I think the noise looks too much like it was projected from the side and gets stretched-out horizontally in places, maybe a 3D procedural noise or at least a different projection angle could fix that? Maybe on the interior surfaces some of the highlights should be shadowed or blocked where he self-reflects. The marble and glass could use some reflections and highlights too. I like the color contrast between the warm tones and the cool greens.

-jeremy

jasvant
11-09-2008, 12:02 PM
thanks for the great comments as you always give.here is my image with few correction.hope you will like it.:arteest: http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii257/jassi782477/bewareofdinoupdated.jpg
5375322
The LightHouse!

weng888
11-09-2008, 03:40 PM
hi , wow , love this new challenge :) will be lots of work though . here is my starting camera angle .. starting to detail the scene already .. hope i'll meet the deadline :)

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s275/weng_888/start.jpg

Fex
11-09-2008, 08:41 PM
update for the night shot...rendertimes are quite hefty (2h on a 3ghz dualcore and still grainy)
next one will be experimental

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t271/fexa/n_hist_03_.jpg

jorust
11-09-2008, 08:52 PM
That a great challenge Jeremy. Kudos to Alvaro and Joel for those great models.
Will join this one. Been years :argh: since my last contribute so it´s time for some renders.

My idea for the image is to place myself with a camera, inside the museum, trying to find a good angle to photograph the Rex. The sun hits the rex and makes a nice diagonal and lead my eyes into the museum.

Anyway, my first render in Modo. Done on my laptop, so render time was around 30min.

Leotril
11-09-2008, 10:19 PM
I basically started from scratch with this one.. importing some shaders from previosly challenges and automapping that to the whole geo it takes about 20 mins, after that i added a bunch of pointlights with low decays values and one directional light that could be the moon for this instance in conjunction with and hdr wich i use for GI+ FG spherical mapping to represent the sky soft illumination .im planning to add some fog for next update and fixing some issues i got witch shadows (raytrace) or occlusion .. maybe rendering some passes not just the beauty this time .. the rendertime about 2 hours ..hope u like the changes

http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/Museo/2dtexture2ps3.jpg
hardware : Intel Quad Q6600 2 GB DDR3
software: vista x64, maya 2008, renderman, photoshop

holle
11-10-2008, 04:21 AM
hi there...........

now this is a pretty nice scene for testing!

many nice renderings to see here.............

ok,

here my first try of the scene.

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/6875/lightchal1702vraycam1plf0.th.jpg (http://img201.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lightchal1702vraycam1plf0.jpg)http://img201.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

Luthias
11-10-2008, 04:24 AM
Here are two possible camera angles for my entry. Not sure if I will go with either of these yet.
option1 (http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn127/Luthias42/Version03-1600x995.jpg)
Option 2 (http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn127/Luthias42/Version02-1400x1600.jpg)

holle
11-10-2008, 04:25 AM
sry, double post.......

gregsandor
11-10-2008, 05:05 AM
lazzhar the patina on the bones looks good.

SeaBreezy
11-10-2008, 07:00 AM
I'm definitely getting into this challenge, I'll post a wip soon.

lazzhar
11-10-2008, 07:37 AM
Thanks.
Another one:
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/5845/museum21dq1.jpg

Rendered in two passes:
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/5672/fillwd7.jpg
And:
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/883/ambyc7.jpg

Obviously some post retouching has been done.
Great stuff in here by the way.

Edit: Sorry I've just seen the note on the first page about mentioning details about the render. Unfortunatly I didn't pay attention to the rendering times, but they were around the 10 minutes up to 20. I used Maya 2008 ext 2 with mental ray. The machine is a dual xeon e5420 @ 2.5 Ghz with 4 GB of RAM.
I used only direct lights not GI or FG or Occlusion here.

JBrant
11-10-2008, 12:56 PM
I thought I'd post another update with a new camera angle and compositional tweaks before I really sank my teeth into the materials. C&C welcome.

holle
11-10-2008, 02:53 PM
Thanks.
Another one:

-------

Obviously some post retouching has been done.
Great stuff in here by the way.


hi lazzhar,

looks pretty nice.
but I think the falloff of the front light goes to deep into the scene.

jeremybirn
11-10-2008, 03:17 PM
JBrant - Both are nice starts, especially 2nd one with the more interesting composition. You'll need some light from the scene onto the dino.

lazzhar - Looking good! The blue light on the dino is fine for fill as it is, but I think the blue light on the set should be split into multiple lights. The area where the blue and warm overlap on the set near the stairs looks a little forced. More, smaller lights can help the sense of scale, and your fill lighting should include a little bit of light on the right side of that display behind the dino.

holle - Nice job! I think the wall texture is almost there, it just has a bit too much bump up close, and further away too much of a repeating color texture. Some reflectivity might add to it. Where the roof/ceiling meets the top corner of that archway, the arch looks bright or the ceiling looks dark, they should meet at the same level of brightness. Once you get the floor textured and reflective, check to make sure the color balance is working over the whole scene. I'm worried about most of the blue being down below, but that might be a temporary effect of some surfaces not being shaded yet.

Leotril - That's great! I agree a little fog or depth fading would add to it. Maybe some more light could happen in that hallway near the bright doors, just enough to put light behind the dino and make him pop more? Some reflections on the floor and walls and glass would be nice.

polymess - Welcome back! Good basic blocking for your lighting and camera. Looking forwards to the next version.

Fex - Keep going! I hope you can find faster settings for test renders, to hammer out a brighter exposure level and make key elements read clearly.

weng888 - Welcome! Looks like just an occ pass, let's see more!

jasvant - Nice scene! The floor has different patterns on it: the shadows, the reflections, and also a black and white round pattern of some kind. I think the reflections could be more prominant (you could break them up a bit with a bump map if they look too perfect), but the round pattern is too bold and should be brought down in contrast. The dinos look good, but the one that's getting back-lit could use some rim light really outlining the brighter edges of his back and head.

-jeremy

kamendola
11-10-2008, 07:52 PM
Hi, i use Cinema4D + Vray
I participate just for fun because I do not have the time but I try to work out a 3D, I'm young, very young when I try to do my best to get more beautiful pictures!
I am sorry I used an online translator :cool:

http://upload.balboulloude.com/img/t2n_LightingChallenge17NaturalHistory_render3_dk8.jpg

Huv
11-10-2008, 09:21 PM
Hi, here's my first try ont his challenge :)
http://www.deltazone.org/~fc4d/images/huv_musee.jpg

holle
11-11-2008, 06:58 AM
hi,

here a new version with updated materials.

http://img390.imageshack.us/img390/8848/lightchal1703vraycam1pyu5.th.jpg (http://img390.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lightchal1703vraycam1pyu5.jpg)http://img390.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

HOOJK
11-11-2008, 07:48 AM
HEY! HOLLE what is your render time? And render settings ( if you're so kind to share ;-)???

holle
11-11-2008, 08:26 AM
HEY! HOLLE what is your render time? And render settings ( if you're so kind to share ;-)???

ups, sry. I totally forgot to tell theses things........

I use vray for c4d.
the only light is the "phsyical sky" and I use "physical cam".
colormapping: "reinhard" at 1, 0.4, 1.
gi was done with "ir", "high"-preset but -3/-1.
"lc" at 1250, rest default.
I also use "detail enhancement" with default settings.
for aa I use admc at 1/16, 0.005.

settings may be a bit high and rendertime was about 5 hours,
but nearly all materials use glossy reflections........

Shordy
11-11-2008, 09:34 AM
here is an update. Rendertime 8mins with vrayforc4d. There is more texture work needed.

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v4.jpg

Shordy
11-11-2008, 11:01 AM
i changed the light a bit...

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v5.jpg

HOOJK
11-11-2008, 11:53 AM
Cinema4D + VRay = :cool:

NAYAK33
11-11-2008, 02:24 PM
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/6187/naturalhistoryfinalsh1.th.jpg


First one with maya standart light and without any plugins. hope u like it

NAYAK33
11-11-2008, 02:31 PM
http://img353.imageshack.us/img353/1451/finaleveningmw9.th.jpg


Another one, evening scene first try

jeremybirn
11-11-2008, 03:32 PM
kamendola - Nice fish-eye lens look! If someone really had a fisheye lens in that room, he might be able to get a more interesting shot with it. Maybe he'd put the camera right near the head of one of the dinosaurs, looking up at it?

Huv - Welcome! That's looking great! I think the sky could be brighter, especially out the side window. There should be 2 colors of outdoor light: the direct sun (warmer) and the sky color for the fill. You can move the dinos if you want, so we aren't looking at the rear end of the t-rex. For the side hallways, maybe the lower ones could use a little fill light, and the upper ones could use a cooler sky color.

holle - That's great! For the lighting, the overall look is great, but I think you need to put in smaller lights to add fill to the side hallways, give a large sense of scale, add highlights to the glass displays, give rims and kicks to help shape and dinos. For the materials, the floor looks terrific, I like the little reflections near the door, maybe the floor could have more warm colors in it. Or the displays down below the dinos could have more warm earth tones? Somehow we don't want all red for the upper scene, then all blue down at the bottom, just from the material colors. The brick work looks great, but maybe in some places like the stairs in the foreground you could remove the lines between bricks, or shift the lines so they don't make it look as if the whole bannister were carved out of a solid peice of rock with brick lines moving into the railing between parts.

Shordy - Looking good! Maybe some atmosphere could reduce the contrast in the more distant parts for better scale. I wish we could see more of the dinos.

-jeremy

thisroomthatikeep
11-11-2008, 04:37 PM
Hi, these are my first pictures for this challenge and the first ones in these forums as well.

The first one is a render made with blender's internal renderer and some quickly done materials; and the second one is a composite, done with blender's nodes, of 5 test renders including the previous one.

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_ou3xTX_sP60/SRm-h_RhmFI/AAAAAAAAAPA/TkaO6CiPIhk/s800/013.jpg

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_ou3xTX_sP60/SRm-ix-xUCI/AAAAAAAAAPI/ELQvwy7ZnJo/s800/014.png

I've never worked with a scene this big before and I'm kinda lost, I'd appreciate any help you can give me. :hmm:

Shordy
11-11-2008, 05:23 PM
thank you for your feedback jeremy, i will try to change the camera a bit to see more from the dinos and less from the roof. I rendered also a athmosphere before my last post its a volume light rendering from c4d advanced renderer but it doesnt fit to the rendering from vrayforc4d because i used the vrayforc4d phys cam. the physcam from vray has some default lens effect and is shifting a bit so it dosnt match to advanced renderer output. Now i have to build a render setting without vray physcam. More post work :( But i think the atmosphere will be better.

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_fog.jpg

pixela
11-11-2008, 07:36 PM
@ fuhshizzle :
I want to ask about the glow effect around windows.
Did you make it during render or is it post-retouche?
Would you tell about it?

spurcell
11-11-2008, 08:54 PM
@ fuhshizzle :
I want to ask about the glow effect around windows.
Did you make it during render or is it post-retouche?
Would you tell about it?

just a simple post move in photoshop.

georgedrakakis
11-11-2008, 10:54 PM
hi,
this is such an interesting lighting challenge and lots of great images so far!
i got one question; is it ok to go for an NPR image?
these are my camera angles, a sequence of a hunting scene.
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/005.jpg
nothing special so far, default textures, and a sun-light (& a volumetric spot) to test the basic lighting & hard shadows.
i've used Cinema's 4D scan-line renderer (1 min / image).
regards,
george

BlenderFan
11-12-2008, 01:19 AM
If there are any Blender and Indigo users here, I was wondering if you could help me with a problem I am having. Because many of the object in this scene were mirrored, some of their scale values are negative. This doesn't matter to the Blender Internal Renderer, but it does matter to Indigo. In Indigo, the objects get moved to strange positions because of their scale values. Worse, if I try to correct the problem by making the scale values positive, the objects become unmirrored. This is compounded by the fact that many of the objects in the scene are linked duplicates, causing further rotation problems.

Does anyone know of a solution, or is anyone experiecing the same problem?

Thanks, I know that was long.

pixela
11-12-2008, 06:56 AM
thanks for the reply:)

Samo
11-12-2008, 07:31 AM
If there are any Blender and Indigo users here, I was wondering if you could help me with a problem I am having. Because many of the object in this scene were mirrored, some of their scale values are negative. This doesn't matter to the Blender Internal Renderer, but it does matter to Indigo. In Indigo, the objects get moved to strange positions because of their scale values. Worse, if I try to correct the problem by making the scale values positive, the objects become unmirrored. This is compounded by the fact that many of the objects in the scene are linked duplicates, causing further rotation problems.

Does anyone know of a solution, or is anyone experiecing the same problem?

Thanks, I know that was long.

That sounds more like an Indigo bug to me, I'm able to render this scene quite well with other Blender external engines.

One solution could be disabling instancing in those objects that are giving you problems, maybe this will fix your problem. Also you can import into an empty scene the OBJ version in Jeremy's page.

Huv
11-12-2008, 01:30 PM
Another try...
http://www.deltazone.org/~fc4d/images/huv_musee2bis.jpg

EricFerreira
11-12-2008, 01:52 PM
Hi Guys. This is my first participation in lighting challenger.:buttrock:

I having still serious problems with this scene (a lot of normal fliped), and to help my computer (Pentium4 Duo Core) doesn´t support this scene, so, very sorry by my image quality. In the next challenge I hope has a new computer.:D

I will do render this scene with another camera, and i will post it.

I'm using 3dsmax, with Mental Ray for lights sets and Combustion to make post-production.:twisted:

Coments are welcome.

Thanks.

Original Take from MentalRay, setup in very very ultra lowww
http://www.actiontv.com.br/cgtalk/original.jpg

Finish Take
http://www.actiontv.com.br/cgtalk/final07.jpg

MooseDog
11-12-2008, 07:26 PM
as always, just a ton of inspiration in these threads. thx for that.

the model of the t-rex just kinda struck me. just perfectly done, so i wanted my image to do it justice.

rendered with lightwave.

thx in advance for any critiques.

http://www.hudson-chathamwinery.com/private/natural_history_museum_final_small.png



(http://www.hudson-chathamwinery.com/private/natural_history_museum_final.png)

AndrewMarch
11-12-2008, 07:40 PM
I've been saying that I'd have a go at one of these for years now, so here's my first shot.

I would upload it but I can't work with a 97kb size restriction, what's the point of that!

If you want to see it, it's over at spinquad http://www.spinquad.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24196

Samo
11-12-2008, 07:50 PM
as always, just a ton of inspiration in these threads. thx for that.

the model of the t-rex just kinda struck me. just perfectly done, so i wanted my image to do it justice.

rendered with lightwave.

thx in advance for any critiques.
(http://www.hudson-chathamwinery.com/private/natural_history_museum_final.png)

MooseDog, the 'fence' sorrounding the dinosaurs is supposed to be glass, like in the original museum. Really nice render BTW.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnnypez/472701279/


http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=london+natural+history+museum

MooseDog
11-12-2008, 08:28 PM
thank you samo. i made it transparent, just not enough!! :) didn't think to check flickr for reference. thx for the heads-up.

as to the render, i forgot to add: lightwave internal render-engine, final gather radiosity for the fill light and bounces, a a third-party "distant" light for the sun, all leading to a beauty pass, a separate ambocc pass, a volumetric pass (not too successful honestly), all rendered out to 32-bit format for some fun with fusion.

georgedrakakis
11-12-2008, 09:06 PM
hi,
this is my attempt with Cinema's 4D Sketch & Toon module.
render time ~11mins @1280*720

Museum Sketch (http://picasaweb.google.gr/lh/photo/qT541GhPuUP9NuXXA7u5Rw?authkey=sLRB0K6fqQo)

regards,
george

Shordy
11-12-2008, 09:22 PM
here is an update. Some people are special they can fly.... I will get them down with magnetic shoes and a metal floor :)

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v9.jpg

here is a link to a bigger version
http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v9_hd.jpg

AnthonyC
11-12-2008, 10:36 PM
Hi all,

My first entry to the lighting challenge! Here's my work in progress, I chose this view because I like the composition. However,from this vantage point, you can't really see the dino skeletons, so I replaced it with a whale exhibition.
I'm using 3dmax with mental ray daylight system, sky portals and photometric lights. Render time is about 13 min.

JBrant
11-12-2008, 11:42 PM
AnthonyC,
I like your solution to the problem of not seeing the dinosaurs. Having a different exhibit definitly sets yours apart. It reminds me of the

New Heathrow Terminal ad (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zH2XGN3CGPI)

The whale is great but I think he's too high up in the rafters, too far from the floor...seems a bit unnatural for an exhibit. Maybe activate the space beneath him with more sea life exhibits. Alternatively you could scale him down a bit or scale up the dinosaurs until they're visible, nothing says that T-Rex can't be taller.

AnthonyC
11-13-2008, 12:05 AM
Hey thanks, that's a really cool commercial! I actually got the idea for the whale from the New York Natural History Museum...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/scalpel_sl/376522406/

I'll play with the scale, maybe add a giant squid...we'll see.

Shordy! The atmospheric effect and the addition of people liven up the scene nicely!

BlenderFan
11-13-2008, 01:05 AM
@samo: I fixed the problem by getting the .obj. Thank you.

holle
11-13-2008, 04:34 AM
hi there,

here an version with updated lights.
I think the color of the showscases and the "earth" in the showcases have still to be tweaked.

here the pure render:
http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/3649/lightchal1704vrayps0.th.jpg (http://img375.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lightchal1704vrayps0.jpg)http://img375.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

and here one tweaked with ps:
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/5278/lightchal1704vrayp1lz0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/lightchal1704vrayp1lz0.jpg/1/w1200.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img171/lightchal1704vrayp1lz0.jpg/1/)

Sealaender
11-13-2008, 05:46 AM
Alternate Sun Position.
Additional lights.
First attempt to Dino-texturing.

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/6148/museeum3uo0.th.jpg (http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=museeum3uo0.jpg)http://img520.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

EricFerreira
11-13-2008, 10:52 AM
Hi Guys, my new image, now with updates in, dino glass, light position, fliped faces.

Comments are welcome. :)

http://www.actiontv.com.br/cgtalk/final08.jpg

floze
11-13-2008, 12:26 PM
Looks fun, subscribed! :)

jeremybirn
11-13-2008, 03:10 PM
floze - Welcome!

EricFerreira - Welcome! Your image looks good! I think a few things about the lighting could be re-worked a little. Right now, the very highest contrast in the scene exists on the far wall. That takes away the sense of depth in the image, and makes the back wall appear closer to us. If you could put contrast and interest more in the foreground, and add more contrast and shadows to the dinos, the background could fade into lower contrast. The upper side hallways look as if they should have more fill/bounce light in them, indirectly coming from all those side windows. The floor could use a little reflectivity. The floor seems to get brighter off to the right side under the lower right arches, it should be brighter in the center and go darker off to the right.

Sealaender - Good start!

holle - A great image keeps getting better. I agree the colors of the displays could be tweaked warmer still. The alcoves going off to the right side on the lower floor could get darker, especially towards the back and corners. In the lower left, behind the t-rex, that alcove near the door could use a little bounce light. Upstairs, in the upper side hallways, I think some of the fill light from the sky could go more blue, and less green. I like the texture improvements you made on the bannister of the stairs in the foreground. Maybe the brick lines could also be removed from some of the round columns, so they don't all look as if they are carved into the same brick wall?

AnthonyC - Welcome aboard, that's a great start. The whale is nice. Maybe the right front side of his head could get more rim light from the windows? In the center foreground, the bright area in the corner of the stairs doesn't seem to have believable shadowing. I'd expect the stairs on the left to shadow the stairs on the right there more, and I'd expect the corner where they meet to go a bit darker. The sunbeam on the stairs themselves is great. The sunbeam on the whale and center hall looks as if the sun is going too horizontally, and maybe the sun itself could be shifted higher? There are some columns or something vertical that are going very bright on the set, unless those are going to look like lamps I think those could be turned down.

Shordy - Wow, that's great! The atmosphere, the people, the texture, all help bring the scene to life. I think the right foreground needs more shading and more occlusion, some of the surfaces facing us look almost as bright as the surfaces facing the windows to the left, and things could dark darker between the columns. The glass around the dinos needs work. I think you need some compromise on the ground shadows between the shadows the people cast, which are very dark and defined, and the shadows of the displays.

georgedrakakis - Keep going, the composition in the last one looks fine!

AndrewMarch - Welcome! If you're looking for places to host your images, so you can link them in-line with your posts here and not require people to have a password to see them, then try www.imageshack.com.

MooseDog - Nice image! Maybe you need more shadowing, and could do more with texture and reflections on the bones?

Huv - Nice shot! It seems as if the camera could aim a little more to the right, just so the head itself doesn't get cropped at the jaw. For the close-up dino, the texture almost looks more like leather or skin than bones. The other dino, on the left, could use some light on him, he's too dark to really see his shape. There are some very sharp reflections on the back windows and other glass, see if you can soften those or replace them with overall reflections of the room.

thisroomthatikeep - Nice job! The first one is the better of them, at least there's some color contrast between the warmer dinos and the cooler background. See if you can get some shadows or occlusion to help define where the arches meet the ceiling. For a dark scene with windows overhead, I'd expect the dinos to be top-lit more. See if you can get some reflections and highlights to add interest to the scene.

NAYAK33 - Welcome! Keep going with that!

-jeremy

EricFerreira
11-13-2008, 03:49 PM
Thanks Jeremy, I Will re-work this ilumination and pos production.

JCBug
11-13-2008, 05:22 PM
Shordy - Terrific ! So realistic, what a great job.

EricFerreira - I love your lighting and the very special ambiance. Wonderful !

Sealaender - Amazing, your textures are great !

georgedrakakis
11-13-2008, 08:58 PM
hi,
this challenge is a great place to learn & study lighting techniques!
lots of great images so far. one of the most impessive is the latest by Holle. the sunset mood is fabulus. can't wait for the next update!
this is little update, i've added an Ambient Occlusion pass, and started to add Sketch lines. so far only the dinos have sketch lines. their form is loose atm, but it;s ok for me, i want that watercolor loose effect, before i add more lines to define their shape.
regards,
george
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/009-1.jpg

badie
11-13-2008, 11:07 PM
Hi All Artists
My First Test Renders, With C4D R11, Advanced Render 3
Time renders around 14 mn & 20 mn, Resolution 1280*1024

badie
11-14-2008, 12:33 AM
new attempts, if I have enough time, I'll finish texturing… I'm so so busy :-(

badie
11-14-2008, 12:39 AM
my last tests

EricFerreira
11-14-2008, 01:16 AM
JCBug - Thanks man,:thumbsup: i will go to remake the passes to improve the final image still more:banghead: , i already made some tests on of the Jeremy´s comments, i really thought great.:buttrock:

:)

tomb
11-14-2008, 04:28 PM
Hey guys,
Good stuff in here. This is my current WIP I've been working on in downtime. Going for a spooky midnight vibe. Textures are basic for now. Stained-glass windows are not working right - have to investigate. Feedback welcome.



Rendered in Maya 8.5 with mental ray with final gathering. Slight color correction, grain and DOF added in PS.

http://www.lucid-cg.com/images/cg_challenge/nhm_light_v06_01_tb_small.jpg
click for larger img
(http://www.lucid-cg.com/images/cg_challenge/nhm_light_v06_01_tb_big.jpg)

zapper1998
11-14-2008, 05:01 PM
will have to render it out.....

massi131
11-14-2008, 05:06 PM
Hi All
My First Test Renders, With C4D R11, Advanced Render 3
Time renders around 24 min .i used glow and volumetric light

massi131
11-14-2008, 05:11 PM
second render

M.Blues
11-14-2008, 08:01 PM
Hey everybody.
Some really nice pictures already.
I thought i give also a try at this competition
Rendering done in Fry and some post work

niEt0
11-14-2008, 09:13 PM
Hi there,
I have some problems with the 3DSMax file, can anyone post a new 3DSMax copy of it that runs under 3DSMAX 9 (64bits)?

I tried to download the file a couple of times, opening the OBJ file in Maya and exporting it, also in DXF... and any of them works on my 3DSMax.

Thanks in advance!!

BTW ... great challenging and participants!


cu,
Luis.

badie
11-14-2008, 09:42 PM
another little try, but with VRay…
http://www.deltazone.org/~fc4d/images/badie_Chall17_VRay1.jpg

badie
11-14-2008, 10:31 PM
:bounce: Lazzhar U'r Work Is INcredible !! :love: :applause:
Moosedog Great Image
& many amzing others artists : Shordy, Holle, Phil-roberts, massi, Huv…

holle
11-15-2008, 04:10 AM
hi there,

here another update.
I tweak the light and some materials for the showcases, the dirt (under the dinos)
and I also use a new texture for some parts of the walls.

here the orig. rendering:
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/1610/lightchal1705vraybh7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

and here one version with a little post in ps:
http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/4559/lightchal1705vrayp1mq3.jpg

massi131
11-15-2008, 07:40 AM
another little try

[/url][url="http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nh3xq5.jpg"]http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/5563/nh3xq5.th.jpg (http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nh3xq5.jpg)http://img529.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
http://img296.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

R-eon
11-15-2008, 03:31 PM
Hi all,

First, sorry for my bad English ...

Great works here !

Well, this is my first participation to a CGTalk Challenge.
I have used C4D R10 with VRay.
For the lights, i've used 6 area lights and 8 spot lights.
The scene was rendered in with low quality GI preset in 1280/960 and it took approximately 2 hours in 200 dpi settings.

Hope you like it.

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/5338/lightchallengelondonmusru5.th.jpg (http://img119.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lightchallengelondonmusru5.jpg)http://img119.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
http://img87.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

Controller51
11-15-2008, 09:16 PM
Hi there!

First rough lighting test without materials - except the floor and the bones. Rendered with 3DSMAX, Vray and little Photoshop postwork. (Glow/Volumelight.)

Greetings from Germany...

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/7983/comp2cv8.jpg

dietpillpyramidscheme
11-16-2008, 05:00 AM
My attempts thus far have been poor at best, would any of the experts/winners of this challenge be willing to post some tips / tutorial on how they achieved their look, once the competition has closed?

Shordy
11-16-2008, 04:49 PM
next update

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v12.jpg

hd here
http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v12_hd.jpg

jeremybirn
11-17-2008, 01:15 AM
Shordy - Nice job! I think the black levels are darker in some of the people than their environment. Especially in the left side hallway, I feel as if the hall gets a fair amount of fill and bounce light, but the people don't. If the people are rendered on a separate layer then within the area they occupy you might try fading between the people and a blurred copy of what's behind them, just to see what percentage you can go to that makes them look better integrated. The stuff on the far back wall (very dark lamps, signs with bright reflections on them) could all be made more subtle. I think the dinos themselves could use more contrast though, maybe getting brighter on the top.

Controller51 - Welcome! That's a great start! I love it! The reflection on the floor of the column in the foreground seems to be brighter than the column itself, that doesn't seem believable to me. I like the reflections on the floor, the glass could also use some reflections or refraction. Maybe the walls behind the dinos don't need to glow so much, it makes it look like there are halos around them. Most of the lighting is very natural, I like the under-lighting on the t-rex.

R-eon - Welcome! That looks great! Really nice feeling! I think it looks like some of the lights aren't shadowing, make sure all the models cast shadows in all of the lights. You could do more with all the reflective surfaces in the scene. Perhaps a little bit of rim light could illuminate some parts of the dinos, just to help them pop out better?

massi131 - Looking good! The upper half, especially the upper left of the image needs a little more interest if you're going to keep this composition, maybe the area under the stairs on the left could go a lot darker, and you could work on the reflections? You're allowed to move objects around if it suits you, if we could get a better look at the triceratops, or the skulls in the case, that might add to the shot.

holle - That's terrific! Looking really polished now! In the lower left corner, it seems as if the brick bump map might be backwards, bumping out instead of in? And just to the right of it, is the tube that starts there supposed to be a hand-rail, or a part of the stone? Most of the hall is looking good. It's hard to see what's in the glass display cases, maybe at least for the closer one you could make the stuff show-up somehow. Some of the signs could use some mapping work. The dino facing away from us, it might be good to turn him around 180 degrees, or at least rotate his head towards the other dino.

badie - That's great! A lot of the materials need work (the glass around the displays, the columns which look like chrome now) but you probably know that. I'd love to see some more top-down lighting on both dinos.

M.Blues - Nice job! The glass looks a little too solidly reflective in places, especially on the left side where it reflects the dino display, that's confusing. Some highlights to demarkate the edge of the glass could help too. The dinos could use a little more shaping, if they could get darker on the bottom then the top-light would provide more contrast.

tomb - Welcome! Wow! That's great! I love the feeling of your night scene! I wonder if you could push-in a little more on the dinos, just because you'd get enough negative space around them already without that extra black space on the left. I'd love to put some more specular highlights and rim light onto the top and backs of the dinos, just about the level that the row of rectangles on the middle right of the image hits. Keep going on those textures, too.

georgedrakakis - That's interesting. There doesn't seem to be much shaping on the dinos, they look very flatly lit. Maybe you are going for some look that doesn't involve much lighting and you'll add defining lines? If you're going fo rlighting I'd like to see more of a gradient on the back wall as well, so there aren't as many areas that are flat, solid tones.

-jeremy

chickenkts
11-17-2008, 08:50 AM
Hi everybody, here is my try, hope u like that
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3179/3037918858_d8f6a65849.jpg?v=0

wasimattar
11-17-2008, 09:36 AM
This is what i have made in Autoesk Maya with mental ray rendering it took me around 7:21 to render it i 320x240 resolution:
Option 1

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk28/wasimattar/Nationalhistory_Option1.jpg

Otpion 2
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk28/wasimattar/Nationalhistory_Option2.jpg

ShamKiR
11-17-2008, 12:00 PM
Hi all. Good works. My experemental stuff
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8053/dinoexample1cn7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img60.imageshack.us/img60/3773/dinoexampleap7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Maya,MentalRAy

Kunotaku
11-17-2008, 12:15 PM
Hellow, this is my first try on this challenge, it was rendered in Maya with mental ray.


http://i488.photobucket.com/albums/rr243/Vizar/0011_2.jpg

PauloRenato
11-17-2008, 01:30 PM
Hi all, this is my participation. I didn't have concern with the textures.
Render in Lightwave, Radiosity Final Gather and PS.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3244/3037502039_331a604d00_o.jpg

eric P
11-17-2008, 02:10 PM
No offense but,
It's more like "GI challenge" then a "Lighting challenge".
Look's like nowadays everybody try to light with GI instead of doing traditional lighting.
Production wise i don't know if any of these will be efficent considering,render time,flickering,sampling,last minute tweak....etc
I'm no saying that GI is bad but,it's like running before learning how to walk.

My two cent's.

Eric.

holle
11-17-2008, 02:27 PM
No offense but,
It's more like "GI challenge" then a "Lighting challenge".
Look's like nowadays everybody try to light with GI instead of doing traditional lighting.
Production wise i don't know if any of these will be efficent considering,render time,flickering,sampling,last minute tweak....etc
I'm no saying that GI is bad but,it's like running before learning how to walk.

My two cent's.

Eric.

hi eric.

I think, for rendering a still, gi is the simpliest and best-looking way to do the job.
when it comes to animation, maybe setting up the light "by hand" can save much time at rendering.

maybe we make anytime a challenge with the task to animate the scene?

just my 2 cents.

jeremybirn
11-17-2008, 02:33 PM
eric P - Welcome! I look forwards to seeing an entry from you -- it sounds as if you already have preferences about which render settings you want to use. If you want to post constructive criticism of someone else's work that's always appreciated too!

PauloRenato - Good start! I think a little more shaping and light on the top of the dinos could help. Hope you can fix the normals on that glass around the t-rex!

ShamKiR - Good start! The top one reads much better.

wasimattar - Welcome! Keep going with those. Option 2 has a brighter wall behind the dark dino and looks more clear to me.

chickenkts - Good start! I think the optical effect with the rays from the sun are a bit much. Maybe you could get rid of those, and focus on adding rim light from the sun to outline the back-lit dinosaur, really giving him a lot of contrast? Some shadows on the floor under him would help too.

-jeremy

Chrisdc
11-17-2008, 06:10 PM
Hi, here's my first attemp at the scene. I've rendered this in Lightwave with 3 bounces of GI, procedural textures (for the time being at least), and a great big volumtric effect. This is also my first attempt at using a linear workflow.
http://chrisdc.com/forums/7.jpg

Render time was 27 minutes and post production was done in Photoshop.

Thanks for your comments,

Chris

BlenderFan
11-17-2008, 09:46 PM
This is my progress so far. I used just Blender for this image. I am particularly looking for advice on how to give the dinosaurs a mencacing appearance.

Thanks.

http://home.comcast.net/%7Escimaster/Natural%20History.jpg

Fex
11-17-2008, 09:57 PM
another try, now without gi but a bit of post
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t271/fexa/n_hist_04_.jpg

georgedrakakis
11-17-2008, 10:35 PM
georgedrakakis - That's interesting. There doesn't seem to be much shaping on the dinos, they look very flatly lit. Maybe you are going for some look that doesn't involve much lighting and you'll add defining lines? If you're going fo rlighting I'd like to see more of a gradient on the back wall as well, so there aren't as many areas that are flat, solid tones.
-jeremy
hi jeremy,
tnx for your kind words.
you are 1000% correct on every comment of yours!!!
see attached the update with a bit more detailed t-rex mesh sketch-lines & texturing, and yes the lighting is super flat, i'll have to re-light everything from scratch.


this is a little update.
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/013.jpg
i am having a hard time with the stone texture (i can't decide if it's gonna be ink-hatched or water-colored-like) so i left it as it was.
i've worked on the t-rex and it's sketching.
i want the lines overshooted, not exactly following the shape, to give the impression of movement.
i've used the same color of sketch-lines for the arc metal structure too. to my eyes there are a lot of similarities between these delicate skeletons; the t-rex & the supporting arcs.
probably these will be the only sketched meshes in the final composition.


and this is a b/w preview render with my re-lighting/composition set-up.
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/014_lighting.jpg
it;s not a GI render, so i've used a sun-light along with rectangular shaped bounce lights.
the sun aims the trikeratops, shining from the right top corner.
the body of the t-rex is aligned (well, not exactly) with this diagonal direction also.
everything that;s above this diagonal is yellowish and everything that;s below is bluish, hoping that i'll get interesting gradients and add more depth to the image.

ps: and a preview of my teeth camera
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/015-1.jpg
regards,
george

R-eon
11-17-2008, 10:37 PM
Hi all !!

As Jeremy wrote, I've tried to work another picture with new settings and a little postwork with photoshop.

The first version : http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/9862/lightchallengelondonmusrf2.th.jpg (http://img101.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lightchallengelondonmusrf2.jpg)http://img101.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)


And the new picture : http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/5919/lightchallengelondonmusor6.th.jpg (http://img233.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lightchallengelondonmusor6.jpg)http://img233.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

artefactum
11-17-2008, 10:44 PM
HI! I found this so challenging: I try it!

Here's my first test: http://www.artefactum.com/3drender/Natural_History_first_test.jpg

About 2 hours work. 3DSMAX + MentalRay + FG, default materials in the downloaded file, except window opacity, floor and T-rex (lighten). Rendering time: 1h13m on quad 3.1 ghz. (with render 2 sided for all).

Thanks for your comments!

Artefactum

PS How can I copy the image in the message???

baochao
11-18-2008, 07:31 AM
hi everyone!
this is my first try on this challenge.Rendered with max,mental ray and little Photoshop postwork.
i used daylight,sky portal,GI+FG+AO and glare shader
http://baochao.hxsdblog.com/files/2008/11/mentalray_final.jpg

ShamKiR
11-18-2008, 08:14 AM
ShamKiR - Good start! The top one reads much better.


Thank a lot ! But I want to hear some advices how to make it much better and natural look :)
By the way some shoots again :)
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/3843/dinoexample2vn8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/4057/dinoexample3hg6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

eric P
11-18-2008, 09:33 AM
eric P - Welcome! I look forwards to seeing an entry from you -- it sounds as if you already have preferences about which render settings you want to use. If you want to post constructive criticism of someone else's work that's always appreciated too!

I would like to participate more, but right now work is taking to much time and energy.

But i'm looking at all challenge entry, and it's really nice from you to help people.
The books are really instructive to.


Cheers.

eric.

wasimattar
11-18-2008, 10:05 AM
Hi
This is my first take on texturing i will upload the updates asap.....
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk28/wasimattar/texture_01big.jpg

threedl
11-18-2008, 12:15 PM
Hi guys,
I'm new on this forum but I've decided to show what is possible to do with Lightwave and Kray renderer....the image on the bottom was rendered with a rough setup regarding the textures and a spotlight for the sun with a background gradient texture 300% opacity and GI radiosity...resolution 1440x1152 in 29 minutes on a dual quad xeon 2.66 ...you can download a little animation (4Mb) at the address: www.3dlvisualisation.com.au/museum.avi (http://www.3dlvisualisation.com.au/museum.avi) ..time per frame 15 minutes on average with 3level of fullscreen AA (same resolution mentioned before) and downsized to 720x576 (PAL standard)...the image has been willingly done a bit dark to fully get all the details of this beatiful model...I hope you'll like ithttp://www.3dlvisualisation.com.au/anim01.jpeg

ramses2028
11-18-2008, 01:52 PM
Hi guys,

Here is mine, rendered in Cinema4D, Advanced render 3, minor postwork on photoshop :

http://bblproductions.fr/museum2.jpg

Avgette
11-18-2008, 02:31 PM
Wow this scene is amazing.
I will try to make this challenge it could be interesting to work on this.
Fuhshizzle I love the atmosphere you create.

artefactum
11-18-2008, 02:45 PM
Here's my second test:http://www.artefactum.com/3drender/Natural_History_second_test.jpg

Added a light on the triceratop, ajusted camera angle. Glass material.

The lighting setup goal is to make the two dynos as in a battle position. So focus point is on the T-Rex with the sunlight and the Triceratop with a strong bounce light (simulated). So trying to keep the museum architecture not too present but spectacular by the point of view.

In file: daylight system (mrSun and mrSky) and the bounce light on the triceratop. No other light.

3DSMAX + MentalRay + FG, default materials in the downloaded file, except window opacity, floor and T-rex (lighten). Rendering time: about 2h00 on quad 3.1 ghz. (with render 2 sided for all and better FG).

Thanks for your comments!

Steven

EricFerreira
11-18-2008, 03:01 PM
Hi guys, so, my last render!

I Remake all ilumination, and now somes textures are much better!

Comments are welcome!

http://www.actiontv.com.br/cgtalk/final011.jpg

e-maje
11-18-2008, 04:15 PM
Hello,

Here is my small contribution, the museum at night.
I use XSI 6.5 only.

http://www.xsilounge.com/tuts/Natural_History.jpg

I have a small question: I see that many changes the framing of origin, it is not common to everyone ?


GeD ;)

zeitgenosse
11-18-2008, 06:52 PM
hi all,

here is my first try to participate on this challenge.
i couldn´t resist as i saw the model, i like the old style of the builing.
so here is one of the first results. i have to improve a lot of things - however, thats the beginning


i try to catch the mood of a early morning cloudy bad weathered sky - someone has switched on the lights in the alcoves - and suddnly the sun breakes throug the clouds and lits the scene.



let me know your comments please.


leo

http://www.raumflug.de/leo/cgtalk_Lch_MuseumofHistory_34_0007aweb.jpg

modelyna
11-18-2008, 10:33 PM
Hello everybody,

Since everybody uses very modern and sophisticated renderers, I've decided to play old school: no GI, only two lamps, internal post-processing. Free renderer (I wonder if you can guess which one:) ?).

greetings to everybody, your works are fantastic!

http://klik.pl/museum.jpg

zero08
11-19-2008, 05:09 AM
Hi everyone,

This is my first time to participate in the challenge and i saw lots of good stuff already, well this is my first attempt and its very rough. please feel free to give critiques and ideas. thanks

http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo213/zero08_photo/1st_stage.jpg

Shordy
11-19-2008, 08:14 AM
thx again jeremy for your comments! The people are 3d and not layered.

i got vrayforc4d 1.1 and changed the lighting and gamma a bit. The People have strange saturated faces thats because of bad textures, i will correct this later in post...

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v15.jpg

wasimattar
11-19-2008, 09:45 AM
Hi
Tweaked the scene light a bit and also uploading some passes of light that I have used for lighting up the scene as i have not used any mental ray feature just default lights to get the output so far.....

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk28/wasimattar/PassesLayers.jpg
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk28/wasimattar/texture_02big.jpg

massi131
11-19-2008, 10:13 AM
another try.Cinema 4D and AR3.Need a lot of work on light and texture.

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/9399/nh4ag5.th.jpg (http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nh4ag5.jpg)http://img359.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)


http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/5893/nh5hk8.th.jpg (http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nh5hk8.jpg)http://img440.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/6520/nh6ic5.th.jpg (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nh6ic5.jpg)http://img167.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

rockmetalray
11-19-2008, 11:06 AM
Hi, I want to join in on this. Having used Vray for quite a time, i figure its time to get more into Mental ray again. Havent used it for years. So I want the units in the scene to be exact since this is crucial for understanding lighting.

How do max users cope with the %#%!&% inches and whatnot system? I want this scene in metric measures (thats millimeters). I hoped it would work without scaling the objects.I'm stuck here...cant seem to get it right. feeling pretty dumb here..any tips anyone?

zero08
11-19-2008, 01:29 PM
Hi Jeremy and everyone,

This is my second image. I used physical sun then i added point lights for the other parts of the interior. feel free to give comments. thank you :)

http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo213/zero08_photo/image_04.jpg

zenerry
11-19-2008, 02:46 PM
i like the marble you have used in your scene it is really good!
Good job!!

sklioness
11-19-2008, 02:54 PM
yeahh right its a GI challenge ... like based on the gallery of previous challenge -the light house..it was a compositing challenge ... as no image of good basic lighting got featured ..

anyways goodluck ..

mmoses00
11-19-2008, 03:18 PM
skilioness,


Yes, there have been "Works in Progress" posted here that show GI only... mainly for getting feedback on render times and settings. But people are now getting to the texturing, which is a massive undertaking, since nothing is textured or has UV's and there are thousands of parts.
There is a lot of room for creativity in this model space, and the GI part is only the start. I think this challenge is a very good example of what a TD might be handed in a real production environment, where they are expected to be able to finish the scene given ONLY the basic model. It is also a massive challenge just to tweak GI settings to something that is doable in a real production. Texturing is integral to lighting, so again, excellent test for aspiring TD's. Then, finally, composition and mood... and trying different lighting setups is a real challenge.

As for Lighthouse, I produced six totally different lighting scenarios (link (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=5423824&postcount=226)), and they were made from a single beauty, a background pass, and Z depth pass - Hardly a compositing test. It was all about lighting for different looks, and the subject suited well to that task.

These challenges are meant to test/challenge people interested in producing compelling 3D images, specifically the challenges that might be faced by people working as Lighting Technical Directors. That position requires skills in art & cinematography, and multiple 3D disciplines, including modeling, animating, texturing/shading, rendering, and compositing .... with actually placing, adjusting, and turning on the lights being one of the last things worked on before rendering. (these are some of the reasons that good Lighting TD's are nearly impossible to find)

I am just saying, people post here to get feedback related to their progress on the lighting challenges, and see how they compare to others' work. The challenge is to actually post something, which I applaud everyone for their efforts.

visua
11-19-2008, 03:23 PM
Matt Moses:

Word, I can't agree with you more ;)
If some people think that turning on GI and hit the renderbutton is
enough to render kickass images, they couldn't be more wrong.

My two cents.

e-maje
11-19-2008, 03:25 PM
Hello

Pass GI
Pass Lights Low
Pass Lights Hight
Pass Lights Back
Pass Lights Dyno
Pass Depth
Pass Occlusion
Make on Softimage|XSI 6.5.

I have just as a basis to do something "beautiful" (it is up to you to judge) with what I have. I just restored transparency to the glasses, I did not hit other textures.

http://www.xsilounge.com/tuts/Natural_History_M.jpg

GeD

mmoses00
11-19-2008, 04:08 PM
One more response to those that feel using GI is cheating or that this is just a GI challenge, or that using GI is a fallback to make up for good lighting design.

1. Everything in 3D is cheating!
2. GI can now be computed on our home machines rather quickly, why not use it?

That said, there are some tech hurdles to overcome to make use of GI on a moving shot. GI will flicker badly if one does not either crank the settings too high to be practical for home rendering, or you can write out the lighting solution to files (one file per frame) and then render the shot using that lighting model. Using this method, you have to re-write/compute the lighting model if any changes to the scene lights, and it also does not work very well if objects are moving thru the scene and affecting the light in the room, or if lights are animated.
Personally, I would use GI and creative lighting to light for the shot, ignoring the rest of the room. Then I would probably camera map almost everything, by rendering a single high quality frame and mapping it over the walls, etc. Things that need reflections and such can be a separate REFL pass, or can be rendered within the camera-mapped scene. Camera mapping most of the room allows for final render times on a moving shot of a few seconds per frame. The GI gets me my base lighting, especially in subtle falloff and bounce fill light, then basic cinematography kicks in, where you need to produce the mood of the shot. Try an create a story using camera angles, composition, Depth of Field, a character placement, or lighting cue.

I suggest that people interested in vfx lighting try to tackle this scene practically, where you need to allow for practical render times. This approach keeps you thinking creatively to mimic the complex lighting needed in an enviro like this, rather than waiting for the computer to calculate for hours... and render you into a corner.

e-maje
11-19-2008, 04:23 PM
I am the goal that illuminate the museum as I would like to be informed, to create a staging light, as a makeup.
I agree that GI is going on a pass from base. Then I dressed my scene as I would have done with real spots.

When I work I often team the following dilemma: I have a scene in which each parameter were accepted (modeling, placement of the camera and textures) and my job is to make something beautiful to watch without changing anything.

At first I set a goal of no change eccept restore transparency
GeD ;)

jojo1975
11-19-2008, 07:14 PM
Hello to all I've a question. I've started putting lights, and everything is going fine.
I've added shaders. and for now everything ok (just to look howe the color in the scene change), then I started UVmapping and here comes the pain :(
both vray and mray crash :(
I'm using windows vista 32, 3dsmax 2009, with a qaud 9300 + 4 G ram, so I guess it's not a memory issues. If anyone can give any help I will be very happy to know :)
jojo

Samo
11-19-2008, 08:12 PM
right its a GI challenge...

This is an interesting debate nonetheless, this is the scene which GI is used the most in. Or at least the GI look is more evident than in other contests, because of the huge central hall. The problem in my opinion is that, whereas in professional environments GI is just another tool with a relative impact in the final result, in our renders seems that GI does most of the work, it takes all the protagonism.

Maybe we should use some lighting tricks to focus the observer's attention in other features than the overall soft shadows.

Another solution to that could be breaking down the lighting tasks and let the GI pass solve only one of the tasks proposed.

artefactum
11-19-2008, 08:13 PM
Hi jojo1975,

I think that it's a memory issue. 32 bits OS with big file in 3DSMAX is a crash recipe!
Do you have lots of hires textures loaded, many lights with shadow map?
You can try render your scene and check in the task manager 3DSMAX memory usage while loading scene assets.

64 bits OS with 3DSMAX 64 bits will render the scene without problem.

Steven

Samo
11-19-2008, 08:38 PM
Hello to all I've a question. I've started putting lights, and everything is going fine.
I've added shaders. and for now everything ok (just to look howe the color in the scene change), then I started UVmapping and here comes the pain :(
both vray and mray crash :(
I'm using windows vista 32, 3dsmax 2009, with a qaud 9300 + 4 G ram, so I guess it's not a memory issues. If anyone can give any help I will be very happy to know :)
jojo

There have been other people with issues about the UV mapping, my question are
do the objects already have UV mapping data before you edit them?
could you delete all the objects UV mapping data at once, and start fresh from scratch?

kanooshka
11-19-2008, 09:50 PM
Hi everyone, great work so far! I hope to post within the next couple days but until then here's some critiques!

e-mage: Hi e-mage thanks for the breakdown! The one thing I would like to see is more continuity between the lighting on the dinosaurs and the lighting on the architecture because the white balance is very deceiving. The pure white vs. vibrant orange for artificial lighting just seems a little too extreme.

zero-08: Great work! I'd like to see a stronger intensity from the sun to create a little more contrast. I look forward to the next version!

massi131: Fantastic! In your first image the Tyranausaurus doesn't appear to be in contact with the platform he's standing on you might want to make sure there's a contact shadow. Also, the texture on the staircase railing may feel more natural if the uv's were rotated to match the angle of the bricks. I love the sense on your 3rd image, good use of bokeh! Finally, on all 3 of your images the glass' edge goes very black, try increasing your tracedepth.

wasimatter: Good work! It looks like you have a good start to your lighting setup. I'd like to see some more play with light color. There also seems to be some strange lighting on the roof. There's what appears to be a cone of white light that ends abruptly. Also, I would expect that where the roof meets the far wall to have a very similar intensity value.

Shordy: Amazing! Great textures, great lighting, everything seems pretty fantastic. My one critique would be that the glass looks like it might be a bit too diffuse and could use more reflection. Good work!

zero08: Welcome to the challenge! Right now I feel the dinosaur bones blend into the background. I think this could be fixed by either changing the light angle, decreasing the amount of fill light on the wall or changing the diffuse color of the bones or wall. I'm not entirely sure what the yellow on the bones is, sunlight?, translucency? If it is sunlight I think it should be much stronger. Keep it up!

Leotril
11-20-2008, 02:07 AM
i tweak the light a bit specially the diffuse light from the sky im using for this kinda cloudy hdr image for the sky not so clear its nightime or daylight .. also added some shader for the floor and stairs and volume lights with litlle fog..

about the lighting coulb be kinda spooky gothic thing and the new perspective add to it for sure .. only the beauty pass tweak a bit in ps underexposed ill try to remaim the contrast of the original render

the rendertime 2 hours nothing baked .. q6600 2 GB of ddr3 mem

http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/Museo/2dtexture41K3apost.jpg
click for 1K (http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/Museo/2dtexture41K3post.jpg) original render (http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/Museo/2dtexture41K.jpg)

Leotril
11-20-2008, 03:33 AM
I think if ur very skill in lighting u dont need GI, just the occ pass , some on the of the renders posted in here are using that very clear gi default look , clay render kinda look ..some of them look arch type renders very bright daylight look..uset it ..but dont forget about direct lights dont let gi make all the work for you..

my skill is lakking on bounce lights so ilet gi help me with that.. and the occ pass. also diffuse from the sky in some cases in others i use a group of lights especialy on interiors..

some of the challenges here really need it .. not this one.. but lets say the neon challenge .

some comments :

Chrisdc: man this kinda make go daily i think u completely nailed.. the dino shader needs some work is laking difuse or is to dark.

ramses2028: love the Dof. i like ur textures .. needs more indirec light and some fog maybe.

massi131: looking good .. i like the dino closeup one also ..the dino shader is looking kinda white

zeitgenosse: nice colors. i ike to see some shader on the dino

modelyna: nice one .. it looks mr to me :hmm:

Shordy: nice textures.. nice scene overall .. fix the white shaders.

qbaqba
11-20-2008, 04:12 AM
Hello,
I've been tracking your " Lighting Challenges (http://forums.cgsociety.org/forumdisplay.php?f=185)" since a few months, but when I saw the Natural History scene I just couldn't not to join to you :). I've been working in 2D for 10 years and learning 3D for 1,5 years. I'm sending just a initial project without textures, only composition, arrangement of lights and an idea. Draft in 2D is just preview futher work.

Technical data:
MacPro 8x3Gh
6GB RAM
Vista
Lightwave
Radiosity, MonteCarlo, Interpolated

http://qbaqba.cgsociety.org/gallery/698835/
http://qbaqba.cgsociety.org/gallery/698835/

Regards
Kuba Lakomiec

Jozvex
11-20-2008, 04:43 AM
I think if ur very skill in lighting u dont need GI, just the occ pass , some on the of the renders posted in here are using that very clear gi default look , clay render kinda look ..some of them look arch type renders very bright daylight look..uset it ..but dont forget about direct lights dont let gi make all the work for you..

It's true that GI gives you a lot for 'free', but don't forget that all photographers and film makers use GI for all of their live action movies! In fact they have no choice. They get full GI from nature and yet still control their lighting exactly as they like. You're right that some people rely too much on GI, but instead of suggesting that skilled lighters don't need GI, I think it's better for people learn how to *light well with GI*.

:shrug:

modelyna
11-20-2008, 07:45 AM
[..]
modelyna: nice one .. it looks mr to me :hmm:
[..]


Thank you for the comment.
Well, I guess mental ray is not free renderer (yet?:) )

This one is of course blender internal - basically all scene is set with sun lamp, sky lamp and carefully choosen AO parameters. Thus it renders quickly, no flickering in animations (no GI).

wasimattar
11-20-2008, 07:46 AM
hi
Done some post fx and texture has been updated will upload the new upload soon......
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk28/wasimattar/texture_03big.jpg

jojo1975
11-20-2008, 01:33 PM
I dont' know but it doesnt' seem a memory issues.
Mental ray tell me that canno allocate memory, even if the memory of PC is free :( while vray gives crash while changing camera.
I probably will try a procedural brick, but I have no idea. Any help appreciated :(
I like this competition and i will be glad to continue it
For now vray sun, vray override materials, texture of 1500x1500 in diffuse slot
file:///C:/Users/Giorgio/AppData/Local/Temp/moz-screenshot.jpghttp://www.giorgioluciano.net/CgTalk/1.jpg
http://www.giorgioluciano.net/CgTalk/2.jpg
spec 3ds max 2009

georgedrakakis
11-20-2008, 07:45 PM
hi,
lots of great images here!
this is a little update of my sketchy approach.
the image is a straight output from the render engine of Cinema4D,
but with some post-effect applied such Sketch&Toon, Ambient Occlusion, Highlights, and LSD (noise, coloration & desaturation driven by z-buffer).
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/022.jpg

Zocky
11-20-2008, 09:39 PM
I was thinking of joining this competition, it's the best way to learn if you ask me.
But, i'm a complete noob to lighting, so i don't know if it's appropriate for me to join? i'd like to join, but i'm nowhere near as good as other people here. You think it would be ok for me to join or?

If so, i assume those models needs to be textured too, and they have no uvmap, right? Alos, do i post my WIP in this thread or?

tnx.

--edited--
oh, and can i create my own models too, or do i strictly use only these models?

modelyna
11-20-2008, 10:19 PM
Well, I've decided to put Dino back into scene. He's running so fast, I took the picture from behind;).
What do you think?
http://klik.pl/museum2.jpg

kanooshka
11-21-2008, 01:22 AM
Hi Zocky come join in! Anyone's welcome at any skill level. The best way to learn is by getting critiques and what better place than here!

You can add models, you can move models you can add textures or whatnot, but a simple scene can be made a great scene with great lighting.

jojo1975
11-21-2008, 08:49 AM
@ modelyna, which renderer did you use ? it seems renderman :)

reinhart82
11-21-2008, 09:27 AM
Hi. 1st time joining this lighting challenge. Saw alot of great renders so far:) Below is a render of my shot.Going for a night scene. Using 3ds max 9. Mental ray.Using an occlusion map. Rendertime about 5min 24 sec. Havent on the raytrace(only the ground is on) or volume lights yet as they will slow down the render by alot. Running on a Core 2 duo 1.86ghz 4gig ram. C&C are welcome:)

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/7196/nhmuseum01qp3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

(http://g.imageshack.us/img525/nhmuseum01qp3.jpg/1/)

georgedrakakis
11-21-2008, 09:36 AM
Hi. 1st time joining this lighting challenge. Saw alot of great renders so far:) Below is a render of my shot.Going for a night scene. Using 3ds max 9. Mental ray.Using an occlusion map. Rendertime about 5min 24 sec. Havent on the raytrace(only the ground is on) or volume lights yet as they will slow down the render by alot. Running on a Core 2 duo 1.86ghz 4gig ram. C&C are welcome:)

hi,
i really like the mood and the way that little details from the mesh gradually reveal. the arched windows with the lights are perfect as they are! i would expect this kind of treatment for the roof parts as well. it's still a bit dark, but i guess this is mainly cause you have just started. the shaders look great so far. keep it up!

modelyna
11-21-2008, 09:57 AM
@ modelyna, which renderer did you use ? it seems renderman :)

As mentioned before, I've used blender internal renderer - to be honest it's just kind of scientific experiment:) but I think it turns out nice.

Normally in architectural lighting, as in this museum scene, I would rather use mental ray.

COBRASoft
11-21-2008, 01:01 PM
Hey all,

As an amateur, I'm very impressed with all these images. Great job everyone!

I was so impressed that I wanted to give this a try myself once. This is done with LW 9.5.1 and took about 3h40m to render at this quality and resolution. Light is done by a blueish dome light, an area light for the 'sun' and 4 spherical lights at the back in the dark areas. I used Final Gather Interpolated with 8 bounces. 300 primary rays and 100 secundary. AS set to 0.05, OS at 0.1 and AA at 8.

http://www.newtek.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=66272&d=1227275499

C&C welcome :)

Greetings,
Sigurd

PauloRenato
11-21-2008, 04:44 PM
Hi all, more 2 renders. I've used LW 9.5 internal renderer.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3143/3048594652_fccd41a637_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3070/3048594870_15fa922837_o.jpg

DuttyFoot
11-22-2008, 12:49 AM
wow, i am blown away at some of the renders that you guys have posted so far. i need to download the scene and jump in with you guys. this will be my first lighting challenge.

Luthias
11-22-2008, 01:27 AM
Here is an update for my enteryhttp://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn127/Luthias42/materialstart03.jpg

fuzzylizard
11-22-2008, 03:52 AM
After what must be a thousand renders, here is the first image worthy of being posted (I hope). This is my first attempt at lighting, texturing, and rendering a scene of this size and complexity.

App: Modo 302
Rendering setup: GI with 4 bounces
Render Time: ~2hrs
Light set up: physical sky with sun

http://upload.fuzzylizard.com/Natural_History-GI_sun-v6-2.png

Critiques welcomed as I still have tonnes to learn.

ShamKiR
11-22-2008, 08:03 AM
HI all Im again ) . This time I tryed to use VRay for Maya for this challenge. It is the first time I used VRay and not so familiar with it so the result is not satisfied me because it is take too much time to render the scene (may be wrong settings I don`t know :blush: ) It takes a 1h45min to render this shot with GI and VRay Sky
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/3918/dinoexamplevraygz1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
So Mental Rulezz for me :buttrock:

vinc3nt12
11-22-2008, 08:07 AM
hi. i tried opening the .max file, but i was getting an error "Unknown Class"

any ideas guys? Im using 3ds max 8 btw. :) Thanks.

visua
11-22-2008, 10:21 AM
ShamKiR: Very nice angle though, keep at it!
(http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=305319)

kanooshka
11-22-2008, 02:48 PM
Hey vinc3nt12! I'm not a Max user but it sounds like a version issue. If there's an option to ignore version in the open dialog check that. Also, you could try importing the file instead of opening and seeing if there's an ignore version option. Otherwise, you can download the OBJ version and import that into your scene.

jeremybirn
11-22-2008, 04:32 PM
yeahh right its a GI challenge ... like based on the gallery of previous challenge -the light house..it was a compositing challenge ... as no image of good basic lighting got featured .

Hey Sklioness -

Did you have any favorites entries in the Light House challenge that you'd like to single out? I'd love to hear which ones you thought had the best lighting, and everyone always appreciates a compliment, so please post the links to your favorites and let us all know.

From some of the discussion in this thread, I hope people aren't getting too worried about the fact that different entries use different tools and functions. If most professional arch-vis work uses GI, or if compositing is used when 3D models are added to real environments, is that a huge problem for someone?

In making movies, most professionals let go of abstract ideas about "purity", and do whatever works best for a particular project, including hacks, cheats, tricks, new technology, old technology, or whatever else can be made to work. If I did an entry in this challenge, I'm not sure which render settings I'd use, or how many passes, but I would just be focused on what could best give me the output I wanted in the time available.

-jeremy

jeremybirn
11-22-2008, 05:30 PM
vinc3nt12 - Maybe someone can give you a Max 8 file, or you can import another supported file format?

ShamKiR - Good basic start. The overall green fill is good as a base layer, you need some more defined lighting on the dino. The glass in the lower frame needs work to look like glass. Reflections would help some of the surfaces.

fuzzylizard - Welcome! The left dino doesn't look lit yet, try putting a kick of light on him from the upper left. For the glass around the left dino, try making it more reflective, or putting some highlights on the top edge so it shows up. See if you can figure out why the sunbeam is not lighting the display cases. Try making the floor less saturated yellow, and more reflective. The right dino looks very over-exposed. If you want to do that intentionally to some parts of him, then at least put a glow around the bright spots, otherwise tone it down or limit it. Some soft cool light off in the side hallways would make them look more air, as if sky light bounced into them.

Luthias - Welcome! Good start! The small dino on the right doesn't have much shaping on him, maybe he could use some soft overhead light from the left? Those two doors in the back needs some ground outside, so it doesn't look as if we're looking down at the sky. In the set, the dark shader on the columns and arches could be much brighter, more simular to the rest of the walls, so that the contrast can come more from the lighting and less from the shaders. The tail of the large dino could use some subtle rim light were it goes in front of the window.

DuttyFoot - Welcome!

PauloRenato - The first one looks better. See if you can get more light and shaping on the dino himself, and tone-down the ceiling lights in the back. You could do more with the blue sky colored light, maybe a little fill or reflection worked into the shadow areas inside?

COBRASoft - Welcome! I wish you'd post your images on a place that doesn't require a password to log in. Try imageshack.com or flickr.com or set-up a cgportfolio. After you've made more posts to establish your account on cgtalk, you'll also be allowed to attach images as you post.

reinhart82 - Welcome! That's a terrific start! I love the look of night scenes with very selective lighting! Right now it seems as if too much of the scene is completely lost in darkness, I hope you can continue being selective, but choose a few more key places to add rim lights, highlights, reflections, and small light sources to bring-out the form of the dinos and define parts of the architectural space. I think I'm going to love this one, can't wait for the next version!

modelyna - Welcome! That last one is a nice image. I think the "butt shot" of the dino is not the best angle, that could be changed I hope, but I like the translucent look to it. For those lamps on the back wall, it's hard to tell if they are supposed to be on or off, maybe just leave them off. The red tone in the set is a little monotonous, it would be great if there were some blue sky reflection in it or other variety compared to all the red.

georgedrakakis - Don't let your work with shaders and sketchy looks distract you too much from focusing on the lighting. I see one sunbeam in the set, which makes it look like you are going for something with some of kind of depiction of real lighting. Starting from there, I'd love to see more contrast and shaping on the dinos, and a little more variety of surfaces like the side walls, so they look more like gradients than flat-shaded areas.

jojo1975 - For the first one, most of the contrast seems to come from the materials instead of the lighting, and that's distracting. The second one (with the fog) is a good start.

wasimattar - Good start! See if you can put some more fill light on the two dinosaurs, so they have nice shaping with a brighter top and shadow tones on the bottom. The second dino is getting almost completely lost, maybe the glass in front of him should be more clear with less reflection, too?

qbaqba - Looks good! Is seems as if you are planning some comical elements to add to the scene, that's great. The dino right now could use a little cooler-colored bounce light, just enough to add some color variety to him and integrate him with the background. The candle is nice, it would be good to darken down the smoke above it, and darken the bottom of the middle-ring in the candle stick, so only the parts facing the flame go that bright. The back dinosaur seems lost in the story, either get rid of the case in front of him and make him a part of the shot, or else don't light him so prominantly, seeing the bright forehead with the rest of him hidden doesn't really work for me.

Leotril - That's great! Really nice "haunted hallway" type look on your lighting of the stairwell. In the upper left, it would be great if there were some softer fill light coming in through the window, around the hard-edged moonbeam. A little color variety coming from the upper right could add some variety in more places, too.

e-maje - Interesting breakdown. The under-lighting on the dinos is a nice idea, but we need to see where the light is coming from. The orange lights are also nice, but even some primitive cylinders mounted as lamps could help make it more believable. The occlusion is making some parts, especially around the windows, much too dark. You'll have to decide which light layer needs occlusion, and then add other layers on top that don't get influenced by occlusion. Self-illumination such as the windows themselves should be added on top of the image, not multiplied by the occlusion. If you could make a nice fill light layer that gave a base with a deep, rich color, you could multiply that with the occlusion, then add the rest of your ligths and the window glows on top of it, and maybe you wouldn't need the GI.

zero08 - That's great! I love it! Really nice "night" look! I'd love to see some of the lights near the foreground brightened, so there was really crisp high-contrast areas in front of us, before it fades off into darkness and mist in the BG. Maybe the warm light on the dino could be boosted? Some reflections on the floor in the foreground could help too.

massi131 - Great job on those! First one is looking really solid, just needs more light on the dinos to give them more contrast and attention. Second one looking through the arches would work better if the foreground had a darker tone or different color, the dinos had more light and contrast. Third one is OK but the fake DOF detracts from the scene. Maybe focus on improving the first one?

wasimattar - Nice scene, and nice breakdown! You could use some bounce light or fill light on the back wall, so the arches around those upper back windows don't go so dark. Is wish there were more contrast in the dinosaurs. Some reflections would really add to the scene.

Shordy - The gamma correction is interesting. That side hallway needs some fill light. The foreground in the lower left of the frame could go much darker, almost a sillouette. The shading on most of the building is good, except those white colomns stand-out too much, especially after the gamma change. I'd love to see a glow around some of the windows, especially the side windows and the stained glass.

zeitgenosse - Nice scene! I think once you have that bright sunbeam coming through the set, you also should have light from the sky around the sun. You need fill light that's softer and less focused, but aimed in the same general direction as the sunbeam, lighting the whole wall. The dinosaurs look like they have too much bounce, if they got less light from the bottom and more from the top they'd have better shaping.

EricFerreira - Better and better! There's some strange dark outlines around things, I don't know if it's a compositing problem or an anti-aliasing problem. Maybe the glass and floor could be a bit reflective? Some light on top of the second dino could help give him shaping.

artefactum - Nice job! I wish more of the blue fill from the windows made it into the scene, maybe with less green in the ceiling. Reflections on the floor will help.

ramses2028 - Welcome! You have a terrific image already! The way parts of the background is blurry looks a bit fake, you could get rid of that effect. I'd love to see more done with reflections and highlights, to punch out little details in the darkness. That blue from the night sky could motivate some nice cooler highlight tones in places.

threedl - That's great! I love the animated fly-through you did too. For things like the bottom of the staircase that appear in the foreground close to camera, usually it's best to bring the brightness way down so they are just defined in darkness. The dino on the left could use some more illumination on him. The dino on the right might get turned around to face camera, so we don't just have his back-side in the shot. I think the architecture could use a fill light that's similar to the sunbeam, but broader and softer, motivated by the bright area of the sky you see around the sun.

ShamKiR - Looks good! Maybe a little bit of blue reflected light or highlights could bring out the shininess of the bones, or add glints of light to the glass on the displays? You might add some artificial lights, too, even if it's just a little glowing exit sign, something to add variety to the dark areas.

baochao - Hello, that's a great start. Solid looking GI. I wish we could get more light and shaping on the dinos.

R-eon - Nice overall scene. For some of the light, such as the lights around the dino's feet, I don't know where the light is coming from. Maybe we just need broader, softer lights on them as well as the focused ones, but maybe also they aren't casting shadows in all of the lights? Especially under the smaller dino it looks like we're missing shadows. I like the little story point that it looks like the t-rex has eaten a person. Myabe some more rim light on his lower jaw and teeth could help pop his head out from the background and help the audience notice what's happened?

Fex - Keep going! I think you need more lights so we can see more of the scene.

BlenderFan - They'd be more menacing if they had more contrast, darker on the bottom and more light from the top. Don't forget to add shadows if you're going for a dark contrasty scene.

Chrisdc - Nice scene! The background is very believable. I'd like to see more light on the dino, wrapping around him because he's so back-lit.

-jeremy

Luthias
11-22-2008, 07:36 PM
Comments and critiques welcomehttp://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn127/Luthias42/natural_history_01.jpg

qbaqba
11-22-2008, 07:38 PM
Jeremy,
Thanks a lot for your comments - it's really essential for me. J'm so grateful for your hard work done for person like me...
ALL my familly alive "LIGHTING CHALLENGES" with me ( MY WIFE TOO... :)))

Jacob Lakomiec

vinc3nt12
11-23-2008, 10:14 AM
i downloaded the .obj files instead and merged them into a scene. everything works fine now. Thanks. :thumbsup:

Xcut0r
11-23-2008, 02:39 PM
hey this is my first post here! hope u guys like it.. just a light test! :)
c4d+fryrender, took about 4hr in a amd64x2 2.6 @ 3.0!

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/969/wipfr3nu8.th.jpg (http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wipfr3nu8.jpg)http://img509.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

P.S:
it would help a lot if someone could post a .c4d scene.. it would help with the textures :)


cheers


Xcut0r

shantanut
11-23-2008, 02:39 PM
hi, this is my first render for this challenge.


its 720*405 res. and mental ray.

ethermammoth
11-23-2008, 07:27 PM
Hey guys and girls,

Some realy nice renderings so far... I whish i could do something that nice.
Ive just startet to dig into the beautiful world of lighting and 3D, read a lot of theories so i thought it was time for some hand on praxis... Whish i had more time for that tho, my university is realy a time killer :(

So here is my first draft. Thought of a night setting, motivational key lights from the side, a strong cast shadow of the evil drex on the walls, then some fill lights for the head (need to tweak them still to bright) - then i through in a rim light behind the head to reveal it from the background (i wanna make it sticking out). Still need a lot of lights for the top celing and tweaking of the overall brightness + all the textures...

Software: 3Dmax, vray - GI with nightsky environment - rendertime: ~1.5min

http://www.schnitzel.dk/rasmus/03.jpg

rockmed
11-23-2008, 08:12 PM
Here is a render done in modo using only physical sky and sun for lighting. No texturing yet with the exception of the floor. Obviously it is photoshopped...

http://idisk.mac.com/aalireza-Public/museum3_modo.jpg

Shordy
11-23-2008, 10:00 PM
ive worked on the lighting in the scene. I placed 20 omnis in the dark corners. Outside the left windows are now some trees.

http://www.cg-creatives.de/files/museum_shordy_v18.jpg

Fex
11-23-2008, 10:59 PM
one more from another angle

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t271/fexa/n_hist_05_cc.jpg

kiko77
11-24-2008, 12:32 AM
hello friends, this is my first test of light still lack many things.

thanks

http://www.kiko3dmania.com/trabalhos/render08.jpg

BlenderFan
11-24-2008, 01:02 AM
Here is my image with a some lighting revision. Thank you very much for the advice, Jeremy.
http://home.comcast.net/%7Escimaster/pwpimages/Natural%20History.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/%7Escimaster/Natural%20History.jpg

jeremybirn
11-24-2008, 01:48 AM
BlenderFan - For a night scene, you need to be selective about the areas you light. Instead of lighting the whole floor uniformly, try putting light just in selected areas, such as pools of light around the dinos. After that, making the floor reflective could put some highlights in other places to break-up the black space. The dinos could use some light on their heads, maybe just an extra spotlight on each from above and a little in front of the heads?

kiko77 - Looking good! The spotlight areas themselves are so bright that I'd expect more spill coming out in other directions and more bounce light from them. That railing in the foreground could read better if it were less reflective, or the steps it was on were more reflective. Then it would be integrated, and you could just put a little rim light or reflection along the top so you could see the handrails.

Fex - Nice job. I'd love to see more contrast and definition on the dinos, and something going on in all the space above them.

Shordy - Maybe you could swap the brightness between the foreground banister and the dinos, so the dinos were the bright constrasty thing that drew your eye? Some of the more distant people look too saturated and jump out at me. The window on the left is so bright it really needs a glow around it.

rockmed - Good start! Maybe you could push in on the dinos to get a better look at them. Make sure the whole scene isn't so overexposed that you lose contrast in the shadow tones.

ethermammoth - Welcome! That's good basic blocking. It should lead to an interesting image. Maybe the fill light could go a deep blue, and you could use a warmer light for the spotlight under-lighting him?

techworms - Welcome! Good start, keep going....

Xcut0r - Welcome! Good start. I hope you can get more light and shaping on the smaller dino.

Luthias - Looks good! I think both characters could use more top-down light. The white windows and black columns on the upper left are a bit distracting. Maybe you could tone-down the windows or put more light or a brighter shader on the black columns?

-jeremy

gEarMon
11-24-2008, 06:21 AM
Great Start

gEarMon
11-24-2008, 06:43 AM
First attempt. Getting a feel for the space. Lightwave GI: Irradience, Interpolated. 15 minutes.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/4314/museumaab9.jpg

zero08
11-24-2008, 10:02 AM
zero08 - That's great! I love it! Really nice "night" look! I'd love to see some of the lights near the foreground brightened, so there was really crisp high-contrast areas in front of us, before it fades off into darkness and mist in the BG. Maybe the warm light on the dino could be boosted? Some reflections on the floor in the foreground could help too.

-jeremy



Hi Jeremy i tried putting bit of fog and rays coming from the upper window and composed it in DF, and i started putting textures on the objects. the fog made the image a bit less contrast, added a slight reflection on the floor and additional inclusive lights for the dinos.
I'm not happy with the glass around the dinos, still tweaking it. just trying another version.Thanks


http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo213/zero08_photo/Museum_Edarker0000.jpg

http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo213/zero08_photo/Museum_Ebrighter0000.jpg

EricFerreira
11-24-2008, 01:41 PM
Hi Guys, how much time, hehehe, now my imagem with a little bit reflex in flood,
less atmosphere effects in foreground and the tips of Jeremy.

Comments are welcome ! ! !:thumbsup:
http://www.actiontv.com.br/cgtalk/final012.jpg

gEarMon
11-24-2008, 04:17 PM
Here's a start to get a feel for the scene. Threw a quick texture on the T-Rex. Lightwave, GI, Irradience, 1 hour to calculate GI, 15 minutes to render. 1280x720http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/4314/museumaab9.jpg

Leotril
11-24-2008, 07:55 PM
@jeremy i follow ur suggestions .. in the case of the directional light added more softness not quite enought it seems .. put back the glass geo on the windows ... move the sky and added pointlights here and there.. the dof was unintentional for now so its out of focos maybe some bokeh effect could work but nof for this particular PoW

http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm255/Leotril/Museo/2dtexture5.jpg

e-maje
11-24-2008, 09:46 PM
Hello,
I tried to take account of remarks made to me. As I have a tiny machine I had cut my image as much as possible.
For this reason I limited the size of the record. I post on fxtree, it will be more clear.
Ha I forgot, there was no GI ...

http://www.xsilounge.com/tuts/fxtree_nh.jpg

http://www.xsilounge.com/tuts/Natural_History_II.jpg
GeD ;)

BlenderFan
11-25-2008, 01:10 AM
This is my latest revision. I have two images, one a raw render, and the other a post-produced version. All of this was created within Blender. I lit the scene using several spotlights linked to the dinos, along with some hemis and suns to light the back wall. I have also attached an image of my compositing node setup in Blender. Please give your opinion.

http://home.comcast.net/%7Escimaster/pwpimages/Natural%20History.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/%7Escimaster/Natural%20History%20with%20post%20pro.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/%7Escimaster/node%20setup%20natural%20history.jpg

COBRASoft
11-25-2008, 01:34 PM
Hey,

Here is an update to my attempt. No login required this time normally. I used Lightwave 9.5.1 and some post in PhotoShop.

http://www.cobrasoft.be/downloads/images/natural%20museum14PS.jpg

Greetings,
Sigurd

kanooshka
11-25-2008, 02:00 PM
Finally was able to throw together a render, had lots of crashes with maya 2008's render layers and assigning different materials on different layers. I'm very happy with the foreground but I do not care too much for how the background looks so far. Critiques more than welcome! The only textures are procedural texture/bump on the dinosaurs and an image mapped onto the architecture.

http://www.dockay.com/CGTalk/LightingChallenges/17_Natural_History/Natural_History_01.jpg

shantanut
11-25-2008, 02:15 PM
hi am posting some more renders. trying to test how light interacts with different materials. Also, trying test my render times. I am doing it in maya. Its taking about 30 mins in maya software render and about 15 mins in mental ray without Fg or Gi. just plain renders. there are like 2 omni`s. 2 areas and and 2 spots.

Will be getting onto the concept part and the shading and texturing part now.

Guy-zmo
11-25-2008, 05:36 PM
hi!
This is my first participation on cgsociety!

So this is my work:

http://www.guyparis.fr/Natural_History/FINAL.jpg

I hope you like it?!
Wait your comments...

georgedrakakis
11-25-2008, 08:37 PM
hi,
this is another update.
as Jeremy suggested, this time i focused on the lighting.
i think there is more contrast in the scene now.
3 examples-> 1) w/o volume light, 2) with yellowish vol light and 3) my favorite, multi-colored volume light which blends well with the yellow-brown textures.
this my previous post (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=5502213&postcount=166) for comparison.
personally i like the way that the triceratops is over-exposed (victim) and the t-rex is gradually revealing (hunter) , like a hunting scene.
C&C are most welcome.



http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/023_3.jpg

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/023_3.jpg

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o271/studiomoccoro/023_4.jpg

davidsharp
11-25-2008, 09:28 PM
Well, I honestly haven't had as much time to play with this as I though I would but I'm finally happy with the camera FOV and position for the still. Part of my interest in participating in the challenge is to work with some lighting types I haven't had much experience or time to play with at work.

So this is my first attempt at IES lights and volume lighting (which I admit I have a long way to go to getting the feel right and some fall off of the volume) Currently the scene has 1 targeted direct light acting as sunlight, 4 ies lights in the entry and 4 vray planes adding light from the arched corridors.

Rendering in two passes taking about 45 - 50 minutes. I'm hoping to get the volume light to "cut" through the banners I added from the trussing and I think I might drop some cylinders from the trussing also to act as can light fixtures to illuminate the exhibits directly.

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h184/cirruse30/lighting_comp/natural_history_3dmax_9_us-view2_10.jpg