So Where's Tesla?

[ediris]

There is no secrecy in what EITG is planning.
They will come out with EIv8 and Tesla at the same time. You donot need to be a science fiction novelist to know this.
Maybe for Christmas, they will be ready to deliver. I bet they are gonna raise the price a lot.Given EIAS history of not knowledge of marketing.

And this is nobodys fault not the developers or anybody in the group is just the way it always has been.They will need some more money to start incorporating tesla into the pipeline.

I wish EI will think about this and stat selling EI cheaper so more people have acces to it, otherwise is gonna be terrible sales.

[futagoza]

Sure, the price should be raised for a combined product, but i assume they will also sell both products seperately without increasing the price of EIAS to much.

Regards
Stefan

[ediris]

Hi Stefan,
How about selling EI/Tesla for 2 euros and as a separate prduct for 1,5 each.
That way you make sure EI/Tesla gets sold.
I have always felt more conf doing my work in just one 3d package not 5 3d packgs.
The beauty of Tesla is that you make sure your models have the correct settings optimized to render in EI.
Being tesla the future of EI i will not doubt to get it, together with EI makes a nice combo. EI is gonna still be there for a lot more years.

[futagoza]

Hi Edgard,

I´m pretty sure should Camera become the next Mental Ray/VRay comparable renderer, like it was stated a while ago, it´s selling like hot cakes, even if the price of EIAS increases slightly for that enhancement. And sure a combined product is more attractive if the price is a bit lower compared to both products sold seperately.

Regards
Stefan

[ediris]

Gigayoda still is gonna be long time now we are almost in october. v8 is got a lot of months until it is released, in what i have seen these last couple of months EITG is not rushing to get the product out,that is good, take their time try it 300 times before making sure it works, take the time to make some video tutorials, a well written PDF manual with graphics and examples.

What i am worried is that a public beta is not out yet.

[sah162]

Anybody from EI how about an answer to the question So Where's Tesla?

[DickM]

Something tells me they don't want to answer such questions! :eek:

[sah162]

Maybe it's vapor ware.

[DickM]

Maybe? :rolleyes:

[ediris]

too much for me

[ediris]

I think i´ve seen kishore in the Bahamas with some piña colada :)

[AlbertKay]

The silence is indeed deafening. And telling.

I have a simple motto: if a company ignores its (potential) customers, than the customers should ignore the company.

[halfworld]

Sorry everyone, I've been away for a few days: treasure hunts in the country-side, sheep rustling, gateaux fights etc., I'm afraid I have no information for you with regards to a release date, however I will ask the question, one thing is for certain, it is still in development.

Best,
Ian

[Vizfizz]

Hello Everyone,

Tesla is not vaporware. I can tell you the application exists and is being developed. :) What is the cause of the delays you may ask? Well as far as I know there have been various licensing negotiations with Spatial that slowed things down, but have been fully settled. Plus there's been various libraries from Spatial that took longer to receive than expected and so forth. All of this sets EI's deadlines back further and further. Its never fun to hear that the beta is "just right around the corner", but trust me it coming.

[AlbertKay]

Its never fun to hear that the beta is "just right around the corner", but trust me it coming.

It must be a hell of a block than before that corner is reached...
Anyway, good luck with the development and a snippet of real news about its status would be appreciated by many.

Cheers,
AlbertKay

[ediris]

I wonder if the models will be updated once you export from Tesla, kind like PS and AE updating not necessarily but it will be much helpful to keep models organized.
Will be hard to get used to the interface but if under the hood evrything is working good it should be a nice purchased.

Is anything discuss in mixing Amorphium and EIM into Tesla?
Could it have displacement brushes ?
Loop Selections of vertex,edges and faces?
Can the user add a loop to a Ubermeshes with no problem?Is th ubernurbs still there they dont seem to work in the latest version.
UV editor?
Point,Edge ,Face extrusion?
How is accurate is the SubD system for modeling vehicles, planes,flowers, etc?

Not asking for a release date more important is that these issues be addressed or any answer will be really good.

[Gigayoda]

Thanks Ian, and Brian. Glad to hear development is still moving along. If a projected 4th Q release or late 1st Q is in sight so I can plan/budget more or less for a new release.

[juanxer]

It's been said elsewhere that EITG has no rights over Amorphium other than distribution, so...

It would be nice if Team Tesla would express some of their basic intentions for v.1: will this be just an EIM UB+UI revamp? Are they thinking about developing a few more tools for both the ACIS set and the SDS set? Or have they got any interesting ideas to surprise us with? :)

[ediris]

Excuse me i heard by one developer that a product for EIAS was coming out that uses Amorphium technology. That to me sounds like some painting will be available for Tesla.
Maybe some Bodypaint.

The only thing i will find surprising is how expensive they are willing to sell the product

[halfworld]

I'm sorry to say there is no product due for release based on Amorphium's code.

Best,
Ian

[halfworld]

I've just been told that I will be able to pass on concrete news to you all in about two weeks.

Cheers,
Ian

[AlbertKay]

I've just been told that I will be able to pass on concrete news to you all in about two weeks.

Cheers,
Ian

The corner is getting closer! :bounce:

Cheers,
AlbertKay

[ediris]

Cant wait to create morph targets.Thanks to Tomas Egger i have a better perspective.

Thanks,
Edgard

[Martin Kay]

I wonder how the current impending economic climate is going to effect 3D developers and purchasers. Luxology say it's actually helped them being reasonably priced. Maybe this will help EI. but maybe it'll be the end of a lot of struggling companies.

Martin K

[ediris]

Good point Martin,
One answer there should be a Learniing Editon for every single 3d package. That was really cool that you could download C4D and save at a limited resolution for 40 days.That is aan aggressive strategy. Houdini Apprentice, Maya Learning Editon.
Could we have a Tesla Leraning Editon?


There is a receipe no ,need to think out of the box. Learn from your competitors.


Edgard

[Martin Kay]

Good point Martin,
One answer there should be a Learniing Editon for every single 3d package. That was really cool that you could download C4D and save at a limited resolution for 40 days.That is aan aggressive strategy. Houdini Apprentice, Maya Learning Editon.
Could we have a Tesla Leraning Editon?


There is a receipe no ,need to think out of the box. Learn from your competitors.


Edgard

I think there should be a time unlimited demo with save disabled so folks can have a good go, bearing in mind its quite difficult sometimes to find the time within a limited period of thirty days or as in my case 15 days with Vs 7. I actually never found the time to mess with it- still exploring 6.5.

Martin K

[futagoza]

I wish the Big5 and EIAS would follow SideFX in offering an "Apprentice HD" Vers. Imagine Maya Apprentice HD instead of having an limited Maya PLE. What impact would that have on the 3D market...?! I wonder anyways why nobody has followed SideFX with such an offer.

Regards
Stefan

[ediris]

You right Stefan,
But lets see how much films has been created with Houdini or Maya.
Blender got some revenues with the Bunny movie i donot know what is the story behind but that did gave them a chance to start.
If Moi is les than 200 dollars, how much is Tesla gonna be sold for? I say to give for example ILM Tesla to start modeling some elements for spots or films so EITG could have that same push.

Or a lot of studios such as The Mill or Psyop so they can try them out nd put it in to their productions, is the same for Maya or C4D.They put it in their hands and they created the art.

[futagoza]

I think they only have to make Tesla a Public Beta and then everybody, including those big studios, can grab a copy of Tesla, plus advertising Tesla on CGTalk. That would give EITG a lot of PR without investing money.

Well, the price of Tesla, i think it will be somewhat around ViaCAD Pro, due to it´s many Surfacing Tools (in EIM), which MoI and ViaCAD lacks.

[juanxer]

I guess being able to do those things will depend on the terms of the ACIS license.

[Burney]

I only know Sub D applications do UV mapping. Can ACIS do UV mapping? :blush: I know very little about the theory of ACIS technology other than there exists in FormZ smooth objects.

Burney

[ediris]

Viacad dont have UV editing. Again i do not know if it is plan to do some type of hybrid between ACIS and SubD surfaces, i do know there was a little trick to get your UV from EIM but is in the UberBundle CD.(Without previs)

[juanxer]

I believe UVs result from the mathematics of NURBS patches. Also, as per the manual, EIM uses UV data for tesellation, so...

[ediris]

I thought NURBS didnt have UV. Anyways it will be interesting to see your source of information Juan about UV. I could only find that UV are face information not edges or vertex information.

How can you use those tessellation settings to calculate where your seem is?I forgot you could avoid that by using Bodypaint.

[Eterea]

I thought NURBS didnt have UV. Anyways it will be interesting to see your source of information Juan about UV. I could only find that UV are face information not edges or vertex information.

In fact, NURBS surfaces have UVs by default (at least in softwares like Maya, Rhino or the old EI Modeler). Thanks to this property we can work on this way (http://www.etereaestudios.com/docs_html/isfahan_htm/isfahan_makingof_04.htm) to get things like this (http://www.etereaestudios.com/docs_html/isfahan_htm/isfahan_still_09.htm).

The question is that NURBS surface can not be UV mapped in the same way than POLYGONAL surfaces AFAIK (you know: UV-Unwrap, UV-Peeler, UV-Relax...), because the UV flow is determined by the building process itself. Simply viewing the isoparms you can figure how UVs —and texture maps— will flow along surface.

[ediris]

Hi Cristobal,
Thanks for the inspired info, when i export as a FACT from my modeler of choice that check box is grayed out USE UV SPACE ,most of the time.
I have to export as FBX which i have found the only way to get that check box to be active again. Off course the object has UV coordinates and i could exported as OBJ and than open it in EIM and exported again as FACT. The thing is that FACT is a rare format is becoming more by the minute.
I could use Silo to convert to FACT but the free converted doesnt alow me to export UV.
ANyways thanks for the Link.

Edgard

PS: There is one solution available and that is obj2fact. Great utility.

[paulchiap]

So, is there any news about Tesla? Is it in beta yet?

[ediris]

Yes , there should be news very very soon in about two weeks more. And so on , and so on , and so on.the balls keep spinning. Maybe by Christmass.:)

[UnixMonkey]

I'm beginning to think it's vaporware. The rug has been pulled out from under us so many times now. Not that it matters, I held out as long as I could, but I had to upgrade my modeling software last month, so there is no chance I will be buying Tesla in the near future unless it comes with EI-v8.
I have also noticed that no one has been hounding Ian about his Oct. 9th post on the EIAS forum with a promise of screen shots.

--start of quote--

Topic: Tesla News? EIAS 8?
Posted: 09 October 2008 12:54 AM

Tesla:
Before the end of this week, I should have the beta in my hands. So again, it will be next week before I can get some screenshots etc., out there.

Cheers,
Ian


--end of quote--

I assume that most people have moved on to other modelers, but I would still like to see what's new in Tesla.


Richard

[PaulS2]

I don't think anyone should be holding their breath for Tesla.....I'm sure it's a big undertaking putting it together.

I wouldn't hold off using the tools you need right now (if that means buying something which suites your needs do it) and then incorporate Tesla into your workflow if it suites your needs. If/when it comes out it will probably be a little rough at first anyway so I don't think anyone is going to drop all of their tools just to use it.

I like EIM and use it when on the mac and in EI but I have tools to keep my work flowing predictably right now. I welcome Tesla and hope it's great...an upgrade over EIM. If it stalls for awhile I still get my work done.

[UnixMonkey]

Paul,
You are absolutely right, and it was not my intention to start finger pointing. I like EIAS and will continue to use the program. My only concern is that when EITG says one thing and then doesn't deliver, it creates ill feelings. If I did that to my clients, I think I would soon find myself out of work.

Richard

[Vizfizz]

Tesla is not vaporware. I posted a preliminary screenshot here in this forum. In my conversations with Brad, I know how much he's been spending to get this product out the door. It will happen.

Unfortunately EITG has stumbled into its old trap of announcing a product too far in advance and various circumstances beyond EITG's control have caused delays. I know users are tired of hearing "Its right around the corner"...but unfortunately that's where we're at.

[ediris]

I have forget about Tesla since it will not have any way to control my UV nor any baking of my textures will be available either in v8 unless the photon mapping feature which bakes the lightning but they havent mentioned if it will bake the textures as well.
That is what i need now , otherwise i will have to learn how to bake textures from Maya since the workflow works good with models coming from Maya imported into VizRT.

The clean lighitning,shadows,GI,AO you get from EIAS will be amazing if you could bake it into the model and than export as OBJ to be used in real rtime graphics systems.

[PaulS2]

Paul,
You are absolutely right, and it was not my intention to start finger pointing. I like EIAS and will continue to use the program. My only concern is that when EITG says one thing and then doesn't deliver, it creates ill feelings. If I did that to my clients, I think I would soon find myself out of work.

Richard

I understand...and wasn't pointing any finger in your direction either. Just commenting on the nature of things which can occur in the EI World.

For me, EI is just one tool in the toolbox....it's a good tool, serves it purpose but having other capable tools, I don't have to depend on EI or get too twitched if they tend to be late or not give me the features I want.

At one time I felt my success as a 3D artist was tied to EI and the capability it provided....it was a relief artistically not having to always depend on it after I started using other tools more earnestly.

[halfworld]

I have been sent Tesla this morning.

Ian

[Martin Kay]

I have been sent Tesla this morning.

Ian

People will be pestering you for information now.... ;-)

Martin K

[halfworld]

They already have! :)

I will be able to take a look at it once my deadline is out the way, so a few days.

But really, it actually exists ;)
Ian

[mike33]

Hi Ian,

Any info on system/OS min requirements at this point.

Thank you,

Mike

[ediris]

They already have! :)

I will be able to take a look at it once my deadline is out the way, so a few days.

But really, it actually exists ;)
Ian

Ian doesnt matter evrybody breaks his word at some point , not big of a deal for EIAS users. We are used to it so is part of our job to be critics. Some epxerience for next time.

[juanxer]

I want to believe :D

[PaulS2]

They already have! :)

I will be able to take a look at it once my deadline is out the way, so a few days.

But really, it actually exists ;)
Ian

So...what's the scoop?

[halfworld]

I'm waiting for some QTFrameworks that will make it launch....

I've sent an email...
Ian

[PaulS2]

That's discouraging......my feel on all of this is that it would be in EI's best interest to get some sort of buzz going on Tesla.

Something like..."Here it is...some screen shots, some new features...some models rendered, etc, etc."

Sorry Ian, not directing this at you but I just don't get it.

[juanxer]

"QTFrameworks"? So is it being developed upon Trolltech's Qt (http://trolltech.com/products)? That's mightily interesting, portability-wise.

[halfworld]

Hi Paul,

I know how you feel, I myself am a little frustrated with this situation. That said, here are some words from Brad regarding Tesla.

---

It hasn't been the easiest route. This is truly my first development
project from scratch and I have had my missteps and my over zealous
thoughts. We are making progress though. I am trying as hard as I can to get
it done by the end of the year, with a classy top of the line product.

Regards,

Brad Parscale
EI Technology Group LLC

--

[PaulS2]

Thanks for the info and honesty Ian.....let us know when you get the pieces you need.

[halfworld]

Hi Paul et al.

So, I have Tesla open and working, It's ridiculously fast at everything I've tried, I'm going to ask Kishore if it's Multi-threaded (I assume it must be).

So, what would you like to see from it?

The interface is aqua, a vast improvement as far as I'm concerned, though, it clearly isn't near finished (missing many options (like extrude) that really are there in the background, there is just no interface button for them yet).

I'm away until Tuesday, but feel free to as a question and I'll try to reply once I'm back...

Best,
Ian

[Gigayoda]

Ian! My man!

Just opened the proverbial can of worms.

1-Does it look like a "new" modeler or is it an EIM major upgrade?
2-If its a text based interface / aqua how much of EIM if any is left? What was added removed?
3-How is the integration into EI as far as meshes / or subDs / UberNurbs / FBX?
4-What export/import options do we have and does it support EIM models?
5-What tools that no other modeler has do we now have, if any?
6-UVunwrap?
7-Paint?
8-Seems you like the speed, is it Modo fast? or Silo or (plug any app here) fast?
9-is the interface customizable and do we have more shortcuts / custom shortcuts available.
10-As far as screenshots I'm interested in sub-division ubernurb handles and if possible an openGL view on how the faces are shown and if we've had any selector improvements.

I'll keep it at 10. I'm sure the gang will have a list for themselves.

[PaulS2]

I guess for me I'd like to know if it's the same modeler as EIM but with a new ACIS version, does it take advantage of the new and improved ACIS blends and fillets and other features....or is it a brand new modeler.

[juanxer]

I would like to see a snapshot of the app with most of its palettes opened, to see if its UI gets too cluttered so, and see how the tools icons look like on an Aqua-style palette surface (that previous snap we saw months ago suggested a bit of space-wasting. EIM managed to be quite compact, even if its Small Icons palette view was a bit too small). If Tesla has a EIM-style long Tools palette, my first question would be: does Tesla support mousewheeling? :)

The last ACIS release was supposed to support multiprocessing.

[DickM]

IS IT PANES??????? Last screen shot I was sorely disappointed with the 4 windows UI :banghead: . I hate that. Please Ian, tell me there are 4 panes so I can "space bar" in the active viewport to make full screen, and again to return to 4 panes???? :thumbsup:

[cjberg]

no, no... space bar allows you to pan around the viewport...

Pie R round, Cornbread R Square.

IS IT PANES??????? Last screen shot I was sorely disappointed with the 4 windows UI :banghead: . I hate that. Please Ian, tell me there are 4 panes so I can "space bar" in the active viewport to make full screen, and again to return to 4 panes???? :thumbsup:

[markalanthomas]

Whatever they do, let's hope it functions exactly like none of the other modeling apps on the market so that every function and feature has to be learned from scratch using yet another completely new and arbitrary series of unintuitive steps only an engineer could love. ;)

Seriously, I hope it rules.

[plsyvjeucxfw]

How are the areas that were weak in EIM?

Does the snapping provide more user feedback, i.e. definite snaps, no doubts, no worry.

Are there pop up inferences and construction aids such as tangent, mid point, 90 degree, etc.

Is the rounding finicky or do illegal bevels crash the program?

Does it still use the Permanent Selection work flow, i.e. you must deselect before beginning another operation.

Do you have a user preference to choose Permanent vs. Temporary Selections?

Does it offer the option for a Manipulator Mode vs. No Manipulator?

How's the navigation when in Perspective mode? Does it orbit around selected objects or components? Does your object veer off out of view into space?

Can you move objects on the Y axis in the Perspective view?

Can Perspective be made the default, or do you always get that wonky Isometric?

Sounds like a lot of nit picky questions I know, however, I'm strongly torn between MoI, which has ease of use as it's primary attribute, and trying to be faithful to EITG. However, the old EIM and I did not get along. Tesla must provide a better user experience for me or I won't be able to work with it.

Thanks.

[3DArtZ]

Hmm, yeah I wasnt too excited when I saw those screen captures either....

[monday1313]

Whatever they do, let's hope it functions exactly like none of the other modeling apps on the market so that every function and feature has to be learned from scratch using yet another completely new and arbitrary series of unintuitive steps only an engineer could love. ;)

Seriously, I hope it rules.


LOL...

You must use Blender then...

[cjberg]

No, he is from Santa Barbara...

LOL...

You must use Blender then...

[halfworld]

Hi everyone,

I played a bit last night.... Many things have no interface yet so I won't be able to say much.... But, here are some minor observations...

It's a complete revamp of EIM, same/similar tools, with the very latest ACIS engine. The 'framework' is now very OS X; nice animations for the dialogues and tool selections (less clicking then EIM). There is no export yet and so far there is OBJ and SAT import. There are no UV tools yet that I can see (Does any ACIS modeller do UVs?). Tesla launches in less then a second....

OpenGL and selection tools are the same as EIM so far, and bevelling has not yet been implemented.

It seems to me that to answer all your questions, I'd need a build with a more complete interface.

Best,
Ian

[ediris]

Well done my friend. I guess is gonna be a nice Christmas for EITG and users.

[futagoza]

Hi Edgard,

what do you mean with nice Christmas, it sounds to me that Tesla is in alpha stadium and not in beta. So maybe by Christmas 2009 ;-)

Regards
Stefan

[AlbertKay]

what do you mean with nice Christmas

Sarcasm, perhaps?

[halfworld]

Hi all,

Brad has said really wants Tesla out by Xmas, we'll re-visit this in a month, so fingers crossed, but the version I have is still at a very early stage of polish.

Best,
Ian

[DickM]

Thanks for the info Ian......but..... Panes or windows???? :bounce:

[bradfilms]

Hi Ian

One quick question. To move, rotate and scale faces and objects, have they implemented manipulators as in SDS applications or is it still the old EIM convoluted way of doing it by holding down YXZ keys?

Cheers

Robert

Congratulations on the new job.

[Gigayoda]

Ian what are your CPU specs again? Are you mainly beta testing on mac or pc as well?

[PaulS2]

Hi everyone,

I played a bit last night.... Many things have no interface yet so I won't be able to say much.... But, here are some minor observations...

It's a complete revamp of EIM, same/similar tools, with the very latest ACIS engine. The 'framework' is now very OS X; nice animations for the dialogues and tool selections (less clicking then EIM). There is no export yet and so far there is OBJ and SAT import. There are no UV tools yet that I can see (Does any ACIS modeller do UVs?). Tesla launches in less then a second....

OpenGL and selection tools are the same as EIM so far, and bevelling has not yet been implemented.

It seems to me that to answer all your questions, I'd need a build with a more complete interface.

Best,
Ian

Thanks Ian.

Can the Obj import be used as a cage in the Ubernurbs?

I think Tesla for Xmas is wishful thinking or a a very shakey V1 release......and a shakey V1 will kill Tesla before it even gets started.

EIM has a history (in some minds) which Tesla needs to fix or correct - here is an opportunity to have a fresh start. If it comes out less than capable and spectacular it probably will be viewed as just more of the same.

A completely open beta would give users much room for feedback and would get the modeler out into circulation. Then EI could take a little more time to get everything done right.

[Reuben5150]

Is there a windows version in the works or is that coming "later" ?

For me this is gonna have to be a really great app to replace concepts 3d and old EIM in any case, i also agree that there should be an open beta for registered EI users.

[ediris]

100% agree with Paul.S and Reuben.But lets not left alone that we all want new costumers as all the hopes are to replace EIAS for Tesla. Rememeber guys it is not gonna be only a modeler but a future for EITG.

In the past EIM cant select multiple faces once converted to SDS, does it has the ability to select multiple and loop of faces and edges like Modo does?

Thanks,
Edgard

[futagoza]

..., i also agree that there should be an open beta for registered EI users.

Not only for registered Ei users. I think it´s very important to make it dongle free and let the whole 3D community participate in a public beta, so that EITG get´s recognized again, which in the end would allow non-EI users to discover EIAS also.

Regards
Stefan

[halfworld]

Hi all,

Thanks for those comments, I'll take them back to Brad, incidentally, we all appear to be on the same wavelength about these things (dongle, beta etc.)...

Best,
Ian

[juanxer]

Is there a windows version in the works or is that coming "later"?
If Tesla is built on the multiplatform framework I think they are using, a Windows version ought to exist already, with a Windows-like UI.

[halfworld]

The Windows version will will almost certainly ship at the same time.

Best,
Ian

[Seabear]

Hi Ian

One quick question. To move, rotate and scale faces and objects, have they implemented manipulators as in SDS applications or is it still the old EIM convoluted way of doing it by holding down YXZ keys?
EIM was an ACIS solids and Nurbs (Ubernurbs) modeler, SDS (Ubermesh) was a later but pioneering addition to the toolset.
Modeling in EIM is far from 'convoluted', on the contrary. I for one believe that EIM Ubermesh ('SDS') cage componant manipulation to be far more immediate and spontaneous than any other sds modeler I can think of (I have tried nearly all of them).
EIM was a lean and mean app for professionals. (so mean and lean it lacked some very necessary features however, but it was never really finished).
Hopefully 'Tesla' will be.

[plsyvjeucxfw]

Hello Malcolm,

good to hear from you again. Of course you're right about not having a manipulator making the work flow lean and mean. But that's if you become familiar with the process and know what you are doing.

Not having a manipulator is difficult for beginners, or for those such as myself who prefer one. We should have the option to switch the manipulator on or off, user preference.

I feel the same way about persistent selection. User preference, leave it on, or switch to temporary selection.

As always, choice is good.

[Seabear]

Hello Malcolm,

good to hear from you again. Of course you're right about not having a manipulator making the work flow lean and mean. But that's if you become familiar with the process and know what you are doing.

Not having a manipulator is difficult for beginners, or for those such as myself who prefer one. We should have the option to switch the manipulator on or off, user preference.

I feel the same way about persistent selection. User preference, leave it on, or switch to temporary selection.

As always, choice is good.
Saying you 'should' have a 'manipulator (gnomon)' is a bit like saying to a drawing instructor you 'should' have an eraser. (Something I always refused to allow, being the monster I am, as was my tutor).
I remember how stricken I was, coming from EIM (sds) to other sds apps that thrust this alien object in front of my face when modeling complex cages. Very clumsy obstructive and tedious, was my thought then, as now.
I think there will be much higher coding priorities in a professional modeling app like EIM. You will be surprised at just how quickly one learns to 'fly' without such devices, or dependency, in EIM.
That sounds a tad 'chauvinistic' , I think if there is a demonstrable advantage to such a GUI device, then the option should indeed be included at some stage

[Seabear]

Thanks Ian.

Can the Obj import be used as a cage in the Ubernurbs?
A completely open beta would give users much room for feedback and would get the modeler out into circulation. Then EI could take a little more time to get everything done right.
Hello Paul
Imported .obj available as cage for sds would be most desirable.
I dont agree that a public beta testing program would be, however.
EIM is an advanced modeling tool that you, Cristobal, Fred Kuentz and others have demonstrated to be capable of of extremely complex and precise modeling.
As such, EIM (Tesla) should continue to be developed and tested by professionals in a separate beta testing arena to EIAS, in my opinion.
Open beta testing will only drown the project in suggestions and wishlists that usually prove to be redundent, fanciful and even destructive. Hobbyists and enthusiasts have their place but not in sophisticated, professional tool development. (Of course suggestions and ideas should be solicited from any user and can be, in such places as this).
Testing is also a disciplined procedure that has to be well presented, as prepared test projects with adequate documentation of bugs and problems.
You have shown this to be the case with your own invaluable, exhaustive contributions in the past. I believe its a mistaken belief; that anyone out there can contribute equally in such an enterprise.
We have to consider the difficulties faced by programers and project managers, trying to decipher amateur attempts to describe a bug or feature. Often such bugs prove to be fictitious and born of ignorance of the software, thereby wasting precious resources, etc .

best regards BTW

[Martin Kay]

Hello Paul
Imported .obj available as cage for sds would be most desirable.
I dont agree that a public beta testing program would be, however.
EIM is an advanced modeling tool that you, Cristobal, Fred Kuentz and others have demonstrated to be capable of of extremely complex and precise modeling.
As such, EIM (Tesla) should continue to be developed and tested by professionals in a separate beta testing arena to EIAS, in my opinion.
Open beta testing will only drown the project in suggestions and wishlists that usually prove to be redundent, fanciful and even destructive. Hobbyists and enthusiasts have their place but not in sophisticated, professional tool development. (Of course suggestions and ideas should be solicited from any user and can be, in such places as this).
Testing is also a disciplined procedure that has to be well presented, as prepared test projects with adequate documentation of bugs and problems.
You have shown this to be the case with your own invaluable, exhaustive contributions in the past. I believe its a mistaken belief; that anyone out there can contribute equally in such an enterprise.
We have to consider the difficulties faced by programers and project managers, trying to decipher amateur attempts to describe a bug or feature. Often such bugs prove to be fictitious and born of ignorance of the software, thereby wasting precious resources, etc .

best regards BTW

Sheesh, what an arrogant post! Lol! Probably a lot of the past problems with EIM was the poor documentation and lack of tutorials. I think it's been conceded that many tools in EIM didn't work. Maybe 'professionals' like you Mr Thain don't need tutorials.

Martin K

[Seabear]

Sheesh, what an arrogant post! Lol! Probably a lot of the past problems with EIM was the poor documentation and lack of tutorials. I think it's been conceded that many tools in EIM didn't work. Maybe 'professionals' like you Mr Thain don't need tutorials.

Martin K
Old fashioned maybe, but certainly not arrogant, old fashioned in the sense that I too had to yield to experienced and knowledgeable journeymen and masters.
I know humility well, and I have tasted arrogance, but I am sincere in my belief that beginners are beginners and the experienced are there to pass on all they know. Tutorials I have depended on as much as the next man. Sorry to offend, but I gave my reasons for my position on this matter.
I had enormous help from EI users and their tutorials, I trust that the legacy continues.

[Martin Kay]

Old fashioned maybe, but certainly not arrogant, old fashioned in the sense that I too had to yield to experienced and knowledgeable journeymen and masters.
I know humility well, and I have tasted arrogance, but I am sincere in my belief that beginners are beginners and the experienced are there to pass on all they know. Tutorials I have depended on as much as the next man. Sorry to offend, but I gave my reasons for my position on this matter.
I had enormous help from EI users and their tutorials, I trust that the legacy continues.

No offence taken! Just amused! The work you produce is undoubtedly top notch!

Martin K

[futagoza]

The reason why i also raised my voice for a public beta (as hobbyist) is that i like to see professionals which are using Big 5 3D Software are testing this baby too, so that i can judge later on if i decide to buy the software or not. It´s better to see the software beta tested by all those professionals instead of a handful EI pro´s which at the end overlook bugs (see EIAS) and EITG doesn´t get the exposure for free it needs...

One thing i also don´t like to see is if Tesla would be only presented to a handful of EI Pro´s is the lack of user assistance and tutorials (Paul and Cristobal excepted) which makes it hard for current EI users to understand the software better, which IMHO wouldn´t happen if Big 5 users would participate in this or at EITG´s forum.

Regards
Stefan

[Martin Kay]

The reason why i also raised my voice for a public beta (as hobbyist) is that i like to see professionals which are using Big 5 3D Software are testing this baby too, so that i can judge later on if i decide to buy the software or not. It´s better to see the software beta tested by all those professionals instead of a handful EI pro´s which at the end overlook bugs (see EIAS) and EITG doesn´t get the exposure for free it needs...

One thing i also don´t like to see is if Tesla would be only presented to a handful of EI Pro´s is the lack of user assistance and tutorials (Paul and Cristobal excepted) which makes it hard for current EI users to understand the software better, which IMHO wouldn´t happen if Big 5 users would participate in this or at EITG´s forum.

Regards
Stefan

I think one thing you can be sure of is that there won't be a public beta...
To suggest that the app shouldn't be tested by hobbyists is highly amusing and ludicrous. At the end of the day the first priority for EITG is sell the product to as many users as possible, whoever they are, even if the software sits 'collecting dust on a shelf'.

I think, public beta or not, I with a few others who have any awareness or interest at all in EI, have a pretty good idea of what lies ahead, especially in this economic environment, for the whole product line...

Martin K

[futagoza]

Ooops, i didn´t meant that it only should be tested by pro´s since i´m as a hobbyist are also interested to test Tesla. It was only meant as a response to the previous post which IMHO suggested that only EI pro´s, if understood corrrectly, should test it.

Anyways, i´m also curious what the 3D future for us will bring...

Regards
Stefan

[juanxer]

I think one ought to distinguish hobbyists and amateurs from simple beginners: one can just visit some well established 3D hobbyists websites to see demonstrations of incredible skills and artistic talent. Getting the attention of that crowd would be a winner.

Also, I don't see EIM/Tesla being more complex or "Pro" than most tools out there: in fact, it could be argued that it is rather less complex and less fully-featured than its competition, and that it makes up for it by being easier and quite pleasant to work with (when it works). Ultimately, EIM was in the 3DToolkit, so... What an app like Tesla needs, as a solids/surfaces/SDS modeler, is learning material that explains the philosophy behind the app's approach to modeling (that is, not just each tool's "what" but the "why" too) and ways to solve things. That's all.

Managing an open beta well is another issue entirely, I guess, but then others have done it (Rhino went through one, didn't it? MOI did, too. Etc.). In any event, a Beta implies a more or less frozen featureset, so our usual Tesla noise :) would be a bit more focused than usual.

[PaulS2]

At this point in time I think an open beta would be like free promotion for EI. If the product is good then many will try and use it....EI needs new blood. If the modeler is simple enough to understand from a new-user's point of view there is chance of success...and attention will be focused by the users into this area of ease of use and quick results.

I'm of the mind Tesla can be a wonderful new tool for thousands of graphic designers breaking into 3D....if it's done right. Yes, there will be more to sift through to fix some things but if there is an issue with work-ability many voices can't be ignored where one or two certainly can, and have been in the past.

McNeel and Assoc is a great model for how to do an open beta successfully.

In the past there weren't enough voices telling EI that EIM was not workable for them....and EI certainly didn't listen as carefully as they needed to in the past.

The simple and easy factor has been raised with ViaCad and MOI but EIM still has some nice features to set it apart.

I guess we'll see before too long.

[UnixMonkey]

Just to muddy the waters further. I think that during the Alpha Testing phase of Tesla (before the feature set is nailed down) the testing should be limited to a small group of testers, experienced hobbyist included, but not open to the public. Too many cooks etc... That way the developers can focus on the core functionality and features of the program. But, during the Beta Testing (after the feature set is mostly complete) they should open the program to the public. Beta testing should be the phase in the development cycle when they are trying to squash bugs, not add features, so the more machines they have the program tested on the better.

Richard

[juanxer]

That makes sense, I guess.

To widen the spectrum of points of view, perhaps EITG should look for alphatester people whose expertise is in truly different areas: archviz, industrial design and such are a given, but it would be useful to see what the character modelers, extreme minutiae-oriented ones, game asset ones, previz ones, poly modeling-accustomed ones, etc. have to say about the product, even if Tesla wouldn't mean to target them specifically.

Saying you 'should' have a 'manipulator (gnomon)' is a bit like saying to a drawing instructor you 'should' have an eraser...
...That sounds a tad 'chauvinistic' , I think if there is a demonstrable advantage to such a GUI device, then the option should indeed be included at some stage
I think it is essential to have one when manipulating items in Iso or Perspective views: without it, doing things like SDSs in EIM is rather painful, nearly relegating the Iso view to doing element selections only. Modo does it right, I've finally come to believe: it lets one do both direct item manipulation and "at a distance" clicking and dragging, plus the widget provides some useful feedback data.

An Animator without manipulator widgets wouldn't be very nice, really :).

Does ACIS prevent using manipulator widgets in any way?

[cjberg]

Definitely not "essential"... it is a crutch, I find myself fighting it in modo more than being helped by it. Probably one of the reasons I find EIM faster to model than other SDS apps.

Cj

That makes sense.


I think it is essential to have one when manipulating items in Iso or Perspective views: without it, doing things like SDSs in EIM is rather painful, nearly relegating the Iso view to doing element selections only. Modo does it right, I've finally come to believe: it lets one doboth direct item manipulation and "at a distance" clicking and dragging, plus the widget provides some useful feedback data.

An Animator without manipulator widgets wouldn't be very nice, really :).

Does ACIS prevent using manipulator widgets in any way?

[3DArtZ]

EITG could learn A LOT from the guy developing MOI3d.
He opened that sucker up for public beta, which expired like the next year.

He never took crits personally and added what seemed reasonable or explained
in a reasonable manner why something could not be added or would not be added.

If they think its some sort of marketing advantage to not showing the world what tesla is looking like... well that time passed for 3d software.... somewhere around 1999.

OPEN THAT SUCKER UP, I WANT A CRACK AT IT!

Mike Fitz
www.3dartz.com

[arketype]

Public Betas are not just about feature testing..... it is about Buzz.

In fact it could be argued that the primary purpose of open Betas is purely marketing... Creating Buzz about a new product (which EITG genuinely needs).

Overall I see almost no downside to a public Beta- ;)

Dave

[nibeck]

I completely agree that a public beta is needed. There are a few possible negatives, all of which can be avoided.

1 - Be sure it's "good enough". People will excuse a lot with the Beta tag, but not everything. It has to be good enough that people "get it", but not bad enough that the bnegative press/comments will overshadow any of the buzz

2 - You need to clearly state expectations about feedback. The one downside with open etas is the potential onslaught of feedback. If you can't manage that correctly, you will end up with a mess.

It's a little hard to understand, but people really feel connected with a product if they can participate in these things. Makes them feel "special".

Hell, gmail is still in "beta" :-)

_mike

[mike33]

Why not just keep Beta 1 to a select few who EITG has vetted. Once the Beta 1 team feels Tesla meets a certain milestone on functionality open up Tesla to Beta 2 - a public release. No doubt there will be more issues found when more people with God only knows how many PC/Mac configs start trying to model.

Cheers,

Mike

Engineer by day,
Family man by nights and weekends,
Part time dabbling artist in-between

[Martin Kay]

Ooops, i didn´t meant that it only should be tested by pro´s since i´m as a hobbyist are also interested to test Tesla. It was only meant as a response to the previous post which IMHO suggested that only EI pro´s, if understood corrrectly, should test it.

Anyways, i´m also curious what the 3D future for us will bring...

Regards
Stefan

Hi Stefan, no, I wasn't suggesting that it was you who said it should only be tested by 'pros'!
It was Seabear. ;-)

Martin K

[Martin Kay]

No doubt as in the past EITG perceive some 'risk' in a public beta. I was only allowed 14 days to have a go at EI vs 7... If I may venture as to be so bold, they probably want us to pay for the product and then beta test it... However, I have the feeling that this tack won't work at this point in time as things stand.

Martin K

[Seabear]

100% agree with Paul.S and Reuben.But lets not left alone that we all want new costumers as all the hopes are to replace EIAS for Tesla. Rememeber guys it is not gonna be only a modeler but a future for EITG.

In the past EIM cant select multiple faces once converted to SDS, does it has the ability to select multiple and loop of faces and edges like Modo does?

Thanks,
Edgard
EIM Ubernurbs loops (sds faces) could always be multiple selected. (shift drag or click as I remember)

[Seabear]

Why not just keep Beta 1 to a select few who EITG has vetted. Once the Beta 1 team feels Tesla meets a certain milestone on functionality open up Tesla to Beta 2 - a public release. No doubt there will be more issues found when more people with God only knows how many PC/Mac configs start trying to model.

Cheers,

Mike

Engineer by day,
Family man by nights and weekends,
Part time dabbling artist in-between

A good compromise I think Mike, but I suspect that this place will suffice for 'beta 2' rather like Post Forum in days of yore.

[DickM]

EI said public beta, so there had better be a public beta!

[halfworld]

That's interesting, just so I'm on the same page, where did EITG say that?

Best,
Ian

[DickM]

well I read a thread somewhere, can't remember where, I'd have to find it.

But it was also confirmed, but not sure I can say anything more :shrug:

[richardjoly]

Here it is:
"EI Technology Group delivers the Sonica Plug-in only two months before the expected beta release of “Tesla”, EI Technology Group’s new 3D modeling package. Tesla, a new hybrid solids modeler is a revolutionary move forward for EI Technology Group. Beta release for Tesla is expected in May 2008."
http://www.eitechnologygroup.com/news/article/sonica_plug_in_for_maya_public_beta_release

[DickM]

That's part of it. It says Beta release. I thought I read more. I really can't remember.

Basically it would be stupid not to do it. EI marketing has always been pretty lousy. So make up your minds EI, and when you know exactly what your going to do, do the complete opposite! :surprised

[cjberg]

Maybe... just Maybe... it was confusion?

"The first software application delivered in this new alliance will be Sonica, a Maya plug-in that allows animators to break digital sound waveforms into frequency bands and drive any animation channel. This Maya plug-in will be available as a public beta release later this month. The second software application delivered will be EIM, otherwise known as Electric Image Modeler. This new modeler has a slated release date of March 1st, 2008. EIM will be written on all new framework and developed for both Apple Universal Binary and Microsoft Windows platforms. A third application, revolutionary in nature, codenamed “Kryptonite” is slated for a May 2008 announcement."

it says the Maya plug will be a public beta, but not EIM(Tesla)

Cj

[Seabear]

Just to muddy the waters further. I think that during the Alpha Testing phase of Tesla (before the feature set is nailed down) the testing should be limited to a small group of testers, experienced hobbyist included, but not open to the public. Too many cooks etc... That way the developers can focus on the core functionality and features of the program. But, during the Beta Testing (after the feature set is mostly complete) they should open the program to the public. Beta testing should be the phase in the development cycle when they are trying to squash bugs, not add features, so the more machines they have the program tested on the better.

Richard
A good compromise I think
(BTW, although I did say 'pro' users, I was referring to any user with a high skill level and capable of submitting disciplined and well presented bug reports and suggestions)

[ediris]

Hey man there is no way to shift select , that is very old way to select multiple faces or edges or points. There should be a loop selection and all those possible selection modes.
That is very retarded and way to antique.Just my little two cents.

NOW WE HAVE NO WAY TO SELECT MULTIPLE FACES,EDGES OR VERTEX.

[Seabear]

Hey man there is no way to shift select , that is very old way to select multiple faces or edges or points. There should be a loop selection and all those possible selection modes.
That is very retarded and way to antique.Just my little two cents.

NOW WE HAVE NO WAY TO SELECT MULTIPLE FACES,EDGES OR VERTEX.

No one said that EIM would not develop new features as Tesla, EIM was one of the first apps to employ sds. Just wait and see what emerges.
Nonetheless I managed to construct complex character cages with Ubermesh just as handily as Silo. Other selection modes and filters are useful aids to fixing bad topology in imported cages, I grant you.

[ediris]

As much as i admire your work , you have to know that i have model a jeep in SDS with C4D,so dont tell me that is user error, is just practical and make sense to me and i am sure to other people will make sense.

[Frankg]

I think the most common misunderstanding concerning EIM / Tesla is the expectation of a non-brainer modeling solution like C4D. EIM / Tesla is a complex construction-safe modeling solution with all limitations in freeness of modeling such a tool brings with it.
I do not think this is a user-issue, but a marketing-issue, which EITG has to solve.
For me it is not clear which target-group EIM / Tesla aims at.
For CA it is too complex, too exact and even too slow. For people who wants to use their models in a construction-environment, like me, it is one of the easiest solutions on the market, but limited to simple modeling tasks, because some of the higher-level modeling tools like continuity-tools on trimmed surfaces or volume-calculation or more basic: numeric input doesn't exist.
On the other hand SDS on NURBS-base is great and really works. It is not so easy to work with as the SDS in C4D, but C4D is ways more inexact, or better said: works with much less polys as EIM / Tesla does, because of it's unlimited NURBS-Solution. The price to pay for is a not so easy to use interface and some limitations in modeling.
I have a real high-end package for my constructive modeling work which has too a sort of SDS-modeling. This solution is ways more ineffective as EIM / Tesla or C4D. This solution is half NURBS-, half poly-based. Anyway people say this is a real killer-feature in a constructive environment. I think ÜberNURBS are really a stand-alone feature, which no other app touches. But it should be better explained for what they can be used.

Regards

Frankg

[Seabear]

I think the most common misunderstanding concerning EIM / Tesla is the expectation of a non-brainer modeling solution like C4D. EIM / Tesla is a complex construction-safe modeling solution with all limitations in freeness of modeling such a tool brings with it. I think ÜberNURBS are really a stand-alone feature, which no other app touches. But it should be better explained for what they can be used.
Regards
Frankg

EIM is an ACIS solids modeler, and as you say very precise, also its complex, deep and versatile. EIM has a superior GUI in the hands of expert (or professional, trained) hands, (albeit difficult to approach for teach yourself beginners)
EIM also includes ubernurbs, a useful tool for modeling freehand, curvilinear or organic forms.
EiM also exploits the Ubernurbs manipulation cage to control an optional (Catmul Clark) subdivision surfaces mesh as 'Ubermesh'.
Ubermesh superseded Ubernurbs for most organic modeling. Ubermesh is a very effective character modeling tool. Ubermesh is but a small part of the overall capability of EIM.
One can anticipate that Tesla will advance/enhance these capabilities even further.

[ediris]

EIM is an ACIS solids modeler, and as you say very precise, also its complex, deep and versatile. EIM has a superior GUI in the hands of expert (or professional, trained) hands, (albeit difficult to approach for teach yourself beginners)
.

That is my point well written manuals and video tutorials should be included in the DVD or for Download. More and more material example scnes, step by step tutorials. Is got a huge potential on the right hands, but who decides who is capable of modeling or not? If i can model a face in InfiniD i think i may be able to figure out any software, i have work with a lot of software and EIM is not similar.

[futagoza]

Hi Ian,

just have a question for you regarding Tesla. I was playing yesterday with EIM to familiarize myself a bit with the workflow, so once Tesla is comming i´m better prepaired. My question is can Tesla "fill" or "cover" non-planar wire bodies or non-planar closed bezier/NURBS curves, like ViaCAD can. I tried yesterday an old EIM challenge (3 pronged object from Juanxer) and thought this would be the solution, but to my surprise EIM can´t do this. It can only import those created shapes as entities.

Any info (on this for me very important feature) would be greatly appreciated!

Regards
Stefan

[UnixMonkey]

I hate to bring this up, but, Uh... where are the screen shots?

r.

[cjberg]

Posted a while ago to EITG site... link is on the top of their home page: http://www.eitechnologygroup.com/display/image_full/1193/

[UnixMonkey]

I meant - where are the NEW screen shots? Ian - Throw us a bone.

r.

[ediris]

HI Stefan :) Covering wires must be planar and exact , watch the curves modification because it might create some twisting even if you cant see any, i also avoid using these type of tools better use the knife tool to cover your surfaces, that is just me but probably Malcolm will have the solution to it since he is the know it all of EIM.

[futagoza]

Hi Edgard,

thanks for the reply but i must admit i quite don´t understand what you mean with "better use the knife tool to cover your surfaces"?!

Regards
Stefan

[ediris]

Example make your free form surface on SDS and than use the knife tool to create your planar surfaces.
The only way i have found any success in creating surfaces from curves is by using their default curves (non Nurbs curves). I try to create a NURBS curves and extrude them and sometimes i have succes other i dont bother cause i need to do some other treatment to my surfaces like extude them. But the need of good tutorials on Soid Modeling will be very good.

[futagoza]

Ah, thanks Edgard i understand now. But i was refering to a non-planar surface. IMHO this kind of surfaces should be constructed in a NURBS Modeler without using SDS, while an SDS option is a nice and useful addition.

Anyways, hope this non-planar question get answered one day by either Ian or Kishore, etc.

Regards
Stefan

[ediris]

No you cant, i answer that right now. You cant from a non planar surfaces, you just can create aplanar object like a bezier nurbs and converted into NURBS and edited but the interface of it is quite confusing for me. But the answer is not you cannot make a plane from a non planar curve , all the points have to be in one axis only.I have tried Stefan it just doesnt work , i donot know it is non common in any app havent tryed the one you mentioned in your original post.ANyways i am sure there are ways to achieve the same results you just have to fry your brain.

[PaulS2]

I actually don't know of any nurbs modeler which will create a plane from nonplanar curves....and it be a useful surface. The definition of plane would indicate a planar surface.

In EIM it's a piece of cake to use your curves as knives to cut from a planar surface or to hit "P" while in edit mode to make your curves planar.

[futagoza]

Hi Edgard, hi Paul,

even if i risk to be called later on the biggest 3D dummie here on CGTalk i give it a try again.

As you can see in my first picture i created with the Bezier tool a n sided planar wire and filled it. The second object on the right is a copy of the left wire but with the control points adjusted differently in the y direction, so that the fill tool doesn´t work. As of my understanding this wire is non-planar, right?

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r212/sacenator/eim-1.png

What i like to archive later when Tesla is available that the second non-planar wire can be filled also like shown in my next example, which is the IGES import from the previous EIM
wire.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r212/sacenator/viacad.png

Why i came up with this is that i think it can be a useful addition to the toolset. Like i mentioned before with Juanxer´s good olé 3 pronged object, it would be as i understand EIM so far than very easy to create the tail of this object with for copied parts, of a 5 part wire...

Regards
Stefan

[3DArtZ]

Stephan, I have not used eim in a long time, but perhaps inorder to fill that 2nd shape you could use the net surface tool?

that is what I would do in MOI3d...

[futagoza]

Hi Mike,

this was only a quick example what i like to archive. I think EIM´s net surface tool requires 3 U and 3 V wires at least and the coons tool 4 wires. However as i figured out if i use 3 profiles and use the skin tool and the cover tool i have the same surface after editing it a bit. But what if i like to use a five sided wire like the tail part of this three pronged object?

Regards
Stefan

[ediris]

Stephan, I have not used eim in a long time, but perhaps inorder to fill that 2nd shape you could use the net surface tool?

that is what I would do in MOI3d...

yes Mike but you dont get such nice precision like in other 3d applications, but i am no expert on ACIS modeling so it looks to me that Tesla is got the latest of ACIS let see how it rocks.

[futagoza]

Hi all,

just saw an ad from NVidia which is bringing out a TeslaTM* Product and wondered if EITG can still use the name Tesla for it´s Modeler?!

*http://www.nvidia.com/object/personal_supercomputing.html

Regards
Stefan

[juanxer]

I hope they are different enough products: 3D modeling software vs. GPGPU-oriented multicore GPU cards for the supercomputing market (that is, curiously enough, 3D cards doing non-3D tasks :D)

[Reuben5150]

EITG's Tesla was announced first so you might ask- can envidia still use the name ;)

[juanxer]

I think nVidia's product arrived to market around last year's end or so :shrug:

[plsyvjeucxfw]

Tesla Motors:

http://www.teslamotors.com/

An all electric roadster that out runs a Porsche!

Seems anything with the name Tesla (as in the early 20th century electrical genius Nikola) sounds really powerful and cool!

[juanxer]

So yeah let's be powerful and cool! :D

(and I still demand a dose of Tesla beta UI pr0n :drool: )

[Slave1]

Hi Ian it's slave1 ( Nick )

Is there any news yet of the release date of EIAS 8 and Tesla?

A little tired of waiting...
Disappointed to hear there is no UV mapping...

Any screen shots?

Thanks :shrug:

Nick

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