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View Full Version : Renderware: Radiosity Lighting in Max5


Vassago
05-30-2003, 04:50 AM
Our company is currently working on Daredevil, for Xbox and PS2, using Renderware. In the past, using 3dsmaxR4 we hand painted our scenes using the vertex paint modifier. This was not only extremely time consuming, but in the end would produce results that were not optimal to our art standards. I recently picked up Max5 at home, and began doing tests using it's radiosity lighting.
While the results within Max were the same as any other GI app
(Arnold, Lightscape, etc), I was unsure if they would properly export to Renderware.
I talked our staff into picking up a copy for the office to test it out with RW. To my extreme satisfaction, the vertex baking ported the radiosity info flawlessly. For those of you using Renderware and Max5, and considering using Radiosity, there was only one thing I found as a downside. You need to bake the vert colors with the radiosity box checked, as well as "mix vertex colors". If you do not check that mix box, the vertex bake will completely obliterate your tri-stripping. I tested meshes that stripped with a 85% quality ratio. When the "mix colors" box was checked, it retained that quality. When it was unchecked, it was visually better looking, but it ripped my quality down to 17%. It's basically seperating every triangle in the scene with seperate color info.
When the colors are mixed though, visual quality of the lighting dropped a smidge. I'd say that on average it dropped to around 85% of the quality I got otherwise. So in retaining the stripping I lost about 15% of the overall lighting quality. So the scene still looked incredibly realistic, and I retained the high performence tristripping I needed. I hope this info helps at least one person out there ;)

Oktavian
05-30-2003, 10:05 AM
A useful hint ...
but this thread should be moved to the new "3dsMax Tutorials & Tips" forum.

[edit]:
Dooh, my mistake, its the right place here - sorry.

EricChadwick
05-30-2003, 02:01 PM
Sounds like something the Renderware folks should hear about, could be a slight bug in their exporter plugin... did you send this their way?

dchavez
05-30-2003, 02:03 PM
Yeah, we've also done some work with Renderware and Max5.1 Radiosity, and although I'm a game coder in my daytime role (an Artist in my spare time :) I recall one of our R&D artists experiencing much the same stripping issues that you mentioned. Especially frustrating when you're trying to maximise performance on the PS2 SKU too....

Nice to know there are people out there experiencing the same sorts of issues - makes you wish RW provided more opportunities for the sharing of developer experiences via some sort of message boards. In fact I find the RW support site somewhat lacking generally (as well as frustratingly slow from an overseas link).

Cheers,

DChavez.

Vassago
05-30-2003, 03:34 PM
Yea, it's really nice to know that other people are experiencing the same problems, dchavez ;) RW can be very frustrating at times.

I haven't sent this into to the folks at RW just yet, Posm. I will when I get some free time though ;)

They need help though, hehe. There is pretty much no documentation on how to use their sectorization hints, which makes culling the world for PVS a real pain. Hopefully there are some new additions in 3.5 when we upgrade here shortly.

suck
05-30-2003, 11:34 PM
i was digging into max5 radiosity back in the 5 beta days... we too were using ghetto vertex painting tools and assign vertex colors, so our lighting looked like hell. i was really disappointed to see that the initial release of max5 had lots of problems with the radiosity->vertex colors path. the new assign vertex colors utility was totally unreliable and would often produce garbage when baking the radiosity solution.

fortunately, discreet released a .gup that gives maxscript access to the radiosity mesh. using it i was able (with the help of kelly snapka of volition), to write a bunch of scripts for baking the radiosity info and blending the seams that it produces between meshes. so although i can't give out these tools, i'll say that it is totally possible to script a great lighting solution. it just wouldn't be discreet if it worked out of the box though, right!?

kelly released his vertex color tools version 2 though, and i forget whether or not he has a radiosity baking function in there. might be worth looking into.

dchavez
05-31-2003, 02:05 AM
@Vassago: We haven't really looked too much at the static PVS hints on world exporting - we're using a Clump-based approach for our world which allows us to do dynamic streaming depending on the player position. Actually you may want to look at upgrading to RW 3.6 which is supposed to be out soon (check their site for more info). It's meant to include a number of improvements: notably a dynamic streaming solution for static geometry, and better support for Max 5.1 Lightmap export to the dynamic RwLtMap plugin.

Cheers,
DChavez.

Vassago
05-31-2003, 06:06 PM
Hey Suck - by any chance, do you know where I might be able to pick up Kelly's toolset?

I have also noticed that at times, the radiosity solution seems to leave hard, dark edges on things. It would be great if I could get rid of those without having to go into the verts and manually fix them. Thanks ;)

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