PDA

View Full Version : warbot trio


crackle
05-04-2008, 06:33 PM
Hi all

i have these three robots i plan to do something with. right now i have been mostly workin on textures and weaponry. i thought i could post what i've got so far and get some feedback hopefully.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/BNR2turnaround2.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/BNR3turnaround.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/chainturn.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/shineywalkfinal.mov

crackle
05-04-2008, 06:36 PM
here's some pics of the "shiney" one

doffer
05-04-2008, 08:57 PM
At first when I looked at the images, I thought you had taken away a lot of flexibility, without elbows, knees and neck.
But when I look at you animations though, it looks amazinly flexible. Very well rigged. Could you talk a bit about how you rigged it?

I looks really great. And the design of the robots is really great.

Kid-Mesh
05-04-2008, 11:11 PM
LOL! This is a RAD character! I like it a lot.

I'm commenting on this clip here "shineywalkfinal.mov".

From what I see so far it's starting out pretty good but you could push this so much further. First of all your character is top heavy and you reflect this very well at FR 17.

When you first start out the anticipation of the right foot coming up sells very well. I can sense the weight of this guy. But FR 41 is weak and continues on like this through the end of the animation.

Scrub through your animation from FR1 - FR17 then mimic this for each step. Push it man, exagerate the heck out of this and really sell the weight for this character. I'm sure it will make the difference in taking it to the next level. Right now he just feels way too light.

Great friggin job though.

Keep animating!

crackle
05-10-2008, 06:34 AM
kid-mesh@ you are so right. i went and pushed the movements alot, but it became more and more cartoonish. i'll post the animation here tommorrrow if your interested. i know the weight is an issue though, he needs to be more of a lumbering strongman....

in the meantime, i've finished the rig for his little enemy/or sidekick. which is fully scalable so if need be i can have ones of different size and color also. well i guess i still have one issue left to figure out, and thats the abilility to pull it apart!

crackle
05-22-2008, 08:41 PM
still testing but its getting closer. animating the offset on the CD PSR constraint is becoming a big pain, i'm wondering if i'm doing it wrong... anyway this is what i'm working on animation the big robot with the little one. testing testing testing...


http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekicktest.mov

crackle
05-26-2008, 08:17 AM
shiney-er version, cleaned up quite abit as well.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/beheading.mov

crackle
05-28-2008, 12:53 AM
any comments?

please?

theflash
05-28-2008, 01:52 AM
I really like what you have so far. When the big guy separates the head of a small guy I would add more force and effort. I think you already have that snap effect, and it's working. But I think even a a bit of more effort before pulling his head off will add more beleiveability.

I also like that you have put secondary motion on the small guy after his head is detached.
I like that in the end he breathes. I love that subtle acting choice, because usually when person becomes angry breathing increases.

I love the character. However I dont like the texturing on it, it's too shiney and I dont like those saturated colors.

crackle
05-28-2008, 08:55 AM
thanks flash, very good comments. i am working on adding more to it, where he tosses the little bot behind hime then puts it's head on like a hat!


itmt i was trying out the luminated tex with a painted version. i dont like how the luminated parts look so flat, have to work on that...

theflash
05-28-2008, 05:34 PM
I am glad that my critique was helpful to you in some way.

I am not an much of a texture guy so mine is just viewer's point of view. I like what you posted on the first post, esp the middle render image. What sort of material are you trying to achieve? like a rusty robot? or shiney like the villain in movie robots?

crackle
05-28-2008, 08:07 PM
i'm more or less looking for a color palet that doesn't suck.

any paintovers with some color ideas would be great!

crackle
05-30-2008, 09:32 PM
here's verson 2.5 of the beheading, with more added, and comments improved apon!

please take a look

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/beheading2.5.mov

SalvadorRuizJr
06-01-2008, 03:56 AM
Theres still room to add more tention when he's pulling the head appart. Maybe add a bit of shaking. Imagine twisting off the cap of a pickle jar that's seal REALLY tight.

In terms of the posing with your camera, when the larger robot is just about to rip the head off, you could make the poses less even. Bring one of the elbows down a bit so when he rips the head off one hand goes down and the other goes up (if that makes any sense).

Also I can understand if there is a limitation in the rig that may prevent this, but the larger robot isn't grabbing hold of the smaller robot.

crackle
06-01-2008, 06:45 PM
True, there is so much left to do, and i'm still trying to understand animating constraints , so thats why the little robot isn't held to well. i'll be coming back to this after awhile

but for now i've finalized/standardized the rigs on the main three. maybe there would be some bettter color combo then the ones i have, any comments?

minifong
06-02-2008, 01:08 AM
I feel that the colour scheme for the characters is good, but maybe you'll have to check back to your set. Whether after compositing with the environment, the characters will stand out and still look appealing.

From the colors now, their personalities can roughly be figured out, I particularly like the yellow guy :D :D

I like the animation too :)

azozel
06-05-2008, 07:19 PM
I like your style and can't wait to see these guys in action.
Also you got a great signature. Nice to know I'm not alone.

crackle
06-06-2008, 06:22 PM
thanks for the comments guys, much appriciated!

i'm trying out a run cycle, trying to get a better feel of the character. its attitude and demeanor. this is what i've got so far, a front and side view of the run cycle. but it feels like its missing something, i think i need another set of eyes to see and maybe find whats missing or what could be added

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/0926.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/0926side.mov

crackle
06-07-2008, 07:32 AM
did some polishing, changed some things incrediblely. i like this version alot better

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/previewv2.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/previewv2side.mov

crackle
06-11-2008, 08:23 PM
new, animation with 785 getting upset.

kind of a doodle, but it gave me ideas for the next one.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/785rage.mov

gibby!
06-12-2008, 06:07 AM
hey man! i'm sure it's been said but these models are nice and the texturing is even better. anyway, your run cycle has has one big fault in it and that is the landing. your foot should be making contact with the ground ahead of the centre of gravity. Also, there's a pause during the cycle which should not be happening during a cycle. look at your character's arms for example: they don't pause and they look great. i hope that helps. beside that, it looks good!

crackle
06-12-2008, 09:23 PM
updated the 785 rage one alittle with a few tweaks and better camera work.


http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/785rage.mov


gibby!@ i think i know what your saying, i have worked on it some and i'll have something up later...

crackle
06-18-2008, 05:32 PM
heres a shot at a proper punch, this is about the thrird pass, so almost complete! it's in editor view so kinda plain but you get the point, there is a picture of what he'll look like textured.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/preview.mov

also Gibby, there are 2 new side and fronts of the run, please take a look.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/926runfront.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/926runside.mov

crackle
07-11-2008, 08:43 AM
http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048lumen.mov

updated animaton, robot get upset and pounds on the floor. rendered out really well.

also some updated shots of the main characters...

DevIII
07-11-2008, 08:59 PM
its a shame that most of the links are 404ing its hard to play catch up....
It like the dirrectness of the character it gets right to bussiness. The head ball really ads some nice character too.
the snappy movement is kind of cool, but its alitle to snappy for me. right now it just looks like youre missing frames. I had too watch it several times to make sure it wasn't internet lag. I think youd end up with a more pleasent viewing experience with 1-3 extra frames on the movements.
it will be interesting to see where you take this.

joryayer
07-12-2008, 02:36 PM
The only two links that work atm are:

048lumen.mov (http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048lumen.mov)
http://webpages.charter.net/icons/movie.gif beheadindHD.mov (http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/beheadindHD.mov)I'm really looking forward to seeing this, but I agree with above, it kinda bums out when we can't see it!

Hope you get the issue resolved!

crackle
07-14-2008, 02:12 AM
sorry about the missing links, i only have 20 meg for webspace, and i have to remove older stuff to make room. i'm trying to find a good host so i can put it all back on...have to wait alittle longer...

crackle
08-05-2008, 09:11 PM
here are some updated animations, with a much better presentation, or resolution. i've come to find out so much more about QTPro over the last few weeks, it seems to be the best 30 bucks i've ever spent.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048lumen.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/BHhd.mov

this may be my next project, it's ashley woods "bertie the pipebot" from a series called "robot vs zombie". there is also a "bramble MK2" that looks to be fun to model and animate as well. i'm trying to contact Ashley Wood for a possible collaberation, and permission to use(non-com). so well see were that goes. so check out the flicker link at some of the pictures.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/9889547@N06/sets/72157600755284148/with/2237182340/

priyankar101
08-07-2008, 07:56 AM
Cool work man ....the flexibility of the rig is very good. but have you seen when the big one catch the small one ....when it going to rip the small one ....check the right elbow....I think the pole vector is changing very suddenly.check that out ...rest is nice.

Regards,
priyankar

crackle
08-07-2008, 11:55 PM
good eye and nice catch. i'll have that updated in the next render. thanks also for viewing!

crackle
08-18-2008, 07:38 AM
here's my attempt at Bertie the Pipebot. i think the texturing is going to make or break theis model. the shapes an all are pretty simple (even though it did take me all day to make). i threw on some ol textures just for fun, and rendered it out in the r11 demo, gi-style! 10 sec! it would take 1 min with my lumen lite dome in r9. so that's pretty sweet.

and more pic of bertie

http://flickr.com/groups/wwr/pool/ (http://flickr.com/groups/wwr/pool/)



next i'm making Bramble MK2

here is a link for him...

http://toysrevil.blogspot.com/2008/08/back...-mk-2-merc.html (http://toysrevil.blogspot.com/2008/08/back...-mk-2-merc.html)



now does anyone have on of these 300 dollar toys? if you do please PM me, i'd like to get some better referance shots than the ones i've found on the net....

crackle
10-17-2008, 01:21 AM
i'm back working on the original robots, i've got some pretty good ideas on paper now and i need to work on the walk and runs to put in the library to pull from.

please take a look

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickrun2dviews.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickwalkviews.mov

Frogman
10-18-2008, 12:34 AM
I love the bots.

Concerning the walk and runs:

First off, would you post a simple untextured version or a more brightly lit version of the cycles with a frame counter - that will help with critiques.

The first thing I see is that there is not much of a weight shift over the legs in the passing pose (frame 7 - 8).

Try delaying in moving the rear foot forward until the forward toe is down (frame 3) and see how that feels. You might even wait a frame or two before the front foot goes back from the contact pose to the passing to emphasize the weight. I think a lumbering walk would really suit the character.

I can't really see what the hips are doing in the video but the overall feeling in the walk is nice.

You can probably push the arms a bit - try widening the arc they're swinging in (the wrist being further away from the body on the forward swing and closer on the back swing) to get more extension on them. You can extend them further at the front on the arc to offset the timing more as well. I don't think he should be loosey-goosy in the arms (I like that you were keeping the movement tight), but I think you could emphasize the weight and the power of the forearms/hands. Think of him as walking with bowling balls at the end of his wrists. Does it look better if you lower the hand in its rear swing during the passing pose? I think it might sell the weight more too.

As a polish, you can add some overlap in the fingers or give him some clenched fists. Also a little up down rotate on the head-ball could add a little overlap as well.

These guys are great ( I think I like the smiley bot - first post picture) the best. Great design!

Frogman
10-18-2008, 01:06 AM
On the Run:

Most of the same things in the walk apply to the run. Here are a couple other things I see.

Extend the legs! You extend your legs the most in a run to clear more distance - just have him bend on the passing leg, before the contact (high knee then kicking out to the contact pose), and when he takes the weight (okay..that is quite a bit of bending, but he really should have stretched legs in the contact and the extension).

Check the left are at 14 and 15 - you can see what I'm talking about most clearly on the top down view.

Nothing to really work on but, I think you doubled a frame at the beginning and end of the cycle. There is a slight jerk/pause..it will most likely be eliminated by getting rid of the last frame on the cycle.

Lets those arms extend and pump more - just really push the pose.

Great work! I am looking forward to seeing more of this.

crackle
10-18-2008, 07:09 AM
thanks! that was an awesome c/c. just what i was hoping to get!

i have made some changes, most of what you said has been done, hopfully to your liking...

i pushed the poses farther, but on the run i may have gone to far.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickrunview5.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickwalkview4.mov

thanks again, much apperciated!

Frogman
10-18-2008, 04:24 PM
Great - I like what you're doing here -

On the walk:

This might be an optical illusion, because the character is not translating in space (you know.. walking anywhere but in place) due to the cycle, but look at framecount 20 - 26. Notice how the whole body seems to be shifting back as his foot moves back. I think the body should stay fairly centered to the legs.

Looking at framecount 15-19 (Contact to Down). This might be a limit of the rig/model, but can you get any ankle rotation out of him? If so, let the foot make full contact on say, frame 17. Then bend the knee fully as the leg takes the weight. It is a succession of movement.. foot (often followed by toe for overlap) and then knee. The knee will bend a bit when the foot goes down, but not fully until the weight gets over that leg.

(Obviously the mirrored later half of the cycle will need the same corrections, but I'll point out a few small tweaks to some areas).

Frame 28: Point the front foot toe upward - you're looking for heel strike on the contact pose.

At 31: See if you can extend the forearm further back (bend the elbow) -- 33 might be the extreme before he starts the forward swing with the arm. You can play with it so he doesn't drag his knuckles.

@ 15-19: Notice how the front forearm seems almost stationary - try offsetting the timing on the arms by a couple frames so it is still swinging forward slightly as the weight bearing leg is moving back.

Look at the arcs on your arms (hands & and elbows) - arcs that look like squished figure 8's from above have a nice quality about them, but see what works best for the bot.

Lastly, the body still isn't shifting the weight over the leg bearing leg - this might be due to constraints in the model/rig, but if anything you can cheat it though rotating the body so that more weight is over the weight bearing leg. To see what I'm talking about, put your hands on your hips and stand on one foot. Bend the knee of the leg of your non-weight bearing leg and look down. You should see that the foot of the leg your standing on is fairly centered under you - your weight shifts over the foot so that you don't fall. The same thing is happening in a walk (walks are basically controlled falls). (If I repeat anything that you already know or seems obvious, my apologies - I'm just trying to be helpful).

Some other things to consider with your character: It is a robot. Duh.. But this gives you some liberties in your animation - you can make the movement more mechanical if you like. Just make sure when you're being mechanical in the character's movement that it is conscious and deliberate. Another thing to think about is realism vs exaggeration in the walk - you can play with timing and weight to get different feels to the walk.

Frogman
10-18-2008, 04:40 PM
On the Run:

Wow! This is starting to look great. I only see a couple things you might work out.

Frame 10 - Feet look great!

Frame 11 - 12 - Let the heel contact the ground first.

Frame 18 - something is going on with the rear leg/ankle.. Look at your graph editor and advance those rotation key forward two frames. Or just make sure the ankle does not break there.

Like in the walk, the body is translating forward and back too much. Look at 18 -22 - see how he looks like he is flying back. Look at the top view - it shows it the best if you were looking down at a runner on a treadmill, she would look pretty much stationary.

Have him leaning forward more in the run - you can probably just lift the whole rotation curve to fix it so you don't have to alter the individual keys.

Apart from those little things, it is looking nice. I think if you push your extreme poses further (stronger arms, pumping fists, longer strides, more angle on the body) and make the few foot tweaks, this will be golden. Great work!

Frogman
10-18-2008, 04:43 PM
Thought of 1 more thing -

The character would look great with a stomping, menacing walk - might be a good animation to do after you have these two worked out.

crackle
10-18-2008, 10:20 PM
again, thanks for the c/c. cant thank you enough!

i've followed your advice as much as i can. i think the walk improved the most just by pushing the legs out more, the run may seem the same, but to me is almost completely differt with the changes made. one of my problems may stem from how i scaled the keys to get a faster run. i have set up poses at f0, f7, f15, f22, f30. then once i got my poses, then i scaled the keys to get the speed right, then i offset everything from the legs as the base. what i had noticed last night was that the keys aren't spaced evenly like i had thought. that is also why he seems to favor one leg over the other, which i kinda like, unsymitry thingy. eitherway i may need to pick out my favorite poses from these and start over....

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickrunview6.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickwalkview5.mov

what i'm really trying to do is create a base walk/run for the little robots. these are supposed to be mass produced, cheap, in a clone wars kinda thing. i can scale the robot/rig easily enough to vary the size. the hieghts are 3-9 feet, while the larger 3 (red/yellow/black)are 10-15 feet tall. i'll try to make base walks/poses for the larger ones also. a kind of library to pull repetative movements from.

to give everyone an idea of what i would like to do i made this, only imagine 50 to 100 on screen... the loop is bad, but i dont know how to make that loop....

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickwalkgrouptest.mov

Frogman
10-19-2008, 02:56 AM
Wow - both look great now! You might counter animate the head a bit on the run so he has less side to side head motion and on the walk make sure that the body is not translating forward and back. I'm looking forward to seeing a hundred of these guys running around on screen.

crackle
10-19-2008, 03:09 AM
thanks for your help, i made a few corrrections, but for now i'm off to animate one of the big ones carring a chaingun!

crackle
10-22-2008, 08:20 AM
hey..

since i'm sitting here waiting for a render to finish i thought i'd post a line render of the little bots to see if you guys could help out with the paint schemes. think along the lines of clone trooper, using colors for rank, or squad colors, rank designs or insignia designs... if you have the time that is. my idea may be more apparent once i post the render...i'm waiting on.


the second is a shot of the robot with the arms moved back up, should i keep this and have a mix of the 2 types, or should i just keep one or the other?

crackle
10-22-2008, 06:12 PM
here's the animation with a group walk test.


http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/biggrouptest.mov

crackle
10-24-2008, 09:35 AM
i've gone with the idea of a mix of the tw0 and started modifing the walk for the one with the arms moved up.

aftera few hours this is what i've got.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickUAwalkview1.mov

Frogman
10-24-2008, 04:52 PM
Hey Kevin,

I like what you're doing here with the walk. See how it looks if you shift the arm animation so that the right arm is outstretched when the left leg is out and vice versa. Definitely keep the nice offset you have in the animation.

Ohh.. Can you post a group walk without the camera animation.. the swinging is kind of nauseating for me. Nice rendering though - I think a natural camera will be nice, but a little goes a long way. Not that I can really make suggestions for it.. I hate animating the camera :|

I can't tell for sure, but I think you may have some foot slip going on in the walk cycles in the group shot. You can counter it by having the master character control move twice the distance that the feet are translating. Like.. if your foot is going from 2 to -2 in the cycle, have your main control advance forward 8 units with each step (flat tangents). I don't like animating a character in place because footslip is a pain, but hopefully that will solve the problem for you.

Here is a pic (http://student.vfs.com/%7Ema12scott/graph-footslide.gif)of a test I just did - the little boxes are parented to the large one and moving from 2 to -2 and back.

crackle
10-24-2008, 05:32 PM
thanks for the tip! i was going to try to have him actually take a few steps in the loop to better deal with the slipping, but i thnk your tip should go much better!

over the weekend i'm going to redo the group walk adding a few of the new one into the group, as grunts and one LT, so a different on should be up over the weekend.

i fixed the arms, i pushed the offset way to much. hopefully you'll see the difference in this version. it's pretty smooth...

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickUAwalkview2.mov

Frogman
10-25-2008, 08:56 PM
Kevin,

You've got yourself one pretty cool walking robot. It has really come together - great job!

I never noticed this before now, but they shoulders move independently of the body. You probably won't want to do this, but I'll throw it out there. What do you think about putting in a groove (like a track) for the shoulder ball to move in? How it is, it is cartoony to have the shoulder separate from the body - it works. The character has no neck, so moving the body to rotate the shoulders (if they were attached) would have his head pointing in the same direction of the body.. I doubt you want that. A track for them to follow would reinforce the mechanical aspect of the character, would make the shoulder movement make sense physically, and be an effective solution to the issue of shoulder-balls intersecting the body geometry.

Or, just keep it like it is because it isn't really detracting from the character - I think I would like them better if they were actually separated from the body - just hovering off the sides of the body. Heck, put a glowy disk on the inside of a floating shoulder ball and that "explains" it visually very well.

Regardless - I think your project is going along great. Fantastic progress - I love the work and am looking forward to seeing more. Thanks Kevin.

crackle
10-26-2008, 12:40 AM
you know what, the foating arm idea may work! i'll mock it up and post it, we'll see how it goes. thanks also for all your comments. that was great to hear that i've got somethin going here, it has really motivated me to keep going with this.

here is an idea i have for a color scheme for one of the squads, i've used it already once, but so far it's the only one i've liked also. still working on some others and i'll use this scene as a test bed.

Nucleo
10-26-2008, 07:43 AM
Hey man really nice work you got there.

I love the smootheness ( there are some pops in the shoulders but iam guessing you are on it) i love the design and the character however there is one thing in my opinion that doesnt fit in this and that it is that it needs more weight it looks like a heavy character the arms swings look like they are heavy but the hips and the ammoung of energy trying to lift it self it doesnt seem that strong. hope this help and good luck with it.

crackle
10-26-2008, 07:00 PM
i agree, alittle. i could rotate the hips more as i scale him up, which is what i started thinking about once i had rendered out this little test last night

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickUAgroupwalktest.mov

the smallest one is at a scale of one, then 1.5 then 2. i scaled the animations according, and what i thought was to make some variations to each scale, but keep the core animation the same.

and just some backround. the smallest one is 3 ft tall, then 5, then 7. the larger ones (in previous posts) are about 12 ft tall.

the interesting part of this really is how i got the 3 into this loop, although not perfect, i figured out they are all together at frame 0 and 180, then i ofset the redered frames to 20 and 199. it was kinda cool for me to figure out that....

crackle
10-30-2008, 07:58 PM
here is the larger robots base walk. this one was a little more frustrating, the more i offset the keys the more cartoony he became, which was good to know, but not what i wanted him to present.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048walk.mov

Frogman
10-30-2008, 09:58 PM
Fan-frickin-awesome!

Not my typical critique and normally I hate fluff posts, but I gotta say, these bot-walks have really come along. This one looks great. I wish my project was going along at the same speed yours is - great job.

*edit*
Ah .. I took another watch and noticed that you might have some intersection when the hand swings back - just check to see if it is going though the leg geometry. Besides that - solid work.

crackle
10-31-2008, 01:56 AM
thanks for noticing that, should be able to clear that up with some f-curve tweaks.

this all comes in waves, i couldn't even touch this project during the summer, so all those saved up ideas had started pouring out, i got to keep it going as long as i can!

thanks for keeping an eye on this project. much appreciated!

crackle
11-01-2008, 06:54 PM
working on the walk while carring a gun. this one proved to be more challenging because of having to constraint the hands to the gun and animating the gun itself. my first attempt had the hands "floating" around the handles, but after figuring out what was wrong i ended up with this little animation

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048walkgun2.mov

any C&C appreciated.

Frogman
11-01-2008, 08:06 PM
Hey Kevin - nifty bot.

I don't really understand your choice in having his shoulders and elbows bounce up and down in the walk - the gun seems to float relative to his arms, instead of feeling like he is lugging the gun around. Try pulling back on the motion and see how it looks.

I think you can sell the weight of the gun by dropping the forward arm's elbow. That arm will be straight if the gun is heavy - you'll get a nice diagonal with the arm in the side view if you do.

The upper body does not have side to side motion - this exaggerates the shoulder motion even more.

On last thing - it might add some nice texture to the walk if there is a pause on each step after the foot comes down. This would have the feel of more of a stomp and further sell the weight.. see what you think.

NURB
11-02-2008, 11:58 AM
I really like walk animation, but totally agree with Frogman about strange weight feeling in all the motion, (especially shoulders) with a gun.

I think leaning back more and a bit to the left side of all the figure will help to create more appropriate pose for holding a heavy gun. I would reduce side to side movement, to keep mostly forward swinging `cos after all, he walks forward :)

Also, take a closer look at overlapping of different character "end-points" like hands, head, or even gun barrel tips and rear part of it. Looking at the top view you can easily see that gun is moving side to side in kinda parallel way. It would be more interesting and less robotic if gun tip and rear part swings in a more wave trajectory and with little overlapping.

Body hit the same frame with the gun and hands making all figure look sticky. Try to shift all these parts on at least one frame and you'll get more soft movement.

crackle
11-03-2008, 01:53 AM
ok, i've tryed to incorperate all i could, but i'm alittle confused about the stomp. should i do a static hold on the contact? take the floping foot in the front and make the step more of a "high knees" to a straight down kinda step. i dont know what i'm saying.

here are the newer versions of the gunwalk, 3 and 4.4 has more overlaping, i offset everything from the feet, 1 to 3 frames.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048walkgun3.mov

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048walkgun4.mov

plus another walk (since there are 3 of the larger).

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/o48walk%203.mov

now i'm just doing a trick to show the 4 views, i make copies of the original(front view) and rtate the main null accordingly. appently this creates issues with the hands and the arm solvers. so take that into accout for the different views, is the overall motion getting better or worse?


thanks again for the intrest, its been a great help.

DevIII
11-03-2008, 05:46 PM
hey man I've been watching from afar :)

i just wanted to chime in with a technical issue, with the last three walk cycles you've had an ik pop on the knee, just before the foot plant. its in all three of them, it means you've asked your rig to go into a pose which the bones don't fit into and it pops into the closest position it can find. you should fix that by placing it in a pose, in range and making sure your curves don't let it go out of range.

I think If you want to make it more "stompish" you should bring the foot down parrallel to the ground. the more we stomp the less heel roll we have when we plant our feet.

its really amazing how far this project has come, great job.

Frogman
11-03-2008, 05:59 PM
DevIII has the right idea on the stomp.. more parallel and just hold the lower body/feet for an extra frame on the gun walk.

On the no-gun walk, I think the hips might be off. On the passing pose, his hip will be at it's highest point on the weight bearing leg. He doesn't really have an "up pose" in the walk because there are no balls to the feet - see if you can adjust the spacing a bit so you can have an extra frame or two to get rid of the pop in the knee.

Boy.. I'd love to see these things bash each other around :) Keep up the good work..

NURB
11-03-2008, 08:37 PM
4.4 has more overlapping, i offset everything from the feet, 1 to 3 frames Nice one, offsets is good! Now, notice how hips rotating while he steps. You definitely should translate this movement upper to a spine, chest and shoulders, reducing it's amount accordingly. Still think that gun moves a bit stiff.

crackle
11-04-2008, 06:56 AM
allright, i've worked on a third walk, tring to incorperate the stomp, i dont think i've got it yet, i think the upper parts are too smooth, and the left leg? ugh, my editor feedback must be slower than i thought.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/o48walkv3.mov

i wasnt going to post it but i thought, oh well...

on the poping, your right the curves were going way beyond where they should be, but i flatten them out, and it seemed to work, more on that as i fix the others.

i incorperated the more of the hips in this last one, but i'm not sure what you meant.

got the frame counter in there as well, dont know why i forgot that on the last few.

and again, thank for all the input! it like i've got a creative team helping out! its awesome and humbling as well.

i'll be tinkering with all three during the week, and i'll keep 'em coming as i get the improvements done

and lastly, how was the gun walk, better or worse ( i can get more outa the gun movement i'm sure) but the arm angle and shoulder movements and such?

thanks again!

Frogman
11-05-2008, 12:32 AM
Wow - I like that you're working to push these.

At first it looked like there was a pop in the foot, but then I realized that it wasn't a looped cycle.

(Ow!..just got a new puppy and got a puppy bite on my little finger.. typing slow)

F37 (reverse on F60)- This is your passing pose for him - to sell the down, you have to push the up - straighten his left leg out. Raise the body and rotate the hips so his left hip is high and the right is low - if you think about it like a line, on contact it is horizontal and then the line tips upward diagonally to whichever leg you are standing on during the passing pose.

After the stomp/contact, try bringing him down faster (adjust your tangents.. think of him like bouncing ball, but with a bit more cushion on the bounce that his knees/legs provide)

On the upper body.. I like the strength that you are portraying in him.. it is very successful. When you polish, try adding a little bit of finger looseness if you're going to keep the hands open or clench his fists.

Anything else in the legs I think will get fixed when you straighten on the passing poses.

Once again - great work. Then more I'm able to analyze and critique your work, the more I'm thinking about my own animation and learning - thank you!

crackle
11-05-2008, 05:49 AM
just so i've got this straight, the weight bearing leg has a high hip, while the passing leg has the low one, right? on the contact the hips should be flat.

i like the idea of the bouncing, i'll work on that. what i was thinking earlier was to key the pass, and adjust from there to tr something diff. so far all the walks have started with the contact-rt foot. more learnin, keeps me sharp!

another question about offsets. should i keep the hips and the feet together and offset everything else 1-3 frames, or have the hips 1 frame ahead of the feet, and the the rest of the body offset from the feet?

what are some of your ideas on the subject of offsets?

i'm glad to help, but i'm thankful also.

Frogman
11-05-2008, 02:46 PM
You got it - (on the hip direction).

As far as offsetting action in the body - there is not an exact answer for you really. How the part of the body relate in motion affects the whole feel of your animation. For example: if you offset the arm swing in a walk (12 frame stride) by 3 frames from the legs (Left Leg out/Right Arm out), the walk will look a bit more determined/rushed ~ power walking. 6 Frames in you might have a relaxed walk.. 8 frames might be somewhat wishy washy in the arms and 12 frames you have no overlap and are walking like a robot.

You can even shape things further by adding time into the offset - for example.. you can have an arm swing that takes 13 frames on one step and then 11 on the next step (keeping the legs at 12 frames per step). On top of that you can play with the swings by offsetting your your keys (offsetting animation that you've already built a timing offset into.. just make sure that the walk still feels good.

This is just a tool in the box though.. don't overlook the forest for the leaves. You can find yourself playing in the graph editor, moving keys on individual rotation channels and parts of the body only to discover that you've destroyed the animation that you had looking so nice before you tried to "polish". Above all.. think about what you're trying to accomplish.

Ohh.. and for someone who knows better than me and has a great tutorial - look at Keith Lango's Tricks for Cartoon Snappy Motion (http://www.keithlango.com/tutorials/old/toonSnap/toonSnap.htm) (even if you're not going for cartoon-snappy motion, the ideas presented are really invaluable).

crackle
11-06-2008, 08:32 AM
i had almost forgotten about Mr Lango's site, i had visited it a long time ago. thaks for the refresher

just to show i'm paying attention and listening i have 2 updates. the first is one of the walks

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/o48walk%203v2.mov

got the hips in there and i'm happy with it. i think if i push it too much he'll start looking like a pimp!

the second is the stomp. i like it much better, but i feel something is missing...

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/o48walk%203v3.mov

i have the "animator's survival kit" also, which again i forgot i had. i should really use this more.

crackle
11-09-2008, 07:45 AM
here's another walk for the library, i got the idea or this one playing fable 2!

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/048walk5.mov

crackle
11-29-2008, 07:25 AM
gave him a gun, gonna try some animating with it...

crackle
12-02-2008, 05:52 AM
animation test with the gun and played around with some dof. still needs some tweaking and some extra stuff added, but this is what i've got so far.

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/new%20gun4.mov

crackle
12-08-2008, 05:43 PM
i've decided to expand on the previous animation by adding a crawling little bot that gets kicked over and blasted. here's the crawling part...

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekicktease6newlight.mov

crackle
12-11-2008, 05:49 PM
i've started making death animations for some filler in the backround while the one is crawling. here's the first one

http://webpages.charter.net/deolsons/sidekickdeath.mov

CGTalk Moderation
12-11-2008, 05:49 PM
This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.