Copy of Corneille's Polyphemus, Ralph Reinle (3D)

[ralphreinle]

Other camera views:

http://features.cgsociety.org/gallerycrits/93979/93979_1205761909_submedium.jpg

http://features.cgsociety.org/gallerycrits/93979/93979_1205762076_submedium.jpg

[Jeggis]

Wow, that's awesome! It's realistic and has a lot of details. Like the beard and abs.
The only thing that bugs me is the background. If he's that close to the wall the depth of field is all wrong. You should make the background in the same scene as the model, and let the virtual lens produce the DoF.

[LadyPurple]

Ohh.. is beautiful! :eek: ( The wire, please..? Thank you :) )

[Maytridy]

Awesome modeling! I think that his forearms are a little bit misshapen however.

[Hybridesigns]

Perfect..
5 stars from me,

[hoogberg]

Great modeling, texture looks to plasterlike but I have not seen the original so may be I'm wrong. Anyway beautifull image.

[souledge3]

wooooooowwwwwwwwooooowwwww super job

[simmsimaging]

Fantastic work! Nice sculpting and great renders.

b

[Vlada3d]

Yeah ;) really good one.
Keep on modeling in the free world.

[TCPortfolio]

Wow! I'm amazed at the modeling. 5 Star work! Well done.

[darklopium83]

wonderfull job you've done here man, awesome details and good modeling, i like!

[KIDI]

Beautiful model and great shader :thumbsup:
Can u share with us your shader ?

[Paljas]

Outstanding. Realism is superb. I'll have to agree on the background with Jeggis. Don't know why you chose to do so while judging from the rest, you have such eye for realism!

[GiuseppeGuzzardi]

Absolut great model, precision, respect to the references..., great job.
For me 5* and Choice gallery!

All the best
Giuseppe

[ralphreinle]

Thank you all for the comments and critics! I really didn't spend too much time with the material settings, I guess I was already tired of the modeling and wanted to really finish it. Here it goes some more close up details, and as asked the material settings (it is really basic):

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/detalhes4.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/detalhes2.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/detalhes1.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/detalhes5.jpg


http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/material.gif

To Jeggis and Paljas, I have to agree, the background does bother me. I tried to take the attention out of the background (without success as I see :shrug:, I thought it was too sharp and it was interfering with the image. Although I made the dof with zdepth maps, the vray camera was giving me this kind information of the dof (the vray camera shows 3 grids showing how dof will be interpreted).
Thanks for the crits :thumbsup:, I'll study more carefully Dofs in the future (I should have heard my wife :D).

[ralphreinle]

the wires:

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/body2-1.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/body-1.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/cabeca.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/mao.jpg

[LadyPurple]

Thank you for the wires, you're very kind :thumbsup:

[wowbaggin]

whoah, excellent model. great attention to detail and understanding of the subject

[erilaz]

Stunning work, but the background feels fake in comparison. Regardless, splendid modelling!

[Boristone]

You are insane man....excellent work!!

[imtilongchar]

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: Great job
5 stars

[Rebeccak]

Congrats on the front page! Well deserved. :)

[factro]

Wow, that's awesome! It's realistic and has a lot of details. But it looks little white

[Molier]

Very good detailing. I liked it a lot. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Rod Seffen]

Sorry, but this is a very poor piece of work.
The pose, the anatomy the sculpting technique are all naive and display a severe lack of knowledge.
The vray render at first glance makes it look kind of cool to someone with no knowledge of sculpture or anatomy, and I guess that's why one of the moderators decided to put it on the front page.
I can go into a long and detailed list of where it's wrong if you like, but since there is no part of the anatomy or cloth that has been adequately observed or sculpted, it would indeed be a long list.

[Klicek]

Sorry, but this is a very poor piece of work.
The pose, the anatomy the sculpting technique are all naive and display a severe lack of knowledge.
The vray render at first glance makes it look kind of cool to someone with no knowledge of sculpture or anatomy, and I guess that's why one of the moderators decided to put it on the front page.
I can go into a long and detailed list of where it's wrong if you like, but since there is no part of the anatomy or cloth that has been adequately observed or sculpted, it would indeed be a long list.

it would indeed be a long list, but any way congrats dude :)

[koolnits]

Good work,though i agree about the background,not good :(
thanks for sharing the wires..:thumbsup:

[easyoom]

zbrush is on power
please show the wire, thx a lot

[Quadart]

Congrats.
I have to agree with oDDity, there are quite a few anatomical issues throughout (e.g. both arms) that grabbed my attention right away. Good anatomy is tricky, it is like a musical score, if a note is botched it is immediately picked up by the sensitive ear.
I like the hair treatment and VRay render.

[SlayerCZ]

Hi, nice work, but average, I must agree with oDDity, whole anatomy is incorrect, there are lot of mistakes, the biggest problem which hit my eyes immediately are the forearms, totally wrong flexors and extensors. The list of mistakes would be a bit longer. I wish you the best luck in future works, you shloud take a look at photos of bodybuilders, the anatomy encyclopedias and etc.

You got Choice Award, in my opinion, 80% of work in this gallery don´t deserve award,(sorry, I don´t want to be harsh or rude, isn´t your fault, responsibility is on shoulders of local moderators and admins) Maybe you should think about works which got awards and change your criteria before it´s too late.

Best R.

[SlayerCZ]

Congrats on the front page! Well deserved. :)

I am a bit surprised, you are anatomy forum leader and don´t see the mistakes on anatomy.

[ralphreinle]

Hi there,

I totally agree with you guys. I surely know it's not perfect and that there's lots of flaws. This is the first time I've ever modeled a full cg body and this is my second zbrush model I ever made. I am at the beginning of the second year of my fine art bachelor degree. We just start doing clay modeling classes. So I still have lots to learn but I have to start somewhere. Isn't that the intention of the workshops? It has never meant to be up to the level of the great artists presented at cgtalk. In my humble opinion I think it was a good start and wanted to share. I don't know why has been chosen to be on the frontpage or the choice award, I wasn't really expecting this. :shrug:

Anyway, thanks a lot for the critics, I respect a lot you guys and your works. You've always inspired me.

P.S.: This is kind of funny, everybody loved the vray render. The render was actually only to post into the galleries and not to present the model as Zbrush screenshots. :D

[Rod Seffen]

You got Choice Award, in my opinion, 80% of work in this gallery don´t deserve award,(sorry, I don´t want to be harsh or rude, isn´t your fault, responsibility is on shoulders of local moderators and admins) Maybe you should think about works which got awards and change your criteria before it´s too late.

Best R.

I wouldn't go as far as 80%. That all depends on just how much above average you set the entry limit on a choice award.
However, what matters is consistency of judgement. You cannot have some works getting in here, which are equal to, or worse, than other works which did not get in here, and I have seen quite a few works that are equal to, and some better than this, in the general gallery that did not get front page or get an award.

[fx81]

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o63/ralphgmr/detalhes4.jpg



nice work on the render.

however it needs lot of revision on the anatomy as Rod mentioned.

[Kaleen]

Awesome...!

[Rebeccak]

I am a bit surprised, you are anatomy forum leader and don´t see the mistakes on anatomy.Hi there, well, it's not to say that I don't, but I guess I find it more useful to encourage someone than to nitpick them whilst their work is being highlighted - I think this is a good work that can be improved upon, yes, as can any piece that's submitted here to CGTalk. Ralphreinle didn't solicit the fp and seems to be taking the crits onboard well, so perhaps the fp is worth the good crits. :)

[SlayerCZ]

[
Hi there, well, it's not to say that I don't, but I guess I find it more useful to encourage someone than to nitpick them whilst their work is being highlighted - I think this is a good work that can be improved upon, yes, as can any piece that's submitted here to CGTalk. Ralphreinle didn't solicit the fp and seems to be taking the crits onboard well, so perhaps the fp is worth the good crits. :)

Hi, I don´t know, but from my point of view is better hard critics than words like "awesome" "well deserved" and etc., because critics comments can push his abilities forward, "awesome" is totally useless and in big contrast with our hard citic comments, and lots of A-class works are overlooked and not on the frontpage. Someone spent several months on his work and then is overlooked, Ralphreinle did this job as his second model and is on frontpage despite the fact that this work has bad anatomy, and this picture is only about anatomy. So in my opinion is better to show this work in WIP forum if you want a good feedback, FP is for A-class and interesting works, ONLY my two cents, I don´t want to be harsh and rude. And at the end, I don´t think that our critics comments were nitpicking, these comments are only for admins and forum leaders or moderators, Ralphreine isn´t responsible for FP, we only said what we think about FP and giving the awards.

I think that would be fair to put every works like this on frontpage to encourage their authors if you mean what you wrote seriously.

Wish you the best luck Ralpreinle;) , keep it up and train.:thumbsup:

[Rebeccak]

SlayerCZ, good points all, I think the key here is not to lay blame on the artist for being fp'd when he did not solicit it. :) I'm sure that you would appreciate the same consideration in the same situation. :thumbsup:

Regarding the fairness of fp posts, well, that's subjective and no, not everyone can be made happy all of the time. Mods choose plug images at their discretion and it's according to personal choice, so no, not even the mods think every piece is or is not plugworthy. Thanks for your feedback and I'm sure it's being taken onboard by the mods here. :)

[SlayerCZ]

SlayerCZ, good points all, I think the key here is not to lay blame on the artist for being fp'd when he did not solicit it. :) I'm sure that you would appreciate the same consideration in the same situation. :thumbsup:

Regarding the fairness of fp posts, well, that's subjective and no, not everyone can be made happy all of the time. Mods choose plug images at their discretion and it's according to personal choice, so no, not even the mods think every piece is or is not plugworthy. Thanks for your feedback and I'm sure it's being taken onboard by the mods here. :)

Laying blame? oh god no:) I wrote it before, Ralphreinle iśn´t responsible for FP, I wrote it before, and I write it again:)

Thanks for you comments ;)

Best R.

[Rebeccak]

Cool, should you have further issues, then contact the admins who can tell you who plugged the image, or alternately, write in your diary. :)

[SlayerCZ]

That isn´t necessary control every moderator or something like this, I only wrote what I think about Ralphreinle job he has done and about his FPplug and giving awards ,nothing less nothing more, situation is going worse and worse and I am not owner of this forum, so frontpage plugs and award aren´t my bussines I am only host, I only wrote my two cents;)

[Maytridy]

I totally agree with you guys. I surely know it's not perfect and that there's lots of flaws. This is the first time I've ever modeled a full cg body and this is my second zbrush model I ever made. I am at the beginning of the second year of my fine art bachelor degree. We just start doing clay modeling classes. So I still have lots to learn but I have to start somewhere. Isn't that the intention of the workshops? It has never meant to be up to the level of the great artists presented at cgtalk. In my humble opinion I think it was a good start and wanted to share. I don't know why has been chosen to be on the frontpage or the choice award, I wasn't really expecting this. :shrug:

Anyway, thanks a lot for the critics, I respect a lot you guys and your works. You've always inspired me.

I was about to post about some more anatomy issues, but I think that your response to the critiques makes you deserving of all the credit that you've thus far received. It's very rare that someone can take harsh criticisms in such a muture and understanding manner. I will keep an eye out for your future work, you have great potential with an attitude like that.

[gaianix]

nice work .....................:thumbsup:

[mushroomgod]

well, it may not be "perfect" but it has a nice look and feel about it

4 stars

[aanup]

Ohh.. it's beautiful!

Keep on modeling great job:thumbsup:

[pap87]

This is your second piece in zbrush? Nice work.:thumbsup:

I do, however, agree with the others about the incorrect anatomy. One thing that stands out to me are the nipples, they are just lumps and are too high up.

Also there seems to be aliasing in the main render. But apart from that the render itself is fantastic.

Congrats on the award!

[beaker]

Sorry, but this is a very poor piece of work.
The pose, the anatomy the sculpting technique are all naive and display a severe lack of knowledge.
The vray render at first glance makes it look kind of cool to someone with no knowledge of sculpture or anatomy, and I guess that's why one of the moderators decided to put it on the front page.
I can go into a long and detailed list of where it's wrong if you like, but since there is no part of the anatomy or cloth that has been adequately observed or sculpted, it would indeed be a long list.I'm confused. This zbrush piece is a copy of a real life sculpture. If his anatomy and cloth is wrong, then isn't that an issue you have with Corneille Van Clève piece in the Louvre and not ralphreinle? So the Louvre sucks because they have pieces with bad anatomy?

http://www.louvre.fr/llv/oeuvres/detail_notice.jsp?CONTENT%3C%3Ecnt_id=10134198673226006&CURRENT_LLV_NOTICE%3C%3Ecnt_id=10134198673226006&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=9852723696500822&fromDept=true&baseIndex=55&bmUID=1189640489251&bmLocale=en#
http://www.louvre.fr/media/repository/ressources/sources/illustration/atlas/image_55091_v2_m56577569830569196.jpg

http://www.louvre.fr/media/repository/ressources/sources/illustration/atlas/image_55092_v2_m56577569830569200.jpg

[Quadart]

I'm confused. This zbrush piece is a copy of a real life sculpture. If his anatomy and cloth is wrong, then isn't that an issue you have with Corneille Van Clève piece in the Louvre and not ralphreinle? So the Louvre sucks because they have pieces with bad anatomy?

No and no.
The issue is one of copy accuracy not inaccuracy of the original leading to inaccuracy copied.

[beaker]

No and no.
The issue is one of copy accuracy not inaccuracy of the original leading to inaccuracy copied.ic, my mistake.

[SlayerCZ]

I'm confused. This zbrush piece is a copy of a real life sculpture. If his anatomy and cloth is wrong, then isn't that an issue you have with Corneille Van Clève piece in the Louvre and not ralphreinle? So the Louvre sucks because they have pieces with bad anatomy?


Want to know my opinion? yeah, this sculpt in Louvre has many incorrects, I don´t affraid to say it, this piece is in Louvre, but this doesn´t mean that is perfect and untouchable like lots of known paintings and etc. And as you can see, the zbrush copy is a bit off when you look at the original.

[alienpioneer]

I think that the real discussion is with the fp...This should be a challenge for everyone to try to achieve better results and someday they will be on the fp if they really want that.My question is how did he used maya and vray without 3dmax? is a version of vray for maya and i am so nood that i don't know? (i really hope not to embarace myself :argh: )

[ralphreinle]

Hi guys! Thank you very much for all your comments and critics. This certainly will incentivate me to keep up working and most important to study even harder! :thumbsup:

Hi alienpioneer, it was rendered in 3dsmax. I didn't mentioned it because it was only used for the rendering. Maya was only used for modeling basemehes and UV mapping.

[alienpioneer]

Thank you for the reply! I am so glad i didn't embarace myself.Nomatter other posts , you should know that you are way on the good road!!! Cheers and many prizes ahead!

[Anatoli]

Great :thumbsup: Very REALISTIC :applause:

[jeonado]

hi ralphreinle,

Really appreciate the amount of effort that you put into this piece.
I know you are tired, why not u take a break and spend some time again
to further finetune this piece, in terms of lighting, background and shader?
Otherwise, it will be such a waste for high detail model like this. You need some
good side dishes (background, shader, lighting) to spice up the maincourse(model)
:)

Cheeers!

jordan.

[jeonado]

hi ralphreinle,

Really appreciate the amount of effort that you put into this piece.
I know you are tired, why not u take a break and spend some time again
to further finetune this piece, in terms of lighting, background and shader?
Otherwise, it will be such a waste for high detail model like this. You need some
good side dishes (background, shader, lighting) to spice up the maincourse(model)
:)

Cheeers! Look forward to see more works from you.

jordan.

[sahercg]

so good work

nice to make vray work in maya environmet

[flaviomonteiro]

Muito bonito!

[nevercg]

great work

[Nadis]

very very good!

[amedina]

excelente, podriamos ver el modelo

[Hellfreezes]

beautiful job

[chobi77]

Amazing Work 5* from me :)

[gode]

Very cool modeling :thumbsup:

[murugucgs]

Terrific modelling...!! Awesome

[mhampton]

Hmm... Personally I don't get the harsh criteques of a the anatomy of model of a guy who has a third eye in his forhead? :)

This right there tells me that "human" anatomy is out the window. A lot of people seem to be comming down hard because it's not this "pefect" human anatomy.. and there is a BIG LIST of things wrong with it. A big list of anatomy problems of a guy who has a third eye in his forehead?

Hmm.. also not to mention that it's refrenced from a real life sculpture, which to me at a glance looks like he nailed it pretty darn good.

I am not familar with this sculpture.. but looking at it, it appears to be some kind of greek god. To me, greek gods scream exaggerated features and such.

But that's just me. :)


So to me.. there is a BIG LIST of reasons why the anatomy should NOT be perfectly human. And that this is one heck of a modeling job! Specially for a second piece of work in Zbrush. I couldn't even touch anything like that quite yet. So Good job. Could there be anything done to make it even better? Sure! But you could say that about anything. But at some point you have to abondon your work and move onto something else. Personally I like to use the 5% rule.. if what you are going to change/redo/remake/add/delete/etc.. is going to change the final output less than 5%.. stick a fork in it and be done with it and move on. Otherwise you will be tweaking it till the end of time.

But I also believe that as a society we have lost sight of the concept of dimenishing returns. But again.. that's just me. :)

Now wether it belongs in the choice gallery or on the FP or not can be left up to debate, but that's always going to be a matter of opinion. We are all going to see images that we feel belong in the choice gallery or FP that don't make it, and vice versa.

[Stahlberg]

Personally I don't get the harsh criteques of a the anatomy of model of a guy who has a third eye in his forhead?
The original sculptor was obviously referencing human anatomy, not cyclops anatomy.
You're saying people should only give appreciative comments?

[mhampton]

You're saying people should only give appreciative comments?

No.. like I said.. "Could there be anything done to make it better? Sure!"

Constructive critisim is half the reason to post your work to your peers... praise alone doesn't help you improve your skills. But constructive critisim doesn't have to be harsh. Again.. I was just referencing some of the harsher comments, that to me just seemed to come out of nowhere like a sledgehammer. Although he seemed to take it all in stride.

I could give some constructive crit. to any of your work.. again.. anything can be improved.. because it always helps to have the opinons of other sets of eyes. But I sure wouldn't give it in a way that cut your work to pieces... I would just throw out a few things I see that personally I think might make the image a little better. btw.. your stuff ROCKS! :smile: Wish I was able to work on those type of jobs and get paid for it!! :smile:

But like YOU said.. it's "referencing" human anatomy. That doesn't mean it's copying perfect human porportions or whatever. Too me.. looks like a greek god. God to me screams exageration... therefore personally I don't have any criteques on the anatomy, because in my opinion.. they could be even MORE exagerated and out of "human" porportion and I wouldn't have a comment on it. Thus that is MY comment on the anatomy. :smile: Others may (and have) pointed to certain areas like the forarms and throw in their two cents about what might be "wrong" about it and how to improve it.. that's all great.

Now maybe the rendering, background, lighting, camera angle, material, etc.. I would give some constructive critisism, but I don't think that was the purpose of his work.. it was a modeling exercise.. pure and simple.

Just my .02.. :smile:

[Quadart]

mhampton—There is a big difference between exaggeration and distortion. The two tend to be commonly confused, which seems to the case here.

[pap87]

Hmm... Personally I don't get the harsh criteques of a the anatomy of model of a guy who has a third eye in his forhead? This right there tells me that "human" anatomy is out the window.

What, because there's a third eye that means he suddenly bears no resemblance to a human?

[Rod Seffen]

mhampton—There is a big difference between exaggeration and distortion. The two tend to be commonly confused, which seems to the case here.

Exactly, you can't start inventing new anatomy, or if you do, you first have to have mastered real anatomy, understand in detail how it works, and your new anatomy invention has to be very well planned out, because the musculoskeletal system is not arbitrary lumps and bumps on the skin, but a very complex integrated system in which everything fills a specific role.
There is already a huge amount of room for manoeuvre within the restraints of technical accuracy, and so there is no need to go outside them. Take a look at every anatomically correct figure ever made, and you'll see, that although they're all equally restrained to anatomical accuracy, they're all quite different.

[KrakenCMT]

Not to mention that when you reference a piece of art that has a bit of inaccurate anatomy to begin with, you're copying that inaccuracy plus adding in your own interpretation and potential human error which could take the form even further away from being physically accurate.

That's why it's good to reference an actual human form when sculpting humanoid forms instead of relying on another artists vision.

[Krishk]

Hi!

Good job & nice details.
Keep it up.

Best Regards
Krishna

www.krishnacreationz.com
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[flysi3000]

This is really beautiful - nice work!

The only thing that bugs me is the background. If he's that close to the wall the depth of field is all wrong. You should make the background in the same scene as the model, and let the virtual lens produce the DoF.

I disagree - one of the things that I actually like the most about this piece is the DOF. It doesn't matter if it's technically not perfect (which I didn't notice anyway). There's nothing wrong with being subjective sometimes for dramatic effect.

[Maview]

BRAVO!+BRILLIANT!

speechless...

greetz,
gunnar

[Helioth]

Great modelling, I have to agree with the questions about your chosen background though, the chosen texture suggests to set in question everything about the model, perspective, scale etc.

Perhaps rethink the 'wall' ? Just seems out of place some how.

No crits whatsoever about the model, just keep doing what your doing (and learning that way).

[geniussteam]

wow~lighting is great

[nebi]

Nice work, congrats..

[gureiduson]

Cara, ficou MUITO bom velho! Parabéns!

[Dues]

Fantastic work)), keep going)))

[tiru]

awesome....

[hgDesign]

Great modeling and render. I however feel that his nipple is a bit too big. Rest is fantastic

[tddtk]

great modeling. very nice
but i don't like the background a little bit.

[LMegginson24]

well done. details galore. awesome, love your work

[shadowseve]

I really like this piece. Odd yet sophisticated. Great lighting!!

Damien

[shrew81]

Good work, as said before, there are some problems with anatomy and such, but it is your second time in z-brush and for that it looks good. the hair and cloth sculpts are especially good, just keep practicing!

[boxofdarkangel]

Good pose!

[puppetorange]

i like it, awesome works!

[xm262413]

I really like this piece

[cocopalm]

Un Beliable Thats cool dude keep it up I am a new member in this forum in a very short time i Will also Show some of my works.... have a nice time......... Best wishes to you keep it up next time somthing new and unbeliveable......Bye take care

[qcmxx120]

oh,my god!
cool!

[techdivine]

amazing...simply amazing..... Pure work of art.... great model...Kudos!

:thumbsup:

[lyriclee]

awesome work,great!

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