My Very First Quadruped Rig. P

[deatheater4ever]

One of the most important things to do with your control curves is to make them 3 dimensional. I always do that . 2d curves like circles are hard to see and select in the front and side viewports . So make them 3 dimensional like box shaped or diamond shaped ....and dont use locators ...locators are thin and tiny and not always clearly visible

Do the legs of the the machine have the "elbow" controls ?? You can also add rotaing controls to the Guns and make them shoot stuff ... or you can atleatst make them fake it. You could sculpt something that looks similar to a gun blast and colour it orange and then attach it to the end of the guns and then turn its visibility on and off to make it seem like the gun is spewing bullets ...

PS -- can u post an animation to show the rig's functionality ??

[deatheater4ever]

Yikes !! Double post

[Gurboura]

One of the most important things to do with your control curves is to make them 3 dimensional. I always do that . 2d curves like circles are hard to see and select in the front and side viewports . So make them 3 dimensional like box shaped or diamond shaped ....and dont use locators ...locators are thin and tiny and not always clearly visible

Do the legs of the the machine have the "elbow" controls ?? You can also add rotaing controls to the Guns and make them shoot stuff ... or you can atleatst make them fake it. You could sculpt something that looks similar to a gun blast and colour it orange and then attach it to the end of the guns and then turn its visibility on and off to make it seem like the gun is spewing bullets ...

PS -- can u post an animation to show the rig's functionality ??

Oh, ok! I did the locators because I didn't know how to make a NURBS circle a control for the joints on the guns.

Elbow controls? Never knew there was such a thing :argh: I just started rigging a month ago.

I didn't model this, it was already modeled, I don't know who modeled it though as it was one of 3 other models to rig.

[stewartjones]

I have to disagree. Making the control curves 3D is not a huge priority for me. It can help for selection, but I wouldn't say it's a big 'must do'. If anything, once you get into MEL scripting a GUI would be a much better option! I do agree about using locators though. I tend to keep locators within the rig, and make sure that the animators don't have to touch them.

I would hide out your rig (joints etc), and make sure your geometry is non-selectable. Is your character under one node? If the character is mechanical, should it be smooth skinned?

From the screenshot I can't really comment on anything else, but I hope that helps some. Good work so far!

[Gurboura]

I have to disagree. Making the control curves 3D is not a huge priority for me. It can help for selection, but I wouldn't say it's a big 'must do'. If anything, once you get into MEL scripting a GUI would be a much better option! I do agree about using locators though. I tend to keep locators within the rig, and make sure that the animators don't have to touch them.

I would hide out your rig (joints etc), and make sure your geometry is non-selectable. Is your character under one node? If the character is mechanical, should it be smooth skinned?

From the screenshot I can't really comment on anything else, but I hope that helps some. Good work so far!

I'm starting to use the Locators more and more, loving em :)

I only posted the rig and geometery so people could see them, and if something wasn't placed right, they could let me know. I tried smooth skinning, but it started giving me problems of pulling other geo around it, got that almost completely gone, but it kept pulling some geo really close to it.. :banghead:

I did a really basic animation today, that I'm quite happy with that I got done in 3 1/2 hours.. I'll post it up on Wednesday when I'm in class.

Thank you for the comments and suggestions, stewartjones! :thumbsup: :bowdown:

Can anyone recommend any MEL scripting books, or maybe a website that could show how to create a GUI for rigs, or maybe point me in a direction, please?

[eek]

One of the most important things to do with your control curves is to make them 3 dimensional. I always do that . 2d curves like circles are hard to see and select in the front and side viewports . So make them 3 dimensional like box shaped or diamond shaped ....and dont use locators ...locators are thin and tiny and not always clearly visible

Do the legs of the the machine have the "elbow" controls ?? You can also add rotaing controls to the Guns and make them shoot stuff ... or you can atleatst make them fake it. You could sculpt something that looks similar to a gun blast and colour it orange and then attach it to the end of the guns and then turn its visibility on and off to make it seem like the gun is spewing bullets ...

PS -- can u post an animation to show the rig's functionality ??


I dont know where you got that nonsence from, but its simply not the case - puppets can be anything from 2d curves, to viewport images to nulls or points. I tend to use simple circles for most controls and try to guide them in the direction the user will use them. The trick with them is to make them readable as a interface to the character, but not to get in the way of the animator in posing - this is fine balance.

[Gurboura]

Can anyone explain more of the elbow controls, please?

Anyone give any more input? Or should I take not many crits/input as a good sign?

[labbejason]

I think they're just talking about pole vectors, which control the swivel of you bone chain. Dig around in your help files to find out more details on how to set it up.

[NPuetz]

Hello there jason, my fellow Full Sail student.

To answer your MEL help, you'll have two full classes on the language with one dedicated completely to mel in a rigging production. Im not sure how different it is from when i went through the class, but the character rigging class for me was completely based on scripting a character rig complete with a GUI for the animator to use, so prepare your fingers for thousands of lines of code. As far as books and that stuff, some stuff that i have are "MEL for maya animators", "Complete Maya Programming" (volumes 1 & 2), all 3 volumes of www.cgtoolkit.com 's maya rigging books (i highly reccomend to any new rigger), and i also highly reccomend of course Jason Osipia's "Stop Staring" second edition. All these books will help you become a better rigger. And speaking from experience, the rigging class is only a very basic introductory course to rigging, and much of your success at full sail as a rigger will depend on how much effort you put into it outside of school. So start tapping into as many resources as possible and read as much as you can. Download already built rigs and even mel sccripts from highend 3d and start disecting them and try to understand why the setup artist/scripter did waht he did and so on. I'd also like to point out some great video tutorial sites/dvd's that offer a more hands on education than books... fahrenheitdigital.com is Great, digitaltutors.com for real introductory/begginning rigging, gnomon, and even Alias Learning Maya brand that you can purcahse from the autodesk site (especially the hyperreal series). Basically start breathing,sleeping, and eating rigging. Hope this helps man, and good luck with the rest of your classes mate cause they only get tougher :).

[AVTPro]

I did my quadruped last week too. I did the same thing. Made flat circle controllers and locators for PVs. :)

It's my first so, next time I will be more mindful .

Looks cool.

[deatheater4ever]

I dont know where you got that nonsence from, but its simply not the case - puppets can be anything from 2d curves, to viewport images to nulls or points. I tend to use simple circles for most controls and try to guide them in the direction the user will use them. The trick with them is to make them readable as a interface to the character, but not to get in the way of the animator in posing - this is fine balance.


I was talikng about those crazy foot shaped curves , some people make that are difficult to see in the front and side viewport .......circles are boring ..... 3D curves are quite much better
the animator can sitch thier visibility on and off if he wants to chk the pose .... you are more experienced than I am so you could be right .... tommorow someone might ask me to create circles as controls !

[eek]

I was talikng about those crazy foot shaped curves , some people make that are difficult to see in the front and side viewport .......circles are boring ..... 3D curves are quite much better
the animator can sitch thier visibility on and off if he wants to chk the pose .... you are more experienced than I am so you could be right .... tommorow someone might ask me to create circles as controls !

To answer it properly - neither is right and neither is wrong. You should be building the rig on the needs of the animator - this isnt a painting by numbers game and never should be. There is no right way of building a rig, your main goal is a simple efficient rig that both equally serves the needs of production and animator. Sometimes i'll use points, boxes, bones - anything infact to make the rig 'feel' fun to use and fast.

The trick to all of this is to build lots and lots of rigs - make lots and lots of mistakes, learn from them and then throw them into production and learn again from them.

With your rig I'd suggest you keep the following a priority:

Independance of controls (pelvis,chest,head)
no-flip ik on the legs (this can be achieved by setting the twist -90 on the pole vector limits) 4 pole vectors is a lot to control in world space
Do you know of any animators too - I strongly advise handing this off to one, to break - it'll teach you lots.

cheers,

[Gurboura]

Hello there jason, my fellow Full Sail student.

To answer your MEL help, you'll have two full classes on the language with one dedicated completely to mel in a rigging production. Im not sure how different it is from when i went through the class, but the character rigging class for me was completely based on scripting a character rig complete with a GUI for the animator to use, so prepare your fingers for thousands of lines of code. As far as books and that stuff, some stuff that i have are "MEL for maya animators", "Complete Maya Programming" (volumes 1 & 2), all 3 volumes of www.cgtoolkit.com (http://www.cgtoolkit.com/) 's maya rigging books (i highly reccomend to any new rigger), and i also highly reccomend of course Jason Osipia's "Stop Staring" second edition. All these books will help you become a better rigger. And speaking from experience, the rigging class is only a very basic introductory course to rigging, and much of your success at full sail as a rigger will depend on how much effort you put into it outside of school. So start tapping into as many resources as possible and read as much as you can. Download already built rigs and even mel sccripts from highend 3d and start disecting them and try to understand why the setup artist/scripter did waht he did and so on. I'd also like to point out some great video tutorial sites/dvd's that offer a more hands on education than books... fahrenheitdigital.com is Great, digitaltutors.com for real introductory/begginning rigging, gnomon, and even Alias Learning Maya brand that you can purcahse from the autodesk site (especially the hyperreal series). Basically start breathing,sleeping, and eating rigging. Hope this helps man, and good luck with the rest of your classes mate cause they only get tougher :).

Thanks Nick!

How indepth do the classes get, both the scripting and rigging?

I got the "Stop Starring" book for Christmas, and love it! :thumbsup:

Those are awesome links, thanks!!

Hope to see ya around the CA building!

My goal for Feburary is to have a GUI menu setup for a basic rig.

I did my quadruped last week too. I did the same thing. Made flat circle controllers and locators for PVs. :)

It's my first so, next time I will be more mindful .

Looks cool.

Awesome! Post it up! :thumbsup:

To answer it properly - neither is right and neither is wrong. You should be building the rig on the needs of the animator - this isnt a painting by numbers game and never should be. There is no right way of building a rig, your main goal is a simple efficient rig that both equally serves the needs of production and animator. Sometimes i'll use points, boxes, bones - anything infact to make the rig 'feel' fun to use and fast.

The trick to all of this is to build lots and lots of rigs - make lots and lots of mistakes, learn from them and then throw them into production and learn again from them.

With your rig I'd suggest you keep the following a priority:



Independance of controls (pelvis,chest,head)
no-flip ik on the legs (this can be achieved by setting the twist -90 on the pole vector limits) 4 pole vectors is a lot to control in world space
Do you know of any animators too - I strongly advise handing this off to one, to break - it'll teach you lots.

cheers,

Can you explain more on the "independance of controls?" Or do you mean, like adding the locators and such? :blush:

I know of a few starting animators, I'll hand it to them and see what they can do :p

Sorry if I'm asking alot of questions, just trying to understand and learn. :thumbsup:

[Gurboura]

Double post! :D

[Gurboura]

Here's a Playblast, please ignore the last second where nothing happens.. I'm still working on it :D

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7782673926466904103

[AVTPro]

I'm new to Maya rigging and I'm not formally training but I'm gaining ground. This had to be a very fast animation on a very tight deadline. I used all circles but I was the only one animation this rig so I need what everything was. I'm posting this because I was doing this at the same time the poster of this thread posted his. It's my first quad.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f190/AVTPro/Picture18.png

[eek]

Can you explain more on the "independance of controls?" Or do you mean, like adding the locators and such? :blush:I know of a few starting animators, I'll hand it to them and see what they can do :pSorry if I'm asking alot of questions, just trying to understand and learn. :thumbsup:

When I worked as an animator doing VFX work on Dinotopia, I animated a main dinosaur 'zippo' and also learnt quadraped walk cycles, runs etc etc. Here's some things you basically need in a quadraped: (btw, your rig is more of a insect, so somethings dont apply)


Independance of the hips to the rest of the body
Independance of the chest to the rest of the body
Independance of the head, with respect to local, parent and world space*
A main torso control that everthings under with respect to the head in world space*
What i mean by independance is that you can adjust the hips without affecting the chest or head* and vice versa. Very important for animal gaits etc.

*The head needs to be able to cleanly switch betweem local, parent and world space, i.e follow local with the chest, in parent space to the torso or world orientationally.

You also need some sort of felt-locking for a horse or dog rig, when its front paw is on and off the ground. My method for this uses a floating chain system.

[Keithtron]

With robotic rigs like that, you can often get away without doing any skinning at all. If the different parts are different pieces of geometry, you can just use constraints and direct connections to attach them to the skeleton. It's a very clean and easy way to to go about doing it, and it's great once you get into more complex mechanical parts. It also evaluates really fast, which might not make a difference to you with simple rigs, but once you get into more advanced rigs the speed at which they evaluate will be much more important. I recently rigged a steam engine in that fashion, which turned out quite nice.

However, if the geometry is all one object, you can't do that. But in some cases, you can get away with doing a rigid bind, as long as none of the vertices need to be influenced by more than 1 joint. In your case, you just have to decide whether or not you want the "elbow" bit to deform halfway between the upper and lower "limbs", or if just having it attached to the upper limb is ok. If that's ok, then a rigid bind would work, otherwise you'll need a smooth bind.

I love mechanical rigging.
:-)

[Keithtron]

Oh, and sometimes you don't even need a skeleton. Grouping the geo properly and placing the groups' pivot points where the joints would go could work too. Then you can just rotate those groups either manually or by driving them with control objects. I don't really like that method, but it's good to be aware of and can potentially be useful if you just need a small task done quick and simple.

[Gurboura]

Thank you everyone for you're ideas and input!

I haven't been able to rig anything lately, or even do anything with Characters as I'm stuck creating with NURBs, Cameras and Lights :D

Character Design is next month. :applause: :bounce:

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