texturing a dragon

[j83]

A dark purple color rendered against a black background makes it hard to see. Do some more close up renders, with a non-black background, etc. and you'll get more help. ;)

[Scott31]

Thnaks alot MrJonathan. Here's some more...

[j83]

The base model is somewhat OK, but he would probably work best as a base mesh, then imported into a high-poly 3d modeling program such as Mudbox or Zbrush.

What is the goal of this dragon? To be shown as a real-time, game piece? :)

For the model, I'd perhaps give it more character, somewhat flared nostrils, more rigid neckline, etc. (see the picture below).

As for the texture, if you're going to be painting in all the detail, and not wanting to create a normal map or displacement map, perhaps work on creating reptilic-like scales on the back and sides, and a alligator like underbelly. :)

Here's an interestesting and hi-res reference for the skin perhaps, but this would be just a basis, as of course, a dragon would "naturally" have a little different, larger scales. :D
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/32/Tree_Dragon_Close444.jpg

[Scott31]

It's just a portfolio/demo reel piece. It was the final project for my last class. Yes it would be nice if I could take it into z-brush or mudbox, but that would require me to have one of those pieces of software.

[j83]

Ok, cool deal then. Check the post above, I edited it and included some more information.

What software are you using, BTW? :) If you're going to leave the model as is, some time working with the diffuse map could make a Wii-esque, low-poly dragon. :)

[Cameo]

There are several seam issues but the main thing that lets it down at the moment is that the colour is one solid flat tone. Search for images of reptiles on google or go to cgtextures and look at the reptiles in the animals section. You'll notice that there are huge variances in colour,shade,pattern and so forth on all the reptiles featured - this is before you even begin to look at scales,pores,creases and so on which actually describe the skin itself.

For instance these bad boys...

http://www.cgtextures.com/texview.php?id=19100&s=L&PHPSESSID=d7f2b261a5ad73828eee66940a3969a2


http://www.cgtextures.com/texview.php?id=19084&s=S&PHPSESSID=d7f2b261a5ad73828eee66940a3969a2 (http://www.cgtextures.com/texview.php?id=19084&s=S&PHPSESSID=d7f2b261a5ad73828eee66940a3969a2)


http://www.cgtextures.com/texview.php?id=19083&s=S&PHPSESSID=d7f2b261a5ad73828eee66940a3969a2 (http://www.cgtextures.com/texview.php?id=19083&s=S&PHPSESSID=d7f2b261a5ad73828eee66940a3969a2)

..would be a pretty good basis for a dragons skin if you ask me. But look at the variance in colours - the legs are a completely different colour to the body which is a completely different colour to the head and yet it still looks completely natural. Thats what looks unnatural about your dragon to me scott, how many living creatures do you know which are a single colour?

I dont know what style you are aiming for with your texture but even something stylised should have variance in the colours and shades used to make it visually appealling.

Theres possibly more stuff but Im tired and off to bed, thats just what hit me straight away.

Good luck with it mate.

[Scott31]

Here's the new one. Keep in mind this is way farther than I've ever been with this kind of texturing. I'm using 3ds max and photoshop. I considered remodeling a couple of times, but ultimately I realize that I can model it forever but it's not going to texture itself. I needed to get this thing textured and put in my reel so I can start looking for work. I also want to redo a praying mantis I did a year ago after this dragon is done. A stylization with a bit of a comic book-like look was what I was thinking from the start. I definitley needed to vary the color! I looked at the lizard pics posted and some alligators and bats. Thanks for the advice.

[j83]

Good progress. :)

[Scott31]

This is about all I can come up with. The last pic is included only to show how disastrous it was when I tried to paint scales. I wasn't planning on putting scales on but the advice here and from my instructor seemed to feel I should. I gave this texture my all and this is the extent of my knowledge. I have such a hard time knowing where I am when I'm painting! I spend so much time saving and rendering just to see where the change will end up. Also I tried other colors but they just seemed to make it look more like a strange lizard and less like my dragon. Thanks again for all the help. Any additional advice?

[Marcel]

Search for images of reptiles on google or go to cgtextures and look at the reptiles in the animals section.

Coincidentally I just added a lot of new reptile images today. A lot of new snake textures, but also some nice lizards that could be used for reference or actual textures. :thumbsup:

[j83]

Coincidentally I just added a lot of new reptile images today. A lot of new snake textures, but also some nice lizards that could be used for reference or actual textures. :thumbsup:

I <3 CGtextures. :D

Thanks for the useful website!

[Scott31]

Here's my...latest. I'm really lost here but i want to be professional about it. I clone stamped a grayscaled lizard scale all over most of it. I'm simply dying at this point to ask how any of you learned how to do this sort of thing? My school curriculum does not go over this. If I taked about creating a spec map for this thing my peers would look at me, say I hate you, and be completely convinced that I'm an over-achieving show off.

Lastly, I'm considering showing this dragon on my demo reel as a non-textured turntable. Any thoughts? I want to succeed so bad. Unfortunately most of the material on demo reels is dated around 2003-2004 so I don't know how updated the advice is. I need to look for work as I'm in my last semester and I want to model.

[Scott31]

I hope this isn't inappropriate to go off the topic of the original post about the dragon but I wanted to show my praying mantis texture as well. Like the dragon this is a model that turned out OK but I had no idea how to texture it. I re-did it recently as attached here. This mantis was actually the final project of my intro to 3ds Max class. I used alot of clone stamping from reference images and then painted a little on top. Again I'll ask if I should just turn this model around with no texture?

[Marcel]

The mantis looks very nice, good work!

For your next model do spend some more time on the UV-mapping, right now you are wasting 50% of the space of your texture. By simply moving around stuff you could easily used the space better.

[Scott31]

Here's the dragon again. Honestly I'd like to know what any of you would think if you saw this in a video game modelers demo reel? I just don't have time anymore to keep at this so it's just going to have to be done.

[j83]

Much better.

What's keeping you from working on it some more? :)

When you're learning, which a lot of us are, it's more important to get the model done well than quick.

I'm not saying you're going too fast or anything, I'm just saying if you're putting it in your reel, it should be the very best you can do, no matter if it takes a few more weeks. :)

[SylvanMist]

For your next model do spend some more time on the UV-mapping, right now you are wasting 50% of the space of your texture. By simply moving around stuff you could easily used the space better.


I was gonna say the same thing. The texture isn't bad but you could totally have made all those pieces a lot larger if you rearranged the UV's better in the space you've got. The more you do it the more you'll learn..just play with it and experiment :)

[Scott31]

Much better.

What's keeping you from working on it some more? :)

When you're learning, which a lot of us are, it's more important to get the model done well than quick.

I'm not saying you're going too fast or anything, I'm just saying if you're putting it in your reel, it should be the very best you can do, no matter if it takes a few more weeks. :)

The main problem is me simply not knowing what to do. I'm trying to figure this out blindly it seems. I'm not sure what it means to not waste space on the texture. I'd love to fix it but I don't even know what that means. I just can't wrap my head around how I'm supposed to get this flat 2d image to wrap around this 3d object right. I can't keep it up foreveer when I have no idea what else to do. This is the best I can do right now. I really have no idea what I'm doing.

Second, I'm running out of time. I have almost no free time anymore. I have to have my demo reel put together soon or I'll never get a job. I graduating soon and I haven't started looking for work yet. I was supposed to be done with this about 2 months ago.

Thanks again. This advice gives me a little bit of hope.

[blank]

Remember you dont just have to just hand paint in photoshop, you can use all the materials in max utiliseing blend maps, procedural textures, gradient maps etc. Whatever to make a good base to paint onto final detail, you could even just do a planar projection from the side and then fix any wierd stretched bits of the texture in photoshop or you could break it down in to smaller chunks and texture each bit individually and then combine and bake them all into 1 or more UVW sets at the end to tidy up.

remember you not fixed with:

model > UnwrapUVW entire model > texture

As for 'Wasting the texture space' what is meant is that how you have layed out your pattern doesn't use the available space that well, which ultimately means that your texture for its size will have less resolution in it.

A quick example hope you dont mind not saying this is the best way to do it but it does illustrate the point.

1, a quick re-jigging of your present UVs, All black space is wasted = Booo!!
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/7831/unwraphelplg8.jpg (http://imageshack.us/)

Because of the Re-jigging I was able to scale up the UVs to better fit the space which means you will end up with a higher res texture on your model but still using exactly the same size texture map as your origonal.

http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/600/unwraphelp2dk1.jpg (http://imageshack.us/)


Hope this helps a little and dont be in a rush to get a job, get you portfolio right and the jobs will follow more easily.

[Scott31]

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj314/scottmichael28/CGTalk01.jpg

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj314/scottmichael28/CGTalk02.jpg

I wanted to post here again after a long silence to assure all those who have helped me here and viewed this thread that I haven't given up. I'm still picking away at it here and there. Most of it lately has been trying to further understand the unwrapping process. I attached links to a couple screen shots to show what I've been doing. I have little confidence on how I've unwrapped the toes. I find it difficult to have the separate areas looked like they are blending together very nicely. By looking at the checker pattern on the model I seen some parts looking OK and others not so. But I won't give up! Thanks again for all the help.

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