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Samran
11-29-2007, 08:07 PM
Hi
I try to study face topology
I now we have a lot of loop idea for face but I want to find new one , good for animation and easy to make
You can tack a look to it ,still in wip
any C is welcome
thanks

toontje
11-29-2007, 08:28 PM
WRONG!
Bad eye loops!
And now for the constructive part:
To see how your character will animate, just compres the loops (in your case the red lines and blue lines). Your eye loops moves in only 2 direction: the blue parallels and the red parallels. Those movement are not what the underlying muscles could ever do.

Why not do it like everybody else? You shouldn't reinvent the wheel. Keep the eye loops circular.

There is a loop running around the lips and ending at the eye socket. Also wrong, you'll get unnecesary stretching between the eyes and mouth. Besides, pulling the mouth verts will pull also the eye verts.

The bottom and sides of the nodes needs some isolation loops.

Tip: look at the flow of the main muscles in an anatomical chart.

Cheers :)

Samran
11-29-2007, 09:14 PM
Thanks toontje for C
I am with you but my I idea is the skin didn’t move lick muscles , the skin banding by defiant whey , if you looking to old man you whal see a lot of band and I think I can make this band by this loop , the muscles can help to find the direction of movement not view of skin ! “ gust idea” ! .

Peter Johansson
11-29-2007, 09:49 PM
Hey Samran!

In my opinion toontje is right, a bit harsh but right. I get your idea but it wont really work well in animation.

Here is a quick sketch of how I would do it. And I think this is somewhat near what toontje meant.
http://www.pjohansson.com/forumbilder/wip1paintover.jpg

//Peter

Peter Johansson
11-29-2007, 09:52 PM
double post...

Peter Johansson
11-29-2007, 10:07 PM
server lag..

toontje
11-29-2007, 10:46 PM
Nice Peter. That's what a face topo should look like! Hey, I'm sorry that I sounded harsh. Of course it is a learning experience, but I wanted to sound like someone that's shouting to a pedestrian to watch out for the speeding truck. If this is one of your first attempts Samran, it was a very good attempt, looks clean and it looks logical. The only fact you've overlooked is the anatomical likeness the loops should mimic.

Samran
11-29-2007, 11:57 PM
Thanks Peter for sketch it’s look perfect , and thanks toontie it’s ok .
Poth of you try to posh my to mimic I think I will do ^_^ so is this sketch is Final ?
I need some think for used in all kind of human face, is this working ?
Thanks
and this face blueprint if any buddy want tray
http://www.j1jj.com/uploads/b7f2d04e21.jpg

Peter Johansson
11-30-2007, 08:41 AM
No problem Samran, glad I could help out.

Yeah, this topology setup should work with all sort of "normal" human heads.

It seems that your tilting your head back a little on your reference pics, be sure to tilt your face mesh a bit forward when your done with it. Or take new pictures.

I thought I could post my current face setup and how it in the end will look like a realistic human head.
Hope it helps.

http://www.pjohansson.com/forumbilder/basemesh_front.jpg

And the face testsculpted in Zbrush.
http://www.pjohansson.com/forumbilder/highres01.jpg

http://www.pjohansson.com/forumbilder/highres02.jpg

//Peter

twedzel
11-30-2007, 04:56 PM
The weakness in yours and Peters topology are the edges that run off the nose and around the mouth structure. You've got one edge that runs off the nose and around the mouth and anouther edge above it that runs off the nose and then along the cheek bone. That edge Should be cutting down and around the whole mouth structure like the one below it. You'll need it when sculpting the mass bulges created by big smiles and frown type shapes. It is an extremely expressive area that is being under represented.

Why not do it like everybody else? You shouldn't reinvent the wheel.

Personally I think this is a lame attitude. Why reinvent the wheel? Because you can make a better wheel. I've reinvented many wheels and found half the time that everybody else is right and its better to do it the tried and true way or that everybody else is screwed and there are better ways of doing things. All you have to do is see what works and what doesn't. I think there are some interesting ideas presented in the initial mock up, but it would be problematic around the nose and for the sculpting skin crinkling/ brow furrowing shapes. Without trying I couldn't say for sure if those eye edges would be cool to work with or a pain in the ass. There are some cool ideas there though.

Samran
11-30-2007, 06:09 PM
Good work Peter happy for your sharing
Twedzel I hop understand you , do you think we can find peter loop ?

toontje
11-30-2007, 06:51 PM
For the first comment, one can place extra edge loops for the nose-mouth area by sub dividing the loops a little more (fill loops).

It seems to me that you have some fresh ideas about topology. Would you care to have a look at my thread and comment on it? I'm always open for new ideas.

http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?t=93651

Peter Johansson
12-01-2007, 01:18 AM
twedzel: When I come to think of it I actually had a problemarea with a character I recently made, just around the mouth area. I could'nt get the detailing right because the lack of polygons in that area. (without getting way out of hand with dividing in Zbrush) So your absolutely right, thanks for pointing it out.

Samran: Thanks, glad you liked it!

BTW, nice thread toontje!

Samran
12-01-2007, 08:33 PM
Hi every one
Toontje : very intrusting good work
I found same intrusting staff
http://www.arabblend.com/temp/000/black_grin_wire.jpghttp://www.arabblend.com/temp/000/diffAng.jpg

and this one make me try to find new loop start from the skin not muscles

http://www.arabblend.com/temp/000/squint.jpg

I tack new photo to help me I wall tray to find the headline of skin

http://www.arabblend.com/temp/000/IMG_1644.jpg

Samran
12-01-2007, 08:56 PM
also we can calculate the number of wire ! if we tack look to skin band

Peter Johansson
12-03-2007, 01:45 PM
Nice study Samran, keep us posted on your progress.

//Peter

Samran
12-04-2007, 09:26 AM
Thanks peter
I find a loot of good information from Dartiste Character Modeling book
I wall add some hear later
Hr is final update for me
C is W

Peter Johansson
12-04-2007, 11:15 AM
That looks more like a topology that i would use, good job.
Maybe if you tried to take a few 3/4 perspective of your face and make a study of that.
That way you could study larger areas and more on the mass of the skull/skin/muscles.

//Peter

Samran
12-06-2007, 09:45 AM
Thanks peter
I wall tack more perspective photo rely I need that .
Her is last update
C is welcome

http://www.j1jj.com/uploads/b782ec6566.jpg

toontje
12-06-2007, 12:31 PM
Double post

toontje
12-06-2007, 01:01 PM
Very nice bas topology! You're on the right track. You have a nice head by the way. It would make a cool render later on.
It is obvious that this stage is still low res. When your done with your modeling, you should increase the resolution of the cage so you kan model in the finer details and the assymetries that shall make this model life like. There are some areas that I would like to see emphesized, areas that are very typical for your face.

I guess the nose would pose a challenge..... but is shouldn't be that hard to model.

The cheek bones of the model should stick out just a tad little bit more to match the photograph.

Keep up the good work.:thumbsup:

PS:
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/1792/suggestionkz8.png

Samran
12-06-2007, 06:49 PM
Thanks toontje lovely you’re sharing ^_^
I try to repeat the modeling with defiant expression to find bad loop for fix , so the details new not important , I wall modeling new one in the end with all the details ^_^
Last update”headline loop only”
I think she is final one for me “eyes and nose range” so the comment new is very important
Thanks
http://www.j1jj.com/uploads/cd0b0b3a47.jpg

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