1080 vs. 1280 for CA work?

[JoelOtron]

You need to find out what the specs for the job are. We always render 1920 x 1080
There is a preset in there:

EDIT--
In 1080, 1920 is the width, 1080 is height
in 720, 1280 is with 720 is height

[danb]

Client wants it in HDTV, but i know there are 2 formats of HDTV. I don't htink i'm dealing with an informed client. So i gotta come up with it myself.

Thanks for the heads up Joel.

[Kuroyume0161]

Actually, there are four basic formats:

(480i) - SDTV
480p
720p
1080i
1080p - (new)

'i' means interlaced while 'p' means progressive. SDTV is your typical 4:3 standard definition (thus 'SD'). HDTV is always in 16:9 (as far as I know; again simplified info).

Before people get all out of shape, this is the 'basic' information. HDTV is mucho moro complex than this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDTV

xxx

[danb]

Thank you Kuryumo.

I'm trying to get an idea if specific HDTV resolutions will effect motion blur, details and all of that side of things, because CA uses a lot of motion blur compared to other animations. Right?

[Kuroyume0161]

Motion is mostly considered on the video compression side of the equation. This has less to do with the video display format and more the MPEG compression involved. Usually, VBR (variable bit rate) compression is best as it will compress based on how fast (and how many of) the pixels are changing. CBR (constant bit rate) compression will compress whether pixels change or not and can result in 'mpegging' if the compression is too high and the motion is fast. That said, progressive scan formats work better with fast motion than interlaced scan formats.

This bit from the previous link should give you a basic idea of which HD format to consider as the source video:

Non-cinematic HDTV video recordings are recorded in either 720p (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/720p) or 1080i (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080i) format. The format used depends on the broadcast company (if destined for television broadcast); however, in other scenarios the format choice will vary depending on a variety of factors. In general, 720p (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/720p) is more appropriate for fast action as it uses progressive scan frames, as opposed to 1080i (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080i) which uses interlaced fields and thus can have a degradation of image quality with fast motion. In addition, 720p (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/720p) is used more often with Internet distribution of HD video, as all computer monitors are progressive. 720p video also has lower storage and decoding requirements than 1080i or 1080p.



So, depending upon the needs of your client and the final type of display involved (cinema, TV, internet, DVD), you'll want to stay with a progressive scan format (which can be either 480,720,or1080) and an appropriate MPEG compression/codec and so on.

[govinda]

This all has to come from the client, definitely, or you could be in for a nightmare. Worse case is you're rendering 1920x1080 @ 60fps so it can be interlaced in case it goes out 1080i.

[marcorabellini]

Also, clients confuse HD with widescreen. If you are delivering on DVD chances are what they want is standard def widescreen, not HD. The only way to do HD on a DVD is BluRay or HD DVD. If you are delivering for a trade show booth you'll need to coordinate what the booth video guys have set up. I did a crazy-big resolution this summer (ultra-something) that was played from a computer to a giant piece of fogged glass. It was pretty impressive. The only thing that I could render to was QT as Windows Media doesn't like non-standard video sizes that large. If they want HD and don't plan on BR or HDDVD they'll need to run it off a computer. Do LOTS of tests. I also did some stuff for Europe recently, but that's another nightmare for res and sizes...
m

[Shademaster]

Also remember you need to have 4 times the detail in your scenes in order to pull of HD nicely. I had this character meant for standard PAL television, at PAL res he looked awesome! When I rendered him to 1280x720p I was amazed at how bad it looked, I needed to rework everyhting in order to make him work for HD. 4 times the detail means 4 times the rendertimes, and 4 times rendertimes x 4 times the resolution can lead up to 16 times longer renders than SD resolution!

[danb]

Thanks guys this is all very helpful.

Would anyone be able to do a critique of my work? I can't show it publicly so it would have to be through private message.

If you can please let me know and i'll send you an animation when its done rendering.

Thank you.

[imashination]

Kick them in the balls and get some real specs from them. If they dont know what they want and theyve been using their neighbours son as a consultant, then you need to tell them what they want. Vague ideas where neither of you know what you want will end up in tears.

My line of gestapo interrogation means I ask them who the audience is; 5 suits in a room? 1 million people on tv? playing on a webpage?

Then ask what its played back on, plasma screen, projector.

Then ask what sources the video is coming from, played from a laptop?, played from a dvd player etc. Once you have these you can make an informed guess.

I tend to find the most popular combos and requested formats are either:

laptop + projector = 1024x768 quicktime
dvd player + tv /plasma = 1024x576 squashed down to Pal D1 after editing

If its for full commercial broadcast and they cant tell you something as basic as the resolution they want then run, now. It means this is the first time theyve done this before, or that theyve idiots who do it alot and still dont know what to do.

[danb]

Kick them in the balls and get some real specs from them. If they dont know what they want and theyve been using their neighbours son as a consultant, then you need to tell them what they want. Vague ideas where neither of you know what you want will end up in tears.

My line of gestapo interrogation means I ask them who the audience is; 5 suits in a room? 1 million people on tv? playing on a webpage?

Then ask what its played back on, plasma screen, projector.

Then ask what sources the video is coming from, played from a laptop?, played from a dvd player etc. Once you have these you can make an informed guess.

I tend to find the most popular combos and requested formats are either:

laptop + projector = 1024x768 quicktime
dvd player + tv /plasma = 1024x576 squashed down to Pal D1 after editing

If its for full commercial broadcast and they cant tell you something as basic as the resolution they want then run, now. It means this is the first time theyve done this before, or that theyve idiots who do it alot and still dont know what to do.

This is awesome advice. Especially the first line. :)

I'll email them back and ask these same questions, and threaten the ball kicking. We'll see what happens. :)

[danb]

Okay i didn't threaten the ball kicking but i did get some answers. :)

They want it rendered at 1280x720.

I rendered one animation out to this res. When i play it in quicktime at 100% it is larger than my desktop, but my screen res is set to 1280x1024 and higher. What i mean is my desktop is larger than the quicktime should be but its not.

Why does this happen?

[Kuroyume0161]

Well, your screen is 1280 wide and the video is 1280 wide and the window around the QuickTime video is ...?

I'm running in 2048x1536 on my main monitor. I wouldn't do less - and I refuse to 'downgrade' to an LCD monitor that does at best 1900x1200. There are LCDs that will do my resolution - yeah, at 26" and $4000.

Either get a better monitor or you'll have to scale the video in QuickTime (Half should do nicely). Or select Full Screen.

[danb]

Yeah it was my mistake. I think i accidentally rendered at 300dpi, plus the screen res was the close to the quicktime res.

I had to dig for the correct settings as my catalyst control center was only letting me go up to 1280. Once i unchecked "hide modes not supported" i could get up to 1600.

Changed to 1680x1024 and everythings fine now.

Thanks again.

[imashination]

Dell 30" LCD, 2560x1600 - $600

The dinosaurs want their CRT monitor back, and they look hungry.

[Kuroyume0161]

Yeah, 30" LCD. Where am I going to put a 30" LCD in my office? I have two monitors. The one doing 2048x1536 is 21" (19"x19"x50'). ;0) That barely fits. Maybe you have that 10' long desk - I don't.

My problem with LCD's isn't the pixel dimensions (specifically), it's the size required to get them. Also, you can't change the pixel dimensions. Oh, you can 'fake' change them but...
I'm also a bit wary about an LCD that big for only $600 - from Dell yet (not my favorite).

CRTs are big, bulky, archaic. They are also more dependable, never suffer from dead pixels, and don't need to span a house to display the same resolutions.

LCDs are getting closer. When you find a 2048x1536 LCD 24" (or smaller) monitor for $600, lemme know.

[CGTalk Moderation]

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.