Spline modelling trouble

[CIM]

Why not try using box modeling for a vcr?

[ClingFree]

Why not use the points from the disc tool?

[SplineGod]

Originally posted by ClingFree
Why not use the points from the disc tool?
Clingfree has a good point. If you are going to use splines use primitives to select points from to make your splines.
CIM also has a point. Use splines when it makes sense to.

[wgreenlee1]

Spline circles can be done with ease.
All you need to do is think of a spline cage as edges of a poly.
Draw the splines out like you would wish to have polys drawn.
Always work in fours,just like quads are everyones favorites,make quad spline cages and almost any shape can be defined.

[Perambulator]

Thanks guys.

The reason why I went for splines is that the object in question has a number of insetted circular areas, and has a number of curved edges.

I am also struggling thinking of the areas where the circular button insets are.

I had (and still have ) no ideas about how I'd do those areas using box modelling.

So, I thought spline outlines, then use sub-patches to finish off.

If any-one can show me how to do it using box modelling with those circular insets, then I'll try it that way.

Cheers

Rich

[SplineGod]

One way you can get those areas from box modeling is once you get a box with sufficient subdivisions you can use spin quads, smooth shift, bevels, edge tools ( a free plugin), band saw and a variety of other tools to change the way the polys flow and create inset or outsetted areas.

[Perambulator]

SplineGod,

Thanks.

Do these techniques still apply to the circular insets that you get for buttons?

I'll download the non-standard plugin (edge tools you mentioned and give them a whirl.

It's just the circular bits that freak me out!

Thanks again

Rich

[sketchyjay]

The great thing about box modeling is that when you hit tab it smooths everything. I did a bucket with the little plastic thingy on the sides that hold the handle. They are just squares or blocks with square openings where the handle goes. When you hit tab it will automatically smooth it to as close as a circle as it can get. But of course it will be really smooth so what you need to do is use bandsaw to add an edge near the already existing one. this will sharpen it.

Read the manual and experiment with it. Bandsaw Pro shows you what will happen as you play with the settings so you might want to use that.

To make the button mini tut...
Make a square poly. Bevel it. but use bevel just to make a smaller poly inside the original one. Then bevel again and this time make your indented space. Bevel again to make the bottom of the indent and finally make another bevel and make the button.

Hit tab and tada indented button. Now it's to smooth so lets bandsaw

hit tab again

Bandsaw would be used on those polys surrounding the indent from the first bevel. Select the 4 polys around the indent. Hit bandsaw. Click divide. use the edit button and drag the line closer to one side (i Usually get it near 10-20%/80-90% unless the poly is really big. ). Try to get the edge it adds closer to the indent side of the polys. you may have to undo it a few times to get it right.

you can hit tab at each step to see what it is doing...

Next select 2 polys that form the inside wall of the indent and run bandsaw again. this time set bandsaw button to add and add a second edge. click edit and move them to either end. You want to sharpen the top and bottom of the indent.

you'll do the same on the bottom. select 2 polys down there and bandsaw them. Since it is already set to 2 edges just use the same settings.

then the button sides. select 2 and bandsaw

The top being one poly can be edged by using bevel and just shrink it a bit to get some extra detail around edge. That should be enough. if not run bandsaw on top...hit the delete button and keep only one edge. hit the edit button and move it to where you need.

that should be it. Bandsaw is your friend. Use it to make a simple box into the cd case by bandsawing edges along each side. Bevel for single polys and smoothshift for groups of polys should do the trick..

Jay

[Chewey]

I started out using spline modeling exclusively for organic modeling when I first purchased Lightwave 5.5 a few years ago. When LW6 arrived and no longer played well with my legacy spline cages I just left the technique behind in favor of using straight poly modeling for organic modeling work.

I'd recommend learning the poly tool set first.

[Perambulator]

sketchyj,

Thanks for the mini-tut. Good way to make buttony type things. Will try it asap.

Chewey,

Cheers for the advice.

Problems I have with box modelling is joining the curved sections to the straight sections.

I tried box type modelling in two ways. i) used points to make a curve like the outside edge of the dvd player. The used extender to move inwards. Problem with this is that I am left with a hole, and still have grief joining up to the curvy bits.

If I start with a sealed box, how do I add the buttons and curved inset areas without resorting to booleans?

I'm going to post some pictures tonight of the actual thing!

Cheers

Rich

[sketchyjay]

you knife detail in or bevel it in and use the spin quads to get the points where you need them.

I would use bandsaw on the polys that house the buttons. hit f to flip them then run bandsaw to add enough edges to put in each button. bandsaw will stop were the faces aren't in the same direction. once your done hit f again. I would then delete the polys on the end that now have more than 4 sides and restitch the hole close. OR make sure they are in an area that is flat and leave them.

The goal is to get inventive with cutting the detail into the areas you need.

Jay

[Steve Warner]

I agree with Chewey. Don't overlook the power of straight poly modeling.

http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Tutorials/html/modeling_overview.html

Just make sure to bevel everything. If you go with subpatch objects, try adding some subpatch weights:

http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Tutorials/html/subpatch_weights.html

Hope this helps,

Steve

[sketchyjay]

Originally posted by Steve Warner
I agree with Chewey. Don't overlook the power of straight poly modeling.

http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Tutorials/html/modeling_overview.html

Just make sure to bevel everything. If you go with subpatch objects, try adding some subpatch weights:

http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Tutorials/html/subpatch_weights.html

Hope this helps,

Steve

Great tutorials. helps explain what is going on when using the knife and bandsaw.

I agree. Use what works. Here is an idea. Use the subpatch mode to smooth the CD player body to what you want. Then freeze it. then go in and bolean out any buttons. You can use Shift-Z to combine large areas of flat polys into one.

There are alot of ways to approch this so try them out and see how they each work.

Jay

[Perambulator]

Here is what I am trying to model:

http://escapedigitalmedia.co.uk/all.jpg

areas which freak me out are:

http://escapedigitalmedia.co.uk/leftside.jpg

and

http://www.escapedigitalmedia.co.uk/rightside.jpg

i.e. the curvy bits.

Still don't see how I start with a flat box front, and get this curved out, without using booleans (which look messy).

Cheers in advance

Rich

[Steve Warner]

Here's a quick movie showing how I'd approach this. Microsoft Mpeg-4 AVI file:

http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Tutorials/DVD.avi

I made a small mistake in the creation of the face template. You'll see me drag out a box with rounded corners and then create a circle to the right of it. I should have dragged the box out more to the right so that it would line up with the circle. As a result, my template needs some minor adjustments to be level. It's not a big deal, and the result is still pleasing. Anyway, just keep that in mind as you're watching so you can avoid that mistake on your end.

Hope this helps!

Steve

P.S. The file is about 12MB, just in case you're on a dial-up connection.

[ClingFree]

Here is a quick pic I hope helps a little with box modeling...smooth shift is the coolest tool.

[SplineGod]

Heres the way I would probably do some of it:
Make the shape of the front bezel using the box tool, give the corners a radius and make it flat.
Selecta all the polys in the object and merge them (shift z).
Make template objects in the background layer and then use the solid drill tool to cut the shapes into the bezel.
Once you have that done make a spline in a background layer that follows the contour of the beveling where the various pieces go. From there select the parts you cut into the bezel and do a RAIL BEVEL.
I probably wouldnt mess with SubDs because the DVD player is made from pieces. Just make the parts and put it together rather then treat it as a single object. As you can see I have a minimal amount of polys and its very clean.
http://www.splinegod.com/examples/dvd_bezel.jpg

[Perambulator]

Guys. And this is why this is the best forum on the web! Three tutorials in essence.

ClingFree- I have used smooth shift a bit, but couldn't get sufficently round buttons for my liking. Yours are better than mine.

SplineGod - Thanks for the pic. I like the minimum poly count. Lot cleaner than my attempt.

Steve - I am sadly on a dial up so won't be able to dowload your movie till tomorrow. Hope you can leave it up till than. That was really good of you!

Will post some of my efforts over the next few days hopefully.

Thanks for all of your help

Rich

[Steve Warner]

Perambulator,

No problem. I'll leave the video up until next week. It's essentially the same technique as Splinegod's, but instead of using a rail bevel, I just use a normal bevel. Quick and efficient. :)

Let us know how it works out for you. :thumbsup:

Steve

[Perambulator]

Steve,

Just watched your video. That was cool. And the end result looks great.

I think I'd just got the idea into my head that subpatches are the way to go. Of course, they are difficult to control, so that's where I was running into problems.

I certainly won't overlook the poly approach in future!

Thanks again for doing that video. It really was great.

Will tackle my version again tonight.

Cheers

Rich

[Perambulator]

Steve,

One final question if you don't mind. What was that plugin that you used halfway through the vid (RFanPoly?) and what was it for?

Cheers

Rich

[Steve Warner]

Hey Rich, glad to hear the video was helpful. :beer:

The plugin I used in the video was ume_R_Polyfan. You can get it here:

http://plaza17.mbn.or.jp/~PICTRIX/index2.html

It basically smooths out sharp edges. When I joined the box and the circle to create the template poly, I ended up with a harder angle than I wanted. Looking at your reference image, I could see that the place where the long box met with the circle was slightly rounded. My box went directly into the circular shape. If you weren't going to do a close up shot, then this would be fine. But a close up shot would reveal an unpleasant hard edge. To be safe, I chose to round that edge out a bit. I did this with the R_Polyfan plugin. Here's a quick animated .gif to help explain:

http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Tutorials/polyfan.gif

Cheers!

Steve

[ClingFree]

Cool plug-in...thanks for the tip Steve!

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