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Mayec
10-07-2007, 01:11 AM
Dear friends,

I'm proud to show you my shortfilm SUBSTANTIA. You can watch/download it at:

http://www.substantia.eu/ (http://www.substantia.eu/)

For those of you who have a fast internet connection, I recommend the HD-720 download. It's the only way to appreciate the work that went into its making, since it was created at HD-1080 resolution.

Some parts will be familiar to those of you who saw my FX/Lighting reel (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=544032).

C&C most welcome. Thanks for the visit.

Mayec

ragdoll
10-07-2007, 01:45 AM
good job! 5 :thumbsup:

ivanisavich
10-07-2007, 03:03 AM
Wow...that was absolutely beautiful....the way you tied it together at the end with the tear...WOW!!! Loved it, 5 stars...I want to see this on the frontpage!

Jasoto
10-07-2007, 03:58 PM
Ragdoll, Ivanisavich I'm glad to see that you enjoyed our shortfilm.

We hope more people will like it as well!!


Regards!!


Jas (José Angel Soto)

http://elindefinidobender.blogspot.com/

marciowski
10-07-2007, 04:11 PM
frontpage?
You deserve an Oscar!

Brilliant

Congratulations!

RobertoOrtiz
10-07-2007, 04:58 PM
Yep you are getting plugged!

Great work!
-R

PS Thanks to Rens Heeren for the tip

Mayec
10-07-2007, 05:31 PM
Wow guys! Thanks a lot for the frontpage (to Roberto Ortiz for doing it, to all the others for giving the idea) ;).

RobertoOrtiz
10-07-2007, 05:43 PM
Wow guys! Thanks a lot for the frontpage (to Roberto Ortiz for doing it, to all the others for giving the idea) ;).

Well when you won some awards, just plug us..

:)
Great work!

-R

Sovica
10-07-2007, 05:49 PM
This is beautiful!
I completely understand.

Good job!

PhuongDPh
10-07-2007, 05:55 PM
frontpage?
You deserve an Oscar!

Brilliant

Congratulations!

oh, ah, make me so curious
but download from megaupload is very slow
downloading.......http://k.1asphost.com/phls/smilies/45.gif
http://k.1asphost.com/phls/smilies/l28.gif http://k.1asphost.com/phls/smilies/l47.gif

Mayec
10-07-2007, 05:57 PM
Well when you won some awards, just plug us..

Truth is, we already won a couple... :D

In June we won the 1st Award in Animation category, at the Caostica (http://caostica.org/caostica/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=100) festival (Bilbao, Spain).

Although we were notified weeks ago about the other one (and a pretty important one, too), it is not fully official. It should be announced in a matter of days, so I'll let you know as soon as it goes public.

I'll add an awards section to the website soon. Until then, for more up-to-date information, and if you understand spanish, you can visit my blog (mayec.blogspot.com).

Mayec
10-07-2007, 06:01 PM
oh, ah, make me so curious
but download from megaupload is very slow
downloading.......

Sorry Latrommi. In a few days we'll find a hosting solution better than megaupload, but until then it's the best solution we have. Thanks a lot for your patience!

Rens
10-07-2007, 06:02 PM
Yeah very nice work guys, awesome work all around. I love the growing ice and flower, nice effects!

RHansen
10-07-2007, 06:24 PM
incredible man! great job!

Taibatsu
10-07-2007, 06:30 PM
It's very beautiful and sweet :) A lot of sense and great effects.

dickma
10-07-2007, 06:31 PM
Sorry, I feel that there's a problem about plugging into the frontpage.

It doesn't mean the animation is no good but it seems that with a few people response to the thread and "yell" plug it, and so it got "plugged". I just think about what does it means?

(4 people response to the thread and so it get plugged?)

ragdoll
10-07-2007, 07:15 PM
Sorry, I feel that there's a problem about plugging into the frontpage.

It doesn't mean the animation is no good but it seems that with a few people response to the thread and "yell" plug it, and so it got "plugged". I just think about what does it means?

(4 people response to the thread and so it get plugged?)

no.

it got plugged because "H" is for Hwhicked...

just like "H" is for cool hwhip.

ringzero
10-07-2007, 08:48 PM
Sorry, I feel that there's a problem about plugging into the frontpage.

It doesn't mean the animation is no good but it seems that with a few people response to the thread and "yell" plug it, and so it got "plugged". I just think about what does it means?

(4 people response to the thread and so it get plugged?)

I agree

I think Ortiz has a personal interest in this from reeading the post where someone mentions he helped with the idea behind this. Nothin wrong with a mod having a personal interest I guess...but...I do think the quality of this piece does no good for CGTALK standards.

This work is not up to the standard I think most people expect.

Sorry, but I wasted time downloading this - I expect MUCH better from plugged items.

Mayec
10-07-2007, 09:05 PM
I think Ortiz has a personal interest in this from reeading the post where someone mentions he helped with the idea behind this.

Just want to put that straight and out of the discussion: Ortiz has nothing to do with the short (read the credits). I thanked him because (I think, not sure) he "plugged" it. As for the reasons why he or whoever plugged it, I can't say. I'm just happy they did.

Jasoto
10-07-2007, 09:12 PM
frontpage?
You deserve an Oscar!

Brilliant

Congratulations!


If we succeed bringing the shortfilm to 35mm., I'm not sure about the Oscar, but we'll send it to the Goya Awards, the Oscar spanish equivalent, and then we'll see...

Once more thanks for your replys!!

QuantumPixel
10-07-2007, 09:40 PM
I don know .. sorry I was kinda board by this. cool idea tho and it looked pretty nice. good shaders and yea it will win some awards. I guess its just not my cup of tea.

moonwatcher
10-07-2007, 09:49 PM
This was one of the most touching animations I've seen recently. I like the minimalistic yet totally clear storytelling style. Nothing really great from technical point of view, but still the video goes directly in my "inspirations" folder. You reminded my why am I involved in 3D animation at all :)

ExanJU
10-07-2007, 10:06 PM
Somehow this work reminds me of my "groth" animation.. Just that it has a lot more sence then mine did and It has that missing conclusion which I was searching for, but couldn't get to figure out what to add to make it sparcle a little more.. Anyway grate job!! And a very intereting style.

Mayec
10-07-2007, 10:10 PM
Somehow this work reminds me of my "groth" animation..

ExanJU, Is there anywhere on the net where we can see your "groth" animation? You woke my curiosity.

ilusiondigital
10-07-2007, 10:38 PM
Heya Mayec..... I´m really happy for this mate!!!

Great work, and my sincere congrats for this well deserved frontpage

un abrazo

Victor Marin
www.ilusiondigital.com

Zodiac
10-07-2007, 10:57 PM
I agree

I think Ortiz has a personal interest in this from reeading the post where someone mentions he helped with the idea behind this. Nothin wrong with a mod having a personal interest I guess...but...I do think the quality of this piece does no good for CGTALK standards.

This work is not up to the standard I think most people expect.

Sorry, but I wasted time downloading this - I expect MUCH better from plugged items.

whenever something is plugged someone has to make a drama I guess. everytime...
if you didnt like it then tell why you didnt like it and give a constructive critique . who will benefit from just a negative opinion ? it is obvious that the guys who made the piece wont.
and guess what, you are harming yourself. we can keep nicknames in our memory.


jose and mayec,
it is an amazing idea and story . congratulations. well done.

I watched it a few times now I am getting the same kind of warm feeling that I got from the movie "the fountain".it is that good.

it is amazing how you captured this feelings with such simplicity.

Jasoto
10-07-2007, 11:28 PM
Thank you Zodiac, I'll share your congrats with Mayec as we both are Substantia's Directors.:thumbsup:

The reception in his first day on the net amazes me...I'm really excited!!!

swardson
10-07-2007, 11:28 PM
Koodos Mayec,

Don't listen to too much of the naysayers here. Not saying anything about their tastes specifically but there are some people out there that cannot see CG as anything but orcs, explosions, swords and boobs.

I thought the piece was awesome. It showed emotion without using people and had a nice look and concept. Really creative. I hope you all do well with this as it seems you already have.

Also, front page stuff doesnt only come from threads with lots of posts. Mods are put in charge because of their creative eye, familiarity with the flavor of the site and what its members enjoy. This site as some of the best class mods I have seen. So even if the post had 1 post and a mod enjoyed the piece and decided to plug it, so what... I don't know if I had found this piece if it it wasn't plugged so for the record. Thanks for plugging it Roberto.

At that, I think its a nice piece and plan on watching it again to see if I catch anything new.

Good job!

</Praise and Rant>

Brad

ringzero
10-07-2007, 11:40 PM
If you guys think this should be plugged then you got more spare time than me...and Im not the only one suprised this got plugged.

I use the plugged items as a way of filtering out items of this level.

Archieoi
10-07-2007, 11:52 PM
very nice! bravo bravo bravo!

depleteD
10-08-2007, 12:00 AM
Very very impressed. That was amazing

Gabriel Sado
10-08-2007, 12:01 AM
Congratulations!! I liked a lot!

I only suggest one thing, its about edition.

At 1:22 the flower grows and then cuts to almost the same plane/animation as before,
and feels a little confuse.
After that, everything is ok for me.

Good job!

Mayec
10-08-2007, 12:02 AM
Thanks swardson. I know exactly what you mean about the naysayers. As long as there is no constructive criticism (which is what I implied with "C&C welcome") in what they say, I know what to do with it ;).

By the way, just in case it wasn't clear already (and jasoto has been making an effort to make it so, hehe), all your congratulations also go to jasoto. He is José A. Soto (a name you will see at the top of the website), co-director of Substantia. So, even if I did most of the CG work, we are both responsible for the idea, the story and the overall creative process, and so kudos also goes to him.

RobertoOrtiz
10-08-2007, 12:49 AM
Sorry, I feel that there's a problem about plugging into the frontpage.

It doesn't mean the animation is no good but it seems that with a few people response to the thread and "yell" plug it, and so it got "plugged". I just think about what does it means?

(4 people response to the thread and so it get plugged?)

The call to plug something or not is the responsibility of the moderators.
People can recommend something to be plugged, but it is the moderators who decide at the end.



I agree

I think Ortiz has a personal interest in this from reeading the post where someone mentions he helped with the idea behind this. Nothin wrong with a mod having a personal interest I guess...but...I do think the quality of this piece does no good for CGTALK standards.



I had NOTHING to do with the short (I wish I did). Sweet Mocca Mocca, people relax.

And the piece DESERVED the plug.
If you wish to continue this conversation send me a Pm.


-R

Vojislav+Milanovic
10-08-2007, 02:45 AM
I really liked this.
Nice, clean idea, and great story told by using such simple elements.
Well deserved front page, if nothing than for very creative use of animation. But there are, of course, a lot of other good aspects that also contribute to this piece.

Congratulations and I wish you many awards.

ThE_JacO
10-08-2007, 02:58 AM
I'm normally not the kind of person that enjoys this kind of productions, but I have to admit this particular one is well conceived, and it grew on me pretty quick, up to the point where a minute into it I couldn't pretend I didn't like it :)

Technically it might probably have been just a lil bit better, but it was still good enough value that it never spoiled the actual point of the movie.
I liked it because of the clear but not overstated symbolism, a very good sense of timing, a well fitting (if a bit "standard/stereotypical") soundtrack, and an overall good editing and direction.

It got a smile out of me and made me want to send a link to a couple friends, which is probably what makes a short a good one.

Congratulations to the whole team.

Melvil
10-08-2007, 03:07 AM
That was great! Congratulations to everybody involved in making this. I love the simplicity of the visuals and storytelling. Simple, but beautiful and effective.

mistasam02
10-08-2007, 04:13 AM
So beautiful.. really simple yet well done. great job!

jumbo
10-08-2007, 04:13 AM
Wow. At first I didn’t know what I was looking at, but I think about the time the second comet deflected off the icy heart everything hit me at once, and I was instantly impressed.

The minimalism/simplicity got to me too. It seemed effortless in its storytelling—like the story didn’t even have to try to tell itself, just that natural. I’m an animation student trying to develop a concept for my senior project, so I’ve been looking at a bunch of shorts but have yet to see one with this much clarity and simplicity. It’s simply beautiful.

The only thing I’ve been trying to figure out is what the heart in the extreme close up shots at the beginning means. Is that the same heart as the one at the end? That’s no critique, though; this film definitely deserves further study.

I’m glad this was on the front page; otherwise I think I would have missed it.

5 stars and a hearty thanks to both of you—excellent piece:thumbsup:

shouroujin
10-08-2007, 04:37 AM
good job and http://www.substantia.eu/ very beautiful!

dickma
10-08-2007, 04:47 AM
The call to plug something or not is the responsibility of the moderators.
People can recommend something to be plugged, but it is the moderators who decide at the end.





I had NOTHING to do with the short (I wish I did). Sweet Mocca Mocca, people relax.

And the piece DESERVED the plug.
If you wish to continue this conversation send me a Pm.


-R

I would like to know why it is get plugged with a few people yelled "plugged", not to explain your responsibility here, that we are already know.

ThE_JacO
10-08-2007, 05:36 AM
I would like to know why it is get plugged with a few people yelled "plugged", not to explain your responsibility here, that we are already know.

It got plugged because Roberto saw it, liked it, and thought other people would have liked it too, hence the piece deserved attention. THAT is why it was plugged, people going "omgwtfplug" have no relevance whatsoever.
Going by how many people are enjoying the piece, Roberto was right. Now could you please stop polluting a thread that is meant to be about the short, and not your concerns with plugging mechanisms and moderators? Thanks.

dickma
10-08-2007, 05:53 AM
It got plugged because Roberto saw it, liked it, and thought other people would have liked it too, hence the piece deserved attention. THAT is why it was plugged, people going "omgwtfplug" have no relevance whatsoever.
Going by how many people are enjoying the piece, Roberto was right. Now could you please stop polluting a thread that is meant to be about the short, and not your concerns with plugging mechanisms and moderators? Thanks.

Well I just hope that he will be more professional next time on the plugging the frontpage.

Because what I feel the problem is what he did was just for his personal interests, rather than to introduce the values of this animation to us, that worth the plug. Not just me, the others also have this question about that, especially for this case, with 4 people yelled "plug it" so it got "plugged".

LeoNeet
10-08-2007, 06:14 AM
I usually don't bother posting on things like this.. but WOW. Well done. Really strong piece. I wish there were more stuff like this instead of the usual character animation with a gag at the end. ;)

As for those who are crying about the plug. Get over yourself. I would have plugged this regardless of what anyone has to say. Ortiz doesn't need your permission.

I see loads of stuff that get plugged, that I couldn't care less about. If I do go on a link that was plugged (which I didn't like or enjoy) I have wasted like 3 minutes of my time. Crying about it just makes you waste more of your own time...

Stop retracting from the work at hand by spouting your own tears all over it.

Melvil
10-08-2007, 06:15 AM
It has already been established that Roberto has no personal interest in this short film. It was plugged based on its own merit.

Just reading this thread should be enough to convince you that Roberto was right in doing so. People call for a plug when they think it deserves it, and if it gets plugged it is because they were right. How this is not clear to you is beyond me.

Now please let this discussion get back to Substantia.

Millionder
10-08-2007, 06:25 AM
wow
.
'
'
'
'
'
'
'
'
' .
*/ .
. very touching . . .

dickma
10-08-2007, 06:27 AM
It has already been established that Roberto has no personal interest in this short film. It was plugged based on its own merit.

Just reading this thread should be enough to convince you that Roberto was right in doing so. People call for a plug when they think it deserves it, and if it gets plugged it is because they were right. How this is not clear to you is beyond me.

Now please let this discussion get back to Substantia.

Roberto and The_JackO mentioned clearly that Roberto has personal interest in this short film.

I am just raising a question here of why it is got plugged after 4 people yell "plug it" (actually 3). it is not about roberto like it so it is plugged. But should we do things with a deeper reason to support the action?

Clearly I would like to say I do no judgement about the animation is good or bad still from now. But obviously somebody don't like me to questioning and think I am polluting. SAD.

Abazaba
10-08-2007, 06:30 AM
Very nice. Im glad I got to see the whole short after that preview on your Reel. Dont listen too much to the naysayers, I think this is beautiful. Some will hate on the textures, but I pick up a professional vibe all around. Cheers

LeoNeet
10-08-2007, 06:36 AM
It proves how much more important creative thinking and effective use of simplicity in story telling is, than having 'really nice textures'

Inspiring!

eagleeyeadvertising
10-08-2007, 07:41 AM
i must say this is a fantastic work tell me how many awards you have won.
hat's off plz give me the link of your works. i am looking forward for it.
and plz comments on my works too.
ashusmotion
My W.I.P. showreel.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=153&t=540055
http://www.youtube.com/ashusmotion

jurx
10-08-2007, 07:54 AM
very nice and special Idea,....and the conversion is really success!

Obaid3DFX
10-08-2007, 08:01 AM
all I can say this is a very beautifull animation...
the main idea of the story is delivered successfully.

great job man :thumbsup:

CarlCampbell
10-08-2007, 09:05 AM
Diox mio, primera pagina en CGtalk! *sobrecarga mental*

OMG! Front page on CGtalk *brain overload*

Bueno, nada más :D

Cheers!

FalseCathedral
10-08-2007, 09:27 AM
This was one of the most touching animations I've seen recently. I like the minimalistic yet totally clear storytelling style. Nothing really great from technical point of view, but still the video goes directly in my "inspirations" folder. You reminded my why am I involved in 3D animation at all :)

I completely agree with moonwatcher's comment. It's simple, beautiful, and wonderful. A story that any human can relate to.

ABOUTCG-STUDIO
10-08-2007, 09:31 AM
You deserve an Oscar,im sure about that..6 stars!

jussing
10-08-2007, 09:50 AM
I am just raising a question here of why it is got plugged after 4 people yell "plug it" (actually 3). it is not about roberto like it so it is plugged. But should we do things with a deeper reason to support the action?

Plugging doesn't have anything to do with responses. If a moderator sees a thread he thinks deserves to be plugged, he plugs it.

If a CGTalk user like you or me sees something that's not plugged, but we think it deserves to be plugged, we can tip a moderator. The moderator will then subjectively judge if he wants to plug or not. In this case, someone tipped Roberto, and he chose to plug.

- Jonas

originalemanuel
10-08-2007, 10:05 AM
amazing work! very touching!

Mayec
10-08-2007, 10:26 AM
You deserve an Oscar

It's the second time someone says this. It's freaking me out! :D

Thanks, thanks, thanks to all the kind comments that keep pouring in. Technically, I didn't try to go to the maximum quality I can give in any one aspect of the short. There was a lot of work involved, and we didn't want to spend 2 years making a 6 minute short. What I tried was to spread the work all over and get to the point where fx, textures, lighting,etc. just tell and reinforce the story and its implications. We set ourselves tight deadlines for everything, and textures or modeling had to be kept simple to keep in our time goal. Still, I did push my own envelope in a couple of things. Compositing-wise, some of these shots were the most complex I have ever done (the one of the eye-energy has more than 100 render passes). But I never finaled a step thinking "this is as good as it can get". It was always "I have to move on, there is a story to be told". And I'm glad I took that direction, or right now I might still be working and never show the whole piece.

What makes us really proud and happy is that so many people *enjoy* it and that it inspires them.

chiquitito
10-08-2007, 10:30 AM
Congratulations! Mayec and Jose are like machines.

the short film i like very much, the idea is excellent!!!
.....................................................................................................................................................
Bernardo

Bandu
10-08-2007, 10:53 AM
nothing for me, sorry...
modeling, animation, shading, vfx and all the rest just mediocre for my eyes...

thats my opinion

Katachi
10-08-2007, 11:22 AM
This is an absolutely touching and outstanding animated short. It brings up a deep feeling in me and I definetly would have plugged it too (if I had the right to). Great work guys! (even when I wouldn´t say it deserves an oscar *meducks* ;) )

Keep it up!

Roberto and The_JackO mentioned clearly that Roberto has personal interest in this short film.

I am just raising a question here of why it is got plugged after 4 people yell "plug it" (actually 3). it is not about roberto like it so it is plugged. But should we do things with a deeper reason to support the action?

Clearly I would like to say I do no judgement about the animation is good or bad still from now. But obviously somebody don't like me to questioning and think I am polluting. SAD.

Oh man....It´s of absolutely no relevance why it got plugged when in the end it is a great animation. Darn even if he had an interest in seeing it plugged, what the hell is the problem when the movie is still great??? Further insisting on getting the "why" from roberto is infantile and doesn´t serve anything but your own satisfaction or making you say "yes, I was right". It definetly doesn´t serve the movie nor is a constructive crit, so why do you wonder people kind of feel disturbed by "raising such question"? Sorry, I am absolutely unsympathetic for such nonsense discussions that lead to nothing, especially not for the creators of the piece which this thread is about.

If you have a personal problme with the plug, get in touch with the plugger via PM!!

Katachi
10-08-2007, 11:27 AM
nothing for me, sorry...
modeling, animation, shading, vfx and all the rest just mediocre for my eyes...

thats my opinion

It´s fine when all these parts are topnotch, but what are they good for when the plot and cinematographie is bullshit? :) Think about it when you see this piece. This animation is not about high-end glamour modeling animation etc. it´s about the sense of the animation itself. And the simplistic and puristic nature of the modeling animation etc. serves to focus on what is important much better than highly detailed, realisticly shaded and fully packed vfx shots could probably ever do.

That´s my opinion trying to show you why it is my opinion. ;)

Jasoto
10-08-2007, 11:44 AM
Thanks, thanks, thanks, thanks,... :applause:

ringzero
10-08-2007, 12:18 PM
It´s fine when all these parts are topnotch, but what are they good for when the plot and cinematographie is bullshit? :) Think about it when you see this piece. This animation is not about high-end glamour modeling animation etc. it´s about the sense of the animation itself. And the simplistic and puristic nature of the modeling animation etc. serves to focus on what is important much better than highly detailed, realisticly shaded and fully packed vfx shots could probably ever do.

That´s my opinion trying to show you why it is my opinion. ;)

Simplistic and puristic? Sound like he designed it that way? Maybe it is genius?

However the creator says the tear drop shot has 100 render passes. Doesnt sound like he inteded it to look as basic as it does. So is this style deliberate to enhance this story that most posters here loves or was it that the skill levels didnt allow for better visuals?

Apparrently not only is it worthy of plugging - a few posters believe its worthy of an oscar!!! Praise indeed. MASSIVE praise. There seems to be a frenzy to protect this piece from any critisism....yet the clearly overly gushing positive comments posted are considered restrained and normal....hmmm.

I must be off my game today not see this as oscar worthy I guess?

PostProductionGuy
10-08-2007, 12:57 PM
WOW!!
It was incredible! I really loved it! The ending was perfect! And yes it's kind of minimalist. It has a great plot and it means much more than other perfect animation movies. I See that you guys have been selected to Animatu here in Portugal! Good Luck!
Also the music was incredible, but than again you used a composer thats becoming famous in my country. That was clever.
Again, I just loved it, it is worthy of a Goya and it is worthy of being nominated for an Oscar.

Katachi
10-08-2007, 01:19 PM
Simplistic and puristic? Sound like he designed it that way? Maybe it is genius?

However the creator says the tear drop shot has 100 render passes. Doesnt sound like he inteded it to look as basic as it does.

I don´t see any relation between quantity and quality? The more passes you have the more it should look like Pixar animation quality or what´s the exact point?

So is this style deliberate to enhance this story that most posters here loves or was it that the skill levels didnt allow for better visuals?

So an animation can only be clasified as good if the creator has a certain skill level? Is it that really what you say? Sorry, what´s the argument in this statement?

I must be off my game today not see this as oscar worthy I guess?

I think it´s rather a metaphoric statement when people say it´s worth an oscar. Should be clear shouldn´t it?

Blaschke
10-08-2007, 01:30 PM
Great!

Well done!

ENL
10-08-2007, 01:44 PM
that was beautiful. Awesome work!

Mayec
10-08-2007, 02:10 PM
(about the oscar thing)

I think it´s rather a metaphoric statement when people say it´s worth an oscar. Should be clear shouldn´t it?

It's clear to me. I don't see why anyone would take it more seriously than myself. :)

RobertoOrtiz
10-08-2007, 03:45 PM
Roberto and The_JackO mentioned clearly that Roberto has personal interest in this short film.

I am just raising a question here of why it is got plugged after 4 people yell "plug it" (actually 3). it is not about roberto like it so it is plugged. But should we do things with a deeper reason to support the action?

Clearly I would like to say I do no judgement about the animation is good or bad still from now. But obviously somebody don't like me to questioning and think I am polluting. SAD.

I have no reason to explain myself to you.

But quoting Wikipedia
"In law, defamation is the communication of a statement that makes a false claim, expressly stated or implied to be factual, that may harm the reputation of an individual, business, product, group, government or nation. Most jurisdictions allow legal actions, civil and/or criminal, to deter various kinds of defamation and retaliate against criticism."

SO STOP IT

Vexona
10-08-2007, 04:12 PM
amazing short! that was great work!

dickma
10-08-2007, 05:30 PM
I have no reason to explain myself to you.

But quoting Wikipedia
"In law, defamation is the communication of a statement that makes a false claim, expressly stated or implied to be factual, that may harm the reputation of an individual, business, product, group, government or nation. Most jurisdictions allow legal actions, civil and/or criminal, to deter various kinds of defamation and retaliate against criticism."

SO STOP IT

I really dislike the action that the forum leader claimed that I "defamation" him. Is it really help for the matter? It is a kind of provocation act because he is threatening me and I will not draw myself into the trap.

thatoneguy
10-08-2007, 05:48 PM
I have to disagree with many here.

The concept was in my opinion cliche and cheesy. I can't say I liked the lighting, modeling, texturing, editing, cinematography, rendering or compositing. Overall it was visually bland and without something of substance to bring it together in the story or execution department it just left me feeling at best very apathetic.

I half expected unmotivated unicorns and dolphins to show up at any moment. Obviously the logistics of the whole metaphysical operation was supposed to be arbitrary and not thought about but the moment it froze you knew love or some representation of love would thaw it. The suprise at the end was' it made an eye and cried'? Why cry? What happened to all the rock inside the first asteroid? I feel like I shouldn't criticize it on rational ground, but really I can't provide constructive criticism on something that only is based on expressionism. It's non-objective art therefore I won't even try.

byvfx
10-08-2007, 06:10 PM
first of all i would like thank you for sharing your short with us. Secondly im not going to tell you how great or how bad i think it is. The fact that you started something and finished it says something, and alot of people cant even do that.

FSkarstedt
10-08-2007, 06:52 PM
Very nice work! The flower growing is spectacular. I wish you hadn't faded to black so often, but made it more of a continuous flow.

OJK
10-08-2007, 06:58 PM
The concept was in my opinion cliche and cheesy.

sry, but that's my opinion too. I think the symbolism was to flat and obviously... it gives not enough space for interpretation. I think you could tell this story in only half the time.

A very good example for a deeper and clever symbolism is the film "switch" which is also posted here in this forum.

There were some nice effects and the last shot was interesting from the technical point of view but the whole film didn't really touch me.

Mayec
10-08-2007, 07:04 PM
I wish you hadn't faded to black so often, but made it more of a continuous flow.

Thanks FSkarstedt. We used fades to black to narrate long periods of time passing. There may have been other options, but it seemed like the best one at the moment.

Marc Andreoli
10-08-2007, 07:09 PM
I half expected unmotivated unicorns and dolphins to show up at any moment.
That is classic!

Regarding the black fades, it might have helped to change the camera angles/position before and after...

FSkarstedt
10-08-2007, 07:22 PM
There may have been other options, but it seemed like the best one at the moment.

Ahh.. I see where you were going with that now. Since the environment never changed nor the "heart" itself changed any, I didn't get a sense of time passing unfortunately. But very big kudos to you and your team for what you created.

Mayec
10-08-2007, 07:25 PM
Since the environment never changed nor the "heart" itself changed any, I didn't get a sense of time passing unfortunately. But very big kudos to you and your team for what you created.

That's why the lighting on the "heart" changes drastically in those fades.

MrPositive
10-08-2007, 09:32 PM
If you guys think this should be plugged then you got more spare time than me...and Im not the only one suprised this got plugged.

I use the plugged items as a way of filtering out items of this level.

I'm sorry, but that is absurd in my opinion. If you are not moved by the piece then I completely understand that. But to say it doesn't carry enough artistic merit for frontpage, as if your opinion was the only one that matters on this site is ludicrous. Personally, I would much rather see something simplistic and with an emotional story than another fantasy environment on front page. As well, just because someone asks for an item to be frontpaged doesn't ever mean it will get it. It simply has to move a mod in some way and bam it's there. It's a shame you don't see the beauty in this piece. *shrug*

adib
10-08-2007, 09:32 PM
THIS IS VERY NICE SHORT:thumbsup: When you see now the rating,just 3 stars,thats because some people don t recognise the real fact of making a short.Some of them can t do anything and I see in this treed ,only some comments are constructive but most of them discuse about the plugged.

Comon guys you must learn from this short.In most of the cases simply is more beautiful than complex:buttrock: For me this is perfect. The fact that is simple,dosn t mean that is not nice enough.
GREAT WORK 5***** STARS

And for those who don t understand...LEARN FROM THIS
:beer:

sahar
10-08-2007, 10:08 PM
it is a beautiful short...

great work:thumbsup:

cg219
10-08-2007, 10:17 PM
Wow that was great. Only gripe is that the tear drop dosent stretch as its falling. It stays a constant sphere. But other than that, great job.

Mayec
10-08-2007, 10:18 PM
thats because some people don t recognise the real fact of making a short.

Thanks Adib. Not just for the stars, but because what you say is so true. I have twice given conferences on making shorts, and often see this fact: people who have never made a short film by themselves (or even in a small group) can't really value the work behind them. There is a big mind-opening when you make your first short... and so many people never manage to get there. This is my 5th animation short (6th counting one live action). Even if very simple, the first one seemed like the highest hurdle. It's a total mind-shift from doing operator work, and concentrating in one pretty model, or one pretty picture, or one pretty shot... it's ironic that often (I'm not saying always) the people who are the harshest critics of short films are those who have never even tried to make their own.

I have met a couple of great artists and animators in the industry (when I say "great" I'm talking about people who animated main characters in Star Wars and movies of the sort) who, after a life of doing their work for big productions, tell me that they've never made "their own" little story. And they both stated very strongly that they admire and envy us for it. Months later, I found them both working on their own shorts (so I guess its also inspiring for them), which I hope to see completed one day.

jussing
10-08-2007, 10:33 PM
Only gripe is that the tear drop dosent stretch as its fallingThey only do that in drawings. :)

Cheers,
- Jonas

ringzero
10-08-2007, 10:35 PM
THIS IS VERY NICE SHORT:thumbsup: When you see now the rating,just 3 stars,thats because some people don t recognise the real fact of making a short.Some of them can t do anything and I see in this treed ,only some comments are constructive but most of them discuse about the plugged.

Comon guys you must learn from this short.In most of the cases simply is more beautiful than complex:buttrock: For me this is perfect. The fact that is simple,dosn t mean that is not nice enough.
GREAT WORK 5***** STARS

And for those who don t understand...LEARN FROM THIS
:beer:

Its sitting at 3 stars cause theres enough people who think its not so hot - hence its 3 stars average. People who dislike it are not speaking up ; but voting.

When people posted to say this short was lacking in a number of areas they/we got pooped on by everyone suggesting all we like is big boobed orcs with laza guns.

The comment about the dolphins is spot on - Substatia is hackneyed animation festival filler. The kind of thing you get between the stuff between the main attractions.... I dont think its clever - Its up its own behind - I wouldnt have wasted my time watching past the first 30 seconds if it hadnt been plugged - I kept thinking something was going to make it worth my while. It never happened. Only good thing was the music...

I dont want to crap on someones parade - the creator seems like a pleasant individual happy with his output - but I would never have posted if it hadnt been plugged and seemed so out of place for being plugged. Ive never seen something so basic and dull getting plugged. Please excuse me for expecting standards from plugged items.

If it was so good it would have a higher ranking - I bet now there will be a deluge of 5 star votes....thats the way it goes....perhaps its oscar looms after all?

Mayec
10-08-2007, 10:39 PM
Wow that was great. Only gripe is that the tear drop dosent stretch as its falling. It stays a constant sphere. But other than that, great job.

Water drops (and tears) don't stretch when they fall. Here (http://www.liquidsculpture.com/)'s an example. it's because of the surface tension that keeps the form spherical. The usual abstract tear/drop shape we are used to, only appears when the drop starts detaching itself from another object (example (http://www.stralunato.com/images/water-drop.jpg)). If you watch closely in our movie, that's exactly what happens when the tear falls from the eye, at the end.

Actually, by the way, the tear in the short film is not a simple sphere with a simple rippling deformation (which some people think it is). All the tears and their interactions were made with RealFlow fluid simulations. Accuracy was not always the main goal in this short, but in the case of the falling tear shots, I wanted to get the high-speed fall dynamics pretty close. Since the shot composition remains pretty static, that's one element that was supposed to give a sense of speed, the fast-trembling surface of the tear falling. That's also a good example that realism was not out goal: since there's no air in space (only void) there would be no such trembling, since it's caused by air friction (the tear wouldn't even move, since there is no gravity). That's self-granted artistic freedom for you :).The goal of that freedom: to carry the story through. It's like the sound of explosions in space battles, in Star Wars movies and such.

thatoneguy
10-08-2007, 11:43 PM
It's ironic that often (I'm not saying always) the people who are the harshest critics of short films are those who have never even tried to make their own.


Funny I've often found the exact opposite to be true. While people often underestimate the effort and time it takes to make a short I've found that those who have succeeded are often the most critical. Newbies conversely are often the least critical.

Ron Martin
10-09-2007, 12:49 AM
I'm really surprised by this. Cgtalk stands for a certain level of quality. But this work in its own direction truely stands out.

All i wonder about is: Might that complete thread be some kind of a fake? This kind of animation remembers me of things people did 20 years ago when getting a nice image out of a computer was not as easy and cheap as today and mostly technichians and programmers did all the work.

Anybody who is in here claiming for "constructive criticism" should at first deliver something where constructive criticism is able to happen!

The amount of work and effort is not the point - the result is. And this piece is definetly very very far from front page.

xeno
10-09-2007, 01:32 AM
I would also like to comment, seeing as there are a couple of entirely different opinions about the short.

Personally, i feel as if the movie is being judged on 2 seperate things.
The first of that being the emotion it evokes, which a lot of people comment on positively. The second one is the technical quality of the short, which also gets comments, albeit negative ones.
There are of course a few other points, such as story and originality, but overall i think its about the first two.

Ive watched the movie and i must say that i understand both parties. Technically it was not what I myself expect to see plugged on the frontpage and after viewing it, it didnt quite have the same effect on me as it had on others.
I thought it was scored great, but, even though i did appreciate the concept, lacking content.

However, i can imagine that there are a lot of people who "get" it on a whole different level and probably view it the way the creator meant it to be. To those people, the technical aspect will be far less important, because it does something else that art is supposed to do and that is to appeal on an emotional level.
Even though it didnt do it to me, i can definitely respect it if others did feel it.

So maybe thats where our answer is, the movie just "got" to the moderator who plugged it and thats a completely valid reason for something to plugged, because even if i may not
be a fan of it, it doesnt mean that it couldnt be a masterpiece to someone else.

prox-emics
10-09-2007, 02:25 AM
well, atleast it succeeds as art..what with sparking all this controversy and what-not..jajajaj..

anyways, i like it man. its good technically, and has that thing...what do they call it,,umm..oh yeah, a unique style. i think the concept could have been flushed out just a bit more, and i agree it could be a bit shorter and still as effective, but none the less, i think it's a good piece of work. as mentioned before, few know what really goes into a short, and there is definetly some stuff in here i think is awesome (like the 'eye' scene).

i think it's funny how so many people forget that art is opinion. if you dont like something fine, but there is no need to get all venomous on people. just post a well constructed critique offering your two sense and move on. thats whats cool about art, everyone keeps learning from others, well most do atleast ;)...

Vojislav+Milanovic
10-09-2007, 02:51 AM
people who have never made a short film by themselves (or even in a small group) can't really value the work behind them. There is a big mind-opening when you make your first short... and so many people never manage to get there.

YES! There is great satisfaction upon successful completition of short (or feature) movie (or any other work of art). Rare are things that can be compared to that!
Sadly, people who never did such thing and never felt that way are first to throw stones. Which is quite obvious from all this "why plug" distraction.

Again, I congratulate you guys and look forward to see more of your works!

JeffrySG
10-09-2007, 03:06 AM
Wow! simply beautiful!!

the 720p version really is worth the download! :)

Galleon
10-09-2007, 03:43 AM
Great work!

dickma
10-09-2007, 03:49 AM
Can I make a comparison here?

Some days ago, the "josie's lalaland" was plugged, I didn't make any comment about that. However, I don't have any problem about the animation is plugged. Because it is well deserved. (at least the animation reminds me if I am still alive, go somewhere that is beautiful and never forget so at the end of my life, I'll never regret)

OK there's another abstract animation got plugged again, but if "josie's lalaland" set up the par and standard that high, is the animation reach the same standard and worth the plug?

ragdoll
10-09-2007, 04:49 AM
madick: if you've ever tried to create your own short story, then maybe you'd understand why it got plugged. :thumbsup: you've made it clear you don't like it, and nobody's forcing you to... besides, if everyone liked the same thing, then the world would just be boring... i think. :shrug:

-rj

beetz15s
10-09-2007, 05:51 AM
Very beautiful. I enjoy ur style and attention to detail.

RO
10-09-2007, 06:42 AM
I get the mood and all of this works meaning, but I also did not like it. I thought execution could be better visual wise. but in general the pacing was good. In general I think some specific people need to chill, so what you do not like, I do onto like it either but wah, whatever get over your distaste for it. I have done one short and I can say it is hard ****in work so to get shorts done it takes time and a lot of tweaking. I think if the visuals were to the level of the story telling this would be really nice. I think just for story it deserves a plug though.



five stars because of the people who can not get over themselves and the rude.

jussing
10-09-2007, 07:18 AM
OK there's another abstract animation got plugged again, but if "josie's lalaland" set up the par and standard that high, is the animation reach the same standard and worth the plug?
Give it a rest, will you.

Raul-Reznek
10-09-2007, 09:37 AM
i always like seeing a good idea and yours was nothing short of it. my crit is on the directing and the music, the music in particular. i think that with better music it would have been a lot better.

more work like this pls :)

Mayec
10-09-2007, 10:16 AM
Finally, there are some interesting comments coming up, even on the negative side. It's very balanced and fair to say that technically it could be much much better. Yet it is important to recognize that visual virtuosity is not the only, or even the most important, aspect of a short film. We are used to incredibly amnazing CG visuals nowadays. But it's just insane to think that one person can do what a whole studio with some of the best talents in the world can do in the same time. It would take years. That's why I didn't even try.

The approach to this short was a "handicraft" one (although the process itself was very professional, there's never an excuse for not doing that). The idea was to make a very personal story and give it a very personal design and style (I wish it was claymation so that you could see our fingerprints). That's the only place where a two-men-short can compete with 20,50,or 100-people-studios. Blur's or Pixar's shorts will always look better than those made by very small teams (1-5 people). Either that, or 1-5 people will spend 5 years of their lives making one short film (and technology advance is a problem there). That may be ok for some. Personally, I'd rather make 5 interesting personal stories with mediocre visuals in 5 years. It's not a matter of talent, but of mathematics.

This said, I should spend the coming months doing a really cool 5 seconds shot to spice up my Reel :).

Siahpoosh
10-09-2007, 10:34 AM
very nice and great short film.

Drakky
10-09-2007, 11:31 AM
Congrats, Mayec and José! :thumbsup:

¡Un trabajo muy emotivo, enhorabuena!

Jasoto
10-09-2007, 11:56 AM
Eyyyyy!!! Muchas gracias Drakky, por fin un coment in spanish :)

La verdad que estamos muy muy contentos de como le está yendo a nuestro cortometraje, tanto en internet como en algunos festivales....esto no ha hecho más que empezar.

Gracias a todos por vuestros comentarios!!





** recordatorio personal: tengo que ponerme con el inglés rápido, así no puede ser.

chatta
10-09-2007, 12:28 PM
Hello,

I found 3d is not excellent but the story is very beautiful. 5 stars :) .

PostProductionGuy
10-09-2007, 02:07 PM
There's a lot of people here with bad stomach..

Like i said It was really good! I did love it!
The ending with the tear and the eye was perfect at least for me. And it has a powerfull beginning.
The plot was for sure one of the best things there. And like i said it means much more than other perfect animation movies or shorts.
I See that you guys have been selected to Animatu here in Portugal! Good Luck! When is it?
Also the music was incredible, but than again you used a composer thats becoming famous in my country. That was very clever. My company is trying to hire the guy and he is making it difficult.

Again, I just loved it, it is worthy of a Goya and it is worthy of being nominated for an Oscar.

Well Done!

Mayec
10-09-2007, 03:48 PM
I See that you guys have been selected to Animatu here in Portugal! Good Luck! When is it?

Thanks Daniel. The Animatu Festival will take place on days 17-21 October. Specifically, Substantia will be screened on October 18th at 22h30.
More info at my blog (http://mayec.blogspot.com/2007/09/substantia-en-el-animatu-update.html), or at the festival's website (http://www.festivalanimatu.com/).

Also the music was incredible, but than again you used a composer thats becoming famous in my country. That was very clever. My company is trying to hire the guy and he is making it difficult.

Yes, Bruno is a great musician, and it's been a pleasure working with him. We were really lucky to have that chance. I'm sure that any success that Bruno is acquiring in his country is well deserved.

HowLeeWould
10-09-2007, 03:57 PM
Hi,man.your download link didn't work for me,your file hosting server didn't take to your file,instead it stopped at it's toolbar AD page.in hoping it would redirecting to the file secs later,i waited,waited and waited,it didn't move..so i guess it may be showing this AD page just for fresh clicks,thus i close it and open it again,disappoingly,AD shows again and it stop.

TinyCerebellum
10-09-2007, 04:23 PM
Congrats! Regardless of whether it deserves the plug here or not, this short has a very good story, which I find rather rare when it comes to 3d animation shorts. Personally, I'd rather watch a good story unfold with decent art, than watch great art being wasted on a poorly written script.

Keep up the good work, and best of luck at the competitions.

Mayec
10-09-2007, 08:18 PM
I already mentioned the award we got at the Caostica Festival. Well, I can finally announce the second award granted to Substantia (it's official now):

Substantia won the Overall Grand Prize of the worldwide Autodesk Ahead of the Curve Competition (http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/index?id=7668396&siteID=123112)!!! :)

There's an "Awards" section in the Substantia website (http://www.substantia.eu/) now.

I don't like to feed the "to plug or not to plug" discussion but... guess Autodesk gave us a plug of their own ;).

Mayec
10-09-2007, 08:23 PM
Hi,man.your download link didn't work for me,your file hosting server didn't take to your file,instead it stopped at it's toolbar AD page.in hoping it would redirecting to the file secs later,i waited,waited and waited,it didn't move..so i guess it may be showing this AD page just for fresh clicks,thus i close it and open it again,disappoingly,AD shows again and it stop.

¿Did anybody else have any trouble downloading?

HowLee, the download link takes you to the hosting server page. At the top of the page (right next to the big text "megaupload") You should see a spam control field stating "Please enter (3 characters)". You type those 3 characters in the field and press download... that should take you to the donwload itself.

If you still can't download it, let me know. Hopefully in a few days we will have a mirror which will make download much easier.

Katachi
10-09-2007, 09:42 PM
I already mentioned the award we got at the Caostica Festival. Well, I can finally announce the second award granted to Substantia (it's official now):

Substantia won the Overall Grand Prize of the worldwide Autodesk Ahead of the Curve Competition (http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/index?id=7668396&siteID=123112)!!! :)

There's an "Awards" section in the Substantia website (http://www.substantia.eu/) now.

I don't like to feed the "to plug or not to plug" discussion but... guess Autodesk gave us a plug of their own ;).

Oh my god, Autodesk must be out of their mind to give you an award for this work. Shame on them. ;-) Congratulations! What I really like is the expression "power of imagination" they use, it fits your work perfectly imo.

PostProductionGuy
10-09-2007, 09:45 PM
Congratulations! :bounce:

Booyah
10-09-2007, 11:19 PM
simply brilliant:love:

ThE_JacO
10-10-2007, 12:23 AM
Roberto and The_JackO mentioned clearly that Roberto has personal interest in this short film.
At this point I have to assume you have more issues with the english language then I thought.
I stated nothing, and Roberto clearly stated THE OPPOSITE of what you're saying, he said THAT HE HAS NO PERSONAL INVOLVEMENT IN THIS PRODUCTION.
Does the capitalization help getting the point across, or are you still reading the exact opposite of what people state in their posts?

I am just raising a question here of why it is got plugged after 4 people yell "plug it" (actually 3). it is not about roberto like it so it is plugged. But should we do things with a deeper reason to support the action?
And you have been told FFS.
It's been plugged because of the same exact reason everything gets plugged. A moderator found it deserving. Period.
How many times and in how many different phrasings do you need the same answer to be given to you for it to sink?

Clearly I would like to say I do no judgement about the animation is good or bad still from now. But obviously somebody don't like me to questioning and think I am polluting. SAD.
Nobody has a problem with you "questioning", but people have a problem when because YOU don't like something keep posting the same retarded comments and questions over and over in the same thread, and the same questions that have been answered thrice now.
Don't go F'in holy crusader on people if you can't even understand the basics of the language you've been addressed in, it just makes you look stupid.

Could you please now let this thread alone? If you don't like something, fine, just move on instead of making it your personal crusade and starting to randomly attack a moderator who did nothing but plug something he thought deserving of attention (which incidentally another thousand people were happy to give to the piece).

RobertoOrtiz
10-10-2007, 12:41 AM
Thanks "ThE_JacO".
The best thing for now is to let it go.

Anyway, I would like to introduce to all
the TROLL button. It is quite neat and useful.

:)
Anyway I would like to congragulate for the screening at the
Animatu Festival in Portugal.

-R

Mayec
10-10-2007, 01:03 AM
Thanks "ThE_JacO".
Anyway I would like to congragulate for the screening at the
Animatu Festival in Portugal.
-R

Thanks a lot Roberto! It's one more chance for more people to see the flick, which is the most important for us. And this thread brought a thousandful of those :)

snowkiwi
10-10-2007, 01:08 AM
Everything comes together really nicely in HD.
The waterdrop falling is beautiful, the music plays with it in a melodious way. How it fluctuates slightly, while falling, makes it feel more alive and is a nice touch. A simple sweet render.
Good-looking ice heart renders too. I think the idea is really good. Love the simple waterdrop ending. Really good music by Bruno, and a really good job overall. Wish to see more work in the future.

snowkiwi
10-10-2007, 01:18 AM
You know Mayec, the only thing I would try adding, is another element to the background in many shots of the rock. Maybe a space aurora to give some color, or some more stars.
Alright then.
DS

Mayec
10-10-2007, 01:27 AM
You know Mayec, the only thing I would try adding, is another element to the background in many shots of the rock. Maybe a space aurora to give some color, or some stars.
Alright then.

True. There is a little bit of color variation and different patterns of stars. In the original background they were more visible, but I finally tuned them down, and left more empty black space, to create a more lonely sensation, and a sense of wider space, and to distract less with strong colors. But finding the right balance in this was really hard... I drove myself to the vrge of sanity looking for the right balance (you know, that point where you change something again and again, and you ask someone and they really can't see the difference, only you can see it).

It's funny... but stars / space backgrounds are a really complex thing to work on... much more than I would have thought before starting a project full of them :).

QuantumPixel
10-10-2007, 01:36 AM
yea some nebulis gass and stuff in a few shots would make it more wow.

snowkiwi
10-10-2007, 01:49 AM
... I drove myself to the vrge of sanity looking for the right balance (you know, that point where you change something again and again, and you ask someone and they really can't see the difference, only you can see it).

Hehehehe, I know how it is. It's hard to judge yourself, after working on it for so long.

I see what your saying. Well if you feel that strongly about it, go with it. Keep it that way. In the end, from your POV, I think it's how satisfied you feel with it. If there are any corrections you need to make in your artwork, you'll find it the more you go forward. And you're going forward.

Hey, boygonemad thinks so too. But in the end, you the man.

It's funny... but stars / space backgrounds are a really complex thing to work on... much more than I would have thought before starting a project full of them .

Hmmm, I'm not sure if you're using a video editor or the programs you're using, but Maya has a star and aurora generator. After you do that, in Final Cut Pro (one video editor), you can just add a Add layer and experiment with it separately from the 3D render. It can be a static image, on top of the render-video layer. But yah, fine-tuning can be a pain. Goodluck Mayek.

Mayec
10-10-2007, 01:54 AM
Hmmm, I'm not sure if you're using a video editor or the programs you're using, but Maya has a star and aurora generator. After you do that, in Final Cut Pro (one video editor), you can just add a Add layer and experiment with it separately from the 3D render. It can be a static image, on top of the render-video layer. But yah, fine-tuning can be a pain. Goodluck Mayek.

By complex I meant creatively, not technically. I mean that there are many different options and choices to be made... "a star filled space background" means as much as "a hills background"... there are a million ways to do them. I didn't think there were so many possibilites with a space background, but there were. :)

dickma
10-10-2007, 07:52 AM
At this point I have to assume you have more issues with the english language then I thought.
I stated nothing, and Roberto clearly stated THE OPPOSITE of what you're saying, he said THAT HE HAS NO PERSONAL INVOLVEMENT IN THIS PRODUCTION.
Does the capitalization help getting the point across, or are you still reading the exact opposite of what people state in their posts?


And you have been told FFS.
It's been plugged because of the same exact reason everything gets plugged. A moderator found it deserving. Period.
How many times and in how many different phrasings do you need the same answer to be given to you for it to sink?


Nobody has a problem with you "questioning", but people have a problem when because YOU don't like something keep posting the same retarded comments and questions over and over in the same thread, and the same questions that have been answered thrice now.
Don't go F'in holy crusader on people if you can't even understand the basics of the language you've been addressed in, it just makes you look stupid.

Could you please now let this thread alone? If you don't like something, fine, just move on instead of making it your personal crusade and starting to randomly attack a moderator who did nothing but plug something he thought deserving of attention (which incidentally another thousand people were happy to give to the piece).

The decision and the right of a work getting plugged is at your hand, me and other people have no control over this. If it is a good work, there is no doubt about getting plugged because of the popularity. However, I have a feeling about this work is getting rid of a "critism" stage and seems that it is directly get plugged. Now the major influence of getting such popularlity is because it is getting plugged and people natually will click into and see what is it.

This is the question I raised: Do moderators have judgement? It seems that it is plugged because a few people "yelled" plug. If you like a piece of work, you should have feeling, then introduce them and explain to us WHY it has those quality to get plugged. (if you reason is just "you like it", then the reason is too shallow and it is hard to get rid of "personal interest" involved)

I have no intention to attack any of moderators. It is about people have different directions and perspectives to see things. Like people do judgement is because of personal interest and my approach is about to do comparisons. Review of the threads, somebody do a more critical and negative arguement than I and your guys thinks I am the main source because I raised the question... it is not fair.

And I really feel discontent about the moderators who involves in the thread. One way Roberto wants to solve the case by "PM" but in the other hand he state it to the public that I "defamation" him and You said I keep pollutiing the forum. Is it what the moderators do?

YeeWu
10-10-2007, 04:47 PM
This is the question I raised: Do moderators have judgement? It seems that it is plugged because a few people "yelled" plug. If you like a piece of work, you should have feeling, then introduce them and explain to us WHY it has those quality to get plugged. (if you reason is just "you like it", then the reason is too shallow and it is hard to get rid of "personal interest" involved)


I think it's less of an issue of "personal interest" and more of a coincidence that Substantia was plugged after a few users included the word "Plugged" in their posts.

Vojislav+Milanovic
10-10-2007, 05:25 PM
I have no intention to attack any of moderators...
...and You said I keep pollutiing the forum. Is it what the moderators do?

You're loosing yourself. When you are posting comment there is big bold "before posting, please review the following" Next time be sure to read it!

You do polute this thread. This is section of cgtalk where you are posting comments and critiques about work itself. If you have issues whether this deserved front page plug or not post that in another thread in General discussion and seek there for your answers.

Someone worked hard to make this movie. You may like it or you may not, but at least have some respect for other people's work.

dickma
10-10-2007, 07:44 PM
Sorry I have to say that, I think I am not the only one who is wrong. What ever it is "personal interest", "personal involvement" or "personal taste". Do they dealing with that well? Or I should say they do it really ugly because they treat plugging in a subjective way.

And remember, we all working hard for animation and everyone wants to be plugged. Just space is limited and so that is why there should be some standard and critria for the plugging system.

OK, your guys keep attacking me here but I will not make any response here anymore.

DaCapo
10-10-2007, 09:30 PM
dear mayec,
i liked your movie very much.
the following things came to my mind (the 4 elements, dualism, love, origin and anihilation of life) but i didn't really get the end.. could you explain what your inspirations and meaning for this short were?

Ron Martin
10-10-2007, 11:53 PM
Well if this kind of stuff is Frontpage Level, this whole platform will loose respect from all over the world and it's time to install a new platform for the premium works.

PostProductionGuy
10-11-2007, 01:26 AM
Oh get over it will ya? :buttrock:
SUBSTANTIA is winning prizes. And big ones, So...move on...

LashkoAlex
10-11-2007, 01:45 AM
Mayec, really stunning work! Brings out a lot of emotions.

Jasoto
10-11-2007, 01:58 AM
Many thanks to all!! :thumbsup:


<>

Moocat
10-11-2007, 07:35 AM
excellent plug and an excellent piece. don't get me wrong, the fancy visuals were still great, but that isn't all there is to art. the piece has a meaning, and to convey that, it doesn't need giant shiny transforming robots.

excellent concept guys, and don't listen to those fools who think it's too simple... who cares about the polygon count, or the texture resolution, or any other technical aspect of the piece; the fact that it brings out emotions to the viewer speaks volumes to the quality of the piece. the simplicity and creativity is what makes this animation so great. I'm not trying to fuel the whole argument, just want the artists to know their work really is great, and the more publicity the better. best of luck, folks!

MokshaProyects
10-11-2007, 11:02 AM
Hola Jas, hola Mayec ¡¡¡

Enhorabuena por haberos hecho con el premio mas gordo en una de las tal vez 3 competiciones CG más importantes a nivel internacional detolmundonteros.

Muy bueno Substantia, rebosa contenido metaforico, tal vez el guion sea lo q más me gusta del corto, tecnicamente esta muy consegido, particulas, refraccion del hielo, la gota impactando sobre el corazon (¿Particle Flow?) ...cojonudo.

Por cierto, al final, cuando el corazon caliente se "fusiona" con el helado se forma una especie de halo con forma de ojo alrrededor de esta union, ¿q es, es un ojo? y porque.
Entonces al final, ¿de esta union de ambos corazones se elimina el hielo ( autoproteccion, permeabilidad a los sentimientos ajenos...y tambien principal recuerdo del daño sufrido...etc) del primer corazon, de todo "esto" que ya sobra,( y que luego impacta en otro corazon)
resulta ser el inicio del "florecimiento", en todos los sentidos, no?
Es decir, que de la siguiente "fase" de lo más negativo y sobrante, surge lo mas positivo y necesario ( su opuesto ) a partir del cual vuelve a convertirse en negativo.....+ - + - y asi sin parar,ambos evolucionando hacia su opuesto, en un perfecto ciclo donde el principio y el fin se integran en un ¿todo? y sin parar. Resulta imposible decir "aqui empieza y aqui acaba"....calor/frio.....no? union/desunion, amor/odio....epi/blas....positivo/negativo......yin/yan.....no?ambas caras de la misma moneda no puede existir sin su opuesta no??.....mmmm, creo que este tipo de relatividades no es muy propia de la mentalidad occidental no? es más bien oriental, taoista budista hinduista ¿no?......pues muymal no me gusta ¡¡¡ no es cristiano ¡¡¡..... jejeje es broma, EXCELENTE Cortometraje, se sale. Enhorabuena.

Sin duda Substantia es un buen ejemplo de como "principio" y "fin" resultan ser tan solo dos conceptos creados por nosotros mismos que resultan tan imprecisos como ilusorios, yportanto erroneos para comprender bien la realidad de la naturaleza.

---------

Por cierto no hagais mucho caso a las opiniones corrosivas y huecas, mucha gente que siente esa especie de ardor en el pecho cuando otros consiguen más se confunden creyendo que es solo ambicion y voluntada de superacion, cuando en realidad es pura ENVIDIA, que se escuezan en su propio acido, ni les deis importancia.

Chao
el loco del Tomás...............................el de "Maha Hrit"

Mayec
10-11-2007, 11:14 AM
Es decir, que de la siguiente "fase" de lo más negativo y sobrante, surge lo mas positivo y necesario ( su opuesto ) a partir del cual vuelve a convertirse en negativo.....+ - + - y asi sin parar,ambos evolucionando hacia su opuesto, en un perfecto ciclo donde el principio y el fin se integran en un ¿todo? y sin parar. Resulta imposible decir "aqui empieza y aqui acaba"....calor/frio.....no? union/desunion, amor/odio....epi/blas....positivo/negativo......yin/yan.....no?ambas caras de la misma moneda no puede existir sin su opuesta no??.....

¡Hola Tomás! ¡Felicidades a tí también por el bien merecido premio! Se ve que al jurado de Autodesk le gusta la filosofía oriental ;). Me ha encantado Maha Hrit. Te hablo al respecto en privado.

Has dado en el clavo con tu análisis. No te has quedado en el nivel más superficial de la relación interpersonal, y has captado muchos de los matices profundos del corto. También has dado con la dualidad (epi/blas jajajaj), y lo necesario del sufrimiento para que luego su superación lleve a un nuevo estado y a ser de nuevo parte del ciclo que permite la vida. Muy oriental, sí. Me planteo por primera vez que puede ser una de mis obsesiones (mi primera mascota se llamaba Yin Yang). A los de La Máquina de Trinar les sugerí incorporar este concepto dual en su corto, y no me hiceron caso (seguro que para bien, a muchos occidentales les desestabiliza mucho). :)

Jasoto
10-11-2007, 11:15 AM
Muchas gracias Tomás y una vez más ¡¡ENHORABUENA!! por tu premio en el Ahead of the Curve.

La lágrima es RealFlow, sí...sí...RealFlow.

Lo del halo del final, sí....la intención fue esa, que la energía tuviera forma de ojo, que hay más simbólico para que surja una lágrima que un ojo, no?....del resto de tu análisis, pues vas perfectamente encaminado así que no tengo nada que decir.

Sobre las opiniones corrosivas, se me ocurre un proverbio de nosequien:

"Las críticas son como la gripe: todos estamos expuestos a ellas pero ninguna de las dos te mata"

Un abrazo Tomás y a ver si nos vemos un día por ahí, no?

Wes_Brown
10-11-2007, 01:46 PM
Very nice. It is not without some problems for sure, but it is a solid effort. It reminds me of the time before 3d became encumbered by the clichés we see every day now. Thought provoking pieces are so rare...so much 3d has become pure illustration that while beautiful, has no meaning or emotion behind it.

It is nice to see someone taking a chance.

Good job.

BTW, for an early piece that reminds me of this, check out "seeds of life" from the Beyond the Mind's Eye video. While actually a collection of several animations, it is anchored by Karl Sims' piece "Panspermia." His animation features growing plants, exploding seeds and some groundbreaking early particle work.

Here is a link to some stills from this 1990 animation:
http://www.genarts.com/karl/panspermia.html

Mayec
10-11-2007, 02:55 PM
BTW, for an early piece that reminds me of this, check out "seeds of life" from the Beyond the Mind's Eye video. While actually a collection of several animations, it is anchored by Karl Sims' piece "Panspermia." His animation features growing plants, exploding seeds and some groundbreaking early particle work.

Wes, thanks for telling us about "Panspermia". I didn't know it. I just checked it out and it's a stunning work for the time it was created, and it does have many connections with "Substantia". It's nice to see how different creative minds spontaneously converge when conveying certain concepts, without having previously seen each other's work.

I'm also adding a link where you can see the whole video of Panspermia:
http://www.archive.org/details/sims_panspermia_1990

dellis
10-11-2007, 06:08 PM
I liked it as well. Congrats on completing it!!!

ThE_JacO
10-11-2007, 08:28 PM
please keep posts in english only guys, for non-english language personal posts you have PMs :)

Jasoto
10-11-2007, 08:34 PM
Ok Jaco, sorry.... but my english is patetic :sad:

I'll try!!

Wes_Brown
10-11-2007, 09:07 PM
Wes, thanks for telling us about "Panspermia". I didn't know it. I just checked it out and it's a stunning work for the time it was created, and it does have many connections with "Substantia". It's nice to see how different creative minds spontaneously converge when conveying certain concepts, without having previously seen each other's work.

I'm also adding a link where you can see the whole video of Panspermia:
http://www.archive.org/details/sims_panspermia_1990

I am glad you enjoyed it! You are right: it is amazing how concepts can cross time and space among different folks without them ever interacting.

Take care and keep up the good work,
Wes

mackdadd
10-11-2007, 09:33 PM
Great work, I really enjoyed it! Congrats, and good luck on the festival circuit!

Mayec
10-12-2007, 02:43 AM
please keep posts in english only guys, for non-english language personal posts you have PMs :)


Oops. Sorry! :) I just thought it more polite to reply to comments in the same language they came in, and I was not conscious of the english-only limitation. I'll keep it in mind now on ;).

Stahlberg
10-12-2007, 03:44 AM
I was not conscious of the english-only limitation
Well, it's never been officially written into the rules, and so it happens quite often.

So I want to take this opportunity for a public service message, directed at everyone, not anyone in particular.

If you think about it you'll see why it's not good to have too much secondary language communication in any forum: those who don't understand it will be shut out of the communication. This usually means about 90 - 99% of members (depending on which language).
Which is sort of against the whole point of a 'forum' right? :)

ThE_JacO
10-12-2007, 09:09 AM
Ok Jaco, sorry.... but my english is patetic :sad:

I'll try!!

We live and learn, I've seen plenty people who started posting in a pathetic excuse for english, and now write competently enough to sometimes be understood. Not that I'm thinking of Thirdeye in particular, or that I'd ever dare calling him out on that :p

As for "the rule", it's not really a rule.
While your posts were all fine, we kinda have to make a point of it, because letting other languages carve their way into CGS would make it unmanagable or require triple the admnistration/moderation team with different linguistic proficiencies.
It's just easier and more convenient for the whole community to agree on one language and trying to limit public posts to that language only.

Mayec
10-12-2007, 10:39 AM
If you think about it you'll see why it's not good to have too much secondary language communication in any forum: those who don't understand it will be shut out of the communication. This usually means about 90 - 99% of members (depending on which language).
Which is sort of against the whole point of a 'forum' right? :)

I agree, both with you and with JacO about the administrative cost/time increase. I've been insisting to JAS for a long time that he should improve his english, so this is as good a chance as any (and for me to practice, too) ;).

AspiriN
10-12-2007, 10:28 PM
Really great work overall...congratulation.. 5***** from me :thumbsup:

PostProductionGuy
10-16-2007, 01:26 PM
When do the Goya nominations begins? :) By the same time of the Oscars or in another time of the year?

Ajouz
10-16-2007, 03:22 PM
that was awesome! it obvious you put a lot of emotions in this, thanks for sharing,

NcatDesigner
10-16-2007, 09:55 PM
Wow

Great job!!

It's like someone had broken his heart some times.

Amazing!

raman3d
10-17-2007, 11:23 AM
hi i m totally new to this



so finding hard to understand the concept and story!



plzz explain!

GKDantas
10-19-2007, 04:48 PM
Well I never talked about all short movies that I saw here, but this time is the first time that I see 3D used like a tool to tell a brilliant concept about love in all worlds.
Very well done, music, idea. Its all your merit guys.
Just try to find a place that I can download the larger version, I cant without pay megauploads.

Bravo!

Mayec
10-19-2007, 07:17 PM
Well I never talked about all short movies that I saw here, but this time is the first time that I see 3D used like a tool to tell a brilliant concept about love in all worlds.
Very well done, music, idea. Its all your merit guys.
Just try to find a place that I can download the larger version, I cant without pay megauploads.

Bravo!

Thanks a lot Marcelo. Comments like yours mean a lot to us.

As for the large HD file, you should be able to download it without a pay account in megauploads. It's supposed to be free. But yes, somebody already offered us some free hosting in their server, but they haven't uploaded the files yet (in 2 weeks), so I can't say when or if they will be available.

Ron Martin
10-19-2007, 08:52 PM
Sorry, but i still think - this must be a fake!

Texturing, Lighting, Rendering as well as editing is more than weak! A "story", people of this planet have told a million times before - this piece is so damn ugly and boring! Particle and Fluid Effects which look like well known tutorials and nothing more!

I have seen outstanding works on this platform - this one on front page is able to ruin the reputation of CG Society!
Its not more than a beginners work. And there are so many far more talented people around.

Keep on practicing, its always good to see people doing something, but fishing for great honours for this little exercise is totally displaced !!!

GKDantas
10-19-2007, 09:08 PM
Hey Ron not offend you, but why a simple 3D work can hurt you so much?? The bible is a story that everyv]body tell and almost everyone like it!
Not the story but the way that you tell is the point. In my graduation I learn to see beyond the tools... they could done this in Flash or by hand, even this way would be a great show... for me the beginning is very simple but the end tell how th things begin... its the circle of life (sorry Disney folks), for me as a Wiccan this mean everything in the life... Look at this like Patch Addams...
Here in Brazil I saw work done for children that even dont know write their names, but they draw a lot with stick figures to tell their storyes...sorry for my english folks.
3D is a tool to make art, art inst real, its what your heart can see, not your eyes.

PostProductionGuy
10-22-2007, 03:43 PM
Ron Martin: .....a fake?
Let me tell you somtehing this "fake" is winning prizes, beeing watched and loved by a lots of people around the world. It really is a wonderfull short-film.

I wonder if is there any other reason for your HATE...Are you some kind of frustrated person? Are you? Just asking...

So, if you don't know what you are talking about (and you obviously aren't) leave this alone...

As my great-grandmother used to say to people like you, "CRAM IT CLOWN".

Best Regards,

PPG

Mayec
10-23-2007, 11:13 PM
For all those who had problems downloading the movie:

Check out www.substantia.eu (http://www.substantia.eu/)

I just changed the download links for both the SD and HD versions of the film to a new hosting space that the school CICE very nicely offered us. Now it's hotlinked, so it should be much easier, and much faster also, I expect.

If anybody has a problem with these new links, please let me know and I'll look into it.

GKDantas
10-23-2007, 11:38 PM
Thankz for the info... I will download it now!

Aurok
10-25-2007, 09:51 AM
.......... Wow........... I really liked that.

RafiS
10-25-2007, 11:40 PM
I thought this was absolutly brilliant....its so amazing to see a short which uses 3d but not humans or animals or women with big boobs (uh, I did lol so yeh) to tell a story. Amazing how you've used a really simple concept to put through emotions....and everytime I saw it, I felt a little different. Its good to see people produce such good work.
Congratulations again on all the awards you've won.

yoshimitsu
10-28-2007, 09:17 PM
wow that hit hard. It's the story of my life, beautifully illustrated.
Phenomenal.


edit after reading through the thread.
..man it's hard to understand the POV of this piece's detractors.. It seems the storytelling is universally sympathetic to anyone with functioning vision (and hopefully awesome headphones like mine :P ) -- you can fully absorb it the first time through.. Why is that a bad thing?
I'm not inexperienced at unravelling the most nuanced and indirect suggestions to synthesize an artist's message.. But when I watched Substantia, it turned my brain inside out by how powerfully this message was conveyed with such basic symbolism. It worked perfectly together with the scoring. The heavenly body metaphor was a brilliantly conceived vehicle, as well, and elevated the more conventional hearts and tears concept to a new height.

I am personally a very technical, complicated thinker. Normally, If a piece doesn't display some "wow how'd they do that?" technical quality, I disregard it.. UNLESS some other aspect is outstanding enough to grab my attention. Substantia showed some small technical flaws, true, but those are meaningless in my final evaluation, because it caught me, emotionally, like a twig in a bench vise.

I have more than one set of sketches from years ago, for ways to tell this exact story. As I mentioned initially, it bears a direct similarity to my own life. Nothing i've ever planned is nearly as elegant as this, though. I wish the creators every success.

Mayec
10-29-2007, 12:48 AM
I wish the creators every success.

Yoshimitsu, thank you very much! The best success we could aim for is the one reflected in your words: you understood the work, and saw your own life reflected in it. You also understand very well some of our creative choices. I believe making films is about communication, and it's very nice to see that the message got through :).

Paul McLaughlin
10-30-2007, 01:50 AM
The fact that every shot was really drawn out took a whole lot away from the overall effect. If it was condensed, it could compete with the really big boys. There really isnt 5 minutes of action in this thing.

chenchao19870220
11-17-2007, 06:20 PM
Great have a good job
come no

Mayec
11-25-2007, 11:15 PM
Just wanted to let all of you know: two days ago Substantia won it's third award, at the Short Film Awards of Soria (Spain). It was the Jury's Special Award.

More info here (http://mayec.blogspot.com/2007/11/substantia-recibe-un-premio-en-soria.html) (spanish).

I'll take this chance to thank once again everyone for their comments and their support.

GKDantas
11-26-2007, 12:11 AM
Congratulations guys!!

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