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Brettzies
08-04-2007, 09:11 AM
Finally, a game from id not called Quake or Doom. I like that they stuck with the one word though. Just fits their style....RAGE. Looks nice too, cool art direction.

Rage Trailer: http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/48289
Has an HD link as well (both look like they were video captured, sync is off).

Cleaner but smaller: http://ve3dboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=27248900 <click on the image to play>


http://www.gametrailers.com/game/5315.html

has an HD version that u can download.

swampjesus
08-04-2007, 10:14 AM
Looks very nice. But i bet that the gameplay is targeted at your average retard. Bring in the coors light.

Trenox
08-04-2007, 10:42 AM
Damnit that looks sweet.

Looks like Id's finally back in the game again.

The part about driving from settlement to settlement is really something im looking forward to since that was basically the best part of HalfLife2. It gives a great sense of freedom and still the gamedesigners are in control so it doesnt go completely sandbox.

The whole post apocalyptic setting is not a fav. of mine but the way they are handling it i think i can get over it ;)

Piek
08-04-2007, 10:43 AM
Having the reaction times of a brick, monkey fingers and an attention span bordering on none, I hope you're right SwampJesus :o)

I've always wanted a Mad Max game, looks like I might get one - "Who runs Bartertown?"

CGmonkey
08-04-2007, 12:15 PM
I didn't like the first demo much but this looks like the old id I remember from my childhood -- finally. I think I've seen somewhere that Massive Black was hired to do some concepts a couple of months back, I can understand why since Marko Djurdjevic is kind of post-apocalyptic designer god.

I almost get the atmosphere that this is a pretty free roaming game, a city?

[id fanboy emerges from the depth]

swampjesus
08-04-2007, 03:08 PM
Piek - yeah right on! - couldnt answer earlier because i was away from my trailer shooting pool and drinking beer. or shooting something

Lordiego01
08-04-2007, 03:27 PM
Holy crap!

That looks fantaboulous!

Spin99
08-04-2007, 03:35 PM
Fanboy or not there's one word to describe the trailer here:
SPECTACULAR!

Characters look phenomenal it's really nice to see the doom engine grow like that.
Love the dark grimness of the faces the incredible detail and realism as well as textures, and, of course, the goth factor to it all :) I also just plain love the post apocaliptic setting.

Thing about ID games is I want all of them period ;)

heavyness
08-04-2007, 04:25 PM
Looks very nice. But i bet that the gameplay is targeted at your average retard. Bring in the coors light.

thanks for offending and adding nothing to the discussion of the thread you posted in!
2x COMBO!



anyways, the first demo id showed didn't impress me [i thought they were making a racing game]. this trailer [with the added fight scenes and such] got me interested. keeping my eyes on this "madmax" type of game.

captainchet
08-04-2007, 04:43 PM
Whoop, misread.

Breinmeester
08-04-2007, 04:50 PM
Wow! That looks really good! It's nicely stylized and the animation is explicitly well done.

Maybe Zemeckis could ask Carmack how it's done? ;)

DogBreath
08-04-2007, 09:56 PM
As usual

http://www.gametrailers.com/

has an HD version that u can download. Its first on the list at the moment.

ha-dou-ken
08-05-2007, 01:19 AM
Did someone say combo?I'm off to the arcade!

Kid Dynomite
08-05-2007, 02:01 AM
But i bet that the gameplay is targeted at your average retard.
HaHaHahAHaaa

Bring in the coors light.
... Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!, hey what?!

Looks like Doom to me.

Jhonus
08-05-2007, 02:08 AM
looks hot to me

JoshBowman
08-05-2007, 02:28 AM
Everything looks totally downright cool except for the characters skin, it's exactly the same issue I had with Doom 3. With all those programmer heavy weights at id I thought they'd at least get that right.

Matt
08-05-2007, 05:12 AM
This is idsoftware's 2008 offering?

I'm sorry gang, but id needs to concentrate on making tech and not assets and games.

Looks like Quake 4. Smells like Star Wars Episode 1 + Mad Max.

When games like Call of Duty 4, Metal Gear Solid 4, and Blacksite: Area 51 are going to be out before this, why even bother?

The most interesting news is how id plans to put Quake 3 online in a browser. It's been done before with Shockwave, but it'll be interesting to see how they pull it off.

Kabab
08-05-2007, 05:33 AM
This is idsoftware's 2008 offering?

I'm sorry gang, but id needs to concentrate on making tech and not assets and games.

Have you seen the demo's of the engine / level editor :eek:

Swizzle
08-05-2007, 06:25 AM
Looks pretty. Judging from past experience, I won't expect anything to cerebrally taxing. Id's good at making stuff blow up real good, though, so maybe it'll be fun! :D

Matt
08-05-2007, 08:26 AM
Have you seen the demo's of the engine / level editor :eek:

I've seen the idtech5 demo from uhhh Macworld I believe it was. Whatever Apple event was a few months ago where they debuted the iPhone.

I haven't seen the level editor, but I have no doubt that it'll still use some proprietary asset formats and shaders.

Perhaps to advance the art form we need to have a group of the best companies come up with a standard format. Microsoft, idsoftware, ravensoft, crytek, sony, konami, and nintendo to name a few.

Consoles often use the same format files for models, levels, etc. PCs should be the same.

ThomasMahler
08-05-2007, 08:39 AM
Dudes.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/23177.html
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/23178.html
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/23179.html

That sounds GREAT from an artists point of view. The Editor certainly looks awesome. If Carmack can really apply the same thing to geometry, he'd basically have the content stuff covered. Then it'd be about lighting and compositing and shader-tech, etc., so that the content is presented properly.

schuubars
08-05-2007, 09:32 AM
Besides from tech5 Engine,(his engines were always fun to use for me) the most interesting thing was "Quake Zero" based on Q3A, and maybe a new Quake Arena. :D

Stefan-Morrell
08-05-2007, 09:33 AM
that layered texturing in the second video does look awesome..it's gotta be better than layering decal upon decal to get that kind of detail..thanks for the video links:thumbsup:

Boone
08-05-2007, 10:03 AM
Good to see a bit more improvement over the last tech demo previously shown. The change of direction is good and I predict this will be more action-rpg than mindless shooter. I hope they make so the player has to manage resourse such as food, water, ammo and fuel whilst deciding which town to travel to next.

ID were at their best when going in new directions: Commander Keen, Wolfenstien, Doom. But when Quake 2 hit something kinda went stale...I think taking cue from Mad Max will take it in a new direction - at least for ID.

As for an improvement over Doom3, I hope they fix the monsters not being affected by pressure of a blast from a gun. When you blast an IMP with a shotgun at point blank range in the stomach - there is no force that physically pushes them back. A little bit of realism wouldnt go amiss...

But yes, I look forward to this new game. Hopefully I wont need to upgrade my hardware in order to play it...

el_diablo
08-05-2007, 10:40 AM
I think the point is its not layered textures in the game engine, its itemized only in the editor. Hence the 'they can do anything' references from Carmack. My impression is that all edits are baked in the giant 64kx64k megatexture at the end. This would (i guess) streamline and simplify the performance management.

Also its funny when he mentiones the next step being doing the same thing with geometry for tech 6 (a giant object being modified by sculpting). I think the crysis engine is doing just that already, which begs the question is it years infront of tech 5?

CGmonkey
08-05-2007, 12:17 PM
Also its funny when he mentiones the next step being doing the same thing with geometry for tech 6 (a giant object being modified by sculpting). I think the crysis engine is doing just that already, which begs the question is it years infront of tech 5?

But if you do not have the foundation of mega-texturing, that tech 6 is pretty freaking useless.

Kabab
08-05-2007, 12:34 PM
I've seen the idtech5 demo from uhhh Macworld I believe it was. Whatever Apple event was a few months ago where they debuted the iPhone.

I haven't seen the level editor, but I have no doubt that it'll still use some proprietary asset formats and shaders.

Perhaps to advance the art form we need to have a group of the best companies come up with a standard format. Microsoft, idsoftware, ravensoft, crytek, sony, konami, and nintendo to name a few.

Consoles often use the same format files for models, levels, etc. PCs should be the same.
I think you missed the point..

Watch the video interviews with John where he shows texturing in the editor...

http://au.media.pc.ign.com/media/926/926419/vids_1.html?RSSwhen2007-08-03_181000&RSSid=810658

Texture resolution is no longer an issue you can go as high as you like!

Thats a big deal in my book.

brkn
08-05-2007, 01:56 PM
Full respect to Mr. Carmack (he stole much of my high school life with Quake) but does anyone else think he bears an uncanny resemblance to Professor Frink from the Simpsons?

wedge
08-05-2007, 07:24 PM
i have heard that you program your game in id Tech 5, and it outputs working files for PS3, 360, PC, and Mac... is that true?

if it's the case, this is a developer's dream!

Laa-Yosh
08-05-2007, 07:58 PM
I didn't like the first demo much but this looks like the old id I remember from my childhood -- finally. I think I've seen somewhere that Massive Black was hired to do some concepts a couple of months back, I can understand why since Marko Djurdjevic is kind of post-apocalyptic designer god.

They've hired Sparth - Nicolas Bouvier - and he's working on site at the id offices.

Laa-Yosh
08-05-2007, 08:04 PM
Also its funny when he mentiones the next step being doing the same thing with geometry for tech 6 (a giant object being modified by sculpting). I think the crysis engine is doing just that already, which begs the question is it years infront of tech 5?

I think he means that you'll be using Mudbox/Zbrush levels of geometry - in the game engine. There's some existing academic research on the topic, just as with virtualizing textures.

So no, I don't think it's what Crytek's doing. :P

Laa-Yosh
08-05-2007, 08:06 PM
Did anyone notice all that nice post processing in the gametrailers editor video? Seems like color correction, based on depth to simulate fog/atmosphere, and also depth of field blur, and even some color grading kinda stuff. Pretty much like what our guys do in comp to get rid of the CG look... very nice job from Carmack.

ThomasMahler
08-05-2007, 08:09 PM
Hard to say, judging from this video. Still waiting for a better HD source. Kinda weird that every site has the same trailer online and there's no direct feed.

CGmonkey
08-05-2007, 08:11 PM
They've hired Sparth - Nicolas Bouvier - and he's working on site at the id offices.

Yes I know, but I doubt he's gonna be able to pull an entire game out of his ass -- Even though it's Sparth. Not to undermine his abilities either but I haven't seen much of his character designs (even though I have full confidence that he can do that with a eaze of a farting breeze).

Laa-Yosh
08-05-2007, 08:28 PM
I dunno, everything in this trailer seems to fit his style...

gio
08-05-2007, 08:41 PM
this, for me, is one of the best designed games i've seen. those environments feel like
kickbutt concept art come to life, and the monster/mutant designs look insane! i've yet to see lighting and atmosphere in a game as sophisticated in design as this. the interior with
that guy feels like its lit by a really good cinematographer. i'm not
really a gamer, but theres a lot to appreciate in thsi one in terms of art direction :)

Laa-Yosh
08-05-2007, 08:42 PM
Hey Gio, didn't one of those monster heads look familiar to you too? :)

PhilOsirus
08-06-2007, 01:14 AM
This engine looks incredible, and I give major thubs up to the people at id Software for making this. I don't yet understand how the textures have basically no memory footprints at all, but whatever the case this is obviously good news.

Now, while the graphics are getting nicer, and this is great for us artists, the rest is NOT following.

Physics were hailed as the second coming but we see how limited they are in interactive environments especially when they get in conflict with AI and animations. This is where there is an immense gap that we must somehow leap over. We need exeptional AI that can deal with dynamic environments, and we need the animations to be credible in such scenarios.

Major task ahead:)

rcumps01
08-06-2007, 03:39 AM
John "Maleficus" Dean is making the bots for Quake Wars, and if you're familiar with his work from Enemy Territory you know that the bots were operating on a high, "intelligent" level. I think the QW bots will be great and perhaps they could use some them to create the enemy AI for Rage. :)

PhilOsirus
08-06-2007, 04:18 AM
John "Maleficus" Dean is making the bots for Quake Wars, and if you're familiar with his work from Enemy Territory you know that the bots were operating on a high, "intelligent" level. I think the QW bots will be great and perhaps they could use some them to create the enemy AI for Rage. :)


Yeah you can have some really good AI, but can it deal with a changing environment, and how does it interact with it? If I put an object in front of the AI, is it able to figure a way to interact with the object such as to move it out of the way, all the while staying responsive to the rest of the environment around him?

Put a metal drum sideways in a hall, right in fron of an opened door entrance. What now uh AI?:p The day I see an AI able to deal with this situation in a realistic manner + convincing animations is the day... well the day we'll have made a very big leap indeed:p

Until then, it's all pretty sights.

theWOODman
08-07-2007, 12:58 AM
The game really looks great. There's only 2 things that I'm hoping for.

1. That this thing will be playable, not like Crysis which I know will be one heck of a hog on processor and resources.

2. For the love of *?&%$#, no ingame advertising!
Just like Quake Wars Enemy Territory, I kept up with that game since the early developement stages and just when it's getting near to release, they announce that there will be in-game ads and tracking to see which ones and how long you look at them. What a huuuge disappointment. I definately wont be buying it now......just like Battlefield 2142, I used to be a fan.

DogBreath
08-07-2007, 04:57 AM
Y I hav to agree with u there DrawT0000much, I did'nt know about that in ETQW but I won't be buying it now either, I played Bf2142 despite the ads, being as they were kind of a surprise after u had paid and installed and put up with all the bugs...I finally gave up when I downloaded the beta MAP and found out I had downloaded a beta GAME and couldnt play even the buggy maps.

Perhaps if we vote with our purchasing power we can save them some research time and give them all the data they need. we don't want ads....just games that work with great visuals.

The RAGE footage that this post pointed at has some good layout as far as interesting environmental features go, (canyons, buildings etc) but the overall effect is dissapointing, eg:to much specularity and gloss on the skin of people, and everything else is a variation on that lighting setup IMHO. That said when Medal of Honour used the Quake 3 engine EA and Partners did some great stuff with that, so maybe this new engine will be capable of some amazing visuals in the hands of a talented team.

I am not aware of any but there must be games that have been made using the DOOM III engine (apart from Doom 3), does anyone know more about that.

jporter313
08-07-2007, 07:16 AM
I am not aware of any but there must be games that have been made using the DOOM III engine (apart from Doom 3), does anyone know more about that.

Quake 4, Enemy Territory Quake wars, Prey.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doom_3_engine

schuubars
08-07-2007, 03:27 PM
The game really looks great. There's only 2 things that I'm hoping for.

1. That this thing will be playable, not like Crysis which I know will be one heck of a hog on processor and resources.

2. For the love of *?&%$#, no ingame advertising!
Just like Quake Wars Enemy Territory, I kept up with that game since the early developement stages and just when it's getting near to release, they announce that there will be in-game ads and tracking to see which ones and how long you look at them. What a huuuge disappointment. I definately wont be buying it now......just like Battlefield 2142, I used to be a fan.

I play the beta often, after beta 2 there was 30% perf boost, in most cases, i have a framerate between 30-60 frames(yes 60fps cap), all settings high, not maxmum but high is still looking good, with a Rad. 1900xt. (plus a moderate CPU)


btw i don't like ingame ads neither but SD at least said the reason for it, because they aim for a longtime Support, EA didn't tell anything what they will do with the incomings, they just said basically eat it or don't play it.

Trenox
08-07-2007, 03:33 PM
2. For the love of *?&%$#, no ingame advertising!
Just like Quake Wars Enemy Territory, I kept up with that game since the early developement stages and just when it's getting near to release, they announce that there will be in-game ads and tracking to see which ones and how long you look at them. What a huuuge disappointment. I definately wont be buying it now......just like Battlefield 2142, I used to be a fan.

Amen to that man. Hopefully ID will stay clear of that for Rage (which im very interested in playing). Atleast they chose a setting thats not very suitable for that but nothings impossible ofc..
Hopefully they are so proud of their amazing content that they wont taint it ;)

Quake Zero will feature advertising but its a good question to what extent. If they are tracking behaviour and shit like that its also a no go for me :( (and im way more excited about quake zero than quake wars)

Neil
08-07-2007, 10:07 PM
It looks cool and i love id, but jeesh. With all the advancements we're making with physics, and texturing and poly count... why do the characters still have to look plastic. That killed doom3 for me.

wedge
08-07-2007, 10:32 PM
This engine looks incredible, and I give major thubs up to the people at id Software for making this. I don't yet understand how the textures have basically no memory footprints at all, but whatever the case this is obviously good news.

Now, while the graphics are getting nicer, and this is great for us artists, the rest is NOT following.

Physics were hailed as the second coming but we see how limited they are in interactive environments especially when they get in conflict with AI and animations. This is where there is an immense gap that we must somehow leap over. We need exeptional AI that can deal with dynamic environments, and we need the animations to be credible in such scenarios.

Major task ahead:)


from what i understand, it seems that no matter what the game will always be using one giant texture, so no matter where you go the texture your machine is using never changes. thats how it doesn't affect gameplay - there's no swapping or loading, save for the first time.

PhilOsirus
08-08-2007, 02:44 AM
from what i understand, it seems that no matter what the game will always be using one giant texture, so no matter where you go the texture your machine is using never changes. thats how it doesn't affect gameplay - there's no swapping or loading, save for the first time.


Yeah but then you would have like 40gb of texture in memory at all time:p

My guess is their blending system is used to bake all texture blends in one big texture, so no decals and such as they said, and this texture is broken in parts and then loaded in parts based on where you are located. So you never actually bust the memory because the textures always take the same amount of memory and how much memory a texture takes is based on the "radius" of the zones (the less separate texture-zones you have the more memory is taken by the texture). Like a big grid basically, each square is a texture, and the bigger the squares the more RAM each zones take.

But I feel there is more to it than that, cause you would still have to deal with the textures that travel from one zone to another (like vehicles and characters), plus it's a 3D game so it could get complicated when you can move in all directions.

Maybe the zones are set manually?

Anyway can't wait to hear more about this, I think it will become a standard. Hopefully anyway:D

DogBreath
08-08-2007, 05:21 AM
Check out this vid for an explanation by John Carmack re mega textures of 80Gb and the way it works in the Developer tool that ships with the game, just bring the console down in game and type "idstudio"....niiiice. He explains and demos some texturing of some terrain.

The video that shows this is the one with the red "Danger" decal on it.

http://www.gametrailers.com/game/4440.html

the 70mb version is flash and the HD is .wmv and .mov (268mb mov).

PhilOsirus
08-09-2007, 03:10 AM
Yeah but he is pretty vague about it tho. He doesn't actually explain to what extent you are free from memory usage by textures, nor how the engine actually deals with it.

It's more like "one big texture! no worry! do what you want!":)

DogBreath
08-09-2007, 05:22 AM
I have only watched it once, and I know what u mean. I heard him say that the decals could be positioned over each other and you could put as much detail as you wanted and it would not alter any game performance, and that it was all run thru some kind of compression to fit onto the distribution material (which I suppose is the game dvd).

So I get the impression that the maps/levels graphic assets can be 80gb, then it is compressed to fit (baked) onto the terrain mesh, which is all loaded as one asset when the game loads. I could'nt help thinking of Age of Empires when I saw those bone and rock stamps placed on the path. It looked like the same idea transfered to a 3d environment.

rcumps01
08-09-2007, 03:18 PM
http://www.quakeunity.com/file=2519

Full QA from Carmack at QuakeCon.

Neil
08-09-2007, 04:36 PM
Yeah but he is pretty vague about it tho. He doesn't actually explain to what extent you are free from memory usage by textures, nor how the engine actually deals with it.

It's more like "one big texture! no worry! do what you want!":)

My guess is that the file size of the ground texture is max'd out from the start. So a flat green surface with no work done to it would take up the same amount of texture space as a heavily detailed piece with lots of work put into it. That's why it doesn't matter what you do to it.

PhilOsirus
08-11-2007, 02:33 AM
My guess is that the file size of the ground texture is max'd out from the start. So a flat green surface with no work done to it would take up the same amount of texture space as a heavily detailed piece with lots of work put into it. That's why it doesn't matter what you do to it.

Yep that's how I see it. It's good and bad I guess.

Watching the Q&A.

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