Cartoon face topology

[ChewyPixels]

Hi Olivier. I am no modeling expert, but I think I do have a possible solution. :)

Your problem is the n-gon you have there, which you have already stated. When I model, I never use n-gons! Actually, I don't even use tris, but that's just me being anal. :D What I usually do is just experiment with different topologies until I find something that works. With time, you get better at it and don't have to guess as much if you know what I mean. :)

Here's a pic of a possible solution that you can play with to see if it removes the unwanted crease. Keep in mind that the edges that I drew must continue throughout the mesh. Number one would give you the least amount of extra polygons in your mesh as the edges would terminate inside the mouth, but I don't know if it will give you good edgeloops for facial animation. Number two will definitely give you good edgeloops, but it will also introduce the most polygons into your mesh. Regardless of which one you choose, you would also then have to go back and move some vertices around to keep your polygons as evenly spaced as possible (I don't know how else to explain this).

http://www.chewypixels.com/images/cgtalk/copi_fix.jpg

I hope this helps! :)

[oliveUK]

well thanks for your input Jedi Juice. I would really want to be able to model in all quads but I don't think I am quite there yet.

Looking at your solution I notice 3 things:

1- I have a triangle just above the problematic area ;-)

2- you are introducing a pole (5 edges meeting). Since you are suggested it I guess poles are not a problem with 5 edges, what about 6?

3- you are increasing the mesh definition. Is is where my main problem lies? I wanted to keep the resolution as low as possible and didn't have enough edges for this level of detail?

and the last thing I learnt. Avoid Ngons.

Thanks again Jedi Juice

[ChewyPixels]

well thanks for your input Jedi Juice. I would really want to be able to model in all quads but I don't think I am quite there yet.

Looking at your solution I notice 3 things:

1- I have a triangle just above the problematic area ;-)

2- you are introducing a pole (5 edges meeting). Since you are suggested it I guess poles are not a problem with 5 edges, what about 6?

3- you are increasing the mesh definition. Is is where my main problem lies? I wanted to keep the resolution as low as possible and didn't have enough edges for this level of detail?

and the last thing I learnt. Avoid Ngons.

Thanks again Jedi Juice

Interesting points you bring up. In terms of using all quads, it is more of a personal preference (obssession? :D) than a rule. I picked the habit up back when earlier versions of Mental Ray had issues with non-quad geometry. This issue is fixed now with the latest version of MR. Just a habit that never went away, lol! So, I would say to not worry about using a few tris here or there when creating meshes. Actually, some of the best modelers use tris and even ngons (Stahlberg)! Besides, if you really insist on an all quad mesh, a smooth iteration will fix this easily. :)

About poles. I really don't worry about these too much. However, I must say that I NEVER keep poles with 6 edges! When introduced in your mesh, do your best to fix this area if the mesh is to be animated in some way (I guess it would not be so bad in a non-deforming mesh such as a piece of armor). 5-edged poles are not so bad, expecially when strategically placed into your mesh. Again, with practice you'll have more control of where exactly to place or avoid poles in your mesh.

Finally, regarding the increase in mesh definition. I did not mean to say that you were lacking in mesh definition. Sorry for the confusion. What I actually meant was that the increase in mesh definition is an unfortunate "side-effect" of adding extra edges in the problematic area around the nose. I hope this clears things up. :)

[oliveUK]

from what I understand, the "all quad" is very important when exporting/importing stuff from Zbrush. I am not a great Zbrush user yet but I intend to use it at some stage.

By the way I just finished some sort of modeling showreel and will start a new thread.

Olive

[mattmos]

Hey olive, this is looking good mate!

I'd say 5 edge poles are very necessary, but like jedi-juice says try to avoid 6 edge ones, the mesh always starts to look pinched at that point, unless its by design. Don't over-focus on using all quads, yeah zbrush doesn't like them but you can sometimes lose sight of the form itself if you're focusing on the details.

You've got a good sense of proportion and eye for detail which I can see purely from how well you're reconstructed the head above. Looking forward to the rest of your reel, let me know when its up!

matt

[oliveUK]

thanks for your input Matt. The reel is actually on the following thread:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=25&t=523598 and I posted it on XSIbase too.

Olive

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