Anyone use Deep Explorer?

[mogh]

do you mean deep exploration (CAD edition?)

otherwise please give a link so we can have a look too...
thx

[Kuroyume0161]

Are you looking at the version over at Daz3D for 50% off? ;)

There are two versions of Deep Exploration: Standard and CAD:

DE Std (http://www.righthemisphere.com/products/dexp/de_std.html)
DE CAD (http://www.righthemisphere.com/products/dexp/de_cad.html)

DE Std regular price is $495. DE CAD regular price is $1995 (!). Std is for stock 3D formats whereas the CAD is for, well, CAD formats.

There are Supported Format PDFs to the right on each of the linked pages. These are probably the best thing to consider - as DE is mainly for format conversion. Otherwise, it is a very good application and has saved me butt a few times. The problem is that for some of the proprietary formats (e.g.: 3DSMax .max) you need to have the application installed as the conversion occurs via it.

Robert

[jimzepellin]

Are you looking at the version over at Daz3D for 50% off? ;)

There are two versions of Deep Exploration: Standard and CAD:

DE Std (http://www.righthemisphere.com/products/dexp/de_std.html)
DE CAD (http://www.righthemisphere.com/products/dexp/de_cad.html)

DE Std regular price is $495. DE CAD regular price is $1995 (!). Std is for stock 3D formats whereas the CAD is for, well, CAD formats.

There are Supported Format PDFs to the right on each of the linked pages. These are probably the best thing to consider - as DE is mainly for format conversion. Otherwise, it is a very good application and has saved me butt a few times. The problem is that for some of the proprietary formats (e.g.: 3DSMax .max) you need to have the application installed as the conversion occurs via it.

Robert
Thanks for the replies.
It's the standard edition that Daz are selling. Proprietary formats, that the kind of problem I wanted to avoid. It kind of defeats the pupose of the quick fix I wanted if you need the each software package installed. I wouldn't mind spending the cash if it was going to be useful. I would have just got this at the price over at Daz but I just spent over £500 on a new guitar and cash is not one of my strong points at the moment. I need this to be some thing that will make it worth getting in debt over.

[Kuroyume0161]

Thanks for the replies.
It's the standard edition that Daz are selling. Proprietary formats, that the kind of problem I wanted to avoid. It kind of defeats the pupose of the quick fix I wanted if you need the each software package installed. I wouldn't mind spending the cash if it was going to be useful. I would have just got this at the price over at Daz but I just spent over £500 on a new guitar and cash is not one of my strong points at the moment. I need this to be some thing that will make it worth getting in debt over.

The major problem with proprietary formats is that nobody can really get the format or license it. Maxon, for instance, never divulges the C4D file format (after v5) not even to SDK developers. AutoDesk *never* divulges their acad format (ever). The only reason for the existence of an open specification is via reverse-engineering and now they are basically 'blackmailing' them to pay a license for use of the format and that has been passed to those wanting to use it (at extravagant costs).

The alternative is to require the original application be present to do the work so that the originator maintains the private and proprietary nature of the format. What is good is that you can convert from a large variety of formats into a good number of exchange formats. So, looking at the list, you can *import* certain proprietary files but you cannot export them without the application being installed if at all. If your goal is to export to an exchange format or more open format you're good.

I note that .max is no longer available at all for DE. It used to be via 3DSMax but maybe Autodesk renigged or hasn't provided their latest support (?).

Robert

[jimzepellin]

Thanks Robert. I've been doing a bit of research and it looks like it would still be a handy application to have and I'm sure I would get the use of it. I was really needing the "It lays golden eggs" answer. Like I said it's more a cash thing since I bought my new guitar. I'm a sucker for handy software even though I may not need it at the moment. I can see a use for it though. I just have to annoy some clients into giving me a few little jobs. It's a good price from Daz and you get Deep Paint and Deep UV, not that I need them.

[helluvapixel]

Deep Exploration is a decent application and includes quite a lot of functionality in that not only do you do translating but it has rendering and animation capability.

The CAD version is very nice in the formats and functionality but it isn't the most hard-core converter.

If you want grass-roots then PolyTrans (http://www.okino.com) is more the route. Or for a real bargain 3D Object Converter (http://web.axelero.hu/karpo/) could be ideal for you.

[Srek]

The major problem with proprietary formats is that nobody can really get the format or license it. Maxon, for instance, never divulges the C4D file format (after v5) not even to SDK developers.
If it were as easy as publishing some documentation it would have been done right from the start. You as a developer should know where the real problem is. To make the current C4D fileformat work for any other application but CINEMA 4D you would need libraries that include the CINEMA 4D functionality needed for this. These libraries would effectively mirror a good deal of CINEMAs code. Even with such libraries the process of implementing an im- / exporter would still require the developer to match the functionality of one app with the functionality of a different app.

I don't say it's impossible, but it's way more effort and will cost way more development time than publishing some specs.
Currently i don't know of any of the major apps that support this way of data import/export. I would be delighted if MAXON could be the first though.

Cheers
Björn

[jimzepellin]

If it were as easy as publishing some documentation it would have been done right from the start. You as a developer should know where the real problem is. To make the current C4D fileformat work for any other application but CINEMA 4D you would need libraries that include the CINEMA 4D functionality needed for this. These libraries would effectively mirror a good deal of CINEMAs code. Even with such libraries the process of implementing an im- / exporter would still require the developer to match the functionality of one app with the functionality of a different app.

I don't say it's impossible, but it's way more effort and will cost way more development time than publishing some specs.
Currently i don't know of any of the major apps that support this way of data import/export. I would be delighted if MAXON could be the first though.

Cheers
Björn

If programmes like deep explorer need the host application installed to use the proprietary formats, then why couldn't Maxon and the rest produce a plug that would basically be the Demo of the software but would allow other programmes access to the proprietary formats.
This sound like a relatively easy solution to me(I do use "easy" through sheer ignorance though).;)

[Srek]

If programmes like deep explorer need the host application installed to use the proprietary formats, then why couldn't Maxon and the rest produce a plug that would basically be the Demo of the software but would allow other programmes access to the proprietary formats.
This sound like a relatively easy solution to me(I do use "easy" through sheer ignorance though).;)
Afaik this is already possible. You can use the CINEMA 4D demo to run a plugin that loads C4D files and then transfers the loaded information to your target plattform (transfer via export is not possible with the demo). If you have a full version of CINEMA you can do it the other way around too or use export as a transfer option.
Basicaly you can do with CINEMA 4D what Deep Explorer does with max, the process is the same.

Cheers
Björn

[jimzepellin]

Thanks Srek. I kind of figured that was the case. But what puzzles me is why havn't all the 3D software companies produced something like I suggested, a simplified demo that would allow another piece of software to access it. If it can be done with the demo of C4D them it can't be difficult for each company to produce such a thing. Then other software like deep exploration can load any file up and format it as another.
Maybe I'm paranoid but there must be other reasons companies don't do this:shrug:. I don't think this just comes down to spending a little bit of cash.

[Srek]

I think that not nearly every application has an API and SDK that is so open and freely available as CINEMA 4Ds. Take Modo for example, to the best of my knowledge they still don't have a SDK that would allow for plugin development by third parties.
If an application hasn't been designed with an API and SDK in mind it's pretty hard if not impossible to add one later. Often such attempts result in practicaly unusable stuff.
CINEMA 4D (like many other 3D apps) was designed with a rather open API in mind right from the start. For example this allows for the exchange plugins MAXON offers for various 3D, CAD and compositing apps.
Cheers
Björn

[helluvapixel]

Take Modo for example, to the best of my knowledge they still don't have a SDK that would allow for plugin development by third parties.
Björn

I think this is not the best example to use... new kid on the block and just in process of preparing a release to support animation. However yes there is an SDK.... but no it's not released to the public. We'll see, but some time after 301 release I'd suspect a release.

But I agree with what Srek's underpinnings are here, it's not the fault of Maxon people. If you want your translator embedded within Cinema 4D you need to harp on your translator provider. Much like what Okino has done, they have produced versions of PolyTrans that is a plugin to the native applications (3DS Max, Maya, XSI, C4D with Engineering bundle). Others have taken a route wherein the application needs to be installed, but they do not embed into the app.

[jimzepellin]

Thanks for answers guys. It's good to have a little understanding of what goes on behind the scenes of your favourite app.:)
I've still got over three weeks, before the offer runs out, to make my mind up and find some cash for Deep Exploration. I might be giving Ebay a visit.;)

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