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sesim
03-21-2009, 01:26 AM
Is it possible for u to make a try and write down ur settings? i tryed low temp and even 0 but still cant get the smoke to float above ground in a haze like way. It shall not be thick just ghost like in a way.

/s

SoLiTuDe
03-21-2009, 01:30 AM
Just a reminder, temperature goes below 0 so you can actually emit cold smoke, meaning it will drop / fall instead of rise... if you have a temp of 0 there will be nothing for bouyancy to calculate, go with a negative temperature number, add some velocity, and you should be at a good starting point.

JohnnyRandom
03-21-2009, 05:15 AM
0? not zero, 10.0 EDIT: sorry fat fingered my first post.

Similar example: max9 ffx1.2 betterwind

EDIT: better example below. Good point Ian (about 0 & bouyancy/gravity) :)

amckay
03-21-2009, 11:20 AM
yeah for the longest time you couldnt get your emitters in fume fx to go below 0 which was frustrating, obviously no show stopper but Maya and other fluid apps you could just quickly switch to 0 and have your dried ice effect instead of having to change your gravity vector.

Interesting now because I'm doing friggin snow explosions all day long ;)

sesim
03-21-2009, 01:45 PM
yeah for the longest time you couldnt get your emitters in fume fx to go below 0 which was frustrating, obviously no show stopper but Maya and other fluid apps you could just quickly switch to 0 and have your dried ice effect instead of having to change your gravity vector.

Interesting now because I'm doing friggin snow explosions all day long ;)

I have the new fumefx and i am able to simulate cold smoke. Negative number that is.

/S

sesim
03-21-2009, 01:49 PM
0? not zero, 10.0 EDIT: sorry fat fingered my first post.

Similar example: max9 ffx1.2 betterwind

Hi and thanx! im simulating as i type this:) But "betterWind" what plugin is that and what is the different of that and reactors wind?

/s

amckay
03-21-2009, 02:04 PM
yeah I'm using latest fume just meant earlier versions didnt use it


betterwind is an improved version of wind, basically Grant Adam opened up the SDK and was adding support for the decay so decay would affect turbulence AS well as wind strength since default wind doesnt. I basically just said to him "dude add support for dif turbulence types, and xyz control and this and that" so he went and added those additional features in. Its a pretty awesome plugin, Grants a pretty awesome guy!
It basically has more controls so you can really control your particles and have more variation and motion through its features

just google it its on maxplugins.de and a few other sites, I think a new version just came out this week?

sesim
03-21-2009, 02:29 PM
yeah I'm using latest fume just meant earlier versions didnt use it


betterwind is an improved version of wind, basically Grant Adam opened up the SDK and was adding support for the decay so decay would affect turbulence AS well as wind strength since default wind doesnt. I basically just said to him "dude add support for dif turbulence types, and xyz control and this and that" so he went and added those additional features in. Its a pretty awesome plugin, Grants a pretty awesome guy!
It basically has more controls so you can really control your particles and have more variation and motion through its features

just google it its on maxplugins.de and a few other sites, I think a new version just came out this week?

ok nice! i will defenatly look into that.

After rendered stills for many years im so sick and tired of it and want to see things moving:) So if im a pain in tha a** u all have to tell me! But i have to learn and why not learn from the best;)

Ill keep u all posted if i have something nice.

/S

JohnnyRandom
03-21-2009, 09:01 PM
That file help a little? Not the same effect but the principle is the same.

Betterwind (http://rpmanager.com/plugins/BetterWind.htm) stomps, so much more versatile, and the fact the decay/falloff actually works as expected is great. Not to mention all the extra control.
Example: betterwind and a standard wind, effect of strength 10.0 on a fume grid. Notice the decay in regards to the range indicators.

Fullsize screenshot (http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/SpaceWarps/BWindvsWind_screen.png)

http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/SpaceWarps/BWindvsWind_thumb.png

JohnnyRandom
03-22-2009, 09:26 PM
First example I posted was... well shit and it was bugging me
So a little more accurate example, still a pretty coarse grid (lacking horsepower) but anyway...

sesim
03-23-2009, 12:58 AM
First example I posted was... well shit and it was bugging me
So a little more accurate example, still a pretty coarse grid (lacking horsepower) but anyway...

oh thanx. I simulated for an hour now i think, looks nice.

but i get these strange verticle lines in every frame:/ any idea why?

/s

by any chance u have msn?

sesim
03-23-2009, 01:22 AM
Having some more problems!

I put some geo in there to see when it reacted with it. I build one box and added it in the list in fume. When render it will not render the box out, just the smoke. U can see that the smoke reacts with the box but cant chose box to cut alpha (-1.0) to compose the smoke ontop of the main render. What am i doing wrong?

/s

sesim
03-23-2009, 01:26 AM
Dont mind the last reply. Did fix the geo thing.

sorry

/s

JohnnyRandom
03-23-2009, 01:34 AM
AFAIK that is an unfortunate side effect from adding (as opposed to setting) the smoke in the voxel and using a large smoke value. The voxel is completely full. The voxel size (spacing) is still fairly large, the smaller sometimes the less noticeable. Most of the time it only occurs really close or within the source.You can soften a little with the jittering value in the render tab at the cost of adding noise.

sesim
03-23-2009, 02:22 PM
After a night of simulating (6hours) i did render out 126 frames of 500 and got like this! Did change some parameters and need to look over the density of the smoke. Need it to be not as thick.

what u all think. And big thanx to JohnnyRandom that guided me verry well and suplied nice material to start of with.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSrnm5RHncc


/S

sesim
03-23-2009, 03:42 PM
Now i got a bigger problem. I took what ive learned it that file provided.

Did try to redo everything in the original scene were the car is! Now that scene is pretty large and not 100% right in messurements. The car might be one meter bigger than in real life. But when fumegrid is so damn large i cant get anything to work anymore! I put the wind strenght to 50 and still its just growing verry slowly in it self to a ball. Nothing happens.

Any help here!?


/s

JohnnyRandom
03-23-2009, 05:07 PM
nice Sebastian, when you render out your fume do so as a pass, this way you will have much finer control over your opacities when you composite. you can of course tweak the shader, you will most likely end up loosing detail.

With your car example if you aren't planning on moving the model (much or at all), I would split it into two grids that overlap, unless you really need the smoke interaction you should be just fine, the grid on the screen right side would be in front and be the predominant grid in the shot, for the most part depending on which way the wind is blowing you may not see too much of the screen left grid, since it will be behind the car (this one could be much smaller in size).

You can also restrict the grid size too the maximum FOV of the camera. The grid doesn't really need to be outside of these bounds.

In the lower corner of the grid is a small yellow cube, this is the size of your voxel, that is really what you want to judge your scene scale upon. As that is what you have run the tests in proportion too. If you want the same look you will have to use the same scale voxel.

As for the wind, use the range indicators to see where your falloff/decay starts/ends. You can do a fairly coarse simulation and use the enable display and check the forces to see how the wind is affecting your grid. You may have to use a number like 0.05 to see the force (seems this option is a little out of balance with the rest, IMHO) You can also use fooTools ForceViewer (http://www.footools.com/3dsmax_plugins.html) to get an idea of what your wind/spacewarps are doing but of course this will be different than what fume sees, it will give you an idea, and it is a handy tool none-the-less for any particle work :)

sesim
03-23-2009, 05:18 PM
Thanx.

I might even pslit this up to 2 diff scenes! making a smaler grid but using same cam as on the finalrender and same res output! and have some dummy geo to represent the car! then it should not be that hard to make the sim and compose over the render! But need to have the smoke interact with wheels and so on.

/s

JohnnyRandom
03-23-2009, 05:59 PM
You could certainly use a lower poly collision mesh as long as it has enough detail to hold the simulation from giving the appearance of bleeding through the high poly mesh.

fiveoften
03-23-2009, 06:05 PM
its better wind freeware? how can i find them. Thx

JohnnyRandom
03-23-2009, 06:08 PM
Yes it is, BetterWind (http://rpmanager.com/plugins/BetterWind.htm), if you find it useful, feel free to thank him for it :)

RFX
03-25-2009, 06:05 PM
Hey gang, I've got a sim that is what I want, the problem is I need to split the box in half for rendering purposes, is there any way I can split a fume box in half keeping the cache I created, or am I going to have to copy the same box, make it the split size I want and then re-sim both of these out?

amckay
03-25-2009, 06:45 PM
you mean split the cache container? unfortunately no
if you mean for rendering, you could render with camera clipping planes, but it isn't feasable to split it

-AM

RFX
03-25-2009, 06:58 PM
you mean split the cache container? unfortunately no
if you mean for rendering, you could render with camera clipping planes, but it isn't feasable to split it

-AM

Hey Allan, yeah the cache container.

I'm trying the clipping plane method from using the camera, seem to be getting some different results than yesterday.

Thanks!

amckay
03-25-2009, 09:08 PM
rendering clipping planes will do the trick, what specifically are you needing to do ? render something in between it?

RFX
03-25-2009, 09:10 PM
rendering clipping planes will do the trick, what specifically are you needing to do ? render something in between it?

Yeah I've got one big fume box and an object is in the middle, I had created a matte shader for the object, but the comper is doing some stuff that breaks it and he needs me to split the fume box in a fg and bg manner.

As for the rendering clipping plane, I'm having some issue setting it up, is this through the camera or do we set this up somewhere else?

Checked the docs but couldn't find much besides the camera clipping plane.


-Rick

jimmy4d
03-26-2009, 01:14 PM
Yes it is, BetterWind (http://rpmanager.com/plugins/BetterWind.htm), if you find it useful, feel free to thank him for it :)


thanks for the tip johnny that is some cool wind.........


still plugging at this:banghead: .....here my next try, it's a bit better still needs a lot of work.
Thats ok i'm having a blast and learning a ton.:) ........... http://www.3dglove.com/09/marchboom.mov

let me know what you guys think.

PexElroy
03-26-2009, 08:32 PM
great blast jimmy. audio was loud hehe, the puffy smoke looks like a large voxel size, you wanted that or low on ram? :thumbsup:

JohnnyRandom
03-27-2009, 02:35 AM
Dude your comp looks waaaay better :), i agree with Rob, looks like you need to knuckle up and let that sucker bake with a tighter grid. Coming along nicely ;)

entrancea
03-27-2009, 03:43 AM
Hey Guys......Long time no seen......Very Quick Question........

When rendering FFX smoke did you guys ever encounter flickering say with a AB Shadow ap setting of depth 128bit?

I seem to be getting flickering every alternate frame....but when I use a higher setting like a shadow depth of 512bit with higher settings then only the flickering goes away......

Seriously I have never emcountered this problem before but only after using FumeFX 1.1 64bit version for Max2008 did I encounter this problem......

If you guys can give me any insight as so whats happening then it'll be very helpful cause due to higher settings my render times are shooting off the roof and my production is getting f***ed up....sorry for being a potty mouth guys....:banghead:

Cheers,
Entrancea

amckay
03-27-2009, 12:24 PM
Hey guys thought I'd do a shameless plug but I figure this is probably useful information to most people here.

I've been working the past months on an expert Fume FX training DVD aimed at advanced users and advanced topics. The DVD is just over 24 hours in length, covering everything fairly in depth, there's lots of production examples and case studies on visual effects shots and all the steps from pre-production through to creating all of the visual effects to rendering them out, compositing etc. as well as scripting, loads of stuff on digital fire, explosions you name it.
I released the DVD Monday and its been goin great! Actually had a couple of guys from ILM purchase the disc and a lot of other major studios so that is also good news! But I've basically dumped as much information I could onto this to make it the best training resource I could, its currently available for direct download (very fast connection) it will also be available through Turbosquid as a physical DVD in a few weeks.

There's a lot more information in the link below if anyone's interested!
http://www.allanmckay.com/FFXDVD2.htm

keep up the great work guys!


PS. Enrancea, couple of questions - are you net rendering or rendering locally? are you using fluid mapping... also look at caching your illumination maps to disc see if that helps..

jimmy4d
03-27-2009, 01:06 PM
Hey Guys......Long time no seen......Very Quick Question........

When rendering FFX smoke did you guys ever encounter flickering say with a AB Shadow ap setting of depth 128bit?

I seem to be getting flickering every alternate frame....but when I use a higher setting like a shadow depth of 512bit with higher settings then only the flickering goes away......

Seriously I have never emcountered this problem before but only after using FumeFX 1.1 64bit version for Max2008 did I encounter this problem......

If you guys can give me any insight as so whats happening then it'll be very helpful cause due to higher settings my render times are shooting off the roof and my production is getting f***ed up....sorry for being a potty mouth guys....:banghead:

Cheers,
Entrancea


I had a problem like that for a while when I had max 2008, never did figure it out. Using max09 64 having no promblems. beats me what it was.:shrug:

Jonny and PexElroy thanks guys, yeah i need let the next one bake for a while. the grid is not that big at all,,,and I got 8 gigs of ram, I just got lazy with the spacing, will turn down and let that sucker bake :o,


Allen.........SWEET I can not wait to get me mits on this.......that is great news.

fiveoften
03-27-2009, 03:01 PM
thx allan i for 5 minutes i buy your secound fumeffx dvd. I love the good dollar curse ^^

nice stuffs thx. but the conncection is very low. i download with 200kb.

the ftp server ist very instabil. have you ideas?

JohnnyRandom
03-27-2009, 05:38 PM
nice stuffs thx. but the conncection is very low. i download with 200kb.

the ftp server ist very instabil. have you ideas?

It is probably getting hammered!

Nazgul
03-27-2009, 05:49 PM
Hey Allan!

Nice for the advanced FUMEFX DVD. Can't wait to see what's you have in store.
I find it amazing how little dvds and informations are out about FumeFX and Afterburn.
Good for your business AND for us that's for sure.

Cheers and see you in Montreal whenever you care!
Can't believe it was monday night. ;)

Marc-André

amckay
03-27-2009, 05:52 PM
Nazgul - hah hah hah
yeah that was one crazy ass night
I will have to come back and visit all the ubisoft crew, that was a load of fun!

fiveoften - it should be quite fast, I believe Johnny Random said he managed to grab the entire thing in 2 hours, give it some time and see if it speeds up

fiveoften
03-27-2009, 06:28 PM
he say authoritation fail.

password and username are correct. i see all file on the browser but i cant download them

amckay
03-27-2009, 06:43 PM
Ohhh OK - yeah I dont recommend using a web browser to log into ftp's, use an ftp client like FileZilla or CuteFTP

email me off list amckay@allanmckay.com and I'll walk you through it if you're having any problems and we'll talk there

PexElroy
03-28-2009, 01:14 AM
@ Allan - new FFX DVD rocks, solid material & packed with cool stuff :twisted:

JohnnyRandom
03-28-2009, 04:24 AM
Something kinda freaky...

freaky QT 19 mb (http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/Freaky/kindafreaky_med.mov)

less freaky QT 5.0 mb (http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/Freaky/lessfreaky.mov)

entrancea
03-28-2009, 10:21 AM
Allan:Hey Mate....yeah am using fluid mapping to add the details.......I didn't try to cache the illumination......

Yeah am rendering locally.....


Jimmy4d: Dude....I know man.......I used to use Max9 before and then switched to Max2008 cause I found it to be a little more faster but then all was fine....then 6 or so months back.....the flickerings started......

Regards,
Entrancea

jimmy4d
03-28-2009, 12:54 PM
Something kinda freaky...

freaky QT 19 mb (http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/Freaky/kindafreaky_med.mov)

less freaky QT 5.0 mb (http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/Freaky/lessfreaky.mov)



cool man..............trying to think of what that looks like....weird!

PexElroy
03-28-2009, 03:10 PM
@ Johnny - that is cool stuff, funky motion, how'd you make that? :)

@ entrancea - in max 2008 try to do a File > Reset after a Fume sim, then reload that file and render the fluids. That may remove flicker without having to light cache & render twice.

JohnnyRandom
03-28-2009, 10:51 PM
Just thought it looked strange, i was goofing with the shaders, its just particles attached to a noise animated plane.

amckay
03-28-2009, 10:57 PM
fluid mapping can sometimes cause flickering, not sure why but it does, try lowering your levels and making your map blend value a bit lower, like it defaults to 70 so bring it lower so its less map more fume see if that helps a little

fiveoften
03-31-2009, 09:45 AM
hey guys. I have problems to build a asteroid ground impact like bruce almighty or the bbc documentation "end day".

Have anyone ideas for the pf and fume setup?
`
i have make this with a old version of afterburn but its not this what i want.



www.bs-media.org/evo2/paristest5_web.avi

entrancea
03-31-2009, 07:03 PM
Hey Guys......
Well I tried all your tips and every one of them worked....thank goodness......I have some major Fume Work ahead of me and these buggers were slowing me down big time...

Allan:Question mate!I did use Fluid mapping but if I rendered it in low res shadow sampling then the fluid used to flicker but when I used a higher shadow settings(which shot the render times badly) it got rid of the flickering.......Is that how its supposed to work?

Cheers Guys,
Entrancea

pgill
04-01-2009, 04:47 AM
hey everyone, need some pointers please.

heres a test clip for my latest job but I need it to look more like white water (although at a massive scale like huge breaking waves), wheras at the mo it looks more like timelapse clouds. I'm going to do the fume follow/krakatoa route for more detail, but any tips/pointers would be welcome!

http://www.vimeo.com/3949411

cheers

paul

ddustin
04-01-2009, 05:24 AM
Paul,
Why not combine RealFlow with fumeFX?

We did it here http://www.dustinproductions.com/fluids-fire.htm
although we were going for more of a flamable liquid look...

David

JohnnyRandom
04-01-2009, 06:35 AM
That's looks pretty tight pgill :) Nice sim.

Do you mean white water as in white water rapids?

EDIT: I should ask is it an object source?

Of course when you bring it into pflow you could thin it out with a low fumefx emision rate and boost your particle count back up by spawn.

grury
04-01-2009, 08:58 AM
Hey Paul, nice stuff. Altho may not be what you after, it looks pretty cool.
Perhaps needs a much higher dissipation strenght on the smoke, or maybe you could try to use only the fire sim, and render it as if it was smoke, check out the dragon on http://grury.cgsociety.org/gallery/665842/
Krakatoa is also the way to go, to had extra detail, and if you Beta testing, defenetly the Voxel render is worth a try.

Cheers

JohnnyRandom
04-02-2009, 02:13 AM
Hey Carlos no bragging about the voxel engine :D

Maybe something like this: Particles and object source...

whitewater QT 4 mb (http://www.4rand.com/TEST/FumeFx/Misc/WhiteWater/whitewater.mov)

Don't bag I didn't spend much time on it :) messed with the shader a bit for the heck of it.

grury
04-02-2009, 07:33 AM
LÖL..u teaser. That looks very cool.
So many new toys, so little time.

pgill
04-02-2009, 01:52 PM
thanks guys

thats a really cool test. so i'm guessing: is it fume for the fine misty stuff. krakatoa for the heavy white water coming off the sphere, fume (or afterburn) particle source spawned by collision with the floor?

cheers

paul

JohnnyRandom
04-02-2009, 04:21 PM
Hi Paul, it is all fumefx, I didn't have time to voxelize it yet :), it is merely a particle source and an object source emitting from a mapped object. Note the noise is to reduce the appearance of the voxel edges (this is from the adjustment of the rendering steps and jitter values), I thought it gave it little more interesting result. I was thinking about this a little more last night and will have to test it out a little more today, I have another idea I would like to try as soon as these PRT's are finished writing to disk. I'll share it if it works out.

I the mean time if your interested and have max 2009...

Scene file:
Max2009 SP1 FumeFX 1.2

pgill
04-02-2009, 11:30 PM
wow!

supercool johnny for sharing the scene! and thanks for looking at the problem further. I'll let you know how it goes.

JohnnyRandom
04-03-2009, 02:09 AM
No problem, I figured a scene is worth a thousand words, I didn't have time to write a tut :)

Got hauled off on some other stuff, wanna revisit it tomorrow.

EricTT
04-07-2009, 04:49 AM
how to make the smoke birth slowly?I use the fumefx to birth smoke with a simple source just only,but the smoke's birth rate is too fast ,which parameter I can control to make the smoke's birth animation like a cigarette smoke :sad:

meg
04-07-2009, 03:58 PM
HI. I'd like to create an energy sphere with an aurea and flares like the sun ones...any advice on how to do it in fumefx?
thx

meg
04-07-2009, 04:04 PM
or at least if particle flow is able to do that? really thx

fiveoften
04-07-2009, 04:57 PM
i think

Time Scale

JohnnyRandom
04-07-2009, 08:02 PM
how to make the smoke birth slowly?I use the fumefx to birth smoke with a simple source just only,but the smoke's birth rate is too fast ,which parameter I can control to make the smoke's birth animation like a cigarette smoke :sad:

Yes, time scale (be careful too low of values have a tendency to loose structure) also note that timescale is more or less based on the development time and not the speed of movement (even though that is a result of the value), so a lower value it will take more time for the set params to develop.

A better approach would be to manipulate the gravity/bouyancy, unlock and add some turbulence (with z being the higher value of the 3) bring up the scale value, add a tiny bit of velocity dampening, bring up your temperature dissipation min. value and strength.

tool2heal
04-08-2009, 11:05 AM
I need a little help with the whole loading of initial states thing, say im trying to make clouds with fume and i sim to a certain frame and then i just want to be able to load that single frame into my scene so it does'nt actually move or render any part of the sim besides that one frame.

how would i go about doing that?

I read earlier in this thread that some were doing this to make clouds.
A little explanation would be nice
thanks.

pauldublin
04-08-2009, 05:38 PM
Hi guys,

I notice a few were talkin about Allan's new DVD here, I bought it just there. I thought it was a Direct Download, but it's saying it's being shipped to me??

Does anyone know how I go about downloading it instead of having to wait?

Thanks,

Paul

JohnnyRandom
04-08-2009, 08:18 PM
I need a little help with the whole loading of initial states thing, say im trying to make clouds with fume and i sim to a certain frame and then i just want to be able to load that single frame into my scene so it does'nt actually move or render any part of the sim besides that one frame.

Not exactly clear on what you are trying to achieve. Sure, you just want one frame, then just render that frame and comp it in post (that is the usual workflow) Using the Load initial state function does exactly that loads a snapshot that you either define or set via the preferences. The sim continues on from the snapshot, it doesn't just take the snapshot and say hey stay this way forever. ;)

Does anyone know how I go about downloading it instead of having to wait?
Where did you buy it? HERE (http://www.allanmckay.com/FFXDVD2.html)

pauldublin
04-08-2009, 09:56 PM
Where did you buy it? HERE (http://www.allanmckay.com/FFXDVD2.html)[/QUOTE]

I bought it from Allan's site, it's cool now I got a mail from him, thanks

DanFX
04-10-2009, 12:09 PM
Whats up guys?

I've had a lot of spare time over the past few weeks, so I decided to cook something up with Fume. Lemme know what ya think.

http://danchamberlin3d.com/htfiles/javelin_lo.html

or

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwnN-6HUplA&feature=channel_page
(Make sure to watch this one in High Quality)

There's a 720p version of it if you've got the patients to wait for a 100mb video to load:

http://danchamberlin3d.com/movies/Javelin_Test_Final_720p.mov

Enjoy

-Dan

Glacierise
04-10-2009, 12:12 PM
Yeah, great shot dude, favved!

Daniel-B
04-10-2009, 05:35 PM
Very nice Fume work there, Dan. However, your camera shake starts at the frame before the explosion even occurs. In real life, the camera wouldn't shake until the shockwave from the explosion reached it. Therefore, try starting the camera shake 3-4 frames after the explosion.

Great work though. :)

JohnnyRandom
04-10-2009, 11:50 PM
Nice Dan, I really wish for a good way to blend different smoke colors, almost like they should do a redesign and somehow implement the smoke shader to the actual source, that be cool :)

Glacierise
04-11-2009, 01:55 PM
yeah i'd say the current fume shading leaves much to be desired in terms of control :) What you could do is render your smoke/fire in RGB - use the color gradient to just set red, green and blue values and then recolor in post. Also, it's cool to have several grids, color them differently. Especially with explosions, you almost always need that to have a more interesting and realistic look.

JohnnyRandom
04-11-2009, 11:56 PM
What you could do is render your smoke/fire in RGB - use the color gradient to just set red, green and blue values and then recolor in post.

I'm going to hit that up. been meaning to try something along those lines forever. time to try it out :)

fiftypercent
04-12-2009, 05:52 AM
i used krakatoa in this.... i was wondering how to do fumefx but anyway....AND PLEASE!!!.... 4get the other effects.... only pay attention 2 nightcrawler
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BJiO-PCjic

jimmy4d
04-12-2009, 11:27 PM
nice one dan.........looks sweet mate..........

renaissance01
04-13-2009, 12:24 AM
Yeah really cool stuff Dan...Keep it up mate :thumbsup:

UbiGuy
04-14-2009, 06:30 PM
Hi!



I working on something similar to this...



http://www.thewe.cc/thewei/&/images3/2004_war_photos/r3165273230.jpe (http://www.thewe.cc/thewei/&/images3/2004_war_photos/r3165273230.jpe) or this

http://www.theage.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1048962849732_2003/04/03/304iraq8,0.jpg (http://www.theage.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1048962849732_2003/04/03/304iraq8,0.jpg) or this

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0frWdUy2Va2Gx/610x.jpg (http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0frWdUy2Va2Gx/610x.jpg)





I can get the mushroom and hard look but not the expansion over the time… The gaz expand at start with the fuel expansion, but after the column stop expand and look like a tube… I know FumeFX is not a compressible fluid system.. But did you think it will be possible to add some expansion vector to the solver by script? Or if someone have a trick... Or at least a good example made with FumeFX



Hot gaz expand in colder air...



Thank You!

Glacierise
04-14-2009, 07:03 PM
Hey dude, be cool and avoid the black text please... On the expansion - put a simple source with just velocity in, no fuel/smoke/temp, and add some radial velocity, that sould help.

UbiGuy
04-14-2009, 09:51 PM
Lololol... Sorry for the black text. I have copy/pasted it from a text editor and the color get imported... :)

For the velocity trick Thank You! But I already have try it. The velocity always slow down too fast and I can't get the cone effect. Even with the velocity damping at 0. Maybe it's my settings. I will try again....

pgill
04-15-2009, 01:06 AM
I'm having boiling shadows with ABshadowmaps in my fume renders. 1 spot and two omnis. The standard shadow maps work fine but don't look as good as the abshadow maps, any ideas? tried the map size and so on but no luck. I have some really thick smoke plumming around.

cheers

paul

meg
04-15-2009, 11:50 AM
i used krakatoa in this.... i was wondering how to do fumefx but anyway....AND PLEASE!!!.... 4get the other effects.... only pay attention 2 nightcrawler
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BJiO-PCjic

wow!!!really good!! how did you do the nightcrawler effects?? do you know if there is a tutorial or a workflow to look at? thx!!

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-16-2009, 02:34 PM
Hey guys.

Im starting out with fume fx at the moment and i have a question.

How would you handle a simulation of dust on rayfire chunks?
There are many chunks once the rayfire simulation has been cached.

Is there a way to append all of these to the object source emitter in fume fx?

thanks in advance

JohnnyRandom
04-16-2009, 03:37 PM
Give Solitude's Fume Object Source Manager (http://www.scriptspot.com/3ds-max/fume-object-source-manager) a shot ;)

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-16-2009, 04:52 PM
will do thanks a bunch:thumbsup:

pgill
04-16-2009, 05:02 PM
how about putting the rayfire sim into a mesher compound?

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-16-2009, 05:24 PM
Quick question before i try it more.
Got the object source to instance over all fragments.
Only problem is they dont emit?
Theyr also grey not yellow like the original one.
Got some error message when klicking do it but cant remember what it was.
Will post it when i see it the next time.

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-16-2009, 05:29 PM
mesher sim is a modifier?
sorry but just switched to max from c4d weeks ago
I also tried to get them connected because they were simulated in 32bit and then moved to 64 for fume fx but didnt get it to work.
Im guessing getting them connected would be the easiest way since theyr keyframed in some sort.

If anyone has a pflow emit from object tut handy id be gratefull too.
Im guessing that would also be a good way to get this to work+extra control over the particles as in stick to surface waves from hitting plane etc.

Pflow are very mighty at first sight and kinda easier to handle than thinking particles in c4d.
Fume Fx and Rayfire are of course magic tricks c4d only dreams of in his wildest dream:applause:

SoLiTuDe
04-16-2009, 06:26 PM
Quick question before i try it more.
Got the object source to instance over all fragments.
Only problem is they dont emit?
Theyr also grey not yellow like the original one.
Got some error message when klicking do it but cant remember what it was.
Will post it when i see it the next time.

I'd be more than happy to fix it for you if you give me what the error was. :D Ideally, get your first object source working on one piece, then copy it across to the other objects. Also.. make sure you add the object sources to the fume grid list

As for the pflow, can you be more detailed? Object emission is pretty simple... just a Position Object + Speed by Surface...
Also, thinking particles for max is also very powerful (much more so than the c4d version from what i understand)... worth a look if you're serious about particles / fx.

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-16-2009, 11:26 PM
Hey solitude.

Sorry i was in a hurry and thought maybe it was some kind of known error.

Did the setup again and heres is what comes when i select do it.
Before i pressed it i added the object source with the first piece of fragment selected in it.

A MAXScript Rollout Handler Exeption pops up saying

Unknown property: "ddl_sel" in undentified


Also the maxscript windows with the script pops up.

I didnt add all the sources to the fume fx objects in the first try.
Ill try now.
Is there a way to get all of them in there quick?
Its quite many ^^

Anyways thanks for helping out :thumbsup:

SoLiTuDe
04-16-2009, 11:45 PM
Hey solitude.

Sorry i was in a hurry and thought maybe it was some kind of known error.

Did the setup again and heres is what comes when i select do it.
Before i pressed it i added the object source with the first piece of fragment selected in it.

A MAXScript Rollout Handler Exeption pops up saying

Unknown property: "ddl_sel" in undentified


Also the maxscript windows with the script pops up.

I didnt add all the sources to the fume fx objects in the first try.
Ill try now.
Is there a way to get all of them in there quick?
Its quite many ^^

Anyways thanks for helping out :thumbsup:

Try adding

Global Selset

to the first line of the script and running it again... otherwise, try unchecking the "add Srcs to Sel. Set" until i fix it

Adding the sources to the grid is easy... the script will do it (albeit was unstable, and i havent done it in a while) for you if you have a fume grid selected in the "select fume grid" button before you run the script... or there is a keyboard shortcut Ctrl-Shift-A if you select all the sources, and then select the fume grid, and run the shortcut ( the keyboard override button on the toolbar might need to be toggled)


Good luck!

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-16-2009, 11:57 PM
Did it again added the object source to the fume fx grid before i pressed do it and it worked.
Then it says pick the dselection set manualy and i did a little further down in your script.
My question is do i have to append the selection set to the fume fx grid objects box?
And if how.

Thanks in advance

oneandonlyDiscoStu
04-17-2009, 12:00 AM
Forget my last post.
Added the fume fx grid to your script and everything worked.

Thank you very much very handy:applause:

SoLiTuDe
04-17-2009, 12:03 AM
If you open the fumefx options, in the obj/src tab are the sources listed there? If so, then you're set. Otherwise, add them. Using the selection set rollout in the script is just a way of manipulating the sources all at once without having them selected in the scene

MacCool
04-17-2009, 12:36 AM
Hello there!

Finding information about getting FumeFX work with Mental Ray is not easy. Maybe you guys can help.

We got a ffx animation of a launching space rocket done that it looks good so far. The scene itself has been rendered with Mental ray and the fume animation has been rendered with scanline. The passes have been comped together.

But we're having trouble with the illumination. The fire should light the surroundings. Scanline can't be used for that (right?). But Mental Ray doesn't offer render elements for fume's illumination.
The thing is, we used a daylight system to illuminate the scene. But the daylight system doesn't work with the same settings when trying to use it with fume. So we need to get the illumination by fume as a separate pass.

For a short sequence we did this:
First, generate the finalgather map using the daylight and fume as light sources. Then fume was hidden and the scene was rendered by using the FG map read-only. This had to be done manually for every single frame, and the resulting sequence comped.
As you can imagine, we don't want to do this for a longer sequence.

How should we go about getting a daylight illuminated scene additionally illuminated by fume in mental ray?
Another note: As mentioned, the previous sequences have been rendered in a combination of scanline and mental ray. But we need to create another version purely in mental ray because we need to use a fish eye camera in there (for a full dome projection). And this fish eye plug-in only works with mental ray.

I hope I explained our problem well enough. If not, please let me know.

grury
04-17-2009, 10:19 AM
Hey have u guys had a look at the new Pyro Fx on Houdini...very very cool.

Check out the Blast Off! video.

http://www.sidefx.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1449&Itemid=322

JohnnyRandom
04-17-2009, 04:34 PM
^ I have! Houdini 10 looks sweet, some really amazing stuff in this release. I haven't seen the page you posted though, thanks :)

As PsychoSilence would put it "another time vampire" that would be a hoot, I have been looking at that Apprentice HD version since they released it, need like 48 hours in a day instead of 24!

PsychoSilence
04-17-2009, 06:02 PM
Hah! very true :)

I´m on vacation as off sunday but if i gonna play with houdini then i guess the lady will gimme a hard time :(

fireknght2
04-17-2009, 11:01 PM
Thanks for the video I can see that I need to get back to using Houdini again. The fire simulation really looks like fume and alot better than the fire created in 3ds max.


Fire

HeadSmell
04-18-2009, 06:58 PM
Hi all,
I just realized that fume recognizes some of max's forces (wind, gravity, vortex....) in the objects/sources. I'm fairly new to fume and have been trying to find as many tutorials as possible.I've notice none of them have mention this and the fume help pdf briefly mentions this.

Just wondering if other people generally use them in there sims?

the winds seems perfect for creating a gentle breeze after an explosion. Also other than having the advantage of animating the gravity force and negative values, what the difference between a regular gravity and fumes gravityVector? am I missing out on some thing if i just use a regular gravity over gravity vector?

Cheers

eldee
04-19-2009, 01:46 AM
max spacewarps tend to slow down a fumefx sim by quite a bit, so generally speaking you should try to get the effect you're looking for within the fumefx settings themselves. That said, some effects are damn near impossible to achieve without using spacewarps- but a gentle breeze could be easily done with a rotated fumefx gravity vector rather than a wind spacewarp. if you want the wind to suddenly swell up and blow the smoke away, that gets a little bit more tricky and probably best done with a spacewarp.

evanschaible
04-19-2009, 03:34 PM
Well, I am new to the forums here, but this thread is particularly interesting to me. I am working on a shot right now that uses alot of Fume and likely PFlow as well. But here are some screens of progress thus far:

http://www.videocopilot.net/forum/download/file.php?id=1748&mode=viewhttp://www.videocopilot.net/forum/download/file.php?id=1749&mode=view

It is cool to see Rif on here too, it is always encouraging to see the industry guys on the forums. Maybe old Alan Mckay will show up too...

Anyhow, here is my site while Im at it: www.VisualEffects.co.cc Ive got lots of PGlow training tutorials and stuff like that.

- Evan

floopyb
04-20-2009, 02:53 AM
the winds seems perfect for creating a gentle breeze after an explosion.
Cheers

Actually the best way to apply wind is to add a simple source with no fuel, no smoke and a temp of 0.01 or above (just so the grid recognizes it). This will create a realistic fluid motion wind that will blow around objects and interact properly with the smoke densities rather than just adding a uniform wind strength to all voxels (as the spacewarp would do). It takes a lot more stuffing around though (Turn your velocities on in viewport!!) as it needs a bit of presim to fill your grid with wind. And it changes a lot when you change grid size. :(

cosm0naut
04-20-2009, 02:21 PM
hey all,

i am emitting from an object source, which is a character i want to disintegrate. what happens is even though i have free flow activated on the object source the fluid collides with the mesh, showing its shilouette through the fluid. this is not wanted of course. i tried animating the mesh out of the container after the emission, but that also influences the simulation in a way that it seems to delete all the smoke it passes through. this seems like a bug to me because there's no difference if free flow is activated or not. but maybe i am missing something obvious..

anyone else experiencing this or knows a workaround?

HeadSmell
04-21-2009, 12:56 PM
Thanx floopyb / eldee
I'l give it a go.


floopyb:
Your guys (ZeroOne) animation of space chimps looks really good. I am setting up a car scene right now driving on a salt plane, just wounder how you guys set up the dust emitter for the chase scene?

Right now i just have a partial flow with a shape instance referencing a simple plane under the tire. Having the whole tire as an emitter wasnt getting good results.

If anyone knows of a good way to set up a pflow for a car dust trail that would be great...
With Fumefx of coarse




Cheers

floopyb
04-22-2009, 12:24 AM
Thanx floopyb / eldee
I'l give it a go.


floopyb:
Your guys (ZeroOne) animation of space chimps looks really good. I am setting up a car scene right now driving on a salt plane, just wounder how you guys set up the dust emitter for the chase scene?

Right now i just have a partial flow with a shape instance referencing a simple plane under the tire. Having the whole tire as an emitter wasnt getting good results.

If anyone knows of a good way to set up a pflow for a car dust trail that would be great...
With Fumefx of coarse




Cheers

The way I did it for the SpaceChipms FMVs was to get the wheels to laydown particles where they had driven (static on the ground) then spawn particles up from these. This gave the dust following a rally car kind of look.

HeadSmell
04-22-2009, 03:39 AM
The way I did it for the SpaceChipms FMVs was to get the wheels to laydown particles where they had driven (static on the ground) then spawn particles up from these. This gave the dust following a rally car kind of look.

Thanks for that,

I was scrambling to find reference material of a car driving, and came across rc cars driving in the sand...which gives a totally ridiculous look as the wheels are spinning up way more durt/dust that a real car would...I had the emiter pumping up way to much dirt :/

Cheers

SandwichMonarch
04-22-2009, 03:51 AM
Howdy everyone,

My name is Sam, and I'm directing and doing vfx for a low budget scifi feature coming out this summer called Dark Island (AKA INFECTED). I've been using FumeFX for the last couple months as our workhorse - the movie features a swarm/smoke monster that relies heavily on this great plugin, in combination with all the tips and tricks I've read about in this thread!

One thing I've been trying to perfect is the FumeFX explosion - we've spent quite a while so far working on tricks (such as fuel-emitting particles with a ultra-hot temperature source) and we've gotten cool results, but not yet to the degree that some of you others have been able to achieve. The effect is something that is rather crucial to our project, as we have a plane drop a bomb at the end of our film, and we'd like to have a large scale napalm/mini nuke explosion in 3D (the footage will be camera-tracked).

This leads me to a modest offer I would like to propose: would anyone be willing to share settings or let us use a particle system they've set up for a cool explosion? We can handle simulation, etc, ourselves. I can offer full credit for any help on the project! Any help would be greatly appreciated to achieve this effect!

Here's a link for our trailer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZZiDLCMu0c

and the production company:

http://www.epic-pictures.com

Mods: if this belongs if a different place, or is violating forums guidlines, just let me know. Thanks.

ps: if anyone has questions, feel free to pm me, or shoot me an email: spamgorski@gmail.com

villean
04-23-2009, 07:55 AM
Does anyone know how to add more detail in your simulation without using enormous amount of hard disk space. My last sim took up to 3 days and over 260GB of FumeFX data. I know you can use fluid mapping but the resuls are not as good as a smaller spacing and tweaking your rending settings.

Here are the nine seconds of animation that took 3 days of sim and 260GB of FumeFX data:
http://www.3dlotus.net/videos/wildfire.wmv

@SandwichMonarch
Could you post some more information like the duration of the explosion, size, enviourmental details and sorts?
And isnt it more easy to use particles to shape your explosion using Thinking particles ,they even have a Mushroom cloud simulation for the particles.

floopyb
04-23-2009, 08:26 AM
Does anyone know how to add more detail in your simulation without using enormous amount of hard disk space. My last sim took up to 3 days and over 260GB of FumeFX data. I know you can use fluid mapping but the resuls are not as good as a smaller spacing and tweaking your rending settings.

Here are the nine seconds of animation that took 3 days of sim and 260GB of FumeFX data:
http://www.3dlotus.net/videos/wildfire.wmv


That looks like a lot of detail... Maybe you need to "do" more with the flames as far as adding objects to effect it or wind etc. Do you actually need a shot like that or is it just a test?
Otherwise Krakatoa will give you more detail (possibly at the cost of even MORE disk space!!) but you dont need a very detailed fume sim at all.

grury
04-23-2009, 08:50 AM
Here are the nine seconds of animation that took 3 days of sim and 260GB of FumeFX data

Thats a stunning result. Love it.

Dont think theres much work around on such a close up kinda shot.

villean
04-23-2009, 09:06 AM
That looks like a lot of detail... Maybe you need to "do" more with the flames as far as adding objects to effect it or wind etc. Do you actually need a shot like that or is it just a test?
Otherwise Krakatoa will give you more detail (possibly at the cost of even MORE disk space!!) but you dont need a very detailed fume sim at all.

It was just a Test to see what FumeFX is capable off. The 3 Simulation steps is probably the main reason why it took so long but those were needed. I tested it with 2 but it was very "stuttery" (Don't know the right word for it).

I'll see if I can get my hand on Kratatoa. But I gues I have to buy a new harddisk first :)

Bandu
04-23-2009, 12:23 PM
@villean.

there is definitively something wrong with your setting. 3 days for simulation?!

can you say more about you settings?

regards,
Bandu

jimmy4d
04-23-2009, 01:07 PM
@villean...wow that render should not take 3 days, dude what is your hardware setup? are you running 64 bit? The fire looks nice but man 3days, thats insane for a short test.

I'm not a pro by nomeans but that just seems too long to me.

I'm sure we can get you down a great deal.......maybe post your max file.

villean
04-23-2009, 01:48 PM
@villean...wow that render should not take 3 days, dude what is your hardware setup? are you running 64 bit? The fire looks nice but man 3days, thats insane for a short test.

I'm not a pro by nomeans but that just seems too long to me.

I'm sure we can get you down a great deal.......maybe post your max file.

Ill make some screens or post the max file when I get home. I'm at work now.

My setup:
Vista Ultimate X64
Core i7 920@3.6Ghz
12GB DDR

villean
04-23-2009, 06:16 PM
As promised my settings.

I highlighted a the area that really confuses me. Is says 8071MB for the simulation but it takes over 260GB is this normal?

http://www.3dlotus.net/fume/settings.gif

I noticed that I apparently forgot to add the smoke layer so here the animation as it should have been. I like the other one better though.

http://www.3dlotus.net/videos/wildfire2.wmv
(http://www.3dlotus.net/videos/wildfire.wmv)

grury
04-23-2009, 07:10 PM
Hum, theres a few things that could help.
With that low spacing theres no need to also calculate n store the fluid map, no wonder u had such huge amount of data.
Also theres no need to use such high values for max iterations and quality.
Spacing could be higher and save the velocity channel then use motion blur.

As for the final result, one of the things I really liked on the first clip, was the lack of smoke. It was the first thing I noticed, nice and clean. The smoke makes it look messy and distracting.

TwiiK
04-23-2009, 07:34 PM
8071MB is the amount of ram needed for the simulation. 260GB, I guess, is how much space it takes up on your harddrive. They are not the same. :)

I think you can see how much space your simulation will use per frame on your harddrive if you click "set" under "Exporting channels" under "Output".

SandwichMonarch
04-23-2009, 08:54 PM
I'll admit - we're open to many types of explosions, as we don't establish what will be dropped - whatever we can make look best! The size of our explosion would be about 50' in diameter, and we would string a couple together to give a carpet bombing effect. The look we've been experimenting is one where it starts off as a rich burst of fire that shakes off a light layer of dust, then eventually plumes into a cloud of smoke. Our environment is a dense forest area, so we will be creating a nice shockwave effect to work with the explosion.

Here's some good reference (around 1:00)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpTeyI4cOdM&feature=related

floopyb
04-24-2009, 12:22 AM
Here is a link to some Krakatoa and fumeFX stuff I mentioned above:
http://www.franticfilms.com/software/support/krakatoa/work_in_progress_gallery.php
Its near the end of the page

Also concerning your 260gig, if you turn off fluid mapping the amount of disk space needed will drop considerably!!! You dont even have it turned on in the rendering tab so you are not seeing the benefit of it!!
Fluidmapping takes the size of the files to 4x-6x the size!

As for the 3 days... I have done sims that have taken 10 days! and about 135Gig (without fluid mapping)

To speed it up there are a few things you can do...
Quality should be about 6 maximum!! anything over is a waste of time. Try it at 5
Maximum iterations can be taken down from 400 to 80 or so (you will need testing to see how low you can go!) as Gury said
Cubic Interpolation can be turned off... you will get a different look and it will be much quicker. I tend to like smoke sims with cubic off.

Try going low and see how it looks.

jimmy4d
04-24-2009, 03:11 AM
As promised my settings.

I highlighted a the area that really confuses me. Is says 8071MB for the simulation but it takes over 260GB is this normal?

http://www.3dlotus.net/fume/settings.gif

I noticed that I apparently forgot to add the smoke layer so here the animation as it should have been. I like the other one better though.

http://www.3dlotus.net/videos/wildfire2.wmv



.14 spacing is like mega low dude..............it's gonna take for ever..but look sweet........

JonathanFreisler
04-24-2009, 03:45 AM
Yeah spacing is really low, and fluid mapping may not be required in this instance. There are a few things you could do which have already been suggested, but its looking pretty good. I think the noise is too hight but that might be what your going for.

villean
04-24-2009, 06:49 AM
Here is a link to some Krakatoa and fumeFX stuff I mentioned above:
http://www.franticfilms.com/software/support/krakatoa/work_in_progress_gallery.php
Its near the end of the page

Also concerning your 260gig, if you turn off fluid mapping the amount of disk space needed will drop considerably!!! You dont even have it turned on in the rendering tab so you are not seeing the benefit of it!!
Fluidmapping takes the size of the files to 4x-6x the size!

As for the 3 days... I have done sims that have taken 10 days! and about 135Gig (without fluid mapping)

To speed it up there are a few things you can do...
Quality should be about 6 maximum!! anything over is a waste of time. Try it at 5
Maximum iterations can be taken down from 400 to 80 or so (you will need testing to see how low you can go!) as Gury said
Cubic Interpolation can be turned off... you will get a different look and it will be much quicker. I tend to like smoke sims with cubic off.

Try going low and see how it looks.

Ahh you're right I still got the Fluidsim on talk about a waste of time. Probably forgot to turn it off during the testing.

Krakatoa looks very nice will have to get my hands on it. Its basically a FX dream pluggin. That hand animation test its just to cool!

Tnx all for these tips This way I can do more Sims in less Time!

JohnnyRandom
04-26-2009, 03:31 AM
Afterworks has released the Max 2010 update for FumeFX 1.2. :)

tool2heal
04-27-2009, 10:23 AM
I little test i did with FumeFX and Krakatoa, nothing spectacular i know its not perfect i just wanted to try it out. Feel free to check my other videos and comment if you like. Most of them are older tests. I'm certainly better now but not nearly as good as some of the stuff i see here.

http://img144.imagevenue.com/loc394/th_23862_thumbs20090427041122_122_394lo.jpg (http://img144.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=23862_thumbs20090427041122_122_394lo.jpg)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzP9KoI4vVo

Thanks.

HeadSmell
04-27-2009, 10:55 AM
Hi everyone,
I just did my first explosion test scene with fume and came across a few problems. This picture was the last frame of the animation, I still need to properly camera map the geometry and grade it.

My goal was to have the debris trailing smoke/dust as it is falling.


It's hard to see in this frame but i had debris shooting out from the point of impact. It is a simple p Flow set up emitting 30 or so shape instances and spawning particles as it fly's through the air.(in the render I just applied a blur to fake the effect) When i plug the Pflow into fume I am not getting a consistent trail and it randomly breaks into small clumps.

There is plenty of particles being spawning, Just trying to figure out what fume setting i might need to play with to archive a solid trail from a fast moving object.

Cheers

tool2heal
04-27-2009, 11:58 AM
Try simulation steps, with fast moving objects you need to have more steps between frames. knock it up to about three. if that does'nt work go to five and so on. under the simulation tab,

Hope that helps, nice explosion by the way. I'm still trying to get my head around correctly camera mapping, if i could do that right then maybe my stuff would'nt be so bland, lol.

HeadSmell
04-27-2009, 01:31 PM
Thanks tool2heal,

Yea i tried putting it to 5 with same results,

I just notice something very weird though...I have bout 40k particals in my scene, so naturally i have my view display set to only display lower, in this case 10% when i put it back to 100% my sim completely changes

This is in particle flow /Source/emission drop down/ in the Quantity Multiplier i am setting viewport display %, the render is awlay at 100%.

Not really sure why my fume sim is beong affected because of view port display :\

Is this normal?

tool2heal
04-27-2009, 09:51 PM
I realized that too once I forgot that it does that, im not sure if thats a bug or what but it should'nt do that. I would assume your using two fume grids, one for the main explosion and one for the debris? It might be a bug? are you using max 2009 because thats what im running and I have seen that problem before.

HeadSmell
04-28-2009, 03:57 AM
Yea I'm on 2009 with fume 1.2

I believe i deleted the second fume grid the the scene. So is this a bug? at least I'm not he only one running into this.
cheers

tool2heal
04-28-2009, 06:45 AM
hmm, yea i just ran a simple little test to see for myself and viewport display certainly has an effect on fume simulation.

SoLiTuDe
04-28-2009, 07:15 AM
^ It's definetly not a bug, and it makes sense if you think about it. Particle flow is set up so that it doesn't calculate those particles at all until render time... otherwise, what's the point? Still calculate all of those particles, but just not display them? Would be just as slow... Fume will only work with what's currently in the scene. If you want to speed up your pflow, you can try caching it first (unless you're using a fume follow while you emit particles)... preferrably with box3 so you don't eat up a lot of ram.

HeadSmell
04-28-2009, 09:51 AM
Thanks SoliTuDe,
Makes sense looking back at it...

Any ideas on how to make a spawning partial that's plugged into fume have a consistent smoke trail?

mine keeps breaking up into clumps

Cheers

MasterZap
04-28-2009, 11:49 AM
Hello there!

Finding information about getting FumeFX work with Mental Ray is not easy. Maybe you guys can help.

We got a ffx animation of a launching space rocket done that it looks good so far. The scene itself has been rendered with Mental ray and the fume animation has been rendered with scanline. The passes have been comped together.


Nowdays, you could render everything in mental ray! Latest FumeFX supports mental ray!


But we're having trouble with the illumination. The fire should light the surroundings. Scanline can't be used for that (right?). But Mental Ray doesn't offer render elements for fume's illumination.
The thing is, we used a daylight system to illuminate the scene. But the daylight system doesn't work with the same settings when trying to use it with fume. So we need to get the illumination by fume as a separate pass.


If you are using the mental ray rendering of FumeFX, the FumeFX intensity (for fires etc.) will be affected by the Physical Scale. For an outdoor render I would then use approxumately 80000 physical scale to have the proper fire intensity show up.

Then you can use FG in mental ray to let it illuminate the scene.

Just make sure to set the "FG multiplier" to 1.0 and not the default of 5.0 (The default of 5.0 is bad for a physically correct render)

Check out my blog for some fume info (http://mentalraytips.blogspot.com/2009/04/fumefx-for-mental-ray-released.html)



For a short sequence we did this:
First, generate the finalgather map using the daylight and fume as light sources.


But where do you get the fume as illumination if you are not rendering it all in mental ray?


How should we go about getting a daylight illuminated scene additionally illuminated by fume in mental ray?


By rendering only in mental ray, and setting up the physical scale such that the intensities of Fume fire works w. the super high intensity of the physical sky/sun.

/Z

Glacierise
04-28-2009, 11:56 AM
It's great to have MasterZ here too! I really want to go into rendering fume with mr too, buut i still have tried it. How's the render times like with FG? Is it affordable to practically use it in animation?

MasterZap
04-28-2009, 01:22 PM
Quite reasonable render times. As a matter of fact, in some cases I've had mental ray render fumeFX faster than Scanline. But it depends on a lot of things.

/Z

Glacierise
04-28-2009, 01:46 PM
Great, I will try that out as soon as possible :)

harefort
05-05-2009, 03:27 PM
Hey guys!

I recently had a chance to try out the FumeFX demo and I'd love to use it in production.
The thing is that we do have license in the company, but it's bound to a certain computer.

Does anybody know for sure whether floating licenses (as in any PC can use it, but only one at a time) are available and reliable for FumeFX?
There's seems to be very little information about this on the web, even less on the afterworks website.

Thanks a ton!

ddustin
05-05-2009, 03:50 PM
Harefort,

The licensing allows you to install it on 2 machines.

If you plan on Netrendering and use MR you will need to buy MR shader render node Licenses (although I have not been able to find out how to buy them).

We use in in our scenes and have a couple of examples on our site.

Hope this helps,
David

wreath
05-06-2009, 12:15 AM
new stuff (http://www.yeatvfx.com/works/warthog--close--call.html) guys! :beer:

JonathanFreisler
05-06-2009, 12:19 AM
god damn it man! Slow donw to give us a chance heh? lol

There is some weird black alpha/premultiplying thing around the fire and the start of the explosion. But besides that all good.

nice work as always.

wreath
05-06-2009, 12:38 AM
Ha! thanks dude you're right about that but it's a shader issue really need to spent more time on my shaders :buttrock:

grury
05-06-2009, 07:45 AM
Damn nice bang dude!
Apart from that alpha issue, looks pretty awesome.

Did you render with MentalRay?

wreath
05-06-2009, 08:48 AM
Thanks man, all the passes are rendered with scanline, only bridge pass have an additional FR AO pass.

Glacierise
05-06-2009, 08:50 AM
Yigit strikes again, nice work man! Aren't you too busy, I thought you were workin, geez :)

wreath
05-06-2009, 12:28 PM
The project that i'm participating is still on pre production so nowadays i'm just working on RnD stuff dude, working/studying at the same time sux need 50hrs per day :scream:

Glacierise
05-06-2009, 12:59 PM
Keep rockin man, I am now in crunch mode but when that's over with i'm gonna blow some stuff up too :)

Jake0
05-06-2009, 03:13 PM
hey guys
1st, awesome stuff Yigit!

2nd, i'm having some problems rendering out fume with scanline, max is randomly hanging on "calculating illumination map". Pretty simple scene that's being rendered and using 2 spot lights with ab shadow map. Sometimes rebuilding the scene allows it to continue on a little, but after a few frames it'll always end up hanging again.. any one know of a solution to this?

PexElroy
05-07-2009, 06:23 PM
Yigit damn good blast and FumeFX there. As others wrote, the alpha edge of the smoke is the only visible offset. I dig how you had the cones shake a bit from the shock wave. Great shot!

wreath
05-07-2009, 08:54 PM
Jake,Rob thanks guys! :)

JohnnyRandom
05-07-2009, 09:04 PM
Yeah, for o in cool do (Wreath >= bada$$) :D

wreath
05-07-2009, 10:25 PM
Hahah thanks dude, that really motivates! :bounce:

jimmy4d
05-08-2009, 12:56 PM
Holy crap
Yigit .your a machine I have been going to your site alot checking out your stuff.......blows my mind. Very very inspiring to me man.

please please....in what way do to camera match your scene, not everything just a tidbit for me to work from.......and the sound track is sweet also dude........

BAKMS
05-08-2009, 08:18 PM
Does Fumefx 1.2 work with mental ray?
If so, is there a special plugin that you need or it installed when the plugin is install?
If it does come with the Fumefx does it ask which version of 3ds you are running to install?

JohnnyRandom
05-08-2009, 08:27 PM
Yes
Yes it is installed
Yes

BAKMS
05-08-2009, 08:59 PM
Yes
Yes it is installed
Yes

Rats, it is not working.
What is the file name that it uses for mental ray or it is the .dlu file?
Strange things are going on............

JohnnyRandom
05-08-2009, 09:21 PM
I would suggest you reinstall it.

It has always worked right off the bat without issues for me on multiple machines.

wreath
05-08-2009, 09:34 PM
Holy crap
Yigit .your a machine I have been going to your site alot checking out your stuff.......blows my mind. Very very inspiring to me man.

please please....in what way do to camera match your scene, not everything just a tidbit for me to work from.......and the sound track is sweet also dude........

James, i'm using camera projection(camera mapping) for the plates, quite same technique with what shown in here: http://www.cgarchitect.com/resources/tutorials/misc/tutorial2.asp
if you still having problem with your scene, mail me,will try to help ya out.

cheers

jimmy4d
05-09-2009, 12:46 PM
Yigit ..thanks dude......ok I think I'am on the right track. Just want to see how you were doing such a sweet job at it. thanks for helping me, if get stuck i will let ya know............thanks again.

BAKMS
05-10-2009, 10:15 PM
Is there a Demo of FumeFx??

I would like completely try it out before I put down that much money, due to I am home hobbyist and $800 is a lot of money.

I tried a download of it to see if I could get Idea of the program; but is had a virus in it.
I have heard it does work with Mental Ray and I have updated the MR to 3.6.5.1 sp1.

and I tried to run it under Mental Ray and get this error "MSG 0.0 error: Atmospheric "FusionWorks Renderer" is not supported."; does any one know what this error is. I believe this error is related to Mental Ray and FusionWorks Renderer.

I would like to demo the plugin under mental ray to make sure that it works and this error puts a hold on it.

thank you.

seb-desmet
05-11-2009, 09:59 AM
Hi,

I have a question about matte/shadow and fumeFX
I'm trying to do a shadow pass of the fumeFX smoke with the matte/Shadow material
it works fine on the objects but a part of the image is just the alpha and on this part,
the fumeFX smoke is rendered normally with color and alpha

how can I remove the smoke color and alpha from the image to keep only the shadow pass ?


Thanks

-SeB-

seb-desmet
05-11-2009, 11:26 AM
problem fixed

I found the solution in the renders elements

floopyb
05-12-2009, 02:40 AM
Also you could have set the FumFX grid's Primary visibility to off

HeadSmell
05-12-2009, 06:51 AM
Well i finally got to use fume in our production. For generating car dust trails.
critiques welcomed please!

Cheers

http://www.lastpixel.com.au/animation_vfx_altis.html

evanschaible
05-12-2009, 06:51 AM
Headsmell,

It looks very good. The only thing I could say is perhaps a little more rise in the dust trail as the car moves. Other than that I really like it.

- Evan

HeadSmell
05-12-2009, 07:10 AM
lol I actually originally had the car raising all hell tearing up the place..of coarse the client didn't want it...had to scale it down and take it out in some cuts. The smoke shadow pass actually worked really well for small fine dust stirs

pauldublin
05-12-2009, 01:51 PM
Lovely ad Alexander, well done

Ingsoc75
05-14-2009, 03:52 AM
I'm trying to achieve rockets launching like the one in this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtnLYcLv8BE). (btw-it's at 0:42 in the video).

The rockets emit lots of smoke and a little fuel fire, then launch and then the smoke/fuel trail is small.

Can this all be done with one emitter?

floopyb
05-14-2009, 04:48 AM
I'm trying to achieve rockets launching like the one in this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtnLYcLv8BE). (btw-it's at 0:42 in the video).

The rockets emit lots of smoke and a little fuel fire, then launch and then the smoke/fuel trail is small.

Can this all be done with one emitter?

Yeah it should be able to be done easily. You may want a second one for more control though.
If you think about it the rocket has one emitter that does the whole thing, its just that there is ground in the way b4 it takes off.

I did a rocket with one emitter (bit different but you get the idea)
About half way through:
http://www.zerooneanimation.com/projects/downloads/01_spacechimps_showreel_480p.mov

Ingsoc75
05-14-2009, 05:15 AM
If you think about it the rocket has one emitter that does the whole thing, its just that there is ground in the way b4 it takes off.

Ah! I just noticed that after you pointed it out. I will give that a try tomorrow.

Ingsoc75
05-14-2009, 10:44 PM
Ok, two things I'm having issues with in regards to the rocket launches based on the video I linked in yesterday's post.

1. The exhaust/smoke shoots out very fast (in like 3 or 4 frames) before the rocket takes off. Should I set the simple source's direction setting really high to achieve this or is there some other setting that would be better?

2. After the rocket leaves it's tube, the exhaust/smoke trail 'shrinks'. How can I make it smaller?

Ingsoc75
05-14-2009, 10:56 PM
1 - yes, the directional velocity will work
2 - animate the source radius and smoke density. always amazing how little people animate with ffx, and it's so cool

Thanks, I will give it a shot!

Glacierise
05-14-2009, 10:58 PM
1 - yes, the directional velocity will work
2 - animate the source radius and smoke density. always amazing how little people animate with ffx, and it's so cool

Ingsoc75
05-14-2009, 11:30 PM
Thanks Glacierise! That works very well and points me in the direction I want to go! :)

pauldublin
05-15-2009, 09:57 AM
Hi guys,

Wonder cam anyone help with this. I'm trying to download Grant Adam's Betterwind plugin for Max, but when I click the link a page no download starts.
Here's the link I'm using, if anyone can point me to where I'd be able to get this It would be great, thanks:

http://rpmanager.com/plugins/BetterWind.htm

Paul

Ingsoc75
05-15-2009, 01:45 PM
Worked for me Paul. You have to right click and select Save Link As.

Going back to my Katyusha style launcher post I have another question. That question is how to go about making multiple sources to launch one after the other?

I'm no expert on FumeFx but I would imagine that if I duplicate the Grid and source for each rocket exhaust, it will kill my computer. Should I simulate one and create duplicates in post for multiples or is there an easy way in Max?

pauldublin
05-15-2009, 01:51 PM
Ah I see it worked now, sorry about that silly me!

Glacierise
05-15-2009, 02:05 PM
How many laucnhes do you have? If they are a few, you can make a diferent grid for each, simulate it separately. If they are katyusha style, meaning dozens - i'd do that in one big grid and particle source.

Ingsoc75
05-15-2009, 04:39 PM
It's a World War 2 Nebelwerfer 42 mounted on a truck so there are only 10.

Particles eh? I was afraid of that as I'm not very familiar with PFlow or how to integrate it with FumeFx and time is limited.

Edit: I think that sounded naive on my part to say that. If using the particle source is a better way to achieve this then I will have to invest the time. :)

BAKMS
05-15-2009, 06:20 PM
I have a request.

Has anyone used 3ds Max 2009, FumeFx, and Vue 7 together.
Do they all work together in Mental Ray?

LD50
05-15-2009, 07:42 PM
@Ingsoc75
If you just want one grid you can also key the fuel emission of every simple source and they will start one after another.

greetz

Ingsoc75
05-15-2009, 08:36 PM
I have a request.

Has anyone used 3ds Max 2009, FumeFx, and Vue 7 together.
Do they all work together in Mental Ray?

MR and Vue work using xStream (it's a pain though with animations IMO).

I haven't added FumeFx into the mix yet but now that it supports MR, I'm sure it's possible.

LD50- Thanks, I will try that.

Ingsoc75
05-15-2009, 08:55 PM
I think I got it by keyframing the Active attribute of the source from off to on! :)

LD50
05-15-2009, 11:22 PM
so as allways many different ways to go :)

Glacierise
05-16-2009, 12:54 PM
Actually animating the source density is better then the active property, because it allows you to ramp up or down, and also allows you to cut the fuel without cutting the directional velocity for example. But for simpler things the active prop would be good enough :)

Ingsoc75
05-20-2009, 04:50 AM
I just noticed something when using MR and FumeFx together. If you have Ambient Occlusion enabled (like in the A&D shader) and applied to an object that intersects Simulation Area, it will occlude it (is that the right word?). Basically, you will see a dark line where both objects meet each other if your Max Distance is set high.

x-tazy
05-20-2009, 07:31 PM
Yes I would say the MR implementation isn't perfectly right now. You have the same effect if you render with the render elements a light layer. You just see the Grid as solid object... I would say the same here in someway the grid acts for MR as Object. Just Hide the Grid an render in two sequences and let the composeting combine it... Is right now the easiest workaround... or deactivate the AO in the Arch&Design Materials and render out a seperate AO Channel. Should work both fine.

HeadSmell
05-23-2009, 04:05 PM
Hi all,
I just finished making a supper quick animation with PullDownIt (pretty cool phyx simulator) and fume for dust generation. Timing is a little off on the dust, I plan of making a few animations in the new weeks using this method. Critiques welcomed please!

http://vimeo.com/4798463

Glacierise
05-23-2009, 04:15 PM
Great, the first PDI animation here! Nice start dude, you have lots of options from here. I'm gonna join you happy campers next week :P O the fume thing - what I'd do is shoot the fume with particles, then make it collide with the fragments, you'll get nice dynamics ;)

StevieMac
05-24-2009, 08:02 PM
Hi guys I'm not sure if this is the best place to ask but here goes.

I've been asked to make the weather system (Weather.Jpg attached) its got about 8 swirls & I'm starting to get that but I'm having problems getting the movement right. Since the the middle moves to the left & the outsides move to the right & there's swirls all over the place I've got a feeling this is going to take time but I was hoping you guys have an idea.

At the mo I have a simple box/rectangle emitter (portrait) the emitter emits smoke, gravity takes the smoke down, & I've increased the buoyancy & Vorticity to make the swirls. Added to that at both bottom corners of the box i have 2 wind helpers to help push the smoke around & up but I keep getting variations on.

I was thinking of using Fume then Krakatoa through PFlow Fume follow

How would you go about setting this up?

Any ideas?

Thanks

Steve

Glacierise
05-24-2009, 11:57 PM
Can't you do it with multiple vortex spacewarps?

StevieMac
05-25-2009, 07:58 PM
I have a Mov of the finished thing & basically the client wants the same thing. Looking at the Mov its a lot more fluid than just using multiple vortex spacewarps. Maybe if I moved them along? I'll give it a go this week.

Any other ideas guys?
I'll see if I'm aloud to post the vid tomorrow.

Steve

renaissance01
05-26-2009, 03:27 AM
I have a Mov of the finished thing & basically the client wants the same thing. Looking at the Mov its a lot more fluid than just using multiple vortex spacewarps. Maybe if I moved them along? I'll give it a go this week.

Any other ideas guys?
I'll see if I'm aloud to post the vid tomorrow.

Steve

I agree with Glacierise... Using vortex spacewarps would be your best bet. If you could post the reference video of what you're after, it would be alot easier to help :) In addition to spacewarps, you could also use pflow with some find target operators to guide your particles to certain spacewarps and then use fume (possibly also krakatoa) to simulate the flowy 'liquid' look you're after.

MartinRomero
05-26-2009, 03:56 AM
Hey Steve,

PFlow, Fume and Krakatoa seems like the way to go about something like that, you just got to get the motion and swirls right.

Good luck dude,

Martin

JohnnyRandom
05-26-2009, 04:47 AM
Any other ideas guys?
I'll see if I'm aloud to post the vid tomorrow.

Steve

You could certainly try a map based emission, ie build up some simple animated swirl maps and emit from them, they will carry some of the motion, keep birthing throughout (as clouds kinda have a tendency to do, at least change constently) and have a fairly quick dissipation. Haven't tried this specifically but it may work.

Certainly more controllable than that damn bane of my existance vortex :D, it may be your only option though, without a deep particle system.
(BTW I wish Grant Adam would build up a BetterVortex to compliment BetterWind :) that would be the shit! )

JonathanFreisler
05-27-2009, 03:05 AM
Hi guys! Finally finished my latest personnal project I've vbeen working on for the past few months. Well, it's as finished as ill get it due to many factors.

:arteest:

Wanted to do a shot that used fume in other ways than what people are used to seeing (desert explosion, smoke based ect) so i went as far from heat producing effects as i could!

MR for rendering, mainly due to the SSS on the glacier and fume now *works* with MR. Some passes still rendered in vray.

The chunks i hand modeled from an image, then ran them through rayfire (not for fracture, but for the sim). Although now i am curious to what it would look like if i did fracture (i think i tried it but they all exploded or something). Pflow and card splash system for the main splashes.

theres a breakdown afterwards, and can watch the shot on:

Youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b06gq0JMXA) (nice and big HD)

download (http://www.fx-td.com/content/misc/glacier_collapse_web.mov) (26 meg mov, kindly hosted by solitude/Ian)
download (http://www.jonathanfreisler.com/glacier_collapse_web.mov) (26 meg mov, my crappy hosting in Australia)

Thanks boys! and enjoy.

MartinRomero
05-27-2009, 03:13 AM
Good Job Jonatha!

KEEP IT UP

Martin

floopyb
05-27-2009, 03:16 AM
Hey Jonathan, Nice work! Looks awesome!

SoLiTuDe
05-27-2009, 03:18 AM
Great job Jonathan! Going to put it up on my site for you... damn your server is horrible! :D
Edit: http://www.fx-td.com/content/misc/glacier_collapse_web.mov (http://www.fx-td.com/content/misc/glacier_collapse_web.mov) << mirror

JonathanFreisler
05-27-2009, 03:37 AM
Heh thanks Jordan. Hows it going at zero one? we had one of your compositors work for us last week i think for a few days, said you guys have some free time for a bit.

And yeah thanks ian :D I need to get better hosting i know... something not on the other side of the world.

Thanks guys!

HeadSmell
05-27-2009, 03:43 AM
Very cool stuff Jonathan

JonathanFreisler
05-27-2009, 03:47 AM
hhhmm, it looks like the youtube version has done some crazy stuff with the colours/levels. Looks a lot brighter/blown out.

SO wait untill you can download it then for the full viewing experience :P

floopyb
05-27-2009, 04:15 AM
Heh thanks Jordan. Hows it going at zero one? we had one of your compositors work for us last week i think for a few days, said you guys have some free time for a bit.

Yeah, some of us had some free time, but not me! Been doing sooo much fume stuff... need a few more terabytes to fill up with fdx files!

wreath
05-27-2009, 04:16 AM
Sweet shot Jonathan :thumbsup: cool splashes,loved the glacier shader as well.

jigu
05-27-2009, 04:27 AM
hey great shot jonathan! I came to know through your portfolio.. (it's my favorite)

StevieMac
05-27-2009, 09:11 AM
wow nice splashes Jon!! Good job.

Ok I had to put the cloud vid on my blog check it out & see if you get any other ideas!!!

http://smactheblog.blogspot.com/


Cheers guys

Stevie

holycause
05-27-2009, 11:40 AM
hi Stevie.
how are u dude?
Great blog ;)

StevieMac
05-27-2009, 12:40 PM
Hey Ruben hows things mate? I'm doing good got some tough shots to do tho but I love a challenge!
Still love that WIP you got on the ground cracking, you should make a tutorial on it! ;0)

Stevie

jimmy4d
05-27-2009, 01:04 PM
really great shot jonathan:applause: , I dig the breakdown. Nice to see you using mr.

Keep it up mate.

JonathanFreisler
05-27-2009, 01:07 PM
Thanks for all the flowers guys.

Yeah, i'm usually a vray man, but i figured why not. and Vrays SSS isn't even in the same realm as MR. Was an interesting experiment.

I don't want people to watch it on youtube now because it looks horrible and blown out and over saturated on there :S I don't know why it did that.

Ian KINDLY uploaded it on his nice and peopel freindly web space:

http://www.fx-td.com/content/misc/glacier_collapse_web.mov

Soon I should have a nice new reel together and begin the quest for a new job :argh:

TwiiK
05-27-2009, 01:16 PM
Glacier shot looked amazing.

How did you do the dynamic water with the waves and floating ice? :)

JonathanFreisler
05-27-2009, 01:41 PM
The water was (very surprisingly) done using reactor water! It took a while to set up but i was fairly impressed, it did what i needed it too do and acted like my reference footage. You can conform a plane to the reactor water, and it takes on the shape and animates accordingly. I put a slight noise on the Z axis on the water so it bobs around a bit as some secondary animation.

The floating chunks were done in pflow and lock/bonded to the water surface once i painted in the positions of them. They weren't set 100% to the pos and rot of the surface, they needed to bob and lag so they were something like 50% so they wouldn't look so rigid.

The water shader was (in retrospect) simple, had a MR ocean in the bump and a falloff for the reflect and colour.

When i look back on it the method for everything is simple, but theres weeks of fumbling around trying to not have water move too fast, or too reflective, or the floating chunks not act horribly.

AND then a reflective surface bouncing light and generating indirect illumination to/from a GIANT SSS object took too long to render, so i projection mapped the glacier render onto the geo of the glacier, and then rendered out a reflection pass or just the water.

So yeah like anything, its weeks of stuffing around and doing parts on there own, and combining them and going "oh crap....."

Thanks again Ian for hosting it! Im pretty stoked an ex Blur guy and talented FX guy likes it and is willing to help out :argh:

Shogun-3D
05-27-2009, 01:47 PM
Hello. :)

This thread is long a bit, so I couldn't serch whole of it. It'd take too much time.

There's an awful grain in Fume's shadow channel (Final Render). I'm looking for a solution for this problem. Of course rendering of an entire scene gives a pretty nice animation with no grain or flickering, but if the scene is supposed to be rendered separately into channels, in order to be prepared for postproduction, the problem appears.
My solution was extracting alpha channel from shadow channel so far, so this channel's "diffuse", full of mentioned grain, was replaced with pretty clean alpha turned into channel's "diffuse". This is not a perfect method, and it makes much more work in order to get proper result, so I'm looking for any other solution. Besides if there's any fire, there's fire's shadow also included. My method of using shadow's alpha doesn't contain separate channel for colour, so there's also another fun with merging it with colour refined from previous shadow pass.
Besides there's another thing I noticed (hope I'm not wrong): when fire generates smoke, then smoke generated by fire doesn't cause such a grain, in opposite of smoke generated by source itself. I'm not sure about this pattern, It's just sth. i noticed. Fire's shadow doesn't have any grain.
I don't even mention of blurring shadow channel in postproduction, that's not the way, the noise remains, however blurred and less visible.

Any idea?

Thanks a lot for any help. :)

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/2641/problemt.jpg (http://img34.imageshack.us/my.php?image=problemt.jpg)

JohnnyRandom
05-27-2009, 03:49 PM
Hi guys! Finally finished my latest personnal project I've vbeen working on for the past few months. Well, it's as finished as ill get it due to many factors.


Great job man! Very well executed ;) Splashes debris and Fume are top notch:arteest:

HeadSmell
05-27-2009, 04:01 PM
Um...never touched final render but scan line Can give you an expended result, Could be a light source conflict...I have no idea with final render

HeadSmell
05-27-2009, 04:14 PM
I've bin watching ALOT of mythbusters lately...any one else see their high speed cameras a blessing for reference material???

Ingsoc75
05-28-2009, 03:30 PM
Okay, time for a daft question. Do I need to re-simulate if change any settings in the Rendering or Illumination tabs of the FumeFx UI ?

darthmaya
05-28-2009, 04:27 PM
I've bin watching ALOT of mythbusters lately...any one else see their high speed cameras a blessing for reference material???

Yeah I have been watching mythbusters for years. I love that show. If you go to the mythbusters website they have interactive video, so you can frame-by-frame some of there footage.

floopyb
05-28-2009, 04:53 PM
There's an awful grain in Fume's shadow channel (Final Render).
If you dont get the answers you need here i would highly recommend getting on the CG Fluids forum and talking to Rif. He s a master of FumeFX and Final Render (Also he will love that you have chosen that combo!!)
http://cgfluids.mba-studios.com/


Okay, time for a daft question. Do I need to re-simulate if change any settings in the Rendering or Illumination tabs of the FumeFx UI ?

No :)

SoLiTuDe
05-28-2009, 05:21 PM
Okay, time for a daft question. Do I need to re-simulate if change any settings in the Rendering or Illumination tabs of the FumeFx UI ?

Time for another daft question. Did you even try re rendering after changing the settings? :D

HeadSmell
05-28-2009, 05:31 PM
Yeah I have been watching mythbusters for years. I love that show. If you go to the mythbusters website they have interactive video, so you can frame-by-frame some of there footage.

I made a couple of explosions with camera projection and the typical silo in in desert being hit with missile...After watching some high speed footage from the web site i realized I wasted about 5 hours siming 100 frames, as a real explosion carry's on for about 10 frames...oh well live and learn :)

Ingsoc75
05-28-2009, 06:58 PM
Time for another daft question. Did you even try re rendering after changing the settings? :D

Yeah I did but haven't seen any changes with lights added or noise maps added. Probably just a matter of getting the settings right but thought I would ask. :)

JonathanFreisler
05-29-2009, 12:01 AM
"Yeah I did but haven't seen any changes with lights added or noise maps added"

If you add noise maps you probably need to re sim (ie in your sources, or as a fluid mapping).

SoLiTuDe
05-29-2009, 12:43 AM
Yeah I did but haven't seen any changes with lights added or noise maps added. Probably just a matter of getting the settings right but thought I would ask. :)

haha, k... just had to ask. Ya never know! :D Lights you should def. see a change... like johnny said about the noise maps, will have to resim if you didn't save out fluid mapping.

fiveoften
06-01-2009, 11:57 PM
Hey Guys.

For a Upcomming shortfilm of mine, i want to make flak explosion like ww2 Air Defense

My problem is the puff in Fumefx. I make many tests but it dosnt works. Have anyone ideas for solutions or a scene file example?


this is my firsttests its not so good^^

www.bs-media.org/Uploads/laboom.max

Sorry for my bad english ^^

Ben

joey1
06-02-2009, 09:09 PM
I've owned FumeFX for about two weeks now and just when I think I've gotten close to achieving my desired look; I realize I'm not even close. I may have actually run through all 167 pages of this thread looking for a clue (plus countless Google searches) but have mostly learned how to blow things up or create fireballs that WILL blow something up. At the following link is my "dream" flame. It's an ethanol fuel source burning in the bottom of a steel box. The flames are fat and tend to loft into the air, separating from their base. Very pretty blue core.

ecosmart.mov (http://www.billprice.com/ecosmart.mov)

Sadly my best effort to date can be see here. I've got the colors looking somewhat reasonable (more blue needed in the base) and the flames are certainly lofting to the sky but in sort of an evil way. Sharp and far too curly.

ethanol3DSMAX.mov (http://www.billprice.com/ethanol.mov)

Here I'm using a simple source but I've tried all combinations of cylinders, spheres and pyramids so that I could convince the flame to congregate in a higher fashion around the middle of the "fire slot" shown in my reference video.

I'm looking for a way to generate a kinder, fatter RIBBON of flame. Here's my miserable (http://www.billprice.com/ethanol.max) 3dsmax09 project folder. Any hints or direction you can offer this noob would be kindly appreciated. I keep telling myself it can be done. Can't it?

-j

Shogun-3D
06-05-2009, 10:59 AM
I've got max 2009 and your file doesn't work on my comuter. Besides your movie with achieved progress has ben removed, so there's no way to help you. Better show your settings and frame of your animation or entire animation again.

joey1
06-05-2009, 10:56 PM
I just checked all links and they worked very well here in Venice, CA. I'll mine my settings, type them here and post a couple of stills as soon as I'm back on the desktop. After several days of this plea for help languishing at the end of this very long thread it does bring up a question in my mind. Is everyone else on CGTalk having a similar problem or were you all too busy finishing up the fx for Spiderman 12 and Oceans 14 to help a noob out?

Glacierise
06-06-2009, 11:40 PM
You have too much turbulence, and it's scale is too small. You also might wanna emit from something that represents your goal more closely.

fireknght2
06-07-2009, 03:03 PM
I just checked all links and they worked very well here in Venice, CA. I'll mine my settings, type them here and post a couple of stills as soon as I'm back on the desktop. After several days of this plea for help languishing at the end of this very long thread it does bring up a question in my mind. Is everyone else on CGTalk having a similar problem or were you all too busy finishing up the fx for Spiderman 12 and Oceans 14 to help a noob out?

Your reference example .mov works but the sample of your work goes to the quicktime opening blurb and a question mark comes up with the movie not starting.
Regarding your being a noob and not getting a quick response to your dilema, BAD FORM!
Typically the artist here will attempt to recreate your dilema first so they have an informative
response to your question. Based on the FACT that we cannot see your work sample as it does not present itself, I cannot imagine how you can expect any assistance from the experts here.
Now your movie may work in Venice CA on the same machine you created the mov but for the rest of the world we cannot see your work progress sample, and unless I misunderstood your tone (aggressive sarcasm) it would be nice if you were patient and polite especially as a noob.

Fire

JonathanFreisler
06-07-2009, 04:53 PM
I agree with the above comment. I didnt want to really respond after reading you last post.

When i read your first post i download both the .movs and only one file worked (the ecosmart one) so how am i supposed to comment when i cant compare it to yours?

JUST now, i downloaded both of the .movs on a different computer. And still only the ecosmart one works. So how am i supposed to comment when i cant compare it to yours?

Im not going to download the max file becuase i simply dont have time (thats not being rude, but if you had it on youtube or a working mov we could tell you in a matter of seconds). The help from these people on these forums are priceless, help us help you.

Have to get back to spiderman 12....

tasiek
06-07-2009, 08:53 PM
Hi mates!

I've been playing around with FFX and Krakatoa to achieve a ink like effect. Could get some cool effect if emiting from custom animated model for some eye candy ad.

peace!

www.tas3d.com/video/ink.mov (http://www.tas3d.com/video/ink.mov)

http://www.tas3d.com/blog/wp-content/gallery/ink/1.jpg

PsychoSilence
06-07-2009, 10:44 PM
looks great! i like it :)

how many particles did u end up using?

Hordak
06-08-2009, 12:33 AM
Hi mates!

I've been playing around with FFX and Krakatoa to achieve a ink like effect. Could get some cool effect if emiting from custom animated model for some eye candy ad.

peace!

www.tas3d.com/video/ink.mov (http://www.tas3d.com/video/ink.mov)

http://www.tas3d.com/blog/wp-content/gallery/ink/1.jpg


I like it too! Awesome!

tasiek
06-08-2009, 04:40 PM
looks great! i like it :)

how many particles did u end up using?

Roughly 20mil :) Actually I ran out of disk space, so I had to save particles in two turns ;)

olipoli1
06-08-2009, 10:22 PM
SHOGUN 3D: I just read your post and wanted to say that I also had rendering problems with fume and FinalRender. It was wired, I was trying to render out float data from fume (which had other limitations as well) but It seemed to work fine untill I turned on AA or other pixel operations. When AA was on the float output had artifacts in it. Similar to the ones in your shadow. I wrote on the cebas forum and they sad that there is a problem with the exr exporter. After all I couldnt solv it so I gave up on FR and went with scanline.

By the way did you try MBlur on FFx with FR? Because I did and for scenes some It seemed its doing something but than it also showd some unexplainable bugs.

joey1
06-08-2009, 11:55 PM
I'm going on record here to state that I don't think there is a single person on this planet (or forum) currently hard at work on Spiderman 13 or Oceans 14. I sincerely apologize to all of the above posters who took offense at the suggestion. It was bad form to ask if everyone could see my video examples by phrasing the question in such a manner. I now realize that my links were only available to Glacierise in Berlin. I thank him for his advice.

I've reposted my videos to Youtube. If there is anyone not currently insulted by my complete lack of tact I would truly appreciate some further advice on what I'm certain is child's play for most here.

Youtube link for my close but not there FumeFX video. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EIHMr3vqbk)

Youtube link for the ethanol based fire I hope to emulate. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twUXWV-g38I)
Drop.io link to my 3ds MAX 2009 Design file. (http://drop.io/lipydyf/asset/ethanol-max)

fireknght2
06-09-2009, 12:27 AM
I'm going on record here to state that I don't think there is a single person on this planet (or forum) currently hard at work on Spiderman 13 or Oceans 14. I sincerely apologize to all of the above posters who took offense at the suggestion. It was bad form to ask if everyone could see my video examples by phrasing the question in such a manner. I now realize that my links were only available to Glacierise in Berlin. I thank him for his advice.

I've reposted my videos to Youtube. If there is anyone not currently insulted by my complete lack of tact I would truly appreciate some further advice on what I'm certain is child's play for most here.

Youtube link for my close but not there FumeFX video. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EIHMr3vqbk)

Youtube link for the ethanol based fire I hope to emulate. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twUXWV-g38I)
Drop.io link to my 3ds MAX 2009 Design file. (http://drop.io/lipydyf/asset/ethanol-max)

Both of your videos worked real well in You Tube, Thank You.
Near as I can tell without seeing your settings your nearly there. The base color needs to be blue if you want the natural gas flame look and increase your turbulence a touch to speed up the flame flicker. Also try applying the simulation to a cylinder versus a sphere to get that elongated appearance like your reference video.
I'm sure "Master G" probably gave you some really good guidance but I hope I helped in some way.

Fire

JonathanFreisler
06-09-2009, 02:02 AM
Like Glacierise said you have too much turbulance. If you play around wiht the burn rate, and yeah emit it from an object that resembles your footage will help. Having a lower burn rate will have shorter flames. And perhaps animate an intensity map over the emitter.

JonathanFreisler
06-09-2009, 02:44 AM
@ joey1

I made a very quick scene (as in about 10 mins) based on the refrence footage and got a good result for you to look off.

Did you set your scene to scale? Doing a test on a sphere, is going to look different than a test on a plane (about 60cm long) like your ref.

Its only about 60% there but might be a good start to look at and see where to go from there.

JohnnyRandom
06-09-2009, 06:03 PM
Hi mates!

I've been playing around with FFX and Krakatoa to achieve a ink like effect. Could get some cool effect if emiting from custom animated model for some eye candy ad.

peace!

www.tas3d.com/video/ink.mov (http://www.tas3d.com/video/ink.mov)



Nice ink tests :)

Speaking of inks, have you seen Deko's? They are something to push towards, for sure, he did an amazing job! Couple of links to his stuff, check'em out ;)

Frantic Films WIP Gallery (http://www.franticfilms.com/software/support/krakatoa/work_in_progress_gallery.php#SPA)

HD version on Vimeo:
http://vimeo.com/1755557

fireknght2
06-09-2009, 08:58 PM
I went to the site and checked out the gallery, but Holy $#@& the Animation is phenomenal.
If you do anything after checking the gallery you have to see the animation, its fantastic.

Fire

tasiek
06-09-2009, 09:05 PM
Nice ink tests :)

Speaking of inks, have you seen Deko's? They are something to push towards, for sure, he did an amazing job! Couple of links to his stuff, check'em out ;)

Frantic Films WIP Gallery (http://www.franticfilms.com/software/support/krakatoa/work_in_progress_gallery.php#SPA)

HD version on Vimeo:
http://vimeo.com/1755557

Sure I've seen this AD, amazing. It was kind of inspiration for my tests. I'd love to use this effect in similar production.

DeKo-LT
06-09-2009, 10:58 PM
It seems that John deserves another beer :D

Thankful for compliments, if anyone will have questions about some particular settings, feel free to ask.

JohnnyRandom
06-10-2009, 05:09 PM
LOL, your the one that deserves a beer :D a really impressive use of fume and krakatoa.

Shogun-3D
06-10-2009, 06:08 PM
So, now there's one of mine. I made it today. Rendered in Vray.

Link in a frame.

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/8208/torussetinflames.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEuop0Rixsc)

DeKo-LT
06-10-2009, 10:24 PM
Grzegorz, swietna sprawa :thumbsup:

Did you use native 3dsmax wind with turbulence?
What simulation time you have for such detail?

tasiek
06-10-2009, 11:20 PM
DeKo-LT : I actually have a question about your recent production. In my last tests with ink, I also tried achieving this result

http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-video-4529091-colored-ink-series-of-four.php

Got any hints, on getting this shape in FFX ? There is a lot of voxels in use, long dissipation

Shogun 3D: Siema, I think that trying to get the most realistic fire movement/look on blank background is no sense. No matter how great shape and shader you get on sphere, with reallife footage it wont work. Wind, lighting, scale.... Though, yours look really good and highres.

DeKo-LT
06-11-2009, 12:29 AM
tasiek,
heh, I was too having problem with natural shapes, lucky, that was needed only in one shot (colourful fluids was simply emited from animated geometry shapes).
I uploaded a file if that helps:
download (http://www.deko.lt/tmp/Forums/juodulys06_stop03_krakatoa_send.zip)

But I warn you, that was my first fume project, so don't learn from it :)

Shogun-3D
06-11-2009, 04:38 AM
DeKo-LT, tasiek, thanks a lot. :)
In fact I've never used any wind in this scene. I 've been basing on x dimension turbulence only. This scene was made during visit of my friend yesterday. I intended to show her some Fume effect. I liked flame i got that time, so i increased detail and set simmulation. Simmulation, as well as rendering have taken about 30 - 40s per frame, excluding the first frames, which've taken less time naturally.

Tasiek, I know that one thing is a simmulation of raw fire without any context, and another thing is a fire fitting well with scale and behavour to scene.

Steve Green
06-11-2009, 10:39 AM
Hi,

I'm trying to do something fairly simple (just a logo dissolve)

I'm using an object source and ramping up the turbulence/vorticity and taking down the drag.

However I'm still getting a problem where the logo is taking several frames to become dense enough to show up, and by that time it is already starting to disperse.

Any ideas how I can get it to keep the logo solid for a few frames, and then disperse?

Seems like it should be obvious, but I must be missing something...

Thanks,

Steve

Glacierise
06-11-2009, 11:05 AM
Do you have your source on add instead of set?