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default-rol
04-14-2007, 09:58 AM
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/918/anatomyforumheadercafe0xg6.jpg


CAFÉ 002

"The Grotesque"

“What is the meaning of these strange savage lions and monsters? To what purpose are here placed these creatures, half beast, half man? I see several bodies with one head and several heads with one body. Here is a quadruped with a serpent's head, there a fish with a quadruped's head, then again an animal half horse, half goat ... ”

St. Bernard of Clairvaux (1090-1153)


Using the above passage as your starting point, design your own Grotesque. It can be a piece of sculpture, living tissue, or anything else you can think of – Just make it horrifying! (but tasteful.)


Definition from Wikipedia of Grotesque - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grotesque

Grotesque - When commonly used in conversation, grotesque means strange, fantastic, ugly or bizarre, and thus is often used to describe weird shapes and distorted forms such as Halloween (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween) masks or gargoyles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gargoyle) on churches. More specifically, the grotesque forms on Gothic buildings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothic_architecture), when not used as drainspouts, should not be called gargoyles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gargoyle), but rather referred to simply as grotesques, or chimeras (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_%28mythology%29).




CHARACTER-A-FORTNIGHT EVENT (CAFÉ)

Manifesto: The anatomy forum CAFÉ - a place to meet, share your concepts, ideas and work for the set brief, and then discuss them with like minded individuals (Bring your own coffee though...)


The purpose of this ongoing workshop series is to develop original character artwork in both 2D and 3D. A theme or brief will be given at the inception point of the workshop, and the project will be executed by the participants during a 2 week period. To have your own idea from the set brief, develop it in 2 dimensions and then execute it in 3 dimensions is very challenging, (especially within the time period,) and helps the artist to understand form “in the round.”

If you are thinking of taking your ideas into 3 dimensions, please decide on a suitable polygon budget (for games/TV/film or as much as your computer can handle!) If you are unsure, please enquire on the workshop and others will try and help. The workshop is application independent, and so anyone can try it. For those of you who would like to try 3d but do not have a package, blender (http://www.blender3d.org/ (http://www.blender3d.org/cms/Home.2.0.html) ) is a very high standard open source 3d application that is free to download and use. However, this will take time to learn.

Duration of projects: 2 Weeks.

Breakdown: (guidelines only – depends on the complexity of the idea and model.)

Concept development and realization - 1 week.*

Model development and texture art - 1 week.*

* You can split up your time however you wish - to reflect the area that you want to work in the most, for example.

The above guidelines are intensive and will require a lot of work. Please look at the amount of time you have available for each project before trying to take on too much. Quality artwork and developing your creative problem solving skills are key here, along with learning how others handled the same brief in conceptual and technical terms.

DELIVERABLES:

These are guidelines only. You can do all the sections or just choose the areas you feel most comfortable with. If you wish to use another persons concept art for a model, then please seek permission to do so from the user. If you just want to create the concept art and don’t mind others using your art work for a fully realized character, please state so in your post. If you are having trouble with an area, please shout up and others will try to help out as best they can.

WIP is encouraged, and please help others by providing your thoughts on their solutions in a positive manner. Discouragement of others will not help anyone as we are all here to get better, and people bring different skills to the table.

1. Concept art >>>




Ideas
Final presentation art (full body character pose, head and image plane orthographics.)
2. Model >>> (high poly cinematic or lower poly real time games character)


Base model (untextured)
Final model (with textures)
Learning outcomes:


How to develop ideas and a final character from a written brief.
Creative problem solving.
How to demonstrate your ideas to others.
Taking 2d artwork in to 3d artwork.
Texture art.
Visual communication skills.
RULES FOR THE WORKSHOP:

1. Work created here MUST be ORIGINAL TO THE CREATOR and for the purpose of serious study of character art and design. Those who post silly or off topic work will have their posts deleted immediately and will no longer be allowed to post on this thread. Rebecca Kimmel reserves the right to determine which pieces are considered to be in poor taste and / or disrespectful in the workshop.

2. This Workshop will run in 2 WEEK slots.

3. There is NO LIMIT to the NUMBER of posts an artist may make. However, we ask that you post only work which you feel best represents your ideas and important design points you feel others should know about during your character development, even if it is considered unfinished.

4. Artists who post comments and critiques of other artists' work on this thread must be RESPECTFUL, POLITE, and offer CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM. Flaming will be NOT be tolerated, and constitutes dismissal from this and other threads.

5. Mike/default.rol and Rebecca Kimmel will be offering the occasional comments / critique ~ however, the main focus of the Workshop should be on Group Critique and interaction.

6. ANY MEDIUM or STYLE may be used: Traditional or Digital Drawing or Painting, Sculpture, or 3D Model / Render for the initial stages. Development beyond the initial character idea (stage 2) should be done in a 3D application of your choice.

7. Please limit the SIZE of your POSTS to 800 pixels WIDTH x Appropriate pixel LENGTH. No huge posts, please! (you are welcome to offer remote links to high resolution versions of your art work along side images that are of an appropriate size, if you so wish.)

8. Have fun, enjoy, and create great art!

default-rol
04-14-2007, 10:00 AM
For those of you slightly confused by the terminology, a fortnight is 14 nights in duration. Here is a definition of it from Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortnight

A fortnight is a unit of time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time) equal to two weeks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Week): that is 14 days (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1_E6_s), or literally 14 nights. The term is common in the British Isles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Isles) and many Commonwealth countries (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commonwealth_of_Nations), but rarely used in the United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States). It derives from the Old English (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_English_language) feowertiene niht, meaning "fourteen nights".


:RESERVED FOR USEFUL LINKS:

Igor Sandman has posted this great link to all of Loomis' books, if you haven't got them then NOW is your chance! >>> http://acid.noobgrinder.com/Loomis/

Rist
04-14-2007, 10:32 AM
Oh my it would be blasphamy to deny participation in this one! i will contribute as much as possible, even complete this one if I can!

I will try to make something very disgusting without breaking forum rules :twisted:

Rebeccak
04-14-2007, 12:30 PM
I'm looking forward to seeing the creative concepts that come out of this one. Good luck everyone! :)

default-rol
04-14-2007, 12:54 PM
I'm looking forward to seeing the creative concepts that come out of this one. Good luck everyone! :)

Thanks for the continued support of this series Rebecca - and for the opportunity to run it. :)

Morning all,

Here is my initial breakdown of the brief, as I see it. Done in around 50 minutes while listening to The Aphex Twin.

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/2467/mindmapfx7.jpg


Initially, I decided on a location for my "Grotesque." I have decided on a Town Square. I also made the decision that my piece would be a sculpture, in keeping with the original meaning of grotesques in the quote.

When breaking down the brief, I decided to update it and make a grotesque for the modern age. With this in mind, I chose a reason for the sculpture to be in existance - Namely, the square is in a dormitary town for a local genetic engineering plant. (1.)

I wanted the sculpture to be something that we, as humans, could relate to - but fear (2.), (reflecting my psychological response to genetic engineering, I think.) I then looked at the positive reasons for genetic engineering and chose the metaphor of "flight" to best encompass man's aspirations, (3.)

Finally, I took all of that into account, but added my negative feelings towards it - (and the fact that this thing is supposed to be a "grotesque") - and locked on to the scavanger mentality of genetic research as a means for making money, (and not so much making human life enriched.) I decided on animals that best reflected these thoughts, a Vulture and a Jackal (4.), added it to the human being itself, and Voila! - I've got my idea!

I hope that helps people a little bit, by understanding the reason behind my choice of creatures for my grotesque. Next I will move on to composition for the sculpture itself.

Cheers all

MIKE :)

Rist
04-14-2007, 03:03 PM
For this one I thought of the most grotesque thing to me without breaking rules, and I think I have something brewing. Here is a quick sketch I made to generate creativity:

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/1500/shiterbeastqa0.jpg

default-rol
04-14-2007, 04:45 PM
For this one I thought of the most grotesque thing to me without breaking rules, and I think I have something brewing. Here is a quick sketch I made to generate creativity:

Perhaps I should have wrote: "Just make it disgusting... but tasteful." ;) You're sailing a bit close to "the pan" with that one mate.

Channel that creative energy into something more "grotesque" in the sense I wrote in the brief, and less "Mr. Hanky," would be my advice. :thumbsup:

Cheers

MIKE :)

Rist
04-14-2007, 05:20 PM
I will re-read the brief and see what others come up with.

Update: I have read the passage again, it was fun to sketch the poop monster though :scream:

So you want some kind of creature that has abnormal features, such as two children with one body, a cat and a dog stuck together (Catdog, the cartoon I recall), or possibly the Hydra from hercules, the one that doubles its head when the head has been chopped off.

BUK
04-14-2007, 06:42 PM
I have always loved creature creation. These were concieved in the late 70's and I am just now beginning to re-visit them. I would appreciate any crits. I tend to gravitate toward more "real" anatomy, in the sense that the form should follow function, but I will break my own rules. That's why I need crit and community. I just wish I had the time. I am looking forward to watching this thread.

I hope I got the spirit of the forum. I don't post much.

I've got a couple more too.

BUK
04-14-2007, 06:44 PM
And this one. Thanks

SylvanMist
04-14-2007, 08:12 PM
Ou I'm definetly going to participate in this one! Although I don't care for really ugly/nasty looking creatures..but I'll do my best :) This can become another monster for my game.

@Fl3wk: the shiter beast..lmao..that's really funny!

Rist
04-14-2007, 08:21 PM
Ou I'm definetly going to participate in this one! Although I don't care for really ugly/nasty looking creatures..but I'll do my best :) This can become another monster for my game.

@Fl3wk: the shiter beast..lmao..that's really funny!

Its meant to be grotesque! ...and funny :twisted:

The above sketch is a 'what not to do' in this workshop :D

Rist
04-14-2007, 08:43 PM
Here is my idea, Owlman! He has no connections to the superhero in comics, I promise! I chose the silhuette on the right.

http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/6301/owlmaner6.jpg

default-rol
04-14-2007, 08:44 PM
Its meant to be grotesque! ...and funny :twisted:

The above sketch is a 'what not to do' in this workshop :D

@ Fl3wk >>> You may have missed this in the initial section, but below please find a definition of "a grotesque" from wikipedia.

Definition from Wikipedia of Grotesque - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grotesque

Grotesque - When commonly used in conversation, grotesque means strange, fantastic, ugly or bizarre, and thus is often used to describe weird shapes and distorted forms such as Halloween (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween) masks or gargoyles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gargoyle) on churches. More specifically, the grotesque forms on Gothic buildings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothic_architecture), when not used as drainspouts, should not be called gargoyles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gargoyle), but rather referred to simply as grotesques, or chimeras (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_%28mythology%29).

While I accept that the brief could be used in the way you have used it, I don't really want this thread to be locked up for "explicit and horrific content" in the bodily function sense of the word, as that would be no use to anyone. I think you get my drift. ;) If you got the thread locked up for producing something so disturbing, evil and frightening that it will stop my old mothers heart upon viewing it, then my hat's off to you! :scream:

@ BUK >>> Great to see you are posting work. Looking forward to seeing the stuff you produce from the brief. :thumbsup:

@ Roja >>> I look forward to seeing what you produce. :)

good energy everyone.

Cheers
MIKE

anwa
04-14-2007, 09:03 PM
Fl3wk, i think we need to submit something similar to the first picture in the following link, its pretty gross so don't blame me if you throw up over your keyboard and monitor and anythig else thats in front of you.
http://mymultiplesclerosis.co.uk/stranger-than-fiction/isabelledinoire.html

AlbertoPadierna
04-14-2007, 09:16 PM
Ok, I´m gonna give a try at this, here´s a fast sketch of what I´m thinking about doing for this contest


http://img403.imageshack.us/my.php?image=creaturewith1000mouthsou5.jpg

Rist
04-14-2007, 09:51 PM
Fl3wk, i think we need to submit something similar to the first picture in the following link, its pretty gross so don't blame me if you throw up over your keyboard and monitor and anythig else thats in front of you.
http://mymultiplesclerosis.co.uk/stranger-than-fiction/isabelledinoire.html

That has actually inspired me on my current creation. I may add the teeth atleast.

Here is an update:

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/1904/owlman1tb1.jpg

default-rol
04-14-2007, 10:26 PM
Alright everyone,

Here is my update for tonight, and my workflow that got me to this stage.

I'm using Andrew Loomis' method of informal composition to generate a pose for my grotesque statue. Here are the initial thumbnails I designed using his method.

http://img481.imageshack.us/img481/5354/informalcompositionbx3.jpg


The red border denotes the composition that I took forward. (In truth, I took 5 of these forward in all, but don't want to bore anyone with all of my choices :scream: .)

From the composition I built this figurative comp >>>

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/3738/poseroughpi0.jpg


*The generic figure is a place holder for my final design. I am not working on character design at this stage, only the composition for the final sculpture I want to create, (hopefully in ZBrush.)

In the comp, the branch represents the top of the tree of wisdom, with my grotesque pointing at the stars with wings about to take flight. (See my initial brief breakdown on page 1 to understand why that is, if you are so inclined.)

A Bit abstract to understand how I got my character composition? Well here is a .gif of how I "saw" a figure sculpture in a bunch of Loomis' lines. If you haven't guessed, I totally love Loomis, and his methods were magic! :thumbsup:

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/8256/chosencompworkflowdq7.gif


Hope that explains how I have come to my figure pose. I did do more poses, and would like to really explore the potential of my informal compositions, but time is not on our side in these 2 week workshops, so I have decided to move on.

Cheers - I will try to leave comment on specific works tomorrow.
MIKE :)

eldee
04-14-2007, 11:16 PM
Where can one read more about these Loomis compositions? Interesting technique, I've never seen it before and a google search yielded nothing.

hermine
04-14-2007, 11:36 PM
Ok, I´m gonna give a try at this, here´s a fast sketch of what I´m thinking about doing for this contest


http://img403.imageshack.us/my.php?image=creaturewith1000mouthsou5.jpg
nice sketch, i thought about something like this too, heads coming out of other heads:)

SylvanMist
04-15-2007, 02:08 AM
Captain Spectra that's a really nice sketch!


I decided to do a mythological creature, the Cockatrice (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cockatrice)

I did a quick sketch today:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/fflewddar/cockatrice1.jpg

Next I'll make a nicer drawing in a better pose probably..and that's a good idea default-rol, I think I'll reference those loomis compisition diagrams too!

Intervain
04-15-2007, 02:42 AM
default-rol - OMG so much thinking goes into this! I feel stupid not doing that :eek:

....

I'm impressed by the planning and methodology everyone's employing in those workshops - keep it up!

igorsandman
04-15-2007, 07:46 AM
Where can one read more about these Loomis compositions? Interesting technique, I've never seen it before and a google search yielded nothing.
http://acid.noobgrinder.com/Loomis/
I don't know which book it is though. I've got all of them but I'm too lazy to read them. One day I'll find the strength, promise :)
-IS-

eldee
04-15-2007, 07:58 AM
Yeah, I've got all of the Loomis books that I know about, and don't remember seeing anything about informal composition in any of them. Thought maybe there was a book I didn't have.

default-rol
04-15-2007, 08:29 AM
Good morning all,

@ Captain Spectra >>> Awesome start - I love the volumes on this grotesque. Care to elaborate on how you came by the idea? Even just a line or so, for those of us less skilled than yourself. :D Cheers.

@ Fl3wk >>> Owlman has the potential to become a really good grotesque. How do you plan on refining it? Where are you going to next with the design?

@ eldee >>> Look in Loomis' book "Creative illustration" on pages 36 - 39 under his first chapter - "Line." Igor Sandman has posted up links to his books as downloads if anyone is intrested in the technique I used.

@ Roja >>> Love that cockatrice! Are you planning on detailing it and then painting it up? Good stuff so far.

@ Igor Sandman >>> Thanks for putting up this link. I've copied it to the relevant links section at the top of the thread.

@ Intervain >>> You don't have to do it, It's just the way I work. I need a reason for something to be, a narrative if you were. I can't "just make something up" without knowing why. My personal feeling is that designs are usually stronger when they have purpose sat firmly behind them, prodding them into being... :D

Thanks everyone - this workshop has got off to a really strong start. Keep it up, and we can all look forward to being thrilled and scared in equal measure. :thumbsup:

Cheers all

MIKE :)

Rist
04-15-2007, 09:45 AM
defualt-rol: Thanks. This one is just a thumbnail, next I am thinking of doing a sketch and gradually build up the details that will make this creaures character, in side/front/back view. I will then wash it with colour on a few copies and see what colour scheme works. The composition will be planned out for the three-quarters view, and then the colours will be shared out and the lighting will be decided. As for the refining process, I am very new to this stage, I am thinking of the building-up process where I build up semi-transparent colours.

I do not have that book on my computer. Is it possible you could explain that process briefly? Looks interesting, I hope it works for you.

Update with backview:

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/2553/owlman2zm6.jpg

default-rol
04-15-2007, 11:02 AM
Here you go Fl3wk, a quick explination >>>

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/7123/loomisinformalus6.gif



STEP 1 >>> Get a ratio for your composition and stick to it. This is really important as you can't just work in different size frames and expect your results to fit together, time and time again.

STEP 2 >>> Draw your first line. Horizontal or vertical makes no difference. But just remember that your first line is actually your 5th. What that means is that your "first line" sits in relation to your frame of 4 lines that you have established. This makes it your 5th line really.

STEP 3 >>> Draw your dynamic diagonal line from 1 extreme corner of the compositional frame to the other. This could have been put in either direction and is your choice entirely. (STEP 3a.)

STEP 4 >>> Draw a horizontal or vertical line through the intersection of your two lines within the frame. you have now subdivided the frame in an informal way. (formal would mean you put your initial horizontal or vertical line in either the halfway point, at the quarter mark, or third of a way through your frame.)

STEP 5 >>> Sub divide your resulting boxes with another diagonal - this could have gone in numerous places, but it has to go from corner to corner within a box in the frame.

STEP 6 >>> Sub divide at an intersecting point again, with either a horizontal or vertical line. This makes more boxes again.

STEP 7 >>> Repeat the drawing of a diagonal within the new boxes.

STEP 8 >>> Keep going in this fashion, breaking up the space with diagonals to the corner of boxes, then laying in a horizontal or vertical at an intersecting point, until you have come to a satisfactory break up of space.

This is Loomis' informal sub division technique as I understand it. I hope you find it a useful addition to your composition armoury. He loved it, and relied upon it to come up with ideas that were interesting and fresh. Download the books that Igor Sandman has posted up in that link if you want to know more about this great illustrators working methods! It's all there in his books!! :thumbsup:

Cheers
MIKE :)

Rist
04-15-2007, 11:19 AM
default-rol: Thanks very much! I have tools or enviroments but never for characters. I will check the books out and see about mastering the technique that you have shown.

Here is a minor update. I just added a quick skeletal structure to the first plate. This tells me if this creature is good enough and well balanced to be an organic being. I will be adding skeletons to the last two too:

http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/6172/owlman3jk8.jpg

Rist
04-15-2007, 01:14 PM
Cleaned the front plate up slightly.

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/715/owlman1gz6.jpg

default-rol
04-15-2007, 02:37 PM
default-rol: Thanks very much! I have tools or enviroments but never for characters. I will check the books out and see about mastering the technique that you have shown.

Glad my Loomis tutorial was of use to you. Loomis used this technique for both environments and character, (as well as a combination of the two - which is a major bonus of this illustration technique.)

I'm roughly paraphrasing what he said, but in "Creative Illustration" he basically says that if you've got an idea but not worked out how to communicate it then this method can suggest arrangements that you probably wouldn't have thought of. And if you don't have an idea then this method can possibly get you started. He also discusses lots of other important things to consider, beyond the 2D graphic break up of space, in that book. It's one of the most important books in my collection, and I don't say that lightly - my book collection is HUGE!! LOL.

Cheers
MIKE :)

SpiritDreamer
04-15-2007, 04:16 PM
Apr 15, 2007

Starting my concept with a poem:

Notions and Potions
Fill the mind's Oceans
Creating the Darkness that surrounds us

I find that creating a little poem about the concept is a great way to stimulate the imagination into seeing a vision.

Glenn


http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE.jpg


http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_1.jpg

Mu
04-15-2007, 04:51 PM
so much cool work by everyone again...

I am taking part in the animation challenge atm, so I won't be joining in on this part, but I will enjoy following your progress, everyone.

:thumbsup:

default-rol
04-15-2007, 07:14 PM
@ Fl3wk >>> Good progress. Nice to see you thinking about the skeleton of your creature. Now you really can, "flesh it out." :thumbsup:

@ SpiritDreamer >>> Great stuff! Working from a poem is not something I've ever done before I don't think. I used a couple of haiku once in a project at University, but they just passed my lecturers by I'm afraid... I'm really looking forward to seeing this develop as you always manage to create something unique. Keep going. :thumbsup:

@ MU >>> Abandon us then, why don't you?! LOL, (I'm not really bitter - honest.) good luck with your animation challenge and keep stopping by, crits are always useful to those working on the project.

Anyway, here is my first thought on the character I've got in mind >>>

http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/2451/initialconcept01cx9.jpg


He's a bit fuzzy at the moment - something I'll need to address in my development. I'll try to establish overall proportions etc now, and then come back and tune him/it in I think.

Cheers all
MIKE :)

nochuss
04-15-2007, 07:52 PM
here is my quick concept sketch numero uno, I like this quote and the brain is bursting with images

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=112151&stc=1


default-rol. nice breakdowns

Roja.do more on your image its a good start

added image two refining of this chimera

Redwolf
04-15-2007, 08:17 PM
This is an intresting thread, Hopefully I can find some time to participate. Looking foward to all the great work.

Default - Rol - Intresting approach, you listen to twin when you draw as well? Howbout square and vsnares? :thumbsup:

Rebeccak
04-15-2007, 08:32 PM
Hi guys,

Nice to see all the work rolling in - keep it coming! :)

Just a reminder to subscribe to / bookmark this thread since the front page plug will probably disappear shortly.

default-rol
04-15-2007, 08:35 PM
Default - Rol - Intresting approach, you listen to twin when you draw as well? Howbout square and vsnares? :thumbsup:

You are asking an interesting question about music, and how it subliminally shows up in your drawing work, eh? Good question!

I do listen to Squarepusher, I also listen to Susumu Yakota, Mileece, Murcof, The Prodigy... but I try to keep it in the "mood" of the work I'm trying to produce when listening while drawing. I've also got a lot of film soundtracks, anime OST's, aswell as a couple of game OST's, (ICO's being my favourite for general listening.) I first started listening to music while drawing only last year, after watching the gnomon DVD series of Iain McCaig. He said that listening to soundtracks were VITAL to the creative process. I tried it on his advice, agreed with him, and have done it ever since. :scream:

After reading that John Singer Sargent did this too - and infact used to play when he was either stuck in a rut, was in a moment of thought, or at a major point in a piece of work - I reckon that the best can't be wrong. :thumbsup:

Anyway, I'm off to put my i-pod back on....

Cheers - I look forward to seeing what work you produce, while "under the influence" too. :scream:
MIKE

<<< UPDATE >>>

Some more ideas, just for fun. I'm still happier with the feel of the earlier one, but it's good to explore.

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/3008/initialconcept02fd2.jpg


Cheers
MIKE :)

SylvanMist
04-16-2007, 01:54 AM
SpiritDreamer-I like how that monster head is shaping out, looks cool!

Default-those last sketches you posted look really nice, I really like that style of drawing..and they're all cool ideas I think :)

I did a nicer drawing of the Cockatrice that I'm pretty happy with. Next step=coloring!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/fflewddar/cockatrice_drawingfinal-sma.jpg

kary
04-16-2007, 06:19 AM
Well even listening to Fear Factory and Napalm Death didn't push me to something satisfactorily grotesque ;). I'll have to step it back to Aphex Twin and Boards of Canada to see it that helps it click.

http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/concept.thumbnail.jpg (http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/concept.jpg)

I was thinking of a statue come to life -- a simple hero facing off against a pair of statues enscrolled by a wizard type thing, pretty Frazetta inspired. I got interested in the above body type from a painting (http://www.tarzan.org/art/ffeb15.jpg) of his. It's getting dangerously close to a Blizzard style Naga, and (even if it is a man/serpent/fish hybrid) it isn't what I originally wanted when thinking grotesque... So most likely back to square one tomorrow unless something clicks in the night.

Nice start all round, Roja's cockatrice, Mike's sketches... this should be a really fun one to follow, exactly the kind of topic that can bring out the ... ?best? in people ;). I'll be pushing hard to get this one done, a bit of a better timeframe then the last one and a topic that is easier for me to get lost in :)

igorsandman
04-16-2007, 08:15 AM
Mike, what McCaig didn't mentioned is that listening to music doesn't make your drawing skills improve. Now that sucks! :sad:
I'm listening to all those music you mentioned, by the way.And Ico is also one listen to on a regular basis (as well as Shadow of the Colossus).
Sorry for beeing off topic. I'm working on a Salvatore-Name-of-the-Rose-type grotesque character, but I still haven't got anything worth showing. For now my sketches are... grotesque.:shrug:
Take care.
-IS-

default-rol
04-16-2007, 09:24 AM
Good Morning all,

@ Roja >>> Thanks for the compliment. :) Your cockatrice is really coming along now, and the volumes of it seem to hold together really well. I've seen them before and I know that they always do seem to have rather small wings for their body size/mass. Have you considered trying to alter the convention by putting larger wings on it and seeing how it looks? Even a "quick and dirty" cut and paste job in photoshop, just to see if larger wings make your cockatrice even better than it already is? Good stuff anyway, can't wait to see the colouring stage. :thumbsup:

@ kary >>> Boards of Canada eh? Another good band I've got a couple of albums of. (I also forgot to say I like Royksopp in my musical paragraph above - even been to see them live.) B of C may produce interesting results, try it and post up your results here!

@ Igor Sandman >>> Another great thing that McCaig says is, "Show everyone your work, no matter how bad you think it is, 'coz everyone has got many thousands of bad sketches in them. Show (what you think is your bad work) with glee, knowing that your great stuff is right on the other side..." I loved that quote and, like everyone else here, we all do really, REALLY bad sketches too! I hope that paraphrased quote empowers you to post your work up here, it did to me. :)

On the SOTC note, I'm going to get the soundtrack today. The game was excellent, like ICO, although the last few "Colossi" proved to be real pain in the a**es. Me and Liang, my girlfriend, fought for many hours... (both in the game, and outside the game - telling each other what we should have been doing to defeat them, LOL.) I will listen to the soundtrack as I create today. Well inspired! :thumbsup:

Cheers all
MIKE

michael-olszak
04-16-2007, 10:01 AM
Cool stuff here so far. I'm in on this one for sure guys. :)

igorsandman
04-16-2007, 10:44 AM
OK Mike, you won. :)

http://www.igorsandman.net/sketch/grotesque.jpg

I worked a bit on it so I'm more satisfied now. I did it while listening to SotC OST :p
Bye.
-IS-

Minor Edit: added the gesture study and a little story telling :p

Rist
04-16-2007, 11:08 AM
I have done my first 3/4 view sketch. This is not the final look, I will be changing things I dislike.

http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/680/owlman2pv5.jpg

Nekomouse
04-16-2007, 12:31 PM
Hello Everyone,

First of all let me just say how grateful I am for something like this online workshop. I am sure that it is going to be a great learning experience.

After messing around a little while, I have decided to paint a kappa. A kappa is a creature from Japanese folklore. He looks like a child carrying a turtle's shell and he has a shallow hollow on the top of his head which holds water. A kappa is incredibly strong, but if you can knock the water out of his head, then you can catch the kappa. Child here in Japan are warned to stay away from the river and lakes in case the kappa might catch them and drag them into the water to drown.

I find the image of a kappa cute and horrible at the same time. All wet and slimey, but still innocent eyes like a child. Anyway, I will paint more tomorrow.

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/9742/kappasr4.jpg

default-rol
04-16-2007, 01:13 PM
Hey all,

@ michael-olszak >>> Great to see you back for round 2! Looking forward to seeing your work for this one.

@ Igor Sandman >>> Hey man, that's looking nice and frightening. I wouldn't be ashamed of those drawing skills at all. Oh, by the way I got the SOTC OST aswell now, and I intend to use it! :buttrock:

@ Fl3wk >>> That's coming along nicely. You've really pushed forward with this 2nd event at a frightening pace, (If you'll pardon the intnded pun.) How far are you intending on taking it? I also have a few suggestions, if you would like me to post them up for you? Keep going, it's looking good so far. :thumbsup:

@ Nekomouse >>> Hello and Welcome! I always have a soft spot for native God's and folklore, (we've got lots here too in the U.K, that go back before Christianity came to these shores.) I've never heard of a Kappa until today, but your explination really does sound disturbing!

(for those that have never heard of this creature, here is a link to it's origins on Wikipedia >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kappa_(folklore) .)

I look forward to seeing your interpretation of this fantastically scary creature! :thumbsup: Good luck, and hope to see updates soon.

Cheers
MIKE

Rist
04-16-2007, 01:18 PM
default-rol: I have more time on my hands right now and this seems to be the right place to let rip the creative drive. As for how far, I am thinking of doing detail close ups of the important features of the creature to really get to know it, then possible go for a final render. As for when that happens, I want to do a few more 3/4 sketches to see if I can comes with a better style (which I think I can). The rendering style I hope to capture is the loose strokes technique, as I get bored quickly with the smooth renders.

I don't mind suggestions, I thrive off comments, thats how I improve.

Djampa
04-16-2007, 04:25 PM
I have always loved creature creation. These were concieved in the late 70's and I am just now beginning to re-visit them. I would appreciate any crits. I tend to gravitate toward more "real" anatomy, in the sense that the form should follow function, but I will break my own rules. That's why I need crit and community. I just wish I had the time. I am looking forward to watching this thread.

I hope I got the spirit of the forum. I don't post much.

I've got a couple more too.

Your artwork is awesome ! Keep on this thread ! Can't wait to see what's gonna come out here.

Default-rol: Congratulations on the Café 002, it's going nice, I'm doing some studies and sketches now, more time to go here now :)
Thanks for sharing the Loomis composition method, it's seems very interesting and effective.
Your last sketches are really interesting, I think they are more 'grotesque' in some aspects, since you start to add some human anatomy into it and begin to break some rules of it, then you start to get some empathy with the concept and create a 'grotesque' feeling. I like to see the first sketches like these last two heads, more you explore the subject more you artwork grows.
Let's go ! :)

default-rol
04-16-2007, 06:11 PM
Hey everyone,

I've reluctantly had to not pursue my initial idea as there was too much fur.... so....

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/6457/imageplanesideqz4.jpg


My side image plane for my character, photo for now, I'll scan when I've done the front... front coming soon. I worked the anatomy as it is an anatomy forum after all.... :scream:

Cheers
MIKE

Rebeccak
04-16-2007, 06:29 PM
Hi guys,

Just another quick reminder to subscribe to / bookmark this thread. This (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=3699942&postcount=1) post shows you how to subscribe if you're not already aware.

Cheers :)

Rist
04-16-2007, 08:11 PM
Just another quick sketch.

http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/2411/owlman3eu1.jpg

SpiritDreamer
04-16-2007, 11:44 PM
Apr 16, 2007

The idea is starting to take shape in my mind's eye
Going to have them perched on top of Notre Dame.
Will be a toad shaped body, with extended throat for croaking,..wings will be skin at the shoulders like a bats, extending about half way down, and then turn into feathers..haven't decided on the shape of the feet yet, maybe human hands..who knows..:scream: ..Might have the male carrying something special in his hands, to feed the female, while she is guarding the eggs...Will put some architecture at the bottom of the nest, to make it seem as though they have thier nest on a ledge at the top of the cathedral...just thinking out load again, and writing down whatever enters into my mind :eek: ...hope you don't mind..:)

GREAT JOB SO FAR EVERYONE...LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING EVERYONE'S CRITTERS AND CONCEPTS EVOLVE..:thumbsup:
TAKE CARE
Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_COMPOSITION.jpg


http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_COPOSITION_1.jpg

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_COPOSITION_4.jpg

ReflectingAbyss
04-17-2007, 05:19 AM
I guess with this post I'll see if I've gone too far or not. I figure it's sort of like a mutant zombie looking thing, and that seems to fit the category ok.

So I drew what would gross me out. I don't know, some of the things that are considered gross somewhat fascinate me... while something like disease, rashes, pug dogs, ringworm, well, it's what I'd consider grotesque, something that would terrify and disgust me at the same time.

I tried the note thing...

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y224/reflectingabyss/thoughts.jpg

And then got to working on the design. While working things suddenly came to mind, like a turkey, and gecko/monkey feet, parasites and stalked eyes. So I'm sorry all of the ideas aren't laid out on the sheet.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y224/reflectingabyss/concept1.jpg

Let me know if this is an ok idea or not. If not- I'll try to think of something else. If it is ok, oh boy is it going to be an interesting thing to model.

Redwolf
04-17-2007, 05:33 AM
http://www.megaangelo.com/images/grotesq.jpg

so many halfbird half human beak.. thing.. images already.. for some reason i just had to draw one.. so here it is.. kind of wanna do some more sketches..

questionmarks
04-17-2007, 09:36 AM
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/choonrobert/b2-1.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/choonrobert/b1-1.jpg

I come out with the sketches d..but then I found that my friend's scanner cannot use......
so I just model it out...this is the rough model..still need to add and fix a lot of things........

very fun doing this...hope to see everyone's update soon.....
^ ^...

default-rol
04-17-2007, 10:08 AM
Good morning all,

@ Fl3wk >>> LOL, he reminds me of a crazed relative at a fancy dress party! Great stuff. I'd try to get more character into his face (you may well need to upres your image to do this,) and then work out and down the body. Once you've established a face you are happy with, then you can use that to guide the form language for the rest of him. Keep going, and I'm looking forward to updates. :thumbsup:

@ SpiritDreamer >>> Hey Glenn, again your lateral thinking astounds me. To turn them back into "living" grotesques, but having them residing in the place they would inhabit anyway! Brilliant! Well, it would save the councils from having to comission stonemasons every few hundred years to replace the weathered stone ones... :D Can't wait to see what you think of next. :applause:

@ ReflectingAbyss >>> I'm glad you tried the mind map approach to breaking down the brief. I'm just curious, but did you find it of any help in your process to get you going? I love the design, and I'm perfectly fine with you going ahead and trying to model that beast!

@ Redwolf >>> What you've said there is quite interesting, as it shows how our minds are taught to think in conventions from an early age. If you look at grotesques on cathederals, some also look like this too. Clearly conventions don't change too much with the passing of time.

@ questionmarks >>> Great to see you back for this event. you did a cool model last time, and i'm expecting great things from this round. You are already off to a "flying" start with that winged, gutted buffalo thing! Looking forward to lots more.

Cheers all - this thread is rocking with great ideas.

MIKE :)

<<< Update >>>

Finished my image planes, and scanned them in:

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/7194/imageplanesfinalwebsu3.jpg


On to modeling now. :twisted:

Cheers
MIKE

Djampa
04-17-2007, 05:12 PM
Here it goes, to understand my workflow I will refine this first rough sketch into something more serious, add rough colored environment and composition than take it to XSI, make a fast base mesh, and then take it to Zbrush 2.5. If I have the time will make textures, render and compose with a refined environment.



Grotesque short briefing:

Use: Film of psychological and/or spiritual thriller.

General idea, basic storyline: A character enters in a trance and is transported to another dimension world; there she has a vision of a grotesque disturbing creature.

Take as inspiration HR Giger (http://www.giger.com/), Beksinski (http://www.beksinski.pl/), HP Lovecraft (http://www.hplovecraft.com/), Alex Oliver (http://www.alexoliver.art.br/).

Time: parallel time, not specified.

Location: Another dimension, hellish ‘Lovecraftian’ mood environment.

Features, appearance and colors: Distorted human anatomy, large head, no jaw, large thick tongue hanging out, fetus in fetus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parasitic_twin#Fiction) head evident as seen in most of Alex Oliver (http://www.alexoliver.art.br/) grotesque creatures, skull lines evident, veins and some muscle noticeable, no flesh on the orbits, big eyes, and wrinkled skin sucked inside orifices.

Resemblance should be mostly with Giger and Beksinski artwork in crossed style.

Colors: Flesh and blood, rotten meat. Environment colors following Beksinski and Lovecraft nightmarish tones.


Note: Only upper part of the body. Head and shoulders, part of chest as optional.

Must look like a portrait of ‘grotesque’.


The first rough sketch:


Done in 5 minutes with 6B pencil then taken to Wacom Intuos 3 with sketchbook pro to refine for 10 minutes using only pencil tool.

Total work = 15 minutes.


http://four.fsphost.com/djampa/anatomy_cafe_002/grotesque_sketch_101.jpg





I really think I could use a lot of advice on it.


I will refine it for sure, I did it fast last night, now I can see problems on the neck structure and position and other little things, but as a fast start here it is.

Cheer all,

SylvanMist
04-17-2007, 06:25 PM
Here's the colors I came up with..I know they might go outside of the "grotesque" theme a bit, but I really like them :p
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/fflewddar/cockatrice_concept_color.jpg

I did try enlarging the wings like you suggested Default-Rol, but I just didnt' care for how they looked being bigger. Maybe it's just because I'm thinking of similarly shaped animals, like an ostrich, and they would have small wings.

btw, your final drawing came out great Default! I like a lot of your images in your portfolio too and noticed that you got some of the Neville page dvd's...did his drawing the fantasy creature one help you out a lot?


questionmarks: that's a cool buffalo design model. It looks kinda mechanical

ReflectingAbyss: Nice drawing, that sure is ugly!

Djampa
04-17-2007, 08:44 PM
Default-rol: Looks great ! Will you gonna Zbrush it too ? Awesome concept, nice anatomy, I like a lot the volume of the forms you gave to it and the proportions used. Grotesque creature ! :)

Roja: Nice, I like the colors you used, the form is grotesque anyway, a nice combination of animals, very well balanced.

questionmarks: interesting creature, I can see what's coming there. Waiting to see your update. Keep going.

ReflectingAbyss: Wow ! That will be a hell to model :D Keep it up man, grotesque creature !

SpiritDreamer: Looks an interesting proposal, following up here. Keep updating, it's good to read the things that come out of our heads on the process :D, unfortunately I don't have much time to keep posting it all here but believe it would be funny...

Fl3wk: Going well, keep updating, I agree that you have to work first on the face to have its body done. Owl is an interesting creature, you should take care a lot with is anatomy issues when crossing it with a man's. Good luck.

Nekomouse: Konichiwa ! I want to see your Kappa coming out ! Great idea. Gambate !

Kary: Nice idea, if you want to do a Naga, it's a creature that you can find a lot of iconography references on Tibetan Buddhist images and texts, also at many old Indian scriptures and images as well. I know a lot of Nagas that are creepy grotesque and a lot of them are very handsome actually. Good luck ! Keep going !

michael-olszak: Hey man, your last concept at Café 001 already was a kinna grotesque, I don't think you are going to have difficulties here with this. Can't wait to see it :)

Redwolf: Keep it up, nice start.

Igor Sandman: Cool face of you character. Keep developing it.

nochuss: There is a lot of mix, I can't read the image very clear, anyway waiting to see it's development. Keep it up.

Intervain: I know you're following this up... HEY ! Come on ! Even I am posting here *lol* join up, how much time you get to make a grotesque 3D on XSI ? 2 hours ? *lol*
You are great and should join up. Best wishes my friend, cya. :D :beer:



Best wishes to everyone, lets keep going.

default-rol
04-18-2007, 12:09 AM
Alright,

Roja >>> That's looking excellent! I'm glad you tried enlarging the wings, even if you ended up rejecting the idea. With photoshop etc. it is so easy to do these things, that they literally cry out to be explored.

The Neville page DVD's are really good btw, but I personally learned more from Iain McCaig's ones I think. For this project I didn't even think about Neville Page's work to be honest with you, but maybe I should as he is pretty damn amazing. He designs creatures in an industrial design way, which makes sense to me a bit since I came from that background. (Though it makes less sense to me now than it used to.)

@ Djampa >>> I intend to block it out in maya, pelt map it and then... take it into Zbrush and sculpt the hell out of it! LOL. I haven't used ZBrush in about 5 months now as I have had no need to, but with ZBrush 3 coming in less than 4 weeks an urge is creeping upon me. :twisted:

I love how you break your ideas down btw, and adding a narrative obviously helps you make choices that would be very hard to do otherwise. I love the idea of your creature having no jaw - that really appeals to me for some reason. I'm looking forward to seeing how you develop your ideas together.

Cheers all
MIKE :)

Rist
04-18-2007, 12:44 PM
The owlman has been redesigned from the skeleton to the muscles. Of course there will be mistakes, but I am more concerned with the look of the thing that will be seen by the viewer. I used actual owl skeleton reference this time.

http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/6697/owlanatomyae8.jpg

EAD
04-18-2007, 02:07 PM
questionmarks, Redwolf> nice work, in two totally different ways

couldn't resist a quick sketch for this. Rhino boy and the Yeti!.

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/5845/ae0407yetiias6.jpg

Rebeccak
04-18-2007, 03:36 PM
EAD,

Awesome sketch! :thumbsup:

questionmarks
04-18-2007, 04:13 PM
default-rol -- ya..this is the second round that you mean earlier.....I thought is the further stage of the first model at first....P..anyway..this workshop is great..giving us opportunity to create something and finish it......
and I like your creature's ear...very nice....^ ^..

djampa -- thanks...can't wait to see your 3d mode of the grotesque..l...^ ^...

EAD -- really nice sketches...which one will you go for ???


a little update...mirror and smooth it to see how it looks like while complete....
still..some part to fix....but I think the modelling part is ok d...will move on to bind skin and posing soon..........

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/choonrobert/buff.jpg

marvelatthedust
04-18-2007, 07:06 PM
I was at an animation symposium this past monday and had time to sketch while listening, and came up with some sketches i thought were pretty fine. let me know what you all think.

http://bp0.blogger.com/_nb03Te_G0GA/RiZaQYnzT5I/AAAAAAAAABA/xBEOsygyhEw/s1600-h/octoSpider.jpgOctopus Spider (http://bp0.blogger.com/_nb03Te_G0GA/RiZaQYnzT5I/AAAAAAAAABA/xBEOsygyhEw/s1600-h/octoSpider.jpg)
http://bp0.blogger.com/_nb03Te_G0GA/RiZaQYnzT5I/AAAAAAAAABA/xBEOsygyhEw/s1600-h/octoSpider.jpg

the basic idea evolved from an octopus like face, like davy jones, and then mixed in a spider. I had thought about using a black widow for the last character, and so wondered what a black widow octopus might look like...

default-rol
04-18-2007, 07:31 PM
Hey everyone,

@ Fl3wk >>> Good to see you working on the anatomy for your grotesque. The finish/epidermis on any organic creature, really is only "skin deep," and it is the surface anatomy/ and even the deep anatomy that really make or break your character in my opinion. Keep working like this and your anatomy knowledge will increase, making your characters stronger. Good stuff!

@ EAD >>> Twisted and evil as usual >>> that said, I'll now comment on your work. :twisted: Great to see you here bud, and hope you get chance to refine one of them. Really nice work.

@ questionmarks >>> LOL, you found the second round even before you knew what I was on about! :thumbsup: It's looking really good and I can't wait to see more of it.

@ marvelatthedust >>> Nice idea, and an octopus would make an amazing grotesque I think, so would a spider having said that... hmmmm.... arms and legs everywhere! I'd say a great idea, a good start and I, for one, am looking forward to seeing it develop.

Cheers all

MIKE :)

SpiritDreamer
04-18-2007, 11:04 PM
Apr 18, 2007

Little more on this concept
Blocked in the architecture
Started working on my lighting
Save the details for last

Glenn


http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_8.jpg

kary
04-19-2007, 05:42 AM
http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/grotesque.thumbnail.jpg (http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/grotesque.jpg)

Not sure on the face yet, either bat or an 'aggressive' dog, whichever feels better on the base mesh. Probably dog as I'm not sure I want a week of looking at bat ref...

---

Mike: The image planes look great.

Djampa: Very thorough method, and the sketch looks promising. A well put together 'heads melting together' piece is definitely in the grotesque realm for me. I've wound up with something similar to a naga, but a bit different. I'll have to take a look at history of those, very sad that all of my experience with them was "at the wrong end of a staff" in WoW ;)

Roja: Maybe more psychedelic then grotesque... but I quite like the colours :)

EAD: Nice.

questionmarks: Coming along well, thats a really different idea.

Glenn: Now that is weird... considering the topic thats exactly the direction to hope for ;)

default-rol
04-19-2007, 10:24 PM
Hey,

@ SpiritDreamer >>> That's shaping up Glenn. :thumbsup: I am really interested your choice of colour - can you please explain why you have gone for that particular "mood" for the piece?

@ kary >>> I really like that side silhouette - it really has a good presence in the thumbnail. Where do you plan on going next with the concept?

As for me... I started modeling today, and hopefully I should have a base mesh to show tomorrow.

Cheers all

MIKE :)

SpiritDreamer
04-19-2007, 11:13 PM
April 19, 2006

THANKS...Mike....About the colors....red, green...complements..I took a class in color theory years ago...was shown the power of a red dot placed on a green background, and a green dot placed on a red background...a 1 part to 9 part ratio kind of thing..It can also be found in nature all the time...example ..a ruby throated humming bird.
I also raised exotic birds since I was a little kid, my father used to sell them to pet shops...always fasinated by their color combinations, and how the combinations and the ratios of those combinations is what made them beautiful, and sellable...I try to imatate those same type of color effects in my paintings...nature is the master, when it comes to COLOR.
Also certain colors just have a way of creating mood and feeling for a subject...I think that reds and greens creat and express the 10th century superstitious mind set...:eek:

Experimenting with some Zbrush textures and colors

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_10.jpg

dude5487
04-20-2007, 02:20 AM
Here is what I drew right after I read about the challenge. I am going for an eye that has a stem coming out of the back that goes to the ground, and on the sides of the eye are loops put into the skin that have a chain running to the ground so it cannot move. My goal with this is to add boils to the skin using ZBrush to sculpt them in.

I am really excited about this challenge because I have had an idea of this eye chained to the ground concept before but never an outlet to run it through. I am also liking what I am seeing from other users, great stuff.

I shall post more soon. Until then here are the concepts.

Look forward to the comments.


http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Eye_Chain_Ground_3%20Copy.jpg (http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Eye_Chain_Ground_3%20Copy.jpg)

http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Char_Ortho_Front%20copy.jpg (http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Char_Ortho_Front%20copy.jpg)

kary
04-20-2007, 05:19 AM
http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/grotesqueretopo.jpg

Got a start tonight, not much time in yet as I wound up having a problem with my firewall and spent an hour or two tracking that down.

michael-olszak
04-20-2007, 04:17 PM
Hey guys. Awesome work so far.

kary - Cool modeling work man. love the creature.
EAD - Dude, these are great man. keep em comming
Djampa - Thanks man.

well here's a quick sketch i did at work today. i haven't had a lot of time this week and i'm hoping to be able to do some more sketching in the weekend. Let me know what you think.

Have a nice weekend.

http://www.molszak.nl/cgtalk/anatomy1/Grotesque_wip_01.jpg

SpiritDreamer
04-20-2007, 10:13 PM
Apr 20, 2006

Expanding a little further and outward on this concept

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_19.jpg

default-rol
04-21-2007, 10:41 AM
Morning all,

@ SpiritDreamer >>> Thank you for the explination of your choice of colours. While I have also learned colour theory in an academic sense, as you quite rightly pointed out, nature's colours are the real teacher. The psychology of colour, though, is something I don't know an awful lot about, and I find it very interesting that you interprit the 10th Century in these colours.

@ dude5487 >>> You've got an idea there that is quite simple, but that will mean that the "devil is in the details" when you go to make it. I look forward to seeing your progress in ZBrush. Keep posting. :)

@ Kary >>> You've got a good ZBrush sculpt going there. Are you trying to make him intentionally "Heroic" in proportions? (9+ heads high) Looking forward to updates. :thumbsup:

@ michael-olszak >>> Nice concept! Very grotesque - keep going and I hope you get chance to develop this idea further as I think the initial sketch demands it. Good stuff!

Cheers all
MIKE :)

dude5487
04-21-2007, 11:15 AM
default-rol- Thanks for the comments. Yeh my plan was to make this creature built for the sculpting.

Here is an update. This isn't the final concept by any means but its still in the exploration stage. I wanted to push the whole chain on the eye thing and I immedietly felt a knot in my stomach when I thought about the chains being attached to my own hands. The idea I might rip my own eye out really got to me so I am going for this for right now.

http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Char_Ortho_Front_2.jpg (http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Char_Ortho_Front_2.jpg)

SpiritDreamer
04-21-2007, 01:31 PM
Apr 21, 2007

Expanding a little further outward with this idea, or inward, depending on which way you look at it..:)
Was thinking of putting something symbolic on the bottom window ledge,..lower left corner...maybe a candle burning, with some rosery beads with a cross at the end of them, at the base of the candle holder.
Was thinking that this image would convey the feeling that ST. Bernard was expressing in his words that are the basis for this concept...an image that creates a feeling that maybe this is the vision that ST. Bernard is seeing as he looks out his window...lets the viewer see through the eyes of ST. Bernard type of thing.
Will do a nice real looking still life of candle and rosery with cross, having shadows, reflextions ect. on the window ledge..just some thoughts to further this concept, and add realism to it...:)

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_BACKGROUND_22.jpg

igorsandman
04-22-2007, 12:34 PM
Hello!


Fagiolo wasn't born like the Others
but he knew the Others better than themselves
for he strived to understand why he was different.


http://www.igorsandman.net/sketch/grotesque-final.jpg

Here is my picture. I'm not quite satisfied with the shading of the face (too flat), but I'm a bit tired of working on it. I'm too lazy :p
-IS-

SpiritDreamer
04-22-2007, 02:41 PM
Apr 22, 2007

A little further on this concept
Extended the window ledge out toward the viewer
Started on the candle.

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_25.jpg

dude5487
04-22-2007, 08:57 PM
Igor Sandman- I like the concept a lot. I also really like the facial deformations and marks. I did have a question though. His hair is split down the middle and their seems to be either a slpit or gash in the skin. What is that?

SpiritDreamer- I like your concept a lot as well. At first I had a hard time understanding what it was going to be though I always liked what I saw. Its all clear to me now and I am looking forward to further progress!

igorsandman
04-23-2007, 08:42 AM
His hair is split down the middle and their seems to be either a slpit or gash in the skin. What is that?
It's a birth mark. Thanks for your comment :)
-IS-

michael-olszak
04-23-2007, 03:32 PM
Here's a cleaner linework.

http://www.molszak.nl/cgtalk/anatomy1/Grotesque_wip_02.jpg

SpiritDreamer
04-23-2007, 11:11 PM
Apr 23, 2007

Josh...THANKS...:) ....Wasn't sure what this was going to be either. Just letting the old imagination take hold of the reins, while I kick back and enjoy the ride...DISTINATION UNKNOWN..:)
I REALLY LIKE that EYE WITH CHAINS concept of yours...kind of reminds me of KLEE'S painting FISH DREAM..I think it's called.
A POTENT SYMBOL you have created there...:thumbsup:

Got my symbols in place for this concept
Now all I have to do is light the candle, set the lighting, shadows and reflections in place. And a few other details. And that should do it.

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE30.jpg

SylvanMist
04-24-2007, 02:07 AM
Igor: I really like that painting/concept. The colors are nice and I especially like that texture you have it on.

Spiritdreamer: that's an interesting concept. I will have to read up on St. Bernard and what he saw through that window :) I like the glass holder you made, that really looks like glass!


Ok well I did the model and started the texture today and got pretty far. Just a couple more hours of work and should be done :)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/fflewddar/cockatrice_model1.jpg

SpiritDreamer
04-24-2007, 11:03 PM
Apr 24, 2007

Roja...THANKS...I think he just meant what he said...What are these monstrousities, and why are they placed on a church...:)

I like your critter so far...Maybe if it had the shimmering colors of a roosters feathers on it's body, and a nice bumpy texture like a roosters legs have...might really add to it's charater...also maybe those killer spikes that the fighting roosters have developed over time...just a couple of thoughts that might help you take it further..:)
TAKE CARE
Glenn

Little further on this THOUGHT

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_37.jpg

kary
04-25-2007, 08:03 PM
Bit of UVing, detailing, and painting to go. Ugh, but I do have a bit of time open for it.

Odd server issue where the last update got replaced with the most recent one... bit strange to finish a prop, post it, come to the thread to put it here and see it as a part of a post from three days ago. Time warp ;)

http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/untitled-1.jpg


Michael Olszak: Nice, reminds me a bit of the concept art for GuildWars Nightfall -- which is high praise, the mutants that they did for that were great.

Glenn: Deep and interesting piece you're getting out of this. I expected a lot of standing solo characters at the end of this, and it's encouraging to see a full piece, cool :)

Mike: Yep heoric proportions indeed. His opposite number is 9 heads... bit of a battle of the titans thing ;)

Igor Sandman: Bit of a Hunchback of Notre Dame meets Hamlet there eh? Nice :)

Roja: Thats winding up nice. The wings do seem a touch small, but it's playing out nicely as a model that would fit nicely into a RTS or similar, good stuff :)

default-rol
04-25-2007, 10:16 PM
Hey everyone,

I'm really sorry to have not been around for the last week, to cut a long story short - I've been diagnosed with Helicobacter pylori, and I'm now on hardcore medication to solve the problem.

Anyway, unless I run a future workshop on "turning gut diseases into character designs," you really don't need to know that! LOL.

It looks like some really excellent work is turning up on here - I've got my poly model blocked out and into ZBrush, but I don't know how far i'll be able to take it this time. I'll do my best and post up what I have done, probably tomorrow night.

I'll leave more specific comments then.

Cheers all - look out for the next workshop, starting Saturday!
MIKE :)

SpiritDreamer
04-25-2007, 11:39 PM
April 25, 2007

Further along on this thought

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_38.jpg

SylvanMist
04-26-2007, 02:52 AM
Ok, I think I'm done now. Any final thoughts you guys might have on it?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/fflewddar/cockatrice_model2.jpg

Kary: That cat creature is looking really great, can't wait to see it textured :)
The cockatrice i'm doing is for a MMO(see sig). So we have to keep the poly count & textures low res.
And yeah, I agreed about the wings being too small, fixed that.

Spiritdreamer: Thanks. I did boost the contrast on the feathers a bit.

Default-rol: Hope you feel better soon!

igorsandman
04-26-2007, 08:07 AM
Hey,
Great work everyone. This workshop rocks. Mike, get well soon :p
-IS-

Rist
04-26-2007, 09:10 AM
Default-rol: I hope you get better soon, everyone hates being ill! To cheer you up i will try to finish this owl-thingy I designed.

Rist
04-26-2007, 11:16 AM
Roja: I believe the colours may be too prismatic (High in saturation). Try adding some more darks (try cold colours like blues and purples), and also try muting the colours to 'quieten' the image.

Good design, its like part dragon, part parrot/chicken birdy thing.

SpiritDreamer: It makes me feel like this is more fine art. The designs are good, its the presentation that makes me feel this way. This is not a bad thing as expression was the longest running movement, and combining it with concept design gives it life.

Kary: Fantastic model, I do feel the flow of the form is a little stiff though as my only quirk.

michael-olszak: Thats some sick manifestation. Make the brain look real fleshy!

Igor Sandman: Very Shakespearian. The eyes, unless it was intened, feel a little distant, make them a little sparkly as if they were real balls in the socket covered with that slimy stuff.

dude5487: Its a great idea, I would be careful with wieght distribution though. Also when sktching cover the page/canvas with flat desaturated colours, better still use neutral colours like grays and browns. White can be overpowering and an empty page can feel overpowering in itself.

EAD: Lets see these in full scale, these look promising!

-----

This is just the underpainting to figure out the rough composition, lighting, and colours. A lot will change. Any tips will be great.

And here is as promised:

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/5369/birdyowlrenderks9.jpg

michael-olszak
04-26-2007, 01:01 PM
well i kind of finished it.

http://www.molszak.nl/cgtalk/anatomy1/Grotesque_wip_03.jpg

My coloring skills are not quite good yet but i'm kind of happy with it.

Don't know if i will have more time till saturday so i don't know if i can work on it some more.

Rist
04-26-2007, 03:01 PM
Okay I'm finished with this one. Not a big fan of colouring, so I may try and change how I do it in future works. The grayscale to colour blend sounds like a good one. Plus I was getting bored with owls :D

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/5281/birdyowlrenderkj2.jpg

SylvanMist
04-27-2007, 04:21 AM
Ahh I can go to sleep now...All done! Had some fun with the background too :p
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/fflewddar/cockatrice.jpg

Fl3wk: I took your advice and added some blue/purple in there, on the feathers, and I just loved it! I also desatured the wings & beak a bit.
Your owl bird guy looks creepy! Are those his feet in the center? It's a little hard to tell.

michael-olszak: That's a nice concept piece! He's really hideous looking :)

kary
04-27-2007, 04:27 AM
Rushing here, need to get some sleep. A bit of time open to sculpt tomorow, but I doubt I'll have it wrapped before Sunday. A stab at UVs down:

http://www.karyblack.com/wip/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/grotesqueuved.jpg

Roja: Doh of course for your MMO, that makes sense ;). It turned out great! Only quibble might be to echo the oranges of the wings in the beak, but that could be just me.

Rist
04-27-2007, 08:18 AM
Roja: The final above is what I would still call the working out stage. I might still go in and clean it up before the deadline. THey are feet and you are right, they were the last things I was doing before I got bored and just erased the refined version :eek:


The dragon-birdy is looking much better with that blue as it compliments the orange in the wings. It also looks less flat now that you have add shadow to some parts. Good job, looking forward to your next character.

questionmarks
04-27-2007, 12:05 PM
michael-olszak, FI3wk - looks good but I think it is better if cak make it more contrast and more finish....

Roja - I like the creature's head.......but the other parts doesn't seems to suit the head....maybe it is your style..but I think it will looks really nice if this is a realistic style of drawing......


http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/choonrobert/bull.jpg

this is my final outcome...
at first wanted to do texture..but...can't finish it...
so..just apply a normal shader on it...
first time using fur...still not use to it...can;t solve the problem with the small weird part there.......

having fun doing this...hope you guys also....^ ^...

michael-olszak
04-27-2007, 12:17 PM
questionmarks - Can you please explain what you mean by contrast? i've just started out with coloring and as you can see am not very good at this. if you have any tips ans suggestions. please, please share them.

thanks.

Rist
04-27-2007, 01:05 PM
He means a higher range of darks and lights. To see a good example of contrast, get a photo into photoshop and then, Image-adjustments-Brightness/contrast. Then play with that slider.

SylvanMist
04-27-2007, 01:09 PM
Fl3wk: Well I didn't just rush through any part..I'm not sure what else I can do with the feet. It is difficult with low poly, those legs are actually only 4 sided, and I didn't want them to have much muscle..they're like a cross between chicken & lizard legs. The texture is only 512 in size too.

questionmarks: I think the other parts suit the head just fine. Yes it is my style, I didn't want to go with realism by using photo textures and such, for the game, just because I think that most games that go that route don't look as good as the painted art style. This guy's fantasy, magical, so I think the colors represent that well. Thanks for your input though, everyone has a style they like :)

I like your buffalo..it's a shame you don't have time to texture him though. Maybe choose a better color for the background, imo that blue-gray doesn't match the rest well.

Djampa
04-27-2007, 02:56 PM
default - where are you ? :) Looking for your 3D model, that character is a powerful concept. Hope you are ok. I pushed myself hard as possible, I'm without comp at nights lately, so It's a real hard to accomplish the goal, but here it is something I pushed to do.

I started UV unwrapping it on Tuesday so I could have a nice map but I had to stop it, now I took today... some hours free to do it ! So I'll be jumping on Zbrush next minute of this post and hopefully I will finish something by the end of the day.

Kary - Oh my, congratulations, nice model ! nice maps too, looking for more :) Keep it up.

Michael - Your characters are getting more and more appealing to me, your style is definitively something I like a lot. Keep it up. 2 weeks from now I will be doing the base mesh for your cafe 001 concept, after Zbrush 3 release... well boy... that will be something.

Roja - good to see it finished. Nice job. Different style we are used to see around but you did it nicely. :) Congratz !

questionmarks - Yeah ! Very nice, firt time using fur ? Good results ! Considering everyone here seems to be in a crazy busy life lately *lol* You came up with a nice model at the end. Def. to texture our models we need to fit some time more on the day. I had kinna 9 hours free for this 002... *lol* crazy but funny ! I love these challenging deadlines, I think we push ourselves out of our limits and by doing so we start to make these 'limits' less 'limits' and find out some turnarounds.

Thanks Default-Rol and Rebecca for this opportunity ! :)
BTW I invited a dozen heavy weight concept designers to join up and an entire concept art classroom here to join up these threads ! Hopefully we can see some of them joining soon on the next slots (they are shy most of them.. *ROFL*). Anyway... seems the world is too busy lately... *lol*
Hey guys try to get your friends here too, seems these threads needs a little more 'energy pump'. It's awesome but could be even better !

Best wishes to everyone !

Here is my base mesh done in XSI, few hours, for the attached head I used a base mesh I did for Rebecca's last OFDW, I did that base mesh for Medusa but I had to jump into a lot of business, so I left it in an 'ideas folder', well here it is in another version... *lol*
It's already missing the big 'Giggerian' tongue and the grotesque Beksinski's styled eyes, I can take care of that in 30 minutes after Zbrushing this base mesh.
Then I want to make a simple composition. I will do it... ! :)

BTW... this model is all quads (4804 quads) and has loops so it could be animated, anyway this kind of workflow will change after Zbrush 3.0, for those who doens't know now Zbrush 3.0 has a feature we can develop the high poly Zbrush model first then make a low poly mesh directly over it like the reconstruction process used inside XSI, Silo, Max, whatever, so no needs anymore to make the low poly base mesh first and take to ZBrush, back to software for normal mapping or displacement, nor make the high poly and rebuild on another software, all very easy inside Zbrush. I had to do the old fashion way...
Box modeling from scratch except the attached head as I mentioned.
Taking to Zbrush 2 to correct anatomy and add as much details as possible now.



http://four.fsphost.com/djampa/anatomy_cafe_002/wip_grotesque_109.jpg

michael-olszak
04-27-2007, 03:28 PM
Djampa - Thank a lot man. i'm happy you like it. still have to learn a lot though. Very much looking forward to the 3d model man. can't wait.


cheers

AndyO
04-27-2007, 10:12 PM
Wow guys, there's some very nice stuff in here!

michael-olszak, questionmarks: I really like what you've come up with - you're getting some great results.

Here's my attempt; a frog-prince type character. I wanted him twisted into a more exaggerated, grotesque position - at pains with his current disposition... It's still in the pencil stage at the moment, as I haven't really had all that much time to work in him.

http://www.andrewowen.co.uk/cg_threads/cgsoc_chara-fortnight/02_prelim_design.jpg

http://www.andrewowen.co.uk/cg_threads/cgsoc_chara-fortnight/02_character.jpg

SpiritDreamer
04-27-2007, 11:09 PM
Apr 27, 2007

More work done on this today
Need to put wick in the candle, and a few chips on the window frame and a couple little odds and ends and that should do it for this one.

Great job by everyone who participated in this!

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_39.jpg

dude5487
04-27-2007, 11:09 PM
To all of you, great work so far! DefaultROL hope you are feeling better!

This is where I am at now. I am moving next week so I wont have much time more modeling, I will probably go with the concept with less work and finish up the second on my own.

Either way here are some updates. The first is a revisit to the original idea I had. The second is an update on what I have been posting lately.

http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Concept_2.jpg (http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Concept_2.jpg.jpg)

http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Char_Ortho_Front_11_2%20copy.jpg (http://www.josh-lynch.com/Grotesque_CGTalk_Project/Grotesque_Char_Ortho_Front_11_2%20copy.jpg)

Djampa
04-28-2007, 01:14 AM
Ok here it is a rough 3D sketch of the final piece.
Photoshop CS2 composed.

No eyes yet, and missing a lot of details, many things to fix up... but I wanted to show it here to get some C&C.
I don't know if I can keep going this night with it, anyway I will refine it soon and make a pro final piece in near future with it.

Please tell me guys what you think of this sketch.


Best wishes all.

http://four.fsphost.com/djampa/anatomy_cafe_002/Grotesque_comp_104%20copy2.jpg

Rist
04-28-2007, 09:05 AM
I'm finished for this episode. Good work so far everyone! Next session I will change my workflow somewhat and also try to push whatever it is to a finished piece.

dude5487
04-28-2007, 09:11 AM
So I have a couple of questions. It looks like people are starting to wrap up on this session. I joint just over a week ago and would still like to model my concept. Does this mean I will carry it over into the next session?

I am new to this whole deal and would really like to finish up what I have started but not sure where to post it when I am done.

Thanks so much and great work everyone!

SpiritDreamer
04-28-2007, 01:52 PM
Apr 28, 2007


Notions that pollute the minds oceans
Creating the darkness that surrounds us

Glenn

Vision of St. Bernard of Clairvaux(1090-1153)

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_44.jpg

SylvanMist
04-28-2007, 02:08 PM
dude5487: that sure is a creepy monster! I think someone mentioned before though, what would happen when he puts his arms down? With those chains it'd bring his head down..that'd be mighty uncomfortable, even for a monster, hehe :p
Try to shade it in more.

If you want to continue with it, I believe you can just keep posting here in this thread if you want, even after the 2 weeks are up.


Djampa: I like how you sculpted that monster! The teeth and tongue don't look like that fit however..did you paint them in Zbrush onto the sculpted model? If so maybe it just needs more painting :)

AndyO: Those frog drawings look great! Cool concept too :)

default-rol
04-28-2007, 09:02 PM
Hey everyone,

I'm sooooo sorry that I didn't get more time to participate with you guys on this one - I ended up having side effects from the medication I am on - not pleasant. My body seems to have *finally* come to terms with it now, and i'm feeling a lot better. :) I am resolved to trying to work on my base mesh for this round, along with what I will produce for CAFE 003. Sleepless nights, here we come!!

There has been some amazing work produced this time round, and this workshop has even surpassed my expectations of what creative talents can do given 2 weeks and a couple of lines for a brief.

I could write a lengthy article of the merits of everyone's work that I've seen here, but I guess that you all would prefer me to set up the new brief? :D

*watch this space...* >>> give me 5 minutes..... LOL.

Beautiful work - you all deserve a big round of applause from me and each other :applause:

MIKE

EDIT >>>

So I have a couple of questions. It looks like people are starting to wrap up on this session. I joint just over a week ago and would still like to model my concept. Does this mean I will carry it over into the next session?

I am new to this whole deal and would really like to finish up what I have started but not sure where to post it when I am done.

Thanks so much and great work everyone!

You can keep posting here the work that you do for this topic, it will remain open. I will post any updated work I do for this round here too, though my main concentration will be turned to the new workshop. I hope that makes sense. :)

default-rol
04-28-2007, 09:15 PM
And here it is >>>>

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?p=4356329#post4356329

Hope to see you all there! :)

Best
MIKE

SpiritDreamer
04-29-2007, 01:35 PM
Apr 29, 2007

Put a couple of color tints on to this to unify the colors more
Calling it done.

Glenn

http://artbyglenngallegos.com/images/GROTESQUE_46.jpg

SylvanMist
05-01-2007, 04:34 PM
Well I got this guy in the game so I thought I'd post 2 screenshots here of what he looks like.

Great job everyone! Now I really gotta get started on #003 :p

ReflectingAbyss
05-13-2007, 09:59 PM
I figured I'd make a post to say I haven't let this die. While I may not be completeing it in two weeks, I would like to go through with this concept. Here's the model so far- I need to finish the back part and add elbows and then I think I'll try out zbrush for the first time :)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y224/reflectingabyss/Maya/grotesquewip.jpg

aa2123
05-14-2007, 04:32 AM
I like it!

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