How do you defend against people like this ...

[KayosIII]

I think this is the sort of user that wants to have something cool to show for their time after about 5mins time. Blender is not that sort of app I think it took me a bit over 2 weeks to get my head around blender. The price is probably not going to be an issue because for a lot of users it is going to be the same price as every other app for them. You have shown some obiously good work that you have done. That is one of the biggest incentives you can do - most people with professional asperations... Will not necessarily listen to any selling you do but if you can show high quality output they will take you a lot more seriously.

What this person is asking for is instant gratification. being able to play with premade stuff can help that as can really good tutorials.

Beyond that I wouldn't worry about it. They probably will be happier with something like Bryce or Poser anyways (what do the kids use these days :p). As much as they are looked down on here there is a huge number of people who enjoy doing that sort of thing.

[Spin99]

Tell him the easiest way to get 3D is to buy a lava lamp.
No learning curve (!)

[FreakyDude]

I wouldn't give him so much credit, his arguments imo don't apply for anyone serious in 3D, more the fast result kinda thing. Those kind of arguments don't apply in ANY field for that matter. No matter what your trade, your rewards don't come falling from the sky. Everything in life takes a little effort to get some result.
He's not whining about just blender's layout, he's whining about layouts of most known 3D packages by saying, he tried and didn't like 3Dmax either makes me think he never even tries for anything. the way he mentions cinema makes me think he hardly gives that any thought beyond what's visible in the default viewport either.
Tell him to get a lava lamp indeed.

[AngelDream]

wow everlite, that link Peerless Productions is sweet!!
About the guy, people like him have always been in the world and will always be, just like cockroaches, hehe.

[FreakyDude]

Actually, I think cockroaches are cool! Very durable, strong, and so efficient they haven't changed a bit in like what, was it millions of years?

People tend to think they are trash/disgusting unworthy etc, yet they in fact are much stronger than they are given credit for, and they clean up other people's mess. Rings a bell, I like em.

[everlite]

Yep, very true, cockroaches are the most successful creatures on the planet in believe.:)

[shadowman99]

I think the keyword in your other discussion is "beginners". Is blender the best 3d program for a beginner? I am a bigtime Blenderhead, but even I'm not so sure.

The concepts of 3d modeling are a barrier more than any software. I was able to pick up on 3D modeling because I found it related to the drafting and mechanical drawing classes I took in highschool. My teacher would give us a faucet or valve and we would have to draw the item from a top, front, and side view. The views had to line up and be to scale. Needless to say, a CAD or 3d modeler is not much of a leap from this starting point.

One of my good friends, a talented artist in every real-word regard, is interested in 3d and what I do with Blender. But when I show him how it is necessary to keep track of the cursor or verts in two or more viewports I can see the panic set in.

Honestly, I think Mudbox and Zbrush are going to help more people take the leap than the 'hand built' meshes many of us labor over. Those programs conceptually are designed to resemble sculpting and are a more "real" way of thinking for many people.

[Mu]

slightly OT...


hey everlite, I checked out your sculpting tool video which is totally cool... til it gets all blurred...:cry:

are you planning on doing another one? It was highly informative as I had no clue that you could create your own brushes! Cool news. But I just can't follow what you're doing anymore when it gets so pixelated.


And On Topic:

I am a beginner and think that one advantage of checking out Blender as a beginner is that you have no predefined ideas of how a 3D UI should look like. I just went with what I found. Also, when I first checked Blender out a few years ago I found the lack of documentation the main hinderance in my learning efforts and that is fortunately a thing of the past with the wiki alone (not to mention CGTalk...:D )

[fktt]

I am a beginner and think that one advantage of checking out Blender as a beginner is that you have no predefined ideas of how a 3D UI should look like. I just went with what I found. Also, when I first checked Blender out a few years ago I found the lack of documentation the main hinderance in my learning efforts and that is fortunately a thing of the past with the wiki alone (not to mention CGTalk...:D ) very well put! the problem of the "reckless fellow" is that hes to used to the(and a bit biased?) interface of the c4d thus its hard for him to adapt to blenders ui, but it shouldnt be as hard for a(total) beginner! i started out with blender 2+ years ago, and after viewing just one video tut from blenders homepage i was on the go... slow, as i was new to 3d in general, but<edit> not too slow & </edit> i understood the interface quite well.. :) just my 2 cents!

[FreakyDude]

I started noob with cinema, then max, which was hard to adopt to, granted, but lovely to use while it lasted, then blender which was a little easier and more fun again.
Someone I know smokes when he's not allowed to. He hinders his colleages with it. It's not that he can't stop, it's that he doesn't want to. Simple as that. Not that he is an asshole because he's actually an allright bloke. Might be the same here, not that he can't learn it, as he apparantly tries it every now and then, just that he doesn't really want to. Doesn't take a truly dedicated person though...

reading that other dude's last post makes me think he's not an arsehole either, but if you're mucking around 3d a bit for about 20 years, even slightly, you should be able to have a better understanding if you want to advice other people. I mean people asking for advice on how best to get into 3D seem keen enough on learning and putting a minimum amount of effort in it right? To be able to know how to make really nice stuff within 20 years give or take.

[danizzil14]

dude, just let the guy know that the blender devs just came out with a patch to make the interface work like maya or Max, its really quite interesting!!

[Datameister]

I admit, I can relate to the guy. Blender confused the heck out of me when I first started using it--but so does any software. Blender's interface could use improvement on the organizational side of things, IMO...but it works.

[Morokiane]

I started doing 3d in AutoCAD. AutoCAD though a powerful piece of software is kind of archaic doing any advanced 3d. I got use to it though...and there really was nothing I couldn't model. Once I started using 3ds Max I freaked out. I didn't know how to do anything...I wanted my AutoCAD controls...it was something I was familiar with, understood etc. Once I got use to Max there was no way of going back to AutoCAD to do 3d. I started playing around with Blender and its the same thing. I wanted my Max interface and controls. Now I can go into Blender and do whatever I need.

When it comes to new people they are going to learn whatever software they get...and probably enjoy it. Its us old hats that can't/don't want to...adapt to different software, because we get so use to a certain way of doing things that when you change it you stumble along and it gets annoying. I make it a point to learn all the software I can, and not get stuck on just one. I still prefer Max...but nice thing about Blender is I can have it installed on my flash drive and use it on any computer.

[Datameister]

When it comes to new people they are going to learn whatever software they get...and probably enjoy it. Its us old hats that can't/don't want to...adapt to different software, because we get so use to a certain way of doing things that when you change it you stumble along and it gets annoying. I make it a point to learn all the software I can, and not get stuck on just one. I still prefer Max...but nice thing about Blender is I can have it installed on my flash drive and use it on any computer.

So true. I mean, I've used Photoshop for the better part of the last decade and I'm very comfortable with the program. When I tried to pick up Painter a few months ago, I was completely overwhelmed and I felt very awkward with the new software. It's hard to wrap your brain around new ways of working.

[smoodiver]

Hi people, I'm a very blender noob and a noob to the forums. I'm an Illustrator, carver by training and have a real interest in learning 3D. The only previous experiance with 3D was playing around on a friends version of max. When I started using blender I thought that I knew enough from my previous experiances to skip all the great blender beginner tutorials out there, I got so confused.

I didn't open blender again for like half a year, then one day I happened across the blender website and saw some of the amazing results created with bender and thought I'd better get into trying to learn it again.

This time I didn't skip the beginner tuts and now I am fairly famailiar with the interface, I've still got a hard journey ahead of me, but I think it's going to be a great one.

[CGIPadawan]

I am a beginner (both in theory and implementation) and Blender is my first and only 3D modeller and animator.

It was intimidating at first. But as I had no preconceptions of other 3D apps, I took it as the norm.

It is the only one that is free. And being FREE is good motivation for beginners (Was that a pun? :P)

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