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willbrown
04-01-2007, 04:47 PM
Ok I'm on to the next head. Humphrey Bogart.


I'm not sure how this will go. For now, It's will be a Bogart bust. Then, hopefully, will move on to hat, shirt, suit, cigarette and Falcon.

Young3D
04-01-2007, 05:30 PM
hello willbrown

For me, i think that if you want to have a good model, you shoulf first of all improve your base mesh, a leat is topology because here, the topology is pretty bad so it will be harder to optain a good hires mesh if you need help about it just have a look at this thread:
HERE (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=25&t=38469)

willbrown
04-01-2007, 09:55 PM
Hey mel, thanks for the comment and link to the topology thread.

Young3D
04-01-2007, 10:47 PM
Welcome, hope it will help you, post your new mesh back when it will be retopologise because i love the idea

willbrown
04-02-2007, 01:47 AM
Mel,

I won't be retopologizing this model. I find it more than adequate for the purpose of this challenge which is a likeness of the actor. Topology, although important for animation, is allowed to be crude for this challenge. I plan to focus on topology more on the rest of the heads I do for this challenge.

I created my base mesh in about 2.5 hrs. It is INTENTIONALLY CRUDE for speed.

BTW People are creating heads in ZBrush from a sphere, creating great sculpts, and topology ain't an issue. I'm more interested in sculpting in Zbrush, any way.

My initial mesh had only 4 n-gons out of the 4K total polys when Zbrush imported it; the rest of the polygons were quads.

Thanks again, your quite correct my; base mesh topology isn't to hot, but so far hasn't created any issues for me in ZBrush.

willbrown
04-03-2007, 12:24 PM
update, Zbrush sculpt partially done.

WhileYouWereArt
04-03-2007, 02:44 PM
Will, sorry to comment on the topology too, even though I agree with you about the model itself being more important than the topology, you need to focus more on the form, and not the details, at least at this stage.

I find that if you work with fewer polys, equally spaced divisions, and with a more correct edge flow, it helps to develop the form even with 2 or 3 divisions only. It's easier to achieve a more accurate form, and the smooth brush is more effective this way.

I learned this from Zack Petroc, he works with very few divisions, this gives you that faceted look, but in a way this is good, because it helps to see the planes of the form more easily, and not to focus on the details on the beginning.

My face models stays within 30 - 70 thousand polys range most of the time, because I'm only focusing on the primary and secondary form first. Later the model will go up to 1 million polys to add more finer details, and rarely to 4 million to add things like skin pores... which is one thing that I find unimportant.

For me your model still needs more development on the basic form, retopologizing it or not, but like I said, working with fewer polys can help you.

KrakenCMT
04-03-2007, 03:14 PM
Hey Will! Nice work so far! I can definately tell who it is.

I agree about going low poly first as it will help get the form and proportions down first then the model will have easier transitions between the planes in the face.

However, I agree that for this challenge, proper topology isn't necessary. In ZB you can get enough detail you need out of a simple sphere or box shape for creating a full bust. If you're not creating him for animation, why bother with perfect topology?

willbrown
04-04-2007, 12:09 AM
My face models stays within 30 - 70 thousand polys range most of the time, because I'm only focusing on the primary and secondary form first. Later the model will go up to 1 million polys to add more finer details, and rarely to 4 million to add things like skin pores... which is one thing that I find unimportant.- WhileYouWereArt

Thanks for the input. Ill keep your suggestions about edge flow in mind on the next head. FYI I clearly state in the pic above the final Silo mesh was 4K not 30 - 70 K, done with NO regard for topology.

I corrected most of my edge flow problems on the Silo base mesh in ZBrush at lo -res before I raised the resolution of the model in ZBrush to just over a million polys. I find this sufficient for pores. It's eaiser to move edges and smooth polys around in ZBrush than Silo. I've found that crude Silo meshes, with eyes, nose, mouth and ears are easily refined quickly in ZBrush at lo-res.

I also worked the mesh at lo-res in Zbrush for quite a while before any subD. I made NO attempt at that time to add detail. I didn't subd until I was satisfied I had the basic structure of Bogie's head where I wanted it on the 4K mesh.

I routinely move from lo to hi in ZBrush to correct the form as I work to a higher level of detail. I check the form against my reference throughout the whole process. I am ALWAYS focused on the whole, no matter what stage of the process. I ALWAYS keep an eye on the MASSES OVER DETAIL. This approach keeps mistakes to a minimum, and I make plenty. It also saves time, is faster, and makes it easier to stay accurate. I have ALWAYS used this approach on all of the 350+ portrait paintings I've done in my career at Boeing.

I use a Macro (Mass) to Micro (Detail) approach on all my workflo's regardless of media.

KrakenCMT,

Thanks, Conan is looking awesome! Can't wait to see it finished. Go man Go!

WhileYouWereArt
04-04-2007, 02:05 AM
Thanks for the input. Ill keep your suggestions about edge flow in mind on the next head. FYI I clearly state in the pic above the final Silo mesh was 4K not 30 - 70 K, done with NO regard for topology.


Will, I know that your mesh was 4K, with no regard for topology

I was referring to your zbrush high res mesh(4 million), my high res meshes normally stays between only 30 - 70 thousand polygons, but anyway, I understand that this approach works for you, so I'll keep my comments to the form next time :)

willbrown
04-04-2007, 10:31 AM
ZBrush lores sculpts. Here's a pic that shows the lo-res Silo mesh after adjusting the basic form and smoothing.

And a front view of the Mesh at hi-res.

willbrown
04-14-2007, 04:55 PM
Here's the latest on Bogie. Now with hat, suit, shirt , tie and cigarette.

KrakenCMT
04-14-2007, 06:23 PM
Nice job, Will! Coming together really well!

quasiagent1
04-15-2007, 06:20 AM
Looking good, I can definitely see the likeness. However, the head/face seems a little too narrow. It might just be the lighting.

RobertoOrtiz
04-25-2007, 07:23 PM
Roberto's Bullhorn: One week to go! (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=208&t=489707) Just an FYI.

-R

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