First EVER head! be kind!

[three]

Looks A-Okay. :D
I've been modeling humans for like 2 years now, and I still can't get it right. :)
Looks like it's gonna be better for you though.
:thumbsup:

The only crits I've got is that he hasn't got any collarbones and you've missed the muscles going from the collar bones to the end of the chin (under the ear, you know). Don't know the names for it though

:xtreme:

[Daveaustin]

Cheers 3

that means a lot coming from someone who's experienced in modeling humans... i'll have a look at his collarbones or rather lack of collarbones tomorrow.. as its just gone midnight, an i'm kinda tired now..

yeh i know which muscles you mean - the one's that make your neck look bigger :)

oh BTW do you know any sites that have good tutorials on modeling ears?.. i'm kinda desperate

[Rye]

This is great fr the first head youve ever done. You should see the first one i did...it was HORRRRRIBLE! Maybe i should post it for you just to make you feel good about yourself :)

The head is a bit too small compared to the face. Usually the eyes fall right about at the middle of the head, so you should have a lot more forehead.

The neck muscles and tendons are off, but im guessing you arent focusing too much ont he neck right now and are just worrying about the head. Its really tough to see any details cause its such a small picture and its a little blown out, but its looking pretty good so far!

[Daveaustin]

Cheers Rye..

i'm not sure what you mean about the forehead bein too low.. i was attempting to use a couple of ref pics.. and i stuck to em pretty close.. so maybe my mate has a funny shaped head?:shrug:

yeh i haven't really spent a great deal of time on the neck n shoulders.. i'll do that tomorrow! other things i've got to sort out...

what i'm not happy with, is the mouth and his nose [nostrils]

check back for some updates!

[Rye]

oh well as for the forheadbeing too short, i did a paint over to show you what i mean, i hope you don't mind.

http://www.stuntbox.com/cgtalk/headpaintover.jpg

[Daveaustin]

oh yeah... i do see what you mean, i might do a hybrid of the 2... i'm startin to think my friend has a very funny shaped head :surprised but then i know everyone's different...

thanks for showing me though Rye.. i'm gonna tweak it! the more i look at it the more things i see wrong with it..
ah well the life of a perfectionist :shrug: :wip:

[three]

"One grows blind if one watch the model for too long."
/Old saying

The lips are really good done :) Me like... the nostrils are pretty good as well, might be a bit to large though, but that's all up to the reference you're working out of.
Try not to create all too perfect models, it'll give it more realism if it's a bit different from all the rest. If you're gonna put some hair on his head the forehead problem might seem smaller.

Do as thou wilt, for the model is thine.

[three]

oh, yeah, forgot :surprised. If you haven't seen this page yet, take a look at it. There's a really good tutorial on ears as well. Damn worth a look :D

Ear tutorial (http://www.3dtotal.com) and then on to "Free stuff", Tutorials and under the headline "Complete projects" on that page, click "Modeling Joan of Arc by Michel Roger".

Edit: Forgot the link :hmm:

[Daveaustin]

Cheers 3 for that link to the tutorial.. saved it an gonna work through it..
yeh i was planning to give him some kind of hairstyle, but i'm also gonna tweak the height of the forehead slightly.. i'm sure it'll all be ok when it's done!:wip:

and once i'm happy with the model. i'm gonna take the symmetry out, cos i've only flipped it at this stage..

watch out for some updates in a couple of hours ..

[Daveaustin]

UPDATE

well 3 i tried that tutorial link you put up... worked a treat, i'll just have to try an remember it!!
I've spent some more time on his neck an shoulders.. gettin more shape in them, still haven't tweaked his nose n mouth corners

but at least he's got ears now :thumbsup:

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP3.jpg

and the wire

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP3_wire.jpg

[Daveaustin]

thought i'd put up one side of his head this time....

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP4.jpg

i've spent a lot of time tweaking his nostrils and mouth, generally reshaping his overall shape.. and i think it's starting to get somewhere..

[Rye]

lookin great! I dont know if you are still working on the ears (they are certainly getting there), but they still need quite a bit more detail. You are missing the main shapes right now.

Could you post the pics you are using for reference?

[Daveaustin]

thanks Rye,
well i'm kinda refining the whole thing, because everytime i take a break, i'll come back to it and see sommat that i'm not too sure about...

this is the latest stage hot off the pc..

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP5.jpg

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP5b.jpg

and here are the pics i'm usin as reference.. and yes i know at the moment it doesn't really look like this guy.. but you'll see what i mean about the forehead..

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/head_front.jpg :: http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/head_side.jpg

if you spot anything that looks out of place compared to my mate in the pics.. don't hesitate to tell me :thumbsup: :beer:
Cheers

[Rye]

he doesnt have a funny shaped head!! :)

I did a really quick paint over. But if you could post orthographic front and side views that would be great.

As you can see his eyes are almost exactly in the middle of his head:

http://www.stuntbox.com/cgtalk/headpaintoverref.jpg

[Daveaustin]

thanks for that Rye.. yeh it looks as if i'm gonna need to raise the top of his head slightly.. i couldn't really tell where it finished..
so i guessed

it's changed quite a bit since that last shot.. so i'll have to check on what you've said

i'm off to bed now... but i'll be postin an update tomorrow sometime..:beer:

[Daveaustin]

well.. here's the front, side and perspective shots of my mates head..

i think i'm quite happy with how it's turned out so far..

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP_grab.jpg

thoughts anyone?

[Aros]

There are a couple of flaws.

First of all, the ear isnt placed correctly:

http://www.vazeno.com/personal/sug.gif

Second, the jaw line isnt good either:
http://www.vazeno.com/personal/sug2.gif

Good luck :)

[Daveaustin]

thanks Aros... i wasn't sure what to do about the ear.. because i can get it perfectly lined up in the right window... but then it appears too low in the front window :surprised what do i do??

thanks for pointing out the jaw line.. i've also noticed that the muscles in his neck stick out too far as well.. [by this ear]

i'll be postin an update in a while [once i've done these things]
thanks again for your help :thumbsup:

[Dennik]

Make your neck thinner, and also round a litle bit the corner of the mouth. Actually the mouth needs some more work. Examine carefully the edge line where the upper lip and lower lip meet. It is not straight in your reference.
Don't forget to put tearducts on the eyeholes.
If you plan to animate that face, and i suppose thats the case, you better plan ahead and add more geometry for forehead wrinkles and adjust your polygons for extreme morph targets such as a wide smile. If it is possible, take reference photos from as many facial expressions as you can, so that you can work your morphs based on that reference.
Good job so far.

Dennis

[Daveaustin]

Cheers Dennik,

i've just read your reply, hopefully this update will have taken into account some of those comments..

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP6.jpg

sorry it's a small image... but i have honestly changed the width of the neck and quite a few other parts..

i''m gonna go in and add more geometry to the forehead and the eyes.. to be able to add more detail :thumbsup:

EDIT - and i know there are seams at the mo... but i didn't bother merging the two halves, so that's y :shrug:

[Daveaustin]

ok i did a quick cam pan capture around the head, so you can get a better idea for what needs tweaking, it's only 150kb, but you need divx 5.0.3..

here it is HEAD SPIN (http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/WIP_head_spin.avi)

I'd love to hear some feedback, as i'm aiming for really high quality modeling :thumbsup:

[Aros]

Originally posted by Daveaustin
thanks Aros... i wasn't sure what to do about the ear.. because i can get it perfectly lined up in the right window... but then it appears too low in the front window :surprised what do i do??

Only thing I can think of is that it's because the ear is rotated too much.

[Daveaustin]

cheers Aros... yeh it was that.. it'd dawned on me, and i just rotated it slightly, seemed to do the trick..

hopefully you'll be able to see that in the quick ani i did of it...

it'll be a couple of days before i get chance to work on this again... so no doubt it'll have disappeared off the first page..

I will be updatin soon though..:thumbsup:

[Rye]

Lookin good there :) Your wireframe has some problems with it. Your edge loops are in the wrong place. Theres a really good explanation of this in some head modeling site (i think its in the general forums somewhere), but i made a picture to show you what I mean. Hopefully this will make a little bit of sense:

http://www.stuntbox.com/cgtalk/edgeloop01.jpg

http://www.stuntbox.com/cgtalk/edgeloop02.jpg

One thing I noticed is that your orthographic front view matches up with your picture which is not right. This will make the head look much skinnier than it should be because the picture is in perspective but your modeling fron the front view is not. So what you have to do is use a 35mm camera view from the front to compare with the picture, same for the side view. When you look at it from the front view without perspective, the head should look much wider than the picture. Its hard to explain, i hope you understand what i mean. Keep up the good work, when you are done modeling this you will have learned A LOT. :thumbsup:

[Daveaustin]

thanks Rye.. i'd not noticed the whole edge loops thing...

i guess the next head i model i'll start with the eye.. and make concentric circles, that's the way to do it huh?

and that thing about the front and side views went kinda over the top of my head.. but i think i know what you mean

i'd noticed that when i duplicated the mesh his head always seemed to be skinnier, so i just change the viewing options and it'll sort it?
thanks for that Rye, you've been a great help!

[three]

I really like the look of it now :D
The ear got to be pretty well done :) I'm sure that you'll take good care of this one.

:thumbsup:

[Daveaustin]

Cheers 3, yeh i'm pretty happy with that ear, although it isn't identical to my mates, it isn't far off :shrug: that tutorial you posted really helped, i followed it religiously!!

next job is fixing the dodgy edge loops.. not sure how i'm gonna do that.. some rearrangin is in order me thinks :surprised

my mates keep telling me that i should keep progressing... up to the stage where i'm using SSS for the transparencies in his skin, one step at a time, but i'm looking forward to gettin this done and dusted!:wip:

[Rye]

i know its a pain in the butt but often times i find the best way to fix a problem like that is to just start over. Its great practice too. THe more you do it, the faster and better you will become. The tutorial you used to make that ear has a GREAT tutorial on making a head. I recommend you try it out just to see how the edge loops should be placed. Good luck :)

[Daveaustin]

thanks Rye...

I will have a look at that head tut, but i was kinda nice to try an figure it out myself.. b4 i realised it had all started to bodge up :shrug:

at least if i start over on a new head i'll be able to do it quicker.. and better..
I'll try an fix this edge loop thing on this model without destroyin the whole thing, if that doesn't work then hey ho back to square one:surprised

[Daveaustin]

well it's been a while since i last updated this thread..

but after rejigging the edge loops, thanks to Rye for pointing that one out to me..

I thought i'd move on to the guy's Torso.. i haven't spent long on it so far. just getting the rough shape in...

if there's sommat i'm blatantly missing out on.. can you peeps let me know.

also i'd like to hear any feedback whatsoever.. so let the crits fly! :thumbsup:

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP7.jpg

EDIT - yes i know about the funny looking pecs.. i'm gonna be changin em pretty soon

[Daveaustin]

doesn't anyone wanna comment?

[Aros]

I'm not the master of human anatomy, but here are some suggestions:

Red = add
Blue = del

http://www.vazeno.com/personal/sug3.gif

(I don't have my wacom plugged in ATM, this is really shitty to draw accurate)

Good luck :thumbsup:

[Aros]

Oh, and here are some reference pics for ya (but I think you already know this site): http://www.fineart.sk/body.htm

[Gremlin]

sweet references!!!
anywho, I still think his forhead receeds too fast... give it more roundicity! :wip:

[Daveaustin]

thanks guys!
Aros, great help with that pic :thumbsup: cheers..
i kinda knew about the funny pecs.. but i thought i'd upload that shot anyway..

i'm not really aiming for superhero washboard stomach.. nor regular Jo shmo.. but somewhere inbetween.. so those ref pics'll help out, but i won't model the pecs or abs to that extent.. but the back shot will really help! because for the moment i started to model it but it was out of my head/and old memories from life class..

Gremlin... you still think his forehead is too 'short'?? really? i've modeled it spot on with my mates head... i'm pretty sure of that..
if it seems a little off the norm, then i guess that's the way his mother made him :shrug:

but isn't that the sort of thing that makes us individuals?

[Daveaustin]

well i've been modeling away.. like there's no tomorrow

here's a couple of shots of what stage i'm up to now
FRONT
http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP8.jpg

BACK
http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP8b.jpg

HEAD
http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/man_head_WIP8c.jpg

and finally a 360 cam pan 120kb
http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/WIP_body_spin.avi

[Aros]

Looking good.

I think the chest area looks better, but not accurate yet.. They look like man boobs now ;)
I think the back looks too square, and there should be a vertical line in the middle of the back.

Keep it up:thumbsup:

[Daveaustin]

Cheers Aros... yeh he has got man boobs hasn't he :wip:
prob cos he hasn't got abs yet... so they kinda stand out a bit

i've got to put in a spine.. and the muscles that run down his back..
Oh does anyone know how to do a decent skin shader?

[Stepunk]

Yea! I like it very much :)

Great modeling job!

[Carina]

I am the laziest person I know, so I haven't actually read all the posts..

Please don't shoot me if someone has said this before, but I think the mesh you have is a bit too dense. When you have a really dense mesh every little vertex that is slightly out of place will be even more visible when you smooth your model.

So basically, try to keep your head models as er.. un-dense (my english just failed me horribly) as you can and you will end up with nicer flowing surfaces.

It's a good first try! But yeah, I feel a bit sorry for him, those man boobs aren't very becoming :shrug:

[Daveaustin]

Stepunk : i'm glad you like it :thumbsup: i've been workin on it for about a week or so now... off an on.. Good luck with yours!

Carina : Yeh i know what you mean about the density of the mesh, it is quite high, but i kinda like the variations on the skin.. i think it almost resembles a person's skin :shrug: like bumps and creases.. thanks for the comment though :thumbsup:
Oh and i'm workin on his man boobs now.. as well as adding in some subtle abs.. so fingers crossed we won't be seeing anymore of his saggy man breasts :surprised

[Daveaustin]

....well it's been a while since any updates and i've kinda gone off on a tangent with the whole body modeling thing [partly because i got stuck on the arms an legs]

got some other weird idea in my head.. and it kinda looks like this

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/torso_sci_fi_WIP.jpg

[there's gonna be computer terminals and railings and more tubes and some subtle lighting.. and possibly a balcony of some sort]

oh and of course all the texturing :wip:

EDIT - this will be the last update in this thread.... as i've gone off on a different subject

but you can expect updates of this current WIP in a whole new thread :thumbsup:

[Daveaustin]

doesn't anyone have any comments/crits? or are you all waiting for me to upload a new one?

[SteffanPoulsen]

WOA ! this is awesome Dave :thumbsup: you clearly have a pretty decent way with anatomy.

A suggestion would be that you take another look at those stomach abs. :D

:beer:

[Daveaustin]

Thanks Steffan.. I've only just checked back on this thread, i've been pretty busy rendering out my reel.. so this WIP and the branched off sci-fi one have kinda slowed down..

"you clearly have a pretty decent way with anatomy"
you think?? that's nice of ya.. seeing as this is the very first human[ish] model i've done... i do have some more up to date shots of this guy.. with ammended abs.. so i'll stick that up in a bit..

I got slightly stuck on his arms n legs, but i'm determined to overcome that little obstacle..

i've also come quite far with that sci-fi scene.. so much so that i've half modeled a drone robot for the chamber room..

lots of updates to come.. [but might appear in a new thread]

[Daveaustin]

ok well i did say i'd stick some updates up here, so here's the first one...

at the mo, i've steered away from a photoreal head, but i haven't given up..

this is just a test into different materials

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/torso_metal.jpg

thoughts/comments would be greatly appreciated... whether it's a crit about the anatomy of the model or the dodgy material..

[Daveaustin]

yep here's another one....

http://www-scm.tees.ac.uk/users/group1/dave/new_renders/torso_metal_2.jpg

[sizzlebits]

I've gotta say that I think your composition skills are better than your modeling skilz. I liked the image torso_sci_fi_WIP. Think it needs more light, though. More color. =) :buttrock:

[k2skier]

this comment is a little late but I think that you need to soften the transition around the lips. A lot of people (including myself at one time) think that the lips have a ridge to it, but most of that is our eyes playing a trick on us when it is just a change in color. Also the nostrils on your model are very hard too, if you take a good look at the picture you will see a much softer curvature from nostril to cheek.

keep up the great work!

[Daveaustin]

sizzlebits.. that env.. you commented on, that's all changed now.. i'm still workin on it but i'll be posting a new pic soon.. and i kinda wanted it to remain almost washed out, but i'm going to introduce a single colour into the scene.

as for my modeling skills.. are you talkin about the bloke? if so.. i don't mind cos that's my very first attempt at a humanoid :shrug:

k2skier .. i'll have a look at his nose + lips, always good to have fresh eyes on a project :thumbsup: i wouldn't have spotted it

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