Sketchbook Thread of Sirielle

[sirielle]

03-16-2007, 01:48 AM

I hope Giordano doesn't roll in his grave. Still got wonky armor-to-be. I have no idea what has happened to lower demons/angels wings in the original (the pair on the left) and have problem with them here. Do you see their wings on Giordano's original? Can't decide their armor either, heavy boots or sandals.

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/2159/szkic4n1rh1.jpg


03-16-2007, 04:38 PM

Still trying to finish mine, I changed the composition to cut down amount of figures. Larger wings :) The composition lacks something in the place where I put my signature, maybe I'll add something there in the end if I manage.

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/3308/szkic4n3hp1.jpg


Or maybe I'll move the main angel to the left in the end to have more balance, putting his leg over fallen angel's throat not chest. Will see.

I hope colors are not awful, I try to pick them from Giordano's painting all the time, laptop wasn't mend for painting, really. And all is more blue here than on my screen at home.

03-16-2007, 07:38 PM

Pieces moved more, now composition should be better.

http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/3307/szkic4n5mf8.jpg


Yesterday, 12:28 AM

Done. I saved the RIFF and TIFF files in Painter exactly at midnight Polish time. [Started in Painter IX, finished in X demo.] I planed to finish it more, but that's all I managed to do. Here is the final whole piece and Mr archangel's close up (resized a bit, too and levels corrected, but actually I have no idea what way colors look like on a screen with correct gamma settings ;) ):

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/2738/szkic4n7cropfo8.jpg


http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/8186/szkic4n7be7.jpg


T.b.c. later, that's for workshop's end.

[Rebeccak]

sirielle,

Great to see you putting up a Sketchbook! I've really enjoyed watching your WIPs progress. The painting has an organic feel so far which is really nice. It will certainly be cool to follow your progress here and to see how you improve.

Cheers!

[SylvanMist]

Hi Sirielle!
That's an interesting approach to doing a master copy..I never thought of first blurring the image to understand/get the basic shapes/colors down. Does it help you a lot more starting that way?
Good job on it so far too :)

[sirielle]

Rebeccak, thank you for the welcome, I'm glad you enjoyed the WIP process of this painting. I hope to finish it with time and to be more active on CGTalk :)

Roja, hi! I saw a tutorial here on CGTalk which advised to blur or to squint eyes to see the basic shapes and valor/color better while painting from a reference photographs. The same time a friend advised me to copy colors not shapes, so I decided to combine both advices. It was more comfortable to blur the original image then keep my eyes squinted all the time, so I blurred it. Together with a grid set better (default grid in Painter was too detailed for this stage) it gave quite nice and easy way to work. When I get back to details things get complicated again, but I had the basic shapes ready. I usually focus on details too fats and forget of the whole image, so it was good to practice this way.

[Asatira]

Nice to see you have a sketchbook now. I think you were doing rather well with the master copy; I look forward to seeing your progress to a finished piece. I hope to see more stuff as well.

[sirielle]

Asatira, thank you. I'll start working on the angels as soon as I get back home, I'm still on a wrong side of the Baltic Sea ;)
I'm trying to sketch, but still got anatomy and shading issues. A portrait of an elf I try to paint for a long time, another test. Not him, yet.

http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/3333/finturretlcrop22ml4.jpg

[xX_eXiGe_Xx]

That elf reminds me of a friend i used to have, nice to "see" him again lol :).

[NR43]

Hi

nice thread start!
Watch the centre line of the face when drawing/painting heads...

looking forward to see more

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, nice to see your sketchbook started. Good work on the angel. I love the soft treatment of the wings. You have a nice beginning to your elf. I am practicing with the Loomis studies. There are some really great head studies that may be of use to you. :)Here..http://www.fineart.sk/

[sirielle]

NR43, thank you, I shifted his face features left and right already, now moved them more, still not there, but better I hope.

Samanthie, thank you, I'm glad you like the wings. I haven't finally decided on them, yet.
I know Loomis, haven't taken ref images with me though and forgot to check them again on-line, silly me XD But soon I'll be home and hopefully have more time for art.

For now I just moved the chin and middle of the hair line more towards head's back, I'll work on him more later.


http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/7070/finturretlcrop222fd4.jpg

[sirielle]

Some practice from December - finally got a scanner:

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9287/szkic13112006eyesig4.jpg

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/2311/szkic24122006fb3.jpg

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/3974/szkicxixii2006facesug4.jpg

And yesterday's exercise with Loomis, a concept for the future drawing:

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/6577/szkic15iv2007ru1.jpg

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, great to see an update! :) Nice ink studies, love the eyes and the portraits in ink, very good contrast. Hope to see more now that you have that scanner! Nice update on the elf. Watch the shape of the iris, it is looking a bit eliptical rather than round.

[Rebeccak]

Hey sirielle,

Good to see you putting more work up, and the sketches have some really nice qualities to them. The major thing I would recommend is to do some drawing from life - what I'm noticing in some of the sketches is that they feel a little bit flat, but I think if you drew from life (other people, self portraits, etc.) this would be less the case. Do you have access to any life drawing sessions in your area? If so, I definitely recommend attending. :)

[sirielle]

Samanthie, thank you :) The eyes are done in a ball pen, not ink, I should have mention that. Ink would be harder, I guess.
I always tend to make elliptical eyes and/or iris, thank you for the warning. I hope I haven't done it now, too. Hmmm, I think I've done it.

Rebeccak, I should start drawing from life, I always avoid it for I can't stand such rough sketches as the "falconer" in my last post. Though I like that one. I leave in a big city so there has to be some course somewhere, being in a group would motivate me to make them.

Results of the sleepless night, no reference apart my older take on that character:

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/215/finwealmostpt4.jpg


Experimental mixture of oils, oil pastels, blenders and other Painter brushes.

[sirielle]

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/4672/sirion01mx8.jpg

A test from last night. [Painter]

[ha-dou-ken]

Nice start Karolina,

I haven't really touched painter, so I'd like to see youre progress with the program. It's hard.:sad:

You have a very fantasy like quality to all your paintings, I dig it.:thumbsup: More!? Please?

[sirielle]

ha-dou-ken, I'm glad you like it. I wanted to make a short comic but ended in one image.

Fantasy is the most frequent theme of my works, though better would be to describe it with a quote of one net group info Tolkien is my religion, The Silmarillion is my Bible, Eru is my God Of course it's not my religion, but illustrating that book is one of my dreams. For now I still struggle with proportions and other evil beasts ;)

Painter is very good tool, hard to say what is better of the two most used programs, some things can be done faster in Photoshop, others in Painter. But I'm sure I don't use Painter properly with all the goods it has to offer, like various brushes which I guess could be used the same way as in traditional media, if I only knew what this way is. So I use various brushes but not the way they would be used on real canvas.

I see you've got a lot of good realistic drawings from sculpture of classical art references in your thread, very good job. I should try it, too, for painting fantasy creatures only will not teach me all I should know :)

[sirielle]

Comic test #2. Balrogs. Who likes them?

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/5784/glorfindelbalroghq7.jpg

Putting him in the middle would be more composition wise, the silly sword is "cut" Oh, well, that was fun, good night!

[sirielle]

I just wated to fix his ear position ;)

http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/7239/glorfindelbalrog21dv3.jpg

Now I can't believe I wanted to leave it in that first stage. T.b.c.

[Samanthie]

Hey Sirielle, I like your fantasy work. Looking forward to more on this latest one. :)

[sirielle]

Hey! I should have posted it in WIP forums, but I'll continue updating here. Maybe later, we'll see. I've posted it in WIPs at other boards. Latest steps:

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3760/glorfindelbalrog3xi4.jpg

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/3760/glorfindelbalrog32yi9.jpg



I'm trying to find a sword for him.I feel it's too long, boys tell me it's too short XD
I lost the cuirass shape a bit, need to find it back.

And he probably would like me to stop bothering him ;)

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/9674/glorfindelbalrogfacewipxy1.jpg

Someone told me he is too feminine, I can't see it. He is not pretty on a purpose for this image, it's rather armor concept than anything else. Maybe the way he grasps hilt right now makes it, I've messed shading a bit I guess.

[Rebeccak]

Heya sirielle, :)

Interesting to watch your progress - some good stuff going on. The main thing I might suggest is using reference of some kind - your work looks to be mostly from imagination only, and I think it could be enhanced by checking out reference for the anatomy and clothing. Color wise in your latest piece, everything all over the image is warm and in the same general area of the color wheel, which is making it harder for you to establish a sense of depth. Hope this helps. :)

[sirielle]

I was browsing for armor references and looked at too many and too long ;) I don't want realism here, but if something is off for then I should fix it.
I almost never use references, I haven't learned to use them, yet. The most referenced piece I did is the Angel and Devils workshop image.

I lost my shading color somewhere, now none of the colors works. Maybe it should be purple and green or cyan. The armor should be golden but I can add more shadow to the background - I guess it's night and balrog itself is a demon of a black fire and shadow, so his symbolical presence here can darken background a bit more.

[sirielle]

It started as a pencil sketch which I've changed a lot in Painter, in fact it barely looks like the first sketch. I was looking at Loomis' examples while working with pencil (and at a movie on TV), but I didn't make any help lines (again). Painter's pastels, chalk, charcoal, pencils and other brushes - I was trying to keep natural media look.
According to tips I got here and there I fixed him that much that he doesn't look like him anymore O_o Now I wonder if leaving the first flawed version wouldn't be better for him. My father suggested that he's got such strange cheek just because he's been in fight and got bruised ;)



http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/7596/orodreth4spw5.jpg

And the first sketch in attachment, it looks funny in comparison to the set above ;)

[sirielle]

Look what a wonderful help (http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=148736#148736) I got on him from Mercuralis! :D

[NR43]

That was a really nice thing of her to do.
very useful indeed!

[sirielle]

Yes, especially that I keep repeating all these mistakes and now I have
them explained :) But I had no time to take care of this guy, yet.

[sirielle]

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/222/finmirind2th3.jpg

A concept for a future drawing. Or a sketch, a wip, whatever future brings ;)

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, Interesting image of the guy in the red armour. The first looks as if his shoulder is too far forward which seems to be improved in the second version. A reference will help you get those proportions down better. It would be great to see some anatomy studies as well. Keep posting you work. :)

[sirielle]

Hi Samanthie, I'm still chicken to do anatomy studies ;)

I've been told to darken shading on this arm to make it pop out less then it
should be visible as being further. I'm still not happy with the
armour. I will work on it more later, hopefully today. As soon as this
little painter goes out from my mind ;)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/5401/finmirind3hr0.jpg

[sirielle]

Stormy weather finally forced me to take a pencil in my hand instead of tablet's pen. HB Pencil (have no other O_o) and a black gel-pen and one more soft black ball pen. I'm pleased with result even if something is wrong with his arms.

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/2568/nothingtodeclareym2.jpg


That's my first totally completely nude man :twisted: and the first muscles drawing. Reference (http://www.posemaniacs.com/blog/2007/02/stand5_m_v0_h0.php) (just rotate it 1 step to the right to get a highlight on upper leg; this is great set of pose references (http://www.posemaniacs.com/blog/pose/), I only wish to know what is written there).
I need to do more of these, that was fun :D

Ah, but first I drew this. I shouldn't show you this one for something went wrong with his legs XD Just stiff 8 heads practice from Loomis:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8862/amistiffsv1.jpg


Uh no, there is no undo option, that is scary :eek:

[nelchee]

the first one is great! the other guy is a bit too narrow around waist and hips.

nice painting style :)

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, I agree with Nelchee, that top sketch is great! I like the linework very much. The second sketch is good too but to me his legs below the knees seem a little short. Keep practicing and posting!:)

[sirielle]

Thank you both! I don't know what I did with this funny guy's legs, I used lines for 8 heads and measured all as Loomis did, yet I messed with feet. Loomis probably did ankles lower and had feet in a different perspective, I'll have to draw it again later.

[sirielle]

The same book and family, but to make life easier let's call him a boy in toga. Anatomy, light and texture practice in a moment I should really be painting something else.

http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/5057/facebookselfdoodle2ay3.jpg


I usually work in a different way, but here I flipped the half face and shifted features to get the face I wanted.Then I painted alternative face variants to came back to the old one:

http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/7948/arakano4ks4.jpg


I managed to spoil his chest a bit, so I'll post less scribbled image later when I fix it.
*Lights - I wanted to have sidelights silver and golden, these lights mingle and fill the air,there is no sun or any other light source. I could try to paint the trees which produce these lights, but that would kill me probably.
*I need to do something with background, colour is awful.
*And find out how to paint his hair to reflect the lights.

[Samanthie]

He has a nice face Sirielle.:) His forehead may be a little narrow. The neck looks right but the muscles leading up to it near the shoulders are curved inwardly. Curves go outward as I have learned from Rebecca. This takes practice but it will make a great deal of difference to your work. Keep sketching!

[sirielle]

Thank you :) Could you underline me what you mean about the muscles?
I've got them also shifted wrong - I mean a part of torso is rotated, a part not (one collarbone higher than other). Haven't get to drawing today, yet.

[fii7e]

Hi sirielle!
Nice progress Sirielle! :thumbsup: gogo

[sirielle]

Thank you, Viktor :)

[Samanthie]

Here is a quick illustration as to what I mean. It's just a subtle curve that is less inward/more outward.:)
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a353/Samanthie_/man1.jpg

[sirielle]

Oh yes,now I see!I was looking totally at different thing XD Thank you! :D

[sirielle]

Let's call them concept doodles or visual notes to remember what I wanted to draw. Doodled without any reference, so I expect proportions are off. I'll be drawing all anew one day when I get back to these:

http://pics.livejournal.com/sirielle/pic/0009c9z1
Dance.

That's in fact remake of that old ball-pen sketch,though I wasn't looking at it:
http://pics.livejournal.com/sirielle/pic/00013r92
I'm still looking for the right pose for them, need a reference for that.

http://pics.livejournal.com/sirielle/pic/0009dzdd
Three hunters.

http://pics.livejournal.com/sirielle/pic/0009ez6q
Wild run under stars. I don't know how to "bite" this one, what angle, format. The guy in the foreground has to be kicked out for sure.

[sirielle]

[dead links]

[sirielle]

http://pics.livejournal.com/sirielle/pic/0009g4hs

No time to draw boys better, good night! (5AM)

[Wongedan]

Hi, its a nice stuffs here,

in my oppinion drawing by using some real photo reference, will improve you a lot also :)

dont worry if you dont want to finish it
just ignore some area that you are not interested make it propotional but less detail
have more detail for the area that you are interested

start paint in the far distance of zomming, its small, so its easier to get proportion
then start zooming in and add more detail

[NR43]

hi sirielle

have you heard of Ben Miller? He's an excellent model who has a lot of excellent stock photo's available for us to study anatomy.

You can find them at his deviantart account here (http://justmeina.deviantart.com/).

I really like the muscle man you drew a few posts back... lovely drawing with a nice snece of humour...

keep it up!

[sirielle]

Thank you both for your input :thumbsup:

xvampire, I agree - basically using references at all will improve. Photos tend to be distorted, so must be chosen carefully, but they are helpful. Yet I did last doodles without any reference. I plan to make this silly comic right now, so I'll browse what resources I have, but I focus more on fun this time. I spent last year or more focusing on catching proportions and symmetry, fixing details almost without fun. Apart that painting is great fun itself, yet it was all more frustrating than enjoyable. So now I decided to paint more for fun. Thus I'll take your advice:
"don't worry if you don't want to finish it just ignore some area that you are not interested make it proportional but less detail have more detail for the area that you are interested"
- that's it :D

I plan to finish that boy in toga and will not hide his chest, I'll try to fix it just in sake of learning, but I will not whine and worry over it for weeks as I used to. Also I plan to finish finally all the WIPs waiting on my HDD, some for 2 years, because there was a detail or anatomy problem I couldn't solve. Now I'll focus on what I like there and let it go away. I could have create more images if I didn't focus on these mistakes which stopped me, I lost too much time because of it.

"start paint in the far distance of zooming, its small, so its easier to get proportion
then start zooming in and add more detail"

I painted the last doodles zoomed out and it's helpful indeed. I want to make something more from that female, but for that I need to take a closer look at ancient sculptures of India and at odissi dancers.

NR43, I've got a lot of his photos saved even, but never paintedhim, yet. He provides great quality reference.
The muscle man was done from 3D skinless renders from web and it was real fun, especially taht I was sure I can't draw that detailed without tablet ;) Now I plan to attend CAFÉ Special Stage 01 - THE MALE ÉCORCHÉ, this is great idea, just why all happens in these 2 weeks? But I can't lose that chance to work on anatomy with other maniacs :)

[sirielle]

[dead links]

[sirielle]

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/4672/sirion01mx8.jpg

A test from last night. [Painter]



http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/5133/silmarilback2se6.jpg


Tried to finish it a bit last night,go messed with background so I borrowed one from the other image of mine. Yet when I compare the WIP and finished variant now I am not sure if that was a good idea. At least I should try a background.

That's in fact alternative take on the same situation - the guy walking with a sword in flames, in front of his army, just now he got further and his target is behind that door.

[sirielle]

Finishing old WIP from December, just started:

http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/289/wild0000yj0.th.jpg (http://img57.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wild0000yj0.jpg)


I've forgotten - after a few repaints the previous image ended up this way and I'm not touching it anymore:

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/3217/silmarilbehindyb6.jpg

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, this latest image of the figure in armour at the door is lovely almost dreamy. I really like the colors you have used.
You have some good form with your pen and ink studies. Also I like the one above that is called Dance. Nice shading with it. Keep going with your anatomy studes. :) I need to do this as well. ;)

[sirielle]

Thank you Samanthie :) I thought I'll take a part in écorché workshops, but had to do a few things on different deadlines, and now I'm leaving for a couple of days, I don't know if I manage to do anything after coming back. But simply looking at the progress folks make there is worthy. I hope to draw the skinless men on my own later using the models they did in the workshops as reference. When I come back - more anatomy studies :)

[rdsarna]

Hi Karolina!
Beautiful work there....Your digital work is really appealing!

The last one has an air of mystery as to what lies on the other side of the door....
really impressive....

I love art work that speaks for itself....:)

Looking forward to more posts from you.......

Tke Cre
Ratul

[sirielle]

Thank you Ratul :) I plan to steal a few ideas from your culture of Ancient India one day, when I finally manage to draw properly my dancers :D

[sirielle]

I should be driving South now, but delayed departure. The red haired elf ended up this way, I'll work on him later:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/2502/wildtest2cropyv1.jpg

and background test:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/6100/wildtest2ab0.th.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wildtest2ab0.jpg)

[sirielle]

I should be driving now, or already reaching my destination right now, but it will have to wait another day. Two days delay. Arrrgh, me!

So, since I'm still at home let's have some elements in action:

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/3773/elementsev0.jpg


Painter IX. Done for Daily Sketch challenges at Epilogue. I wanted my elements to be ballet dances in a first thought so my Earth is not that heavy. I hope my elements are distinguishable, maybe all apart air/wind waiting for it's turn in the background ;)

[sirielle]

Working on an old sketch which was drawing starting with perspective lines exercise, now I'm trying to turn it into a portrait:

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/3705/liesv3pi.jpg

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/8635/nerdanelwipjc0.jpg


Face is blurred on purpose- taht's not exactly 'that' face. This is mother of my fav red head (who I paint sop often) and I want them to have more family resemblance. We'll see.

[damdakikedi]

awesome jobs! i dont have the knowledge to crit you. just im watching your thread with a great pleasure :)

[sirielle]

Thank you :) The first face was no male,nor female,but when I sketched it it looked like her. I see her as strong women - also in look, but not that angular as on the first sketch. So I'm trying to find her right face - resembling her son, but also being her own. There are some anatomy issues on the sketch,I think I fixed most already.

[sirielle]

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/2473/royaldutiesdb5.jpg


Finally took tablet's pen into my hand :D Wasn't painting since July :eek:

I'm not sure about the women faces, they were supposed to look like a drawing not a smooth painting (and different from each other), I may work on that later; haven't touched the painter, yet (except resizing him a bit):

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2174/finmirind3nissizt6.jpg

[sirielle]

DSC #28: Barbarian King (http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=20057&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=) on Epilogue. I was going to sketch my king when I saw this challenge today, then decided to do a speed painting... Well, this was speed of a turtle :lol: About 3/4 hours. Overdosed (on purpose) and messed anatomy (not on purpose), but I'm pleased anyway - Conan was blond :twisted:

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/5247/barbariankingso9.jpg

[sirielle]

I couldn't stand women's faces, especially that they do not resemble the women at all. One has got sharp and heart shaped face, the other strong cheek bones and oval face, etc. So I have let Finwë paint them more symbolically - matching resemblance only in colors and brows shape. I hope now their face is OK. I may add a little here later, but I'll leave painting the rest to my little painter. In fact he is painting them, I only report it here ;)

http://img76.imageshack.us/img76/3990/finmirind3nissifixedbv7.jpg

[VincereCaos]

You have great works here, I really like your elf concept, the way you painted his face he looks very realistic.
I think you did a good job changing the face of the womens, I think the strong cheekbone they had made them look more like a guy, now that you softened it they look more girly :)
By the way,the face of your speedpainting looks very good, the way you accentuated his features with yellows gives him this kind of glowy look, and goes very well with his hair :D, very nice, very nice for being a quick painting (the only speed thing I've been able to do are sketches...with pencil D: )
Keep it up :bounce:

[sirielle]

Thank you! Pencil is a great tool, I need to work with it more, either. Just bought books on anatomy, so as soon as I finish a few drawings I plan to draw hands, feet, legs, chests... I'm just fighting with chest's back of my little painter with a nose in the books ;) I managed to spoil him, but hopefully I'll fix that.
From the speedy painting I like the face most :) Face and the ridiculous horns which might hurt the owner of the throne ;) Fantasy XD

[NR43]

I think it's not a bad idea to have the hair color "shine through" in some of the facial features, but I think your approach doesn't work. Now it looks like paint on her face. Maybe blend those yellow and blue colors more in the skin colors.

The swirls in the hair are lovely, but personally, I would have put that layer on overlay or soft light or something, to make the lines a bit more unified with the tones.

Check the shoulder anatomy on your barbarian king. The position of the deltoid muscle is off.

Keep working you are making lots of progress and it's always a pleasure to see your work :)
More soon I hope!

[sirielle]

Thank you for the points and encouragement :)

I added the line art especially to the women's face for they supposed to be a drawing while I had them more refined than the painter himself. In fact they should be in art nouveau style but I don't know how to make it. So I just scribed the line art on the top of faces, it wasn't there before. If I find any way to fix it I may try, if not - my little painter will have to finish it ;) I might also go for a brush strokes look and cover faces with a lot of them, we'll see.

Barbarian has got arm and neck to fix, I haven't touched it yet, except fixing his nipple position. In fact he needs another arm, bent knee with a crown on it (robbed in the south) and something else. Maybe I'll have to paint the whole image anew.

[sirielle]

Update. I have spoiled his back (twisted it too much back, it supposed to be more 3/4 side view) and fixed back, but I'm not sure of it:

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/8893/finmirind3plecy2xc2.jpg

- the old and newest variant. Haven't touched hands, yet. Amount of hair cut down (looks poor now :( ).

And the little painter in the right background:

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/5347/finmirind4jl9.jpg


Light check would be great - I guess to paint he needs it from the top. Would there be any shadows on the mural then?

Edit. Or maybe this variant was better?
http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/8880/finmirind2cropzp5.jpg

[sirielle]

Where the lowered head goes? I'm lost!

http://img292.imageshack.us/img292/7654/offthyheadmv5.jpg

[sirielle]

I wanted to finish that barbarian king's portrait and went a bit too far with ideas. What shall I do with him now? :twisted:

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/899/barbariankingtest2croply8.jpg


http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/2306/barbariankingtestsej4.jpg


Crop the head and forget about knees, choose one of options or make something else? I'm not sure of his pants type, either, leaving him without any is tempting ;) He should have something on if the slave is going to be there. He is too stiff, either.

[NR43]

Seeing the thumbs like that... his head looks too small. It needs more mass at the back as well.
It's an interesting pose so why not go for the big thing.

However, you would need a bit of a story though... for a barbarian king, the pose looks too "civilized".

Concerning the person sitting down in sideview, these might help:

justmenia pose 1 (http://justmeina.deviantart.com/art/hands-down-floor-59388796)
justmenia pose 2 (http://justmeina.deviantart.com/art/four-on-floor-54113710)
justmenia pose 3 (http://justmeina.deviantart.com/art/Blocked-left-glow-46846674)

Thinking about bones may help you a lot here. Where does the spine go and how does is the head connected to the rest of the body? How does the "swiveling" mechanism work when changing the position of the head (nodding yes, nodding no). Check your mirror :)

[tizianoadmirer]

Great stuff ! Is it me or your barbarian is heavily inspired by Michelangelo's Adam ? :)

[sirielle]

tizianoadmirer, not you, I was looking at Adam, one of Michelangelo's Ignudi gentlemen, stock photos and anatomy books, but none of them had exact pose I was looking for. I want him too be quite heavy as Adam is, but not the same.

NR43 - I collected these photos from Ben's stock (and was looking also at some for legs), but I thought the slave's head should be lower since there is no hope for salvation now. But maybe he could have it higher, as on the first linked picture of Ben. If I save him, I consider kicking him off the picture.
It started as barbarian king now I am torn between fantasy Viking, Celt or totally unknown northern tribe. Boy just got back from the south, robbed some Roman or Christian village/city and brought spoils of war, including a bishop's crown(kind of) or kind of Roman crown, which will finally make him a real king, since he had no crown before. And he has to have it somewhere thus I needed bent knee to put a crown there. Not on head, damn, he is not used to such non-comfortable hat ;) Of course the more I doodle the more ideas come. Maybe I should stay away from historical barbarians so no one accused me later that Celts were black haired (?) or bishops have no crown etc. The pose should be comfortable, I'll check what you noticed and act in front of mirror to check his head position!

[sirielle]

Can't find the right position for his right leg, so I thought I'll sketch some legs following anatomy books:

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/9549/legsbl8.jpg
(It was not sketched in one line, I just put it together after scanning.)

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/9062/feetoj3.jpg
We'll have to try again with feet later.

[sirielle]

Ha, some sketchy progress:
http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/6311/barbariankingtest3ir3.jpg
Polish scribblings say that I need to move his right foot up to place it better on slave's head or lower to place it on slave's leg, to move the horns left etc. Haven't I moved the head too much to the left?
He is still too stiff, but I finally moved that damned leg. Will have to move it up or down, but I'm glad I managed to work on it, for I was so angry on that guy tonight that I would gladly throttle him if that was only possible.

[NR43]

Hey Sirielle.
The refs shouldn't be used as an example to copy the pose straight away but I thought they would give you an idea on how the head is attached onto the trunk when under an angle ;)

Keep searching. You will eventually "invent" the right pose.

[Cyanid]

yes indeed. nice work on the painting. you make use of the soft brush/smudge tool a little too much in my taste, but I like the way you are trying different ways. nice charcoal drawings, you should do more of em.

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, Nice paintings. I know sometimes finding just the right pose is the hardest part of all to express your vision. You will get there.:) You have alot of nice colors going on in the painting of the woman with two faces, very interesting. I hope you will keep working on the king. He has a great face. The leg and feet studies are good. I know that right foot is throwing you a curve. I suggest more practice on the parts that give you the most trouble.( I am trying to do this too):D

[sirielle]

Johan, finally I'll do :)

Cyanid, Oh yes I used a lot of blenders here - blenders and Rob's brushes (Painter IX). I wanted to paint the whole image with more visible brush strokes at first, but before I noticed I was already blending all ;)
These were in pencil, I finally bought 2B, 4B and 6B pencils - that 6B one must give that effect (and maybe better contrast after scanning). If you are referring to b&w portrait done with Painter's paste brushes, than it doesn't have the charcoal feeling anymore, I'm just fixing it right now:(

Samanthie, I will! he problem is right now everything gives me nightmares. I just noticed I don't remember how to paint an eye. Oh, will practice more, maybe one day I'll remember ;)

I'm moving from WIP to WIP and nothing is finished.

Yes, that's this boy after fix ;)
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4383522&postcount=25

I feel messed with eyes again, but can't find it out:
http://upload3.postimage.org/73044/Orodreth_steps8_hair.jpg (http://upload3.postimage.org/73044/photo_hosting.html)
Is the further eye too small or both are too much in front position?

[sirielle]

OK, got some advice already and put in the line of sight and help lines, finally. Set after painting the image, but they fit. I finally noticed that my eyes were both from different face view. New eyes sketched according to a redline I got on Epi:


///del lmg

I'm still not sure about pupil vs mouth corner position of the further eye, they should match in front view if a person is looking straight ahead, so I guess they should match in 3/4 profile, they don't here.

[sirielle]

I did something in the middle - will extend the mouth corner and move the pupil a little closer. I think this line is not straight in reality - I just redlined one photo and the line pupil - mouth corner must be slanted. Cleaned red(pink)line:

http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/4287/orodrethsteps8redline2sp6.jpg

[NR43]

Great to see this.
another trick is that the distance between the 2 eyes (at the corners close to the nose) should be "about" the same as the width of 1 eye.


the bigger the foreshortening, the smaller the actual distance will be between 2 points on your paper (2D), to create the illusion of a distance in 3D space.

This is some very very important stuff you are displaying here and I'm glad you did.
It's basics like this that are often ignored, unfortunately

[sirielle]

Kay Allen at Epilogue taught me to draw the vanishing point and help lines, I would never think of it myself. But they should be put before sketching, not after the face has been painted. Though on the other hand every time I paint with all these measures I feel like I was completing a technical drawing, not painting. I guess the real fun will come later when I'll be able to catch proportions without guide lines.

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, you make a valid point I think in having the lines drawn first. Maybe make some guidelines as a template. It would be like using a grid in a way but I think it would be a great way to learn..and eventually drop the template as you improve.:)

[VincereCaos]

Is great that you decided to take your barbarian king speedpaint further :). oh that poor slave. hmm if you want to make your king have the heavy build of adam maybe you should make his torso more wide, in my opinion thats what really stands out in him.
that technique you're using on the last painting looks very difficult xD. I think even great artists use some sort of way to getting proportions right or to make sure that they are right.

[sirielle]

Heh, I've changed his eyes and features more and made another guide after he didn't fit to the old one ;) I still don't like the bottom part of his face and shadows are too dark, but I'm almost there :D Brows test #12:

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/8804/orodrethsteps12guidelinau0.jpg

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/8962/orodrethsteps12zi6.jpg

Samanthie, that's good idea, though usually every new image needs different guidelines. Apart that almost al I paint so far is the same head shot, hmmm.


VincereCaos, poor slave provides support for babr's legs, that's his main goal of life now. It's not so bad, they will throw things on him, shout and push through a room etc. but finally will trade him for some gold and jewelry ;)
After time I'm not sure anymore what way the barbarian guy should look like. I wanted a huge guy at first, Conan type, but I'm not sure anymore. Though yes, wide torso is still on my mind. But Adam is too broad, so I rather keep him as loose reference or I would have to broaden barb's face/head either to keep proportions.
Great artists invented all the ways to measure proportions and used them till they didn't need them. I hope I will not need any detailed guide lines in the future, too :)

[Samanthie]

Sirielle, this face is beautiful!:thumbsup: I think just a little more definition to the hair strands here and there is needed. I know what you mean about painting the same head shot. I do that too.;) Keep up the great work you are making wonderful progress.

[sirielle]

Thank you :) Ah, I managed to spoil that face fixing his chin shading and forehead, but
fortunately I saved older variant. In a mean time I was thinking
how to dress him and here is final idea:

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/3922/olweclothestest2sjq3.jpg


Of course his robe will not be transparent nor that shiny and the diadem/hair dressing might change - I wanted him to have a pearl somewhere, but maybe not like that. I don't want any connotations with LotR movie and this diadem brings it to my mind. And I'm sure I'll change it anyway during painting ;)
I like this background, but I'll probably crop it to arms as before, we'll see.

[abbeytermeer]

dont you hate that? you start something that looks really good, but in the end you know its going to be totally different? but you know its going to be so much better :)!! this is a great piece so far, i think the most recent painting of it, you change his neck muscles a bit. they should wrap from the middle of the clavicles around to the back of the ear, atm they look like they stick straight up. id really like to see this painting finished, the face renderings you have so far are looking great!

[sirielle]

Oh, it happens all the time to me. But what I hate the most is I usually come to a moment when I can't render things as I imagine them and it stays neverending WIP... I hope I'll be able to paint them with time.
Here I just made a manikin to test clothes, I'll be painting his neck from again on the original image. Thank you for advice, I'll try to get muscles right. And I've already got better idea what to do with pearls, there will be no tiara at all. Can't wait to see it finished either :D

[sirielle]

/////deleted

[sirielle]

/////deleted

[sirielle]

Unexpected kid study - referenced form a drawing course book, later turned into one of my fav fictional characters - finally I drew that guy. This (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4280020&postcount=7) guy (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4288587&postcount=11) :D

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/2572/kidsye1.jpg


I haven't noticed I spoiled little his knee, fixed here:

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/7144/kiddodiddora5.jpg


I need to paint him like that one day! [Painter IX used here, as usually.]

[sirielle]

My mum has noticed I gave him to thick limbs - compared to his head. I
hope that's last change for that doodle:

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/4382/kiddodiddogu5.jpg

[sirielle]

We're forgetting the robe, hair dressing and sun for a while, here is starry night to be:

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/6954/olwe15beleriandcd4.jpg

[Samanthie]

Hey Sirielle, nice update on the man and I like the work you've done on his hair. Maybe just a little darker with that shading you have in the hair already. Looks great keep going!:thumbsup:

[sirielle]

Hi Samanthie, I've changed the brightness of his face, for now all is brighter so I left hair shadows untouched. I haven't decided yet how bright will it be in these conditions, in fact - I don't know ;)

Small update, I need to shade his face more later, according to the starlight:

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/7401/olwe17beleriandmz0.jpg


What should light reflection on his eyes look like if stars are the only light source? No moon nor any other single light source? These stars must be really bright :P ;)

[Samanthie]

Hi Sirielle, It is a lovely image. :) If the only light is starlight then I'm thinking lighting conditions would be darker and so would the overall shading. The lights in his eyes wouldn't be as bright. I hope that helps, I am no expert but I am working on improving my lighting as well.

[abbeytermeer]

im glad you kept with the original face, its really cool to see all these different versions of this picture. shows your not afraid to mess with a piece in order to get it just right... thats admirable. truely :)

face looks great, love the draping hair over the robes, i do think his head is a little jotted forward though, looks like hes slouched over. of course, if this is what you were going for this is the time i shut my mouth :)!! hehe

seriously, looks great ^^

[NR43]

Hey Karolina,

be bold! don't be afraid to screw up, it's a digital wip so as long as you save you can't screw up :)

if your light source will be coming from his left (our right), it would mean his right (our left) side would be in much darker values than his left side...

keep pushing!

[sirielle]

Samanthie, yes he would have to be darker, in fact we would see only his head top, forehead and nose ;) But then I would loose the whole idea of painting his portrait, so I will leave logic behind and paint him like there was some light source somewhere, maybe we see him with elven eyes ;) Really, there could be some for example gate to a camp with torches, whatever, it's out of vision and serves only one goal - lets me paint him brighter. I'll darken him a bit in the end, but have to find out his face lines finally. I'm changing nose length and shape again, can't work out cheek muscles and darker areas.

Auria, if I haven't saved versions I would not know what his faced looked like before ;) Though I'm still little chicken to make real changes and get details right.
I see that slouching, too and it is not intentional, but I can't find out what is making it. The shawl's curls or the invisible neck? I'll try to get rid of it.

NR43, the light source in reality are only the stars, but as I said to Debbie it would mean we see only his nose and forehead ;) So let's say there are some torches/lamps over his head in some distance to give mild top light, strong enough to let me paint him. I will darken him a bit in the end to fit background better, but I don't like totally dark portrait. So, the light is somewhere above in front of him.
I've got too many variants of his face saved and still it's not might. I'll try to be bolder, but what I'm afraid of is making more anatomically proper face but loose him in it.

I thought this handsome version of him will help me paint his portrait:

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/3597/olweecorchefi9.jpg


but I ended up detailing it (reference (http://www.posemaniacs.com/?p=343)). There are some mistakes, but anyway things invisible on face covered with skin ;) I watched some photos, anatomy drawings and still mess the muscles on cheeks at the main painting O_o But maybe it will help me in the end.

[sirielle]

After comparing what I've got now with my favourite (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4652837&postcount=86) WIP I decided I was too bold and lost his face:

http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/3348/olwe18beleriandix7.jpg


Tomorrow I'll try to make the final variant with fixed nose/mouth area but the old face. I hope there is no slouching anymore?

Anyway I finally learned a few details more about tricky face muscles and got here scull experiment, oh alines ;)

http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/7545/olweskullsj3.jpg




I've got a question. A friend told me today to use not perspective in such portrait for we see the face from a distance long enough to see both eyes in the same perspective; not only here but in portraits generally. Before I was told by someone else to use perspective in portraits. Do we have different schools? In fact I prefer when eyes are the same size and moth are in line, but I have no idea what is proper.

[iuvo]

Hello :)
I don't use perspective lines to do portraits. I think if you continue to do them your should do it more subtle, as I think it sometimes distort your drawings. But I'm really not an expert on that part :)

Very good that you're studying the muscles in the face (yes they are tricky!) I found a lot of help from this site: http://www.artnatomia.net/uk/artnatomy.html
It shows you how the muscles create the basic facial expressions (You have to play around with it a bit... Click where it says level II at the top)

I think the recent skull you did looks like he has too high a forhead and too much skull on top. Plus his right shoulder seems too high. The folds in the cloth look nice and I like what you did with the stars.
It's great to see someone with so much dedication to what they're doing.

[sirielle]

Amazing site, thank you! :) This scull would serve as a good hanger for the double crown of North and South Egypt ;) He looks like an alien or ghoul O.o Let's believe his real scull looks more natural under his hair. I need to make some real studies of muscles and sculls for human kind, then experiment with non-human yet very similar species, for I'm afraid Tolkien would not accept such alien scull for his Firstborn ;)

Ah, that arm too high must make him look like slouching, thank you for noticing that. I wanted the material to be thick and fold high atop shoulders but then I made it flat on the other side, it doesn't work. I'll move the folds lower, then it should look better.

[Gisaiagami]

Hi karol
Excellent works in sketch...love the hair. And the last figure is nice
Keep up friend

[sirielle]

Gisaiagami, thank you :)

I'm trying to bring him to an end, but for unknown reason I gave him mean expression in this latest step:


http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/8316/olwe19beleriandsie7.jpg

I don't see it normally till I flip horizontally. I don't want him too look hostile but thoughtful, need to pay attention to the face expression on the site iuvo linked below. Now it's too late, after 4AM, I should be sleeping for hours now O.o
I have moved the shawl lower on the left (his right), also moved his chin&mouth higher and hair line lower instead of making longer nose. (And sharpened a bit bottom of the chin.) I hope it helped to get better proportions.
I definitely let him have too much mess in hair ;) Bottom layer is painted directly on shawl, I'm too lazy to fix it so I guess he'll have to live with that.

[sirielle]

First I've been away from home, than too busy to do anything. And I'm still ill after I got cold while being in another city. Now I finally come back to art and plan to take my tablet's pen into hand today :)

During my net absence I went to Comics Festival in Łódź (http://dehala.republika.pl/komiks/english.html), Poland (5 & 6 X 2007) to attend a meeting with Grzegorz Rosiński (http://lambiek.net/artists/r/rosinski.htm), my favorite comic series creator - Thorgal Saga (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorgal). I've watched a video showing his painting process from first sketches (he does a lot of them for one single cover painting, using various pencils, pens & other stuff) up to the final result in a form of oil painting. It makes me want to try more traditional media, too, though I've never worked with oils nor really tried watercolors (he does covers in oils and pages in pencils and/or inks and watercolors).

But, that in the future. Now here is a quick practice with pencil, ball pen, some liquid pen and marker I did after the con:

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/4704/szkic9102007ji7.jpg


Reference for the first portrait (http://img1.gildia.pl/_n_/komiks/komiksy/thorgal/8/skan2-640.jpg), haven't seen the other on-line - images from 'Alinoe' by Rosiński & Van Hamme. The likeness is not that accurate, let's say they are related ;)

[NR43]

Thorgal was one of the best comics I read when I was early in my teens... that and XIII.
Must have been quite something to see him work (even if it was on video)

you should do more "quick studies" like these last few...
welcome back :)

[Samanthie]

Hey Sirielle, Sounds like you had and amazing time at the festival. :) I like this latest quick drawing as well, great face and hair on the top figure.

[sirielle]

Thank you both for comments. Yes I should do more of such studies. And anatomy studies, I will not even show you my mutated skeleton I tried to draw the same time O.o It looked like someone distorted image widening it out of proportion.

Johan - I don't know XIII, what is it? I plan to read Enki Bilal's Nikopol trilogy, recommended as innovative art and plotwise.
The film about Rosiński during work was done beautifully with music composed especially for that, it was artistic itself - we've been looking at sketches from behind his back, we saw him mirrored in a window, took look outside the window on Alps... I wish it was available on net so others could watch it, too. I wonder if the DVD is on sale - it was added as extra feature to a DVD with Thorgal on the cover, but I didn't ask of that DVD when I had a chance.

Here is hair doodle over my old WIP (untouched, yet), I finally used tablet since my latest battle with b&w image. It's also great, full of artism and expression self portrait with headphones on and the tools in hands, beware :D


http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/4384/braidstestcp2.jpg

[sirielle]

A forgotten concept from July I just found on my HDD, a passage through a glacier:

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/2232/helcaraxedv3.jpg

[sirielle]

I'm trying to paint new wings and finish details of a fairy dragon I painted a year ago. This dragon was inspired by fairy dragons from HoMM III - funny purple creatures with butterfly wings and big eyes (colour and mood), by sea horses (head and body) and fish floating tails. I wanted it to float in the air, but it's impossible for a dragon with dragon wings :(

Present stage (and 4th wings idea):
http://www.postimage.org/aV6J309.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV6J309)

The one year old original with funny wings:
http://www.postimage.org/PqXi_BJ.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=PqXi_BJ)

[sirielle]

Abandoned variant of my [pb]event #09 Opposities (http://www.pixelbrush.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=29) entry Fire and Ice (http://www.pixelbrush.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1901):
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/2893/fireice05gh8.jpg

Final contributions for the event, I want to refine it more:

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/7803/siriellefireandicemuo2.jpg

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/9010/siriellefireandicespd8.jpg

[sirielle]

Working on my fav red head (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4402836&postcount=28) again - latest anatomy twist (there were a few not posted) as someone at CA.org advised me I twisted him again, I hope now proportions work best of all the WiPs:

http://www.postimage.org/aV16tYp9.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV16tYp9)

And more advanced face sketch plus armour decorations test:

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/5015/maefirewalkfacesketchrp7.jpg

I hope the armour reads as metal (very dark red metal, on a border of brown lit by flames from the bottom on his sides). Someone told me it's too dark/saturated/too much contrast, but when I compare it with van Dyck's paintings pictures (http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1552176&postcount=10) on my screen the scheme is the same, I want it to be that dark, but I have no idea what gamma settings I have got (I tried to set 1,8 but failed to state what number I have). What does it look like to you?

[sirielle]

Having a little rest from the red armour (which drives me nuts) - started as a boy turned into a girl, I may finish the boy either or not, but the girl should be finished soon, these colors improve my mood a lot:

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/1908/vanya2sea2.jpg

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/2144/vanya4webwn4.jpg

-> http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/3897/vanyagirlmi1.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vanyagirlmi1.jpg)

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7512/vanyagirl2cs4.jpg

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/9246/vanyagirltestoc5.jpg

[SylvanMist]

Ou I like how that red armor guy is turning out..I really like how the armor looks so shiny and the little details you've put on it.
Also the way you've painted the skin in the last one you've posted looks really nice. One thing that you might want to check on, on the face, I think you put too much of an emphasis on shading for the roundness of the cheekbones where it meets the top of the mouth, near the nose. It should probably be a bit more like your 1st wip..the light should go down straight more, or just put less of contrast between the shadow on the cheeks and top of the mouth..ugh, this is hard to explain :p

[sirielle]

I think I know what you mean - someone called it moustache on another board, I have toned it down a bit (maybe it needs more touch) plus made her nostrils thinner and sketched the hair:

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/2139/vanyagirl3tiaralj1.jpg

I'll re-do the ears later, they're too close, I see it now and I need to refine her face sides, too. (There is a misspell in description on the image - lotus flower tiara.)

The red armor guy appeared to be too red after printing, I have to redo more than I thought O.o I'm just going to get back to him now (like since 4 PM and it's 8 already ;) ).

Thank you for advice!

[sirielle]

I officially hate his armour (and probably repeat myself) and the same time like this image too much to leave it unfinished (am I too attached to my WIPs?). I hope he is twisted enough now, also that his leg finally looks better (bent backwards):

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6185/lthbwip24sa4.jpg

[sirielle]

Some update. I moved the arm cover of his armour on the shield's side more to his side, it was too close in the middle. And I put it on the whole image to progress the whole piece (I was woring on a cropped image so far to avoid Painter slowing down).

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/875/lthbwip26qw4.jpg

What should be water's colour? Night sky above and flames over it, so I guess there would be no blue nor violet as I sketched, but only some brown/bordo, maybe a bit of dirty and very dark blue?

And yes, I should darken the gauntlet and still he holds a wooden stick not a decent sword ;)

[anandpg]

Hi Karolina! WOW! you have lots of good stuff going on here, simultaneously!:thumbsup: I have just started learning Painter and it is good to see your technique!.. Waiting to see how you render the water and fire!:bounce:

[sirielle]

Thank you :) Please check my latest portfolio addition, I've forgotten to add that image here - a first take on fire on the finished Fire and Ice image:

http://features.cgsociety.org//gallerycrits/212255/212255_1197638225_small.jpg (http://sirielle.cgsociety.org/gallery/572450/)
http://sirielle.cgsociety.org/gallery/572450/

(http://sirielle.cgsociety.org/gallery/572450/)

There is glow brush in Painter in FX brushes set - this one is very helpful with painting fire, try it. It behaves differently on a top layer and directly on a background. Choose some dark orange/brown and stroke after stroke it will give you flame colors.

[sirielle]

Last background sketch:

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9923/lthbwip26firesketch2op7.jpg

[sirielle]

waves time:

http://www.postimage.org/aVybJhr.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVybJhr)

[Maidith]

Way to go, Karolina! The light in this WIP is really great :thumbsup:
A little tip: try painting the foam of the waves with a bigger brush and lower flow/opacity to make it more foam-ish :)

[sirielle]

Hi Kristina, I'll try :) Waves have no final shape, yet, also foam is too bright right now but I guess it will change x times till I finish ;)

[sirielle]

Small update, it looks a bit like frozen chocolate not water ;)

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/9638/lthbwip26waves2zt5.th.jpg (http://img229.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lthbwip26waves2zt5.jpg)

I used Painter's soft acrylic brush to smooth the water, but as you advice a bigger brush with lower opacity is needed to make more natural foam/water. I used airbrush with jitter enabled (is it scattering in Photoshop?) to make foam, but I probably did it too early, will have to work with some simple low opacity brush first.

[sirielle]

Amount of WIP images with this one on my HDD is terrifying.

I toned down the waves (made them anew), but now the fire took over the picture. I could tone it down or make the knight lighter as ages ago someone suggested me, unless it still works:

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/9145/lthbwip27ma2.jpg


Isn't the fire too blurry? I must admit fire looks to me blurry and artificial on photos, so I can't judge it properly.

I hope the new look of folks behind him works with the image. Still have to finish his face, hair and add something here and there. Sword and bottom part of his leg bother me:

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/8416/firesmoke28croppedof3.jpg

[Balduran]

Well they ARE a bit blurry, it could use a bit of sharpening, but i wouldn't worry about that so much if i were you ;)
After all, the main detail should be on Maedhros. The only thing you could do about the fire is to add some white here and there, but that's not necessary (I've sent you some photos of fire on your mail to compare ;) )

As for the leg - Maybe that's because metal reflects differently?
What i mean is - the reflections should be more smooth, now it looks a bit like cloth, or leather because of the reflections.

Hope it helps ;)

PS.
Mogę to wysłać na maila po polskiemu żeby było dokładniej xD

[sirielle]

Comment answered via e-mail :)

Miss Vanyarinwa is back. (I ate 'Nis' in description - Nis Vanyarinwa = Vanyarin woman in Quenya).

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/7748/vanyadancerus3.jpg


A doodle at 4 AM. No reference, pastel oils brushes test. Trying to get back to drawing :)

BTW - great music (http://www.last.fm/music/Prem+Joshua/_/Sarang+Solitaire) which kept me company during drawing ^_^

[sirielle]

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/699/kinslayerpromowip1is8.jpg


The best band evah! Doesn't exist? So what! :D
Pastel oils in Painter again (and glow for the lights).


Forgotten practice from December, also 'band promo' like:

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/5650/triohz7.jpg

The same guy as on the unfinished fiery wip.

[SylvanMist]

Hi Sirielle,

I hope you don't mind a big critique..here it comes! :)

I like how the red fire guy is turning out. The flames are a bit blurry, maybe you can help that out by putting some sharper sparks here and there? I wouldn't worry about that too much though, it doesn't look bad.

One thing that looks a bit wrong is the lighting on the guy. Right now it looks like his face is lit from the bottom, like there's a great light there but the strongest light is coming from the sides, then it might get a little less from the bottom-and also from the top. You don't really have the top of his head lit but there is fire reaching up in that direction so it should probably bounce from there too. Although i'm not expert on lighting conditions, and fire is tricky.

About his lower leg, it looks like he's stepping up on a stair because of how it's bent. If that's the case then it's fine, but if he's just walking the lower leg may be straighter coming out towards you.

Anyway right now I think that the cropped version you posted is actually a stronger piece than the whole. It's just more pleasant to look at..maybe because you can see more details. I love how you did the armor, especially those scales or chainmail around his legs..those little circles of light look really cool!

Anyway, great work so far, you should try to block in faces too on those other guys :)

[sirielle]

Hi Roja,

thank you so much for the points! :)

You are right about the lightning - people say it's great but I'm afraid it's not totally accurate. I guess you're more keen on lightning than 2D artists for while making 3D scenes illogical light source will be visible right away, more clear than on 2D where brush strokes can cheat the viewer. My idea was the strongest light is in the bottom in front of him and on his sides - the source of flames; where flames get higher they are colder and darker (these shoul be behind him). And basing on that idea I lighted the guy but I am not sure if final flames behave the way I see it in my mind. Plus they supposed to look wings alike. Adding more details would help to make it (though I didn't want it to look literally like wings) and more realistic. Yet time was running away and the same time people kept telling me contradictory advice to add less details to the background to keep focus on the main character. Maybe that's why close up looks better for in the whole image the fire takes over the image, although I finally haven't detailed it more and darkened it.

Here is the finished version, I haven't posted the link (in my portfolio):

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=600134

And here are some details & close ups:

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/160/lthbhairdetailnn5.th.jpg (http://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lthbhairdetailnn5.jpg) http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8571/10050closeuppt4.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=10050closeuppt4.jpg)

Unfortunately details are gone in the resized version, even after extra sharpening them. I need to find a way to keep details visible after resizing on such large images. Same time I want them to look good on large prints, I hate blurred prints. I bought some myself and was disappointed about the blurriness on a few. I see some artists make the whole image blurry and leave only some elements sharp (not talking about a depth of field), so it looks right after resizing. Only I don't know if it works for large prints.

And about the leg - well I hid it as you see, it's bent back and I expect he has to put some effort to walk through the waves, but I am not sure if it is anatomy correct. Noone complains about it, so maybe it works for the image.

That cover around his legs is a kind of scale mail, inspired by Warhammer elves conceptart (http://uk.games-workshop.com/download/popup.htm?/highelves/artwork/images/art12.jpg) (the high elves (http://uk.games-workshop.com/highelves/artwork/)). I was going to detail it more but after browsing various artworks I decided it doesn't need to be detailed. In fact to have a more interesting mood and image not screaming 'it's digital!' I should leave more less detailed/polished areas. Like on a traditional painting.

I will continue the latest WIPs probably somewhere in April, I should finish older images first and do something for a contest for Silmarillion inspired art (http://www.tolkfolk.pl/news/ivkon_en.html).

[sirielle]

A little birthday gift (Painter watercolours have beaten me again - 2:0 for them http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif ):

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/1271/finwaterbluete1.jpg

and working on my WIP:

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/9485/wildtest3jf6.jpg

[Splinter]

You have a very interesting sketchbook I am really going to have to take the time and look through what you have here. Keep up the good work:beer:

[sirielle]

Splinter, thank you! Some of the images look horrible now after time, but still some may be a lesson to others - one can always learn on mistakes of others.

Here is my first hand for Open Figure Drawing Workshop - hands at CGTalk. (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?p=5078726) 24 hands to come. It took me wayyyy too long O_o I'm quite satisfied with the hand, but definitely not with the time I spent on it. First I used Painter's watercolors, but had to fix it with eraser/airbrushes, to use watercolors again, then had to fix and so on... Had to stop finally. After hand from reference #35 Douleur d'amour [Elegy] (http://www.artrenewal.org/asp/database/image.asp?id=58&hires=1) by William Bouguereau:


http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/301/hand1on4.jpg

(flipped)

I feel like I wasn't able to draw when I have to reproduce something (not necessarily to copy in this case) and I can't achieve the same result as the reference. Drawing from imagination is much easier in that case when references are not to be reproduced but instructve only. But it tells only that I still don't practice sketches and studies as I should.

[Balduran]

The hand turned out great :)

The only major issue would be the smallest finger (how do you call it anyway?), it seems to be too far away from the hand.

Oh and remember it's supposed to be a study, so - don't try to make it a perfect, finished piece (It's not Maedhros' hand after all.... :p )

[ceruleanvii]

That hand came out well, good lighting and skin tone. Only 24 more to go - you're doing better than I am! :)

I like the rest of your sketchbook too, you paint very strong and interesting faces - nice work!

[NR43]

Great hand study Karolina!

[sirielle]

Thank you guys :)

Oh and remember it's supposed to be a study, so - don't try to make it a perfect, finished piece (It's not Maedhros' hand after all.... :p )
If that was his hand I would be still fixing it till it was real ;) I have forgotten it can be less refined, on the other hand I practiced the watercolors and generally colors the same time. I didn't use grid not picked colors form the original (which is visible) but tried to find out where William used blues/violets or greens to make skin tones. It would be easier if I used airbrushes for watercolor layer in Painter behaves different, but it was fun and a good lesson same time.

You have a good eye, it proves again :D I couldn't see what is wrong with the little finger yesterday, I was fixing shading over and over, but now I see it is too far and thus too long. On the reference it ends a little bit below the thumb (a millimeter maybe), here it is much longer. I'll leave it that way, it's a study so no lasso+copy+paste closer to use as I would do normally. (And I am not into repainting if with brushes right now). I'll focus better with the next hand.

[Balduran]

If that was his hand I would be still fixing it till it was real ;)
Ha! I knew it :p

I have forgotten it can be less refined, on the other hand I practiced the watercolors and generally colors the same time. I didn't use grid not picked colors form the original (which is visible) but tried to find out where William used blues/violets or greens to make skin tones. It would be easier if I used airbrushes for watercolor layer in Painter behaves different, but it was fun and a good lesson same time.
In that case it wasn't a waste of time like you seem to see it ;)

You have a good eye, it proves again :D I couldn't see what is wrong with the little finger yesterday, I was fixing shading over and over, but now I see it is too far and thus too long. On the reference it ends a little bit below the thumb (a millimeter maybe), here it is much longer. I'll leave it that way, it's a study so no lasso+copy+paste closer to use as I would do normally. (And I am not into repainting if with brushes right now). I'll focus better with the next hand.
That's the spirit! :) Keep in mind that it's about learning not making it uber cool ;)

[sirielle]

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/8316/olwe19beleriandsie7.jpg


I must have lost this variant #19 somewhere. Anyway I repainted his face since then a few times and here is the latest variant (#20) and mix of it with the old #14 which I still like the best:

http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/3108/olwebel2014yh3.jpg

I thought it is done till I put the old WIP over the newest variant. Of course I don't like the new face anymore O_o And now when I see the previous (quoted #19) I don't know anything anymore. Insanity.

Tomorrow I'll decide and probably only fix the chin in the final mixed variant and that's all.
Or it will finish me :/

What have I done with #19? It looks nice, pity pity.

[Balduran]

I must have lost this variant #19 somewhere. Anyway I repainted his face since then a few times and here is the latest variant (#20) and mix of it with the old #14 which I still like the best:
That should teach you leaving a finished work finished :curious: (No offence :blush: )




I thought it is done till I put the old WIP over the newest variant. Of course I don't like the new face anymore O_o And now when I see the previous (quoted #19) I don't know anything anymore. Insanity.

But you still have the #20 variant? It's not that different from #19...

And what do you exactly mean by 'i thought it is done till i put the old wip over the newst'?

Tomorrow I'll decide and probably only fix the chin in the final mixed variant and that's all.
Or it will finish me :/
No one's going to finish you while i'm on guard ;)
Maybe just leave #20 alone?


What have I done with #19? It looks nice, pity pity.
Maybe you've accidentally put it in a music folder? Anathema... ;P

[sirielle]

It wasn't finished :( He still looks like a plastic doll without character and expression.

I provably painted over #19 and saved it. I don't like over polished #20 anymore, the mix of old and new face looks best. Anyway I feel he looks like a clown, not a real face.

And what do you exactly mean by 'i thought it is done till i put the old wip over the newst'?
What you see above - mix of the old WIP (this face (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4652837&postcount=86)) and #20 = the face on the right.

My lesson is to finish works in a shorter period (if I can't finish them at once) - to not leave it for such long time as I do. I've got enough of this style of work finally. Same goes for a few other of my WIPs. I should listen to Kallen and paint anew when I'm stuck, not fix old stuff again.

And I should do 24 hands more.

[Balduran]

It wasn't finished :( He still looks like a plastic doll without character and expression.
De gustibus ;)

I provably painted over #19 and saved it. I don't like over polished #20 anymore, the mix of old and new face looks best. Anyway I feel he looks like a clown, not a real face.

Probably.
I like the #20 better, but... that's just me ;)


What you see above - mix of the old WIP (this face (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=4652837&postcount=86)) and #20 = the face on the right.

Ah, wasn't sure about that.

My lesson is to finish works in a shorter period (if I can't finish them at once) - to not leave it for such long time as I do. I've got enough of this style of work finally. Same goes for a few other of my WIPs. I should listen to Kallen and paint anew when I'm stuck, not fix old stuff again.

That's a good resolution! :) (Postanowienie)
That's what i meant with the 'finished' part in my previous post - You could give him a break.


And I should do 24 hands more.
Whoops! Me too xD

[sirielle]

OK, enough of it. I belive my boy is ready:

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/2636/olwebel21wipzi4.jpg

[Balduran]

OK, enough of it. I belive my boy is ready:

Yay! :thumbsup:

[sirielle]

I thought I'll let you know I'm still spoiling this portrait:

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/7064/stepsvd5.gif

Trying to fix the overdosed perspective and some details.

[ceruleanvii]

It's looking very good, Karolina! So now what? :)

[sirielle]

He is done, the final image is different than above:

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/3475/stepshh3.gif

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/6395/olwebelfinhairoh3.th.jpg (http://img218.imageshack.us/my.php?image=olwebelfinhairoh3.jpg)

[sirielle]

OK. Everybody say he looks nice, but his eyes still bother me - they are misplaced. Don't you see it too? Or is it me? He looks weird in miniature, it's less visible on the larger image. Here is another idea, not detailed - I just moved eyes on a new layer sketched over:

http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/9671/olweremanufacturegb6.gif

We'll see if I still like it in the morning.

[Balduran]

OK. Everybody say he looks nice, but his eyes still bother me - they are misplaced. Don't you see it too? Or is it me? He looks weird in miniature, it's less visible on the larger image. Here is another idea, not detailed - I just moved eyes on a new layer sketched over:



We'll see if I still like it in the morning.
Now that i see the difference - they are a little misplaced...

Too bad you made his eyes less clear and shiny, they looked better that way.

[sirielle]

This is not a finished polished version but as I said a sketchy test where to place the eyes. Though in this light conditions they have to be less shiny as they are in shadow (and he hasn't seen the light of Aman, so doesn't have it in his eyes).

[Balduran]

This is not a finished polished version but as I said a sketchy test where to place the eyes. Though in this light conditions they have to be less shiny as they are in shadow (and he hasn't seen the light of Aman, so doesn't have it in his eyes).
Well, technically there should be no light really ;) (Stars don't really give much light_
The just seem more blank now.

Anyway - good luck! :)

[sirielle]

The final variant:
http://sirielle.cgsociety.org/gallery/625443
and the older one I decided to keep in scraps:
http://sirielle.deviantart.com/art/WIP-of-Olwe-in-Beleriand-65975355
To be redone one day.

Now, time to move on. I still have 24 hands to do for workshops and some WIPs to polish.

[sirielle]

It looks like finishing present OFDW will take me longer than workshop's time, here is my second image:

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/6885/hand2mi6.jpg


Oil pastels in Painter IX. Short record of my chaotic creation process:

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/3029/hand2lm1.gif

I used grid for most of the time, as you can see. (I was flipping horizontally, as always but I flipped image back for the record.) It's second time I tried it and I feel it doesn't really help in learning. It's rather helpful to measure, test proportions.



Reference: Au Bord du Ruisseau by William Bouguereau (http://www.artrenewal.org/asp/database/image.asp?id=22&hires=1).

[Balduran]

Just a quick note: Your fingers seem to be a little longer than in the original.

And her right hand is... Urm, it seems a bit longer than it should be, but it may be either the shading, or the fact that i'm dead tired.
Probably both, either way - good work :) I wish i could pay that much attention to my doodles ;P

Goodnight :)

[sirielle]

Possibly maybe.

Sketch for WSC #3: Broken Wing(s) (http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=20902) at Epilogue:

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/4582/wsc3brokenwingsei3.jpg


Forearm area is wonky I know, but it's done. Just for the mood and in sake of sketching.

And one more angel, though I am not sure if I should post him for the public view ;) I just wanted to state where his chest is to fix the outfit and ended up looking for muscles and refining ;)

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/18/manatbr5.jpg


Yup, I'm trying to finish this image (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=200&t=475514&page=1) finally. T.b.c.

[Balduran]

Possibly maybe.

Sketch for WSC #3: Broken Wing(s) (http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=20902) at Epilogue:



http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/4582/wsc3brokenwingsei3.jpg






Forearm area is wonky I know, but it's done. Just for the mood and in sake of sketching.

Actually the forearm is okay, not anatomically, but it gives to the atmosphere ;) (My first
though was a winged old-school vampire, must be the lack of hair)
...anyway, it looks nice :)
I like those contrasting colours, is the right part supposed to be flesh?

Hm, since it's a sketch challenge... i think i'll give it a try too :P

And one more angel, though I am not sure if I should post him for the public view ;) I just wanted to state where his chest is to fix the outfit and ended up looking for muscles and refining ;)

Yup, I'm trying to finish this image (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=200&t=475514&page=1) finally. T.b.c.
Well, since you have the muscles already (boy is he an athlete) you can rewok his previous armor (the body shaped), or, if don't feel like it anymore, you can give him something simpler like this http://www.aurorahistoryboutique.com/products/A000001_L.jpg (Come to think of it - it's still supposed to be a remastered painting?)


Edit:
Oh, wait, that challenge is not on CGTalk, i'll draw something either way

[sirielle]

Epilogue challenges are just for sake of sketching, there are no winners nor competition, not in this sort. There used to be competitions in the past, but that was a different thing.

Even vampire should have proper arms anatomy - if the upper part is longer so the lower should be. But my archangel with smashed wings (as they supposed to be hurt/broken) could not touch his arms top with same hand as I can - it looks like it.

I am about to steal a soft leather breast plate from a Roman legionnaire, just need to find a suitable one. Or maybe it will be leather armour +7 against demons from Baldur's Gate ;) It's not a master copy since I have changed the details and arrangemenet, it's still heavily referenced from Giordano, but rather reinterpretation than a master copy.

[Balduran]

Epilogue challenges are just for sake of sketching, there are no winners nor competition, not in this sort. There used to be competitions in the past, but that was a different thing.

I know, what i had in mind is that i don't have an account there.

Even vampire should have proper arms anatomy - if the upper part is longer so the lower should be. But my archangel with smashed wings (as they supposed to be hurt/broken) could not touch his arms top with same hand as I can - it looks like it.
Ohh... You mean the length.
I didn't notice that, i though you have the forearm's width in mind.

I am about to steal a soft leather breast plate from a Roman legionnaire, just need to find a suitable one. Or maybe it will be leather armour +7 against demons from Baldur's Gate ;) It's not a master copy since I have changed the details and arrangemenet, it's still heavily referenced from Giordano, but rather reinterpretation than a master copy.
Heheh ;) Good, that allows more fun ;)

A few references of that breastplate you mentioned: ;)
http://www.by-the-sword.com/acatalog/images/ah6071L.jpg
http://www.schmitthenner.com/images/Leather%20Musculata%20Cuirass.JPG
http://www.schmitthenner.com/images/SCH1040PB.jpg
http://www.valhallaleathercraft.com/chest/musclebreast2.jpg
Hope it helps

[sirielle]

Ha, some are uglier than what I gave him before ;) But the one with joints (two pieces breast) and the golden one are great, thank you!

Edit. Check this challenge (but let's not talk about the other stuff here, just letting you know btw).

[sirielle]

I see I forgot to link that challenge entry above:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=630777

http://img372.imageshack.us/img372/5525/angelsiiwipua4.jpg


Aiming for golden breastplate, we'll see.

[sirielle]

She supposed to be Hel, ruler of Hellheim in Nordic mythology for a current PB event Myths. A woman half alive, half dead, half in colour of flesh, half blue. My idea was to decompose her down from waist, turn into muddy filthy something. I imagined bony, skinny woman but painted someone opposite..

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/1306/wip2lz6.jpg


Maybe I'll use it for someone else. Anatomy to be corrected, if I continue with this one.

[Balduran]

I see I forgot to link that challenge entry above
Urm, the link is still wrong. Just send it on my email ;)




Aiming for golden breastplate, we'll seeLooking good :) Try using more yellow.
The shading on that armor seems a bit off - The round stomach part seems to be facing forward, while the rest of the muscles are twisted with the figure (Although it can be just my impression)

Plus, that protunded edge on the lower plate is facing too far to the right. Keep in mind that that's leather, not skin (even though it's the same word in Polish)
Check the attachment to see what i mean (Crudely drawn in MS Paint, forgive the compression)



And about Hel - My first though was of someone from Conan the Barbarian. The second was a Valier gone bad ;) (Maybe Melkor got married?)

[sirielle]

Link is good, leads to Morano's entry.

I thought that leather breast plate constructed from two parts will twist more than a usual one. His body is still twisted more than the armour. Other way I would not bother with two parts and gave him one part breast plate with a nicer shape. Probably. On the sketch the bottom half it's twisted even more, just like his belly. E-mail it to me in Polish, will be easier.

Morgoth was a woman! :argh: ;)

[sirielle]

Yay, I got it! Someone was missing on that image :D

I'll leave her alone, reaching out towards us...

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/8051/wip4qh7.jpg

..or a missing detail will join her:

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/4745/helbaldrol1.jpg

Why I didn't think of it before?


Now Daudi Baldrs by Burzum should accompany this image.

[sirielle]

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/2217/wip5oa8.jpg

"While the gods were lamenting Balder's death, Odin sent his other son Hermod to Hel, the goddess of death, to plead for Balder's return. Hel agreed to send Balder back to the land of the living on one condition: everything in the world, dead or alive, must weep for him. And everything wept, except for Loki, who had disguised himself as the witch Thokk. And so Balder had to remain in the underworld."

I searched for more info and finally decided to follow the description with half face dead and dead body from waist down. Her dress name is Sickness (Nausea), so my idea to paint it filthy was good. Plus golden floor of her hall for the contrast.

[sirielle]

A quick sketch in pencil (yay, it doesn't bite!) and a quick coloring test:

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/8027/tribalfusionserpenttk9.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5087/tribalfusionserpentcolni6.jpg


I will not be coloring this one, it's just a concept for a future painting. Without the serpent's tail, probably, this I added on my daddy's request :) I just want to paint a tribal fusion dancer in motion. Check Rachel Brice on YouTube if you have no idea what I mean!

[sirielle]

Here is Baldr, if his anatomy is off please let me know:


http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/8495/wip7dn3.jpg

He was bigger, but he messed the focus of this image, I want Hel to be the main character. Also it is her domain, she is power here. That's why I decided to make him smaller. I hope it works.

Baldr in the Prosaic Edda:
The second son of Odin is Baldr, and good things are to be said of him. He is best, and all praise him; he is so fair of feature, and so bright, that light shines from him. A certain herb is so white that it is likened to Baldr's brow; of all grasses it is whitest, and by it thou mayest judge his fairness, both in hair and in body. He is the wisest of the Æsir, and the fairest-spoken and most gracious; and that quality attends him, that none may gainsay his judgments. He dwells in the place called Breidablik, which is in heaven; in that place may nothing unclean be[.]

[Balduran]

He was bigger, but he messed the focus of this image, I want Hel to be the main character. Also it is her domain, she is power here. That's why I decided to make him smaller. I hope it works
Just my two cents:
I think it would be more convincing if he was facing Hel and/or hloding his face with both hands.
Cliche, i know, but now i have the impression that he's Hel's servant or underling of a sort.
Nice touch with those faces though :)

[sirielle]

I don't have such feelings at all with his pose. He is in despair, worried, thinking what if someone will not weep?

Baldr got more body, it fits Nordic god better:

http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/3585/wip8rx8.jpg

Still got to choose breeches and boots for him. Looking at my pictures from Viking Festival 2002 (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/index.html) in Wolin, Poland I should have referenced him from this guy (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/Jomswiking042.jpg) or face of the blond (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/Gny001.jpg) musician from Gny and give him the bordo breeches (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/Fidelius03.jpg) of the musician from Fidelius :D

[Balduran]

I don't have such feelings at all with his pose. He is in despair, worried, thinking what if someone will not weep?
Might just be the sketch, it looks better now ;) Plus i thought he was at the pleading stage.

Baldr got more body, it fits Nordic god better:
It's your mythology :P Seriously though - You shouldn't worry about that in this case, after all it's Baldr - the most beautiful god of them all.

Still got to choose breeches and boots for him. Looking at my pictures from Viking Festival 2002 (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/index.html) in Wolin, Poland I should have referenced him from this guy (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/Jomswiking042.jpg) or face of the blond (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/Gny001.jpg) musician from Gny and give him the bordo breeches (http://www.isle.px.pl/_w/Wolin2002/Fidelius03.jpg) of the musician from Fidelius :DAbout boots, why not give him Slavic wrappings? (I think they'll be ok for someone of Nordic origin)
Like those guys have: 1 (http://www.easydrinkers.com/woje/grody/images/druzyna/big/5.JPG) 2 (http://www.easydrinkers.com/woje/grody/images/druzyna/big/34.JPG)


(Just in case you don't know - they have breeches, with a strap of material wrapped around their legs (which is then tied with by girdle), it's called owijki in Polish)

[sirielle]

Or like shoes here Viking Clothing (http://www.cdli.ca/CITE/v_dress.htm%20) or on men from my Viking Festival pictures. No, I don't like these, Aesir had better stuff than mere mortals ;)

It's your mythology :P Seriously though - You shouldn't worry about that in this case, after all it's Baldr - the most beautiful god of them all.
And I paint my vision of Nordic gods, so there is no place for weak bodies here.

[Balduran]

Or like shoes here Viking Clothing (http://www.cdli.ca/CITE/v_dress.htm%20) or on men from my Viking Festival pictures. No, I don't like these, Aesir had better stuff than mere mortals ;)

Good point ;) (Just throwing loose ideas as always ;P)

[sirielle]

Fancy boots season ;P Medieval brotherhoods would probably kill me (with laughter) for these, but I like them http://www.pixelbrush.net/forum/images/smiles/icon_twisted.gif


http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/2051/wip9jt5.jpg


Anatomy is still off, but much better now. No funny breeches, yet, but I will not leave him in leggings http://www.pixelbrush.net/forum/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif Leather to be.

http://www.postimage.org/Pq1iJ90i.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Pq1iJ90i)

[sirielle]

A quick hand studies to catch what is wrong with Baldr's hand:

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/5375/hand34zv9.jpg

If I have completed the hands workshop this would be easier.

Here are references from amazing photographer Mehmet Turgut:
http://mehmeturgut.deviantart.com/art/sign-XII-62599211
http://mehmeturgut.deviantart.com/art/ogun-sanlisoy-1-52795275
- a lot of expressive faces, hands and bodies in his gallery, fascinating.

[sirielle]

OK, enough struggling with proportions - WIP #10 and final #11:

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/1286/wip10baldrzj1.jpg

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/9303/wip11baldrqh6.jpg

He got slender finally ;)

http://www.postimage.org/Pq1lbohr.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Pq1lbohr)


Time to refine the rest.

[sirielle]

I just tweaked a bit their clothes to fit more with Viking world, but I will not change his boots. Maybe a bit, gods wear better stuff than mortals ;) I need to change Hel's throne as well. All went out too elfy!

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/4231/wip14nz3.jpg

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/1379/wip14baldrwz5.jpg


Older WIP with throne's bottom which took me a long while and I have to get rid of it now :(

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/9664/wip13aq4.jpg


I've got a book about Vikings with a lot of sculptures and relieves inside, so will tweak the environment a bit. Deadline ended at midnight, but Henning said that we still got a few hours more, till 5 PM my time, so keep your fingers crossed!

[sirielle]

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/4276/wip15li0.jpg

I should have planed it better from the start.

[sirielle]

http://www.postimage.org/aVEXluA.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVEXluA)


Playing with fire to add some misty atmosphere here - from smoke. But I don't want warm light nor hues in this piece, too. Maybe some glowing embers or just smoke coming out of a bowl (or nowhere) will do the job.

[Eiki]

hey this work looks better and better! nice development! :)
i like how the person in the front is poping out a bit :applause:

and the fire is cool :)

keep going ;)
seb

[sirielle]

Thank you! I will not make the fire, tough, but will use some smoke to add atmosphere, it needs soemthing more to be Hellheim.

Hel is almost done, her face will stay as it is now, I need repaint her hands, finish jewellery, throne, fur and blend Badr more into the picture.

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/8496/wip17xg0.jpg


Only she should rather be skinny for a half-dead ruler of a realm filled with hunger.

[sirielle]

I couldn't finish myths so I moved another WIP. I used impasto brush in Painter to add texture to the wall and to paint the texture of paint on his palette:

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/2992/finmirind5xo9.jpg

I feel the impasto parts are too different in texture than the rest of image.

[sirielle]

Ugh, all looks ugly on the above update. I'll save only fixed toe and head size. Brrr, no imasto for me!

Two images for Quick-Pix at pixelbrush, SF theme (mixed it with ancient civilisations as I missed that one):

http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/2535/pbsfue5.jpg

http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/3235/pbsfsuz0.jpg

[sirielle]

Here is face of the painter:

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/5479/threekingsfinweqk9.jpg

[Balduran]

Ugh, all looks ugly on the above update. I'll save only fixed toe and head size. Brrr, no imasto for me!

Two images for Quick-Pix at pixelbrush, SF theme (mixed it with ancient civilisations as I missed that one):



http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/2535/pbsfue5.jpg




Niiiice! You should draw more stuff like that! :)

[sirielle]

Thank you, I'll do :)

One more face caught:

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/6571/ingwesketchnf4.jpg


Both were done quickly and accidentally in a moment when I should be doing something else... Maybe that's a trick to do more often ;)


A quick concept for a painting to my First snow (http://sirielle.deviantart.com/art/The-First-Snow-15203069):

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/8519/firstsnowconceptsnowkr7.jpg


I can't find a reference for that pose, one of reasons I can't work it out. I tried to change the pose, but it didn't work:

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1340/firstsnowdigiinktestti1.jpg


And when I tried to change the pose more a handsome man turned into orc woman:

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/8993/orcwomanby2.jpg


Maybe I should try it in a moment when I should do something else :P

[NR43]

Well... perhaps it will seem odd to you but I like the last version best :p
Sure he doesn't look very pretty... but he sure looks masculin, yet there is a lot of emotion there thanks to the closed eyes, the pose and the viewpoint.

Perhaps the face could indeed use a tad more refinement, but I wouldn't want to make him too pretty... Imho the so called "ugly" people tend to have a lot more charisma and express more character than the pretty boys we all see in the adds... I think if you could step away a bit more from trying to paint pretty people, your work would really level up, particularly the narrative part would be more convincing and believable.

Anyway, keep pushing yourself!
Doing great!

[sirielle]

Hey I like the last image a lot, too! Thank you :) But I'm not sure if it's good enough to stand alone, it's just a sketchy practice. But no, it's not him, I left the initial idea aside and doodled. I should redo this idea later. For sure my work will improve with changing subject - more variety and lines to follow. But I want to portray my fav Silmarillion characters, too, so unfortunately he's not gonna look like an orc ;) Also I'm sure I'll get bored with pretty boys soon, that's just a matter of time. I'll learn basic schematic face features and move further. As I'm trying to avoid clean and airbrushed lines, hard but slowly wroking.


Since I post I'll add some pencil (supported by ballpen) I did on Sunday, though these are not the happiest pieces ever. Referenced from Anatomy for artists by Sarah Simblet:

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/6274/echorcheheadii5.jpg
I squished the back of head, ref. was wider.

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/1654/dreamingheadtr3.jpg

This was good till I turned the page upside down... For some reason I was thinking I should not turn it during the drawing process. A mistake! Referenced form the same book, only from a photo this time.

[NR43]

I see what you mean...

just stumbled upon this masterpiece in the cg 2D gallery... thought I'd post it here as it might give you some inspiration

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=137&t=604259

take care

[sirielle]

Yes, I've seen it. Great piece, one of images which weren't created for the Silmarillion, but would be perfect to illustrate it. Lovely brush work as well, movement captured, very inspiring image :)

[sirielle]

The image in snow looks finally like this:

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/797/firstsnowh700da5.jpg

I had to send it already, but if you see things to fix here I want to fix them anyway, especially on his face. Unintentionally I've changed head angle, but left arms the same - comparing with the concept (I painted the new version over it).

[sirielle]

A double realistic portrait of one anime character. Two variants, none presents exactly the face I was looking for, but I find both of them interesting and love the colours, so here they are:

http://www.sirielle.com/gallery/Sirielle_Katze.jpg
My first choice = final image for myself, he is younger here than in the movie.

http://www.sirielle.com/gallery/Sirielle_Ethereal_boy.jpg
Original b&w sketch, before shifting face features and colouring. Not alike the character though - according to my nitpicking vision.


http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/7393/katzeforlenado7.jpg
An earlier WIP stage refined for my friend who liked it better than my final result.

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/3914/katzeforlenabwkf7.jpg
B&w original I did for her, some way better than coloured one.


Oil pastel brushes in Painter IX. If you want comparison, here is reference (http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/2614/katze06if3.jpg).
Maybe I'll add the first version to portfolio, for the colours :)

[sirielle]

Galaxy speedy - about 1,5 - 2h, including browsing for reference and songs about Andromeda plus coffee time:

http://www.sirielle.com/gallery/Sirielle_Galaxy.jpg

[ceruleanvii]

I like the last colored version of the guy - it's a little closer to the anime reference in that the features are less angular. Nice painting!

[sirielle]

Thank you! I have changed my mind since then and feel he should have more pointy chin, too, but still I want to keep him a bit angular either. All the anime characters have got pointy chins there, such style. But still something is missing, so I need to paint that red haired hacker again one day. Also I want better cigarette smoke around him.

[Balduran]

Galaxy speedy (http://sirielle.cgsociety.org/gallery/651298/) (image in my portfolio) - about 1,5 - 2h, including browsing for reference and songs about Andromeda plus coffee time.

Wow, it's beautiful :D (Though it's a bit too blurry imo)

[sirielle]

What would you make less blurry? I know I would add less "foggy" elements in the far background if was making it now. Take a look at it at dA and check Dunadan's info, BTW, now I know such view is impossible to see with a bare eye, it exists only on photos :(

[Balduran]

What would you make less blurry? I know I would add less "foggy" elements in the far background if was making it now. Take a look at it at dA and check Dunadan's info, BTW, now I know such view is impossible to see with a bare eye, it exists only on photos :(
I mean the overall image seems blurry, the stars could be a bit more sharp (At least the main ones), and the 'foggy thing' ;)

Urm, which info?

[sirielle]

In Dunadan's comments at dA under this image. Here is reference (http://www.freewebs.com/bnip1/Astronomy/AndromedaRGB.jpg) - the main stars are that blurry,too (and it looks a bit like someone retouched the reflexes on them? heh). Or take a look here (http://www.alpineastro.com/observatory/astro%20images/images/Horsehead_HalfRes.jpg) (though I have just found it). But it's not real. As I said some overal sharpness would be better = less details in some places,no "clouds" which I called foggy stuff, but most of elements seem to be correct.

[sirielle]

Trying to finish this one, WIP on the left, a test in the middle and the old face (brrrr!):

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/5387/huntervii2008wipnh9.jpg

[Heozart]

Wow, looks like you have a very vivid imagination. Great hand studies too! The WIP is looking good, but perhaps the ear shouldn't receive so much light since it is in the shadows? I think it draws more attention than it should, and kinda looks like it is floating in space.

[Balduran]

The old face was more charming but the new one is... well, new and unique ;)
His eyes are more interesting in the middle, but overall i prefer the left one (Although the middle 'gandalf-like' eyebrows are neat).

What's that thing on his chin though? A goatee or henna?

[Sky_Eagle]

nice face paintings !
your lastest middle face looks very good.

[sirielle]

I didn't get your replies, strange.

Ah, forget that WIP (to be deleted), I've made a few more, scrapped them and did again, and here is what I've got now:

http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/1547/huntervii2008wip3av2.jpg


To be polished more, as you see hair are in progress,layer with no hair nor eye lights on the left. I'm still not happy with the face and can't force him to look into the camera,I'm not sure what causes it. Maybe iris is too low?

Heozart,I have moved the ear a bit and treated the whole face with some dark reds on soft light layer to make the whole skin tones more alike. I've made some mistakes in the beginning with it and still it's not perfect. I'll take a look at it, in the and softening some lights and making others brighter (as the sharpness level). In theory the light source is behind him (and clouds),so yes, it should not be that vivid, good point!

Balduran, the old face reminds me a frog ;) But indeed there was some character in it which got lost here. On chin? Beard? Tattoo? Who knows!

Sky_Eagle, that was test what he should look like.

Edit. And I just see the face on the 3-parts WIP above was better (mouth & nose), but I didn't save it :(

[Balduran]

To be polished more, as you see hair are in progress,layer with no hair nor eye lights on the left. I'm still not happy with the face and can't force him to look into the camera,I'm not sure what causes it. Maybe iris is too low?

Hard to tell. Maybe his eyes should be more in the middle of the eyesocket? In the right one you almost have it ;)

Oh, and about the hair - That braid on top of his hair shouldn't be so straight and stretched. it makes it look artificial (imho)


Balduran, the old face reminds me a frog ;) But indeed there was some character in it which got lost here. On chin? Beard? Tattoo? Who knows!


Edit. And I just see the face on the 3-parts WIP above was better (mouth & nose), but I didn't save it :(
Heh, i still think it could stay that way :P (My original thought was that he scratched his chin)

The nose isn't that bad (It's just smallish), but you really need to change his mouth now, it's awfuly big (not to mention something is off with it)

[sirielle]

I've been told to hide the further iris more and that helped (no lights on eyes):

http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/482/huntervii2008wip4fl7.jpg

[NR43]

Hi, a few crits:
You can improve the eyes by making the lower lid disappear underneath the upper.
Also, his left eye, the lower lid does not indicated the roundness of the eyeball enough.
Check some refs from that 3/4 view to get a good idea.
I'd also put some reflections on the eyes. this really helps a lot to make them more believable if done well (use overlay or another layer mode that allows for a bit of transparancy)
His left eye should also be positioned a bit lower (the eyes are aligned horizontal, but the nose/mouth vertical line is under an angle)

the forehead is too flat, particularly where it meets the eyebrows... Male skulls have bulges there. The area where the forehead transits into the side of the cranium needs work as well (his right side of the forehead). It's not parallel to his left side due to the "corner" being too "wide" and the hairline being too low in comparison with the left side.

The ear is placed too low. It shouldn't be (much) lower than the bottom of the nose if you see the head in profile, a tiny bit is ok though, but this is too low.

[sirielle]

Thank you for all the points, Johan!

http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/5370/huntervii2008wip5nt4.jpg


I changed the ear position and did some changes to forehead's highlights (not finished yet,nose needs more work, too) and eyelids. Also I'm attaching a shot with hair, brows and eye highlights layers (the previous one didn't have them to keep pupils visible). The lights on eyes aren't the final option, as almost everything here. I haven't moved the eye & brow lower, yet, I'll do it when I flatten the layers.
Desaturated flipped bottom layer on the right, to check the shading (I still forget to do it in Painter, a colour layer filled with dark grey can serve to check it, without need of real desaturation).

This guy has no luck, started in December '06, I couldn't work more on him then.Next I haven't finished him summer of last year, nor in March (or February) and now his chances aren't high, either. But the background is ready (only I need to add there more mist and in the end freezing air he exhales), so I need to get him done.

[sirielle]

I have spoiled, I have fixed, I hope the face is acceptable. Level of redness still kills and oh glitter... I hope I haven't overdosed it too much ;) I'll check levels in the end.

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/4706/huntervii2008wip6pz2.jpg

If I had more time he would have scales here and there. Maybe on a remake after a few years, with a decent scull shape and face features ^_^ Now, fur!

[sirielle]

OK, he is done, though eyes look strange, still.

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/6969/siriellehuntercroph700de9.jpg

I don't like the colour scheme, but can't do anything about it now - I preferred the original warmer colours I had before, this is result of levels correction.

The whole image - ready?

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/7138/siriellehunterw800os2.jpg

[NR43]

Nice work. I like the color palette. The background's cool colors are nicely balancing the warm colors of the man. Sometimes one has to call a piece finished or one will work on it forever.
Time to move on ;)

I'd love to see you tackle some anatomy studies, particularly (but not limited to) heads and facial features, since these subjects tend to be more prominent in your work.
When drawing anatomy from ref, don't stall too much during these exercises. Work through them at a fairly quick tempo. It's better to do 100 quickies then 1 longer study.
I know they can seem boring to do but once you are at it they're not boring at all. Anatomy studies are actually quite challenging (no matter what skill level you are).

Hope you will keep pushing yourself.

[sirielle]

Thank you for all advices! Regarding studies - every time you upload yours I want to do them,too. I know they are necessary and can be fun. I have found a group of people who meet from time to time to sketch together, I hope to join them after summer (they aren't active now). Also I've found a teacher in the area, I plan to visit that place and if the person is really teaching I will make a course (I'm always worried that I'll step on someone who knows less than me as I've heard many times they do not really care of proper anatomy studies in art schools and one has to exercise it on their own). So,I know I always say I'll do more studies but I will really do them, without life drawing sessions and studies I'll never get out of the stage, where instead of thinking what I want to paint and what way I want to show it I'm struggling with head proportions and try to remember what way a nose looks like.


I'm moving, moving, but in a mean time I've done final post production. In other words I brought back the warm colours to the sky, copied, pasted and moved a few details (hair top down, closer iris more to the right) and made the "dragon" pupils more visible. Now he is looking at us :)

Here is close up, the whole final image is posted in my portfolio (http://sirielle.cgsociety.org/gallery/660729/):

http://www.sirielle.com/illus/Sirielle_Hunter2.jpg



Also I managed to change Exotique 4 submissions again, now I'm uploading the final option (I hope they'll not switch the FTP right now,it worked much faster at night). Yes, I decided to submit this fella, that's the only reason I had to finish him last night. I had to sleep (still no cure for that ;)), so the final corrections were done just now. Also I could check it with fresh eyes today. Anyway I didn't manage to finish him for Exotique 3, now I managed to do it for the 4th edition. It's like a symbol to me - it doesn't matter if he gets in, what matters is I did it, he's done and now I can really move on :D

[NR43]

I hope you're not too late for Exotique 4? Thought the deadline was midnight last night... oh well, I hope you get in.

About studying (anything really, not just anatomy)... why wait until after summer? No better time to do some sketches than now ;)

Today at work, things were a bit slow (always are the day after our main deadline) so I made a perspective study. I'm not supposed to be drawing at work (I work at a finance dept) but I did it anyway and I'm glad I did, even if the sketch turned out quite crappy.
What I'm trying to say is that you should take advantage of every chance you get to draw or paint. I've not seen much traditional stuff in your sb sofar. I think if you really put your mind to it, you could draw a lot more than you actually do and your skills would go up in the sky pretty darn fast. Go to school but don't limit your drawing and painting to these courses. They are great because we learn at school, but we also need mileage and routine.

Just my 2 cents (forgive me if I sounded too harsh - I hope you'll take it in a positive way, coz that's how it is intended)

[sirielle]

Johan, you never sound too harsh and I agree with all you said :) The only problem is I know I should sketch every day, so I've bought paper and soft pencils, some books and collected photo references, but I almost never do it. (What I wanted to say about the drawing group was that they'll start with Autumn, so I could join them then, not that I can't start anything on my own earlier.)

Regarding E4 - I decided that as long as FTP and upload system is working, that long time I've got, so I upgraded the image 3 times. It was working the other day after Expose deadline, too.
Yet it was in vain, I almost deleted it today to spare effort for jury, but my mum told me to leave it as it is (I should listen to my mum sometimes ;) ). For after I posted it in 2D I got interesting feedback and can't leave that image in it's present shape (the feedback is here (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?p=5310919)). I don't agree with all what people said, but some things are really important and bother me, too. On the other hand I could just dim colour, crop it to portrait and forget it, but then I'm loosing the whole idea of the guy being something more than a "random elfy guy".

But right now I've got a chance to update another old image - till tomorrow evening. Then it'll be printed the way it is or not at all depending on my mood (which is crappy right now, but I'm driving to seaside tomorrow, so maybe it'll be better - unexpected family meeting 400 km from my place :) ). Anyway I was trying to bring this face into better shape, but still something is wrong and if he put his face straight it would not be a face I desired him to have, as always:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/9269/wip1hb0.jpg



To my eye the old face had forehead part in a different perspective than the nose and chin. New mouth and chin placement is still too high. I enlarged his hand, but this I'll check in the end, it's not visible after putting the snow over (http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=firstsnowh700da5.jpg). The face is most important here. I'll get back to it tomorrow evening.

[sirielle]

It was impossible to work on it last night, I drove home before 1AM.

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/1677/wip2vx5.jpg

[sirielle]

Almost done, I'm finishing hair, but still got problem with his chest and hand needs more work:

http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/38/wip4ni5.jpg


I've made the whole face a bit shorter, mouth slightly less wide etc.

[sirielle]

Latest steps - final body:

http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/4443/wip5ut7.jpg

Bottom part of the face still seemed too high (like bent towards the top), so I rotated the bottom (part of nose with mouth and chin) 2degrees down:

http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/2884/wip6nz1.jpg



Now it looks OK to me, only the hand still needs work - I didn't finish the hands workshop, now it pays off.

[NR43]

Hi there

The last piece is a big improvement over the previous one imo.

You might want to correct the form of the collarbone. Check some reference if you can, the collarbone is not straight but it bends backwards in a bit of an S-curve.

Good work on the hair!

[sirielle]

Thank you. I have already sent it last night, but I'll take a look at refs and move the colarboine a bit. It's less visible under the snow, fortunately - here is the final image from last night (or rather today 4 AM morning, when I was fixing the further arm):

http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/8604/firstsnowwip3ip7.jpg

[namnocilis]

Just dropped by to say this is a great thread! love all the paintings.. i don't know much about painting but i have tried doing some.. i like the colors you have used for your paintings and i admire fantasy works a lot

[sirielle]

Thank you, namnocilis!

Final final, I left the hand, but fixed the collar bone and made sure the snow falls better:

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/7171/firstsnowwip4bk2.jpg


Now I can go away from home for a few days :)

[sirielle]

It's been a while since August, when I finished the man in snow and got stuck on the other WIP (well I finally turned the wild elf into grey scale, haven't done anything else though). Not much happened since then:

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/8559/sirielleredheaduk8.jpg

It supposed to be face of the man in snow, but someone else got into my mind while painting.

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/685/siriellevampvr9.jpg

A vampire for PixelBrush quick pix.

But recently I reminded myself about old idea for illustration I've had, so I grabbed pencil, some pens and moved it a bit forward in planing:

- initial sketch from July 2007 (a "note" to remember the scene)
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/568/siriellehelcaraxefd8.jpg


- present ideas on thumbnails, I like the bottom right one best
http://img74.imageshack.us/img74/6173/20081128helcaraxethcolsn8.jpg


- clothes ideas for characters
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/500/20081128helcaraxeconc2ce2.jpg

(colour variants coloured and corrected in PC)


People marching through ice field (ice straits). It can't really be fashion fair, also I want to keep it toned down, but still I could make up something more than just a hood and blanket. Need and want to sketch more of it. Chances are I'll continue this one next year or so ;)

On a side note I can't stand pencil alone, looks lacking contrast to me, so I have to ran with ball pen or pens over it.

[NR43]

Hi Sirielle :)


You know I was reading a bit in your sketchbook and something occured to me:
Your biggest problem is not composition nor color nor value nor anatomy as you think. Surely they are extremely important and every self respecting artist will strive to improve all of these things for the rest of his/her life.

I know exactly what you go through because I am a bit of a perfectionist myself, and many times it has kept me from calling something finished, being unable to let go.

What will really help you is to learn to see every painting, drawing or sketch you make as an exercise, nothing more. A step upward on the infinite stairs to heaven, if you like. Think about it. Surely you will think now that this is contradictory to artistic perseption, but it works great if you give every sketch, every doodle, every painting your very best and put your whole heart to it... until at some point you say: DONE! when you evaluate your work afterwards, think about the things that can be improved and the things that worked out well. Take those things with you on your next exercise.

Also, you need to draw from reference. Perhaps it seems boring to you now (although I personally think that you avoid it because you fear to fail at sketching things, which is perfectly normal), but you will learn how to really see by doing such studies. Pick out any master painter from the present or the past, and you will find out that they did many many studies.

The way I see it is that every person, tree, cloud, flower, car, house, street, table, etc is a tool.

A tool I can use to get better and faster, in combination with my pencil, pen or stylus or whatever medium is at hand. Don't spend too much time on each sketch (max 1hr or 90min if you want to practice shading). You should try to keep an average of 30 sec to 10mn max per sketch. Often, when drawing from real life situations you will find 2 minutes is extremely long for a person to keep a pose. They look around, move their arms, switch the supporting leg when standing, turn around, etc...
In general, it's better to combine lots and lots of quick studies with a few longer studies.

A couple of posts ago (on aug 7th to be specific) you mentioned that you would like to draw on a daily basis, but you just don't. Any particular reason? How did that drawing group go btw? A sketching group is AWESOME! It's like going to drawing class, only in a different environment, and with different models :)

But even if you don't have a sketching group, there are still many things around you that can be studied -at any time of the day. I often look at the clouds when I'm driving home from work for example, and every time I wish I had a laptop and a cintiq so I could stop the car and start painting them. Then again, I'd have to do many explanations of being late everywhere I go LOL.

Anyway, I hope I was able to motivate you to pick up that pencil, leave those fears of failing, and start sketching the world around you. And yes, I garantuee you that most of the stuff you draw the first weeks (or even months in my case) will disappoint you. But be persistent! When I have a rought time studying I always remember Anand's signature that said "Talent is cheap, dedication is priceless"!

The stuff you paint is beautiful.
The stuff you will study will make it so much better and it will make you more complete as an artist.
Put everything you have in every sketch, but letting go and moving on to the next "exercise" at the right time will make you feel FREE

[sirielle]

Thank you so much Johan :)

You are right in everything what you said, including the fear to fail, also at sketching from life. Plus something you said in your thread - fear of leaving (and showing) imperfections. I used to post drawings, but I after time I feel urge to delete everything (sketches, not portfolio images). I'm still learning to let pieces go, treat them as exercise and paint a new those failed ones, not repaint them. Good thing is I see it now and understand it, only the urge to fix haven't disappeared. And I still got problem with the redhaired "elf" fella. I should let it go but after the crit I got I feel like a cheater and coward not fixing it. People put effort to give me advice, I should at least try.

Persistence, you are so right about it and Anand's signature is true - talent is just a start, will do nothing without practice. A side not - I am sure that most of people would draw nice if they never gave it up, as all the kids can draw in first years of school. John Howe said once that we are loosing ability to draw because we stop doing it early and only practice writing and do it a lot, which involves different type of focus (detail vs global). If all of us practised drawing as much as writing, we would not only draw better, but also had better planning skills and look at world differently :)

My problem is the lack of systematics in drawing reflects my life. I never went to the drawing classes so far, although e-mailed them and got invitation for a free lesson. And I will not get there tomorrow for it's already after 6 AM and I haven't gone to bed yet. If I don't change the way I live and think of myself drawings will be missing, incomplete and wonky. In the end what we draw/the way we draw reflects us, no matter what we would say against it. On the other hand changing drawing habits should reflect on life, too :)

What is surprising to me those pencil sketches I did were pretty fast, I do it longer on computer - a trap of fixing forever and being lazy because everything can be moved etc. On paper plan must be better from the start. Still I expected to get much worse results than I did. Of course I had to fix them at least with ballpen ;) But my sketch from life was a crap compared with what I expected from myself, so yes, I should prepare to see a lot of crappy sketches. Plan for later today - do some life studies on paper, I'll try :)

Thank you again for all the thoughts and inspirations!



A few images. The sketch was quick, I just discovered textures on paper in Art Rage and sketched "whatever" to test it. Then a trap - I liked the sketch, so decided to ink it and colour in Painter. There are still anatomical problems, but I had fun making it:

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/411/2008125nonamemanoy3.jpg
Sketch in Art Rage.

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/5194/inkstep2kg5.jpg
Digital ink in Painter, I 'fixed" it on the tests below, but it looks better here.

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/665/test12jk0.jpg

Watercolour layer in Painter. Crazy colours, too dark shading, lost light source and fun.


http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/6451/test3lighthairfk1.jpg
I tried to repaint it with airbrushes to fix what I noticed. Still not enough, but this poor guy will stay this way. I started it thinking "exercise" and that's what it is.

[NR43]

It's a real pleasure to read your last post
Your're on the right track for sure!

[sirielle]

It didn't work as I planned, I tried to sketch my cats who moved too much, got to sketch more before I scan those.

Here is an apple from memory for Epilogue sketch challenge #1:

http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/2035/applememdi9.jpg


I need to make a few more - now from reference. I even bought an apple for that (I can't eat them, so didn't have any at home).

And here is something I wanted to draw - a harp player. I wanted him to play but so far he is rather stiff, I used as ref Justmeina stock (http://justmeina.deviantart.com/art/Chair-sit-27745287) (sketched him on another layer then sketched harp player over it):

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/1377/elemmiresketch2sgj8.jpg


I guess I'll make him playing it the next time. All references I've found are taken from a different angle and with women. Maybe I'll find a better pose after a meal ;)
Harp needs shaping either, but body bothers me most.

[sirielle]

I had to make strings on a test drawing to notice how stupid the above idea of holding harp is :lol:

In a meantime completing my apples set for the Weekly Sketchbook Challenge #1: Apple (http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=21534) - drawings from life:
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/6360/applegreyscaleus1.jpg

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/9408/applecolourik6.jpg
This was tough. I couldn't make colours right and it still doesn't much reference colours.

Simplified:
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/9146/applecontourcl3.jpg

[sirielle]

A quick exercise for the harp image (referenced from dani_stock at dA (http://dani-stock.deviantart.com/art/dani-339-11390933)):

http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/9307/harpdanistockqa3.jpg

[Gord-MacDonald]

You are doing some wonderful analysis of your works - I see big improvements from page 1 to now! Keep up the good work. Keep up the awesome work!

Gord

[sirielle]

Thank you Gordon!


Yesterday's exercise with constructing female head from Loomis:
http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/303/femaleheadsloomis2jm6.jpg


and Morgaine Le Fay sketch:

http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/4674/morgaine001zs5.jpg


I messed something with her arms, like I messed sides while flipping image horizontally. Will fix it later.
She should have been done yesterday, but I browsed for reference and ended up watching too many faces, clothes, Celts and myths sites and in the end totally accidentally John Howe forums. Internet.

[sirielle]

I thought I'll finish her fast, but time is too busy now, I guess I'll get back to her after Christmas. I'm not sure if this face will stay, I'm still looking for Morgana's face, but I find the present one interesting so here it is, still in WIP stage, to be shaped more:

http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/9649/morgaine002gg4.jpg

[NR43]

I know exactly what you mean about losing track of time when browsing the internet.
I was at deviantart downloading stock images from Marcus J. Ranum (http://mjranum-stock.deviantart.com/). This man has a huge pile of wonderful stock images, I just couldn't resist to add them to my reference database. Think I only dl half of them but it took me a while to say the least. I think it's a good investment though because I use them often.

It's one thing I try to do regularly:
let my image organisor software (ACDSee) create me a random slideshow with the timer set at 3 or 5 minutes per image and do some gesture sketching...

[sirielle]

Good tip, I'll try it. In a mean time my cats provided way too fast changing reference ;)

Good stock gallery. Following Mercuralis advice I've made a collection with stock accounts in my favs folder at dA, so I usually fav 1-2 images of a nice collection/series. Still when I get lost in collecting references it takes ages... and then I even have no time to look at these. So I stopped to full view them when saving to HDD, only use it as ref for the future. Then again I rather base on my memory or favs than HDD, because I collected too many images on my disk to find quickly some images, even with folders done by theme and/or artist. Crazy! I need to review it one day and delete a lot of stuff I would not save now but I thought it was fabulous a few years ago. Everything is changing.

But I finally got Dynamic Anatomy by Burne Hogarth and - after quick browsing - I must say it rocks. Also I ordered with it Fantasy Art Workshop and Forging Dragons by John Howe and will not hasitate to use them ;D With time, that is.

Enough of talking. I've had no time to work on any of my WIPs, but I have finally managed to do a few pencil sketches :D Cats and glasses/cups done from life, faces done while looking at a movie with Jean Reno and Gérard Depardieu (a movie on TV, I didn't still/stop it). I tried to catch some characteristics of the actor's faces not to really portrait them, like my cats they were moving too fast either ;)

First take on cats:

http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/5476/20081206jx9.jpg


Second take, way better but if you really want to see what way my cats look like go here (http://sirielle.deviantart.com/art/Who-stole-my-socks-92651829) ;)

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/2166/200812261rr2.jpg


http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/5187/200812262om5.jpg


Faces (one with no ref):

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/6302/200812263lg6.jpg

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/7864/200812264fa8.jpg



Both Depardieu and Rano have got really interesting faces and totally different to a generic faces I try to catch, I need to make a real studies/portraits of them with time.

In the end - a quick image done for Pierre on Christmas gifts exchange over Epilogue. I used references for pandas, they supposed to represent his two daughters:

http://img386.imageshack.us/img386/8033/pandachristmass2008ff9.jpg

[NR43]

Ah it's great to see you sketching this often!
Jean Reno and Depardieu are both indeed awesome actors!
Think you depicted a young Reno there, which I'm sure he'd appreciate :D

[sirielle]

Young Rano, could be. Now I realised I have never seen him young anywhere, need to browse the web one day.

Haven't had enough time, but I managed to sketch again and now when I do have more time again I'll try to keep this pace.

Here is something from the night of 1st/3nd of January - a quick digital sketch of characters to Baldur's Gate add-on my friends have been doing (and never finished). I tried to push further the female necromancer (referenced Jennifer Lopez (http://kylecheatham.tripod.com/THE_CELL_POSTER.jpg) in The Cell movie (http://kylecheatham.tripod.com/THE_CELL_POSTER.jpg)):

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/5347/20090101dy9.jpg


http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6742/kleotestsdh6.jpg


Ears are crap, I need to do ears studies.

Pencil sketches, one page of two I did last night. The other page is nothing interesting, but I like the sketches done while looking at old photos of my parents. While I caught some similarity to my mum, my dad want totally different way XD

http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/5246/200901062jf8.jpg



Another thing I tried to do here was holding a pencil in a different way than while writing, holding it more like a brush. That's what John Howe advices to do. But I had to switch to the usual grasp for details. I guess it's just a matter of time, though. Much better way to keep image clean of unintentional hand smudging ;) But I wonder now if a tablet pen should not be hold such way, too? And what way do you hold pencils?

[sirielle]

A little update on the necromancer - after I did the necklace (which I didn't plan to make at all) I have to finish the rest. And fix the overdosed breasts ;)

http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/2523/kleowip2nx5.jpg

[sirielle]

I have forgotten about that red necklace and spent a whole day yesterday making an animation in Painter. Well, maybe too big word - a little test only, Painter is not the best animation tool ever. And I still haven't tried to animate real movement, like moving a hand or walking, but will try, especially since I browsed animation forums here, which I never did before and found pout a lot of different animation software to try :)

Yesterday I only tried to animate the first 3 frames of my unfinished comic. It took me a whole day (almost, I'm ill, so I got up late but also stayed up late) because of no experience and crappy way Painter replaces frames at random and loses layers after reopening FRM file which makes hard moving back and making changes. I had to redo all from the start to test different amount of frames to make camera movement more natural etc. Here are the sketchy comic/colour test I probably posted in my sketchbook before and new images for the animation:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/5549/losgaranitestconceptarttl5.jpg


Story based on J. R. R. Tolkien's alternative version of the events in Losgar (burning ships of the Teleri) - the quoatation above might not be readable, here it is:

"Fëanor stole the ships of the Teleri, and breaking faith with Fingolfin and with those faithful to him sailed away, leaving the rest of his host to make their way on foot with great travail and loss. The ships were anchored off the shore, in the Firth of Drengist, and all the host of Fëanor went on land and camped there."
J. R. R. Tolkien, History of Middle Earth vol. XII (page 354)

The animation tests are at You Tube, a lot of things has to be detailed and/or changed, but I'm happy I could put my artwork into "life":
- test #1 [link] (http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=lJuw117sQIs) with more natural animation of fire light on character's face
- test #2 [link] (http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=VPSM9mlyk3E) simplified fire light, more mimics on face, format 6x9

Note1 - I start too many things, should finish something first.
Note 2 - apart ears handd studies are necessary.

[sirielle]

Working back on the old image to finalise it. I'm trying to show a transformation into a dragon, not a guy with dragon wings. The first idea was to swirl his hair into appearing wings (partially invisible). Here is what I came to while doodling over the original. Does it work?

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/5008/sketch04.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I decided to give him less human face, as I wanted in the beginning.

A few sketches I haven't posted:

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/6268/02022009hogarth.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/8480/redbeard.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/1462/20090128.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
The image on the left has been done with left hand (I'm right handed). I like it better than the right hand one.

http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/46/drowningwip.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
A forgotten WIP - drowning or drowned girl.

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/338/defaultnoldowip.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
A forgotten portrait WIP.
Funny, I see nothing wrong as I did when I wrote that text.

[sirielle]

An idea born while making up a new layout for my web site. It used to be called Forgotten Isle, so here is a concept of the isle's gate:

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6987/2009ii26.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


The pose is slightly different than I wanted, but the idea gets shape. Two female statues in ivy like company. We'll see what way it'll evolve.

[Intervain]

I really like the gate design - especially the figure on the left in the middle image!

[vikramvr]

As Dadela said,The gate design is cool. Will look great if it comes in a game like unreal, all normal mapped and grunge textured.

[Balduran]

As Dadela said,The gate design is cool. Will look great if it comes in a game like unreal, all normal mapped and grunge textured.
I don't think Sirielle knows what normal mapping is ;)

In short, it's the bumpiness we get on objects in newer games.
Example: http://www.sub-standards.com/NormalPictures/WithNormal.JPG (see the neat light on the ball? It's an extra texture on the model)

Oh and sorry for the lack of comments, i can't get myself to do anything lately :(

[sirielle]

Tahnk you guys for the feedback!

No problem, thank you for example :) I figured out that vikramvr thinks about 3D, but indeed I didn't know what exactly mapping nor grunge texture are, I was going to google it. It will not be 3D, I want to paint it the usual way, but I'll google Unreal Tournament art to compare. Need also take a look at Argonath from LotR movie again, as I decided to make my gate in a bit similar scale. I hope the plants fit to such scale.

Intervain, I hope you're thinking of the better rendered figure? That would be on the right. That was just a sketchy base on the left.

A bit more work tonight - I had not much time, so I gave up painting all by hand and copied, flipped and painted over the sketch to get two very similar, but not necessarily identical sides:

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6765/2009ii27.jpg

Still I am not sure what way the figure will look like finally. One supposed to be darker, the other handle light. Aaaaand I haven't decided what will be visible behind the gate... I didn't need anything for website as the content would be there, but now I need to think of it for an illustration.

[vikramvr]

The last image is nice. As soon as I looked at it, it reminded me of level art from Unreal

http://xbox360media.ign.com/xbox360/image/article/744/744356/gears-of-war-20061107035032612.jpg

So I thought it might be cool, if it became a gate in that game..

[sirielle]

I see. I thought you're referring to something more like the Ancient Bath House by James McWilliams (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=2909315&postcount=127).
I was going to keep it as a gate to my Forgotten Isle, but we'll see what way it'll evolve, maybe into a gate to something darker. No post nuclear industry realm, though, rather alternative Avalon.

I'm still thinking what to pout in the back, this is gate in high mountains, the realm should be visible far away in the bottom or a misty mountains like the Chinese Yellow Mountains (http://images.google.pl/images?q=yellow%20mountains%20china&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:pl:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=pl&tab=wi). The plants on the gate itself are inspired by this tree roots on a shot my father has taken in India (http://gregri.carbonmade.com/projects/2236478#9), somewhere in Mumbai area (and that's my mum there, several years ago).

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/3339/backtest3.jpg

[sirielle]

Finally I used photo elements as background base (shots taken by my father in India). I don't think it's enough to call a piece matte painting. Nor if that has made painting faster, but at least I'm not irritated any more. Now I've got to repaint all the puzzles into oness:

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/4373/2009iii02.jpg

[sirielle]

Not much done and I like and hate this photo paint over element. ATM looks as the best rendered element of the picture and i's not entirely mine, I hate it. Of course I need refine the rest, but I still hate it, so I'll test more empty background. Also I wonder if the perspective is not off now?

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/2757/2009iii022.jpg

I need more hands and female body studies, definitely.

[Intervain]

hahah omg my 3d way of thinking has taken over - yes I ment the right ;) geez... I am too used to talking of the character's right or left :eek::surprised

I think adding more value contrasts in the whole image might help it a bit :)

[NR43]

Hi Sirielle

I think repainting the clouds in a less scattered way will improve the serenity a lot.
Take a good look at that vid your dad made... the clouds are actually a lot bigger than in your painting.

What I've also noticed is that there doesn't seem to be a path leading towards and behind the gate anymore. I think you should go easy on the fog/clouds a bit. Save them for the last and add a more interesting light setup to the scene first. Paint in grayscale only until you are really happy with the piece. Then color it.
Only after that, add the fog n clouds on a separate layer, use a big soft brush (you can play with an airbrush type and make it spread a lot wider than a normal airbrush for example).

Always try to use 100% opacity for your brushes (except for fog and for the blenders in painter, where playing with brush opacity is actually handy) and lower the opacity of your layers afterwards instead. This will allow you to understand the effects of your strokes a lot better (remember, we paint forms) and personally I think painting this way makes controlling the values a 1000 times easier

Think about it, a good workflow makes so much difference but it is something we have to discover along the way. I think working straight in color without thoroughly knowing the forms you try to depict is suicide. Don't compare your workflow with how pro illustrators work. They make nice tutorials but they forget to mention that it takes a long time to find a workflow that allows for quick painting on a professional level.
Speaking of that... where are the life sketches? :bounce: :twisted:

Oh just one thing I notice just now, why not try to break the symmetry a bit more?
Will add a lot to the "believability" of the piece I think.
Looking forward to your update