Character WIP: Combat Alien/Cyborg

[gnarlycranium]

Those are some really nifty details you've got going on the helmet-- but the body underneath it all looks a little weird. Might want to show just that part so you can get some help with it, and make sure that you're building your armor on a good base.

[PCollier]

Well here is a more detailed analysis of the torso area with the half designed chest armour. I am happy with the torso itself. I wanted to keep the muscle structure slightly different to human muscle structure as it is after all alien. But I am having real trouble designing the chest armour. I want a large raised area for the back of the armour but I can't visualize it, any ideas anyone a helpful sketch or something would be great as I am not a great drawer :wip:

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/TorsoArmour.jpg

Also here is a 360 of the helmet a bit closer up. CC's are still welcome for the helmet but keep in mind I am happy with it hehe:

Helmet Spin (http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/animation/alienanimes/helmetspin.avi)

[smudgefoster]

:bounce: Excellent stuff mister collier....cant wait to see it textured and moving around.....a nice mix of hard modelling and
organic form....nice stuff.

[Ian Christie]

Hi, nice nice work.

You requested some sugestions for the back aromour, here's a pic I quickly threw together. Note, I'm not a great drawer either, but thought I'd try.

I was trying to make it fit in with what you have. The "Flexible" tubes at the top I thought would go to the helmet. And yes I have a thing for vents :) The "wing sections" are supposed to follow the shape of the "strap" from the bottom right render in the image you have above, and completely cover the shoulder blades.

These were just quick sketches.

here's one drawn on your model (may have to copy and paste) http://ianchristie.batcave.net/renders/TorsoArmour-ian.jpg

[PCollier]

Hey Ian,

I couldn't get the render sketch working could you try again and I would be most grateful :beer:

Yes the pipes idea going to the helmet I like, it is definatly something I will implement into the design if I figure out an effective way of animating joining pipes without restricting movement when animating.

Blend shapes with set driven keys I expect will be the way to go.

Thanks to Smudge also. A mix between organic and hard surfaces is exactly what I am going for with the style of the character so that means alot :)

[PCollier]

Did a quick sketch at work today hence why it is on note paper :shame:

Quite happy with this basic design now. Pipes and stuff will be added as detail as they are always good :D

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/BackArmourSketch.jpg

[PCollier]

Ok So below is the Back Armour I've done for him. I think Once I've finished the whole character I will start adding more details like a few more screws and inset and things. what do you all think? any improvments are most welcome :)

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/021.jpg

Watch this space got some other material to come either later today or tomorrow :wip:

[PCollier]

Doesn't seem like people are very interested in this project :hmm: It would be cool to get some feedback or encouragment anything will do :)

I have made a quick animation of his mechanical hand moving. It took about 4 minutes to animate as it is all rigged using expressions and animated via custom attributes on a control curve (see below) which makes it very easy to animate, if only the organic parts would be so easy to animate!

The animation is 2.6mb and is encoded with DivX 5.02:

Mech Hand Animation (http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/animation/alienanimes/mechhand.avi)

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/MechHandControls.jpg

[Ian Christie]

I love the back armour, fits perfectly. Also like that Mech hand.

[PCollier]

First of all thanks Ian for the encouragment :beer:

Ok this is a concept I've done of the mechanical arm that will attach to the Mech Hand. I'm sure the design will slightly change when I start modelling it (it always does) but it's always better to have a base idea in your head.

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/mecharmconcept.jpg

[Gobbo]

Its looking very cool now, how about adding some strips of flesh like the terminator, that have been torn and sindged in battle?

[PCollier]

Hi Gobbo thx for the compliment :love:

Yep I intend to have all the flesh hanging/stripped glory I can muster without my machine getting onto its knee's and begging for mercy. Just watch this space. Got some latest work coming up today or tomorrow... :wip:

[Gobbo]

Plus he could have a machine gun or something on the other arm instead of a hand. But your probably going to do that anyway :buttrock:

[ALZHEM]

Good job

[PCollier]

Thx for the assurance Alzhem :beer:

hehe gobbo he is not going to have a gun as a hand, I actually hope to make a unique and original cyborg sorry :scream:

Here is the mech leg and the organic leg finished minus small details like a few more screws and stuff. The mech foot similar to the mech hand is rigged with expressions and animatable with sliders, what can I say I find it fun doing them :rolleyes:

As you can also see I've done most of the front crotch area and yes he has had his Bicini line done :p

What do you all think?

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/Legs.jpg

[Gobbo]

Very cool, I know hes meant to be an alien/cyborg dude, but the leg joints at the knee look like they need to swivel round 90 degrees, it looks like all he could do is wobble side to side! Sorry, its not meant to be a put down, it just looks unnatural to the casual eye.

Other than that, it looks amazingly cool! Your skills certainly have come on leaps and bounds from the second year! I applaud you sir! :applause:

[mediumRare]

Hey PCollier,
You have modelling skills thats for sure. Character looks good. I have a bit of a critique on the character design....if I may:

Its a little confusing to me.
Is it an alien, or a cyborg?

Right now it seems like a "terminator" robot with skin on top.
If this is the case why does he need a helmet? for air?
Id rather see the head with lots of skin damages off showing the underneath metal skeleton. Dont forget that the head adds tons of character to your, well... character.

If he is living, then he has had a lot of robotic additions to his body. Both feet, a hand, and a leg from what I can see but his torso sems pretty intact. It doesnt seem consistent to me. And why does he have armour on his legs, to protect his skin? Why? Theres just strong metal underneath, not fragile bones!

I hope Im conveying some of the contradictions in your design well enough.

I think perhaps a more clear design might bring the whole thing together a little better.

Hope this helps?

Cheers

[PCollier]

Ok below are 2 renders of the complete character so far (minus the mech hand). Hopefully this will give peeps a better perspective on the way he is heading.

Gobbo: Thanks for the support :beer: I see what you are saying about the knee. I will explain my design; First of all mechanically it does work believe it or not however as you say it does look like it could collapse but I am using a bit of AL there. The 2nd major reason is that it is meant to symbolise the shape of that muscle on an organic leg if you look at the other organic leg you may see what I mean. I did have round circular bars protecting it to emphisize this more (you may see this in an earlier render on this thread) but I took them out cause it looks more pleasing without them.

mediumRare: Thanks also for your compliments and thanks for spending time to help me with this it is much appreciated :love:

I will try and answer your questions: The character is an alien with cyborg parts. I definitely intend to model his head. As it is gonna be very important for the animation plot.

He does not have an exo-skeleton mearly mechanical replacement parts. The metal plating on his right leg for example join with his organic fragile leg which is why he has armour protecting his upper leg. This will me more obvious when I texture him as I will add have bloody mangey bits wheres the flesh meets that metal plated part for example.

You are right about it not being consistent at the moment. But I assure you most of his lower torso is gonna have metal joins mech detail galore where its gonna look pretty battered I just havn't got round to it yet. I weill be incorporating a loin cloth to the design to help bring some fluidity to his movement when I come to animate him, as it is as you say very mechanically dominated.

I have just realised how hard it is to get help on a character design without telling people the animations plot and what the intention is with the character. But it is extremely useful to get opinion as to how the character is currently coming across to everyone so I can them adjust it accordingly.

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/Full01.jpg

[mark_battista]

hey pete, hows it goin? Recognise the name? Good to see your churning out some kick arse stuff. Where you working at this year and hows it going?
mark

[Gobbo]

Any new work to show Pete?

[PCollier]

Very busy with work at the moment so he has to take a back seat for the next week or so I'm afraid :wip:

[Gobbo]

Never mind mate, im the same, got plenty to do, im redoing my website (again) and im going to buy a domain as well.

[BlackMedusa]

great design
are you going to animate it after you're done?
would be nice too see

[PCollier]

Thx BlackMedusa :wavey:

Yes I will be animating him once he is done. Half of him (his mechanical parts) I will be animating using expressions and custom sliders. Exactly in the same way as I've done the mech hand on the first page. The 2nd half traditional skinning :)

Still got a bit to do on the modelling side: His head (thats only his helmet at the moment). His mech arm (see concept on page 1), his organic arm. This is along with alot more detail put into his lower torso where its joined with the mech leg etc.

Maybe I should take a couple of weeks of work to finish modelling him heh :D

[PCollier]

Managed to get a bit of time to get the arms and hands done and connected to the torso. The hands are 3 fingered with two thumbs, the same as the mech hand. I think I'm still gonna add some veins. That will come later when I add final detail to him.

I've left the chest armour out on the front render just so you can see the detail. Alot still to be added in the lower torso where all the pipes are to be attached. Comments welcome :wip: thanks :bounce:

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/FullArms.jpg

[mark_battista]

summat don't look quite right with them arms mate. Just nitpicking but I think the hand as an overall feature is still too boxy, especially the fingers. Perhaps the arm is too thick!?
Anyway looking good so far mate
regards
mark battista

[chayground]

the arms look fractionally too long. if I imaging them by his sides they seem to long. like a monkey. I know he isnt maybe human but it looks odd to the human eye.

oh and the rest is cool

im still trying to model a hand :(

did you use Sub Dees or Splines or Nurbs for those hands and arms?

my fingers look like sausages :(

[JasonA]

yeah those hands need some work, but boy the overall character looks really good. Keep going with it, and try shaping the hands' palm to be more curved. Sweet work so far,

[ZVAN]

hoPe to sEE the FinIsh ModEl soon as wELL with the texture! it might get a chance on the front page heh!

[Grub]

Interesting model design, P.:thumbsup: Like the head and feet the most. Arms look longer than natural for a human, so that must be the alien part of this 'borg. Carry on with the good work.:bounce: :wip:

[Maximus Groff]

Hello maya people! heheh

Show!

I like it very much... ;) Keep up!

[PCollier]

Wow much support I'm very happy :love: Updated with all your crits taken on board.

Mark Battista: I agree with the hands being to boxy, I've narrowed the fingers and made a few other small changes. Is it better now?

Chaymation: I'm in complete agreement about the arms lots of people have been saying. I've now shortened them. The entire torso, arms and hands are all standard poly modelled with a sub-d surface to smooth it. Keep lugging away at your hand I'm sure it will be great, be sure to show when you have done.

JasonA: Thx for the compliments :love: I have re-shaped the hand and made a more defined palm. Can you tell the difference?

Grub: Getting such great support makes me want to work even more thankyou :love: My fav parts include the head too, but I'm most proud of the mech hand that you can see on page 1 of this thread hehe. By the way your Bond modelling is excellent!

Groff: Thx for the support :beer:

ZVAN: I'm also really looking forward to the texturing. Gonna have some lovely stuff going on :lightbulb I also hope it has a chance on the frontpage. I am certainly trying my hardest to get it there :beer: Thx for your support :)

Phew! hehe....here's the update:

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/NewArms.jpg

[mark_battista]

dont know if its just me or just the render pete but the palms of the hand appear to bulge out, i thinks they should be indented more. Its definitely coming along, I reckon if your gonna be improving it, its the hand area and where it meets the arm that you want to be looking at. I like the veins running down the arms, nice touch.
check out some pictures of hands and stuff. How about adding some nipples?

regards
mark battista

ps is it all box modelled, with nnurms subd??? Or did you use some splines in there?

[PCollier]

Arghh gonna have to take a close render of the hand tomorrow so people can takea proper look I think. The hand itself has two thumbs which can give the impression of a bulging palm. But if you look at your hand and imagine another thumb on the other side there doesn't leave much room does there hehe. But I'm fairly happy with it the render doesn't show it well I think thats the problem. We will see tomorrow when I will post a close-up hand render.

In answer to your second question: No only the torso, arms and hands are poly modelled and then smoothed with sub-d's. all the rest is Nurbs. Additionally you don't get splines in Maya hehe

[Gobbo]

I think its looking excellent, how long does a piece of work like this take you (roughly)? :applause:

I like the way youve decided to give him two thumbs, very fresh. I agree about the veins, they give it an extra dimension.

Very much looking forward to the final video/animation!

:beer: :beer:

[Maximus Groff]

Well, if i was doing it, for types of component i would choose a material.. ;)

Like ultra tech equip is gray (phong) and some plastic (phongE) can go for blue, black, red...

going good and smooth...

[PCollier]

Well I've been working quite hard this week and I think I have got to a point now where I have finished modelling and can now move to texturing. I think you will be able to see in these latest renders what changes have been made to him. I'm very happy with the chest armour so don't crit that or I will come and hunt you down and bash you on the head :wip: cause it drove me mad :surprised
I also had to re-build the mech hand as it was pushing the render-time to stupid amounts, it's now renders pretty quick.

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/NewDetails04.jpg

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/NewDetails05.jpg

[hypercube]

Hey, this is looking very cool..including the chest armour ;) Always like details, details, and more details :thumbsup:

I may have missed a previous post skimming the whole thread at once, so I don't know if this was already discussed, but occurs to me the mech hand on him looks really 'delicate', especially compared to the rest of him. If you're going for contrast specifically, that's exactly right, but if not it seems like he could break it just adjusting his armour. :) To a smaller degree the same crit on the feet, but they look agile, and humans manage with the same size, so it could work. Though usually 'visual weight' wise, there are big boots or such to balance out a large bulky torso and shoulders. Either way, just some thoughts. Love the ankle mechanism down there.

The wrist on the whole arm seems awkward but then I don't know what a two thumbed wrist would look like, so I'll leave off and look forward to seeing him textured, animated, and on the front page :D

[that damn kid]

yeah...the mech hand looks too delicate....something like a big beefy claw hand with some guns/knives or something would suit him better:shrug:

P.S. does anyone know how to get that stupid pop for some macromedia download to stop bugging me everytime i go to a CGtalk page on the forum?:scream:

[dragunzng]

I think youre a very talented modeller, but your concept artistry could be a little stronger. Right now the main problem I'm having with the model is the wrists, which are stretched out waaay too long. jm2c

[Maximus Groff]

no updates ? :rolleyes:

[William b. Hand]

Nice job! This is looking great! I add my voice to those concerned about the wrists... to me, it seems like the problem is not that they're stretched out... but, rather, that there aren't any prominent wrist bones! On hands that actually have two thumbs... gosh, it seems like it'd have pretty chunky ones. Whatever your solution, I think you gotta do SOMETHING about the wrist area... they look like they'd twist like taffy! It may be "alien", but it's really a very human architecture here, so diverging from that here only looks "off".
Also, I'm thinking that if I were this alien, I'd want some extra armor around that exposed crotch area! Maybe something jerry-rigged? It'd be funny and realistic, I think. Enh, what do I know?
As is everybody, I'm looking forward to this fellas completion! Keep powering along!:thumbsup:

[DogBreath]

Nice work Pete, I think you have done a great job of keeping it Original . Really good work.

Its already come so far from the concept sketch. You are obviously working hard on your textures at the mo, but I would like to suggest that you go back to the mech hand and beef it up with a bit of scaling. The mech hand concept sketch was cool, but the hand as it is does'nt quite fit in proportion to the robust dimensions of the foot and armour.

It looks kind of like it was designed and manufactured by another bot/cyborg part supplier. If it was similar in proportion to the foot it would add balance and it would still have the same polycount.

[CoolmoeDee]

nice work dude, it's coming along well. keep it up:thumbsup:

[PCollier]

Hi everyone,

Thankyou so much for all your support, it is really pushing me and I appreciate it alot. Ok...

Hypercube: Thx for the support :beer: I agree with you about the mech hand being to delicate, so I have thickened it up. But I don't want it that beefy because it needs to look as agile as a regular hand. I see what you are saying about the balance issue with the big torso and quite bare feet area, but I think the mech side is pretty beefy as it is and I wanted to highlight the fragility of his organic side slightly for character/plot reasons.

that damn kid: I've beefed it up, but no built in guns and knives for him he is gonna carry that stuff.

dragunzng: Thankyou for the support :love: I believe I have sorted out the wrist problem, just shows what happens when you concentrate on two areas (arm and hand) then don't properly concentrate on joining them and making that look good. New wrist below.

Maximus Groff: Yep just wait for the images to load, I guess your connection was snoozing that day hehe ;)

William b. Hand: Thankyou for your support :love: I actually went and looked properly at wrist architecture after I read what you said and looked at my own. There is only bones on the wrist that stick out on the little finger side. So a hand with two thumbs in theory wouldn't have any. But it looks wrong with out so I did two anyway hehe. I'm gonna disagree with you about the crotch area if 'Predator' can go almost al-fresco Cyal (his new name) can hehe.

Dogbreath: That is the best compliment yet I have really tried to go for an original design, thankyou. I saw what you meant about the mech hand and changed it. Does it look ok now?

CoolmoeDee: Thankyou.

Here are the updates, now for the texturing:

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/newwrist.jpg

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/NewDetails06.jpg

[Maximus Groff]

:cool:

i dare to say u are almost there buddy... ;)

:wavey:

[DogBreath]

Looking better............still slightly light. I realise you prob spent a long time constructing this mech hand....being very detailed.

And so changing it dramatically would be a long drawn out process that would slow you down and stop you from texturing.

So maybe you could give him one or two pieces of wrist armour.
something resembling a tear dropped shape ....floating (attached of course) over the top of the wrist.

Just to even out the weight on both arms.

[Gobbo]

Wow, its looking really cool now, good work :applause:

Have you thought about a background for him, a character bio? Where he comes from and his history may influence his look, for example he might come from a hunter civilisation where the honour is in the kill, so he may have trophies like teeth or skulls about him, or he might come from a swamp planet and all those pipes could be elaborate scuba gear.

Dunno if that helps, but it might give you an area to focus on, like your stargate animation.

Rock on dude! :buttrock: :airguitar

[PCollier]

Hey dog breath that was an excellent idea did it straight away and I'm very happy with the result, I think it works now. Gobbo yeah I have a bio of him and background in fact the animation plot orientates around this so it's kinda important, thx :thumbsup:

Now can I start texturing? :shrug:

http://www.petecollier.com/pictures/gallery/AlienProgress/WristArmour.jpg

[rrobert]

Good combining of organic and mechanical modeling!! :thumbsup:
Love to see the textured result.. Can't wait..

[DogBreath]

Yeah, that looks good.

Can't wait to see it textured. Gobbo mentioned your Stargate animation, do you have a post here for that project or do you have a website?

edit: I found your site on the profile page, I'm dnlding oigloc.

[PCollier]

Thx guys. Just spent the morning optimizing him so he renders quicker. Texturing this afternoon shall start finally hehe.

Heh yeah I'm a bit embarassed of my stargate stlye animation now. It was my first 3d project after I had started learning Max about a year and a bit ago and that was my first 3d work. Since moving to the company I'm working for now in August, I learnt Maya and my skills have improved alot since then.

www.petecollier.com (http://www.petecollier.com) But it is here if you wanna download and watch it. Just browse to the animation section.

[Maximus Groff]

check this dude!

http://www.spawn.com/toys/spawn/series20/overtkill3/images/series20_overtkill3_photo_02_dp.jpg

and this other shot

http://www.spawn.com/toys/spawn/series20/overtkill3/images/series20_overtkill3_photo_01_dl.jpg

Hope this inspire your texture work!

:drool:

[Gobbo]

Holy crap!

Is that a CG character or a model????? :eek:

:airguitar :buttrock: :airguitar

[PCollier]

Wow how cool a character is that!! :drool: Pleeeease please tell me that isn't CG cause if it is I'm gonna cry right here right now

Started the texturing today and realised how long a process its going to be cause I'm a complete rookie at texturing really. Been studying Leigh's tutorials which are helpful.

EDIT: I'm pretty sure it's not CG but a figurine. At least thats what I've told myself now.

[William b. Hand]

Yeah, that's a figure from Todd McFarlane's line. Pretty cool, and super CHEAP. I think I paid six to eight dollars for mine.
Don't let it distract you from your mission.

[loked]

I wasn't sure either and then I checked out his Alien Boss WIP and realized there was no way he made that. I say that in the nicest way, your Alien Boss is really cool, but Im just talking relative to this toy model. :thumbsup:


Later

Loked!!

[Maximus Groff]

Thats a toy... from SPAWN... can anyone track a CG inspired by that ?

To LOKED:
:rolleyes: hey, hope u c&C my WIP ;) :wavey:

There is another killer models on that site, try this link:
http://www.spawn.com/toys/series.aspx?division=toys&category=spawn&series=series18

[Maximus Groff]

How its going the texture process ?

:rolleyes:

[PCollier]

Been busy with other other 3d work at work for the moment. Although I have got the helmet almost textured. Can't find the energy to come home and do more 3d at the moment zaps the creativity out of ya :rolleyes:

Wanna get it finished before June 1st so I can enter it for the Expose' book, but I have a bad feeling I won't be able to get it done in time.

[Gobbo]

Do you have anything new on your cyborg Pete?

[PCollier]

Sorry folks for the lack of updates. Still the same as above. Very busy with work at work at the moment. But believe me I wanna see this finished as much as you do.

[Maximus Groff]

Me 2!

:bounce:

[Gobbo]

So how are things going now?

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