2DArt / Nudity: Asian Girl

[Aros]

I'm sorry.. But honestly it looks like a real photo cut out to make it look like its in progress :hmm:

[RuneV]

"I'm sorry.. But honestly it looks like a real photo cut out to make it look like its in progress "

I think that would be a compliment :thumbsup:

[JonasNoell]

Mh it's always kind of easy to say that it's just copied. Gladly I saved a short WIP of the face.

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/FaceWIP.jpg


If you still don't trust me, give the thing a try, download the picture and zoom very near to the face for example so you see it's actually painted. It's simply too clean, and by the way I'm not that type of guy who lies at himself by posting fotos and stuff he actually didn't paint. I'm actually working with Photoshop for quite a long time (about 2 years).

By the way here is another WIP just to make shure that proves what I worked in the time between my first post and this one (see left arm)

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Girl2.jpg

cANt

[JonasNoell]

Bug while posting the FaceWIP

Here it is again
http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/FaceWIP.jpg

[uday]

Originally posted by Aros
I'm sorry.. But honestly it looks like a real photo cut out to make it look like its in progress :hmm:

i have to agree with cANt as most people freak out when they see something as realistic as that. I worked woth Frank Ordaz(ex. ILM matte painter and have seen some illustrations he has done in his post ILM carrier.Some stuff looks like a photograph but with an edge.
There are a lot of other painters like Hajime Sorayama and the likes who have done stuff for years that looked like photos.
infact some really good "photographers try to immitate Sorayama"

SO someone who has only spent 4 hour hours thats at pretty good job at realism.

My only criticism is that it doesnt have that oomph !!! that most Illustrators add when doing photo realism.but again its work in progress so who knows...it might turn out way better than expected.:eek:

[JonasNoell]

uday, thanks for support!

Actually I don't know what you mean with the word "oomph"? I'm german, so could you translate it for me please? ;)

Yeah right, it is "only" work in progress. Don't be too hard, I always add details such as spots and stuff when finished.

Greetings
cANt

[JonasNoell]

Finished the upper boddy and began with the hair, which was not too easy, but finally I am satisfied with the part of hair so far ;)

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Girl4.jpg

Greetings
cANt

[voyer]

can i ask what you are using for referance if anything???
photo?

and could you post your referance in the thread ?

[Aros]

Okay then, I believe you. Looking very nice!

IMO The upper lip looks a bit too big in height :)
Keep it up! :thumbsup:

[JonasNoell]

Finished Hair and updated the face a bit. Pooh, the hardest parts which are the face and the hair are now done. No lets work on the hands ;)

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Girl6.jpg

Aros: NP ;)
voyer: Shure. This (http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/GirlRef.jpg) is my reference, mainly for picking colors and the general shape...

Thanks, greetings and out
cANt

[wok]

Great work!! Can't believe your doing this with a mouse!!!

[ceql]

hehe Great Work! that's amazing speed and work, especially for using only a mouse... look after your wrist tho ;)

[Baal]

Very nice and impressive, you did a great job so far :D

Keep it up !!

[Error404]

The upper lip looks a bit large.

Don't Asian people have some what small lips? if so, then the lower lip is probably a tad to large as well.

Crazy good work man!

[Talos]

is this in the wrong thread :rolleyes:


looks uber :thumbsup:

[JonasNoell]

wok: Yeah, it's kinda difficult. I use the undo button more than really painting, simply because it's quite difficult to make the lines you want by mouse...
ceql: Hehe can you read my mind? That's why I actually stopped paintin yesterday, I thought my wrist would just die ;)
Error04: Yeah, you might be right! I'll keep a look to the mouth when I'm finished. Till now I will work on the hair, since I'm not 100% satisfied yet with it.
Talos: What you mean with being in the wrong thread?
Baal: Thx ;)

I'll keep you updated, this evening there should be up a new version if everything goes like I planned
:thumbsup:

cANt

[JonasNoell]

Updated: Face, upper body, hair and arms
Done: Hands
Still missing: Fingernails

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Girl7.jpg

Hope you enjoy ;)
cANt

[shoey]

could you post a large close up of the hand please:thumbsup:

[Boone]

Good Lord...:eek:

[JonasNoell]

shoe: There is actually no larger version of the pic, I always try to work in the final size to avoid scaling differences and stuff. Anyway, I uploaded you a zoomed pic to the hand. As said it is not 100% finished yet, details will be added in the end...

Click here (http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Hands.jpg)

Thanks and out ;)
cANt

[JonasNoell]

Here is a zoom to the face.

Click here to see a zoom of the face (http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Face.jpg)

[ntmonkey]

Wow, great work Can't. The only thing about the work is that I wished it wasn't so freakin real and that the hand covers the breasts (sorta) so I could oogle it in class and not get busted for being mistaken for something I'm not suppose to look at. :buttrock: :buttrock: Hehe, I'm kidding. Keep up the great work and I'll be sure to come back and oogle it on my computer at home.

[sic1]

Great work cANt...and with a mouse too! if only I were half as good with a tablet :)

I really like the smooth gradients and the colors so far. They seem to have more life than the ref.

[JonasNoell]

ntmonkey: Well, my intention was to make kind of erotic, so she will keep showing her breasts. Don't worry she will wear a slip in the final version so that she isn't totally nude. ;)
sic: Thanks for the compliment. Wished I had a tablet, too. This would speed up things so much! Will buy one soon, I think ;)

Greetings
cANt

[slooper]

very very talented work. I do have to say that part of what makes this appear so great is the assumption that it is a much more high-res piece. I can see how it would be much harder if you were painting at 4000x2000 rather than the lower resolution. Regardless it is still so much better than I could probably do so CONGRATS!

[ntmonkey]

ooohhh....slip....mmmmmmm....yumm......doughnuts....what? doughnuts? NO! NO! NO! Boobies! Boobies! Boobies!

Sorry

:beer:

[JonasNoell]

slooper: Yeah, you might be right. Reason why I'm working on this resolution is that I have quite a slow hardware so my PC perhaps might die with such a large resolution. Furthermore I like working in the finished image size, that was always this way ;)
In some points I have do disagree. It's particularly more difficult to get some real looking gradients in a low resolution than in a very high one. Well everyone likes do paint the way he wants, thats just my way ;)
ntmonkey :D No problem mate!!!

[xeno]

True, painting a nice gradient in a lower resolution usually is harder coz of the lower pixel count.

it is really looking amazing! Im just curious tho, could u tell us a bit how u did the hair? it looks so real!

[Snakeman]

sorry for what i;m about to say....(here comes trouble again:twisted: ) i'm still not believing this is ur skill showing....i took the liberty of matching the "refrence" photo to the "painted" picture....the lines fit...hmmm....really close........and looking at the wip picture...the eyes appear to be....cut out........still gotta make a believer outta me...........good job on the hair tho

PS
:drool: shes pretty damn hot:drool:

[Boone]

Re: Snakeman.

I think you need to look at German artwork...

They have a thing for creating picture-perfect art. This sort of thing isn't uncommon in Germany. There is something about the eyes-meeting the nose that show that this is true art...

[Snakeman]

RE: boone


go into photoshop take both pics and put them together.....then call me in the morning....lemme know what ya see

[Boone]

Re: Snakeman.

Oookay. If you're that sure...I'm on it.

Re: CaNT.

Seems like we have a bit of doubt here...do you have a site with your other works on it?

At the moment I belive its your work...lets get this cleared up.:curious:

[gruvsyco]

Not that it really matters all that much in the grand scheme but, I'll side with Snakeman here. When flipping between the 2 pictures in photoshop, Some of the anti-aliasing doesn't even move. If this is in fact the case, it's a remarkable job of photo-retouching.

[Boone]

Re: Snakeman.

Give us your e-mail.

[Boone]

Re: Snakeman.

Forget it, I just found it.

[JonasNoell]

Ok first of all don't see this as a post that should prove if it was my work or not. As already said, I'm not the guy who lies at himself by posting alien or faked artwork, I just want to do as good as I can. I try to develope myself and my skills, nothing is worse than to get compliments for work you didn't do. Believe what you want, it's your choice.

Snakeman: I resized the reference photo to work out the general shape. I also took quite attention to the way of lightreflections so there are shurely parts that match. My intention was to do nearly the same image but drawn and in a higher resolution/quality. You see that I didn't reached this goal 100% till now. The face of "my" girl is still not looking as the one from the reference photo.
To the question with the eyes: Photoshop is a programm that works with layers. For the face I first draw the main aspects as the eyes, mouth etc and put them in different layers. This might first look cut out but when I work on the skin that surrounds the eye I begin putting both layers together. Anyway, if the WIP of the face and body doesn't give you enough prove to see that it's actually painted, I don't know how else to prove it. I think it's furthermore not my job to justify me for my work. This WIP toppic should show how the whole thing developes, as said zoom near to the thing to see that the gradients are so soft, they must be painted, same with the other aspects.

Boone: Thanks for support. No I don't have a website yet, it's that I was a long time jobbing in the gameindustrie (www.ratbytes.de) and gained a lot of experience with texturing and skinning there. I already posted some of my skins here and even made a metalskinning tutorial for this community here. I can upload it again if you want to.

I can not tell you what to think, think what you want. But I don't see any sense in lying at me and faking everything. I always worked hard, and I am a bit disappointed how the whole toppic developed. Everything I can say is: Just zoom near to the picture, for example the hair or the skin, and if you already have experience in 2d you will see that it's painted.

cANt

[JonasNoell]

By the way I have all the photoshopfiles (Girl1.psd - Girl17.psd that shows the developing) If you still don't trust me I would be willing to upload them somewhere. You will see that the hair consist out of about 25 seperate layers and much more. This is all I will do...

[Snakeman]

it's a remarkable job of photo-retouching

....im sorry but when the lines come that close....where i come from thats called TRACING

.....and like i said good job on the hair

[xeno]

i also really dont want to accuse u of anything, but i have also placed the 2 pics on top of eachother and switched back and forth, and noticed also that there r a lot of pixel perfect similarities between them, especially the nose stays the same, except for perhaps some lighting differences. Also, did u use the same colors for the left eye? Becoz the colors in ur ref and ur work match perfectly.

also a last thing, why did u cut out the shape of whatever she is holding?

I know im being just another pain in the behind section but i just had to say this.

But damn...it still looks really good!


btw, im not saying u copied it, i see indeed that a lot of it is painted and in a remarkable qualty as well

[HoodZ]

Originally posted by cANt
By the way I have all the photoshopfiles (Girl1.psd - Girl17.psd that shows the developing) If you still don't trust me I would be willing to upload them somewhere. You will see that the hair consist out of about 25 seperate layers and much more. This is all I will do...

yes please...i like the boobies :beer: and normally i stay out of these can ya prove it thing....but hey i always liked looking at how to's

[JonasNoell]

You guys see a lot of similarities! Hey, this was my REFERENCE pic, what did you expect? A big fat and ugly girl sitting there in a total other pose? For shure I paid close attention for important parts such like the nose, eyes and stuff, but they are all actually painted.
Most of you think it's made out of the photo? Well comon give the thing a try and try to reproduce an arm or something using the photo.
You guys think I painted the hair. Why the hell shouldn't I be able then to do the rest, since the hair is the most difficult part. As said a REAL 2d artist acutally sees that it MUST be painted. Comon try to reproduce such a CLEAR face by using this reference:

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Face.jpg

There is no way, you must paint it. Why the hell shouldn't I be able to work with the airbrush tool, if I use Photoshop for over 2 years now. There is no big secret in it, just use big brushes with the right colors and the right ocupacy and then give the whole thing a burn and dodge artwork.

You see I'm actually a bit annoyed, I don't know why you planned to destroy this toppic, but consider it as closed now until the whole thing cleared up. I am willing to prove everything but not in this way. You switch between 2 layers and see two arms and see this as a prove that it's made out of a photo? See the first pics and you SEE how the arm developed. See the WIP of the face and you SEE how it developed. I have more than 17 psd files that prove the developing of the girl (I always save as a new file after developing some steps) with more then 50 layers. If that is no prove enogh for you then it is not my job to show you how the whole thing developed.

I was never insulted by others for my hard work in this way. As said I am am someone who tries to become popular with HARD work not with HARD fake.

Thanks and out...
cANt

[Darkmesh]

Very Realistic ;):applause:

[xeno]

i can understand that u feel insulted, but no one here is trying to do that, we are just looking at a pic that is so incredibly photo realistic that, yes, its a little difficult to believe that it is painted completely.
I am really sorry if i sound insulting becoz i really dont want to, its just that, with a 3d model its easy to convince someone with a wireframe, but in projects such as these its a bit more difficult.

I also have to say that with similarities i mean pixel perfect ones, there areas where the pixels dont even change. Things like that make it difficult to be, well, convinced.

Im sorry, i can understand that this must be incredibly frustrating.

[Hexodam]

I have been following this since you first started this thread and I'm still impressed :applause:

[JonasNoell]

It is more than incredibly frustrating! I put very much efford in this piece worked day and night to finally hear I'm a fake? This is nothing but unfair. I will never be able to post work from me without people thinking it might perhaps be faked. You think that's a good feeling? For my part I think I put enogh efford in proving that it's mine, leave me in peace if you still like attacking me.

I was inspired by the incredible good Valentine Arwork from kfc, you see that he used a reference, too?

http://splicewarestudios.com/kfc/works/valentine2003/final-lowrez.jpg
Original <- damn its fantastic, photorealistic really great piece

http://splicewarestudios.com/kfc/works/valentine2003/reference.jpg
Reference

Paste everything together in one layer and keep switchin' till you found your ("pixel perfect") similarities there as well! And did somebody call him a fake! No, and for shure he isn't! See that this is kindof unfair, only because I'm a "new" user?

Could you please post screens of your pixel perfect similarities? I enlarged my reference pic to the final size and tried to reproduce it as perfect as the photo (thats the way kfc made it as well I suppose). Did anybody went to Photoshop and switching layers to claim he is a fake? Tell me one good reason why I should do so! He's a great artist and I personally don't need it to prove in every case that he is just a lousy fake and screw up his reputation in this community here.

Everything else you claim about copied parts is an insult for me and I will take this as a personal one. I'm normally a nice guy (I suppose) but stuff like this just drives me mad.

Thanks for the other guys nice comments by the way ;)

Thanks and out
cANt

[swampthing]

I guess in my opinion the above pic is as close to tracing as you can get. When your reference and the final pic are identical in both pose and form then it's tracing in my book. It's almost like the person was cut and paste together and then repainted and edited to look more like a 2d painting. I dunno, I personally don't respect that all that much as even i can do that, and i'm a terrible painter.

I'd personally say that if that's not what you did, i'd be shocked. The first pic posted, i mean cmon, it even has straight edges on it like it was cut out, and the area on her left breast? Who paints a weird shape in like that unless they are tracing. And her nipples in the first pic, they have straight edges on them as well as if they were cut out with a mouse and pasted on. And then the fact that her face is a perfect cutout minus the hair, plus the shadows on her neck in the first pic are the same as the reference? I don't think i've seen anyone work like that before from scratch.

I think you need to be clear and upfront about the technique your using. Are you saying you painted this ENTIRE girl FROM SCRATCH with a bare white canvas with absolutely no cloning or cutting and pasting?

[JonasNoell]

swampthing: I don't need any lecture about the technic I, kfc or anyone else is using. As you said you are a terrible painter don't try to give me "advice" how a from scratch painted image shall look like. I always try to work with true shapes thats why I keep a saveback of the selection from the body for example and cut it out to have an impression of how the borders of the arm, etc are actually looking. I don't want to instruct you but everything you mentioned has a logical explanation. For example the nibbles were first done as a seperate layer till the skin of the breasts was finished. Then you start combining both (deleting the perfect "cut out" round shape). Same technic as for the eyes was used here.
Holy shit you must be ignorant or something, you can't paint stuff like this from scratch so others aren't able too, or what?
And to make it clearer than I ever expressed it:

Yes I painted this ENTIRE girl FROM SCRATCH with a bare white canvas with absolutely no cloning or cutting and pasting. Have you finally understood it?

Sometimes I think I'm talking against a wall here. You really think you come from this

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Face2.jpg

to this

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Face1.jpg

By cutting your out the now and the mouth and its finished or what? Do you even know about what you're talking or are you just following the mainstream that is against me to be accepted by the others?

Yeah I am a lousy artist, maybe the lousiest ever seen her, and I do ABSOLUTELY not have the RIGHT to post my work here or what? Is that what you want to hear? I always thought this would be a serious board with professionals and people helping each other. I just liked to open a WIP section of my newest artwork what is it that made you start to post such flamewars?
Holy crap calm down, go out with your dog or somethin'

cANt

[psyop63b]

To me it seemed like the eyes were pointing in two different directions, but with the addition of more features like the hair it doesn't bother me as much. I admit, I too was skeptical of this piece, when I saw the first one it did in fact look like it was cut out, and you can see the outline of the right thumb cut out of the torso. But if I read this thread correctly, the technique used is coloring over ("tracing" for the critics) reference material. This is good for photo retouch and compositing, or even matte paintings.

I have no problem with people doing that, because it still requires a great amount of skill. I did a photo retouch project once, and what a pain in the butt that was. Now on the other hand, if someone were to do that with a photo of themself and say "Here's my self-portrait!" THEN I would not be happy. As long as you're forthcoming, I don't think people will be too upset.

Maybe what will help stop this debate is showing some other work you've done with PSP. Preferably something that there is no reference photo for (trolls, aliens, a 3m tall man). Since you say you've been using it for two years I bet you have some other pieces that are just as good. :thumbsup:

[JonasNoell]

Hey finally somebody you seem to be able to have a normal conversation with.

You are actually wrong: It is not drawing over reference material but redrawing from scratch. I take the shape from the reference image and then pay close attention to geometry, colors, shadows and highlight, but it's all actually painted.

As for the thing with my artwork, I come from another "world" of 2dart which is gamedesign, so there won't be any comparable characters to be seen ( worked on textures, skins, leveldesign, etc), so this is actually my first character scene. I once designed a logo for me ABOUT 1 YEAR AGO which could have the most similarities to a character such as this one, where I outworked concept, colors and stuff.
It is not comparable that much, I know but you asked for it so I did my best to find some comparable work...


http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/cANtCan.jpg

cANt

[xeno]

well, to end it then, ill say it looks great, nomatter what kind of technique u used.

I like it alot!
I do have to say tho, that this is anything BUT a flamewar, its just people who are trying to understand or in this case, see, something. We didnt just say that it sucked or whatever, we only wanted to "see".

(i would have gone out with my dog, but im afraid i only have a cat, thats why i kept talking ;))

no hard feelings? :beer:

[slooper]

cANt>

I for one cannot believe the lack of humility in this thread. There are many youthful artists out there who, just because they have not been exposed to the possibliity of great art, believe that great art must be faked. Anytime you present such a realistic piece of artwork that isnt a dragon, ork, alien, weapon, or multi-breasted warrior woman, you run the risk of criticism of your authenticity (ironic I think). Don't let it all get to you. I for one, do not doubt for a second the accuracy of your statements, especially after you posted those two head shots. What you have done hardly varies from what a traditional painter would have done with traditional media. Congratulations on your progress with such a beautiful piece and PLEASE keep posting your work. Believe me when I say, there are many more artists here that admire your work than the ones who doubt it.

sean

[Neil]

Dude, i believe you did it. Relax and just ignore them, you're bound to get flamers on forums.

What size is your canvas, and are you doing it at 72dpi or print quality?

[Snakeman]

this is my last post on the subject....i have been part of this art community for some time now so i have seen many a photorealistic picture, however yours was not done from scratch....like i said good job on the hair...but there is no way the lines/pixels match exactly without tracing....i'm not just blowing steam here...i wouldnt have said anything if i wernt sure...i didnt find out by matching the 2 layers,i did a pixel matching process...anyeon who checks it will see.....i've been in 2d art for a while and i'd have to say i've known photoshop for MORE than 2 years, and the way u have shown your WIP with the cut outs and what-not....were no doubtedly done from lassoing or some form of tracing....directly from the picture....in the case of kfcs pic.....i took the liberty (again) of matching reference and the pic....his lines dont come out exact. i'm sorry for insulting u but it had to be pointed out.....i understand that u must have put a lot of work into the paint job and i do not doubt that u painted the stuff:thumbsup:...but it wasnt done from scratch......i find it insulting that u would continue to try to take credit for it:shame: :shame: :shame: :shame:

[boon]

it is great....!!!!:drool:
if i didn't saw the step by step .....
i really don't believe that is a drawing....
what software did u use..??
hope to see your final work...remember to let me know...ok!!:thumbsup:

[JonasNoell]

xeno: I don't need anybody to consider my work to be good, but I hate getting flamed by people (I don't mean you in this case here) who don't know anything about 2D artwork keep switchin' between 2 layers to see some so called "pixel perfect similarities" and start to cry.
Well thanks for the PM and a clear "YES" to the no hard feelings. By the way the thing with the dog wasn't meant to you. ;)
Slooper: I have nothing to add here, thanks for support ;) I'll keep posting updates
Neil: Thx again, what you actually mean with canvas? (I'm german)

Snakeman: Omg, still don't get it huh? You need to be ignorant, frustrated or anything else dunno, but I don't understand why you keep trying to get such an attention here. You looked at the hair hank of the artwork by kfc? You compared the lightreflections on the arm? Man don't lie at yourself, try to be realistic.
It's really kind of amusing how you present your opinion! You noticed that you always claim but never post any prooves or something? I simply can't take your post serious, if you keep representing your opinion but keep refusing to post some prooves! (if you dare please post zoomed pics such as I did with the face)
If you knew anything about 2d artwork you WOULD see that you can not reproduce something that clear out of a photo, so I think this stuff with the OVER 2 years of photoshop is a joke, very funny indeed. I myself "took the liberty" to search the forum of artwork from you, ... Ok nothing more to add here.
Things are the way I say because I would never lie at myself, the way you actually do. Now put your :shame: - finger away, it should be better pointing in your direction...

Thanks
cANt

[JonasNoell]

Boon: thx :D

[Cronium]

If I look at a painting and like it and then look at the reference I don’t CARE if it’s ultra realistic and very, very closely matching, I would still admire the piece without doubt. I’d still believe that what the artist’s saying about his credibility is true. Anyway he’s the only one that could ever know the truth. Trying to prove that he’s a liar just proves one thing about yourself: you are jealous.

Call me naive, but I don’t think cops are the solution for crime.

I get really upset when I see this flaming! All kind of art is profound and beautiful and should be experienced without jealousy and harsh feelings.

If you are so eager to learn his techniques, why don't ask him to post a tutorial?

One last thing: I love your work and I believe in that what you are saying is true! You have no reason to lie.

:wavey:

Cheers! :beer:

[JonasNoell]

I would be absolutely willing to do a tutorial!!!
Cheers mate :beer:

[Jevin]

I would like to point out something that may have been overlooked in this thread. Obviously the artist looked at the picture and then drew hers as close as possible, while making it look sharper. You know what all that entails, besides looking at geometry and lighting and etc, it means going and seeing pixel by pixel what color things are, and closely trying to match it. Enough time and effort and anyone can copy a photo from scratch (though keep in mind, this was not a copy, because it's higher quality than the original, and uses different hues)

It's a technique many, if not all photoeditors use. They work on an extremely detailed, pixel by pixel basis in some areas, to ensure that their image looks like it belongs there. Is this cheating? Maybe a little, but only if you consider drawing or painting a scene while looking at someone else's drawing or painting cheating. It's not original, no, but it certaintly requires oodles of effort to pull off well.

[JonasNoell]

Jevin: Indeed, that is a description I could live with, but only when you read the words you wrote in the brackets. As you said I didn't work pixel for pixel but took quite attention to the reference image...

I didn't had much time the last week so here is only a little update just to make you shure that I'm still working on it ;). There are still some parts missing as the legs and her clothes need to be textured, too

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Girl8.jpg

cANt

[lurifrax]

amazzing work cANt.. really great
I would like to se a PSD-file.. not that I doubt that you´ve done it, I just want to se How you´ve done it..

keep it up! :eek:

[JonasNoell]

lurifrax: No problem mate! When I'm finished with everything and post the thing in the gallery section I'll upload some psd files out of the developing progress, so that you will see how it's done, for example the building of the hair or the face...

Greetings
cANt

[KolbyJukes]

The hands are blowing my F#cking mind! I would like to see the pic at higher res. Very nice job.

Regardless of whether it's a paintover or not. That level of realism is extremely difficult to achieve. You have some serious talent.

-Kol.

[JonasNoell]

KWAK: Actually there is no higher resolution of the image I am working in this size ;) My hardware is damn slow so my computer would die with a higher resolution. Anyway I have a zoomed shot up showing one of the hands. Click here (http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Hands.jpg) to see it.
Thanks for critics!

cANt

[Lukashi]

Hey nice job :beer: , i was just wondering, are you going to add anything special to her or are you strickly following the reference?
(i really could see her in some cool fantasy-ish thing)

[JonasNoell]

Lukashi: Thx :beer: Well I think I will go individual with the background. But I don't already know what exactly it will look like but well let's see ;) Btw, I never saw an asian chick in a fantasy picture, maybe this would be a good idea :wavey:

[Jerridb]

cANT: It is actually insulting that you keep telling us this is completely done from scratch. ANYONE who has ever done any sort of painting on the computer can simply take the two images (the painting is exactly twice as big as the original photo btw, just to make things easier) and look for themselves in photoshop. I admit this is extremely well done, but you're not kidding anyone.

[Daniel Ho]

How come NO body noticed this?

Isn't this the one of the MOST famous Jap. "PORN STAR" :drool:
good job with the painting

here i'll help u out a little

http://www.3dart.idv.tw/tcbb/myindex.php?vplace=action&action=download&attachmentid=746

here u'll see a photo which is a 3d model
plz do understand the texture is acutally on the model when render instead of did in photoshop

[Pauldls]

ahem, what the "model"s name? :p

Great work by the way, definitly very realistic but too smooth and good to be a photo. Keep it up :thumbsup:

edit: The thumb looks wierd, maybe too thin, I don't know I don't have an artistic eye. Wait, it doesn't have a knukle, ah thats it I think.

[AtrusDni]

Man, awesome job!!! Looks very realistic! Keep posting updates!

[Daniel Ho]

i didn't do that model @@
i am just trying to show u guys
there are ppl out there
(probably for u it's the other side of the Earth)
can do great job


don't underestimate ppl when u (whoever ur) can't do it urself
:buttrock:

[Duffman]

cANt, that's some amazing work!

Hey, you know your work is good when someone (Jerridb) can get SO convinced that it's a cut and paste photograph. Great work! Keep us updated until it's done!

[JonasNoell]

Jerridb: I won't reply to this kind of posts anymore. On the last 4 (!) pages I put enogh effort in proving that it's done from scratch, and it is. You guys always claim it's a fake (which is the REAL insult here) but never give a **** to actually prove it. That drives me crazy. omg...
Daniel Ho: Hehe, well I didn't know either, a friend sent me that piece so I just liked to draw it ;) Thanks for support anyway, it sometimes really drives me mad if idiots keep claiming me that I'm a fake. But let's hang on with this toppic now, we talked about it enogh now :beer:
Pauldls: Thanks for critics ;) I will watch out the thumb again, thanks for telling me.
Duffman: Thank you very much! This is what I actually had in mind, too ;)

Thanks for comments and critics
cANt

[ambient-whisper]

i wont say whether i believe you or not. ill stay neutral.
but prove it :)no matter how good the artist is, they always need some form of outline...sketch..for good form etc. you dont just...paint perfect form out of thin air.

so i guess what im asking is this. go here. http://www.techsmith.com

download camtasia. and record a video of you painting a single section of that picture, show me yer skills :)and prove any nay sayers wrong.

[JonasNoell]

Omg, well ok I'll give it a try but only to finish this. It's already getting boring... :wise:

cANt

[Hexodam]

dont care what the others say, doing it like you are doing is a great learning experiance and you are doing a great job at it :)

[Snakeman]

:twisted: :twisted: MUHAHAHAHAHAHA:twisted: :twisted:


exactly twice as.....; jerib:D

[JonasNoell]

Snakeman: Muhihi! You are quite a funny guy, aren't you?

All: Well I finally downloaded the software trial called Camtasia, and made a short video out of it. I tried to make it quick to not oversize the whole thing (it's only 6 MB large and goes about 4 minutes or so), so the leg is of cause anything but finished, its just to show you guys the general kind of working.

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/LegVideo.zip

Muhahaha I would really love to see the dumb expression in Snakeman's face.

[Glasko]

Hey do you have the shadows, lights and different aspects of your recreation seperated into layers? I'd really like to see how each layer looks, because your ability to recreate an image like this using all brushes means you could do some killer texture maps! You say you used burn and dodge mostly?

[JonasNoell]

Glasko: Are you referring to the video? No, I paint lights and shadows into one layer just using color brushes and the burne and dodge tool. Yes I spent much time with texturing the last months and made a tutorial out of it, too, where I describe how to skin real looking metal. Perhaps you are interested?

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Tutorials.jpg
Click here to download (http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/TutorialsHTML.zip)

Greetings cANt

[JonasNoell]

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Upload/files/Girl10.jpg

<-- Last WIP image. Finished with general skin so far. Stay tuned for the finished version with textured clothes, details and buckground in the gallery section.
Thanks

cANt

[Witchy]

I tried watching the video but unfortunately got no pictures, only sound. I was interested to see it as well as I have followed this thread pretty closely.

The question I would ask is if you drew this girl freehand, why did you draw in the precise shapes of the clothes and object she was holding on the way?

It seems a very odd thing to do to me, I would have thought you would have drawn the complete areas and then worked in blocks of colour. I think the thing that makes this look as if you blew up your reference image and traced it is these odd shapes and outlines. Not saying it's not a great piece of painting, it is, but the outline is just so similar when you over lay the two in PS that I find it hard to believe you drew it freehand with a mouse and it turned out to the line like the reference image. I'm sorry but I don't think anyone can do that.

Thanks for the metal tut though, interesting stuff.

[P_T]

Hi, im interested in your tut on realistic looking metal but i get 404 error trying to access the page... got any alternative?

[oracle]

Video won't play for me :shrug:

What codec is it?

[xeno]

tried it as well, wont play

[Snakeman]

video doesnt work for me either :rolleyes:

[dark_lotus]

Where are the pictures? I cannot see them :cry:

[JonasNoell]

Arg, sorry but I have a big server problem up here :(
For everybody who downloaded the video, I used Camtasia (http://www.techsmith.com), so I don't know which coded he uses, I can play it here and I have the latest DivX Codec. I will have a look for this when I have the server running again, so stay tuned...

[JonasNoell]

Hm I just found out that you perhaps need to download Camtasia in order to watch the video. It seems as if he uses his own codec, but I'm not totally shure of it. If anybody knows the way it works, please let me know...

[StefanB]

You need the TechSmithcodec to watch the video.

Klick (http://www.getafile.com/cgi-bin/merlot/get/techsmith/TSCC.exe)

I can't download the Video.

[JonasNoell]

Thanks a lot StefanB ;)
I will work on the server to reupload the video again, that's the reason you can't download it... ;(

[bobafat]

where did all the pictures go?!

[JonasNoell]

I found a temporary solution for the files and uploaded the lates Girl.jpg and the Video again. All the older files are lost and can only be updated in about 1 week or so ;(

http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/Girl10.jpg

Video: Download (http://www.nut-shell.com/~josh/LegVideo.zip)
Codec: Download (http://www.getafile.com/cgi-bin/merlot/get/techsmith/TSCC.exe)

Thanks again
cANt

[Jerridb]

The video STILL doesn't work.

[tristanbaker]

where is ???:hmm: :thumbsdow :hmm: :hmm: :D
please reupload it.

[Lukashi]

Id like to see it but it just doesnt work for me :(

[cycron]

Try downloading the codec from here -> http://www.techsmith.com/products/studio/codec.asp

:)

[Daveaustin]

well i can't see any of your pictures... dunno y

but if it's the same as your avatar, then it's lookin pretty nice!!

[JonasNoell]

Well guys, I'm just working on a resolution, stay tuned :thumbsup: It will work in about 10 minutes or so...

[JonasNoell]

Hey nice to see that there are still guys interested. I have a new host now, so any further uploads will be no problem. The thing is that all files that were in this WIP thread are lost because they were on the other server which has crashed. When I finish this piece I will upload a little VIP page, so you see how it has developed, if you are interested.

Anyway, here is the newest version of my girl. The clothes are still WIP :wip:, you will note this ;)

http://www.josh.ch/phpmydesktop1/_users/cANt/Girl1.jpg

For those who are interested, I have uploaded a little video that shows my general technic. I was called a fake, so I though, this will perhaps make you believe me. The video shurely is not too long (about 4 minutes) to keep it small so I can't show you hour filling steps like doing the face or the hair. But they all more or less developed the same way. When I'm finished with the whole pic, I will upload some psd files so that you can see how the hair is built up, or the face, and so on...

Video:
Download (http://www.profm-consult.de/TCS/LegVideo.zip)
Codec: Download (http://www.getafile.com/cgi-bin/merlot/get/techsmith/TSCC.exe) or Download (http://www.techsmith.com/products/studio/codec.asp)

Greetings
cANt

[Aros]

Looks great ! :D
1 comment, the nipples are looking too grainy IMO.

Keep it up :thumbsup:

[bobafat]

isnt she Ichigo Milk or someone like that??

[JonasNoell]

Oh yeah, that's her! You know them all, don't you? ;)
Thanks for telling me, I found my refpic in Kazaa, so I didn't know her name ;)

cANt

[greekdish]

CANT...very nice work....my only suggestion to you is not artistically at all. My advice would be to get to know Photoshop's keyboard shortcuts. I notice in your video (which I had no problems with at all viewing BTW, and no downloading codecs at all), that you are drawing and shaping, then your mouse goes off to the top left, and you come back with a smaller brush or different tool. Seemed like to me you waste lots of time just changing tools and brush sizes. From what I saw....here are 2 keys that should benefit you tremendously....

[ & ] change brush size smaller or larger :rolleyes:

Not trying to nitpick cuz your art is fabulous....just something to hopefulyl help you out as you seem to work pretty fast, but then you get distracted by changing keys or brush sizes. Hope this helps you. :applause:

[FallenSwordsman]

I've seen some Japanese artists do similar kinds of work in the Virtual Beauty books - its nice to see its not just the Japanese who can do this kind of stuff. I think I'll agree with Aros though - there's something not quite right about the nipples.

Excellent piece of work tho.:applause:

[JonasNoell]

greekdish: Yes, you are pretty right. I only know some few shortcuts, and you are right: I have to learn the other ones. It will save a lot of time. Thanks for helping me here! It's always cool to hear some tips how I can achieve a faster working, very nice :thumbsup:
FallenSwordsman: Yeah, the nipples will need some overwork, so that they fit better. It's always good to hear such things, because I myself wouldn't have noticed it until you said it :thumbsup:

Thanks for comments, mates!
cANt

[insanepoly]

This is bogus, you've all being had LOL

http://www.insanepoly.com/temp/ichigo.jpg

[ceql]

yes, that was the reference material, which cANT said he used early on. uhh, it's not uncommon for people to use reference material when painting, y'know :p However, The issue was that it was so close to the reference material that people started questing it's authenticity. cANT supplied a recorded video to prove this, but it's just of the leg and not a highly detailed and difficult area like the face, but at the same time, you can't expect him to make a 4 hr recording :p

[SteffanPoulsen]

Pathetic...... :shame:

[insanepoly]

Take a closer look at the face, there's no difference whatsoever with the original. I understand that everyone uses references, heck I use it. But there's a difference between using references and image manipulation. If I trace over an image of the Mona Lisa, it doesn't mean I am the next DaVinci

[ceql]

People were saying that the parts of the image matched the reference almost pixel-perfect-ly in some areas (page 3 I think?) :o Sooo, I dunno, maybe he's just really good? It does look consipicuously like a paintover though, but I don't want to dish out any judgement too hastily anywayz :p

On these forums, There's been a few cases of people passing off false work as their own, but also cases of people wrongfully accusing artists of cheating... for instance, when someone accussed stalhberg's 3d fairy and snake piece to be a 2d painting, there was alot of proof to backup stalhberg's authenticity, [not to mention a detailed WIP] and also he is well-known and has a massive net presence ;)

... but it's difficult when you're a relative unknown, trying to prove what you really did :o perhaps if cANT was to post some more of his previous work/ sketches/ etc. it might give some insight ;)

[edit: am I going around in circles? It's 2am here :p]

[JonasNoell]

ceql: Thanks for support. Here is a previously done work from me how you liked to see...

http://www.josh.ch/phpmydesktop1/_users/cANt/EvilRat4.jpg

Btw: The hand: I already linked this pic here earlier...

Thanks
cANt

[Wetterschneider]

cANT,

I'm sorry that you're frustrated by the doubters, we've seen work very much like this piece, with "step-by-step" wip images and everything, all of which turned out to be "backwards engineered" fakes using the smart blur feature in PS, a little airbrush and a little smearing, and a transparent overlay of the original for details like knuckles and eyes.

Unfortunately, your painting resembles these works to an enormous degree, and what makes this similarity more of a shame, is that all the evidence that you have shown also looks just like the fake evidence the other artists have produced. You won't be able to convince the naysayers, the cards are stacked against you, so it might be best to just bow out, that is, ignore them and just get back to painting more work.

It would be nice to see more of your other work and just let this argument fade into the past. I like the rat, it's clear you have some skill, and I'm sure you'll find your footing in the future as your talent becomes more developed.

[insanepoly]

I guess this is really up to every individual to decide for himself if this is true or false.

But let me quote cant on some of his previous replies:

"...Yes I painted this ENTIRE girl FROM SCRATCH with a bare white canvas with absolutely no cloning or cutting and pasting. Have you finally understood it?.."

"...You are actually wrong: It is not drawing over reference material but redrawing from scratch. I take the shape from the reference image and then pay close attention to geometry, colors, shadows and highlight, but it's all actually painted..."

Now take the image posted by him and do a layer comparison with my image in Photoshop and ask yourself it its really possible to paint an exact pixel perfect replica of a image just by using your eyes alone. Just check out the outline of the body, there's nary a pixel of of place. Who knows maybe its possible but I'm not convinced.


http://www.insanepoly.com/temp/im12.jpg

[Snakeman]

*chuckle*....didnt know this was still around.....hey believe me when i say it is pixel PERFECT....to the last lil dot, oh ya and the rat..umm......doesnt seem to match the extremely high quality of ur elegidly painted 2d nudity chick, i guess u just went with a differnt style that time eh?.......lol, good to see my face again eh cant :deal: :deal: :deal: :deal:

[sforsyth]

Gotta admit, it looks pretty dodgy to say the least. The technique used being the weirdest thing of all. I'm no painter myself, but it seems REALLY weird. On top of that, to be completely done with a mouse...?
Personally, I was wondering why her left arm was of such poor quality compared to the rest of it, now I think I know why - that was the bit actually painted from scratch. The arm is about the quality of the rat aswell. Not that the rat isn't good, it's just nowhere near the same level as the girl. If it is meant to be an exact copy, and happened to work out to be spectacularly so, well, then I think it's a pity to waste such talent on copying something when you could have come up with something new. Pity really.

Gotta say I'm not convinced either. Then again, what should cANt care what the rest of us think? If he knows he's done it himself, he can just ignore us. Being entitled to my own opinion though, I choose to believe this is a fake, and a marvellous waste of time. (as is the time I just spent writing this)

[insanepoly]

Take a look at this- http://www.enchanted.prohosting.com/goodies/tutorials/nude1_tutorial/nude1_tutorial.htm

No illustrator or painter worth his salt would paint the way you did. Most artists would have block out the general shapes and tones and only work on the details in the final stage. Yet in your wip, I could see a very detailed face with the body gradually painted in from the top to the bottom. Its the equilvalent of drawing a perfectly straight line and inch at a time without the use of a ruler- just humanly impossible.

One can also see the huge difference in quality between the mouse and the girl.

[Cronium]

Are you never getting tired? Some of you has harassed cANT for almost four months. Why do you bother anyway? He didn´t copy anyone elses work, he just made a copy of a picure. If he want to lie to raise his self esteem it´s his problem not yours. The only way we could find out if he speaks the truth is to hypnotize him and forze his unconscious to reveal it... *sigh!*

Or we could just believe him and congratulate him for a nice work!

Anyway, which kind of person would actually raise his esteem with a lie? And defend that lie for four months...

I like you cANT, and i hope that you´ll give us some more eyecandy soon ;)

[ceql]

hehe yea, we'll have to see some other realistic pieces from cANT to be able to tell, as the rat is too stylised :p

But anywayz, there's another picture here http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=54420 (nudity warning) in the gallery which was apperantly also drawn by the artist with just a mouse, which is extremely photorealistic too....

So, uhhh, hmm, what boggles my mind, is how are ppl apperantly doing these things with just a mouse? :p

[Werner]

wow, what is the girl in the photos name? :drool:

[JonasNoell]

All I ever claimed and said that it is a reproduction of a photo. All you want to hear that I used the photo as a base and painted it over and this is simply not true and I won't do you a favor by admitting things I haven't done. I thougt a video or a detailled WIP would have ended these debates, but it seems it has not.
The_hand, you needn't play the detective here and search all those images, I already have posted them before on the first or second page of this WIP thread. Anyway I do my style of doing an image and you do yours, you don't need to critizise mine at the same time I don't critizise yours. If you would have really made a layer comparison in Photoshop you would have seen that what you claim is what you call "bogus". Try to be realistic and honost to yourself and for example watch out the hair? Or the breasts, or the clothes, or the hands and you will simply see that it is maybe quite near to the original photo but not the same, nowhere.
Furthermore I don't why people treat me like a liar here. I never lied ever said I USED A REFERENCE PIC, and so I don't know why, even if I strictly said IT IS A REPRODUCTION OF A PHOTO, my toppic get's deleted in the gallery section and ripped out of the gallery. This sucks guys...
And snakeman, thanks for proving you stupidity again...

cANt

[ceql]

just a note, differing areas of quality in the same image doesn't nescessarily mean that the artist didn't do the piece, for instance, in http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49857 , the head is much higher quality than the legs, but it is an authentic painting ;)

[slaughters]

Here's a link to someone who uses a simulare technique:

http://homepage.mac.com/digitalphoenix/wip/wip.html

cANt,

Just use this technique on a new image. Use references, but create an original image instead of reproducing a photo. It should be easier now that you have learned the technique.

[Cooper]

Well i think it looks damn good, and you know you have done a great job when people doubt your work, trust me I have been there.

Don't listen to these people who don't believe you or your work, They are probably mad that they can't do it :P:beer:

[JonasNoell]

Hm thx, Cooper :thumbsup:
finally I see a light in the end of the tunnel...

[Snakeman]

lol :scream:

[Adam]

somebody is a liar :shame:

[3DKnight]

after looking at the two.. i do have to agree that it looks too perfect to the original... and that the outline in the "panting" is almost exact.. and also ends aburptly..

I mean in the hair some strands are the same pixle for pixle...

I can't condemn, but i can say it is just too perfect.. especially with a mouse after only 4 hours.. and using photoshop with its limited tools and not painter.

To get the outline that precise without tracing is ungodly....

if you did it, then you should be making 6 figures in a movie concept design studio

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