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Pengy300
02-15-2003, 03:48 AM
Hello All:
I'd love to see what all the A:M animators could do, so here is my mini-challenge take the term lip sync the way most people know it pretending to be a singer to your favorite song. Use A:M, your favorite song's chorus, best model and put together. interested to see the results. Plus be great to show off what everyone can do...good luck:buttrock:

zandoria
02-15-2003, 04:52 PM
After "Alien Song", I just don't think that there is any point... Victor Navone already won this challenge hands down:bowdown:

Pengy300
02-16-2003, 09:42 PM
I agree about "Alien Song" being great but does anyone remember who was the best before it? My point being bars are set and thank goodness Victor Navone didn't say that he couldn't do any better than the guy that was best before him. But that's just MHO

kloak
02-17-2003, 08:44 PM
we all know alien song was the bomb but there is more than one hash god out there and i think this is a very nice idea, i'll give it a bash, it'll take a while but music videos are a good character exercise, 'weird al yankovic' and 'they might be giants' both have songs that would make incredible examples of good imaginative animations. i've been tempted to do one before. any other takers?

JBarrett
02-17-2003, 11:16 PM
While it's not a chorus, there's a small piece of a song that I'm animating for the Hash animation contest (topic: fast). I've already got the lip-sync mostly finished. The body animation should be a piece of cake by comparison.

And no, I'm not tellin' what it is. You're just gonna have to wait and see like everyone else. :p

JB

Pengy300
02-21-2003, 03:10 AM
I'm glad to see there is some interest. I've started on mine but since I'm new to this all it's going to take some time and some sleepless nights . I think people that do this for a living must be very pale...:)

kloak
02-21-2003, 09:58 AM
very, however, 2 weeks in Greece usually does the trick.

what song are you thinking of using?

i was considering posting some storyboards of the most likely song, i had to abondon the project after a test animation, last year as the software, (c4d) was unable the animate the characters, no constraints etc. it was because of this i moved to hash, it would be appropriate to do the song as it's why i'm here, and iv'e already done the pre-production and designs.

does anyone use the auto phoneme breakdown? i was wondering whether there's a better way to dub, as i have a lot of trouble with version eights, dopesheet.

JBarrett
02-21-2003, 12:41 PM
For some folks the dopesheet feature is a useful way to go, but it leads to lip-sync that needs a lot of tweaking. From my experience, you'll get better lip-sync in about the same amount of time (guessing) if you just key it manually from the get-go.

kloak
02-21-2003, 04:11 PM
my thoughts exacly, hash is a great package for audio, and i'll have a lot of fun on this. i've got to make a new bloke for it, iv'e done the hand but the face will need redesigning as the ones i use have bad creases when lip syncing.

Pengy300
02-21-2003, 08:49 PM
didn't really have any one song in mind. Probably better not to have a bunch of replicas of the same song, so use whichever one you want Python's Always look on the bright side of life, Prince or the symbol or whatever he's calling himself these days just pick one and show what your animation skills are like....good luck

JBarrett
03-11-2003, 05:10 PM
Here's the lip-sync portion of the piece I'm going to do. Hopefully I can get some of the body motion done in the next little while, but I'm not sure...

(URL removed temporarily...trying to make my contest entry at least somewhat anonymous... :) )

Cheers!

Justin

hoochoochoochoo
03-11-2003, 05:20 PM
Here's the lip-sync portion of the piece I'm going to do. Hopefully I can get some of the body motion done in the next little while, but I'm not sure...

all I can say is you're mad. completely, you need to lie down and rest...........................................................!




Actually, I laughed just watching the lip-movement!:beer:

Pengy300
03-11-2003, 08:30 PM
Jazbees: I'm glad to see someone else is actually working on this, I thought maybe the idea had died..lol...I can't wait to see your finished product. Unfortunately my A:M cd busted and I'm waiting for a replacement. As soon as it finds me I'll post my start. It's killing me to not be able to work on it. I'd love to see anyone else's wip in the meantime..good luck

kloak
03-12-2003, 03:54 AM
my hash cds cracked as well, but i don't want to stop using 8.5, however it still kinda works, for now, i've taken a break from the 10sec_club, i was getting my arss kicking all the time at cg_char, so this project will be my primary focus at the moment.

heres a qwick test

http://www.webresearch.org.uk/edward/takl1.mpg

(its weird al's version)

JBarrett
03-12-2003, 02:01 PM
hoochoochoochoo: Thank you for confirming my madness. I told the doctors that I wanted a second opinion, but they wouldn't refer me to anyone but the vet. :)

Pengy300: Sorry to hear about the busted CD. Looking forward to seeing something once you get a working disc!

kloak: Ahhh...Weird Al! This is the first I've seen anyone animate to his stuff, and all I can say is that it's about time!!! :)

Well, not quite all I can say. You've got a good start, but some of the shapes need more work. If you aren't already doing this, grab a mirror and watch your mouth as you sing along with the music. For example, "Once" should have the mouth and jaw open from a tight "oo"-type shape to an "ah" sort of shape. It looks like you're going about the lip-sync process by only using one shape slider at a time, when there really should be more blending between shapes. There's also a bit of a snappy jump right before "kid." Even though it sounds like an abrupt transition in the voice, a lot of what's causing that sharp change is motion inside the mouth with the tongue, so it wouldn't really be too visible in the external mouth shapes. If you haven't done so already, I recommend reading through Keith Lango's lip-sync tutorial...

http://www.keithlango.com/lipSync.html

It has some good pointers that would probably help you out.

Cool stuff! Let's keep this thread alive and kicking!

Justin

alfiebabes
03-13-2003, 10:34 AM
Did someone mention lip-sync?

http://members.lycos.co.uk/aphil/animation/beef.mov

sorenson3 movie. 500k but there are pop-ups. Must get a proper web-provider soon.

Any feedback?

JBarrett
03-13-2003, 02:21 PM
Hey, alfiebabes. Fun piece of audio you've got there! :)

Re: the lip-sync, it looks like a good start, but there are some core issues to address to take it to the next level...

Most times when a person is speaking, the mouth is in almost constant motion. Right now there are a lot of pauses and stops on certain mouth shapes, making the mouth look "poppy" in places. One of the things I learned early in lip-sync is that moving holds apply to the mouth just as much as they do to the body. That's why I say the mouth is in "almost constant motion." You need to hold certain shapes for it to read properly, and the mouth will almost come to a stop, but not quite. Only when the person stops speaking will the mouth really come to a full stop.

This also relates to the need to incorporate blending between shapes when doing lip-sync. A lot of the shapes I saw in this character appeared to be isolated shapes; i.e. only using the "e" shape slider/control when making a shape for an "e" sound. If you carefully listen to people speak, especially when listening to an audio track frame by frame, you'll notice that there is a lot of blending between sounds as words are spoken. Similarly, there should also be blending when animating the shapes that match those sounds.

Something else to begin to pick up on is the amount of time the speaker spends on consonants vs. vowels. I learned this a couple years ago when doing a line for a 3-2-1 Penguins! episode. I noticed that the actor had put a lot of emphasis on the consonants in a particular line, so I made sure I mirrored that emphasis when animating the mouth shapes to match it. Each person emphasizes words -- and parts of words -- in a very unique way. The more you can match that emphasis in lip-sync, the more authentic it will look.

Again, I think you've got some good building blocks in this piece. Keep working at it! :)

Justin

Pengy300
03-14-2003, 02:44 AM
Hello all: My replacement disc arrived today! gotta love Fedex. Here's a tease from my lip sync http://penguinstudios.tripod.com/cgi-bin/animation//beautiful_test_1.avi

Pengy300
03-14-2003, 02:48 AM
man oh man..lol sorry about that and after I went to all the trouble to sign up and everything! If anyone knows of a free site where I could place this and link to it I would greatly appreciate it..thanks in advance

amsmf
03-14-2003, 02:13 PM
You can post your avi in the forums here:

www.numbmonkey.com

There is a Animation Master forum thread just waiting to be used.

If the avi is bigger than 2mb private message me about it.

Pengy300
03-17-2003, 02:02 AM
Hello All..Still no luck on finding a place to host my little lipsync..If anyone knows of a place I could use any suggestions..plz

alfiebabes
03-19-2003, 05:34 PM
thanks Jazbees!

Funny but your critiscisms are generally to put back all the stuff one of my friends asked me to take out! She's not into animation so I think I'll go with your advice.

I've been working on new mouth shapes and re-working existing ones though so I'll re-post when I've had another go at this. For action I intend the character to be sitting at a table talking to an old mop while he does his talking to it..

(was trying to physically animate the mop-strands flopping while the guy stroked it but the cloth thread has given me new hope!)

Pengy300
03-21-2003, 08:55 PM
Hello all: Finally all the stars have properly aligned, my four leaf clover has worked and thanks to amsmf I have a home for my lipsync test..check it out here http://www.numbmonkey.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=14 I know it's not much but any critics would be helpful, thanks in advance

JBarrett
03-31-2003, 05:12 PM
Sorry I can't comment on your clip, Pengy300...It's increasingly difficult to find a way to easily view AVI/QT stuff here at work. If it were MPEG-1, I could watch it directly on my machine.

In other news, I finished my clip...but because it's also a Hash contest entry, I'm hesitant to show it just yet. For those who saw the lip-sync, you'll know which is mine when the contest entries are up for voting. In the meantime, I'm pulling the link to the lip-clip so that my entry can be at least somewhat anonymous... :)

JBarrett
04-12-2003, 01:25 PM
Well, the Hash contest is over, and my clip took third place. Not surprising, especially considering its total lack of a storyline. Still, I'm happy with how it did. Here's the link to the clip from my site:

http://www.jb-av.com/anims/scatman.mpg
(1.22 MB, MPEG-1)

Cheers!

(addendum: found out a bit late that the audio was compressing on only one channel. It's fixed, and the file's a tad smaller)

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