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valoukh
12-06-2006, 08:28 PM
Hey all.

Started modelling a male character as I need practice doing high-poly 'realistic' games characters. I'm in the early stages and still don't know what he's going to be yet (maybe a generic guy in a suit, or a roman solider, something like that) but I'm looking for any crits/tips regarding the anatomy (and eventually the clothing and textures).

Here he is so far: now I'll get to work!

Thanks.

http://stevenkay.free.fr/Files/Renders/male1.jpg

http://stevenkay.free.fr/Files/Renders/male3.jpg

monkeynutz
12-06-2006, 11:36 PM
I think you may have gone too hires too soon, unless of course this wire image was smoothed before posting. It's hard to say without a wire from teh front, but I think you may have some edge flow issues going into the arm and the upper arm. Also with his arms, they seem fairly bulky but lack definition. Also, the definition on the torso is very harsh. The line down the middle of his torso should really be almost just implied unless very muscular. He seems to have definition to his pecs but no volume. There are some areas where I think I can see good edge flow, though the particular angle and method used for the screen shots is giving me some trouble getting a feel for the model and edge flow in particular. Overall, however, it looks like the edges are a bit too grid like to deform well. Edge looping should really be used on joints like elbows and knees, particularly if you are allowing yourself such a high poly budget.

I'd say that overall your form is pretty good and your proportions are accurate, but the edge flow could use some work. Pay more attention to muscle groups and overall anatomy. I'm not sure what method you are using for modelling, but I find it quite useful sometimes to model muscles as completely separate objects (ie all 6 abs separate) and then stitch them together. This way you make sure you've given adequate attention to all of them and it generally returns clean results (provided you pay attention to the number of edges you need to match).

NME-Se7eN
12-07-2006, 01:48 AM
I agree with monkeynutz. Seems like you are far too eager to get into the "high poly" without adequate foundations. Your muscles need more defining and there are some topographical issues that will be problematic later on. I suggest jumping back to a low poly and getting a better foundation. Also, seriously, I have yet to see a next gen character that wasteful with polygons.

benclark
12-07-2006, 09:00 AM
the palm areas of the hands need to be much larger

valoukh
12-07-2006, 04:17 PM
Hi everyone. Thanks so much for your words, this is exactly what I wanted to hear. About the high-poly thing, I just smoothed it, I'm still working with the low-poly mesh at present. I don't have any updates at the moment because I've been doing his head (which I'll post soon), but here are some images of the low-poly mesh so you can tear this apart instead. I'm guessing the comments would be the same anyway, I thought the hands looked a bit small but I'm working from a reference image - I'll change them. The armpit area is horrendous, mainly in terms of the loops, so I need to work on that. Also, there are lots of places like the stomach where the loops are wasted, just going vertically up the body. I'm going to use these to define the stomach area. I'll get to work on correcting the anatomy and get back to you with updates. Thanks again everyone!

http://stevenkay.free.fr/Files/Renders/3way.jpg

LaughingBun
12-07-2006, 07:17 PM
one think you need to do is make sure your loops follow the form from all sides, right now it looks like you model the loop from one view then assume the form continues that way around the rest of the loop. Your loops need to be more dynamic like paint strokes right now they look really static.

monkeynutz
12-07-2006, 09:31 PM
ok, this is a little more telling than the last wire pic. You have a lot going on here and for the most part you have a decent consistency in teh size and shape of your poly's so that's good. I would, however, nix the two loops I think you eluded to that go through the torso vertically near the center. They creat some very thin poly's and currently offer nothing to the silhouette. Aside from that, I don't think they really provide the shading you want. As teh rest of the model stands, those edges are just too close and aren't really working for you.

As for the edge flow, it could be a little tricky, but your shoulders need some work. You usually want to wrap the edges coming up the torso over the shoulder (closer to the middle of the torso they can go up into the neck/head). I'm sorry I don't have any reference offhand, but I'm sure you can see it happening on many other character models. The idea is largely to follow the flow of a humans muscles. If you have an anatomy book it can be an excellent resource for designing edge flow as well as of course accurately capturing shape and form. The flow around the waist is a litle closer to ideal, but it's still a bit off. The flow of your edges should highlight the border of teh muscle groups where the leg meets the torso.

Also on the topic of edge flow, or at least for the most part, I can see that your edges change direction eratically. They don't necessarily go off somewhere completely different, but they're jagged. With organic model you generally want to create a nice organic flow with the edges. If you're planning to smooth then sharp changes in direction can work for you, however, some of these just look like lack of refinement. It's very noticeable on the inside of the upper legs where the flow becomes wavy. Watch out for those Ngons as well. If you can't find a way to quad out th earea through edge looping or other tactics then at least cut some tris out. Again, I'd recommend edge looping the elbows and knees for better deformation.

valoukh
12-08-2006, 03:44 PM
Hey all. Just a small update, I've mainly been concentrating on cleaning up the edge loops as you've suggested. I've not had a lot of practice with organic models and I want to get it right!

There aren't any major differences; I've changed lots of edges so that the shoulder area is more uniform; I've got edges flowing from the leg upwards, around the shoulder and back down the leg, and I've also made sure the loops around the shoulder continue all the way around. At the moment there are a lot of loops here where I could probably have less, but as I said, I'm concentrating on the loops at the moment, I'll optimise later!

I'm unsure about the neck area, and also the flow from the breast to the upper arm is something I've never been good at, so I guess they're next on the list!

http://stevenkay.free.fr/Files/Renders/male7.jpg
http://stevenkay.free.fr/Files/Renders/male8.jpg

Also, this might be just me dreaming but I feel that I'm already getting better results on the smoothed version:

http://stevenkay.free.fr/Files/Renders/male6.jpg

Thanks for your comments!!

P.S. I will change the hands! ;)

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