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faultymoose
11-27-2006, 04:52 AM
Does anyone know where to find this?

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=103342&page=1&pp=15

I was pretty thorough in searching for a working link, but everything seems to be down. I'd love to see this tutorial.

fahr
11-27-2006, 07:30 AM
As would I. Any chance of seeing this tutorial back online?

faultymoose
11-27-2006, 10:11 PM
Anyone? :(

Sergio76
11-28-2006, 01:42 PM
The original poster has his own forum now:
http://www.sektor-41.com/forum/showthread.php?t=182

goleafsgo
11-28-2006, 08:47 PM
I'm not sure if he's changed his tutorial or not but his original tutorial on modeling a porshe using nurbs in Maya was "pretty", ie. he spent a lot of time on the web page and the images and everything, but the content was terrible. It taught you some of the options that the nurbs tools have but it was one of the most incorrect workflows for nurbs that I've ever seen.

So, yeah, you could learn about aligning curves and that you can rebuild curves or that you can create a curve from an isoparm on a surface, but when/where/why he did these things was way off if you ask me.

Sergio76
11-28-2006, 09:41 PM
but it was one of the most incorrect workflows for nurbs that I've ever seen.
OT: Can you please write which tutorial available on the internet has 100% correct nurbs workflow for complex hard surface modeling (car, ship, etc.).
I want to check my workflow.

Thank you in advance.

Kabab
11-28-2006, 11:30 PM
Have a look at some StudioTools tutorials on the autodesk website that will give you some idea's on proper nurbs workflows.

faultymoose
11-28-2006, 11:42 PM
I just want to make a nice car :(

Unfortunately, my nurbs workflow is nonexistent. I do understand the importance of a good workflow (I've been involved in constructing our pipelines at work) but I haven't found any decent nurbs tutorials that produce an end product worthy of showing off. This doesn't mean I'm after a 101 for my reel - it simply means that it is more entertaining to follow through a process from start to a finished, workable model, as opposed to a flower vase or wine glass.

The last thing I want is to pick up bad habits, so I'll bear that in mind if I do come across this tutorial. But my desire to run through it was purely out of a hobbiest interest level, not a professional one (I have no desire to move into our modeling department - our modelers are far too good to compete with).

That said, could you recommend any tutorials that (a)Demonstrate a good nurbs workflow, (b)Cover most of the nurbs toolset, (c)Don't spend three hours describing the move tool, and (d)Produce an end result that I can show to my non-CG friends so they can "ooo!" and "aaah!" ?

Not asking for much, mind you ;)

goleafsgo
11-28-2006, 11:56 PM
Ok, I'll admit that I'm not the biggest fan of that guy. He was something of a snob and if you want you can go look at all the threads that he posted here and make your own call on that.

I personally haven't seen a good tutorial online for modeling an entire car in nurbs. What I would suggest would be to find smaller tutorials and once you have all the fundamentals down then just apply them to something like a car.

Even the courses for StudioTools don't start with somethink like a car...they start with a mouse. Actually a good way to start with nurbs would be to download the StudioTools PLE version and go through some of their tutorials.

Some of the problems that I had with his tutorial were:

Avoiding trimed surfaces entirely. Most people who are used to poly modeling have this belief that they need to "attach" every surface in order to get a good render, and so they avoid using trimmed surfaces. In his earlier tutorial I remember he had modeled the front fender area around the headlights with an actual curve when I would say that that area is perfect for being trimmed out of a larger smooth surface.

Instead of creating longer curves which sweep across as much of the surface as possible, he would draw small pieces here and there, and line them up by just looking at them, and then blame Maya when he tried to attach them using the curvature continuous option. His real problem was that the scale of the curves were way off, even though they looked aligned to the eye, and that was why his attaching was producing strange results.

Another workflow, that I think he got from the popular Subaru WRX tutorial, was to create a surface which was "close" to what you want, then create new curves from the isoparms from that surface, tweak those new curves and recreate the surface. Repeat this a few times until you get what looks nice enough.

Anyways...I think what happened was that he got frustrated with Maya's nurbs tools and switched to XSI and started using polys. After that he made a lot of posts about how crap Maya was and how much nurbs sucked in general. There was one post where he said that hard surface modeling like for cars is more accurate in polys then in nurbs and anyone who disagrees obviously doesn't know what they are talking about. It was about then that I started to ignore any thread that he was a part of...and in all honesty was happy when he left to start another site. (Which has some excellant car rendering I might add)

I understand the desire to be able to model something like that, and learn it as quickly as possible. Believe me, I worked on StudioTools for awhile and for someone who loves cars, loves 3d/computers and sees what the guys we have there can create...not to mention the 3d models of cars from BMW/Mercedes/Porshe that we get to look at...but couldn't model much myself at all it's absolutely painfull.

I talked to one guy who trained a lot of the modelers at most of the big car companies and he told me to sit down and go through the tutorials where they create things like a computer mouse. Becuase 100% of the things you learn in those kind of tutorials are directly applicable when you move onto a car. It's just the same thing over and over again.

Ok, I'm done ranting for now...gotta go change a diaper :)

faultymoose
11-29-2006, 12:05 AM
I personally haven't seen a good tutorial online for modeling an entire car in nurbs. What I would suggest would be to find smaller tutorials and once you have all the fundamentals down then just apply them to something like a car.

I know this is the RIGHT way of doing it, but I'm lazy hahaha! I don't get a lot of spare time (you work in the industry and juggle a family on top of it, so I'm sure I don't need to explain ;)) and I was just after something easy and lazy to poke along at.

I'll have a look around for some good tutorials that demonstrate some tricker aspects of nurbs modelling (maintaining surface continuity, for example, or how to set up good tesselation attributes, how to avoid holes along trimmed edges, how to rebuild surfaces for filleting and whatnot, etc.) because in my previous (sporadic and clunky) efforts to model a vehicle, I always get stuck on the details.

And regarding the attitude of the tutorial dude... *cough*... I mostly skimmed that thread looking for working links. I'm kinda glad I didn't read it any deeper now ;)

goleafsgo
11-29-2006, 12:58 AM
I know this is the RIGHT way of doing it, but I'm lazy hahaha! I don't get a lot of spare time (you work in the industry and juggle a family on top of it, so I'm sure I don't need to explain ;)) and I was just after something easy and lazy to poke along at.
Oh, I completely understand where you are coming from :)

Look though some of these:
http://www.carbodydesign.com/tutorials/car-3d-modeling-tutorials.php

This one is pretty popular I think:
http://67.15.36.49/team/Tutorials/julian_sarmiento_carmod/carmodel_part1_01.asp

If you can get a copy of the Maya Modeling book that Alias put out, I think when Maya 7.0 went out, it has a chapter on modeling a car in nurbs and then a chapter on modeling the interior in subd's. A lot of chapters in that book are on patch modeling a human in nurbs (which I think is a mostly outdated technique) so I'm not sure if paying full price for the book would be worthwhile to you...but if you can find it used...

And if I could plug one thing...if you are playing around with modeling cars in your spare time, and we still offer a 30 day evaluation copy of ImageStudio then grab it. I can set up a professional rendering of my car models in about 5 minutes in ImageStudio. Very nice to have for "in progress" but nice renderings. :thumbsup:

faultymoose
11-29-2006, 02:12 AM
Wicked! Thanks for the links and tips :)

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