question: making character group with skin and bones

[svenip]

so as always, it is DOUBLE TRANSFORMATIONS.

if you think about the skinning you'll see that the surface is driven by the skincluster, which are driven by the bones. so the only thing you have to move are the bones. if you take all (bones and skin) you'll get the double thing, because first it is driven by the bones and on top of that by your group node. i suggest make a single group with your bound skin and name it "don't move" or make a display layer and reference it.

[Neil]

Well another reason why i ask is because if i try importing a character into another file, and it's the wrong size, how do i adjust that?

If i scale the skeletal node, the skin doesn't scale uniformely with it. Basically how do you make a character larger/smaller once rigged?

[MDuffy]

Like svenip said, you're getting a double transform. You want a Top node, that doesn't move, and under that a Skeleton node that contains your skeleton, and a Geometry node that contains your geometry. I also tend to have a Controls node which contains the controls that drive the skeleton. On our rigs, the joints are point and orient constrained to the controls, and usually scale constrained as well at strategic places like the root of each chain. Then by scaling our main controls node (actually a control within that heirarchy), our characters scale up or down appropriately. You have to play with the rig and make sure that only the things that need scaling are getting scaled, but you can get this setup to work.

Hope this helps,
Michael Duffy
mduffy@ionet.net

[Neil]

Duffy/Sven: I appreciate the help and i kinda understand what you're saying, but i'm still not sure how i do it myself. I'm confused by the terms you're using duffy, if something is orient constrained, wouldn't it be scale constrained anyway? I think i don't understand what you really mean.
I've read through the tutorials and stuff about rigging/skinning but i haven't seen the mention of techniques like what you're talking about.

If you care to explain clearer what i have to exactly do, i would appreciate it, if you just wanna send me to a good site that already explains it, then i'll do that too.

Thanks!

[playmesumch00ns]

just try selecting the root node of your skeleton (*not* your skin) and press CTRL-G to group it to itself. Select the group node and scale. Voila. You can use the group node to scale, rotate and position your skeleton as needed.

The reason you get the double transformations is because the skeleton is controlling the shape of the skin. If you group the skeleton and the skin together, then when you scale it the skin is scaled first by the skeleton's scaling, and then the group node's scaling is applied afterwards - double transformation.

[Neil]

Here is what my scene looks like...
This is the skeletal node right? (arrow) I tried grouping it and it just errored out.

[mgrawert]

try taking the root of the skeleton and parenting it under something like a nurbs curve. Then use the curve to rotate, scale and move.

[dmcgrath]

Neil, go to the tutorial on my website, in my sig. On about the eighth page you'll find an explaination, and step by step instructions for setting up you character in proper groups. It's pretty easy to understand.

-dan

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