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dfaris
01-24-2003, 06:26 PM
I was going through this forum and was trying to find all the postings for competitive upgrades for hash users so I thought if everyone that knows of an upgrade offer could post it in this thread so all of them can be in one place.

Thanks Dave

dfaris
01-24-2003, 06:31 PM
Here is one that John Keates posted on EI
Hope its ok John that I cut and pasted your post.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I will give you $400.00 off our price for a competitive upgrade from
Animation Master. Your cost will be $895.00 plus shipping and
handling.
This price will not come with printed manuals (manuals are in pdf
format on
the cd's) but it will include the DUO dongle which will allow you to
run
Universe 5 on the Mac or the PC. Printed manuals are available for
$59.95
but will add 6 pounds to the shipping costs. Call 888-736-3371 ext
107
(Phil) or 109 (Mike) and make sure you have your serial number from
the AM
program. We accept Visa, MasterCard, and American Express. Pass this
information on and as long as the serial numbers supplied check out,
we will
honor this for your user group.

Best Regards,

Phil Martin
Electric Image, Inc
Sales Team
----------------------------------------------------------------------

dfaris
01-24-2003, 11:45 PM
From Philip Nelson

If anyone here is interested in LightWave, I would be willing to offer you guys a special price on a competitive upgrade to LightWave 7.5 from Animation Master.. You can even KEEP you copy of A:M!

This offer would only be good until the end of January!!

If interested, drop me an email...

later,
Philip Nelson - pnelson@newtek.com
Director of Worldwide Sales
NewTek

Hookflash
01-25-2003, 02:36 AM
Realsoft offers a competetive upgrade from any software valued at $200 or more to Realsoft3d 4.5 for $450. The regular price for rs3d is $700, I believe, so this seems very reasonable.

HellBorn
01-25-2003, 11:03 PM
I have started to ask around little. Not stopping at the webshop.

EIU does not offer any competitive uppgrade from AM on the webstore but I sent an email:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We are a number of users that have grown tired about the fact that Hash shows more interest in adding to the feature list than to get the product stable. Some of us have allready switched application and some of us is now searching for a replacement of Animation Master.

Any Chance for a competitive upgrade from Animation Master?

Christer Wallentin

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

and got this reply:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello Christer,

I will give you $500.00 off our price for a competitive upgrade from Animation Master. Your cost will be $795.00 plus shipping and handling. This price will not come with printed manuals (manuals are in pdf format on the cd's) but it will include the DUO dongle which will allow you to run Universe 5 on the Mac or the PC. Printed manuals are available for $59.95 but will add 6 pounds to the shipping costs. Call 949-481-6660 ext 107 (Phil) or 109 (Mike), or email all your information to pmartin@electricimage.com and make sure you have your serial number from the AM program. We accept Visa, MasterCard, and American Express. Pass this information on and as long as the serial numbers supplied check out, we will honor this for your user group.

Best Regards,

Phil Martin

Electric Image, Inc

Sales Team
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have also asked Eovia if they can offer a competitive uppgrade on Carrara Studio...lets se what answer I get.

EDIT:
As the deal I got is $100 under the other one in another tread and as Animation Master now had ben added to the list of applications for competitive upgrades with a $400 price reduction I will again mail Phil Martin and ask for confirmation on the $500 price reduction.

I'll be back...

EDIT:
OK I'm back.
Phil Martin had to admit that he had made a misstake.
But he will stand up to his offer for this AM to EIU upgrade.
So if you want buy, contact Phil Martin directly (phil.martin@electricimage.com) instead of going trough the web store

Hookflash
01-27-2003, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by dfaris
From Philip Nelson

If anyone here is interested in LightWave, I would be willing to offer you guys a special price on a competitive upgrade to LightWave 7.5 from Animation Master.. You can even KEEP you copy of A:M!

This offer would only be good until the end of January!!

If interested, drop me an email...

later,
Philip Nelson - pnelson@newtek.com
Director of Worldwide Sales
NewTek

I just got a reply from Philip saying they would be willing to offer LW for $995 as a competitive upgrade from A:M. Pretty sweet deal, if you ask me! :eek: I have emailed Maxon to see if they would be willing to make a similar offer (somehow I doubt it).

pabitel
01-27-2003, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by Hookflash
I just got a reply from Philip saying they would be willing to offer LW for $995 as a competitive upgrade from A:M. Pretty sweet deal, if you ask me!

Sweet deal? Dude, you can order LW 7.5 right now at SafeHarbor for $995. It's no deal at all.

N.B.: If anyone does order it from SafeHarbor, caveat emptor: I ordered A:M from them and they charged me a lot more for shipping than they indicated on my order.

pabitel
01-27-2003, 04:36 PM
From the Safe Harbor Web site:

LightWave 5.6 Graphics Studio w/ Upgrade to 7.5 $995.00

Everything the graphics artist and the 3D animator will need -- all in one, neat package. You'll get LightWave 5.6, the award-winning Aura 1.0 paint and compositing program, plus Motion Pack and Film Grain plug-ins for LightWave (compatible with LightWave 5.6 only), plus the popular CD tutorial "Doug Kelly's Character Animation (LENY, Volume 2), plus the full upgrade to 7.5. What a great way to try LightWave for a very affordable price!

Still think you've got a great deal?

Hookflash
01-27-2003, 04:49 PM
Originally posted by pabitel
Still think you've got a great deal?

Yes, when you consider that LW doesn't normally retail for $995. Still, I don't really care, since I'll probably go for either the Holiday Bundle (which, unfortunately, they will not offer a discount on), or Cinema 4D XL 8 (both are $1595). Decisions, decisions...

jaguar
01-27-2003, 05:02 PM
I have found LW 7.5 with 10 training dvds at 689 pounds in the uk. This is a special offer and is the same price as the competitive upgrade even though it is not one. The usual price of a full (non upgrade) copy is 995 pounds.
Not hard to find this deal if you search on google but ask me if you cant find it.

Nonproductive
01-27-2003, 05:13 PM
for what it's worth -
I have ordered *many* times from Safe Harbor and have never had an issue. In fact, I ordered my copy of LW from them back in July or August and at the same time ordered another App.

I got an email the next day stating that App#2 was not in stock and may *not* be in stock due to a problem with the publisher - and would I like them to just ship LW seperately. I advised them to cancel the order for App#2 adn ship LW. That was it...

They charged me less shipping (since only one box shipped) and had the order to me the next day. It was, quite honestly, one of the better custoemr service experiences I've had.

Not to say that your experience may have been bad - but yours may have been an exception. For that matter, my multiple experiences may have been an exception.


Personally, and this is based only on my perception of the LW team, I bet if you pointed out that Safe Harbor had the same deal as the one you were offered that Newtek might drop the upgrade price a little more. In all posts I have read and dealings I have had - the Newtek crew has been nothing but fantastic.

I would also suggest you ask Weggington here about their experience with C4D. When I did my research prior to buying LW I looked at Maya, C4D and EUI and to a lesser extent Max and Truespace. In the end I chose LW because it offered significantly more "bang for the buck" then the others. C4D is nice (and I confess that I still have the v8 demo installed to play with sometimes) but you end up shelling out much more to get a comparable feature set to LW - and LW's modeling tools are *much* better. For the price of C4D XL you could get Messiah:Animate($595) and LW($995) (which is what I did) and have a set of modeling/animation/rendering tools that are hard to beat in any package (excepting XSI *drool).

In the end they all offer demos - find what works best for you and fits your wallet. If I did it again I would have waited to purchase Messiah:Animate but still purchased LW. Messiah's tools and speed are incredible but as a hobbyist it's almost overkill for me.

marcopio
01-27-2003, 07:31 PM
What is the website address for Safe Harbor ?

Thanks

Commiekeebler
01-27-2003, 09:47 PM
I also emailed this Nelson guy from LW, but haven't heard anything. Will post here if I do.

http://www.cluetrain.com website says so well everything I wanted to say to Hash... *wistful sigh* Do they even surf?

Nonproductive
01-27-2003, 09:49 PM
safe harbor is http://www.sharbor.com/

dfaris
01-30-2003, 07:24 PM
Well I have just heard from the TS folks about the upgrade offer for AM users and I think they came through for anyone interested.

I will post more when I get it from them.

This is what he said:
You're quite right about a competitive upgrade offer, and we are in the process of preparing that for Hash AM users, since moving from one software platform to another is always difficult enough as it is. The price will be $299, for trueSpace6.5, to match what the average AM user pays - we'll be getting that arranged and finalised over the next few days.

Thank you again for getting in touch, and I look forward to hearing from you again.

Best regards!
Tom


Just heard from them again:

We should have the details on how to order at that special price for AM users today, or at the very latest tomorrow.

Meantime, feel free to pass on my email if anyone has any questions they'd like to ask directly. People may be interested in the new trueSpace6.5 information, just released this week at :
http://www.caligari.com/Products/trueSpace/ts65/Brochure/intro.asp?Cate=BIntro

His email is mailto:thomas@caligari.com

Hookflash
01-30-2003, 11:54 PM
dfaris: Interesting. Apparently, TS 6.5 has vastly improved animation tools (well, according to Caligari;)). Boy, it's just getting more and more confusing;)

dfaris
01-31-2003, 12:01 AM
Hook I think that TS has some pretty cool modeling tools too.

I might have to check it out.

Nonproductive
01-31-2003, 12:40 AM
Per the upgrade letter I got (from 6 - 6.5) - the new features are Non Linear Animation, Physics based Animation, some additions to import/export abilities, some interface enhancements, Additions to subdivision surface modeling (that ability to selectively add detail), NURBS surfaces will repair gaps when converted to Polys, "paint" geometry onto a surface and a few other changes to existing features.

However, they also offer a special deal on "Motion Studio" - which is a plug in from Primitive Itch that allows Pose Libraries and pose blending, Vertex painting (weight maps?) and "local skeletons."

here's the link to Motion Studios features:

http://www.pixelfu.com/MotionStudio/

ruscler
01-31-2003, 05:40 AM
Just want to point out that maxon always have a competitive upgrade price for most software, but twice I called them in the past and they have honor hash as a upgrade option everytime I called them on it. so most likely they will consider hash as a competitor even though its not listed. Just ask and you will recieve!

Sorry I tried looking for the upgrade path from competitor software and it seem they dont have one at their site anymore. I apologize for getting your heart racing.

Hookflash
01-31-2003, 05:42 AM
ruscler: What version of c4d did you get? What sort of deal did they give you?

HellBorn
01-31-2003, 06:37 AM
ruscler:
I have emailed them but they did not even answer.....
Can someone get an offer on Cinema up here it would be greate as it's one of the applications I might decide to move to.

pabitel
01-31-2003, 02:53 PM
Curious Labs is now selling TS 5.2 for $189.

Nonproductive
01-31-2003, 04:51 PM
I know some folks are not going to like this...but... avoid TS. Actually, let me rephrase that. TS is very nice for still work and is worth $299 if that's what you will be doing.

The animation tools in 6.5 are better, but - in my opinion - not there yet. You would need to spend another $130 on Motion Builder to come anywhere near what the other packages offer...

Take a look at the forum link for the Motion Builder site - and in a thread there is a link to some videos of the plugin in action. Download the demo of TS and look at the tools - especially textureing and lighting tools and the finicky undo.

The current issue (at least in my local book store) of Computer Arts has the full, commercial version 3.2 of TS on the cover CD for free (well, for the price of the magazine). Incidentally - the same cover CD has the Lightwave Demo on it.

Really work it over before commiting the money. You get a better render engine then Hash, and some nice modelign tools - but lose out everywhere else. (interface, animation, texturing...)

-----------
The problem I see here is that there are a lot of *really* nice offers in the $1000 range. Lightwave, EUI (though this is another one with weak char animation tools), hopefully C4D, and Maya a little higher up....but nothing in the $300 range. People buy into Hash partly because of the price and unless you are a "serious hobbyist" or looking to do 3D as a career - $1000 is tough to swallow.

dfaris
01-31-2003, 06:04 PM
Originally posted by Nonproductive
I know some folks are not going to like this...but... avoid TS. Actually, let me rephrase that. TS is very nice for still work and is worth $299 if that's what you will be doing.

The animation tools in 6.5 are better, but - in my opinion - not there yet. You would need to spend another $130 on Motion Builder to come anywhere near what the other packages offer...

Take a look at the forum link for the Motion Builder site - and in a thread there is a link to some videos of the plugin in action. Download the demo of TS and look at the tools - especially textureing and lighting tools and the finicky undo.

The current issue (at least in my local book store) of Computer Arts has the full, commercial version 3.2 of TS on the cover CD for free (well, for the price of the magazine). Incidentally - the same cover CD has the Lightwave Demo on it.

Really work it over before commiting the money. You get a better render engine then Hash, and some nice modelign tools - but lose out everywhere else. (interface, animation, texturing...)


Hey NON

I would like to know how you were able to check out TS 6.5? I would like to check it out. Can you let me know where I can get the demo.

I nailed it on the head for me I'm looking at TS for just modeling tools I have Messiah for animating.

Thanks
Dave

Nonproductive
01-31-2003, 06:31 PM
I have TS 6 and got an upgrade notice (snail mail) for TS 6.5 listing the new features. Caligari's site has an updated "brochure" for 6.5 online and they have public forums where folks that are beta testing have posted examples of their work. I'm not going to lie - I am upgrading to 6.5 - but only because it is $50 from 6.0 and I like some of TS's interactive modeling tools. If it was any more money I would pass on it. I have no intention of using Motion Studio since I too have Messiah: Animate and LW for rendering.

More Links then want:
Brochure (http://www.caligari.com/Products/trueSpace/ts65/Brochure/intro.asp)
Caligari's Public forums (http://forum.caligari.com/discus/messages/board-topics.html)
Active EZBoard TS4um (http://pub7.ezboard.com/btruespace4um)
List of 6.5 features (http://forum.caligari.com/discus/messages/74/9837.html?1041269754) (scroll to bottom)
Caligari's Newsletter abotu 6.5 (http://www.caligari.com/store/special/news_jan03/newsletter.html)
Download TS 6 Demo (http://www.caligari.com/download/trials.asp?Cate=DTrials)

dfaris
01-31-2003, 06:41 PM
OK thanks for the info

Hookflash
02-02-2003, 04:13 AM
Looks like Cinema 4D XL 8 is available as a competitive upgrade from many packages that are in a similar price range as A:M. Go to the MaxonShop, choose Cinema4d XL 8, and look in the bottom right corner for "Save money if you already own a similar 3d package". I have emailed Maxon to request that they add A:M to the list, and I would strongly encourage anyone interested in c4d to do the same. $1295 is a very good deal for this package!

amsmf
02-03-2003, 06:07 PM
Has anyone gotten a price quote from Phil at Newtek? I sent him an email but haven't heard back.... if anyone has heard back, what was the price quoted?

Nonproductive
02-03-2003, 06:11 PM
I'm pretty sure Phil was in NY last Thurs, Fri, Sat at the DV Expo. He may be a little behind in email. Give him a day or two this week and then you may want to try shooting him a follow up.

From my experience Phil and William ("proton") have always been very good about responding.

Hookflash
02-03-2003, 06:24 PM
Originally posted by amsmf
Has anyone gotten a price quote from Phil at Newtek? I sent him an email but haven't heard back.... if anyone has heard back, what was the price quoted?

He told me we could get a competitive upgrade from A:M to LW 7.5 for $995.

pabitel
02-03-2003, 07:01 PM
I thought he stated that the offer expires at the end of January.

howardt
02-03-2003, 08:39 PM
I took NewTek up on the $995 offer last Thursday. My LW should be here tomorrow.

koon69
02-03-2003, 10:11 PM
I decided to save $1000, buy a PC and stick with Hash. I tried the demos of LW and C4d. Id rather not trade one set of problems for another. I want to be a animator and Hash is the best way to get there. Simple as that. Getting LW aint going to make me a better animator. My demo reel will be me not LW or what not.

My $.0689

Cheers

pabitel
02-03-2003, 10:22 PM
Originally posted by koon69
I decided to save $1000, buy a PC and stick with Hash. I tried the demos of LW and C4d. Id rather not trade one set of problems for another. I want to be a animator and Hash is the best way to get there. Simple as that. Getting LW aint going to make me a better animator. My demo reel will be me not LW or what not.

My $.0689

Cheers

I don't know if you speak for everybody, but you certainly speak for me. Very eloquently put.

Nonproductive
02-03-2003, 10:36 PM
well put, koon! Software does not an animator make!

Most of the folks bailing out seem to be hobbyists like myself that are tired of paying for stress and some professionals that are having trouble meeting project needs.

As much as I don't like Hash (the company) right now, I still think - and have felt all along - that there is no better software than A:M if you want to learn to animate. It's rigging is fast and somewhat flexible - and when the app is stable it runs quick. Rigging in LW is rough - I ended up popping $90 for ACS4 because at this stage I simply can not get my head around it from scratch. No idea how it is in C4D or other apps because I haven't attempted to rig a char in them...

To learn Animation timing and such A:M is top notch...of course, when it comes to rendering that animation...well..that's subjective :smirk:

dfaris
02-03-2003, 11:05 PM
Well just heard about the upgrade from AM to TS6.5, here is the link and information about it.
http://www.caligari.com/store/special/hash/hash_cu.html

Feel free to post that link wherever you think people might find it of use. Please note that the Hash A:M serial number is required, BUT you do not need to surrender your copy of Hash A:M to take advantage of the offer!

koon69
02-03-2003, 11:34 PM
I checked out the site. Not bad. But did you see the animations? Enough said.

dfaris
02-04-2003, 01:05 AM
Originally posted by koon69
I checked out the site. Not bad. But did you see the animations? Enough said.

Yeah I hear ya but thats what I have Messiah Studio for.

dAfTiE
02-09-2003, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by koon69
My demo reel will be me not LW or what not.


Originally posted by koon69
I checked out the site. Not bad. But did you see the animations? Enough said.


When you do anims,it's all you,and not the software,
but because of some bad anims on a site tS sucks for animating?
heh...that's kinda strange,innit? :beer:

koon69
02-09-2003, 11:10 PM
Your demo reel is all you but in the same way there has to be a basic way for the software to help you get to a certain point. From there its all teh arist. Looks like ts dosnet offer that much help. At least AM does. I think software takes you only so far from there its up to the artist to finish the job.

Nonproductive
02-10-2003, 12:38 AM
The artist makes the artwork. The tool determines the ease in which the artist can complete it.

With enough persistance and creative thinking pretty much anybody can accomplish anything with any tool...that doesn't mean anybody *wants* to work 3x as hard to achieve a particular result.

Hand two artists a pencil and, talent being equal, they can both sketch pretty good faces. Hand one artist a pencil and the other a pencil with a busted lead and they will both ultimately be able to draw something...but the guy with the busted lead is going to take a lot longer and have to work a lot harder at it.

Your demo reel will be judged on Talent - but it's a lot easier to be creative with a good pencil.

Don't get me wrong - if you have the patience and persistance to accomplish what you need to with A:M - then more power to ya! I, on the other hand, don't have enough time in the day to get the things done that I want to get done - fighting with software or spending time on workarounds or extreme post processing only sets me back even further.

Wegg
02-22-2003, 12:06 AM
marcopio
Veteran

Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Conyers, GA
Posts: 36

Here is how to place the order for the special pricing for a Cinema4D XL Bundle version 8 crossgrade.

Call Halimah at Maxon at:
805-376-3333 XT 5127

Halimah will take everyones name and once 20 people have called in, she can process the order for the special price of $847.50 (50% off).

__________________
Peace in Christ
Marco Napoli
http://www.ourlovingmother.org

marcopio
02-22-2003, 12:12 AM
ps: This is the Cinema 4D XL Bundle version 8.

HellBorn
02-22-2003, 04:44 PM
For good sake.
It's year 2003 and they don't have an email address!!!
I'm on the other side of the world and I don't like to make phone calls in English...

Steve want's us to call...
Maxon want's us to call...
...e-mail was invented so we not should have to call or snailmail...

Nonproductive
02-22-2003, 05:24 PM
I'm sure you could email Maxon. Just ask someone that calls her to get an email address to post. ;)

I'm evaluating my finances to see if I can swing it - being unemployed things are very tight but it's a pretty damn good deal.

If I manage to budget it and call her - I will get an email address to post.

marcopio
02-22-2003, 07:35 PM
I will call Maxon and get an email address for us.

dfaris
03-01-2003, 04:13 AM
Well I just recived an email from the folks that make Messiah. I sent them an email weeks ago asking about an upgrade from AM. This wont effect me because I already have Messiah Studio but I thought some of you folks would like to hear this info.

Here it is:

Animation Master User Special

Messiah:animate
regular $1,045
special $595
1 copy - Animation Master user special $495 each
2 copies - Animation Master user special $399 each


Messiah:studio Advance
regular $1,795
special $1,395
1 copy - Animation Master user special $1295 each
2 copies - Animation Master user special $999 each

To purchase your copy, please send an email to paula@projectmessiah.com with the subject: Animation Master User Special, to receive a pdf order form.

marcopio
03-01-2003, 06:16 AM
Here is how to place the order for the special pricing on the Cinema 4D XL Bundle version 8.

Call Halimah at Maxon at:
805-376-3333 XT 5127

or

email her at:
halimah@maxon.net

Halimah will take everyones name and once 20 people have called in, she can process the order for the special price of $847.50 (50% off).

Wegg
03-01-2003, 08:40 PM
These are some amazing offers. Now is the time to add some really beafy stable applications to your toolbelt. . . .

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